Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
Archived Boards => 2010 World Cup - South Africa => Topic started by: behind-de-bridge on July 04, 2010, 11:59:29 PM
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/world_cup_2010/8787104.stm
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I'm shocked!!....... ::)
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I'm shocked!!....... ::)
Appalled even!!
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Wow, theose Brazilians doh make joke wit dey football boy.
As much as people criticized his style, Dunga did lead Brazil to a Copa America title and a Confederations Cup title.
But I guess once, he doh at least lead Brazil to the final of the world cup, he is considered a failure.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
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im gonna admit that dunga did do a good job, but you cant just take de "ginga" out of brasilian football.
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The best thing that happened to brazil was dunga, he just got unlucky wid the elano and ramirez scenario. the game of football is changing , and this slow speed pretty football wasn't cutting it.
dunga had those guys running and playing race horse football, hense the reason they came back from ah 2-0 deficit to beat the USA in the conf cup.
dunga's demise came down tuh two bad breaks. i believe dunga's system was good for brazil.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
So how they lost playing in 2006? everybody talking about no Ronaldinho. Nobody eh talking about in 06 Ronaldinho UEFA and World Player of the Year, did not score a single goal and contributed little. How they lost in 2010 has more to do with a lack of concentration and discipline than style. Holland as an example move completly away from their style and because they getting results no one complaining (until they lose that is).
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They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are.
Me eh tink so. Dem jes lorse dey head. A mental collapse. Before dat own goal (me eh care what FIFA say), de Dutch couldn't see dey way, Robben and Sneijder wasn't saying nutten. Once de goal score de tides turned.
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He never liked Ronaldinho because he don't track back and he kinda lazy. I could understand dropping a man for that. But the way Ronaldinho played in the 09/10 season was very different to the previous one. He was training hard and was the absolute linchpin of his side. How Kleberson and Julio Baptisita made it onto that side is beyond me. Kaka wasn't 100% fit and Kaka put too much pressure on him especially after Elano went out through injury.
Why convert Bastos into a LB ? Bring Cicinho or Marcelo
Why call Felipe Melo, a Brazilian goat if I ever saw one. He is no better than the present Gatuso (past his prime, tough in the tackle, weak in the mind)
Why not bring Pato in case O Fabuloso have a bad game, like the last one.
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They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are.
Me eh tink so. Dem jes lorse dey head. A mental collapse. Before dat own goal (me eh care what FIFA say), de Dutch couldn't see dey way, Robben and Sneijder wasn't saying nutten. Once de goal score de tides turned.
AGREED
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
It had betta b there time d big dance by them
As 4 d Brazil flair it eh win a WC since 1970. So peeps need 2 give it a rest.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
It had betta b there time d big dance by them
As 4 d Brazil flair it eh win a WC since 1970. So peeps need 2 give it a rest.
With respect to the samba boys.What make things so much more difficult for them is that the gap is way closer than before.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
It had betta b there time d big dance by them
As 4 d Brazil flair it eh win a WC since 1970. So peeps need 2 give it a rest.
With respect to the samba boys.What make things so much more difficult for them is that the gap is way closer than before.
The gap in what is closer? Skill? Touches on the ball? Tactics and strategy? Fitness? World Cup Titles? Diving even? (since so many fans around the world seem to think that Brazilians are the kings of faking, thanks to Rivaldo) ???
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If Dunga picked more creative backup to go with his suffocating defence/midfiled, he would have won and proven a point.
Since he only uses 4 creatives at a time, they need to be 100% and they need strong/numerous understudies.
He could have picked Dinho and say Ganso or Neymar without undue hassle to his squad balance.
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He never liked Ronaldinho because he don't track back and he kinda lazy. I could understand dropping a man for that. But the way Ronaldinho played in the 09/10 season was very different to the previous one. He was training hard and was the absolute linchpin of his side. How Kleberson and Julio Baptisita made it onto that side is beyond me. Kaka wasn't 100% fit and Kaka put too much pressure on him especially after Elano went out through injury.
Why convert Bastos into a LB ? Bring Cicinho or Marcelo
Why call Felipe Melo, a Brazilian goat if I ever saw one. He is no better than the present Gatuso (past his prime, tough in the tackle, weak in the mind)
Why not bring Pato in case O Fabuloso have a bad game, like the last one.
Dunga drop Goofy because of de cap he get from him...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3jq6L1-b9s
It start dey, and it basically end dey... yes yes he get some games, but Dunga never fuhget dat...
The rest of the post I'll agree with...
Bless up!...
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He never liked Ronaldinho because he don't track back and he kinda lazy. I could understand dropping a man for that. But the way Ronaldinho played in the 09/10 season was very different to the previous one. He was training hard and was the absolute linchpin of his side. How Kleberson and Julio Baptisita made it onto that side is beyond me. Kaka wasn't 100% fit and Kaka put too much pressure on him especially after Elano went out through injury.
Why convert Bastos into a LB ? Bring Cicinho or Marcelo
Why call Felipe Melo, a Brazilian goat if I ever saw one. He is no better than the present Gatuso (past his prime, tough in the tackle, weak in the mind)
Why not bring Pato in case O Fabuloso have a bad game, like the last one.
kleberson's selection is still a mystery, kleber being selected over marcelo is another one...cicinho is a right back.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
Boss post brodda
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So how they lost playing in 2006? everybody talking about no Ronaldinho. Nobody eh talking about in 06 Ronaldinho UEFA and World Player of the Year, did not score a single goal and contributed little. How they lost in 2010 has more to do with a lack of concentration and discipline than style. Holland as an example move completly away from their style and because they getting results no one complaining (until they lose that is).
They lost in 2006 due to squad selection. Cafu and Roberto Carlos together with an aged Ronaldo killed that team. If you look at the Japan game, the only game where they played too young wing backs, that was a Brazil team playing gingha football.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
It had betta b there time d big dance by them
As 4 d Brazil flair it eh win a WC since 1970. So peeps need 2 give it a rest.
With respect to the samba boys.What make things so much more difficult for them is that the gap is way closer than before.
The gap in what is closer? Skill? Touches on the ball? Tactics and strategy? Fitness? World Cup Titles? Diving even? (since so many fans around the world seem to think that Brazilians are the kings of faking, thanks to Rivaldo) ???
Plain and simple: Results. These are all basics of the sport that is being microvisioned here .
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He never liked Ronaldinho because he don't track back and he kinda lazy. I could understand dropping a man for that. But the way Ronaldinho played in the 09/10 season was very different to the previous one. He was training hard and was the absolute linchpin of his side. How Kleberson and Julio Baptisita made it onto that side is beyond me. Kaka wasn't 100% fit and Kaka put too much pressure on him especially after Elano went out through injury.
Why convert Bastos into a LB ? Bring Cicinho or Marcelo
Why call Felipe Melo, a Brazilian goat if I ever saw one. He is no better than the present Gatuso (past his prime, tough in the tackle, weak in the mind)
Why not bring Pato in case O Fabuloso have a bad game, like the last one.
Carrying Ronaldinho to tell him he benching for Kaka when Kaka playing real tata, woulda cause unrest in the camp. Better to leave him home and have a team atmosphere. I understand that logic.
Dinho couldn't go there just as a sub, or squad player who might not have been needed so Dunga avoid that situation by not bothering with him at all once he decide that Robinho starting.
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Yeah that was his rationale. But deprive the team of technical quality to prevent a ‘possible’ fallout between players who don’t have a history of conflict.
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In Brazil, coming home with anything less than the trophy is deemed a failure but was Dunga's regime really a failure?
Imo, Brazil were unfortunate to crash out of the World Cup in the way that they did and it says nothing of the side he assembled. They were the clearly superior team against Holland, until the own goal changed the game. Then Melo's sending off gave them no chance of coming back, no amount of coaching could compensate for a moment of madness from a player that puts his team up against it.
When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
I give Dunga credit, he did it his way and he brought a never before seen steel to the Brazilian team but in a World Cup you have to have luck. For my money, Brazil and Germany were the best teams in the World Cup bar none, but they were unlucky. Its a pity that he has to pay the price with no better replacements on the horizon, but when you take the radical approach and go against the grain, any slip up is excuse for the hammer to fall.
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In Brazil, coming home with anything less than the trophy is deemed a failure but was Dunga's regime really a failure?
Imo, Brazil were unfortunate to crash out of the World Cup in the way that they did and it says nothing of the side he assembled. They were the clearly superior team against Holland, until the own goal changed the game. Then Melo's sending off gave them no chance of coming back, no amount of coaching could compensate for a moment of madness from a player that puts his team up against it.
When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
I give Dunga credit, he did it his way and he brought a never before seen steel to the Brazilian team but in a World Cup you have to have luck. For my money, Brazil and Germany were the best teams in the World Cup bar none, but they were unlucky. Its a pity that he has to pay the price with no better replacements on the horizon, but when you take the radical approach and go against the grain, any slip up is excuse for the hammer to fall.
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :beermug: I feel sorry for d romantics dat cry dong dis side, but when u live in d past u live in d past ......sigh
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Brazil want to Win in Style and if they have to Lose, Lose in Style.
They lost and it wasn't pretty.
Of course Dunga getting fired. Even if he won he was getting fired.
Cause in 2014 Brazil want to turn on the style
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Brazil also won the Copa America and Confederations Cup under Carlos Alberto Parreira prior to the world Cup in 2006. Both teams exited at the Quarter Final of the World Cup. Dunga was supposed to take the team to the next level. I would call that failure of equal proportion to the 2006 team.
The confederations Cup victory in 2005 was outstanding in my view.
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I would have taken a healthy Ronaldinho who had a better season than Kaka who was coming off an injury. If Kaka had played or was playing the same way he played against USA in the Fed Cup Brasil would be playing today but he did not and has not.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Brazil also won the Copa America and Confederations Cup under Carlos Alberto Parreira prior to the world Cup in 2006. Both teams exited at the Quarter Final of the World Cup. Dunga was supposed to take the team to the next level. I would call that failure of equal proportion to the 2006 team.
The confederations Cup victory in 2005 was outstanding in my view.
The 2005 Confed Cup showed the difference as compared with the world cup ...again..with younger more mobile players. But again....bowing to public pressure and forcing to fit in both adriano and ronaldo..with kaka and ronaldinho made no sense. So parreira deserved it.
In this instance....Dunga....while doing alot.....still didnt do what was desired. Fact is..this is the first tournament that Dunga didnt win. Brazillians would only put up with that brand of football when the results happening. It was stupid to even bank on a semi-fit kaka. And even still.....it coulda work out had it not been for melo. But it was to be expected. How many Brazillian coaches stay on after world cup anyhow?
In any case...ent he was leaving after the world cup anyhow?
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
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When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
Watch the games brother. CAP's persistance in playing aging stars is what caused teh downfall in that team. The wingbackls and center forward were immobile and that doomed the 2006 team.
Compare that to today where you have a very active Fabiano and Maicon. Huge difference.
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When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
Watch the games brother. CAP's persistance in playing aging stars is what caused teh downfall in that team. The wingbackls and center forward were immobile and that doomed the 2006 team.
Compare that to today where you have a very active Fabiano and Maicon. Huge difference.
I don't disagree with you I just saying the ageing wingbacks was one of a number of problems with that team. Indiscipline was a big thing too, then men was real coasting and thought they woulda walk through the tournament given all the stars they had.. Remember when they were talking of playing 4-2-4 so they could chook everybody in?
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
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Football have no logic. Dunga won the Copa, Confederation Cup and Qualified top of the SA WC qualification. But we talking about Brazil. Nothing less than the WC trophy.
Dunga hung his hat on HIS SYSTEM, HIS WAY, knowing full well the price of failure and the potential glory of success
He gambled it ALL. He left home Ronaldinho, Pato, Diego, Neymar, Adriano etc.
Had he won, he coulda drop he pants and moon everybody and they couldn't do a thing about it.
He lost...playing in a manner which is an aberration to Brazilian football fans who were willing to put up with it so long as they WON.
They LOST and not just LOST, but LOST playing in a way that is the antithesis of the Brazilian way of playing football so he has to pay the price.
A friend of mine put it simply:
Brazil lost trying to play a European style of football. They lost to a European team who is better at playing European style than they are. What REALLY did they expect? If this isn't a lesson for a Brazilian team to be true to itself, I don't know what is.
Nothing wrong with injecting some pragmatism. But not at the near complete expense of that which makes and made you GREAT.
true but the european brand worked for carlos alberto parreira in 1994...the early rumor of leonardo being his replacement is a bad idea, another inexperienced coach is not the solution...this leadsto the question...is there a shortage of good Brazilian coaches?
personally i didnt see any problem with Dunga's system since it worked in the WCQ, Copa America and Confederations Cup...the problem was his team selection, a fit and in form Kaka is different from the one that played in the WC plus the lack of creative options other than Kaka was an issue. Elano was the closest thing to creativity and he was out after 2 games. Ronaldinho would have been the ideal replacement for Elano after the injury, not Ramires or Dani Alves.
I agree with the exclusions of Pato (another Kaka...injury), Ganso and Neymar. 2014 will be their time.
Ahm Nightmare yuh talk dat like ah man who know lil football jed....bigup!
It had betta b there time d big dance by them
As 4 d Brazil flair it eh win a WC since 1970. So peeps need 2 give it a rest.
With respect to the samba boys.What make things so much more difficult for them is that the gap is way closer than before.
The gap in what is closer? Skill? Touches on the ball? Tactics and strategy? Fitness? World Cup Titles? Diving even? (since so many fans around the world seem to think that Brazilians are the kings of faking, thanks to Rivaldo) ???
Plain and simple: Results. These are all basics of the sport that is being microvisioned here .
I just asked 'cause as far as the gap closing being results, I think that is somewhat obvious.....I just thought you was offering some kinda insight beyond that. However, just when the gap closes to onion skin thickness, Brazil seems to come outta nowhere and open it up again. Remember they were stuck on three WC titles for all of 24 years and then what happened in '94 and '02? They come and restore order again......so as far as the results being something for Brazil to worry about, I don't think that's an issue. Now if you tell me that teams are beating them from consistently matching them skill-for-skill, then that is something I would think they might want to worry about. As it is, and until they lost their collective cool under pressure, Brazil proved in the first half of their last game that when they come on and assert their will on a team, hardly any team really can keep up with them. That will get them their results.
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
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I want Zico!
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
Brazil CANNOT lose the 2014 World Cup playing at home, its physically & mentally impossible! 8)
If Scolari decides he doesn't want that job, I will take it as that will be the easiest head coaching job in the 2014 World Cup! :beermug:
They may as well save they money playing that tournament and hand over the cup to Brazil but I guess we have to go thru the motions!! ;D
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
Brazil CANNOT lose the 2014 World Cup playing at home, its physically & mentally impossible! 8)
If Scolari decides he doesn't want that job, I will take it as that will be the easiest head coaching job in the 2014 World Cup! :beermug:
They may as well save they money playing that tournament and hand over the cup to Brazil but I guess we have to go thru the motions!! ;D
:rotfl: Doh jinx meh side like BrownSugar nuh!
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
Brazil CANNOT lose the 2014 World Cup playing at home, its physically & mentally impossible! 8)
If Scolari decides he doesn't want that job, I will take it as that will be the easiest head coaching job in the 2014 World Cup! :beermug:
They may as well save they money playing that tournament and hand over the cup to Brazil but I guess we have to go thru the motions!! ;D
:rotfl: Doh jinx meh side like BrownSugar nuh!
Your side is Brazil and mines is the Soca Warriors so I'm happy to jinx yours!
Btw while I'm on this jinxing thing, ah doh really expect the Soca Warriors to qualify for Brazil 2014.
Lets hope both jinxs work! ;D
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
Cyar be afraid ah de hot seat man, nothing ventured nothing gained....I would not take dat wuk myself :devil:
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Hindsight is 50/50. Brazil have 4 yrs to prepare they team. They already in. It have 31 places to fill. TT has 2yrs to prepare. What is TTFF doing???
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(http://soccernet-assets.espn.go.com/design05/images/2010/0705/juninhopernambucanoclose-up2006_275x155.jpg)
Former Brazil midfielder Juninho Pernambucano has hit out at Dunga, comparing him to ex-France coach Raymond Domenech.
Dunga was formally dismissed on Sunday and Juninho, who announced his international retirement after the 2006 World Cup, feels he made major mistakes in all aspects of his work in South Africa.
"I'm sad but I'm not surprised [by Brazil's early exit]," he told Journal du Dimanche. "This team was flawed and the first person responsible was Dunga.
"How could he not take Ronaldinho? Even at 70%, he is better than most. He could have taken the burden off Kaka, who was not at the top of his game. Marcelo should also have been in the squad, but Dunga preferred to stick with the team that won the 2009 Confederations Cup.
"It's unfortunate that we were denied the chance to play our way. There was no design. Several players were out of position. In the World Cup, that is not forgiven.
"We also knew that Felipe Melo could crack. That's what happened. Dunga has made many mistakes. We must change everything to prepare for the 2014 World Cup. Change the coach, the technical committee, the medical staff, the press officers. We can't stay as we are."
Having spent the majority of his career with French club Lyon, Juninho said he is "sad to see France in such a state" and, asked if Dunga could be compared to Domenech, he said: "Yes. Unfortunately, they are alike.
"Dunga loves conflict - he feeds on it. His communication has been disastrous. He has brought a negative energy around the Selecao. He should let people talk but, no, he did the same as Domenech and put himself in the position of 'one against the world'.
"I think Domenech made the same mistakes as Dunga. He built a team in his own image, based more around force than technique."
Juninho also said that, while he is disappointed by the quality of performances in South Africa, the much-maligned Jabulani ball is not to blame. "I bought one and I went to test it," he said. "The ball requires a little practice, but it's delicious. It's a poor excuse."
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/id/806217/ce/uk/&cc=3888?ver=global (http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/story/_/id/806217/ce/uk/&cc=3888?ver=global)
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
Brazil CANNOT lose the 2014 World Cup playing at home, its physically & mentally impossible! 8)
If Scolari decides he doesn't want that job, I will take it as that will be the easiest head coaching job in the 2014 World Cup! :beermug:
They may as well save they money playing that tournament and hand over the cup to Brazil but I guess we have to go thru the motions!! ;D
:rotfl: Doh jinx meh side like BrownSugar nuh!
Aye, stop calling mih name in yuh bachanal..... ;D
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Now is time for a foreign coach. ;D Beenhakker anyone?
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I want Zico!
that thought crossed my mind but has zico coached in recent times? i thought he would have been selected in 2006 instead of dunga....i like ricardo gomes as dunga's replacement or scolari.
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I like Andrade from Flamengo. Even though they fired him after winning the Brazilian championship.
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Scolari makin noise that he wants back in!
i hope he gets the job but i doubt it will happen...coaching brazil for 2014 will be the most stressful job this century...the expectations are always high (i.e. win the world cup) plus they playing at home.....if i was a coach no amount of money could get me to take that job....i cant wait to see who will be that brave soldier.
ENTTTTTTTTTT. Dey should change d name of d mad house in his honor whoever accept dat wuk
Brazil CANNOT lose the 2014 World Cup playing at home, its physically & mentally impossible! 8)
If Scolari decides he doesn't want that job, I will take it as that will be the easiest head coaching job in the 2014 World Cup! :beermug:
They may as well save they money playing that tournament and hand over the cup to Brazil but I guess we have to go thru the motions!! ;D
And even doh i'm a brazil fan...i go disagree.
Uruguay beat dem in de Maracanara stadium...in de 1956 or someting so final. In Brazil.
People kill deyself and ting. Dey used to rock an all white kit....dahs wha dey was wearing in de final i think...and since dat....dey NEVER wear it again.
De pressure will be overwhelming.
Buh...God's willing .....life...job...and money available...i going dat world cup. Opening game and final for sure..as well as at 2 other group (maybe even more if Trinidad and Tobago gets their act together) games.
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Things could change in 4 years but consider this. Julio Cesar , Juan and Lucio are over 30 . Maicon and Dani Alves are will be over 30 by the next cup. Their best DM Gilberto Silva will definitely be retired by then. Kaka will be 32 , Ronaldinho will be 34 ,if selected next World Cup he will be well and truly past it. The good thing is Pato and Diego have real potential ,age and experience on their side. I feel those guys will be really important. You could probably give Anderson a play there too.
Yeah they have some youth men coming up like Neymar , Ganso and Alex Texeira but them men have 4 years to become world beaters. That real hard.
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Things could change in 4 years but consider this. Julio Cesar , Juan and Lucio are over 30 . Maicon and Dani Alves are will be over 30 by the next cup. Their best DM Gilberto Silva will definitely be retired by then. Kaka will be 32 , Ronaldinho will be 34 ,if selected next World Cup he will be well and truly past it. The good thing is Pato and Diego have real potential ,age and experience on their side. I feel those guys will be really important. You could probably give Anderson a play there too.
Yeah they have some youth men coming up like Neymar , Ganso and Alex Texeira but them men have 4 years to become world beaters. That real hard.
It have Rafael and Fabio the twins.....they would be 24.
And yeah...is hope..buh..is Brazillians. Is 80 Million it have. Is one of de few countries that could actually export players. Look how old Fabiano get before he actually get a chance because of who was before him.
Anything could happen in four years.
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Allyuh men seriously sweating over Brazil's talent pool?? Ah mean tuh say, allyuh for real?
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Allyuh men seriously sweating over Brazil's talent pool?? Ah mean tuh say, allyuh for real?
:rotfl: Same ting I was thinkin'.
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brazil have plenty talent, DM Sandro, D Thiago Silva, M Hernanes, F Nilmar, F Pato, M Ramires, D Marcelo plus youths such as Ganso, Neymar, carlos eduardo, etc.
Dani Alves will be 31, Robinho 30, and Maicon 32 so they are not out of it.
JUlio cesar will be 34 and keepers have a long shelf life.
my concern is the coach.
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brazil have plenty talent, DM Sandro, D Thiago Silva, M Hernanes, F Nilmar, F Pato, M Ramires, D Marcelo plus youths such as Ganso, Neymar, carlos eduardo, etc.
Dani Alves will be 31, Robinho 30, and Maicon 32 so they are not out of it.
JUlio cesar will be 34 and keepers have a long shelf life.
my concern is the coach.
Exactly!! But seriously I would take that job!! All them Brazilian women will keep me busy!! 8)
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brazil have plenty talent, DM Sandro, D Thiago Silva, M Hernanes, F Nilmar, F Pato, M Ramires, D Marcelo plus youths such as Ganso, Neymar, carlos eduardo, etc.
Dani Alves will be 31, Robinho 30, and Maicon 32 so they are not out of it.
JUlio cesar will be 34 and keepers have a long shelf life.
my concern is the coach.
Exactly!! But seriously I would take that job!! All them Brazilian women will keep me busy!! 8)
If dahs wha yuh studying..better dey get Sven.
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Big side is big side, and Brazil is as big as they come.
Is the only team that comes into a WC expecting to win
Whoever is in charge next, and whatever football he have them playing, I expect Brazil to win at home in 2014.
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Allyuh men seriously sweating over Brazil's talent pool?? Ah mean tuh say, allyuh for real?
De..same thing I was saying until I bounce up yuh post breds. You could not have said it any better
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Douglas Costa is teh next Ronaldinho anyway and I think he is 18.
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In Brazil, coming home with anything less than the trophy is deemed a failure but was Dunga's regime really a failure?
Imo, Brazil were unfortunate to crash out of the World Cup in the way that they did and it says nothing of the side he assembled. They were the clearly superior team against Holland, until the own goal changed the game. Then Melo's sending off gave them no chance of coming back, no amount of coaching could compensate for a moment of madness from a player that puts his team up against it.
When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
I give Dunga credit, he did it his way and he brought a never before seen steel to the Brazilian team but in a World Cup you have to have luck. For my money, Brazil and Germany were the best teams in the World Cup bar none, but they were unlucky. Its a pity that he has to pay the price with no better replacements on the horizon, but when you take the radical approach and go against the grain, any slip up is excuse for the hammer to fall.
Good post
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In Brazil, coming home with anything less than the trophy is deemed a failure but was Dunga's regime really a failure?
Imo, Brazil were unfortunate to crash out of the World Cup in the way that they did and it says nothing of the side he assembled. They were the clearly superior team against Holland, until the own goal changed the game. Then Melo's sending off gave them no chance of coming back, no amount of coaching could compensate for a moment of madness from a player that puts his team up against it.
When Dunga took over that side, it was wrought with indiscipline and lacking a true solid system except finding a way to accomodate all its namebrand 'star' players. Men talking about the wingbacks being the downfall in the last world cup, but what about the mess that was Adriano and the trying to fit Ronaldinho, Robinho, Kaka and Ronaldo into the same starting lineup?
I give Dunga credit, he did it his way and he brought a never before seen steel to the Brazilian team but in a World Cup you have to have luck. For my money, Brazil and Germany were the best teams in the World Cup bar none, but they were unlucky. Its a pity that he has to pay the price with no better replacements on the horizon, but when you take the radical approach and go against the grain, any slip up is excuse for the hammer to fall.
Good post
If T&T could get Dunga then we in business for Brazil 2014!! ;)
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He's back! Dunga has been appointed to replace Scolari.
Who would have made that call?!!!
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He's back! Dunga has been appointed to replace Scolari.
Who would have made that call?!!!
This surprised most football fans around the world.
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Allyuh men seriously sweating over Brazil's talent pool?? Ah mean tuh say, allyuh for real?
Dun dun duuun!