Caribbean/BWIA Airlines Thread.

[Flex]

'Air J'ca buy a good move'
...minus the US$900m debt
Curtis Rampersad Business Editor

Caribbean Airlines should attempt to take over struggling carrier Air Jamaica only if it does not include the company’s massive US$900 million debt.

This was the opinion expressed yesterday by Ian Bertrand, aviation consultant and former chief executive of BWIA, the predecessor company of Caribbean Airlines.

Air Jamaica’s government guaranteed debt stands at US$650 million, with another US$200 million in short-term debt, Bertrand said during a lecture titled Meeting the Challenges of the Aviation Industry in the Caribbean-Whither Air Jamaica at the University of the West Indies, St Augustine.

If the airline has to be divested, it will involve another US$50 million to reduce personnel, he suggested.

’Once you are not taking all that debt and you don’t have the tourism obligation (that the Jamaican government demanded of Air Jamaica in past decades) and you had the money to capitalise the airline, then it might not be a bad time for a merger’ between Caribbean Airlines and Air Jamaica, Bertrand said.

The International Monetary Fund has specified that the Jamaican government must sell Air Jamaica if it is to qualify for a nearly US$1.3 billion aid loan.

But Bertrand said if anyone had to buy Air Jamaica from that country’s government, they should not spend more than one dollar for it because of its debt.

Another possible option would be for Air Jamaica and Caribbean Airlines to approach aircraft suppliers together, change their machinery to one type of airplane and thus reduce costs.

Prof Norman Girvan of UWI’s Institute of International Relations was also scheduled to comment at the seminar yesterday, but was delayed in Jamaica.

Head of Economics at UWI Martin Franklin delivered Girvan’s comments, which suggested that with Jamaica under pressure from the IMF to divest Air Jamaica, Caribbean Airlines might have ’considerable leverage’ to negotiate with the Jamaican government.

Caribbean Airlines and Government are continuing discussions with the Jamaican government to explore acquiring Air Jamaica.

[weary1969]

'Air J'ca buy a good move'
...minus the US$900m debt
Curtis Rampersad Business Editor

Caribbean Airlines should attempt to take over struggling carrier Air Jamaica only if it does not include the company’s massive US$900 million debt.

This was the opinion expressed yesterday by Ian Bertrand, aviation consultant and former chief executive of BWIA, the predecessor company of Caribbean Airlines.

Air Jamaica’s government guaranteed debt stands at US$650 million, with another US$200 million in short-term debt, Bertrand said during a lecture titled Meeting the Challenges of the Aviation Industry in the Caribbean-Whither Air Jamaica at the University of the West Indies, St Augustine.

If the airline has to be divested, it will involve another US$50 million to reduce personnel, he suggested.

’Once you are not taking all that debt and you don’t have the tourism obligation (that the Jamaican government demanded of Air Jamaica in past decades) and you had the money to capitalise the airline, then it might not be a bad time for a merger’ between Caribbean Airlines and Air Jamaica, Bertrand said.

The International Monetary Fund has specified that the Jamaican government must sell Air Jamaica if it is to qualify for a nearly US$1.3 billion aid loan.

But Bertrand said if anyone had to buy Air Jamaica from that country’s government, they should not spend more than one dollar for it because of its debt.

Another possible option would be for Air Jamaica and Caribbean Airlines to approach aircraft suppliers together, change their machinery to one type of airplane and thus reduce costs.

Prof Norman Girvan of UWI’s Institute of International Relations was also scheduled to comment at the seminar yesterday, but was delayed in Jamaica.

Head of Economics at UWI Martin Franklin delivered Girvan’s comments, which suggested that with Jamaica under pressure from the IMF to divest Air Jamaica, Caribbean Airlines might have ’considerable leverage’ to negotiate with the Jamaican government.

Caribbean Airlines and Government are continuing discussions with the Jamaican government to explore acquiring Air Jamaica.
[/quote


These reporters serious Imbert say they not buyin Air Jam. They lokin into takin ovah any routes that maybe profitable

[Jah Gol]

Jamaicans formed Facebook group to stop sale of Air Jamaica to Trini owners...

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=photos&ref=mf&gid=289770028372#/group.php?v=wall&ref=mf&gid=289770028372

I joined and made a comment on the wall.

[AirMan]

Workers, ICIs protest planned Air J sale to Trinidad (Check link below)


There is a Poll to the right of the article

http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/Air-jamaica-TUE_7401174#poll

[lefty]

the result of that poll is enough for me to tell dem take dat airline an shuv dey ass

[Sando prince]

the result of that poll is enough for me to tell dem take dat airline an shuv dey ass

so harsh lol

[Jah Gol]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

[jahkingdom]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

[Blue]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

From what I've read in this thread, the Jamaican press are reporting heavily (and no doubt quite rightyl) that Jamaicans dont support this deal. The Jamaican press should also be publicizing that noone in Trinidad wants Air Jamaica either. Surely that would put your govt under even more pressure to reconsider.

[jahkingdom]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

From what I've read in this thread, the Jamaican press are reporting heavily (and no doubt quite rightyl) that Jamaicans dont support this deal. The Jamaican press should also be publicizing that noone in Trinidad wants Air Jamaica either. Surely that would put your govt under even more pressure to reconsider.

there would be no pressure. two more bids came in after Trinidad, one is overseas and one is the Jamaica airlines association. but the government say he will not consider them unless the T&T bid falls through. that's because they reach an advance stage with Caribbean airlines.

[Deeks]

Trini own Ja, Trini own B'dos. All yuh real crazy. Because some TT journalist or politician looking to get milage on a situation and run their , they feel TT own the Caribbean? That is real crock. The opposition to TT anything goes way beyond that. TT could own just ONLY a chenette tree and they will complain. But we can't change the way people feel about. That is just human nature.

But I have no issues with intra-island ownership. Business owners only see after their self interest and interest of their shareholders. I oppose the investment in A JA because of TT gov't INCOMPETENCE. CAL barely keeping it head above water and they want to take on massive undertaking like that. NO. It may be good business move, but not with this administration.

[Jah Gol]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

I never suggested that T&T could take over Jamaica nor do I hold any such ambition. However, from the reports I've been reading and many of the comments I've heard It's clear to me that a significant number of Jamaicans are weary of the presence of T&T based companies in their country.  That poll while anything but scientific is an indicator of that sentiment. The are 3 choices, not two- Sell, Don't Sell and Don't Sell to 'Trinidad'.   

BTW try to insert some paragraphs

I'm sorry you misinterpreted the statement. 

[jahkingdom]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

I never suggested that T&T could take over Jamaica nor do I hold any such ambition. However, from the reports I've been reading and many of the comments I've heard It's clear to me that a significant number of Jamaicans are weary of the presence of T&T based companies in their country.  That poll while anything but scientific is an indicator of that sentiment. The are 3 choices, not two- Sell, Don't Sell and Don't Sell to 'Trinidad'.   

BTW try to insert some paragraphs

I'm sorry you misinterpreted the statement. 

am not saying you said it. i was just referring to why some people are protesting the sale. i was talking about some Trinidadian, not that you said it. but like some who keep saying it to different Jamaicans which could cause anger and could cause violence because some Jamaican are very patriotic and short temper.

[Jah Gol]

There is a growing sense of frustration at the state of their economy. They feel that they don't own their country and they feel especially threatened by the presence of T&T in JA. They often cite TCL and RBTT's presence as a some form of Trini takeover of JA business. That poll suggests 1) opposition to T&T control of their airline 2) a feeling that the airline should be controlled by Jamaicans.

nobody in Jamaica don't feel no threatened by no Trinidad take over, because Trinidad cannot take over Jamaica. Jamaica has an abundant of companies. T&T has stake in 10 companies. the government has announce that he will be releasing 20 companies from his books which are dept riddle companies. Jamaica government only owns a small portion of Jamaican companies. sandals and a lot of other major Jamaican company are not own by the government, but by different Jamaican business man. the companies that T&T are buying are the ones that the government mismanage. and Jamaica understand that we have to get sell of these companies to improve the economy,but a lot of people do not want no more companies be sold to Trinidad even if it means closing it. for some strange reason Trinidadian have these weird attitude to walk around and talk crap about " we own Jamaica", i did not know that owning ten companies make you own a country. china own  a lot more companies in America but don't here them talking about they own America. i have also herd a Barbados youth talking about the same thing. say trinis say they own Barbados. Michal lee chin owns companies in Barbados, Trinidad, Canada but i never herd a Jamaican saying they own other people country. butch Stewart also bought business in Bahamas. i could care less if Air Jamaica is sold because flights are easy to get to Jamaica, farm workers may be affected. Jamaica has a total of three domestic air lines, i just hope they don't sell the name air Jamaica so in the future a new company can expand with that name. the people knows that Jamaicans own allot of stuff they only say they will not own anything because they do not want the government to sell air Jamaica to Trinidad, that the only reason.  some of these companies that T&T buy you would have taught they all would be profitable. T&T will have to sell back Mercado to make sure Clico do not close. Carib cement is still in dept with stock pill inventory because they now produce the worse cement, so Jamaicans now import cement rather than buy from Carib. Caribbean airlines have not yet turn a profit.

I never suggested that T&T could take over Jamaica nor do I hold any such ambition. However, from the reports I've been reading and many of the comments I've heard It's clear to me that a significant number of Jamaicans are weary of the presence of T&T based companies in their country.  That poll while anything but scientific is an indicator of that sentiment. The are 3 choices, not two- Sell, Don't Sell and Don't Sell to 'Trinidad'.   

BTW try to insert some paragraphs

I'm sorry you misinterpreted the statement. 

am not saying you said it. i was just referring to why some people are protesting the sale. i was talking about some Trinidadian, not that you said it. but like some who keep saying it to different Jamaicans which could cause anger and could cause violence because some Jamaican are very patriotic and short temper.

Cool. That person is misguided.

[Sam]

T&T taking over Jamaica.

We control JPS (Jamaica Public Services in Jamaica) which is manage by PJ Patterson two kids who is based in T&T.

Portmore Cement factories.

And now or soon Air Jamaica, which I think is a bad move because Air Jamaica is always grounded in USA and gets heavy fines.

[jahkingdom]

T&T taking over Jamaica.

We control JPS (Jamaica Public Services in Jamaica) which is manage by PJ Patterson two kids who is based in T&T.

Portmore Cement factories.

And now or soon Air Jamaica, which I think is a bad move because Air Jamaica is always grounded in USA and gets heavy fines.

keep making your self looking stupid this is what i was talking about earlier. even your own power grid have foreign owners in it.



In the early days, several towns had their own electric companies; but through a process of consolidation, buy-outs and amalgamations, Jamaica Public Service Company Limited emerged and was registered in 1923. At that time, JPS had 3,928 customers, a far cry from today's customer base of over 585,000. JPS was granted an all-island franchise in 1966, and today remains the sole public supplier of electricity.

The nature of the ownership of JPS has changed several times throughout our history. The company started out as a private company, owned by foreign shareholders. In 1970, the Government of Jamaica acquired controlling interest. In 2001, ownership of JPS returned to private hands when Mirant Corporation, a US-based energy service provider acquired 80 percent of the company, with the Government retaining almost 20 percent. The remainder, amounting to less than 1 percent, is owned by a small group of shareholders.

In 2007, Mirant sold its majority shares to Marubeni Caribbean Power Holdings (MCPH) Inc, a subsidiary of Marubeni Corporation of Japan. In early 2009 Abu Dhabi National Energy Company (TAQA) of the United Arab Emirates, joined Marubeni as co-owner of the Jamaica Public Service Co. Ltd. Majority shares are therefore jointly held by Marubeni TAQA Caribbean. In addition to Jamaica, MCPH has interests in utility companies in Trinidad and Tobago, the Bahamas, and Curacao.

http://www.myjpsco.com/about_us/our_history.php

http://www.myjpsco.com/news/000003.php


http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20070815/business/business2.html


Marubeni Caribbean Power Holdings (MCPH) Inc, a subsidiary of Marubeni Corporation of Japan

an just so you know you will not be owning air jamaica you will be getting the 6 aircrafs and some crap routs. jamaica will be geting stake in Caribbean airlines.


http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20100211/lead/lead2.html

Golding noted it was made clear in the negotiations that the Air Jamaica brand was not for sale, as this would be retained by the Government.

In addition to keeping the name Air Jamaica, Government will also retain its popular Fort Lauderdale, New York, Philadelphia, Toronto and Baltimore destinations
.

BTW witch cement factory in portmore
any way you must mean Rockfort in Kingston, you could keep expand it, it getting larger.but  no one is buy from it any  more, because the cement quality is no good like in the pass. 
http://www.caribcement.com/news/project2.asp

http://www.caribcement.com/news/project1.asp


but you guys just wasting money better save for rainy days. oil will not be around for ever. that money could go well to make sure T&T have water and hospitals maybe like this.http://cayjam.com/

isn't this going to take away the little they getting?

http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20070815/business/business3.html

http://cemcorpcement.com/5401.html



does this means Jamaican owns the Caribbean?, because i sure T&T does not own half these company in any country. http://yourhiddenpotential.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/entrepreneur-profile-michael-lee-chin/


http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20090225/business/business1.html


http://www.hotelschool.cornell.edu/research/chr/news/newsroom/item-details.html?id=4043013

[Bitter]

I try to look up faring companies. but faring.com doh work...

[AirMan]

Any news from our own T&T Government?? ..Check this..http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20100212/lead/lead2.html

[Jah Gol]

This is a horrible move. For all the losses that AJ made their customers are loyal to the brand. This could backfire bigtime. There is already talk of a boycott.

[AirMan]

This is a horrible move. For all the losses that AJ made their customers are loyal to the brand. This could backfire bigtime. There is already talk of a boycott.

But why must we have to get most of the info from JA press ??..T&T taxpayers money is part of this too, so our Government is not feeling obligated to make all the info public when developments happen..??

[jahkingdom]

This is a horrible move. For all the losses that AJ made their customers are loyal to the brand. This could backfire bigtime. There is already talk of a boycott.

this will backfire on both county.

disadvantage Jamaica:

 lost of tourist. also remember their biggest passengers were the  Jamaican diaspora. and remember the diaspora was trying to get the airline with the airline association and got turn down. do they really thing they are going to fly on Caribbean airlines?


disadvantage Trinidad:
the profit that Caribbean airline is anticipating may turn in to dept. why?, because the deal states Jamaica will not sell its important routs, so therefore Caribbean airlines cannot redirect those routs, so what if the diaspora decide not to take Caribbean airlines?, are they going to fly empty planes?. the difference between Jamaica and Trinidad is that more planes fly to Jamaica than Trinidad, so a Jamaican can easily switch to Jet blue or whatever. if this happen Caribbean airline will be in trouble. i read an article in the Trinidad news paper a while back where a Trini at U.W.I state that air Jamaica would be a good buy only if Trinidad do not have to honer Jamaican routs and tourism obligations.but Trinidad will have to do the opposite because Jamaica will not sell those routs.


advantage Jamaica:

Jamaica will not sale "air Jamaica" so this could re open in the future are could be sold to a Jamaican million or billionaire who interested in starting a new national air line. or if one of three domestic airline wishes to expand internationally. Jamaica will also keep all its important routs. Jamaica will have no less than 10% shares in Caribbean airline so they would also have a say in its management.

advantage Trinidad:
any profit made will go to Trinidad

[Controversial]

the tt govt is smart, all those losses by air jamaica will be used to write off profits by caribbean airlines, smart move, plus its a bigger reveune for CA if it is run properly

[Bitter]

The final step is to pull in LIAT and make an airline big enough to compete.

If Jamaicans feel that by boycotting CAL they will roll back the clock they are mistaken. The choices are: Caribbean Airlines or Nothing. And then you are relying on an airlines with zero connection to the island to provide service. CAL is doing its best to run profitable routes.

Routes/slots are not salable unless you are using them. You can't hold them for later. If you stop using them, they will be given to someone else.

I suppose we could look back to 1962 and talk about the demise of the Federation.  Bottom line, if the planes are empty, CAL will stop flying those routes unless the Jamaican Gov't want's to throw in some cash.

[jahkingdom]

The final step is to pull in LIAT and make an airline big enough to compete.

If Jamaicans feel that by boycotting CAL they will roll back the clock they are mistaken. The choices are: Caribbean Airlines or Nothing. And then you are relying on an airlines with zero connection to the island to provide service. CAL is doing its best to run profitable routes.

Routes/slots are not salable unless you are using them. You can't hold them for later. If you stop using them, they will be given to someone else.

I suppose we could look back to 1962 and talk about the demise of the Federation.  Bottom line, if the planes are empty, CAL will stop flying those routes unless the Jamaican Gov't want's to throw in some cash.

wouldn't this be a breach of contract if the airline is also a designated national carrier. so then the deal would turn upside down. anyway its going to be fun to watch this play out. am a bit sorry for Bruse Golding.

[Bitter]

If Designated National Carrier mean that empty planes must fly where you tell them, then this will buss before the end of the year.

What it does mean is that CAL is offered subsidies or other fiscal incentives by the Jamaican Gov't. in other words. we'll pony up some cash if you hook us up.  Which is probably how we ended up here in the first place.

[truetrini]

This is a horrible move. For all the losses that AJ made their customers are loyal to the brand. This could backfire bigtime. There is already talk of a boycott.

this will backfire on both county.

disadvantage Jamaica:

 lost of tourist. also remember their biggest passengers were the  Jamaican diaspora. and remember the diaspora was trying to get the airline with the airline association and got turn down. do they really thing they are going to fly on Caribbean airlines?


disadvantage Trinidad:
the profit that Caribbean airline is anticipating may turn in to dept. why?, because the deal states Jamaica will not sell its important routs, so therefore Caribbean airlines cannot redirect those routs, so what if the diaspora decide not to take Caribbean airlines?, are they going to fly empty planes?. the difference between Jamaica and Trinidad is that more planes fly to Jamaica than Trinidad, so a Jamaican can easily switch to Jet blue or whatever. if this happen Caribbean airline will be in trouble. i read an article in the Trinidad news paper a while back where a Trini at U.W.I state that air Jamaica would be a good buy only if Trinidad do not have to honer Jamaican routs and tourism obligations.but Trinidad will have to do the opposite because Jamaica will not sell those routs.


advantage Jamaica:

Jamaica will not sale "air Jamaica" so this could re open in the future are could be sold to a Jamaican million or billionaire who interested in starting a new national air line. or if one of three domestic airline wishes to expand internationally. Jamaica will also keep all its important routs. Jamaica will have no less than 10% shares in Caribbean airline so they would also have a say in its management.

advantage Trinidad:
any profit made will go to Trinidad

Stop taking nonsense.  there are NO Jamaicans that fly Air Jamaica just for pride, they may say this now, but the bottom line is cost of air fare.  If what yu were sayin was truthful Spirit AA etc. would not be fling into Jamaica as their planes would have been empty.

Diaspora and JALPA were not in any real position to hold the airline that is Billions in debt.  The real advantage is CAL is taking over the airline without...WITHOUT the Air Jamaica debt.

Tourists look for the best prices when going on vacation first, frequent flier miles after and then whatever else is left.  Bottom line is Dominican Republic is number one tourist destination in the Caribbeana nd they DO NOT HAVE a national airline!

Air Jamaica is about to fold up anyway as the IRS (US TAX SERVICE) is owed US 40 million dollars, Jamaica has no cash to pay that, and the IRS can move on their planes, right now Air Jam is trying to sell 2 planes to pay the IRS!!!

The Jamaican government cannot even afford to keep the planes in the air after MArch due to serious cash flow problems, translated:  JAmaica is dead broke, as in bankrupt and thats why they ahd to go to the IMF!  The IMF says sell by march 31 or we not giving you money.  Bruce Golding is doing what many before did not have the belly, guts and brains to do..sell that piece of money sucking airline!

CAL is already in discussions with LIAT and they met in Antigua...soon LIAT will be part of Caribbean Airlines.  Financially, T&T is a Tiger in a sea of pussy cats.

Additionally, there is no way Air Jamaica can tell CA that they not having certain routes, that is stupid to believe, when we take it over we are taking ALL of it over EXCEPT the debt.

Airline tickets to be honoured

Also, the fuel hedge now enjoyed by Caribbean Airlines will be extended to the Jamaica operations.

Caribbean Airlines will honour airline tickets bought on Air Jamaica on routes which will comprise the Jamaican operation and have not yet flown at the time of the closing of Air Jamaica. On or before the closing, "the Government of Jamaica will pay to Caribbean Airlines an amount equal to 93 per cent of the passenger fare value of the Air Jamaica ticket fares".

In consideration for all of the above, the agreement shall contain an anti-dilution provision "to insure that Government of Jamaica retains no less than a 10 per cent equity interest in Caribbean Airlines after closing, giving effect to any equity funding post-closing needed to meet the requisite cash threshold. Such securities shall be of the same class of securities held by the Government of Trinidad and Tobago and there shall be no securities senior to it".

The Government of Jamaica will also appoint one director to the board of Caribbean Airlines.

[jahkingdom]

the way this deal is. it does not look like sale of air Jamaica. it seems like air Jamaica will be close after march 31, and Caribbean airline will then get its aircraft and fly on does routs. the name is not sold and the routs are not sold, it seems a bit funny. there must be more to this.  

[jahkingdom]

This is a horrible move. For all the losses that AJ made their customers are loyal to the brand. This could backfire bigtime. There is already talk of a boycott.

this will backfire on both county.

disadvantage Jamaica:

 lost of tourist. also remember their biggest passengers were the  Jamaican diaspora. and remember the diaspora was trying to get the airline with the airline association and got turn down. do they really thing they are going to fly on Caribbean airlines?


disadvantage Trinidad:
the profit that Caribbean airline is anticipating may turn in to dept. why?, because the deal states Jamaica will not sell its important routs, so therefore Caribbean airlines cannot redirect those routs, so what if the diaspora decide not to take Caribbean airlines?, are they going to fly empty planes?. the difference between Jamaica and Trinidad is that more planes fly to Jamaica than Trinidad, so a Jamaican can easily switch to Jet blue or whatever. if this happen Caribbean airline will be in trouble. i read an article in the Trinidad news paper a while back where a Trini at U.W.I state that air Jamaica would be a good buy only if Trinidad do not have to honer Jamaican routs and tourism obligations.but Trinidad will have to do the opposite because Jamaica will not sell those routs.


advantage Jamaica:

Jamaica will not sale "air Jamaica" so this could re open in the future are could be sold to a Jamaican million or billionaire who interested in starting a new national air line. or if one of three domestic airline wishes to expand internationally. Jamaica will also keep all its important routs. Jamaica will have no less than 10% shares in Caribbean airline so they would also have a say in its management.

advantage Trinidad:
any profit made will go to Trinidad

Stop taking nonsense.  there are NO Jamaicans that fly Air Jamaica just for pride, they may say this now, but the bottom line is cost of air fare.  If what yu were sayin was truthful Spirit AA etc. would not be fling into Jamaica as their planes would have been empty.

Diaspora and JALPA were not in any real position to hold the airline that is Billions in debt.  The real advantage is CAL is taking over the airline without...WITHOUT the Air Jamaica debt.

Tourists look for the best prices when going on vacation first, frequent flier miles after and then whatever else is left.  Bottom line is Dominican Republic is number one tourist destination in the Caribbeana nd they DO NOT HAVE a national airline!

Air Jamaica is about to fold up anyway as the IRS (US TAX SERVICE) is owed US 40 million dollars, Jamaica has no cash to pay that, and the IRS can move on their planes, right now Air Jam is trying to sell 2 planes to pay the IRS!!!

The Jamaican government cannot even afford to keep the planes in the air after MArch due to serious cash flow problems, translated:  JAmaica is dead broke, as in bankrupt and thats why they ahd to go to the IMF!  The IMF says sell by march 31 or we not giving you money.  Bruce Golding is doing what many before did not have the belly, guts and brains to do..sell that piece of money sucking airline!

CAL is already in discussions with LIAT and they met in Antigua...soon LIAT will be part of Caribbean Airlines.  Financially, T&T is a Tiger in a sea of pussy cats.

Additionally, there is no way Air Jamaica can tell CA that they not having certain routes, that is stupid to believe, when we take it over we are taking ALL of it over EXCEPT the debt.

Airline tickets to be honoured

Also, the fuel hedge now enjoyed by Caribbean Airlines will be extended to the Jamaica operations.

Caribbean Airlines will honour airline tickets bought on Air Jamaica on routes which will comprise the Jamaican operation and have not yet flown at the time of the closing of Air Jamaica. On or before the closing, "the Government of Jamaica will pay to Caribbean Airlines an amount equal to 93 per cent of the passenger fare value of the Air Jamaica ticket fares".

In consideration for all of the above, the agreement shall contain an anti-dilution provision "to insure that Government of Jamaica retains no less than a 10 per cent equity interest in Caribbean Airlines after closing, giving effect to any equity funding post-closing needed to meet the requisite cash threshold. Such securities shall be of the same class of securities held by the Government of Trinidad and Tobago and there shall be no securities senior to it".

The Government of Jamaica will also appoint one director to the board of Caribbean Airlines.

i am 100% with the sale of air Jamaica and i also know that this should have happen along time, i already know we will have to sell the two aircraft and  all that already. i  think Golding is doing the right thing and i think Jamaica economic future is bright.you say they just talking they not going to take Caribbean airline?, more Jamaican fly on air Jamaica than tourist and the funny thing so far is that Caribbean air line is not yet flying to Jamaica and five person i know already cancel there ticket. that why i say its going to be interesting to watch. watch 

[JDB]

the way this deal is. it does not look like sale of air Jamaica. it seems like air Jamaica will be close after march 31, and Caribbean airline will then get its aircraft and fly on does routs. the name is not sold and the routs are not sold, it seems a bit funny. there must be more to this.  

keeping the routes and the name is a moot point if CA is the National Carrier for as long as they choose to be and Air Jamaica is bankrupt. They are a worse prospect for revival by a third party now because the Govt has to support CA.

Form the looks of it for all the talk about pride and supporting the national airline Air Jamaica was a massive failure. The posters who lamenting the loss of an intra-island route probably missing the fact that the route is not profitable. If it is CA will take it on, if it isn’t they won’t

As for flying it will be all about cost. Jamaicans would have to be dotish to fly on a service where they get less value just to spite CA.

[jahkingdom]

the way this deal is. it does not look like sale of air Jamaica. it seems like air Jamaica will be close after march 31, and Caribbean airline will then get its aircraft and fly on does routs. the name is not sold and the routs are not sold, it seems a bit funny. there must be more to this.  

keeping the routes and the name is a moot point if CA is the National Carrier for as long as they choose to be and Air Jamaica is bankrupt. They are a worse prospect for revival by a third party now because the Govt has to support CA.

Form the looks of it for all the talk about pride and supporting the national airline Air Jamaica was a massive failure. The posters who lamenting the loss of an intra-island route probably missing the fact that the route is not profitable. If it is CA will take it on, if it isn’t they won’t

As for flying it will be all about cost. Jamaicans would have to be dotish to fly on a service where they get less value just to spite CA.

it seems like you never been to Jamaica before  ,fact is a lot of Jamaicans do not support anything if its not from Jamaica. if they say they going to do that trust me they will. the media is run by the people if they say don't play so and so, and that channel still play it. that channel would lose listeners or viewers very quickly.