Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: pecan on September 23, 2006, 07:06:53 AM
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Here is an except from today's paper (yes Dutty - is de National Post) on Dual Citizenship.
There is talk to cancel this policy. I know that ppl of T&T birth can now apply for dual citizenship with Canadian. Does the US have a similar policy? Does this polciy benefit either country? should it be allowed? I have mixed feelings ...see below.
What you can do for your country - Why dual citizens should be forced to choose
Andrew Coyne, National Post, Published: Saturday, September 23, 2006
Here's a statistic guaranteed to set your teeth on edge: Of the 15,000 Lebanese citizens evacuated from Beirut by Canadian Forces during last month's war -- the largest such operation this country has mounted since the Second World War, at a cost of $85-million -- some 7,000 are reported to have returned home. Home, as in Lebanon.
Why were Canadian ships sent thousands of miles across the sea to pluck another country's citizens out of harm's way? Because, as you well know, they are also Canadian citizens. That is, they are dual citizens, beneficiaries of a 1977 change in immigration legislation, and as such, though many have not lived or paid taxes in this country for several years, are entitled to all the protections the Canadian state affords......
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Yes we should
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Yes we should
yuh choose trini or canuck citizenship triniman?
yuh name triniman but yuh is ah canuck by birth.
which yuh choose?
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if the US invade Cananda, should the T&T government be obligated to extract the ppl with both T&T and Cdn citizenship?
or vice versa
if there is a military coup in T&T, shoud the Cdn government extract dose ppl who had cdn passports but living most of the year in T&T and only coming up to cananda for medical purpose?
I think if yuh want the benifit of both countries, den yuh better starting paying your share of taxes in both countyries (year round).
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steups.
dem is yu citizens..yuh do whatever to get dem.
yuh doh leave yuh own in harm's way.
dat is what de military dey for anyway...protection from external and internal enemies.
yuh government dey tuh protect yuh. suppose yuh overseas working fuh yuh country in de fus place?
yuh cyar jes take dem who wukking and leave de odders who on vacation.
besides if yuh is ah politican yuh eh leaving yuh citizens in harms way..especially if yuh want to get re-elected
the US will always go fuh dey citizens....!
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There is talk to cancel this policy. I know that ppl of T&T birth can now apply for dual citizenship with Canadian. Does the US have a similar policy? Does this polciy benefit either country? should it be allowed? I have mixed feelings ...see below.
Once you become naturalized in the US the gov't will no longer recognize your foreign documents, however they will not confiscate them - so in essence you can maintain dual citizenship.
I naturalized from being German and let my passport lapse. The Germans actually wanted me to pay 500 Euro to maintain my citizenship with them plus list all my financial/personal ties to Germany. So there you go if they are going to protect you you better have some kind of connection besides birth alone.
My wife still as a valid T&T passport after naturalizing, don't know what she plans to do once it expires yet.
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There is talk to cancel this policy. I know that ppl of T&T birth can now apply for dual citizenship with Canadian. Does the US have a similar policy? Does this polciy benefit either country? should it be allowed? I have mixed feelings ...see below.
Once you become naturalized in the US the gov't will no longer recognize your foreign documents, however they will not confiscate them - so in essence you can maintain dual citizenship.
I naturalized from being German and let my passport lapse. The Germans actually wanted me to pay 500 Euro to maintain my citizenship with them plus list all my financial/personal ties to Germany. So there you go if they are going to protect you you better have some kind of connection besides birth alone.
My wife still as a valid T&T passport after naturalizing, don't know what she plans to do once it expires yet.
Thins is technically you really doh ahve dual citizenship..because the us makes you abdicate any alleigance to foreignn lands.
now yuh country of birth may allow it.
but even in de cae ah T&T yuh have tuh get yuh yankee passport stamped as a citizen ah T&T.
I did it,
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I talking about citizens of convenience ... thre is a moral versus legal issue.
For ex: the cdn/lebones who live in Lebanon, doh speak english and doh give a s**t about canada. Why should my tax $$ pay for their evacuation onlt to have dem run back to Lebanaon de moment the shooting stop.
I eh talking about the cdn/lenanose who conducts busineee in Lebanon, but has a moral allegiance to canada.
That is my issue ... if yuh want to maintain dual citenzhip, den you need to have a moral connection to both countries.
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I talking about citizens of convenience ... thre is a moral versus legal issue.
For ex: the cdn/lebones who live in Lebanon, doh speak english and doh give a s**t about canada. Why should my tax $$ pay for their evacuation onlt to have dem run back to Lebanaon de moment the shooting stop.
I eh talking about the cdn/lenanose who conducts busineee in Lebanon, but has a moral allegiance to canada.
That is my issue ... if yuh want to maintain dual citenzhip, den you need to have a moral connection to both countries.
I understood that. However, I asked should the government extricate those on legit business and leave the rest?
What will the moral rational be for such an action?
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The way I look at it.. even as trinis become US citizen or Canadian citizens... there is nothing that stops you from not being a trinidad citizen.. as long as your birth certificate says trinidad and tobago.. your ledgit.. who is to say your not trini? If we move back to trinidad tomorrow.. which trinidad immigration officer going and tell yuh doh come?
TT make a good point dey... I ehh know much about the Canadian citizenship but if you have a US passport it makes scene to get the stamp saying that your a citizen of Trinidad and Tobago..
I still have to get mine..
p.s..
I dissapointed that TT have dual citizenship. i was going and start the thread for TT for Prime Minister.. but then again you could do like Gypsy and renounce it then still run... ;D
Love up the culture :beermug:
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The way I look at it.. even as trinis become US citizen or Canadian citizens... there is nothing that stops you from not being a trinidad citizen.. as long as your birth certificate says trinidad and tobago.. your ledgit.. who is to say your not trini? If we move back to trinidad tomorrow.. which trinidad immigration officer going and tell yuh doh come?
TT make a good point dey... I ehh know much about the Canadian citizenship but if you have a US passport it makes scene to get the stamp saying that your a citizen of Trinidad and Tobago..
I still have to get mine..
p.s..
I dissapointed that TT have dual citizenship. i was going and start the thread for TT for Prime Minister.. but then again you could do like Gypsy and renounce it then still run... ;D
Love up the culture :beermug:
all gypsy had was ah green card ent?
lol
yuh like comess
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I talking about citizens of convenience ... thre is a moral versus legal issue.
For ex: the cdn/lebones who live in Lebanon, doh speak english and doh give a s**t about canada. Why should my tax $$ pay for their evacuation onlt to have dem run back to Lebanaon de moment the shooting stop.
I eh talking about the cdn/lenanose who conducts busineee in Lebanon, but has a moral allegiance to canada.
That is my issue ... if yuh want to maintain dual citenzhip, den you need to have a moral connection to both countries.
I understood that. However, I asked should the government extricate those on legit business and leave the rest?
What will the moral rational be for such an action?
yuh is right ... once you are a citizen, the country have a moral and legal obligation to save yuh arse in these situations we discussing ... that is why Canada helped its citizens in time of need .. no questions asked . jes sho yuh passport. But now the crisis is over (for now), it begs the question: should a country allow dual citenship? too many ppl take advantage of it at the expense of those who paying taxes. So to elimate the debate about who should be saved, jes have single citenship policy and continue to help the citezens. If yuh is not a citizen, den the government can exercise descretion and extend help to who ever dey want.
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I talking about citizens of convenience ... thre is a moral versus legal issue.
For ex: the cdn/lebones who live in Lebanon, doh speak english and doh give a s**t about canada. Why should my tax $$ pay for their evacuation onlt to have dem run back to Lebanaon de moment the shooting stop.
I eh talking about the cdn/lenanose who conducts busineee in Lebanon, but has a moral allegiance to canada.
That is my issue ... if yuh want to maintain dual citenzhip, den you need to have a moral connection to both countries.
I understood that. However, I asked should the government extricate those on legit business and leave the rest?
What will the moral rational be for such an action?
yuh is right ... once you are a citizen, the country have a moral and legal obligation to save yuh arse in these situations we discussing ... that is why Canada helped its citizens in time of need .. no questions asked . jes sho yuh passport. But now the crisis is over (for now), it begs the question: should a country allow dual citenship? too many ppl take advantage of it at the expense of those who paying taxes. So to elimate the debate about who should be saved, jes have single citenship policy and continue to help the citezens. If yuh is not a citizen, den the government can exercise descretion and extend help to who ever dey want.
what is the advantage of holding dual citizenship? Other than the obvious reason of maintaing cultural and probably religius connections. D you think people become citizens so they can have one country save them if and when they get caught up in some political crisis in another country?
You are going to be always a citizen of T&T once yuh born in de islands, unless yuh renonuce yuh right to be such.
I guess I eh getting yuh point.
How yuh could take advantage of dual citizenship except hn yuh walking thru immigration and yuh get tuh use de short line?
Ah mean tell me what does it benefit dem Lebanese except whn there was a crisis? and how often is Canada specifically called upon to act anyway?
ah feel yuh getting caught up in right wing ting dey breds....far right wing too.
Look at in de USA when Irsih Amercians were supporting de IRA?
nah breds...! Canadain navy need something to do odder dan fish anyway! :rotfl:
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pecan...you saying it is to the detriment of tax payers.
What are the benefits then?
For T&T it will be better to have people with dual citizenship cuz push come to shove majority will leave to benefit from first world citizenship.
Now the US makes you renounce/abdigate your previous citizenship. Technically T&T should not want those people to retain citizenship but they don't want to lose them outright.
So...as far as the US concerned you are only a US citizen. Is it true then that if you try to serve in the T&T army you will be considered a traitor or something? But if you serve in the US army then T&T doh dig any horros. Just curious...not sure what the law is in the US about serving in another military.
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here is my point .. nuttin right wing about it
1) there are immigrants to apply for and receive cdn citizenship, which entitles them to three major benefits - old age pension and free or subsidized medical care (remember, we have universal medicare in canda), and voting (if yuh count that as a benefit)
2) The they rtn to their country of origin and do not set foot in canada unless they need medical care (for free) and do not pay taxes
3) In the rare case, canada will cover the cots to evacuate them from a crisis (Lebanon case in point). That evcuation cost the government (read that tax payer and cdns are one of the hoghest taxed ppl in the world) $75 million to evacuate 15,000 ppl. Now that the crisis is over, 7,000 have rtn to Lebanon until the next evacuation. They have no roots in Cananda -- in fact many of them did not have homes or relative to stay with when they arrived in Canada.
So my question: why should I foot the bill to pay for dual citenzen who doh give a rat's arse about canada?
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Other people who familar with Candian Immigration Policies can correct me if I am wrong about what the benefits are.
What gets me irate is the apparent lack of gratitude some of the evacuees displayed when they were rescued.
here are some quotes - paraphrased (that i heard them say on the radio)
" we were evcuated on a rust bucket with no air conditioning and no seats"
" I was not allowed to take my pet"
" why did it take so long for the government to send rescue ships" (doh forget, we in the middle of a war)
"we had to wait for hours ..."
Now, almost 50% of the evacuee runnng back to Lebanon after their fellow citenzens worked aroufn the cluck to effect the evacuation and paid for the rescue.
I think, by and large, dual citienship could be beneficial to both countries ... but liike any other program, theyre are some people who will take advantage of it at my expense.
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Pecan it sound like who only seeing things from one side.
U say they go back Lebanon and have nothing to do with Canada. Dat sounding like right wing propaganda for true. How you eh know if the people have business links but choose to stay in Lebanon.
How you eh know they sending they children to school in Canada.
As for the complaints about the conditions. WHen the evacuations were taking place I saw the reports trying to make the people look like they ungrateful. I find that suspicious...why did the media choose to do that? Cuz I think they could have spun it the other way to blame the governments if it suited them.
And I doh get your point about them running back to Lebanon....u don't think they should go back because money was spent on evacuation? I cud easily see why it would be unbearable for an elderly person to be in sweltering middle east heat. U feel a regular canadian cud survuve that? Dem can't even handle sun in T&T out on the beach much less in an enclosed environment in the middle east.
What is the source of your information? Mass media or people you know or smaller independent sources...is it politicians?
I just feel like if u dig a little deeper u might see the other side but I don't want to assume u haven't taken that into account already...have you?
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Canada evacuates more 825 of its citizens from Lebanon
By: Israel Insider staff and partners
Published: August 14, 2006
Canada evacuated more than 800 of its citizens and other foreigners from Lebanon Sunday -- one day before a cease-fire deal went into effect.
The Canadian Embassy had contacted 1,200 of its citizens who were thought to still be in Lebanon, but only 825 showed up and departed on the ship that sailed to the Mediterranean island of Cyprus, diplomats said. About 35 foreigners including citizens from Russia and Denmark also left on the Princesa Marrisa ship.
The Canadians were scheduled to be flown home from Cyprus on planes paid for by the Canadian government.
Most of the people who left Sunday were Lebanese-Canadians including Ahmed al-Akhras who lost eight members of his family in the Israeli bombing of the border village of Aitaroun.
Al-Akhras' wife, son, daughter-in-law, four grandchildren and another relative died in the bombing last month.
Including those who left Sunday, Canada has evacuated some 14,000 of its citizens from war-torn Lebanon over the past month.
The AP contributed to this report.
http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Briefs/9163.htm
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Canada Evacuates 1,375 Citizens, Residents From Lebanon
Published July 21, 2006 - 5:17am Tags: News & Analysis | Canada | Indigenious | Middle East | War & IMperialism | Zionism
printer friendly version
Canada Evacuates 1,375 Citizens, Residents From Lebanon
July 20, 2006 Bloomberg
Canada has rescued more than 1,375 citizens and permanent residents from Lebanon in the biggest government-led evacuation in Canada's history, Foreign Affairs Minister Peter MacKay said today.
Six ships carrying evacuees left Beirut today for ports in Cyprus and Turkey, MacKay told reporters in Ottawa. About 261 of the Canadians boarded a chartered plane in Cyprus and will arrive in Canada overnight or early tomorrow morning, government officials said on a conference call with reporters.
There may be as many as 45,000 Canadians living in Lebanon, one of the largest groups of foreign nationals in the country, said Sandra Buckler, a spokeswoman for Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper.
Thousands of people have flocked to the Canadian embassy Beirut to leave the country after Israel began rocket attacks in Lebanon to retaliate for the July 12 kidnapping of two Israeli soldiers. Eight Canadians in Lebanon have been killed in the fighting.
Harper, who was scheduled to return to Canada yesterday from a six-day trip to western Europe and Russia, detoured his armed forces plane to Cyprus to help with the evacuation. Harper was expected to return to Ottawa this evening.
Some evacuees have complained the ships taking them from Beirut don't have enough provisions, and they've had to wait for hours in sweltering heat before getting on the ships.
``Everybody was vomiting on everybody. It was very miserable,'' Caroline Nohra of Montreal told Canadian Press. ``I would have preferred to stay in Lebanon than come this way, the way we were treated, like animals.''
Slow Response
The government has been too slow to respond to the early warnings of a crisis, said Dan McTeague, the opposition Liberal Party lawmaker responsible for foreign affairs.
``This inept interference and ensuing delays have resulted in a badly botched evacuation that has failed Canadians,'' he said in a statement.
MacKay said the government has taken steps to ensure future sailings are more comfortable for the evacuees. He said more than 1,100 people have registered to leave Lebanon on ships tomorrow.
``My understanding is those six ships today were fully stocked with food and water,'' MacKay said.
Harper's government has also come under fire from evacuees and Muslim-Canadian groups because he blamed Hezbollah and Hamas for the recent violence and called Israel's military operations last week ``measured.''
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here is my point .. nuttin right wing about it
1) there are immigrants to apply for and receive cdn citizenship, which entitles them to three major benefits - old age pension and free or subsidized medical care (remember, we have universal medicare in canda), and voting (if yuh count that as a benefit)
2) The they rtn to their country of origin and do not set foot in canada unless they need medical care (for free) and do not pay taxes
3) In the rare case, canada will cover the cots to evacuate them from a crisis (Lebanon case in point). That evcuation cost the government (read that tax payer and cdns are one of the hoghest taxed ppl in the world) $75 million to evacuate 15,000 ppl. Now that the crisis is over, 7,000 have rtn to Lebanon until the next evacuation. They have no roots in Cananda -- in fact many of them did not have homes or relative to stay with when they arrived in Canada.
So my question: why should I foot the bill to pay for dual citenzen who doh give a rat's arse about canada?
:applause: And when ya get that answer...lemme know.
Pecan we had this converstion back in August when all the unrest started in Lebanon. My question at the time was "who send dem". Granted some were on vacation and got caught up in it, but others were living there for years and their children maybe were attending University in Canada - so maybe this is why all of ah sudden everybody on dey boat say dey is Canadian citizen and dey children dey.
Why dey ass bring everybody back? Some ah dem only put dey foot in Canada just to get dey visa and is gone dey go back to dey native land. What dey Government shoulda do was all ah dem who passport stamp "left Canada in 2003", shoulda leave dey ass dey.
God knows why i ain't running dey blasted cold place >:(
pecan ya ever watch ya pay slip and wonder what is dey main reason why ya wuking for ?....fuss dey tax high
ah go give ya ah little insight ah meh pay check.....i wuking fur X amount ah dollars per week, my tax alone is almost ah thousand dollars and some cents...i ain't lying - ah could show ya.
so ya know i wanted to mash up every Lebie ass on dey TV when ah see dem coming back in ship loads...bawling dem is citizens. stups
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so wait nah. canadian citizens not allowed to live in other countries?
allyuh real bold face oui.
did the people do wha was required to attainn citizenship?
if yes den dey entitled.
steups.
right wing drivel
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Is not the matter of not allowed. u see for example.. in order to get yuh full pension u have to be ind e country for at least half de yr. and cana right the amt a money u does hadd apay in taxes and money u does have to give to yuh pension and RRSP'S(DAIS CANADIAN VERSION OF 401K) u will wnat to make sure u around.
but cana alllyuh we know de taxes high but remeber, de health system here second to none or very few( although ppl does be real complaiing here,, y i eh know). and education good, and by and large the systems efficent.
who else ind e world have an education plan..RESP'S....where de government adding 20% of what ever you put towards your child's tertiray education. well tirni not including with thier show off educationf or all. ;D though me eh know how dat wukkin
and if your canadian citizen and working here or workign in a next country but the company based here u hadd apy taxes aclare all yuh forgien assests for that to eb taxed to.
so u cant hide
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well..well...
My parnets fall in the "using" the dual citizenship thing... they here now, but will be going back to TnT soon. BTW, anyone paying attention to the number of "OLD" expats that has the idea in their head that they'll be going back trinidad to live? Ah whole heap ah old people.. who den will be wukking and who taking care of all these old people?
Back to my parents...
wuk all they life except the last few years in Trinidad..so they contributed dey!
To get they citiozenship (canadian) they first had to apply for their landed doc..took about2-3 years, during whic time my dad wuk in Canada and paid taxes etc... after getting they landed they had to live (show residency) in Canada for another 2yrs I think..could be 3. So another 2 years of taxes etc.. In toatl so far they paid taxes for 5 years...
So they've paid taxes and contributed to both countries... so I don't see it as any abuse.
Who vex about the money spent getting the people (Canadians) out of Leb..need to consider..
John Wlliams reports in his May 2003 Waste Report that our government often purchases items for promotional or in-house use. When Williams decided to look into this, he found many items, including the following:
* $121,159 for golf balls
* $15,886 for golf tees
* $1,488,581 for cameras
* $16,714 for games and wheeled toys
* $1,744 on perfume (ACOA, the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency, which is in the business of giving loans, spent $144.34 on perfumes, toilet preparations and powders. (Was that to make the handouts smell sweeter?)
Some of Williams favourite spenders were:
* Canadian Housing and Mortgage Corporation, which spent $14,653 on briefcases and $10,900 on umbrellas.
* The Museum of Nature spent $3,250 on assorted games.
The National Film Board has produced some internationally recognized works, but Williams asks us to reflect on the following expenditures:
* $303,800 for “The Influent and the Effluent,” a documentary that explores the hidden world of sewage and the relationship between humans and waste.
* $276,929 for “Christopher, Please Clean Up!” a film described as: “Christopher is cool and smart except he is messy; his shoes smell, his fish bowl smells, and even the cockroaches take offence.”
More recently I read that the Gov't spent 1.2 million approx. the study the mating habits of Squirells (sp).. millions daily in Afg... I know personally 2 people who got their DRs to bill the Gov't for lypo and breast reduction.. yea ..we 4king paid for that.
The truth is.. the Canadian Gov't waited too long to get the Canadians out! On the same page..de focaks who complain bout aircond. should just shut they cat and say thanks. That is the real problem.. we have a very hard time saying THANKS!
I is ah political refugee, so my c**t staying rite here until ah certain party no longer in power in Trinidad :rotfl:
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Is not the matter of not allowed. u see for example.. in order to get yuh full pension u have to be ind e country for at least half de yr. and cana right the amt a money u does hadd apay in taxes and money u does have to give to yuh pension and RRSP'S(DAIS CANADIAN VERSION OF 401K) u will wnat to make sure u around.
but cana alllyuh we know de taxes high but remeber, de health system here second to none or very few( although ppl does be real complaiing here,, y i eh know). and education good, and by and large the systems efficent. who else ind e world have an education plan..RESP'S....where de government adding 20% of what ever you put towards your child's tertiray education. well tirni not including with thier show off educationf or all. ;D though me eh know how dat wukkin
and if your canadian citizen and working here or workign in a next country but the company based here u hadd apy taxes aclare all yuh forgien assests for that to eb taxed to.
so u cant hide
aye doh get me wrong....Sure tax meh hard - cause ah know at dey end of dey day I will have to use one ah dey FREE services dat meh money went into. Organic what does turn meh stomach is the fact that people like does Leboniee people living in dey own native land for how many donkey years, bomb drop, dey bawl dem is canadian citizen, and government take meh good tax dollars to bring dey ass back. Every one ah dem. When dem self ain't even here to pay tax.
Government should tax dem double fur dey years dey stay in dey own country.
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Jumbie, I read ah ting that de Canadian Government had a ting called "The Sponsorship Scandal" and one of the MANY wastes was to pay companies two and three times for doing a job for them. I hear is MILLIONS gorn to their friends pockets.
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well that stemed from at least what i gathered is that canada had a policy..now de funct one...that once your mother was born in canada you were automatically a candian citizen. crazy eh..so it have nuff ppl all over de world..who never step ah foot in canada but are canadians.
does paying taxes alone give u the right to be called a citizen? what about allegineces? i mean i paying taxes here..but if shit hti the fan and is ever CANADA VS TRINI (and i eh mean jus in sports) i mean for anythign, war for example , i jus syaing i knwo trinidad army could give canadian army good pressure..lol...WHO WOULD U SIDE WITH.
No matter what u say botut he us..andi say alot..lol... they , for the most part take care of thier citizens especially thier veterans.
remeber the trini born vietnam vet who got kidnapped and mrudered int rin..they wasted no time senidng the FBI TO look for him..and guess what they catch the ppl.
It have some of the forumites...who werent even born in trinidad..or was only born..or concieved there and they consider them selves trini. some lived there for only short periods of time and if u ask dem..where u form...they will say trini.
If venezuala invade tirni how much of allyuh runnign back to help tirni if they call for help?
allyuh might say i being silly but its valid question. would u fight for aplace wheer u ahve almost no ties to? (i eh mean as a professional soldeir dem getting paid for dat amdness..lol)
or would the landed trinis or new candian citizens born in trini defend canada..if bush decide all the oil in north ah canada he want and want now? would u?
is nto just about taxes.but where ar eu willing to scarcife yhu life for? where is your home?
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Point is Cana..yuh missing de point!
de people is Canadian citizens! Dem never start tuh beg de canuck governmant fuh any thing!!
The canadian gov is obligated to look after its citizens!
Secondly, going right over yuh head is the fact that people are NOT bound to stay in any one country! They are free, if they meet the requirements to live whereever they damn well feel. so if it were Trinidad or Thailand or Phillipines..then dey free to go dey!
supposed it was ah bunch ah lebanese canadians and dem was in living in thailand fuh donkey years and de tsunami did hit.....would it have made a difference?
third point: does paying taxes make yuh ah citizen?
see I am sure dey have canadians, born in canada, and never wuk ah day in dey life...dey using all de free ting and dey never pay ah dime in taxes..ah bet yuh deh have whole families like dat!
so dem is somehow more canadian dan de lebanese/canucks?
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third point: does paying taxes make yuh ah citizen?
see I am sure dey have canadians, born in canada, and never wuk ah day in dey life...dey using all de free ting and dey never pay ah dime in taxes..ah bet yuh deh have whole families like dat!
so dem is somehow more canadian dan de lebanese/canucks?
x4kingzactly... come the end of the month (welfare check time) you does see people taking taxi to the friggin beer store, pizza and chinee food men busy delivering..mall pack.. yea, is we tax dollars dem 4cars spending.. they doh wuk, but wearing latest styles and quenching they tust with beer..while I have to invite mehself by fren house to enjoy some beverages..
Yea RedHowler.. they take the coins, big EXPENSIVE enquiry and nobody eh making frens lovas in the big house yet!
As a person with dual citizenship..who has as much pride for TnT as Canada... I should have the right to live where I want when I want. I expect to be given the same privilidges as any Canadian or Trinbagonian.
That whole story bout dem Leb/Can getting for help and cost xamount ah dollars was not about the $$ as much as it was about who they were. Muslim, beige people.
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exactly. Is because dem is muslim or brown people. racist, far right drivel!
I am a US citizen and I sure I serve this country more dan 90% ah americans.
if I want to live in Iran and it have trouble dey have ah dam right tuh come get me.. same fuh ah damn welfare recepient who eh serve ah day.
dat is why we is citizens...so we can enjoy de priveleges of citizenship... all ah we.
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ya kno wha, even if i was to pay taxes in TnT ALSO, I truly believe, that ent going towards solving some ah dem problems dong day.
when allya go home and look arong...it different dan foren
i doh know where to start it so different
I brought up in tong, so goin out of tong does be an eye opener
just driving arong in all the different areas, the regular down to earth people need proper infrustructure. i sure that the powers dat be could put MORE energy to provide more for the regular TrinBagonians.
Some of us have been very fortunate to do well in school resulting in us getting jobs that allow us to have certains things that I am sure that many people in TnT doh have atall atall..so it comes back to Government as day HAVE de money in TnT but it goin for the wrong tings I feel.
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http://www.counterpunch.org/fisk06122006.html
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about the idea of moral citizenship:
immigrants to canada have to take a citizenship test whereas native-born canadians do not have to take any kind of citizenship test.
alot of these native-born canadians doing everything they can to cheat the tax system that is supposed to be for the benefit of all canadians. even paul martin self flying his CSL ships under a different flag to avoid taxes.
it seems there's a bit of a double standard going on. i agree that there is a moral component of citizenship and certainly some of the evacuees might have failed this test. but maybe the evacuees (and new immigrants to canada) aren't the only ones that should be subject to such a moral test.
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http://www.counterpunch.org/fisk06122006.html
staying orf topic here....
aye man that article reminds me of de time dat the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma geh bomb and i was watching CNN live and day come right out and say that it was a terrorist (hinting towards muslim) attack. come to find out is a white boy who is a militia member...dem miltitias ent easy oui..
you want to confirm if dem is private companies in Iraq now.
like Blackwater (http://www.blackwaterusa.com/)
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When I posted this topic, I indicated I had mixed feeling ....
I have readthe replies and have not come to a somewhat reasoned conclusion.
The real issue is not dual citienzship ... it is one of moral allegiance.
Dual or single citienship ..it doh matter ...what matters is whether you give back tou your county(tries).
I think about these words from the inaugural address of President John F. Kennedy, delivered in 1961.
Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country
I have no issue with anyone provided they not only taking and do give back to their community, province, state, county, country ect. How do you do that? taxes, charity, volunteer, donate time, help yuh neighbour.
But when I see able-body ppl taking, taking, taking and never giving ... >:( >:(
As far as the Cd/Leb who went back, I belive that the statisatics i posted are valid ..i.e 40,000 tyo 45,000 cdn/leb living in Lebanon, 15,000 evacuated and 7,000 already gone back .... I cant help but conclude that asome of them are in the "take, take, take" category. Prove me wrong ...maybe many do give, but i eh see any evidence of dat.
Same applies for single citizenhip ppl who doh gave any thought to the country dat they live in.
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Pecan, it transcends even moral allegiance.
It is the Press causing hate and sicontent simply because of profiling and racism..subtle though it may be.
So 7000 have returned....what of the other 8,000?
They too were lumped unceremoniously by a press hell bent on creating an atmosphere of fear and discontent!
Who is to say what the ages of these returness are.
Are they past retirement age? Are they back home taking care of family? What have they contributed to canadian society?
Do they have family members still working/studying/contributing to canada?
I guarantee you if you look at those making the most noise about this issue non-issue really, they are of the conservative nature.
canada is fast becoming like the US with its sub culture of fear.
Look for more murders by gun and crime to escalate as wellas incidences of racial tension in the land of the Maple Leaf!
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From many of the interviews I saw during this crisis...
the families here were saying that the ones that were in Leb (can citz) were there on holiday and/or visiting relatives.
The ones that did get out.. they too mentioned that they were there on holiday and visiting family etc.
Bear in mind that these are just the ones I saw being interviewed on TV.
Makes me wonder if the press in US, Europe and other countries who had citizens in leb, did they speak about the dual citizenship issue? After-all, they did get their citizens out at the expense of their tax payers.
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Well we could talk till we blue in we face, I know as was mentioned earlier, US does not recognise our "dual citizenship" If you go to the INS website, we are not listed as one of the countries that qualify and you can thank the high crime, drug traffic and Abu Bakr for that.
I paying taxes to Uncle Sam for a long time now, so is time I reap some of them benefits. In all honesty I feel Trinis want this DUAL thing in place more for sentimental reasons than practical, becuase you would still be required by the US government to file your taxes as long as youh hold a US passport, even though you were not in the country
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Pecan and trinicana..see how BIG country does treat they citizens? And dey pets too!
Pets orphaned by Lebanon war to come to U.S.
300 homeless dogs and cats to be airlifted out of Beirut for adoption
• Rescuing canine victims of war
Sept. 24: From Lebanon, there is good news about a group of innocent victims of the recent war - stray dogs. NBC's Jim Maceda reports.
Nightly News
Updated: 10:21 a.m. ET Sept 25, 2006
BEIRUT, Lebanon - They endured a summer of war, but now relief is coming for Lebanon’s little known victims — cats and dogs abandoned when their owners fled the country during the early days of fighting between Israel and Hezbollah.
Some 300 of the former pets are being flown to the United States on Monday for adoption.
For Mona Khoury, who has helped take care of the animals the past few weeks, the rescue operation is tinged with sadness.
“I’ve grown attached to them and I’m very, very sad that they’re leaving. But I know they’ll be in good hands and have a better life there,” she said.
Khoury is co-founder of Beirut for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, which is working on the project with the American animal society Best Friends.
BETA rounded up many of the pets left behind when tens of thousands of foreigners and Lebanese with foreign passports evacuated the country in July and August.
The U.S. Embassy and others told the evacuees that pets would not be allowed on the ships and helicopters carrying them to safety, and many families had to abandon their animals or leave them with friends who later got rid of them.
'Largest animal airlift'
Michael Mountain, president of the Utah-based Best Friends, which describes itself as America’s largest refuge for abused and abandoned pets, said in a phone interview that about 300 of the homeless pets would be put on a special cargo plane Monday and flown to the United States
“This is certainly the largest animal airlift operation we’ve ever done overseas,” he said.
There will be two refueling stops — one in Manchester, England, and another at New York’s JFK Airport — before arriving in Las Vegas, where the orphans will be put on Best Friends trucks for a 3˝-hour ride to temporary housing at the Best Friends Animal Sanctuary in Kanab, Utah.
“Once there, the pets will undergo a final health and behavior evaluation before they’re off to their new, permanent homes,” Mountain said. “We’ve already had a lot of offers to adopt these cats and dogs.”
He said the operation is costing around $250,000, most of it from donations raised by animal activists.
Best Friends arranged a similar operation just a year ago in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, when it moved more than 6,000 animals out of the disaster zone to new homes.
The society has also been assisting animal groups in Israel, where people also had to evacuate their homes in the north without their pets during the recent war.
But the major crisis for animals has been in Lebanon.
On July 12, at the start of what proved to be a 34-day war, BETA had to move dogs and cats from a shelter near a Hezbollah stronghold in Beirut that was repeatedly pounded by Israeli warplanes. The animals were taken to an abandoned pig farm in Monteverde in the hills. Other BETA shelters were also damaged.
Hundreds of adoption offers
At the height of the war, the abandoned animals were featured on ABC’s “Good Morning America,” after which adoption offers from the U.S. “started coming down on us by the hundreds,” Khoury said.
Jutta Sold, a 36-year-old German animal activist who is also a BETA volunteer, said the airlift is “a very good thing.”
“It’s sad for me. I knew some of these dogs when they were just puppies, but I’m very hopeful that their chances for adoption are much better over there,” said Sold, who has adopted one of the dogs herself.
She said Lebanese don’t have much connection with animals. “The attitude here is very different from Europe or the United States. A lot of people are afraid of animals, they kick them around.”
Sold also noted there are no laws to protect animals, and said chances of them being adopted are much higher in the West.
© 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved
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BETA, People for the Ethical Treament of Animal etc. etc and Pamela ANderson
As humans we have a duty for the welfare of our world ...but BETA and PETA, imo, is take it too far.
They airlifted animals across the Atlantic Ocean from a war torn country!
Dat taking it too far .... those animal go have to lear the language and may be subject to discrimations by the US animal ... taking away food, walk time, owners ...
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BETA, People for the Ethical Treament of Animal etc. etc and Pamela ANderson
As humans we have a duty for the welfare of our world ...but BETA and PETA, imo, is take it too far.
They airlifted animals across the Atlantic Ocean from a war torn country!
Dat taking it too far .... those animal go have to lear the language and may be subject to discrimations by the US animal ... taking away food, walk time, owners ...
NIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICE :justkidding:
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Well dis is ah interesting topic...so leh me get een on de action
I have dual citizenship and when I travel, I travel wid meh Canadian passport. Why? First, is de country ah living, paying taxes and voting. So although ah go die ah Trini tuh de bone, in meh day tuh day living, ah is ah Canadian. Plus Ah doh have no trouble going through no customs anywhere.
Ah go tell yuh honestly, if war break out between Canada and Trinidad, ah go be in a quandry eh but since de chance ah dat happening is as good as me turning white tomorrow morning, ah not really worrying bout having tuh choose. That aside, if ah in trouble anywhere in de world, ah hope either Canada or Trinidad go come an rescue meh arse one way or de odder. Say what you want bout de US government (and ah doh usually have much good tuh say bout dem), when it come tuh dey citizens, dey does act and den akse questions later. Dey doh mess around wid de people.
As fuh de argument bout getting Canadian citizens out of other countries in times of trouble, it seems to me that the focus is on people who hold citizenship of their country of birth or their parents and of Canada/US. What about Canadians who are born, raised and bred in Canada, move to another country and then adopt citizenhip at that country while still maintaining Canadian citizenship? Do they loose that link? Leave dem dey? Dey pay taxes too fuh years. So what bout dat. I paying taxes here 18 years now. So what if I go back Trini tomorrow and den de US invade Trini. meh 18 years eh worth nuttin dat dey cyar sen ah Maple Leaf ship and pluck meh tuh safety?
This argument to me is raised to draw negative attention to immigrants and not to citizenhip and all that it offers.
The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms affords Canadians the right of movement. Which means we can go anywhere in the world we want, whenever we want, stay as long as want (wid de permission ah de odder country of course) and are welcomed back when we decide to return. It's plain and simple. To change that would not only affect immigrants obtaining Canadian citizenship but also born Canadians as well.
Someone made a comment about coming to Canada and getting free medical care. Not ALL Canadian provinces offer free medical care. Ontario does, Alberta does not as an example. You have to pay for health care in Alberta. True, it's not expensive and it's still subsidized but you have to RESIDE in the province to get it. As with Ontario, you also have to RESIDE in Ontario to get it. Once you leave Canada or the province of Ontario for more than 90 days, you LOOSE health care and you have to re-apply and wait three months on return to the province for it to kick in again. So it's not as simple as coming to Canada and everything free. All health care in Canada is NOT free. That is an unfortunate mistake many people have.
So daise meh 2 cents
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Ok everybody who gave their 2 cents worth .. thank you ...
I no longer have mixed feels about Dual Citizenship ..
I now think it will benefit both countries .... some people will take advantage of it .... but I think at the end of the day, the benefits will outweight the costs and these costs are inherent in any civlized society.
Is like the cost of keeping extreme criminals in jail for life (instead of exucuting dem) ... that is a cost a civilized country have to bear .... but dat is a nother debate all together ::)