Who will take over from LARA?

[gtokyo]

I keep searching for some emerging talent who can secure LARA position when he decides to retire. Does anyone see any emeging stars apart from the likes of Lendl Simmons(Trinidad) or N.Deonarine(Guyana) ...and these names will not get me far but I do believe that they are both talented

[vibetrini]

Talented yes - but who has ever shown to be more talented in battin than Lara? He is considered to be the best batting talent ever by many. Hard to see anyone filling those shoes for years even decades to come. However for team unity, the team may indeed start to perform beter as a unit when lara leaves. I think the other batsmen feel overshadowed by him, as to them he is at a batting level where they want to be and so their confidence is low when Lara is in d team...

[cm103]

Talented yes - but who has ever shown to be more talented in battin than Lara? He is considered to be the best batting talent ever by many. Hard to see anyone filling those shoes for years even decades to come. However for team unity, the team may indeed start to perform beter as a unit when lara leaves. I think the other batsmen feel overshadowed by him, as to them he is at a batting level where they want to be and so their confidence is low when Lara is in d team...

I would have to agree with the confidence thing but dem men have to adjust. If they getting horrors off men in dey own team den they need to check deyself.

Like Micheal Jordan, there will never be another just like him...many pretenders, many who are good in their own right and will probably break Brian's record...but there will never be another Lara like there will never be another Bradman.

[trinidad badboy]

i really cant tell you, cuz no one to me seems as though thay can fill his shoes. the confidence, determination, style, grace and experience.....   i have seen anyone step up to that level yett.

[TrinInfinite]

Bravo, he is de next sobers, ive been sayin dis for a few years now, he will be a better allround player and bastman dan lara

[cm103]

Bravo good..if he is d next sobers is a different story. Even Phil Simmonds had some stellar games and Bravo still go hadda prove heself.

I guess I a bit pessimistic here, men like Franklyn Rose had great debuts in bowling for we and didn't amount to anything. Bravo should be a mainstay in d side now but in Sobers class he have a ways to go. A few good overseas tours for him and I might be eating dem words though.

[Slacker]

Bravo, he is de next sobers, ive been sayin dis for a few years now, he will be a better allround player and bastman dan lara

What is this i hearing here? Bravo will be a better batsman and allrounder than Lara? 

OK boss, to each his own yes 

[fishs]

Bravo, he is de next sobers, ive been sayin dis for a few years now, he will be a better allround player and bastman dan lara

Ah know yuh like de youthman as much as I do buh.. it go take another decade before we see de start of ah new Lara.

Bravo by far is de brightest prospect we have to go on and become another WI legend. He will be better than Malcolm Marshall (RIP) because of his batting, he will be miles ahead of de Juliens, Kings, Holford, Boyce etc.

In comparison to Sobers he will have to learn to bowl offbreaks and legbreaks (maybe in time ) , so fuh dat comparison I waiting.
He definitely going to be better than Flintoff , Kallis, Afridi etc as an allrounder.

But Trinifinite.... Ah like how yuh thinking.

[vibetrini]

Bravo aint no Lara - by this I mean that he doh have the battin flair of Lara (who does) ... yes we see he have potential to be a consistent batsman (i would guess that by the end of his career he would average in the 40s in Test cricket), and he can be more than an average medium pace bowler (see him averaging in the middle to late 20's per wicket) ... could be one ah d better fielders we ever had, I give him dat, but in terms of batting...

 I see he could become real good, but not a Lara and in bowling i see him as being one ah d best medium pace bowlers, but remember Sobers could bowl with genuine pace so i doh think he would be a sobers in terms of bowling....

with dat said, i think in terms of comittment and creativity as an allrounder he can be unmatched in world cricket in a couple yrs... buh his medium pace go only carry him so far I feel, look at Pollock now - jus a medium pacer and could swing and move d ball every which way he wants buh cuz he lose dat pace he is no longer considered one ah d 5 best bowlers in world cricket... and bravo doh have pollocks consistency in line and length yet, nor the ability to hit the seam as often... not yet, but even when he does, medium pace can only go so far in my opinion ... i want him to prove me wrong though!

[TrinInfinite]

sobers dont have de flair like lara either, lara is one of de most attacking west indian batsman in history, apart from khanhai, viv, rowe and sobers afterwards, sobers was steady, classical, he played de forward defensive regularly, it was his trademark tuh deaden a ball with magnificent form, lara will tear u apart with eye catching magnificance

Bravo, will learn to bowl faster, but will bowl med pace swingers, then off breaks and leg breaks, then his fielding right now is de bess in de world, hands down, his athleticism is top of de line, i give him 3 years, and he will be the closest ting tuh sobers, ramdin will also be de best wicket keeper batsman in de world, he will surpass gilchrist and will also take on captaincy.

[TrinInfinite]

u think mcgrath is a pace bowler? i doubt it, watching him in de tests, he is med-pace and is one of de bess, pace aint shit dese days, spin and med are the wave of the future, line and length will always rule

[vibetrini]

TrinInfinite i feel yuh vibe - buh McGrath is a lil quicker dan Bravo and he like wha 39 yrs old (?) plus he's 6'5 (?) ... i not sure how much faster bravo can bowl, if u iz 23 and 5'9 and still bowling medium, i doubt u could increase by more dan 5 mph on a steady basis if dat.

even top batsmen admit that balls in d 80 mph range doh friten dem, buh once it start hitiin 90 mph + ... top batsmen does get a lil tizzic.

look at aktar pace... u ever see a man rattle a top order batsman's stumps as much as he does? pace could breach a solid defence... medium pace go struggle to do the same in comparison.

i like your assesment of ramdin - he could become d best wicketkeeper/batsman, buh he have to learn to concentrate for 5 days, and so not drop 'easy' chances (easy by international standards) ... and yes, i think he have a great chance to be captain in a few years

bravo can become d best allrounder in a few yrs, buh again, i'll be surprised if he becomes one of the best bowlers in the history of world cricket, like Sobers is still considered to be

[Jefferz]

u think mcgrath is a pace bowler? i doubt it, watching him in de tests, he is med-pace and is one of de bess, pace aint shit dese days, spin and med are the wave of the future, line and length will always rule

That is the most idiotic thing ive ever heard. Of course pace is key. STEWPS. OF COURSE PACE COUNTS. you tink bret lee has good line and length NO. full down the legside short on the offside? its his pace and swing that saves him. AND McGrath bowls consistantly from a range of 81mphs-87mphs. That is imbetween a medium fast and fast bowler. NOT a medium pace bowler. Bravo doesnt usually have the best consistency with line and length but he can bowl a consistent amount of uniquely attacking balls. Always testing a batsman. Mcgrath is probably the best fast boweler ever an no matter wa we say we cyah take da away.

[ribbit]

u think mcgrath is a pace bowler? i doubt it, watching him in de tests, he is med-pace and is one of de bess, pace aint shit dese days, spin and med are the wave of the future, line and length will always rule

That is the most idiotic thing ive ever heard. Of course pace is key. STEWPS. OF COURSE PACE COUNTS. you tink bret lee has good line and length NO. full down the legside short on the offside? its his pace and swing that saves him. AND McGrath bowls consistantly from a range of 81mphs-87mphs. That is imbetween a medium fast and fast bowler. NOT a medium pace bowler. Bravo doesnt usually have the best consistency with line and length but he can bowl a consistent amount of uniquely attacking balls. Always testing a batsman. Mcgrath is probably the best fast boweler ever an no matter wa we say we cyah take da away.

pace important but with all the protective equipment these days, batters aren't as fraid to stand in against even the akhtars and lees. back when the west indies had the killer pace attack, there was real fear for the batsmen. pace that doesn't result in wickets is a real waste of time and effort i find.

swing and spin are timeless. look what flintoff did to the aussies? that was domination.

[dwolfman]

this question highlights one of the biggest problems we face here in the Caribbean. Why bother trying to find a replacement for Lara? Australia continued on without Border, England without Botham. Lara is and can only ever be an individual on a team. Rather than worrying about replacing Lara we need to worry about putting together a competitive team where reliance individual brilliance (that usually comes too seldom) is not part and parcel of their play.

Lara is a great batsman without doubt, but if we pay attention to the history books we can argue that he is not the most talented batsman ever. I might argue third behind Headley and Sobers another might put him in front of Sobers. What all three have in common is that for their brilliance the teams they played on still did not dominate world cricket. The teams that dominate played as an awesome team rather than a group of talented individuals. Talent and $3.50 will buy you a Fruta.

[vibetrini]

good post dwolfman - we aint sayin that the only answer is a replacement to Lara, cuz every man is his own man, we jus want someone to entertain us as much has he has done throughout his career. U right about talent, buh one thing with talent and the 'coming to age of talent' is that it puts people in the stands and eyes on the tv... flair and talent is entertainment... many if not most people follow sports for no less of a reason.

we want someone or a group of WI cricketers to entertain us as much as a Lara did, as much as an Ambrose did, if we can get fellas who comitted to being a team as well, all the better.

[dwolfman]

I hear yuh vibe, but I am sure most of us would be entertained seeing the Windies win. The Windies will win if players step up and play well consistently. Rather than scoring 200 runs in 6 innings in a series and 114 came in one innings wouldn't we be more entertained to see 250 runs in the same 6 innings with 3 or 4 half centuries? Wouldn't that be better for the team? That's all that I am saying. Time to build teams. Good teams will entertain. 

[Savannah boy]

Replace Lara?!  Not in de near future.

[TrinInfinite]

lara is de greatest, not headley and sobers, dey behind lara, heres why dey behind lara, lara is de most studied batsman in the history of the game, de aussies know and watch lara more than dey know and watch de wives, in the age of video and technology, lara is by far de greatest, nobdoy studied sobers and headley to anywhere near de capacity like lara, and plus sobers never brake bradman's records like lara, against even faster and more intimidating bowling, lara by far is de greatest batsman, yuh cant take dat away from him

[dwolfman]

lara is de greatest, not headley and sobers, dey behind lara, heres why dey behind lara, lara is de most studied batsman in the history of the game, de aussies know and watch lara more than dey know and watch de wives, in the age of video and technology, lara is by far de greatest, nobdoy studied sobers and headley to anywhere near de capacity like lara, and plus sobers never brake bradman's records like lara, against even faster and more intimidating bowling, lara by far is de greatest batsman, yuh cant take dat away from him

*sigh* Present facts. You do not know that Lara is the most studied batsman. Any team will target the best players on it, not so? Lara is the best batsman we have seen without a doubt, but there are others who we have not seen and they have performed against the best of their time. Right now you are letting insularity rather than a logical presentation rule (as usual). Come with a better argument than that, padner. Thompson and Lilly were among the most intimidating in the game ever with comparitive speeds to today's quickest. Ahktar and Lee aside and neither of Lara's records were against them. That is not taking anything away from Lara or the amazing things he has accomplished, but your argument is flawed. Fix it and come again.

[cm103]

Lara is the best batsman (arguably) to grace this game but after him if we have some consisntency and men hungry to win den we don't need a superstar like him.

We got accustomed to him coming in and bringing the excitement of knowing he could turn a match around, imagine if we didn't need that because any of them players could step up and bring it home.

I dare to mention South Africa and Austrailia, no clear superstar player but every one is capable of a match winning performance under different situations. We need that.

[dwolfman]

Any man who insists that Ganga should be in the team does not know the game inside out. Any man who can say that men like Headly or Sobers are mentioned because people are jealous of Lara's achievements not only knows very little about the game, but is so completely confounded by insular thoughts that he probably couldn't tell the different between a Jamaican and his grandmother.

Brian Lara is among the most celebrated cricketers ANYWHERE in the world, including the Caribbean. You are not the only person with links to other Caribbean islands. I remember him saying once that one of his problems with home is that he doesn't always feel as appreciated as when he travels. I heard it from his mouth, not second hand.

Lara, like any class player, is studied by his opponents. Before our reliance on computers men were able to observe using their God given gifts and make assesments about a player's strengths and weakenesses. Coaches would sit at games and make notes using good old fashioned pen and paper. They could tell you how many runs a player scored on the offside or onside, infront or behind square, balls faced to balls scored and so on. You are an ignoramus and blissfully unaware of this fact.

As for what I use as my avatar... hold a f**k off! Come and talk cricket and we can agree to disagree that's cool. I'll try to treat you with respect and I hope that you will return the favour. If not then so be it. You are not a cricketing guru, you're as ordinary as me. Know your place.

[Jefferz]

Any man who insists that Ganga should be in the team does not know the game inside out. Any man who can say that men like Headly or Sobers are mentioned because people are jealous of Lara's achievements not only knows very little about the game, but is so completely confounded by insular thoughts that he probably couldn't tell the different between a Jamaican and his grandmother.

Brian Lara is among the most celebrated cricketers ANYWHERE in the world, including the Caribbean. You are not the only person with links to other Caribbean islands. I remember him saying once that one of his problems with home is that he doesn't always feel as appreciated as when he travels. I heard it from his mouth, not second hand.

Lara, like any class player, is studied by his opponents. Before our reliance on computers men were able to observe using their God given gifts and make assesments about a player's strengths and weakenesses. Coaches would sit at games and make notes using good old fashioned pen and paper. They could tell you how many runs a player scored on the offside or onside, infront or behind square, balls faced to balls scored and so on. You are an ignoramus and blissfully unaware of this fact.

As for what I use as my avatar... hold a f**k off! Come and talk cricket and we can agree to disagree that's cool. I'll try to treat you with respect and I hope that you will return the favour. If not then so be it. You are not a cricketing guru, you're as ordinary as me. Know your place.

Well said! These fellahz need to go into cricinfo archives or read a 5oth aniversary book on West Indies cuz like dey doh know shit man.

Again. Well said.

[TrinInfinite]

schupssssss, i doh know shit? lol, allyuh funny yes, i never discredited sobers or headley, but why cant laras name be mentioned by itself, when he stands on his own, with achievements that no other west indian has done, insular my ass, allyuh people on here de ress of the islands, when dey dont love we or even care

WOLFMAN AND JEFFERZ, ALLYUH ANSWER THIS QUESTION, HAS TECHNOLOGY MADE THE MODERN DAY GAME OF CRICKET MORE DIFFICULT FOR BATSMAN AND HAS IT CREATED MORE COMPETITION?

WHEN ALLYUH ANSWER DIS QUESTION, THEN AND ONLY THEN YOU WILL REALIZE THE DEPT OF MY ARGUMENT, UNTIL THEN ALLYUH PRAISE AND LOVE UP THE OTHER CRICKET NATIONS, SINCE WHEN JEFFERZ IS MR CRICKET?

[Jefferz]

You dont know who sobers or headly really are you jackass!


i nut go reply tuh yuh shit boy you just so f**kin childish!

[dwolfman]

Well now I know TI is a complete idiot. What does this have to do with praising or loving another cricket region? Never once have I mentioned another cricketing nation nor have I heaped praise on anyone besides Headley, Sobers or Lara.

Has technology in the modern game made things more difficult for batsmen and has it created more competition? I thought the whole point of all the electronic marvels was to improve the game of cricket across the board. You are limiting improved technology to the ability to see a batsman on a television and to replay it over and over. How exactly has that made batting more difficult and created more competition? What about improvements in cricket equipment? Bats are better made enabling more powerful shots. The batsman's padding is stronger and more likely to protect a batsman from pace bowling at his body leading to a more confident batsman since the fear of being hurt is minimised. What about improvements in training and dietary habits? Have all these technological improvements made batting more difficult?

Lastly, what do you mean by "created more competition"? Do you mean that games are more competitive? Does it mean that more people can do the things that batsmen did 30 plus years ago? What exactly do you mean?

Your argument contains as much dept as a dinner plate and not much more sense.

Sobers - 93 Test matches with 160 innings, 8032 runs at an average of 57.78 and 26 centuries (a century every 6.1 innings)
Headley - 22 Test matches with 40 innings, 2190 runs at an average of 60.83 and 10 centuries (a century every 4 innings in a career curtailed by WWII)
Lara - 121 Test matches with 214 innings, 11204 runs at an average of 53.86 and 31 centuries (a century every 6.9 innings)
For the first time I will mention non-West Indian cricketers:
Bradman averaged a century every 2.75 innings and had an average of 99.94
Tendulkar averages a century every 5.80 innings and has an average of 56.71
Gavaskar averages a century every 6.29 innings and had an average of 51.12

Lara has all the West Indian records and for that he will definitely be among the greatest cricketers to have played the game, but there are other batsmen who have showed themselves to be greats of the game as well. We have been fortunate enough to experience Lara in our lifetime so we can appreciate how good he is. Without being around to properly appreciate other greats limits one's judgement especially when one chooses to ignore the efforts of those gone before.

[capodetutticapi]

it will b a very long time when we will b able to see another brian charles lara.lara is to cricket like jordan is to basketball or clay to boxin.pele to football.KND TO SHIT TALK.

[ribbit]

You dont know who sobers or headly really are you jackass!


i nut go reply tuh yuh shit boy you just so f**kin childish!

jefferz have as much consistency as blackcake - he all over the place. he done say lara is the best batsman ever here. when next you changing your mind, tomorrow noon?

dwolfman you started this debate claiming headley and sobers ahead of lara in talent. you using stats from different eras to support this when the game today is clearly different than the game sobers play and the game headley play. you presenting stats sine non qua which is bullshit because you aren't accounting (and can't account) for the different eras. besides which, your claim was about talent and run rates are not a direct measure of talent. you letting cricinfo statsguru tie yuh up.

allyuh arguing about talent which, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

[TrinInfinite]

wolfman talkin about stats, de stats he quotin i know, he still avoidin de question about technology and its influence on the game and the players

WHY ARE YOU AVOIDING THESE QUESTIONS WOLFMAN?

ITS EASY TUH PULL STATS OFF CRIC INFO, BUT CAN READ BETWEEN THE LINES AND ADDRESS THIS ELEMENT?

[dwolfman]

Along with a shocking inability to acknowledge that there are different opinions to yours is an equally shocking inability to read and understand. I've answered about technology already, but for your benefit I'll do so again.

Technology is more than television cameras. Technology is also improvements in equipment. Bats hit the ball further, balls stay hard longer and pads protect batsmen better. Besides that there are also improvements in diet and and training methods (including mental training) so players are fitter, stronger and better prepared mentally. Generally athletes are better conditioned and better equiped. As a result, performances improve.

Television cameras and computers have been introduced into the Caribbean and what has happened? Sarwan and Gayle to name a few will get out the exact same way to the exact same bowler 4 or 5 times per series. We've continued to be swept aside in test series away from home and most of our so called fast bowlers can't put a ball in the same spot 3 times in an over far more with consecutive deliveries. I've seen coaches pull out statistics of batsmen that included how many runs were scored behind square, on the offside, the number of attacking shots, etc. I've even seen a few hand drawn spider charts of scoring shots played by batsmen and all this was 15 years ago. In other words, assessment of players were being done by men willing to use their own God given gifts long before a computer was considered a tool in sporting development. A video clip is useless without someone there to make assessments of what they are seeing. These assessments in turn are useless if the athlete is not mentally equiped to take the information and use it to improve.

So to answer your question for the last time. Yes, technology has had a tremendous impact on modern day sports. Athletes are stronger, quicker and smarter not because of more television angles or computer print outs. Why is it that West Indian players do not possess the same technical or tactical ability of players of our great teams yet they have at their disposal way more television (technology) available to them? Why is it that South African, English or Australian have access to the same technology, but out perform our players?

So what is it that I am avoiding answering? For the second time I have given my view of technology and it's impact on the modern game.

wolfman talkin about stats, de stats he quotin i know, he still avoidin de question about technology and its influence on the game and the players

WHY ARE YOU AVOIDING THESE QUESTIONS WOLFMAN?

ITS EASY TUH PULL STATS OFF CRIC INFO, BUT CAN READ BETWEEN THE LINES AND ADDRESS THIS ELEMENT?