Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: sammy on April 29, 2010, 05:05:18 PM
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just wanna let u guys know that hubert volney will be on cnc 3 live @ 8 tonight.
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record it...then post it later .. :beermug:
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Dey used to call dis man "justice"? steups.
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record it...then post it later .. :beermug:
unfortunately i dont have a tv card :-\
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He basically said that he felt he needed to leave the judiciary to help effect the changes needed in that system. He said while he was not a PNM party card holder, he voted PNM for every election except 1986. But he say he like hundreds of thousands of PNMites are turned off by Patrick Manning and are not voting PNM this rounds but the UNC/COP.
He says he doh trust Manning he trust Kamla. He say Manning harden. He say Dr. Eric Williams was hard of hearing but had the humility to get hearing aids so he could hear. Manning on the other hand refuses to get hearing aids....
hhhhhmmmmm....what else.....he say something like he wasn't in discussion with the UNC for any protracted length of time (huh??)...
He call Manning a liar for the claims he made on the platform last night. He say he eh have nutten to hide and that he house mortgage to Scotiabank and as of right now he unemployed and have to find money to pay he mortgage month end like everybody else so he eh know where Manning getting the impression that he has some improper dealings financially...
Dais all ah remember....
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He basically said that he felt he needed to leave the judiciary to help effect the changes needed in that system. He said while he was not a PNM party card holder, he voted PNM for every election except 1986. But he say he like hundreds of thousands of PNMites are turned off by Patrick Manning and are not voting PNM this rounds but the UNC/COP.
He says he doh trust Manning he trust Kamla. He say Manning harden. He say Dr. Eric Williams was hard of hearing but had the humility to get hearing aids so he could hear. Manning on the other hand refuses to get hearing aids....
hhhhhmmmmm....what else.....he say something like he wasn't in discussion with the UNC for any protracted length of time (huh??)...
He call Manning a liar for the claims he made on the platform last night. He say he eh have nutten to hide and that he house mortgage to Scotiabank and as of right now he unemployed and have to find money to pay he mortgage month end like everybody else so he eh know where Manning getting the impression that he has some improper dealings financially...
Dais all ah remember....
Them fellas good yes.
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also said that he is still not a member of the unc....kamla has a soft touch..
did i hear right that he met her for the first time today at screening?
when asked what position he wanted if the uncop wins, he said anything PM kamla offer
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also said that he is still not a member of the unc....kamla has a soft touch..
did i hear right that he met her for the first time today at screening?
when asked what position he wanted if the uncop wins, he said anything PM kamla offer
This same unemployed fella ?
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Video Footage Former judge Herbert Volney explains his decision..http://www.ctntworld.com/LocalArticles.aspx?id=20374
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Video Footage Former judge Herbert Volney explains his decision..http://www.ctntworld.com/LocalArticles.aspx?id=20374
Hmm! some telling words and even the media are major players in the whole mix
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he goin up against some seasoned politicians for d unc ticket for st joseph...how was he so sure that he wud be given the nod unless he was given the guarantee after some serious protracted negotiations..
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he goin up against some seasoned politicians for d unc ticket for st joseph...how was he so sure that he wud be given the nod unless he was given the guarantee after some serious protracted negotiations..
so you really beleived that BS? kamla stated on the platform that HE WAS THE CANDIDATE
Feature address by Hon Kamla Persad-Bissessar
Leader of the Opposition, MP for SipariaPolitical Leader of the UNC
On 28th April, 2010 at Croisee, San Juan/Barataria
My brothers and sisters tonight I want to put this election in its proper perspective. As you all know by now justice Herbert Volney resigned from his distinguished post as a judge to contest the general election as a UNC candidate.
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Well Tony & Dale interviewing Jones P. Madeira now and Mr. Madeira says Mr. Volney is a bald faced liar!!...He said when he spoke with Mr. Volney, the goodly judge denied the reports that he was leaving the judiciary. Volney had said last night when Mr. Madeira called him he told him it was none of his business...
Madeira say its amazing the depths to which people will go to get into political office....He say is about time politicians stop operating on the premise that politics has a morality of its own.....
Kamla gyal, ah think yuh just swallow a grenade!!!....
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Can someone explain what, if any wrong was done here?
Ah man say he care bout the country and leff he wuk to try and make a difference. Power to he and anyone else who feel they can make a difference. Can TnT get any worse?
Patos destroying a good thing.. country and party!
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Well Tony & Dale interviewing Jones P. Madeira now and Mr. Madeira says Mr. Volney is a bald faced liar!!...He said when he spoke with Mr. Volney, the goodly judge denied the reports that he was leaving the judiciary. Volney had said last night when Mr. Madeira called him he told him it was none of his business...
Madeira say its amazing the depths to which people will go to get into political office....He say is about time politicians stop operating on the premise that politics has a morality of its own.....
Kamla gyal, ah think yuh just swallow a grenade!!!....
i was totally shocked by what came out in this interview.
and these are the same people, if you are in their courtroom and yuh lie...they want to kill you.
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Kamla gyal, ah think yuh just swallow a grenade!!!....
yuh need go no further than the brad boyce case an d other questionable decisions while he was on d bench to know dat
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Dr Narinesingh case, which also had some suspicious rulings as well?
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Can someone explain what, if any wrong was done here?
Ah man say he care bout the country and leff he wuk to try and make a difference. Power to he and anyone else who feel they can make a difference. Can TnT get any worse?
Patos destroying a good thing.. country and party!
Jumbie, examine dis man's behaviors nah..In any country with proper governance he wouldn't be able to do dis shit. And he suspect as a judge too
DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
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Can someone explain what, if any wrong was done here?
Ah man say he care bout the country and leff he wuk to try and make a difference. Power to he and anyone else who feel they can make a difference. Can TnT get any worse?
Patos destroying a good thing.. country and party!
Mr Volney didnt do anything wrong or unconstitutional, but according to martin daly, president of the JLSC, he has put the entire judiciary into disrepute by the fact that within hours of resigning as a judge, he went into politics.
In my opinion, aspersions will now be cast upon his past judgements. I think that just as there is a 10 year period you must wait if you leave the justice system and want to come back in...there must be a waiting period if you come off the bench and want to enter the political arena. remember justice must not only be done, but must be seen to be done.
my 2 cents.
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Dr Narinesingh case, which also had some suspicious rulings as well?
Remember he and Ramadhar wear T&T flag ties talking about the preservation of justice in the country
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Can someone explain what, if any wrong was done here?
Ah man say he care bout the country and leff he wuk to try and make a difference. Power to he and anyone else who feel they can make a difference. Can TnT get any worse?
Patos destroying a good thing.. country and party!
Justice must be independent or seen to be independent (ah think dais the saying)......his move was too, too close to his being a judge and his jumping on a political platform.....that is the crux of the matter....
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
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Can someone explain what, if any wrong was done here?
Ah man say he care bout the country and leff he wuk to try and make a difference. Power to he and anyone else who feel they can make a difference. Can TnT get any worse?
Patos destroying a good thing.. country and party!
Justice must be independent or seen to be independent (ah think dais the saying)......his move was too, too close to his being a judge and his jumping on a political platform.....that is the crux of the matter....
Ok.. but
how does this prove that his decisions were not independent? (asking to better understand this) Also, are there rules in place that governs a judge from going into politics? Time frame etc?
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
this was a snap election, therefore he had to jump off the bench and into the politics immediately.You want him to wait how long? 1 or 2 years? what will he do for that period?
Another thing, please explain to me any possible reason y he went into politics other than what he is saying. Remember he had total privacy being a judge and couldnt be investigated by the Integrity commission, so if he leaving to be in bobol is a big risk he taking. ALso, high court judges make more money than MPs.
I am not a lawyer, nor a judge to know about the intricate details regarding the brad boyce case when it comes to the law. Remember Volney can only rule on evidence based on the law and the law alone not his personal feelings. It easy for me and u to say a man guilty, but he dosent have that luxary. He may very well know that a person guilty, but if proper procedure was not followed then he have no choice but to let a person go free.
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Another thing, are judges allowed to vote?
When they vote, arent they biased towards a party of choice?
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
this was a snap election, therefore he had to jump off the bench and into the politics immediately.You want him to wait how long? 1 or 2 years? what will he do for that period?
Another thing, please explain to me any possible reason y he went into politics other than what he is saying. Remember he had total privacy being a judge and couldnt be investigated by the Integrity commission, so if he leaving to be in bobol is a big risk he taking. ALso, high court judges make more money than MPs.
I am not a lawyer, nor a judge to know about the intricate details regarding the brad boyce case when it comes to the law. Remember Volney can only rule on evidence based on the law and the law alone not his personal feelings. It easy for me and u to say a man guilty, but he dosent have that luxary. He may very well know that a person guilty, but if proper procedure was not followed then he have no choice but to let a person go free.
how much u about the boyce case....... even d privy counsel had grave concerns about d way he handle dat and dem had d same evidence he had..................QUESTIONABLE CHARACTER INDEED HE IS!
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
this was a snap election, therefore he had to jump off the bench and into the politics immediately.You want him to wait how long? 1 or 2 years? what will he do for that period?
Another thing, please explain to me any possible reason y he went into politics other than what he is saying. Remember he had total privacy being a judge and couldnt be investigated by the Integrity commission, so if he leaving to be in bobol is a big risk he taking. ALso, high court judges make more money than MPs.
I am not a lawyer, nor a judge to know about the intricate details regarding the brad boyce case when it comes to the law. Remember Volney can only rule on evidence based on the law and the law alone not his personal feelings. It easy for me and u to say a man guilty, but he dosent have that luxary. He may very well know that a person guilty, but if proper procedure was not followed then he have no choice but to let a person go free.
Actually Volney instructed the jury to come back with a not guilty verdict, based on his reasoning that patholist Dr hughvorn Des veignes was not a forensic pathologist. This was later challenged by the state and it was proven that indeed he was.
What is interesting is that Dr Des veignes is a high ranking TOP official in Tobago!!
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Sammy boy, yuh didn't have to have any legal training whatsoever to know something was wrong about what went down in that Brad Boyce case. Ah sure if yuh do some digging yuh goh find info on that whole thing....take a read and see....
On the question of independence, I remember when Gillian Lucky was appointed a judge (wasn't that supposed to be temporary?) I had a ??? moment. After all, didn't she campaign openly for the UNC and COP in the past two elections? Yes she was out of the political limelight for about 1 year after 2007 but still....
Also, another magistrate resigned about 2 - 3 weeks ago and offered himself up for screening by the UNC for this upcoming elections. The thing is I don't remember anyone making a hue and cry about it....
I think a lot of the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth over the Volney issue is as a result of
1. People never forgave him for that Brad Boyce fiasco (not his only controversial ruling but the most memorable one).
2. People done think the coalition thing on shaky ground, to add a controversial figure to the mix like Volney is just asking for trouble.
3. It makes Kamla look like she preaching one thing (integrity, accountability, openess, good governance etc. etc.) and practicing something else. And yuh coalition done on shaky ground.
I know the man eh commit no crime but I still think Kamla swallow a grenade....in any event by election day we goh forget cuz ah sure between now and the 24th Patos goh but he foot in he mouth, the man just can't help himself.....
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
this was a snap election, therefore he had to jump off the bench and into the politics immediately.You want him to wait how long? 1 or 2 years? what will he do for that period?
Another thing, please explain to me any possible reason y he went into politics other than what he is saying. Remember he had total privacy being a judge and couldnt be investigated by the Integrity commission, so if he leaving to be in bobol is a big risk he taking. ALso, high court judges make more money than MPs.
I am not a lawyer, nor a judge to know about the intricate details regarding the brad boyce case when it comes to the law. Remember Volney can only rule on evidence based on the law and the law alone not his personal feelings. It easy for me and u to say a man guilty, but he dosent have that luxary. He may very well know that a person guilty, but if proper procedure was not followed then he have no choice but to let a person go free.
Actually Volney instructed the jury to come back with a not guilty verdict, based on his reasoning that patholist Dr hughvorn Des veignes was not a forensic pathologist. This was later challenged by the state and it was proven that indeed he was.
What is interesting is that Dr Des veignes is a high ranking TOP official in Tobago!!
if the state won the case against volney, then shouldnt/couldnt the state retry Boyce?
edit: ok did some reading and it was judged that he did make an error.
heres the link with the post script
http://www.privy-council.org.uk/files/other/The%20state%20v.%20Brad%20Boyce.final-rtf.rtf
so my question is, did he do it cause he was/is biased ? or did he make an error?
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The Privy cousil also said that the time passed was too long therefore the eyewitnesses memories would not have been clear so they said he could not be retired.
Volney always doing shit
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if the state won the case against volney, then shouldnt/couldnt the state retry Boyce?
edit: ok did some reading and it was judged that he did make an error.
heres the link with the post script
http://www.privy-council.org.uk/files/other/The%20state%20v.%20Brad%20Boyce.final-rtf.rtf
so my question is, did he do it cause he was/is biased ? or did he make an error?
.......or something else so sinister I dare not allow myself to speak or type it.....
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
this was a snap election, therefore he had to jump off the bench and into the politics immediately.You want him to wait how long? 1 or 2 years? what will he do for that period?
Another thing, please explain to me any possible reason y he went into politics other than what he is saying. Remember he had total privacy being a judge and couldnt be investigated by the Integrity commission, so if he leaving to be in bobol is a big risk he taking. ALso, high court judges make more money than MPs.
I am not a lawyer, nor a judge to know about the intricate details regarding the brad boyce case when it comes to the law. Remember Volney can only rule on evidence based on the law and the law alone not his personal feelings. It easy for me and u to say a man guilty, but he dosent have that luxary. He may very well know that a person guilty, but if proper procedure was not followed then he have no choice but to let a person go free.
Actually Volney instructed the jury to come back with a not guilty verdict, based on his reasoning that patholist Dr hughvorn Des veignes was not a forensic pathologist. This was later challenged by the state and it was proven that indeed he was.
What is interesting is that Dr Des veignes is a high ranking TOP official in Tobago!!
It seems as if politics is the destination for self actualization in T&T
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if the state won the case against volney, then shouldnt/couldnt the state retry Boyce?
edit: ok did some reading and it was judged that he did make an error.
heres the link with the post script
http://www.privy-council.org.uk/files/other/The%20state%20v.%20Brad%20Boyce.final-rtf.rtf
so my question is, did he do it cause he was/is biased ? or did he make an error?
.......or something else so sinister I dare not allow myself to speak or type it.....
race/ bribe?
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Volney Addesses the Media
http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/Sh64twfusf0
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someone please come up with a reason y this man would leave his sanctity of judicial office to risk it all where he can be probed and must make financial declarations.
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someone please come up with a reason y this man would leave his sanctity of judicial office to risk it all where he can be probed and must make financial declarations.
Judges and magistrates have to make declarations to the JLSC.
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Reginald Dumas has called the move an inappropriate one and that Kamla has shot herself in the foot by taking on this man......
If I were in the St. Joseph constituency, I wouldn't have been able to bring mih self to put an X next to this man's name....all I would be thinking is Brad Boyce, Brad Boyce, Brad Boyce.......
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someone please come up with a reason y this man would leave his sanctity of judicial office to risk it all where he can be probed and must make financial declarations.
Judges and magistrates have to make declarations to the JLSC.
I really dunno what world Sammy living in... how else would we be able to guard against corruption of the judiciary if there were no way to monitor their extra-judicial income? The info just isn't public knowledge, but that doesn't mean there aren't disclosures. Me personally, this move by Volney is highly suspect and critics are right that it casts the judiciary in a negative light. Everyone knows (although we easily forget) that judges are citizens as well and have their own political agendas. However the goal should be to minimize the focus on one's personal politics.
For those who still having a hard time seeing the impropriety of his actions let me use an analogy: imagine a high-ranking EPL referee resigning he wuk one week to go take up a job with a big club days later. The natural reaction would be to think that there was some pre-existing relationship between him and the club while he was still active as a ref, and before he quit. Immediately this would draw scrutiny to any match that he officiated involving his new employer-club.
By not allowing for the passage of some time between his posts it gives rise to the assumption that there was a pre-existing relationship between Volney and the UNC/COP or whatever it is they calling deyself. The passage of time between posts would at least create the pretext (if not reality) that the relationship was formed after his resignation. At best it shows extremely poor judgment... something that's anathema to the judicial profession... any sort of poor judgement by a judge/ex-judge reflects badly on the profession... let alone poor judgment such as this where the impartiality of the judiciary is now being questioned.
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someone please come up with a reason y this man would leave his sanctity of judicial office to risk it all where he can be probed and must make financial declarations.
Judges and magistrates have to make declarations to the JLSC.
I really dunno what world Sammy living in... how else would we be able to guard against corruption of the judiciary if there were no way to monitor their extra-judicial income? The info just isn't public knowledge, but that doesn't mean there aren't disclosures. Me personally, this move by Volney is highly suspect and critics are right that it casts the judiciary in a negative light. Everyone knows (although we easily forget) that judges are citizens as well and have their own political agendas. However the goal should be to minimize the focus on one's personal politics.
For those who still having a hard time seeing the impropriety of his actions let me use an analogy: imagine a high-ranking EPL referee resigning he wuk one week to go take up a job with a big club days later. The natural reaction would be to think that there was some pre-existing relationship between him and the club while he was still active as a ref, and before he quit. Immediately this would draw scrutiny to any match that he officiated involving his new employer-club.
By not allowing for the passage of some time between his posts it gives rise to the assumption that there was a pre-existing relationship between Volney and the UNC/COP or whatever it is they calling deyself. The passage of time between posts would at least create the pretext (if not reality) that the relationship was formed after his resignation. At best it shows extremely poor judgment... something that's anathema to the judicial profession... any sort of poor judgement by a judge/ex-judge reflects badly on the profession... let alone poor judgment such as this where the impartiality of the judiciary is now being questioned.
A fitting comparison. Volney's actions confirms the degree of political contagion in our legal system.
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TT "wag the dog" story.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
Link to LIVE UNC Rally http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161651332
A group of protestors have arrived... They are booed. Volney has called for the police to remove them. Their posters read, "Remember Brad Boyce?........" Volney said they cannot take the fire from him. The invasion by the protestors, he said is the PNM’s way of dealing with opposition.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
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THEY WELL ORGANIZED WITH WELL PRINTED PLACARDS.to be random citizens
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have a right to protest a crooked judge
(http://paper.trinidadexpress.com/0001.gif)
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
My thoughts exactly. Allyuh feel is only the Johnson family that have a problem with volney?? I know a whole lot of Tobagonians who want to cuss him for wha he say about des vignes.
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lol
airman bring the video of the protest fast nah - try to get cnmg version.
It clear that it was a political ploy. Printed placards, lol. I wouldna mind it it was real, but come on, the reporter tried to interview the protesters and no one wanted to talk, except one fella who was roughed and dragged off by another protester. Since when protesters dont want to speak to the press? that happens when u are there not knowing the reasons for the protest, not knowing what the placards state and to cause trouble. This coulda turned out violent.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
you saw the footage and the reporter trying to get an interview? if u did, u would know that this was not for brad boyce but a political ploy.
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lol
airman bring the video of the protest fast nah - try to get cnmg version.
It clear that it was a political ploy. Printed placards, lol. I wouldna mind it it was real, but come on, the reporter tried to interview the protesters and no one wanted to talk, except one fella who was roughed and dragged off by another protester. Since when protesters dont want to speak to the press? that happens when u are there not knowing the reasons for the protest, not knowing what the placards state and to cause trouble. This coulda turned out violent.
so wha yuh saying sammy that these people illiterate?
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Signal, I like yuh signature.....it could make a good slogan on a juzzy!!...... ;D
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TT "wag the dog" story.
on point!
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(http://newsday.co.tt/galeria/2010-05-04-7-1_A_rubber_snake.jpg)
De man really bring a dead rubber snake to a political rally..what a ting !!
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
you saw the footage and the reporter trying to get an interview? if u did, u would know that this was not for brad boyce but a political ploy.
A political ploy to highlight the actions of a candidate. They are perfectly entitled to do so. There is nothing wrong with it.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
you saw the footage and the reporter trying to get an interview? if u did, u would know that this was not for brad boyce but a political ploy.
A political ploy to highlight the actions of a candidate. They are perfectly entitled to do so. There is nothing wrong with it.
true true...but it coulda turn ugly with the protesters bussing through the crowd in front the stage.
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
you saw the footage and the reporter trying to get an interview? if u did, u would know that this was not for brad boyce but a political ploy.
A political ploy to highlight the actions of a candidate. They are perfectly entitled to do so. There is nothing wrong with it.
One of the reasons I keep saying Kamla swallow a grenade on this.........
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(http://newsday.co.tt/galeria/2010-05-04-7-1_A_rubber_snake.jpg)
De man really bring a dead rubber snake to a political rally..what a ting !!
what was that about?
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(http://newsday.co.tt/galeria/2010-05-04-7-1_A_rubber_snake.jpg)
De man really bring a dead rubber snake to a political rally..what a ting !!
what was that about?
Real theatre was on last night with volney before the protesters came through.
brownie..heard your tex loud & clear on i95 :beermug:
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while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
I doubt it, but Kamla swallow a grenade on this Volney thing....
All yuh tink d electorate so sophisticated.while Volney was giving his speech protesters was the most present
yeap and he called for their arrest and jack called them DOGS...I will definitely not be voting UNC come this election...That was probably the man's family..They held candles and stufff..really touching!!!
dunno dred. my neighbour is real close to the johnson family. he told my dad he didnt recognise any of them. could be cousins or something if any at all but he said if they were planning on doing something like that they would have told others about it about it so he would have known. he also said they're not very vindictive people so i really think its some PNM BS.
So if it was Johnson family it woulda b aceptable but if d ave Joe who maybe pissed by Volney have 2 b PNM BS
you saw the footage and the reporter trying to get an interview? if u did, u would know that this was not for brad boyce but a political ploy.
All my news on d election on d GD pg so no me eh c d protest but nuff peeps upset bout Volney so I will not assume dat dey get money 2 protest.
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Anybody have a video? Cuz..i all de reports i hearing..reading...etc...saying that the protesters were silent. Which opening my mind to the question..wha purpose they were trying to serve? And..if they didnt allow themselves to be interviewed...and they were met with immediate censure by those on the platform....(who were able to give exact numbers of how many protesters there were)...it makes me wonder.
Or probably i over cynical.
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Real theatre was on last night with volney before the protesters came through.
And to think I was supposed to stop and pick up a bag of popcorn last night...the entertainment level was at its max last night!! I say Volney was a closet politician all this time.... :devil: ;D
brownie..heard your tex loud & clear on i95 :beermug:
:beermug: ;)
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THat man relll creepy boii...He have a heavyness about him I find...Right after his speech, they start playing Singing Sandra's "Voices from the ghetto"..Doesn't that song make a direct reference to Brad Boyce?...Rell pappyshow campaign is like these ppl aren't thinking...Kamla had it in her grasps and it slowly but surely slipping from her..!!!
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Volney attacks Jeremie
‘He tried to undermine judiciary’s independence’
Alicia Llanos
Published: 4 May 2010
Alicia Llanos
In his first appearance on a political platform retired High Court judge Herbert Volney last night accused Attorney General John Jeremie of trying to undermine the independence of the Judiciary. A fiery Volney said he had to leave the Judiciary to fight for its independence. Volney, speaking during a UNC political meeting in St Joseph last night, said he was moved by the holy spirit. Speaking after him Movement for Social Change candidate for Pointe-a-Pierre Errol McLeod described Volney as “a hoodlum minister.”
During his speech, a number of people appeared in the crowd holding placards questioning his credibility. The former judge said they were Cepep workers who were paid by the PNM. “Let them do it. If they don’t they will be fired,” he said.
Volney added: “That is the PNM way of dealing with it. They can’t deal with the fire from Volney... because I speak with the holy spirit.” He claimed Jeremie was having State attorneys “burn the midnight oil” for the last three days to make out a case that he was still a judge and therefore could not be a candidate for the May 24 general election
Continue http://guardian.co.tt/news/politics/2010/05/04/volney-attacks-jeremie
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I was unfamiliar with the Brad Boyce incident... removed as I am from the circus that is often life in Trinidad. Having read the accounts of Volney's ruling it is amazing to me that this man escaped sanction for his actions. Any place else and he would have been disrobed and stamping papers as a paralegal.
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I was unfamiliar with the Brad Boyce incident... removed as I am from the circus that is often life in Trinidad. Having read the accounts of Volney's ruling it is amazing to me that this man escaped sanction for his actions. Any place else and he would have been disrobed and stamping papers as a paralegal.
The furthest this layperson would go is to say that the decision was an act of judicial activism. Do they where do they disrobe you for that?
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I was unfamiliar with the Brad Boyce incident... removed as I am from the circus that is often life in Trinidad. Having read the accounts of Volney's ruling it is amazing to me that this man escaped sanction for his actions. Any place else and he would have been disrobed and stamping papers as a paralegal.
The furthest this layperson would go is to say that the decision was an act of judicial activism. Do they where do they disrobe you for that?
Nah... dai'z not judicial activism.
Judicial activism in the most cynical sense (how critics would characterize it) is using the bench to create law where there is no basis for it in the nation's charter. A more balanced interpretation would be that the judge isn't creating laws per se, but rather interpreting the existing laws in a contemporary context so as to stay current with evolving societal mores. For example, the US case of Plessy vs. Ferguson (1896) upheld segregation, stating that blacks were not discriminated against provided that 'separate but equal' facilities were provided for them so that they wouldn't comingle with whites. Nearly 60 yrs later the Supreme Court overruled itself in Brown vs. Board of Ed. of Topeka (1954), essentially saying that changing societal values no longer found segregation acceptable, that the mere fact that you're forcing blacks to live separate lives is itself discriminatory. Critics (also known as 'strict constructionists') would call that a case of judicial activism... which is nonsense, of course.
What Volney did was to disregard his role as arbiter in the matter and step himself into the fray compromising the deliberations. In Civil Law jurisdictions (Germany, Japan, Italy) the judge has an active role, driving the proceedings, calling witnesses, investigating facts and applying the law. In Common Law jurisdictions (TnT, the UK and US) the role of the judge is to hear the facts, listen to the arguments and apply the law. A judge under such a system cannot undertake to call his own witnesses (as Volney did in calling his own forensic pathologist), conduct his own investigation into the qualifications of an expert witness, or essentially become part of the defense team by discrediting the prosecution's witness. Needless to say his interference compromised the outcome of the trial long before the directed verdict was ordered.
Frankly, I surprised Karl didn't say something... the integrity of the proceedings demanded it. Plus had Volney simply interfered as he did with Des Vignes w/o the directed verdict instruction... and then the jury still found Boyce guilty, that would have been grounds for a mistrial for the defendant.
The impartiality of the judiciary should never be brought into question... except in the Mickey Mouse world that passes for Trinidad. That is precisely what Volney did by his actions. Anywhere else and he wouldn't have been disbarred from practicing but he woulda loss he big wuk as ah judge.
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well des vignes and volney wud have ample time to catch up as both are members in d coalition
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well des vignes and volney wud have ample time to catch up as both are members in d coalition
All is 4given I am sure Manning is now d enemy.
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Bakes dais the thing that was so frigtening about the Volney - Brad Boyce issue. HE instruct the jury to return a guilty verdict after all his shenanigans.
This has been reopened and laid bare again like the nasty festering sore it has and always will be.
And I agree with you, apparently judges and magistrates do not get sanctioned for anything in this country....shame, shame, shame!!...
Ah hearing ah talk that is Carlos John was the friend who is a "patriot" that recommended him to the UNC....is only an allegation at this point though soooooo....
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Bakes dais the thing that was so frigtening about the Volney - Brad Boyce issue. HE instruct the jury to return a guilty verdict after all his shenanigans.
This has been reopened and laid bare again like the nasty festering sore it has and always will be.
And I agree with you, apparently judges and magistrates do not get sanctioned for anything in this country....shame, shame, shame!!...
Ah hearing ah talk that is Carlos John was the friend who is a "patriot" that recommended him to the UNC....is only an allegation at this point though soooooo....
There's nothing really unusual about that instruction itself to be honest, if a judge thinks as a matter of law that no reasonable jury could find a defendant guilty he can instruct the jury to return a directed verdict. A judge can even go one step further and overturn a jury verdict in rare instances... called judgment n.o.v. (or judgment notwithstanding the verdict). What made his behavior aberrant was the degree of involvement in the proceedings, I honestly don't know what he was thinking... or how he justified his actions to his peers afterwards. 'Cause you know somebody musta ask him about that.
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Actually what was more aberrant was the fact he instructed the JURY to return a verdict of NOT guilty! Brownsugar yuh wrong on dat! Volney free de man after he kill Johnson!
It was in Karl's best interest to say nutten as he was defending Brad Boyce.
The real sinister thing about this was that when the DPP appealed the case, Sharma and the rest ah the now UNCOP supporters on the T&T high court ruled in favor of Volney saying the a part of the law was constitutional ( Section 65 of the Supreme Court of Judicature Act).
Volney say that De Vignes was NOT qualified to be a pathologist based on ah Indian doctor's testimony. He den day there was no evidence on what caused the death of Jason Johnson.
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Actually what was more aberrant was the fact he instructed the JURY toreturn a verdict of NOT guilty!
What's the point of a jury anyway right.
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DAT SAID...when Patrick and dem did have Sharma jumping, and Panday in jail nobody cry interference..do so doh like so..
........ah was thinking that same thing, ah feel Patos realise we does forget quickly....Patos' move (re Sharma) to me was direct judicial interference so he cyar be throwing stone in a glass house now.......
I just remember why I eh have no choice this election......*sigh*
u forget Abu Bakr or what? :rotfl:
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Actually what was more aberrant was the fact he instructed the JURY to return a verdict of NOT guilty! Brownsugar yuh wrong on dat! Volney free de man after he kill Johnson!
It was in Karl's best interest to say nutten as he was defending Brad Boyce.
The real sinister thing about this was that when the DPP appealed the case, Sharma and the rest ah the now UNCOP supporters on the T&T high court ruled in favor of Volney saying the a part of the law was constitutional ( Section 65 of the Supreme Court of Judicature Act).
Volney say that De Vignes was NOT qualified to be a pathologist based on ah Indian doctor's testimony. He den day there was no evidence on what caused the death of Jason Johnson.
You totally misread my point... I understand clearly what Brownsugar meant. Again... there is nothing at all aberrant about an instruction for a directed verdict. A directed verdict today in the US is called Judgment As a Matter of Law (JMOL). Again take a look at what I said
if a judge thinks as a matter of law that no reasonable jury could find a defendant guilty he can instruct the jury to return a directed verdict.
Therefore, if as a matter of law he doesn't think the prosecution's evidence supports a conviction he can instruct to jury to return a directed verdict. A 'directed verdict' can only be issued for aquittal... no judge cannot instruct a jury to return a guilty verdict).
You also missed my point about Karl... yes he wants his client to be acquitted, but Volney's actions were so egregious that they threatened any outcome in the matter, guilt or innocence. Staying quiet in the hopes of an acquittal won as the result of a tainted trial is a fool's errand. You should note that the only thing preventing a retrial was the passage of time as the Privy Council rightly noted.
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Jah Gol... the jury is there to decide issues relating to fact not law. Matters of law are the exclusive purview of the judge. Therefore in the case of a directed verdict (at least here in the states) a judge will always preface his instruction with the incantation "as a matter of law, there is insufficient evidence upon which to find this defendant..."
So he's not usurping the Jury's powers, rather he's asserting his in that instance. The matter if taken up on appeal then becomes a question for the Appellate tribunal to decide wheter he abused his discretion.
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Source: http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161652575
WHY I FREED BRAD BOYCE
Volney: I cannot be blamed
Ria Taitt Political Editor
Wednesday, May 5th 2010
UNITED NATIONAL CONGRESS (COP) St Joseph candidate Herbert Volney, a former High Court judge, yesterday defended his 1998 judgment which led to the freeing of Brad Boyce, saying that if people knew the facts of that case, they would understand why he ruled the way he did.
The Brad Boyce case, in which Volney in 1998 directed a nine-member jury to return a not guilty verdict in favour of Boyce, who was on trial for unlawfully killing Jason Johnson, was resurrected when a small group of protestors stormed the UNC meeting at St Joseph on Monday night during Volney’s address.
Speaking to the Express in a telephone interview yesterday, Volney said:
’People should read my judgment and they would quite well understand why I ruled as I had. Most people don’t recall the facts of the Brad Boyce trial. It was a case of mismanagement and a matter of intervening cause of death-broncho pneumonia, he said.
’The person (Johnson) died from something totally unrelated to the initial injury. And the onus was on the State..to negate that, that intervening event was not the substantial cause of death. The State had failed to do so,’ he added.
DEFENDS JUDGMENT: Herbert Volney
’The guy (Johnson) died not from the injuries sustained (from the blow from Boyce) but from broncho-pneumonia, (which came) because the nurses put a feeding tube down into his lungs and because of all the food that went down into his lungs. They placed him on a ventilator and the ventilator malfunctioned. And the State had to prove that it was not medical negligence on the part of the San Fernando Hospital that had been the substantial cause of death. And the State failed to do so. So I upheld the submission of no case. People don’t seem to understand the law. They just see the result and they conclude ’travesty’ (of justice).
He stated further that his decision in this case was reviewed by the Court of Appeal. The State lost its appeal against his decision and they (Court of Appeal) did not order a retrial, he noted. The State appealed again to the Privy Council which did not order a retrial, Volney said. ’The system has three layers and I was just the first. I can’t be blamed for the eventual so-called travesty of justice. There are two courts of review after me. Why don’t they (the protestors and his detractors) blame the other courts including the Court of Appeal in which three judges reviewed my decision? Why don’t they blame them? Why didn’t they order a retrial? Why don’t they blame the Privy Council for not ordering a retrial? Why are they only training their guns on me and not at the Court of Appeal or the Privy Council? They want to blame me because it is expedient to them to blame me,’ Volney stated.
The Privy Council did not order a retrial because of the nine-year lapse of time since the incident occurred. -See box
He added: ’Our system is three strikes. Three strikes! Not one’.
Volney also responded to concerns about his discussing the Naraynsingh case on the political platform. ’That matter was dead. It is finished, out of the court system. I happened to know what happened behind the scenes, because it was quite clear from the evidence. And I am quite capable of commenting on the evidence because the matter is at an end. It is not sub judice,’ Volney said.
However Volney, who gave a very fiery address on Monday night, said that the rhetoric of his first political speech would not be reproduced in his subsequent addresses on the platform. ’The rhetoric of that first meeting is not going to be the way I shall be speaking hereinafter. I am going to be dealing with issues of crime and law and order’.
On his statements on Attorney General John Jeremie, Volney said: ’Mr Jeremie is a former senator, he would be out of Parliament momentarily. I don’t care to comment on him. I have said what I had to. He is not worth my effort. I would be talking on the platform on crime, good governance of the criminal justice system and public order.
Asked about his rubber snake which he so dramatically pulled out and which looked so real, he laughed and said it belonged to his six-year-old son.
On the protestors, Volney said the Opposition intelligence indicated that the protestors were mobilised and gathered at the PNM St Joseph office.
He said should a similar situation reoccur he believes that the police would be better able to deal with the situation than they did on Monday night. ’I think that the police did not know the election law and they felt that they could not have acted as they ought to have. But what happened there- is conduct that is likely to result in a breach of peace. Because it almost come to that,’ he said.
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So if all dem reasons are the reason he instruct de jury to return a not guilty verdict....den...why dis happen?
http://www.trinidadandtobagonews.com/forum/webbbs_config.pl/noframes/read/3447
The Privy Council Tells Justice Herbert Volney his Ruling was Wrong in the Brad Boyce Trial
The Privy Council has ruled that High Court Judge Herbert Volney was wrong when he told a jury to return a not guilty verdict in the Brad Boyce trial seven years ago.
But despite the ruling Brad Boyce will not be rearrested.
The ruling was handed down by the Privy Council this morning and it comes after this country’s Director of Public Prosecution appealed Justice Volney’s decision to free Brad Boyce.
Oh and to answer Volney's question (as if he didnt know)
The Privy Council says he must remain free because too much time had passed since the incident and much of the eyewitness testimony would now be unreliable.
I go dig and see if i find de actual documents from de Privy Council ruling. Since like dey believe people dotish and cyar think critically.
I know i did read it somewhere. Sammy did post it up.
http://www.privy-council.org.uk/files/other/The%20state%20v.%20Brad%20Boyce.final-rtf.rtf
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The more Volney speaks the more sinister his pronouncements. The Privy Council didn't order a retrial not because yuh initial ruling was correct yuh shameless bastard... but because too much time had passed such as to make the eyewitness statements no longer reliable (imagine having to testify to something you saw 9-10 yrs ago). Not sure why the reporter didn't call him on that.
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So if all dem reasons are the reason he instruct de jury to return a not guilty verdict....den...why dis happen?
http://www.trinidadandtobagonews.com/forum/webbbs_config.pl/noframes/read/3447
The Privy Council Tells Justice Herbert Volney his Ruling was Wrong in the Brad Boyce Trial
The Privy Council has ruled that High Court Judge Herbert Volney was wrong when he told a jury to return a not guilty verdict in the Brad Boyce trial seven years ago.
But despite the ruling Brad Boyce will not be rearrested.
The ruling was handed down by the Privy Council this morning and it comes after this country’s Director of Public Prosecution appealed Justice Volney’s decision to free Brad Boyce.
Oh and to answer Volney's question (as if he didnt know)
The Privy Council says he must remain free because too much time had passed since the incident and much of the eyewitness testimony would now be unreliable.
I go dig and see if i find de actual documents from de Privy Council ruling. Since like dey believe people dotish and cyar think critically.
OF COURSE WE DOTISH
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I was unfamiliar with the Brad Boyce incident... removed as I am from the circus that is often life in Trinidad. Having read the accounts of Volney's ruling it is amazing to me that this man escaped sanction for his actions. Any place else and he would have been disrobed and stamping papers as a paralegal.
The furthest this layperson would go is to say that the decision was an act of judicial activism. Do they where do they disrobe you for that?
Nah... dai'z not judicial activism.
Judicial activism in the most cynical sense (how critics would characterize it) is using the bench to create law where there is no basis for it in the nation's charter. A more balanced interpretation would be that the judge isn't creating laws per se, but rather interpreting the existing laws in a contemporary context so as to stay current with evolving societal mores. For example, the US case of Plessy vs. Ferguson (1896) upheld segregation, stating that blacks were not discriminated against provided that 'separate but equal' facilities were provided for them so that they wouldn't comingle with whites. Nearly 60 yrs later the Supreme Court overruled itself in Brown vs. Board of Ed. of Topeka (1954), essentially saying that changing societal values no longer found segregation acceptable, that the mere fact that you're forcing blacks to live separate lives is itself discriminatory. Critics (also known as 'strict constructionists') would call that a case of judicial activism... which is nonsense, of course.
What Volney did was to disregard his role as arbiter in the matter and step himself into the fray compromising the deliberations. In Civil Law jurisdictions (Germany, Japan, Italy) the judge has an active role, driving the proceedings, calling witnesses, investigating facts and applying the law. In Common Law jurisdictions (TnT, the UK and US) the role of the judge is to hear the facts, listen to the arguments and apply the law. A judge under such a system cannot undertake to call his own witnesses (as Volney did in calling his own forensic pathologist), conduct his own investigation into the qualifications of an expert witness, or essentially become part of the defense team by discrediting the prosecution's witness. Needless to say his interference compromised the outcome of the trial long before the directed verdict was ordered.
Frankly, I surprised Karl didn't say something... the integrity of the proceedings demanded it. Plus had Volney simply interfered as he did with Des Vignes w/o the directed verdict instruction... and then the jury still found Boyce guilty, that would have been grounds for a mistrial for the defendant.
The impartiality of the judiciary should never be brought into question... except in the Mickey Mouse world that passes for Trinidad. That is precisely what Volney did by his actions. Anywhere else and he wouldn't have been disbarred from practicing but he woulda loss he big wuk as ah judge.
Again, I'm just a layperson who has never ever been in a courtroom. My observation is that your position has softened a bit - from disrobing him to maybe losing his wuk. The law and its application often times appear very subjective. How else could the divisions in the US supreme Court be explained?
Is the Dred Scott decision still a principle in US law?
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anyone has the info on the court of appeal's judgement on volneys judgement?
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http://guardian.co.tt/news/crime/2010/05/05/mom-still-feels-pain-after-11-years
Mom still feels the pain after 11 years
Nancy Johnson sat in her Diego Martin apartment yesterday and shed a soft tear for her dead son Jason. It’s been more than 11 years now, but the mother’s pain never goes away. In fact, the hurt was further awakened this week, not just because of Mother’s Day on Sunday. In a dramatic move, family members, sympathisers and friends took the matter to the political circuit. They placarded a United National Congress (UNC) election campaign meeting in St Joseph, at which candidate Herbert Volney was a featured speaker. Volney, as a High Court judge, had presided over the legal trial a decade ago, at which young Brad Boyce faced a manslaughter charge. Boyce was eventually freed of the charge. In an interview at her Diego Martin Main Road apartment, Johnson said she would not like to see St Joseph constituents place a red finger for Volney.
“No, no, no. That is the judge who freed the person with respect to my son’s death,” she said. An emotional Johnson said: “It was just like yesterday to me. We are anti-Volney. I am tired. It was election time when my son was alive. I visited them and voted UNC. I am seeking compensation for my son’s death,” she said in a raspy voice. Jason was a waiter at a casino in Woodbrook, when he was struck on the head on September 1, 1998. The incident occurred outside the Edge nightclub at Long Circular Mall. He died on September 16, at San Fernando General Hospital. Boyce was said to have told Johnson he and his friends were banned from entering the club.
Boyce, 21, of Bel Air Gardens, La Romaine, was later acquitted by Justice Volney at Port-of-Spain Assizes for the unlawful killing of Johnson. Boyce is now residing abroad. Volney was speaking Monday night at George Earle Park, St Joseph, when a number of placard bearers protested close to the platform. Protesters included Stephen Johnson, brother of slain Jason Johnson. The urn with her son’s ashes was yesterday placed on the dining room table. A placard read: “Remember Brad Boyce? Remember the victim Jason Johnson—Volney Must Answer,” stood tall against a wall on top a buffet. Nancy, small in stature and dressed all in black, yesterday was the picture of hurt, mere days before Mother’s Day. Her brown eyes were void of emotion as she took a drink of her rum and pear drink and took a pull on a cigarette.
“I have to drink to sleep and take a smoke,” Johnson said. She said she will not join her son Stephen and protest against Volney. “Brad Boyce mash up my family...We separated after that,” she said. “My children did not want to go to school, although they had passes. I am not a person to do harm to anybody. He didn’t spend one night in jail. He was in the infirmary for the entire time.” Tears came to her eyes as she kissed a cross around her neck. She said in a low voice: “God can forgive. I can forgive him, but I can never forget.” Stephen said he did not orchestrate the protest. “Two friends told me we were going to protest my brother’s death,” he said. “All I know is I walked straight into a UNC meeting. I try to put my brother’s death behind me but it is still there.” He said he had his head bowed throughout the protest
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Poor CEPEP, just now they go get blame for earthquakes too
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Actually what was more aberrant was the fact he instructed the JURY to return a verdict of NOT guilty! Brownsugar yuh wrong on dat! Volney free de man after he kill Johnson!
oooopppsss my bad...is not guilty I meant to say....
On another but related note, I thought of Jason Johnson's mother and relatives the other day (to be honest I couldn't even remember the victims name until now, all I remember was Brad Boyce).
It must be difficult to have never had justice but to have that kinda pain to deal with all over again cyar be easy...lord aye, what the hell Kamla thinking??!!....in fact, she thinking at all??....steups!!!
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Again, I'm just a layperson who has never ever been in a courtroom. My observation is that your position has softened a bit - from disrobing him to maybe losing his wuk. The law and its application often times appear very subjective. How else could the divisions in the US supreme Court be explained?
Is the Dred Scott decision still a principle in US law?
Fella... my position hasn't been softened at all, what yuh think being "disrobed" means? Literally it means he loses his judge's robe, aka he loses his job as a judge. This is why I specifically used "disbarred" the second time because I sensed your confusion. As for the law being subjective... you can never fully guard against judges being influenced by their own personal opinions, but they're ethically sworn to not do so.
The "divisions" among the Supreme Court members may indicate their personal biases, but it isn't absolute proof of subjective interpretation by judges. Reasonable people could objectively look at the same set of facts and interpret it differently.
As for Dred Scott, that hasn't been good law for almost 150 years now...
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Poor CEPEP, just now they go get blame for earthquakes too
Nah d whorish women have dat lock down.
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I understood your point, I did not make my clear, sorry. It was aberrant in MY view as he totally disregarded a qualified opinion and freed a man erroneously. Then his frens and dem, who now on de same UNCOP platform agreed with his decision, only for the Privy Council to say dey was wrong.
sorry.
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Jah Gol... the jury is there to decide issues relating to fact not law. Matters of law are the exclusive purview of the judge. Therefore in the case of a directed verdict (at least here in the states) a judge will always preface his instruction with the incantation "as a matter of law, there is insufficient evidence upon which to find this defendant..."
So he's not usurping the Jury's powers, rather he's asserting his in that instance. The matter if taken up on appeal then becomes a question for the Appellate tribunal to decide wheter he abused his discretion.
Thanks for the clarification.
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I understood your point, I did not make my clear, sorry. It was aberrant in MY view as he totally disregarded a qualified opinion and freed a man erroneously. Then his frens and dem, who now on de same UNCOP platform agreed with his decision, only for the Privy Council to say dey was wrong.
sorry.
Still interested in knowing what the court of appeal said, or was they bypassed for the privy council?
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It real interesting that ah man who's name is becomming an electoral 'issue'....must be limin on bondi beach blissfully unaware that it even have elections in trinidad
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I understood your point, I did not make my clear, sorry. It was aberrant in MY view as he totally disregarded a qualified opinion and freed a man erroneously. Then his frens and dem, who now on de same UNCOP platform agreed with his decision, only for the Privy Council to say dey was wrong.
sorry.
Still interested in knowing what the court of appeal said, or was they bypassed for the privy council?
I told you that Sharma and de rest ah dem say Volney was right..den the State took it to the highest court which ruled Volney erred
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I understood your point, I did not make my clear, sorry. It was aberrant in MY view as he totally disregarded a qualified opinion and freed a man erroneously. Then his frens and dem, who now on de same UNCOP platform agreed with his decision, only for the Privy Council to say dey was wrong.
sorry.
He didn't just disregard Des Vignes' opinion... he disCREDITED it. He went out of his way to investigate, call his own expert witness (he's not a party to the case, nor should he be helping either side) and discredit a witness. Real bizarro world thing. Yeah it was a clear departure from procedure.
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I understood your point, I did not make my clear, sorry. It was aberrant in MY view as he totally disregarded a qualified opinion and freed a man erroneously. Then his frens and dem, who now on de same UNCOP platform agreed with his decision, only for the Privy Council to say dey was wrong.
sorry.
Still interested in knowing what the court of appeal said, or was they bypassed for the privy council?
I told you that Sharma and de rest ah dem say Volney was right..den the State took it to the highest court which ruled Volney erred
so is not volney alone who erred in this instance, but rather our panel of judges failed, so then y all the attacks on volney alone? Maybe all of our judges are tainted?
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so is not volney alone who erred in this instance, but rather our panel of judges failed, so then y all the attacks on volney alone? Maybe all of our judges are tainted?
If you don't understand why Volney being "attacked" then something wrong in your head. The Appellate panel didn't step outside their roles to compromise a trial... they merely found some b.s. justification for Volney's actions.
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so is not volney alone who erred in this instance, but rather our panel of judges failed, so then y all the attacks on volney alone? Maybe all of our judges are tainted?
If you don't understand why Volney being "attacked" then something wrong in your head. The Appellate panel didn't step outside their roles to compromise a trial... they merely found some b.s. justification for Volney's actions.
it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
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so is not volney alone who erred in this instance, but rather our panel of judges failed, so then y all the attacks on volney alone? Maybe all of our judges are tainted?
If you don't understand why Volney being "attacked" then something wrong in your head. The Appellate panel didn't step outside their roles to compromise a trial... they merely found some b.s. justification for Volney's actions.
it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
Maybe....maybe the whole damn judicial system is a bunch a Volney's waiting to reveal themselves.....look Sammy yuh trying real hard.....yuh is a obvious opposition supporter, but come on nah man, take off yuh blinders for a bit and admit that Kamla make a big mistake in choosing this man....or rather he may have been foisted on her......hhhhhmmmm....
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it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
Fella... their actions weren't nearly as egregious as Volney's. To top it off, is not them who now have the gall to leave the judiciary and immediately start campaigning for a political position. If you have some argument to make as to why they're just as bad as Volney then let's hear it.
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well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
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it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
Fella... their actions weren't nearly as egregious as Volney's. To top it off, is not them who now have the gall to leave the judiciary and immediately start campaigning for a political position. If you have some argument to make as to why they're just as bad as Volney then let's hear it.
so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
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Brown sugar, lol i not wearing any blinders. If u saying that due to the negative publicity kamla made a mistake then you could be right but that is left to be seen.
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it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
Fella... their actions weren't nearly as egregious as Volney's. To top it off, is not them who now have the gall to leave the judiciary and immediately start campaigning for a political position. If you have some argument to make as to why they're just as bad as Volney then let's hear it.
so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
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Brown sugar, lol i not wearing any blinders. If u saying that due to the negative publicity kamla made a mistake then you could be right but that is left to be seen.
Yuh real pushing it, de ink wasn't dry and he get nominated, highly inappropriate even Kamla said she should have waited.
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it other words, they defending the indefensible and should be chided as well?
Fella... their actions weren't nearly as egregious as Volney's. To top it off, is not them who now have the gall to leave the judiciary and immediately start campaigning for a political position. If you have some argument to make as to why they're just as bad as Volney then let's hear it.
so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
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Brown sugar, lol i not wearing any blinders. If u saying that due to the negative publicity kamla made a mistake then you could be right but that is left to be seen.
Yuh real pushing it, de ink wasn't dry and he get nominated, highly inappropriate even Kamla said she should have waited.
TC, u your self said : well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
so what difference does it make if he got nominated right after he resign see that there are impartial judges on the bench?
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so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
of course they do... but they usually don't wear their politics on their sleeves.
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
How long after retiring should football referies wait until they reveal their club allegiances? Lemme know if yuh confused by the question so that I could point yuh to de explanation.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
There have?? Can you name another former judge/justice who ran for political office or who endorsed a political party/candidate soon (or even long) after leaving the bench?
so what difference does it make if he got nominated right after he resign see that there are impartial judges on the bench?
The difference is that you call the impartiality of the judiciary into question because it makes it seem as though there was a pre-existing relationship between him and the party he now seeks to represent. But I already explain all of this... if you didn't find it persuasive then you probably won't now, so I won't waste either of our time.
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so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
of course they do... but they usually don't wear their politics on their sleeves.
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
How long after retiring should football referies wait until they reveal their club allegiances? Lemme know if yuh confused by the question so that I could point yuh to de explanation.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
There have?? Can you name another former judge/justice who ran for political office or who endorsed a political party/candidate soon (or even long) after leaving the bench?
so what difference does it make if he got nominated right after he resign see that there are impartial judges on the bench?
The difference is that you call the impartiality of the judiciary into question because it makes it seem as though there was a pre-existing relationship between him and the party he now seeks to represent. But I already explain all of this... if you didn't find it persuasive then you probably won't now, so I won't waste either of our time.
see? all a allyuh saying the man shoudla wait, but no-one willing to tell me how long. lol
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so judges in T&T dont vote and dont hold party cards? whats to say that they are not biased in the first place?
of course they do... but they usually don't wear their politics on their sleeves.
I ask again, how long should he have waited before he ran? Please enlighten me.
How long after retiring should football referies wait until they reveal their club allegiances? Lemme know if yuh confused by the question so that I could point yuh to de explanation.
Also, have there not been situations like this in the country before thus setting a precedence ?
There have?? Can you name another former judge/justice who ran for political office or who endorsed a political party/candidate soon (or even long) after leaving the bench?
so what difference does it make if he got nominated right after he resign see that there are impartial judges on the bench?
The difference is that you call the impartiality of the judiciary into question because it makes it seem as though there was a pre-existing relationship between him and the party he now seeks to represent. But I already explain all of this... if you didn't find it persuasive then you probably won't now, so I won't waste either of our time.
see? all a allyuh saying the man shoudla wait, but no-one willing to tell me how long. lol
Well....i could say 20 minutes probably eh enuff time.
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see? all a allyuh saying the man shoudla wait, but no-one willing to tell me how long. lol
That is because common sense is something you either have or you don't have... others can't share what they have with you.
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see? all a allyuh saying the man shoudla wait, but no-one willing to tell me how long. lol
That is because common sense is something you either have or you don't have... others can't share what they have with you.
lol...take win bredda.....he choulda wait some time right? lol ok bright man. u win.....he should wait some time.
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lol...take win bredda.....he choulda wait some time right? lol ok bright man. u win.....he should wait some time.
Is not a matter of being "bright"... if out ah de blue you and yuh wife mash up one day, and next day BAM yuh pick up with ah next woman... yuh doh think that will appear shady to de wife and de casual on-looker? Whereas if yuh wait fuh some time tuh pass before yuh move in wid de new doolahin it wouldn't look as bad, no?
It eh have no mathematical formula to tell you how long yuh should wait... that is something common sense should tell you, yuh eh have to be bright to figure dat out.
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lol...take win bredda.....he choulda wait some time right? lol ok bright man. u win.....he should wait some time.
Is not a matter of being "bright"... if out ah de blue you and yuh wife mash up one day, and next day BAM yuh pick up with ah next woman... yuh doh think that will appear shady to de wife and de casual on-looker? Whereas if yuh wait fuh some time tuh pass before yuh move in wid de new doolahin it wouldn't look as bad, no?
It eh have no mathematical formula to tell you how long yuh should wait... that is something common sense should tell you, yuh eh have to be bright to figure dat out.
Usa an analogy with ah rotten latrine seat Bakes............he go get dat!
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lol...take win bredda.....he choulda wait some time right? lol ok bright man. u win.....he should wait some time.
Is not a matter of being "bright"... if out ah de blue you and yuh wife mash up one day, and next day BAM yuh pick up with ah next woman... yuh doh think that will appear shady to de wife and de casual on-looker? Whereas if yuh wait fuh some time tuh pass before yuh move in wid de new doolahin it wouldn't look as bad, no?
It eh have no mathematical formula to tell you how long yuh should wait... that is something common sense should tell you, yuh eh have to be bright to figure dat out.
how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
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how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
I guess that's where you and the rest of us disagree... you putting de interests of de outside woman and she chirren over the interests of yuh marri'd wife. Just as Volney putting his own selfish political aspirations over the reputation of the judiciary. To each his own.
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how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
I guess that's where you and the rest of us disagree... you putting de interests of de outside woman and she chirren over the interests of yuh marri'd wife. Just as Volney putting his own selfish political aspirations over the reputation of the judiciary. To each his own.
the reputation of the judiciary is already of biased.
well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
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how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
I guess that's where you and the rest of us disagree... you putting de interests of de outside woman and she chirren over the interests of yuh marri'd wife. Just as Volney putting his own selfish political aspirations over the reputation of the judiciary. To each his own.
the reputation of the judiciary is already of biased.
well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
They were appointed by the then government and after losing to PNm..what de f**k I trying to explain to you, yuh done decide already..why de facking debate?
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how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
I guess that's where you and the rest of us disagree... you putting de interests of de outside woman and she chirren over the interests of yuh marri'd wife. Just as Volney putting his own selfish political aspirations over the reputation of the judiciary. To each his own.
the reputation of the judiciary is already of biased.
well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
They were appointed by the then government and after losing to PNm..what de f**k I trying to explain to you, yuh done decide already..why de facking debate?
all i simply trying to show allyuh that u cant get away from the fact that all of them politically link one way or the other no matter what - daiz all.
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how u think it would appear to the outside woman and she chirren and all who think they might have a chance to benfit from it? would they care? ;)
I guess that's where you and the rest of us disagree... you putting de interests of de outside woman and she chirren over the interests of yuh marri'd wife. Just as Volney putting his own selfish political aspirations over the reputation of the judiciary. To each his own.
the reputation of the judiciary is already of biased.
well dem were opposition judges mostly anyway...so who knows what de fack was going on..Sharma come CJ after lol
They were appointed by the then government and after losing to PNm..what de f**k I trying to explain to you, yuh done decide already..why de facking debate?
all i simply trying to show allyuh that u cant get away from the fact that all of them politically link one way or the other no matter what - daiz all.
errrr...everyone has already accepted that FACT!
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It real interesting that ah man who's name is becomming an electoral 'issue'....must be limin on bondi beach blissfully unaware that it even have elections in trinidad
if yuh mean boyce he right in trini...he only left for a couple years following the trial
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It real interesting that ah man who's name is becomming an electoral 'issue'....must be limin on bondi beach blissfully unaware that it even have elections in trinidad
if yuh mean boyce he right in trini...he only left for a couple years following the trial
eh heh? Papers and everyone saying he resides in Australia still.
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he went aussie for a lil while..but that was not where he was based for long..he back in trini for couple years now
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I see he put up a patch up website to clean up his PR.. lol That American stratagist aint know the man on the street don't be on the internet. Is mostly the foreign Trinis.
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he went aussie for a lil while..but that was not where he was based for long..he back in trini for couple years now
hmmm....
cant we use dna or something to re-open this case and convict?
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he went aussie for a lil while..but that was not where he was based for long..he back in trini for couple years now
hmmm....
cant we use dna or something to re-open this case and convict?
1. Mih eh think it had any DNA to be tested in the case....it was primarily eye witness testimony and in any event.....
2. De Privy Council already rule that he can't be rearrested....case closed, move on...
It real interesting that ah man who's name is becomming an electoral 'issue'....must be limin on bondi beach blissfully unaware that it even have elections in trinidad
if yuh mean boyce he right in trini...he only left for a couple years following the trial
eh heh? Papers and everyone saying he resides in Australia still.
For true Triniwhiteboy?? I swear he left and never came back.....
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believe me he probably was wining next to u in plenty fetes and carnival...he keeps a low profile tho. Yuh wud not recognize him from the old photos
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For true Triniwhiteboy?? I swear he left and never came back.....
well , yuh know we journalists is not de greatest wit accurate info....plus dem white fellahs from sout does real link
Brownie yuh mus be gih de man ah wine in troot.
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Ex Justice Volney publicly apologise to the johnson family and friends this morning on TV6, saying he made a mistake and its all in a days work, he wants people to put it behind them now. He said that he was not apologising to De vignes though.
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Ex Justice Volney publicly apologise to the johnson family and friends this morning on TV6, saying he made a mistake and its all in a days work,
:o
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Ex Justice Volney publicly apologise to the johnson family and friends this morning on TV6, saying he made a mistake and its all in a days work, he wants people to put it behind them now. He said that he was not apologising to De vignes though.
ooooohhhhhh guuuudddd!!! :o :o.....ah shoulda know something was up....he wasn't on the UNC/COP/NJAC/TOP/MSJ/ABC/XYZ platform last night......
....there is an article in the papers today giving Des Vignes's response to the whole thing....ah goh link it when ah get ah chance later......
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Ex Justice Volney publicly apologise to the johnson family and friends this morning on TV6, saying he made a mistake and its all in a days work, he wants people to put it behind them now. He said that he was not apologising to De vignes though.
ooooohhhhhh guuuudddd!!! :o :o.....ah shoulda know something was up....he wasn't on the UNC/COP/NJAC/TOP/MSJ/ABC/XYZ platform last night......
....there is an article in the papers today giving Des Vignes's response to the whole thing....ah goh link it when ah get ah chance later......
D time on my watch say later.
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believe me he probably was wining next to u in plenty fetes and carnival...he keeps a low profile tho. Yuh wud not recognize him from the old photos
for real?? i remember brad from pres, was a year ahead of me...that man was realll dred boy, my lord...get expelled for smoking weed.
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D time on my watch say later.
Here ya go ma'am.... ;D
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161653553 (http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161653553)
Pathologist in Boyce trial: Let's move on for T&T's sake
Akile Simon akile.simon@trinidadexpress.com
Thursday, May 6th 2010
DR HUGHVON Des Vignes, a member of the Tobago Organisation of the People (TOP), and the pathologist who conducted the autopsy on the body of 19-year-old Jason Johnson says that the resurrection of the Brad Boyce trial was not in the best interest for the future development of the country.
According to Des Vignes, the media is only seeking to get news by seeking to stretch the issue.
On Monday several protesters carrying placards and lighted candles, with white t-shirts covering their heads and faces, stormed a political meeting demanding that former High Court judge Herbert Volney answer certain questions relating to Boyce’s acquittal on a manslaughter charge against Johnson.
He said: ’Why are you all going back in the graveyard? Let’s move on. This thing happened over 12 years ago and I think we should move on. What you all are doing is trying to make news because this doesn’t add anything to the progress of our society. Let’s move on because I have gone past this thing a long time ago,’ Des Vignes said yesterday. Volney directed the jury to disregard the testimony of Des Vignes at the trial since he was not registered as a forensic pathologist.
bury the past: Dr Hughvon Des Vignes
Des Vignes explained at the time of the acquittal, he was not registered as forensic pathologist. He said laws have now been put in place to get specialists registered.
’They are now trying to get the criteria so I’m still not registered as a forensic pathologist,’ he said.
When asked he (Des Vignes) believes Volney should apologise to Johnson’s relatives, Des Vignes said that was something for Volney himself to decide. ’I don’t know if he’d be inclined or if there is any place for that. But, I can’t really answer that,’ he added.
Des Vignes was recently screened as a TOP candidate for the Tobago West seat but was not given the nod by the party’s screening committee chaired by it’s political leader, Ashworth Jack. In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
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In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
so how is Boyce responsible for Johnson's death??
am I missing something
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In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
so how is Boyce responsible for Johnson's death??
am I missing something
that is why the charge dropped to manslaughter
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In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
so how is Boyce responsible for Johnson's death??
am I missing something
He claims that was the cause of death. If you bring somebody in to question someones qualifications.....then...since they qualified to question somebody's expertise.....let them interpret the evidence in the persons place nah. Nah...buh....dat eh wha he decide to do.
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Bourbon boy......is best Brad Boyce did pay Volney to be he defence lawyer....or maybe he did .....:whistling: :whistling:
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D time on my watch say later.
Here ya go ma'am.... ;D
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161653553 (http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161653553)
Pathologist in Boyce trial: Let's move on for T&T's sake
Akile Simon akile.simon@trinidadexpress.com
Thursday, May 6th 2010
DR HUGHVON Des Vignes, a member of the Tobago Organisation of the People (TOP), and the pathologist who conducted the autopsy on the body of 19-year-old Jason Johnson says that the resurrection of the Brad Boyce trial was not in the best interest for the future development of the country.
According to Des Vignes, the media is only seeking to get news by seeking to stretch the issue.
On Monday several protesters carrying placards and lighted candles, with white t-shirts covering their heads and faces, stormed a political meeting demanding that former High Court judge Herbert Volney answer certain questions relating to Boyce’s acquittal on a manslaughter charge against Johnson.
He said: ’Why are you all going back in the graveyard? Let’s move on. This thing happened over 12 years ago and I think we should move on. What you all are doing is trying to make news because this doesn’t add anything to the progress of our society. Let’s move on because I have gone past this thing a long time ago,’ Des Vignes said yesterday. Volney directed the jury to disregard the testimony of Des Vignes at the trial since he was not registered as a forensic pathologist.
bury the past: Dr Hughvon Des Vignes
Des Vignes explained at the time of the acquittal, he was not registered as forensic pathologist. He said laws have now been put in place to get specialists registered.
’They are now trying to get the criteria so I’m still not registered as a forensic pathologist,’ he said.
When asked he (Des Vignes) believes Volney should apologise to Johnson’s relatives, Des Vignes said that was something for Volney himself to decide. ’I don’t know if he’d be inclined or if there is any place for that. But, I can’t really answer that,’ he added.
Des Vignes was recently screened as a TOP candidate for the Tobago West seat but was not given the nod by the party’s screening committee chaired by it’s political leader, Ashworth Jack. In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
THXS
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In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
so how is Boyce responsible for Johnson's death??
am I missing something
He claims that was the cause of death. If you bring somebody in to question someones qualifications.....then...since they qualified to question somebody's expertise.....let them interpret the evidence in the persons place nah. Nah...buh....dat eh wha he decide to do.
If he was in a coma it more than likely it is de tube aspirating into the lung that wudda cause him to die. THe necrosis and ischemia that wud take place would prob kill him. And the then ripe ground for bacterial infection on top of that. Whoever inserted the feeding tube wrongly should have faced some action at least from the hospital. That is real madness to miss the esophagus and go down the trachea. The insertion of a feeding tube in a unconscious patient eh that hard.
But fact is Brad put the man in that position in de first place.
edit: and the aspiration pneumonia is one of the worst to get. Gettin that in the hospital yuh have a high chance of having antibiotic resistant strep or staph...that reaaaaaaaal hard to get rid of.
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Mom: I forgive judge
Thursday, May 6th 2010
NANCY JOHNSON, the mother of Jason Johnson who was killed 14 years ago, said yesterday she was unaware of any plans to picket the United National Congress (UNC) meeting in St Joseph on Monday during retired Justice Herbert Volney’s maiden speech on the political platform.
Nancy Johnson said yesterday, ’I believed someone decided to do it (the protest) on their own,’ but to this day she believed that Brad Boyce, who faced trial for unlawfully killing her son, had, ’some sort of weapon,’ that night.
She said the family had moved from their Cornelio Street, Woodbrook home because, ’anytime I opened Jason’s bedroom it would carry me back. I said I cannot live in that house anymore.’
Years after the incident, Nancy Johnson and her husband Stephen Johnson separated.
I WILL NEVER FORGET WHAT HE DID: Nancy Johnson, the mother of Jason Johnson, at her Diego Martin home yesterday. -Photo: GYASI GONZALES
’I forgive Volney,’ she said..Continue http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/nart?id=161653549
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Minister: Prisoner spilling beans’ on Volney
Gail Alexander
Published: 7 May 2010
A Venezuelan national, who was freed under a judgment of Justice Herbert Volney, as he then was, is now back in prison and is “talking about what happened and why he got off,” PNM Works Minister Colm Imbert said yesterday. Imbert and several other PNM Ministers—including St Joseph MP Kennedy Swaratsingh—weighed in on issues involving UNC St Joseph candidate Volney during yesterday’s post-Cabinet media briefing at the Diplomatic Centre, St Ann’s. They addressed the issue about Monday night’s UNC meeting where members of the Jason Johnson family protested Volney’s judgment which freed Brad Boyce who was accused of the manslaughter of Johnson...http://guardian.co.tt/news/general/2010/05/07/minister-prisoner-spilling-beans-volney
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I remember meeting Brad Boyce in Jail. The fella was ah rel arse. He did feel he in to much thing. He knew he was gonna get off even before appeals and all that was handed down. He was never worried about anything.
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I remember meeting Brad Boyce in Jail. The fella was ah rel arse. He did feel he in to much thing. He knew he was gonna get off even before appeals and all that was handed down. He was never worried about anything.
We are all friends here we know what Boyce did what did u do?
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I remember meeting Brad Boyce in Jail. The fella was ah rel arse. He did feel he in to much thing. He knew he was gonna get off even before appeals and all that was handed down. He was never worried about anything.
We are all friends here we know what Boyce did what did u do?
:o like Elan get out the big house too. how you know Volney to get off too?
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In the early hours of September 1, 1996 there was an altercation outside The Edge Nightclub at Long Circular Mall in St James, in which Boyce allegedly struck Jason Johnson a blow to the head.
On September 9, Johnson developed aspiration pneumonia and was put on a ventilator, where he remained in a coma until he died on September 16. At the trial it was revealed that a feeding tube was inserted into his lung and Johnson was hooked up on a malfunctioning ventilator.
Boyce was charged with murder at the preliminary enquiry stage but this was reduced to manslaughter and he was tried before Volney and a jury in July 1998.
so how is Boyce responsible for Johnson's death??
am I missing something
He claims that was the cause of death. If you bring somebody in to question someones qualifications.....then...since they qualified to question somebody's expertise.....let them interpret the evidence in the persons place nah. Nah...buh....dat eh wha he decide to do.
If he was in a coma it more than likely it is de tube aspirating into the lung that wudda cause him to die. THe necrosis and ischemia that wud take place would prob kill him. And the then ripe ground for bacterial infection on top of that. Whoever inserted the feeding tube wrongly should have faced some action at least from the hospital. That is real madness to miss the esophagus and go down the trachea. The insertion of a feeding tube in a unconscious patient eh that hard.
But fact is Brad put the man in that position in de first place.
edit: and the aspiration pneumonia is one of the worst to get. Gettin that in the hospital yuh have a high chance of having antibiotic resistant strep or staph...that reaaaaaaaal hard to get rid of.
Several things you saying here I have issue with. Apart from a paid defence witness no one ever agreed that the man had a feeding tube wrongly inserted. That was the defence case, ventilator cut of temporarily, and tube placed in lung instead ah stomach. You have also admitted that placing a feeding tube correctly in a comatose patient is not that hard.
The man had an emergency craniotomy to release pressure and bleeding subdural hematoma etc. Some of the side effects of this can be seizures, swelling, trouble breathing etc. Now from what I learned as a medic in the military aspiration pneumonia is caused by some foreign substance in your lungs, like food (dat is why the defence came up with that), anesthesia, people who in ah coma get it, vomiting etc.
The trouble with making a diagnosis without the benefit of at least medical records is that yuh could make MANY errors.
DesVignes was there he say is de concussive force ah the blows what kill de man. Karl was doing he job and introduce aspiration pneumonia as a possibility to bring in reasonable doubt and bring in an expert to say the cause of death in his opinion was aspiration Pneu.
Aspiration Pneumonia occurs when you aspirate foreign matter into your lungs — most often when the contents of your stomach enter your lungs after you vomit. This commonly happens when a brain injury or other condition affects your normal gag reflex. There was NO evidence that the hospital was guilty of wrongly placing a feeding tube. NONE! The FACT that he had aspiration Pneu. is not to say he got if from malpractice, it could have been a result of aspirating foreign matter into his lungs after he got cuffed down.
Look me eh no expert eh, I was simply a well trained medic in the US Navy.... and I mean well trained I was doctor on small ships and doctor to marines, I was allowed to do lots of things only licensed doctors could do in teh civilian world and I remember sometings...A common predisposing factor fuh dis type ah pneumonia is G.E.R.D. This dioes happen when contents from yuh belly happen to flow back into the upper esophagus. From dey, gastroesophageal contents can be aspirated into yuh windpipe an den into yuh lower airways. Even small amounts of gastroesophageal reflux can lead to pneumonia in people who are hospitalized, especially if yuh comatose or underwent surgery.
There is little doubt in my mind Brad get away with he ting. Volney call back a doctor and ask him if des Vignes is a qualified specialist according to certain civil servant guidelines, de man say no, and before the prosecution could cross examine de man he direct de jury to let de man go...dat really sloppy and smacks of interference. The man coulda die from aspiration pneumonia eh, but what cause he to get that is up in de air....DesVignes with the benefit of an autopsy say is de blows, a paid man reviewing the records say nah...is pneumonia, if the defence had paid for an independent autopy and the findings were different den that was anodder story.
Taken from the Privy Council ruling:
5. Events then took an unusual course. After Dr Daisley had been cross-examined, but before re-examination, the judge of his own motion recalled Dr des Vignes to ask him about his qualifications in forensic pathology. It appeared that he was not registered as such with the Trinidad and Tobago Medical Board and that his fellowship in Alberta was more in the nature of an apprenticeship than a formal course leading to a certificate or diploma. Instead, the Chief Medical Examiner, under whose general supervision he had performed some 270 autopsies, had simply written a letter recommending Dr des Vignes as competent to act as a forensic pathologist and he had been so employed by the Forensic Science Centre.
6. The judge then, still acting of his own accord, called Professor Chandulal, the Chief Forensic Pathologist, to ask him about the qualifications required for civil service appointment as a forensic pathologist. He said that one needed a medical degree followed by a postgraduate degree in forensic pathology which would be accepted as registrable by the Medical Board of Trinidad and Tobago. Professor Chandulal said that he was registered as a forensic pathologist but that Dr des Vignes was not.
7. After hearing this evidence and submissions from counsel, the judge decided that Dr des Vignes was not qualified as an expert for the purpose of giving an opinion on the cause of death and that his evidence was inadmissible and should be withdrawn from the jury. He then ruled that the evidence of Dr des Etanges did not provide a sufficient basis for a finding by the jury that Boyce had caused Johnson’s death and directed the jury to acquit.
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I remember meeting Brad Boyce in Jail.
I not interested in anything else yuh say after this.....please do tell how yuh meet Brad Boyce in jail??!!....surely you were doing some kinda charity work or something so and was just visiting the prisoners right? Cuz we doh associate with criminals on here.... :devil: ;D
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TC i was just going on what was said in the article..I eh kno the details of the case. I was just commenting on if it was a feeding tube down the trachea that is madness and poorly done, u as a medic should know that.. But even with a gag reflex if yuh got a bunch of foreign bodies down into the lungs yuh beggin for infection..
Yuh also right about GERD being a common factor, reason which it is often these people who get the gastric acid into the lungs. However it is by no means the only way it gonna happen.
But as you pointed out this was the defence story, that i didn't know.
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if the defence had paid for an independent autopy and the findings were different den that was anodder story.
Isn't that the crux of the matter right there?? Why didn't the defence use their own experts to discredit Des Vignes??
After all, ent is the same Justice (now "citizen" ::)) Volney who accepted autopsy results from Des Vignes in other cases?? So what was so special about this case that Des Vignes wasn't qualified??
I couldn't remember the facts and issues in the case only that Volney screwed up big time. But thanks to Kamla and her brilliant decision we get to rehash this dark moment in our justice system....
It stinks today as it stank back then and Volney could apologise all he want, he let a guilty man go free....end of story....
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Volney also let de venezuelan go, and he also let De Professor and he wife go after the evidence suggested that he ahd his wife were implicated in his ex-wife's murder, including a confession by the hit men.
de man also fail he bar exam plenty times I heard. lol
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I remember meeting Brad Boyce in Jail.
I not interested in anything else yuh say after this.....please do tell how yuh meet Brad Boyce in jail??!!....surely you were doing some kinda charity work or something so and was just visiting the prisoners right? Cuz we doh associate with criminals on here.... :devil: ;D
:devil: :devil:
Oh gawd all ya voupping good today
maybe Elan is a guard
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Elan, how well did you know Brad Boyce, did you share the same cell, what did he do to you after the lights went out? The folks of this forum need to know :beermug:
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TC i was just going on what was said in the article..I eh kno the details of the case. I was just commenting on if it was a feeding tube down the trachea that is madness and poorly done, u as a medic should know that.. But even with a gag reflex if yuh got a bunch of foreign bodies down into the lungs yuh beggin for infection..
Yuh also right about GERD being a common factor, reason which it is often these people who get the gastric acid into the lungs. However it is by no means the only way it gonna happen.
But as you pointed out this was the defence story, that i didn't know.
The main problem is ....where in the medical record did it say aspiration pneumonia due to wrongly inserted tube as a cause of death. What people have a problem with is why Volney acted on his own accord to question the credentials and discredit the testimony of DeVignes. I am sure that wasn't the first time that DeVignes gave testimony in a court. Why did that become an issue for the judge all of a sudden when the defense did not bring it up?
The judiciary has to maintain or attempt to maintain impartiality. What irks people is "if this was ah poor boy from de ghetto," would Volney take the unprecedented step to act on his own?
And now he further brings himself and his judgment into disrepute because he was obviously dealing with UNC while still a sitting judge.
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TC i was just going on what was said in the article..I eh kno the details of the case. I was just commenting on if it was a feeding tube down the trachea that is madness and poorly done, u as a medic should know that.. But even with a gag reflex if yuh got a bunch of foreign bodies down into the lungs yuh beggin for infection..
Yuh also right about GERD being a common factor, reason which it is often these people who get the gastric acid into the lungs. However it is by no means the only way it gonna happen.
But as you pointed out this was the defence story, that i didn't know.
The main problem is ....where in the medical record did it say aspiration pneumonia due to wrongly inserted tube as a cause of death. What people have a problem with is why Volney acted on his own accord to question the credentials and discredit the testimony of DeVignes. I am sure that wasn't the first time that DeVignes gave testimony in a court. Why did that become an issue for the judge all of a sudden when the defense did not bring it up?
The judiciary has to maintain or attempt to maintain impartiality. What irks people is "if this was ah poor boy from de ghetto," would Volney take the unprecedented step to act on his own?
And now he further brings himself and his judgment into disrepute because he was obviously dealing with UNC while still a sitting judge.
like allyuh eh realize i agreeing with yuh..I said i was going on what was mentioned in the article..TC done clear that up for me
I was just trying to give pple a heads up on what the article said about aspiration pneumonia and why it really could kill de fella IF IT HAPPENED!
I agree wit everyting u say. I not defending Boyce and never have, cuz I was not there so i doh have a clue what really went on with that fight. Volney do shit clearly
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
Gary Hunt was a perfect example of that.....
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
Gary Hunt was a perfect example of that.....
So what is colm imbert den :-\ ???
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
Gary Hunt was a perfect example of that.....
So what is colm imbert den :-\ ???
He is a crapaud from long time, so we used to he.....Gary on the other hand hit we like ah bolt of lightning out of the blue....and we will never be the same again....national pride and all..... ::) ::)
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
Gary Hunt was a perfect example of that.....
So what is colm imbert den :-\ ???
A Hobbit.
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A Hobbit.
lol
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At Kennedy Swaratsingh Saturday. Crowd was 3 times larger than judge snake's own last week, and this one mostly a mix of young and old St joseph resisdence from mt.dour to the main road. Don't think he will not even come close to losing this seat. A true resident and community resident for the youths.
Not surprised. The thought of voting for Volney would ah drive mih to make sure he lose....Kamla probably had St. Joseph sown up until that dumb move.
Girl peeps doh vote candidate in TNT is party
I could put a crapaud in a suit......
Gary Hunt was a perfect example of that.....
So what is colm imbert den :-\ ???
A Hobbit.
:rotfl: :rotfl: