Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: weary1969 on November 25, 2011, 10:12:05 AM
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..Trinidad PM says assassination plot uncovered
By TONY FRASER | AP – 17 hrs ago....
that police have uncovered an apparent plot to assassinate her and members of her government in the southern Caribbean country.
At a press conference in Trinidad's capital, Kamla Persad-Bissessar gave no specifics of the alleged plot, but indicated that it was a response by criminal groups to her government's ongoing state of emergency to tackle crime and dismantle gangs.
"The criminals are hurting in their pockets and so I am not surprised such elements would seek to make good on their threats of reprisals," Persad-Bissessar told reporters in Port-of-Spain.
Police Commissioner Dwayne Gibbs also declined to provide any details regarding the alleged plot. But he said about a dozen people have been detained. Their identities were not released.
"It would be imprudent to provide further details as we are engaged in looking at the threats," Gibbs said.
Earlier this month, Persad-Bissessar's government lifted a nearly three-month curfew that had helped stem a surging homicide rate but disgruntled many in a Caribbean country known for its party culture and carnival celebrations.
At the time, Persad-Bissessar said the state of emergency, which allows police to search properties without warrants, would remain in place and warned that limited curfews would be applied in some areas as needed.
The emergency orders, which have helped dramatically reduce homicides, come up for review in December and the country is divided on whether it has been a success.
On Thursday, the prime minister said the alleged assassination plot would not deter her government and the security forces from dismantling criminal gangs.
"We will noted be cowed in any way and we will give no quarter to them and our resolve has been strengthened to return Trinidad and Tobago to the peaceful place it used to be," she said.
She did not specifically say if she would push to have the state of emergency extended.
Trinidad and Tobago, the full name of the twin-island nation of 1.3 million people, is one of the most prosperous Caribbean countries thanks to oil and natural gas that make it a major fuel supplier for the U.S. and other nations.
It has one of the region's most diverse populations, a blend of African, Indian, Chinese and Middle Eastern cultures. But like other Caribbean nations, it also has developed a gang culture fueled by drug trafficking that has caused crime to soar.
The country has experienced political turmoil in the past, including a 1990 attempted coup by Muslim extremists that prompted the last state of emergency in Trinidad.
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..Trinidad prime minister says assassination plot foiled
AFP – 12 hrs ago............Trinidad and Tobago Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, pictured in October, said …
Trinidad and Tobago Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar said local security forces had foiled an assassination plot against her and several government ministers.
Police Commissioner Dwayne Gibbs said 12 people were arrested, including members of the local Defence Force, in an operation conducted by over 100 soldiers and police.
The announcement drew skepticism from the mayor of Port of Spain and others who raised concerns that the government might use it to extend a three-month state of emergency.
Persad-Bissessar said the "sinister plot" was concocted by "nefarious elements" in response to the "success" of the country's state of emergency, which has been in effect since August 21.
Local security "forces have thwarted what is an evil, devious act of treason," she said. "We are flushing out... these nefarious elements. They are finally confronted by a government which has the political will (to take them on)."
News of the assassination plot was met with skepticism from labor leaders and the mayor of Port of Spain, who said they hoped it would not be used to extend a state of emergency in effect since August 21.
Earlier this week, several trade unions declared their intention to resume protest action against the government as soon as the State of Emergency was lifted on December 5.
"We have no evidence of this so called assassination plot," said Vincent Cabrera, president of the Banking, Insurance and General Workers Union.
"So far, it is very incredulous that, just two weeks before the lifting of the state of emergency, another threat is being hoisted upon us. They cannot keep a state of emergency forever."
"It is my sincerest hope that the prime minister doesn't use this latest story to extend the state of emergency," said Port of Prince Mayor Louis Lee Sing.
The government said in August it was imposing the state of emergency in response to intelligence information that it could not share with the public.
Three days later, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan said the government had "averted a crisis." But the state of emergency remained in place and the government subsequently extended it for three months.
Two hundred and thirty six persons were arrested during that period under the Anti-Gang Act but all were released within weeks after chief public prosecutor Roger Gaspard concluded there was "no reasonable prospect of conviction."
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Ent they could name people who are arrested ?
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Me eh able to copy and paste articles.
Read it yuhself.
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/No_politics_here__threat_is_real-134476398.html
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/Cops_continue_search_for_would-be_assassins-134476403.html
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/___Believe_it_or_not_there_is_a_plot__says_Gibbs-134476413.html
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/Team_files_court_action_to_release_Karamath-134476373.html
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/AN_ACT_OF_TREASON-134476423.html
Nah...DIS ONE deserve posting:
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/The_Prime_Minister_s_speech-134476418.html
The following is the full text of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar's statement on the assasination plot:
I want to say, I never expected those who plotted against the security of our nation to congratulate me and my government for curtailing their ability to operate but I did anticipate their extreme displeasure. The State of Emergency has had a major impact on crime reduction and if I may share with you the following information that between August the 21st and November the 23rd thus far 7,269 persons have been arrested of these only 6.4 %( 463 persons) were arrested on gang related charges, the minority. The others were arrested on charges related to
• Drug offences
• Serious offences
• Homicide investigations
• Outstanding warrants
• Ammunition
• Firearms seized
In addition as of this morning 13,183 rounds of ammunition and 34 magazines have been recovered. 1bullet ladies and gentleman 1 life, also seized were 173 firearms I am told that 1 gun can "take out" 20 people.
In this three month period my Government's focus has been on the protection of life and property. We have seized over 1.5 billion dollars in drugs, the largest single "drug bust" worth over 55 million dollars. We are hurting them in their pockets. [EH? When dis happen?]
The criminal elements have tried to make good on their threats to carry out reprisals. I am grateful to the intelligence resources that uncovered the assassination plot.
As a result of their vigilance they have thwarted what was an evil, devious act of treason against the Republic of Trinidad and Tobago. Their actions have proven that the efforts of the government are having the desired effect. We are flushing them out; we are making it almost impossible to operate as they would have in the past.
These nefarious elements, with support from others whose names will also come to light in time, are finally confronted by a government which possesses the political will, courage and strength of conviction to stoutly defend and protect the citizens of our country. We will not cow to them, nor negotiate with them not give any quarter to them. No quarter to them.
The cowardly plots against me and the people's government serve only to strengthen my resolve and embolden efforts to eradicate this scourge from our society. For far too long these criminals have been allowed to flourish as the untouchables some with their sinister connections of legitimacy. The intense pressure brought to bear by our initiatives will be intensified and I will stop at nothing to return Trinidad and Tobago to the peaceful state we once enjoyed.
I want to remind you of what occurred in 1990. A commission of inquiry was established at that time and reports were produced and nothing was done with the information and that is why we have agreed to have this current Commission of Inquiry to ensure that nothing like this ever happens again.
I have spoken with the Leader of the opposition and have agreed that persons authorized by the Security forces will share with him the intelligence that we have. He has agreed to meet with them.
I wish to assure the nation that the uncovering of this plot and the motives for carrying it out demonstrate the competency and effectiveness of the government's national security resources and initiatives. The Republic is safer than ever. Your personal security and that of the nation is in safe hands. Once again, our protective services and intelligence units have performed admirably. Trinidad and Tobago salutes you.
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I personally think sey this thread should go into the entertainment section until di Police force actually charge people wid it.. Di Police force still wutless..
war
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I hear lefty get hold :devil:
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I hear lefty get hold :devil:
steups........wouldn't even be seen coming :devil:
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Men doing they planning on a facebook page or what.
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The fact there is so much doubt about the validity of this threat shows the credibility of the government is in the toilet. For the umpteenth time a position has been taken and the PM is hiding a hands behind her back saying some mischief is afoot. Hopefully we will get names and pics of the perpetrators of this plot.
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I just can't understand why - if this threat was real - they haven't called in Ian Alleyne. I mean, Kamla could go on Crimewatch and give her side of events and then Ian could tell everyone that " he's not playing and that he will mash up those responsible"
On a more serious note, I can't see the point of a "crime lord" doing this, because the replacement PM and AG would come back even harder. So, if there was a plot, its kinda pointless as a long term strategy.
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I just can't understand why - if this threat was real - they haven't called in Ian Alleyne. I mean, Kamla could go on Crimewatch and give her side of events and then Ian could tell everyone that " he's not playing and that he will mash up those responsible"
On a more serious note, I can't see the point of a "crime lord" doing this, because the replacement PM and AG would come back even harder. So, if there was a plot, its kinda pointless as a long term strategy.
??? Not supporting the validity of the threat or not only your highlighted comment. Since when does that impact organized crime? In almost all societies where lawlessness prevails this the standard MO, for crying out loud, it happened in Uncle Sam as well
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You remember the time people find out about the threat, there was supposed to be a statement by the AG/Judge as to why Ish and them did not get deported. So again smoke and mirrors. No explanation as to why UNC financiers were not deported and how the Judge in the case arrived at that decision.
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EXPERTS LED PLOT TO KILL KAMLA
By NALINEE SEELAL (Newsday).
Sunday, November 27 2011
The hunt is on for high-powered sniper rifles which were to be used in the assassination attempt of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and two members of her Cabinet.
The rifles were part of a cache of arms secretly brought into this country, and which were reportedly used in the target training practise at a secret camp in east Trinidad by three rogue ex-soldiers, who are now in custody assisting in the probe into the assassination attempt.
The three ex-soldiers, two of whom worked in the Defence Force and the other, a Coast Guardsman, were dishonourably discharged from the army and Coast Guard after they were found to be in possession of illegal arms, ammunition and drugs.
The three, who had over 15 years service, are all trained marksmen, and according to intelligence sources, were the actual trainers for the persons who were supposed to carry out the assassination attempt on the Prime Minister and two other Cabinet ministers.
One of the ex-soldiers detained has a farm in east Trinidad, and police believe that he was using it as a cover for the illegal trading of arms and ammunition. His farm is close to where a secret camp was found by law enforcement officers recently, and where several spent shells as well as paper targets were found.
That ex-soldier was up until yesterday in a cell at the Central Police Station in Port-of-Spain, where he is being heavily guarded. The ex-soldier has denied any involvement in an assassination plot.
Police have also detained a Trinidadian man, 30 years old, from the El Socorro, San Juan area who worked as a soldier in the US Army. That man was detained on Thursday and was up until yesterday being questioned in connection with the assassination plot.
Yesterday, Chief of Defence Staff, Brig Kenrick Maharaj, told Sunday Newsday that every effort is being made to verify if any law enforcement officer still on active duty is linked to this assassination attempt. He said intelligence officers are at this time trying to verify this.
“At this point in time we are engaged in a comprehensive investigation in both the police and Defence Force with respect to any other persons who may be involved in this assassination plot, or any other criminal activities,” Maharaj said in a telephone interview.
He commended officers who have been working round the clock to bring closure to this probe, and maintained that the Trinidad and Tobago Defence Force and other arms of the military remain committed to preserving law and order.
Thirteen persons have so far been detained in connection with the assassination plot and police hope to lay charges against some of the detained shortly. Apart from the men with local military backgrounds, four businessmen, an ex-soldier with the US Army, two police sergeants and three others have also been detained.
A secret camp which police believe was used to train persons involved in the assassination plot was discovered last week, and the country remained on high alert yesterday.
The assassination attempt was supposed to take place on Thursday following the Cabinet meeting, and the persons targeted were Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, and Minister of Housing and Environment Roodal Moonilal.
The plot was discovered two weeks ago by Special Branch officers, and the first person to be detained in connection with the plot was a central businessman last Monday.
Sunday Newsday was reliably informed yesterday that more persons allegedly involved in the assassination plot are to be detained under an authorisation order.
Yesterday, Deputy Police Commissioner Mervyn Richardson told Sunday Newsday that the investigation into the assassination plot is well underway, and officers are working round the clock to bring closure to the investigation. He pointed out that police officers will be carrying out searches, roadblocks and exercises as part of the attempt to flush out criminal elements, not only linked to the assassination plot, but those involved in other criminal activities.
A security blanket has been placed over the residence of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, and new security arrangements made for her and other Cabinet colleagues in wake of the assassination plot.
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say what yuh want, if this is indeed true , this is a serious act treason , people might be angry with the government but plotting to kill is on a whole different level of hate. If this plot is indeed as they say, it should be a straight death sentence. Imagine what would have happened if the PM (PP or PNM) were to be assassinated :(
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say what yuh want, if this is indeed true , this is a serious act treason , people might be angry with the government but plotting to kill is on a whole different level of hate. If this plot is indeed as they say, it should be a straight death sentence. Imagine what would have happened if the PM (PP or PNM) were to be assassinated :(
You're absolutely correct. Why hasn't anyone been charged yet though.
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say what yuh want, if this is indeed true , this is a serious act treason , people might be angry with the government but plotting to kill is on a whole different level of hate. If this plot is indeed as they say, it should be a straight death sentence. Imagine what would have happened if the PM (PP or PNM) were to be assassinated :(
You're absolutely correct. Why hasn't anyone been charged yet though.
Gathering of evidence maybe?
Under an SOE they could hold somebody for 7 days right? So the latest charges should be laid is next week or thereabouts. Holding 13 people should indicate that they have SOMETHING.
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say what yuh want, if this is indeed true , this is a serious act treason , people might be angry with the government but plotting to kill is on a whole different level of hate. If this plot is indeed as they say, it should be a straight death sentence. Imagine what would have happened if the PM (PP or PNM) were to be assassinated :(
You're absolutely correct. Why hasn't anyone been charged yet though.
I agree wholehearted with DWH on this one, even more so since d country is already on a very sharp knife edge...........but yuh have to agree that d initial skepticism that greeted news of the threat was ah problem of the gov't own making.............one question dat would be interesting to ask is if they truly have captured all the players involved given our poor intel gathering and investigative skills
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steups... yawn
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Okay, so we was under cufew and still under an SoE, the whole country lock down, the sea too; where did the guns come in and how were they allowed to enter the country? A heightened state of security and guns still coming in? How then can one argue for the success of the SoE, if at the end - when people could not move freely - guns are still getting into the hands of rogue members of society?
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Okay, so we was under cufew and still under an SoE, the whole country lock down, the sea too; where did the guns come in and how were they allowed to enter the country? A heightened state of security and guns still coming in? How then can one argue for the success of the SoE, if at the end - when people could not move freely - guns are still getting into the hands of rogue members of society?
Ah find yuh asking too many questions!!
Are you PNM by any chance? ::)
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Latest news is that is just d PM and AG that the threat is about. They wondering y peeps feel it eh true.
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OK forget about that lets move on, we had a Guinness and puncheon with red bull and miss spoke .
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notice they never said that the SOE was because there was a credible threat against the Gov't rather it seems as if the curfew uncovered the plot thereby justifying the SOE.
maybe I've read too many hardy boys and nancy drew growing up but wouldn't the first person you want to charge be the ring leader and all evidence gathered be in support of that looks like they goin deep sea fishin for cascadoo.
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http://www.newsday.co.tt/news/0,151402.html
PLOT TO KILL, TRIGGER PANIC
By Clint Chan Tack Tuesday, November 29 2011
Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis is being held under a detention order for his alleged role in a conspiracy to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, Housing and Environment Minister Dr Roodal Moonilal and Local Government Minister Chandresh Sharma.
Three other men, Ashmeed Choate, Shane Crawfowd and Chionesu Luqman, are also now in custody under detention orders for their roles in plotting to destabilise the country and to cause major panic.
National Security Minister Brigadier John Sandy yesterday signed the detention orders for the four men in accordance with the Emergency Powers Regulations 2011.
Newsday obtained copies of the detention orders, numbered 238, 239, 240, 241, which were gazetted yesterday.
Order 239, issued to Alexis, states he “has been named as a person involved in a conspiracy to assassinate the following government officials, which assassinations were to occur on November 24, 2011.”
The government officials listed in the order issued to Alexis are Persad-Bissessar, Ramlogan, Moonilal and Sharma.
In the document, Sandy notes that it was necessary to place Alexis, of Francois Street, Enterprise, Chaguanas, under detention to prevent him from “acting in any manner prejudicial to public safety or public order or the defence of Trinidad and Tobago”.
Only Alexis was named as being involved in the assassination plot.
The other three, however, were identified for roles in a plot to destabilise the country.
Detention order 238, issued for Choate, of 167 Craignish Road, Princes Town, states Choate has been identified as “the mastermind behind a plot to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic”.
Orders 240 and 241 for Luqman and Crawfowd respectively state they are among persons “behind a plot to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic.”
Several addresses were listed for Luqman in Mon Repos, Upper Malick, Morvant, East Dry River, Belmont and Valencia.
Crawfowd, also known as Asadullah, has addresses at 349 Dass Branch Trace, Enterprise, Chaguanas and Balisier Road, Smith Field Lands, Wallerfield.
All four are being held at the Eastern Detention Correctional and Rehabilitation Centre at Churchill Roosevelt Highway, Santa Rosa, Arima.
At a news conference held at the National Security Ministry’s Temple Court headquarters on Abercromby Street, Port-of-Spain, Sandy said he signed detention orders “for four individuals who are in police custody with respect to an assassination plot against high-ranking officials of the Government of the Republic of Trinidad and Tobago, including our Prime Minister.”
At the time, he did not name the four persons.
Detention orders were being prepared for nine other persons and will be issued pending legal advice.
Last week, 13 people were arrested by the police in connection to the murder conspiracy.
Sandy explained that Commissioner of Police Dwayne Gibbs had submitted to him a report two weeks ago stating that “intelligence units of the service had uncovered a threat to the nation’s security.”
“On Friday, November 18, 2011, Commissioner Gibbs in an official document reported to me that his intelligence personnel had unearthed a plot to assassinate the Prime Minister and three members of her Cabinet.”
The three ministers were Ramlogan, Moonilal and Sharma.
Sandy said the plotters had planned to carry out the killings on November 24.
“This plot to undermine the security and stability of the Republic of TT was to be executed on November 24, 2011, the 24th being a significant date in the political successes of the Prime Minister,” he told reporters.
Persad-Bissessar was elected United National Congress (UNC) political leader on January 24, 2010, appointed Opposition Leader on February 24, 2010 and elected Prime Minister on May 24, 2010.
“As a consequence, the Prime Minister was immediately alerted and briefed on the same afternoon of November 18, by senior members of law enforcement,” Sandy added.
He explained that as a result of the further gathering of intelligence by the security forces, five days after he received the report from Gibbs and Persad-Bissessar was briefed on the matter, the 13 persons who are now in police custody were arrested and detained at different locations in the country. “They remain in custody and continue to be interrogated,” he stated.
Sandy said there were no clear motives as to why Moonilal and Sharma were targeted for assassination. He added the only possible linkage which investigators have advanced are the fact that CEPEP falls under Moonilal’s portfolio while Sharma’s ministry manages one part of the Unemployment Relief Programme (URP).
Indicating that a serving member of the Police Service, two former soldiers and a former member of the Coast Guard were among those detained, Sandy reiterated how saddened he was that former members of the military were involved in the plot.
In the case of the four persons, now being held under detention orders, Sandy said consideration is being given to charging them under the Anti-Terrorism Act among other laws.
Reminded that the state of emergency ends on December 5 and Government, Sandy said, “By then, we should have sufficient evidence to pursue the matters. If we don’t, then they have to be released.”
Asked about previous arrests of persons, who were held under the Anti-Gang Act, but have been released due to a lack of evidence, Sandy replied, “Well, I used to be in the military, never a police officer. That is something for the police.”
He reminded reporters that Government had engaged the services of Law Association president Dana Seetahal SC, Israel Khan SC, Pamela Elder SC and Theodore Guerra SC to provide legal advice on these and other matters during the state of emergency.
Seetahal and a team of lawyers met the Attorney General on Sunday at Seetahal’s El Dorado chambers in Port-of-Spain to discuss the preparation of the detention orders.
During the briefing, Sandy disclosed he had requested a report from the Chief Immigration Officer with respect to a pair of Israeli nationals who were reportedly in the custody of Caribbean Airlines but escaped five months ago.
Reporters asked whether police were investigating whether those individuals were involved in the assassination plot.
“I am advised by the police that all avenues are being explored,” Sandy replied. Sandy neither confirmed nor denied whether wire-tapping was one of the tactics used to detain the 13 persons now in custody.
He also remained silent about reports that the plot had international links to extremist or fundamentalist groups outside of TT.
However, he did reveal that the American Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and the British MI- 6 intelligence agency were “among other international agencies” who were collaborating with local security forces in ongoing investigations into this matter.
Saying Persad-Bissessar held a briefing to speak about the plot last Thursday because she felt it was time to “apprise the population” since there were rumours circulating in the country, Sandy said, “The fact of the matter remains no matter how high your level of security is, it could be breached.”
He said the Prime Minister felt she could continue with her schedule of public engagements and “the security around her will take care of her.”
Observing it was harder to protect someone like Persad-Bissessar in public, Sandy said, “I totally agree but then what do you do? Stay underground forever? It doesn’t make sense.”
Asked whether Persad-Bissessar will still be attending the Third Summit of Latin American and Caribbean leaders in Caracas, Venezuela on Friday and Saturday, all Sandy was prepared to say was “it has been discussed.”
After Sandy said security personnel close to Persad-Bissessar are being checked in relation to the plot, Newsday asked whether similar checks are being done for all government officials who report directly to the Prime Minister or who are close enough to be aware of sensitive information she is privy to.
“You can’t be 100 percent certain about things like that but you make every effort through vetting, through enquiries of the personnel to ensure that the people you have close to you are loyal to you.”
Asked again if these persons were being checked out by security forces, Sandy replied, “They must be.”
Asked whether there was any evidence that there were persons who were politically opposed to the Government involved in this plot, Sandy replied, “That thought has occurred. I would not what to comment on that from a political perspective, we are looking now at the strategic operational aspect of things.”
Asked how this plot differed from a case in 2001 when then prime minister Basdeo Panday claimed there was a plot to overthrow the then UNC administration, of which Persad-Bissessar was a Cabinet minister, Sandy said, “Now we have the intelligence.”
Recalling he was the TT Defence Force Chief of Staff at that time, Sandy said his reply to Panday’s claim was, “what plot?”
“I knew nothing of it at that time. I still don’t. When I asked him about it, he said he had information that certain people in the country were trying to kill him. I had nothing positive from the Commissioner of Police at the time neither did I get anything from him that would suggest some reason to pursue it.”
Gibbs, who attended the briefing along with Defence Force Chief of Staff Brigadier Kenrick Maharaj and Minister in the Ministry of National Security Collin Partap, said many of the questions which were put to Sandy were speculative in nature.
“I will not answer those questions with regards to investigative tactics and investigations that are underway. It would be inappropriate for me to do that as it could compromise any kind of investigation that we have, any kind of evidence that we may be gathering,” Gibbs said.
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Is it common practice to publicize moves made by such deep intelligence?
If the CIA thwarted a plot to kill Obama, is that gonna be on the front page of the Post the next morning?
honest question...
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Is it common practice to publicize moves made by such deep intelligence?
If the CIA thwarted a plot to kill Obama, is that gonna be on the front page of the Post the next morning?
honest question...
Not a matter of publicizing moves but if there is a credible threat you don't say anything until the investigation is almost done and people are on the verge of being arrested. In this case it seems as if they are arresting people then trying to investigate. For example they arrested an ex-soldier and accused him of smuggling weapons now mind you if that truly were the case then wouldn't have followed the trail back to the supplier and be working with Interpol, the FBI or whomever to apprend that supplier?
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This country is so unstable.
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This country is so unstable.
dread stop d indian hating
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This country is so unstable.
dread stop d indian hating
CO-SIGNNNNNNNNNNNN
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Coup plot: Trying to convince the sceptics (http://ht.ly/7JAV9)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 21:35
Tony Fraser
No one genuinely discerning of the state of politics in T&T and the world should be surprised at the measure of disbelief, cynicism, blind support and equally blind opposition to the very serious allegation that a group of people has been planning to assassi- nate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three of her Cabinet ministers. Here is the Prime Minister not sending her Minister of National Security but coming to the population (this is after the so patent backroom, orchestrated leaks of the previous day) and putting her reputation and the credibility of the Government on the line, informing about and giving context to a plot to assassinate her and her ministers.
Moreover, she was supported in her effort by the Commissioner of Police who attested to the assassination plot, and in the background the head of the Defence Force who sought to lend the weight of his office to the allegations. But even before the statements are finished there are the cynics on radio talk shows and social media sending messages across the world, those so minded saying that the alleged plot is a hoax.
Indeed, inside the news conference studio, Commissioner Gibbs, who at the best of times seems incapable of exuding confidence and rigour, recognises a measure of disbelief among a few reporters, so much so that he finds it necessary to say to them they could choose to believe or not, to disbelieve would be their prerogative, but that the plot has been discovered and the police are investigating it. But to bolster the strength of the allegations, the CoP indicates that a dozen people have been arrested and among them members (or former members) of the police and army.
But notwithstanding the Prime Minister and the security forces going this far to convince the sceptics, the disbelief continues. Prime Minister Persad-Bissessar went one step further and consulted with the Leader of the Opposition, Dr Keith Rowley, and secured a confidential meeting for him and the commissioner. Out of such a decision, the Prime Minister must have hoped to get a buy-in from the Leader of the Opposition for the selling of the allegation to that section of the population supportive of Dr Rowley. In addition, the Prime Minister must have been hoping to influence those not aligned to either side.
But as we know, Dr Rowley, although so far keeping the confidence about the details of the plot, has deemed it to be overreaction by the Government and behind it a plan to extend the state of emergency. So here is what must be referred to as a very serious threat against the Prime Minister and three of her ministers, with the police and army as points of reference, and the Attorney General all there to give credibility and stiffening to the claims, and yet there are significant pockets of disbelief in the society.
How could such people, the analyst may want to ask, so believe that a Prime Minister could be seeking to deceive and toss the country into turmoil to achieve some sectarian, short-term objective? What is more, how could people, those online, the callers and others, think that a government, any government, would place itself in jeopardy simply to win public sympathy which would fizzle if the allegations turn into a hoax?
Understandably, the cynics and believers should be divided into groups: the tribal supporters of the ruling and opposition parties who can be easily led around by their noses, who will see no evil, hear no evil about their party and tribe but will easily agree that the claims and actions of the other are false. This phenomenon of blind loyalty has seriously blighted the politics; it has given us a mass from which there can be drawn no critical thinking, just driven by tribal instincts. What it does in times such as those we are in now is to make public discourse meaningless as the tribal, unthinking loyalty offers nothing constructive to infuse the discussion and inform the society.
Those who support the ruling party will have us believe without questioning that the drug dealers are out to get the Prime Minister for smashing their drug rings, and that the Leader of the Opposition is hopelessly out of touch. On the other side there are those telling the nation that Mrs Persad-Bissessar represents the quintessence of Machiavellian intrigue and so no one should believe anything she and her Gov- ernment say. Outside of those entrenched blocs, there are many whose scepticism is based on the reality of a political culture which has been developing over the decades. That culture is founded in Anancy politics, who could outsmart who, deception being the first line of communication and the belief that at their very core, those who would engage in politics are inherently corrupt and so incapable of truth.
This is the reality of the politics developed by the political parties; it offers little hope for rational thinking and meaningful political participation. There are those who would say that culture has been very deliberately developed in the post-independence period so that the parties can depend on tribal loyalties. What seems fair to conclude is that a Prime Minister, the CoP, the Defence Force commander, the Attorney General and the Minister of National Security and threatened ministers could not hold the population in such contempt that they believe they could so deceive. Therefore, it must be that there is substance to the alleged assassination plot.
But like others, this columnist has a healthy scepticism of politicians and their parties. What is more, politicians and their parties have earned the disbelief which people have of them. Therefore, the allegation is before the Government and the security forces to be proven, and neither one of the two entities could seek to lay blame on each other for some faux pas which blocks the way forward. Nothing short of an unqualified conviction in the courts would satisfy those with doubts and there can be no long drawn-out investigation and deliberation: the police must go out and find the evidence to convince the Director of Public Prosecutions there is a basis for the laying of charges.
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Detention orders for 7 alleged assassins (http://ht.ly/7JAEi)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 20:23
Geisha Kowlessar & Derek Achong
Selwyn Alexis, also known as “Robocop”, a businessman of Francois Street, Enerprise, Chaguanas is one of the detainees. The State has identified seven alleged assassins involved in a conspiracy to kill Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three of her Cabinet colleagues. Five others have been named in a plot to destabilised Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic. Up to late yesterday, another suspect, held in east Port-of-Spain, was being questioned by police in connection with the plot. Detention orders for the 12 suspects were served yesterday at police stations in north Trinidad. Although the detention order stated the 12 detainees were to be house at the Eastern Detection Correctional and Rehabilitation Centre at Santa Rosa, Arima, it was learnt they were instead sent to the Golden Grove Prison, Arouca
The orders were enacted under the Emergency Powers Regulations 2011, made by National Security Minister John Sandy, in accordance with paragraph two of the regulations.
On Monday, at a National Security Ministry press briefing, Sandy revealed there were 13 people involved in the plot. The detention orders were drafted and served on the suspects late yesterday. The final suspect is expected to be served with a similar order today. The T&T Guardian was reliably informed, however, that the detainees have maintained their innocence. While the hunt is on for more suspects believed to be associated in the plot to assassinate Persad-Bissessar, senior investigators, however, have expressed doubt whether criminal charges could in fact be laid against those detained. Police sources said yesterday they believed other people, mainly from the Central area, could assist them with unearthing fresh information.
Investigators said they were hoping they could obtain tangible evidence before the state of emergency expired on Monday so that charges could be laid. “Right now we are working with what we have and that’s the best we could do. We believe we have the people we need at this point. “As we continue our investigations we believe there may be other people who can help us and we will be looking for them,” one senior investigator said. The alleged plot is believed to have stemmed from intelligence officers intercepting telephone conversations. Investigators said Ashmeed Choate, the Islamic scholar of Calcutta No 1, Freeport was the first person to be served with the detention order. He was arrested at his home by Special Branch officers last Tuesday. Prisons sources said the first batch of people sent to prison, via a detention order, were insurrectionists involved in the attempted 1990 coup. Prisons officials also added that the detainees would be treated like any other inmate, adding that no special treatment would be afforded to them.Contacted yesterday Gary Griffith, national security advisor to Persad-Bissessar, said security continued to be very heightened around the Prime Minister.
List of detainees:
• Selwyn Alexis, also known as “Robocop”, a businessman of Francois Street, Enerprise, Chaguanas.
• Yohann Cruickshank, also called “Wally”, of Mayers Lane, Chrissie Terrace, Longdenville, Chaguanas.
• David Millard, also known as “Buffy”, of 64, La Baja Road, Maracas, St Joseph.
• Andy Brown, also called “Sudan”, of Green and King Streets, Plymouth, Tobago.
• Police Sergeant Earl Elie, of Sampson Trace, off Cunupia Road, Cunupia. He was last assigned to the St Clair Police Station.
• William Taylor, also known as “Billy”, of Cumuto Main Road, Wallerfield, Cumuto.
• Bryan Barrington, also called “Soldier Barry”, of 20, Partap Trace, South Oropouche. Barrington is a former member of the Defence Force and was dishonourably discharged from the service.
• Khalil Karamath. of 30, Palm Road, Valsayn North, Valsayn. Karamath is the son of late contractor Hafeez Karamath.
• Shane Crawford, also called “Asadullah”, of
349 Dass Branch Trance, Enterprise.
• Milton Algernon, also called Fareed Mustapha ,of 34, Hibiscus Arc Road, Rio Claro. Algernon is a member of the T&T Sheep and Goat Farmers’ Association.
• Chionesu Luqman, also called Asim Cuffie, and also called Salim Luqman, of Mon Repos, Upper Malick, Morvant, and of Thomas Trace, East Dry River, Port-of-Spain ,and of St Margaret’s Lane, Belmont.
• Ashmeed Choate, an Islamic scholar, of Craignish Road, Princes Town.
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Lawyers claiming unlawful arrests (http://ht.ly/7JAD5)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 20:23
Even as detention orders were being served on two of the men held in connection with an alleged plot to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Government Ministers, their attorneys were proceeding with habeas corpus writ applications in the High Court. The applications are seeking to force authorities to justify the continuing detention of the men. The detention orders are expected to expire on Monday, coinciding with the end of the ongoing state of emergency. One detainee, Khalil Karamath, was served with the order while his matter was being heard before Justice David Harris in the Port-of-Spain High Court.
Karamath, 23, was arrested last Wednesday at his Palm Road, Valsayn, home by officers of the North Eastern Division Task Force, led by Cpl Sunil Bharath. Karamath is the son of late contractor Hafeez Karamath. During yesterday’s hearing, which was held in a closed-chamber court, attorneys representing Karamath claimed their client’s detention was unlawful. Karamath was taken to the Golden Grove Prison facility where he is expected to be housed for the duration of his detention order.
The matter was adjourned to a date to be decided by the court. During a simultaneous hearing before Justice Andre des Vignes in a separate court, another application, on behalf of Ashmeed Choate, of Craignish Village, Princes Town, was adjourned to tomorrow because of the absence of State counsel, who were before Justice Harris.
Choate was brought to the court almost an hour after the matter was adjourned. Choate was served with a detention order late yesterday evening and is said to be housed at the Arouca Police Station.
Several of Choate’s female relatives attended yesterday’s hearing. Before they were served with detention orders under Section 3 of the Emergency Powers Regulations of 2011, both men were held for a seven days under Section 16.3 of the said regulations which allows investigators more time to continue investigations. Last week a habeas corpus application was filed on behalf of another detainee, Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis, days after his arrest. That application was later withdrawn by his attorney, Joseph Honare, after Alexis was served with a notice of continuing detention under Section 16.3 of the regulations. Karamath is being represented by a team of attorneys, including Ravi Rajcoomar, John Heath and Irshaad Ali. Rajcoomar, Rishi Dass and Faris al Rawi appeared on behalf of Choate.
Senior Counsel Dana Seetahal and attorney Larry Lalla appeared on behalf of the State in both matters.
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AG on alleged death threat detentions: Govt working on laying charges before Monday (http://ht.ly/7JABV)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 20:23
Richard Lord
Attorney General Anand Ramlogan says the State is working around-the-clock to establish a case for people arrested under the state of emergency detention orders to be charged before Monday. He said that during an interview during yesterday’s Senate lunch break at Tower D, Waterfront Complex, Port-of-Spain. Asked what would be the State’s position if those detained were freed at the expiration of the emergency on Monday, Ramlogan said: “We’ll cross that bridge when we come to it. “The police have to do their work (and) the challenge now is for us to gather the various parts of the jigsaw puzzle and see whether or not you can put together a case that will satisfy the legal requirements for the DPP (Director of Public Prosecutions) to proffer charges.”
He said that was a matter “entirely for the security agencies and they are working ‘round-the-clock and trying their very best.” Asked if that must be done by Monday, Ramlogan said: “Well, I would assume so.”
He said the National Security Minister was responsible for the operational aspects of the matter while he (AG) was on the pulse of the legal aspects of the matter. Ramlogan said he was doing “all that is necessary and required to ensure the interest of justice will be served.” He also denied any move by the Government to draft new legislation to allow for those detained under the detention orders to be charged after the expiration of the emergency. Ramlogan also responded to questions on a claim by Opposition Senator Fitzgerald Hinds that the emergency was creating religious divisions between Hindus and Muslims in T&T.
Ramlogan said any move “to inject passions of race and religion in the affairs of national security will be reckless and dangerous.” He said the law enforcement agencies were operating on the basis of intelligence presented to them. He said intelligence was not driven by anything to do with race or religion. He said when the list of detainees was revealed it may show the varied mix of people in T&T.
Ramlogan said T&T has had a rich and proud history of managing “diversity and any extremist and fundamentalist sects within our country.”
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He won’t even hurt an ant—colleagues
Shock over detention of Islamic scholar... (http://ht.ly/7JAuz)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 21:38
Radhica Sookraj
Colleagues of Islamic scholar Ashmeed Choate, one of the persons served with a detention order by National Security Minister John Sandy, claim he is so compassionate about life he would not even kill an ant. Choate, 56, of Craignish Village, Princes Town, operates the Darul Qur’an Wal Hadith Islamic school in Freeport. Yesterday, his colleagues expressed shock and surprise at his detention. They said Choate, who opened the school in 2003, had never been involved in any illicit activities and did not have a criminal record. The school has an enrolment of more than 100, from kindergarten to CXC levels, and a staff 11 teachers.
There are concerns about the future of the school, now that its founder has been incarcerated. A senior teacher told the T&T Guardian that the school had a full turnout of students yesterday. “He is compassionate man and easy to approach,” the teacher said. “Right now we are in shock because we know that this is a malicious lie...He is like a father to us. “What our own husbands did not do for us, he did,” said the woman, who was dressed in a burka which covered her face and body. She explained that Choate spent most of his time at the private Islamic school.
“He comes in here from 6.30 and stays until 2 pm,” she said. “He does not travel abroad...He did some studies in Saudi Arabia but he is no terrorist or killer.” She added that Choate always taught his pupils to preserve life. “He says whatever have life, you leave it alone,” she said. “He insisted to the students not to kill the ants in the school...This is why we are so baffled that the police arrested him.” Another teacher, who said she was a Seventh-Day Adventist, said she had spent time with Choate discussing the differences between Christianity and Islam. She added that Choate worked at the Moruga Secondary School before he decided to open his own private school.
The institution has no funding from the Government and students are registered for the SEA and CXC exams privately. The teachers said the Ministry of Education curriculum was followed rigidly, although pupils were also exposed to Islamic studies. “The focus here is academics but we also teach the children basic morals and values to help them with life,” a teacher said. Choate’s grandfather started the popular Ali’s Doubles at Craignish and operated a variety store in Princes Town. Before opening the school, Choate studied in Saudi Arabia.
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Assassination? Not in T&T says Robocop’s wife (http://ht.ly/7JAt5)
Published: Wed, 2011-11-30 21:38
Radhica Sookraj
Krystal Alexis, daughter of Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis, holds her daughter Khalida Sanchez yesterday. PHOTO: RISHI RAGOONATH Bernadette Alexis, wife of Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis said yesterday that T&T was not the kind of nation where a Prime Minister would ever be assassinated because people were too passive. She was speaking during a telephone interview while returning from the Belmont Police Station where her husband was detained. Alexis, a former murder accused, has been detained under the Emergency Powers Regulations. Bernadette, however, said she did not believe this plot was true. “It is a sad thing because we voted for her...Why would we plot to kill her when we put her in that position,” she said.
She added that Persad-Bissessar was the “mother of the nation” and even if people were disgruntled about her policies, nobody would want to kill her. “Look at how much nonsense Patrick Manning do and nobody plot to kill him,” she said. “Why would anybody plot to kill her...This is stupidness. “In Trinidad, we don’t have assassins and snipers...We will grumble but we won’t kill.” She said she was also worried about Alexis as he fell ill while in custody and was taken to Port-of-Spain General Hospital on Thursday. She said she went to drop food for Alexis at the Belmont Police Station around noon yesterday but was told he was taken to the Santa Rosa detention centre.
“Right now, I don’t even know where that is and I am worried about him,” Bernadette said. Meanwhile, Krystal Alexis, Robocop’s daughter said she was upset because the Government was using her father in a political game. She denied that he was involved in any plot, saying the arrest had embarrassed her family. Speaking from the family’s shop at Enterprise, Chaguanas, Krystal said many people in Enterprise were upset by the detention orders. “People coming here and saying this is total craziness,” she added.
Meanwhile, people who live near detainee Shane Crawford said they never knew much about him. Crawford has two addresses—Dass Branch Trace, Enterprise, Chaguanas, and Balisier Road, Smithfield Lands, Wallerfield. At Dass Trace, residents said Crawford lived in an apartment and never mixed much. At Wallerfield, residents also said they did not know Crawford.
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Wait wait wait wait.
Nobody get charged yet right? So far is just detained?
Hm.
So much people from different parts of the country....with no consistent connecting thread......interesting.
*Edit*
Talking to my reporter brethrin.....he saying dat "the men held know each other and do business together."
He also say that he getting the impression they being held for something else other than the assination plot....BUT they being touted as being responsible.
So....we just hadda wait and see.
Dey hadda charge somebody by monday. If they dont...dey go get branded as frauds.
If dey do charge somebody and the case doh stick...they go get branded as frauds. (And dey cyar blame de legislation or the police this time i think.)
If dey do charge somebody and the case sticks and the persons found guilty.....well then.....they could say..."see...told you so."
So lets wait and see.
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well on the news tonight as he PM was being interviewed at some appearance she had today, she was surrounded by reporters and was probably asked if she felt safe with all that has happened and she responded, (paraphrasing), she isnt worried for her safety in this ALLEGED plot.
ahhmmm. :thinking:
aren't investigations being done and evidence being gathered about the plot. aren't people being detained based on evidence??
so for days Sandy, Gibbs, Griffith and Kamla have been sayin 'the threat is real, the threat is real'. now today. it is ALLEGED. lol
:whistling:
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well on the news tonight as he PM was being interviewed at some appearance she had today, she was surrounded by reporters and was probably asked if she felt safe with all that has happened and she responded, (paraphrasing), she isnt worried for her safety in this ALLEGED plot.
ahhmmm. :thinking:
aren't investigations being done and evidence being gathered about the plot. aren't people being detained based on evidence??
so for days Sandy, Gibbs, Griffith and Kamla have been sayin 'the threat is real, the threat is real'. now today. it is ALLEGED. lol
:whistling:
:rotfl:
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well on the news tonight as he PM was being interviewed at some appearance she had today, she was surrounded by reporters and was probably asked if she felt safe with all that has happened and she responded, (paraphrasing), she isnt worried for her safety in this ALLEGED plot.
ahhmmm. :thinking:
aren't investigations being done and evidence being gathered about the plot. aren't people being detained based on evidence??
so for days Sandy, Gibbs, Griffith and Kamla have been sayin 'the threat is real, the threat is real'. now today. it is ALLEGED. lol
:whistling:
Doh worry by 2 mor it go b a window and by Mon 5th WHAT PLOT. She would have misspoke and would just b another misstep. The SOE ends on Monday but d SIE continues. We are a State In Emergency
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Anybody else find this headline real jokey??......de man is accostumed to the likes of One Woodbrook Place....how dare they put him in "Guantanamo"......:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Golden Grove 'below Robocop's standards'
By Richard Charan
Selwyn "Robocop" Alexis complained yesterday that he was being kept in atrocious conditions in "Guantanamo"—the high-risk section of the Golden Grove Prison in Arouca.
He told his son, Kerron Alexis, the accommodation was below his standards and the State had breached the detention order that was served on him on Monday.
According to the copy of the order served on Alexis, signed by National Security Minister John Sandy, it specifies that Alexis be held at the Eastern Detention and Correctional Rehabilitation Centre at Santa Rosa, Arima.
Kerron Alexis said he was allowed to meet with his father for 15 minutes, while masked prison officers stood by "as if my father already convicted".
He said Alexis wanted the public to know he was willing to submit to a lie detector test.
Alexis also wanted the police officers who arrested him at One Woodbrook Place, in Woodbrook, to also take the test.
Alexis was held at One Woodbrook Place a week into the declaration of the State of Emergency and was charged with murder.
However, the case was dropped and Alexis was freed three weeks after Director of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard was shown evidence that the State's star witness had fabricated his statement implicating Alexis.
Alexis was rearrested a week later and subsequently implicated in the alleged plot to kill Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Cabinet ministers.
Through his son, he asked yesterday why investigators were only now looking for evidence to charge him.
Alexis said he wanted to meet with Prime Minister Persad-Bissessar or any police officer who was "not corrupted".
His lawyer, Joseph Honore, said he believed Alexis was telling the truth.
Honore said, "We are not going before any (review) tribunal because by the time they are ready to hear the matter, it will be Monday and the end of the State of Emergency and he will be released."
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/Golden_Grove__below_Robocop_s_standards_-134803563.html (http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/Golden_Grove__below_Robocop_s_standards_-134803563.html)
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In most other countries in the world, if something like this goes down, the press might not even hear about it.
I know for a fact here in the US, if you pick up your cell phone and call ANYONE ELSE and say certain specific words that are connected to terrorism, the US presidency, etc etc in one conversation, I can guarantee you a big black van will pull up outside your house, storm your place and detain you...
You will be held under special US legislature and your family won't even know what happen to you.
Your entire life will be surgically examined, every person you communicated with in the last few months will be checked out, and even if there is a sniff of something, you might be shipped off to God knows where, where the best of the best of the CIA/FBI/Mossad will have fun with you.
The point I am making is that any threat, whether its alleged or just a hint, must be investigated fully, because of the potential symbolic risk. We very lucky in T&T, cause we so small, and everbody know everybody, its very hard for a Govt to secretly round up people...
Its like now how you can't even say certain phrases while in the airport in the US, you will be reported and detained.
When the SOE started, we began to hear reports of gangsters being upset and were promising retaliation when they got out.
Add that to the picture they found of Kamla in Robocop's house, the large cache of arms in Valsayn last year, the radical Islamic link, and you have more than enough to at least warrant detailed investigation.
I am sure we the public are only privy to about 30% of all that is going on, its no secret the CIA has full time operations in Trinidad, hell its been even in the news that the Govt working together with them.
Now whether the threat is really as serious as it is being made out to be, the Govt has a duty to inform the population once (if) these men are charged by Monday. I will not be surprised if they are released, it seems we have some incompetent people in law enforcement, but with external help it may work.
I for one do not listen to any reports of family who say their people not involved in this, or its political in nature - most of the 9/11 suicide bombers' family spoke of how gentle and loving their people were.
I slightly skeptical on this whole issue, but I giving the Govt till Monday to inform us.
All the bad talk they badtalk the previous administration for bringing in all that Israeli spy equipment, its that same thing they using now for these threats...
Trinidad has had 2 uprisings in its past, we have been home to radical terrorists who threaten the western world, we have had attempts on a president's life, a former attorney general murdered. Whether we like it or not, there are things afoot in sweet T&T that we would not like to believe is reality.
Any govt of the day has the duty, right and hopefully the common sense to investigate these things properly, exactly as Robocop said in the press.
I remember Panday being threatened, I remember Manning as well, but both those issues quickly disappeared. Will this be any different?
We need some answers come Monday when either they are charged or released.
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Trinidad has had 2 uprisings in its past, we have been home to radical terrorists who threaten the western world, we have had attempts on a president's life, a former attorney general murdered. Whether we like it or not, there are things afoot in sweet T&T that we would not like to believe is reality.
When that happened?
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Trini it wasn't a matter of the plot being difficult to contain in small country, it was a case of Government and the PM in particular boldly publicizing this as an act of retribution for the SOE. An allegation which as time goes by is losing credibility. It is interesting as Brownsugar pointed out that the PM is now calling it an 'alleged' plot. I'm not trying to be flippant about this at all. I think the fact that soldiers have already been discharged points to a degree of mischief in itself. What is discouraging is there hasn't been a single person charged. What this points to at the very least is the Government tried to gain political points by skewing preliminary information about a plot while investigations were still ongoing. This is irresponsible in the extreme.
We should have heard about this a day before we had men in handcuffs ,charged for crimes.
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dat is d ting d gov't so taken up with attempting to win, sway, skew and control public opinion dat they consistently trip over themselves everything is a publicity stunt............simple example I take the water taxi every morning.......the crews got an idea to start showing the morning news ....TV6 news to be exact......all of ah sudden is CNMG propaganda news from d night before and specifically packaged for d water taxi steups
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dat is d ting d gov't so taken up with attempting to win, sway, skew and control public opinion dat they consistently trip over themselves everything is a publicity stunt............simple example I take the water taxi every morning.......the crews got an idea to start showing the morning news ....TV6 news to be exact......all of ah sudden is CNMG propaganda news from d night before and specifically packaged for d water taxi steups
U self if dey givin UWI students BB 4 Blogging u eh expect dat u go see C News on d water taxi.
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I'm speaking more to d fact dat dey jump on dat like rabid wolves.......... what was ah "nice to have" that occurred occasionally was hijacked and made into standardized political gimmickry
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Trinidad has had 2 uprisings in its past, we have been home to radical terrorists who threaten the western world, we have had attempts on a president's life, a former attorney general murdered. Whether we like it or not, there are things afoot in sweet T&T that we would not like to believe is reality.
When that happened?
Not sure if he was talking bout a group but one of the top Al Qaeda men still missing is a Guyanese Trini..can't recall his name at the moment
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Trini it wasn't a matter of the plot being difficult to contain in small country, it was a case of Government and the PM in particular boldly publicizing this as an act of retribution for the SOE. An allegation which as time goes by is losing credibility. It is interesting as Brownsugar pointed out that the PM is now calling it an 'alleged' plot. I'm not trying to be flippant about this at all. I think the fact that soldiers have already been discharged points to a degree of mischief in itself. What is discouraging is there hasn't been a single person charged. What this points to at the very least is the Government tried to gain political points by skewing preliminary information about a plot while investigations were still ongoing. This is irresponsible in the extreme.
We should have heard about this a day before we had men in handcuffs ,charged for crimes.
I agree, some of this undoubtedly points to political mileage, just like Rowley doing the same, as I said at least I will give them until Monday when the accused have to be charged or released, to come clean to the population.
The GOP used a similar thing to trump up Bush's ratings in the 2 years after 9-11.
But it turned back round to bite them, as you can argue the Republicans biggest gaffe was the supposed Iraq WMD scenario, which proved to be a white elephant. Perhaps this is also what brought down the British PM at the time....
This whole episode has the potential to be just as damaging for the PP if this all proves to be one big conspiracy for political mileage or as a diversionary tactic by the Govt.
This is where your PR peeps earn their cheese. Even if you do stuff that is deemed unpopular, or you just cannot divulge sensitive information, your PR machinery should be at least appeasing the population as best as it can.
This is democracy at work.
In plenty other countries (and well developed ones that we look up to), these men would have disappeared long time, whether they guilty or innocent.
Remember, as of now, these 14 men are being held for questioning. Whether the equivalent Miranda warning has been read to them yet, we don't know, given the present conditions that they are being held under.
The key questions now become:
1) Did the Govt fabricate everything about this plot?
2) If yes, was it exclusively for political sympathy or a reason to extend the SOE (in which case what is the ultimate aim of the SOE?)
3) If no, should they have done this discretely to avoid any accusations of political points? I guarantee this would have caused more problems, then they would have been rightfully accused of "secret state behaviour infringing on citizen's rights"
Trini politics like a soap opera yes. Hadda love it.
PS Elan - yep, as Feliz mentioned, its the Al Qaeda Guyanaese guy in Trinidad, as well as the other people involved in the JFK bombing plot.
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Rowley: PM misled T&T on death plot
‘It’s misconduct in public office’
By Richard Lord (Guardian).
Opposition Leader Dr Keith Rowley Opposition Leader Dr Keith Rowley said yesterday no plot was established to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three members of her Cabinet. He said so at a news briefing at the Opposition caucus room at the Waterfront Complex, Wrightson Road, Port-of- Spain.
He said the “so-called plot” was used to justify the state of emergency. “The Prime Minister has, in a very reckless manner, misled this country on November 24,” Rowley stressed. He quoted a document, called “The evaluation of the plot by the country’s security services”. It was dated November 23.
It read:
(1). The general assessment of this information (alleged plot) is that it seems to be an amalgamation of several pieces of information, using historic information on individuals of known ill-repute to validate the claim of a future act and embellished by the author’s liberal use of opinions rather than facts;
(2). the chronological sequence of events is inconsistent;
(3). it is quite possible that he (the source who leaked the plot) is speculating as to what he is seeing in an attempt to make sense of it;
(4). due to a lack of understanding by the source, there seems to be an attempt to use the term (certain term used which suggests that these persons are extremists); and
(5). there is no information identifying the leaders of the two groups (supposed to be the extremists groups), or whether the persons involved are known to each other. Attempts to identify a common link, possible through the Imams of the community to which they belonged, proved futile.
Rowley then said: “The information surrounding this so-called plot has been discredited by the (police) analyst in the evaluation, as of November 23.” He said despite that information Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar, who is the chairman of the National Security Council, “creates the hysteria that we have been through, mobilise the forces, makes political statements, tell the country we can’t tell you anything because it is secret.” He said: “So now we know for a fact no plot was determined on November 24.”
He said the Opposition had concerns that those detained were held “under criminal conduct as to the plot to commit murder but they are held under existing powers of the state of emergency.”
He said that when the emergency powers expire on Monday when the state of emergency expires “those persons (detained) will have to walk.” He said however those people were “now in serious jeopardy” because the political directorate needed evidence to keep them incarcerated or charged to keep it from serious allegations of misconduct in public office.
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DPP: I have not been consulted
Alleged plot to kill PM
By Akile Simon
DIRECTOR of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard yesterday said he has not yet been consulted by the police in connection with an alleged plot to destabilise the country and assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Government Ministers.
An ex-US soldier is among 16 men who were served detention notices which were signed by National Security Minister Brig John Sandy earlier this week. They are in custody at the Remand Yard Facility of the Golden Grove Prison, Arouca. Two other men — one an alleged Laventille gang leader and the other the son of a Freeport businessman—remain in custody.
Some detainees are being held in connection with their alleged involvement in a plot to destabilise the country and cause major panic while some are held for allegedly conspiring to assassinate Persad-Bissessar and Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, Minister of Housing and the Environment Dr Roodal Moonilal and Minister of Local Government, Chandresh Sharma.
Contacted on whether he or his Office has been in contact with the police with their probe, Gaspard said no.
"Sir, to date, the police have not contacted me in relation to the prospect of them bringing criminal charges in that matter," Gaspard said in the text message in which he responded.
It is the norm in high profile matters for the police to consult the DPP during and sometimes after their investigations to ensure that the intended criminal prosecutions could stand up in court.
However, the police could and in the past have gone ahead and laid charges in high profile matters without consulting the DPP but when the matters go before the court the file still has to be sent to the DPP's office for review so a State attorney could be appointed to prosecute the case.
This was evident with the recent cases filed under the Anti-Gang legislation where the police went ahead and charged 243 alleged gang members without consulting the DPP.
This resulted in the DPP offering no evidence and discontinuing all the cases before the courts.
Meanwhile, police probing the incident said they had completed their investigations and were reviewing all the statements.
Yesterday, officers were expected to go to the Remand Yard facility of the Golden Grove, in Arouca to interview one of the suspects a second time.
No indication has been given on whether they intend to approach Gaspard before the State of Emergency expires on Monday.
However, a source close to the investigation said no, when questioned on the likelihood of criminal charges being laid against the accused.
The State of Emergency ends on Monday and the police will either have to lay charges against the detainees or release them, if the Government does not extend it.
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DPP: I have not been consulted
Alleged plot to kill PM
By Akile Simon
DIRECTOR of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard yesterday said he has not yet been consulted by the police in connection with an alleged plot to destabilise the country and assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Government Ministers.
An ex-US soldier is among 16 men who were served detention notices which were signed by National Security Minister Brig John Sandy earlier this week. They are in custody at the Remand Yard Facility of the Golden Grove Prison, Arouca. Two other men — one an alleged Laventille gang leader and the other the son of a Freeport businessman—remain in custody.
Some detainees are being held in connection with their alleged involvement in a plot to destabilise the country and cause major panic while some are held for allegedly conspiring to assassinate Persad-Bissessar and Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, Minister of Housing and the Environment Dr Roodal Moonilal and Minister of Local Government, Chandresh Sharma.
Contacted on whether he or his Office has been in contact with the police with their probe, Gaspard said no.
"Sir, to date, the police have not contacted me in relation to the prospect of them bringing criminal charges in that matter," Gaspard said in the text message in which he responded.
It is the norm in high profile matters for the police to consult the DPP during and sometimes after their investigations to ensure that the intended criminal prosecutions could stand up in court.
However, the police could and in the past have gone ahead and laid charges in high profile matters without consulting the DPP but when the matters go before the court the file still has to be sent to the DPP's office for review so a State attorney could be appointed to prosecute the case.
This was evident with the recent cases filed under the Anti-Gang legislation where the police went ahead and charged 243 alleged gang members without consulting the DPP.
This resulted in the DPP offering no evidence and discontinuing all the cases before the courts.
Meanwhile, police probing the incident said they had completed their investigations :-\ and were reviewing all the statements.
Yesterday, officers were expected to go to the Remand Yard facility of the Golden Grove, in Arouca to interview one of the suspects a second time. ???
No indication has been given on whether they intend to approach Gaspard before the State of Emergency expires on Monday.
However, a source close to the investigation said no, when questioned on the likelihood of criminal charges being laid against the accused.
The State of Emergency ends on Monday and the police will either have to lay charges against the detainees or release them, if the Government does not extend it.
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In most other countries in the world, if something like this goes down, the press might not even hear about it.
I know for a fact here in the US, if you pick up your cell phone and call ANYONE ELSE and say certain specific words that are connected to terrorism, the US presidency, etc etc in one conversation, I can guarantee you a big black van will pull up outside your house, storm your place and detain you...
You will be held under special US legislature and your family won't even know what happen to you.
Your entire life will be surgically examined, every person you communicated with in the last few months will be checked out, and even if there is a sniff of something, you might be shipped off to God knows where, where the best of the best of the CIA/FBI/Mossad will have fun with you.
The point I am making is that any threat, whether its alleged or just a hint, must be investigated fully, because of the potential symbolic risk. We very lucky in T&T, cause we so small, and everbody know everybody, its very hard for a Govt to secretly round up people...
Its like now how you can't even say certain phrases while in the airport in the US, you will be reported and detained.
When the SOE started, we began to hear reports of gangsters being upset and were promising retaliation when they got out.
Add that to the picture they found of Kamla in Robocop's house, the large cache of arms in Valsayn last year, the radical Islamic link, and you have more than enough to at least warrant detailed investigation.
I am sure we the public are only privy to about 30% of all that is going on, its no secret the CIA has full time operations in Trinidad, hell its been even in the news that the Govt working together with them.
Now whether the threat is really as serious as it is being made out to be, the Govt has a duty to inform the population once (if) these men are charged by Monday. I will not be surprised if they are released, it seems we have some incompetent people in law enforcement, but with external help it may work.
I for one do not listen to any reports of family who say their people not involved in this, or its political in nature - most of the 9/11 suicide bombers' family spoke of how gentle and loving their people were.
I slightly skeptical on this whole issue, but I giving the Govt till Monday to inform us.
All the bad talk they badtalk the previous administration for bringing in all that Israeli spy equipment, its that same thing they using now for these threats...
Trinidad has had 2 uprisings in its past, we have been home to radical terrorists who threaten the western world, we have had attempts on a president's life, a former attorney general murdered. Whether we like it or not, there are things afoot in sweet T&T that we would not like to believe is reality.
Any govt of the day has the duty, right and hopefully the common sense to investigate these things properly, exactly as Robocop said in the press.
I remember Panday being threatened, I remember Manning as well, but both those issues quickly disappeared. Will this be any different?
We need some answers come Monday when either they are charged or released.
Actually no....once those codes words are triggered then a federal warrant to issue a wiretap would be requested...yes they can eavesdrop without one ...the wiretap would then be used to build a case against the person and what is subsequently done is that a matrix of all the calls incoming and outgoing is created to see what links there may be. It is not as easy as you state otherwise every republican in the south would be arrested for their hatred of President Obama.
The thing is that Federal attorneys operate within the scope of the law and they build their case off of that ...so that when a warrant is issued it states why and on what charges they are being served.
However, what is interesting is that in TnT they are using the emergency powers of the SOE to detain people and then build a case. Logic would dictate that if these people were indeed plotting against the Gov't then wouldn't the Ministry of National Security be the one who would build the case against them? But given the rum shop type of governance we've been seeing in T&T it is not surprising that Martin Joseph, who should be front and center on this issue, has been unusually silent.
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I don't know where Rowley get that 'report'' and how credible it is but the words of the DPP are instructive.All politics aside ,KPB right in her head ?
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Where is the shake your head in dismay button?
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why dem cyar just buckle down jus govern d muddacuunt country boy, why d games is not Jack self did bring ah crime expert here..............whenever............ try to come up wit an effective crime plan nah............d SOE is not ah plan.......lawd have mercy..............I feel I woulda even take ah Panday Govt over this shit
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Wait wait wait wait wait wait WAIT!
In today's express:
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/No_charges_yet-134975433.html
To quote from the article:
The security evaluation of the intelligence report which detailed the alleged assassination plot against the Prime Minister and other members of the Cabinet found the information to be highly speculative and poured cold water over the conclusion arrived at that there was a credible security threat.
The security evaluation, received by the Sunday Express, documented on November 23, stated the "chronological sequence of events was inconsistent".
It noted, for example, that if the stated purpose of the assassination was to show the Government that the State of Emergency called on August 21 was a dismal failure, then the conspirators would have had to have known since January 2011 (when they allegedly imported the arms and ammunition) that the Prime Minister planned to call a State of Emergency in August.
"The stated purpose of the assassination being to show the Government that the State of Emergency called on the 21st August was a dismal failure. If this be true, then it can be inferred that they had prior knowledge that the Prime Minister would have called a State of Emergency prior to 21st August, 2011, and it would have failed, so they imported arms and ammunition in January, 2011," the document stated.
The document said the assertion that the firearms and ammunition for the plot were brought by one person (named) and that the guns may have been supplied by another alleged conspirator, through the assistance of another alleged conspirator, "shows the informant use of persons of ill-repute to validate his alleged plot without linking anyone in particular to each other".
The evaluation document noted that no leaders were identified in the plot, and no linkage was established between the two groups who were supposed to be acting in concert.
Then yuh read this:
http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/Police_still_to_decide_on_charges-134975398.html
Sources close to the investigation told the Sunday Express that up to late yesterday there wasn't sufficient evidence to lay charges against the detainees.
The Government has before tomorrow at midnight to extend the SoE which could be done by having a special sitting of Parliament.
It has been speculated that the SoE may be extended because of the alleged assassination plot.
Yesterday, Deputy Commissioner of Police Mervyn Richardson said the police will approach Director of Public Prosecutions Roger Gasprad for advice in the investigations into an alleged asssaination plot. Richardson's comments came one day after Gaspard, responding to a question from the Express, said he had not been consulted by the police in the matter. Contacted on whether the police intend to approach Gaspard on the matter, Richardson said yes.
"We must do that. That is a matter of course, so to answer your question, yes, we will approach the DPP but I can't tell you when," Richardson said.
Questioned further on why the police didn't approach Gaspard during the course of their investigations for advice, as is the norm with high profile matters, Richardson said, "We are working together as a team."
Asked for clarity on the persons he was referring to as "we" he said, "The police and everybody are working as a team."
DEN...to ice the cake...yuh read THIS:
http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2011/12/04/no-charges-against-detainees-pm-s-assassination-plot
Contacted yesterday, former attorney general Ramesh Lawrence Maharaj said statements and confessions taken from detainees held by the detention orders are not admissible. “Even if they charge these people they would have to be charged under the criminal law and it would seem any prosecution would be an abuse of process because you cannot use a SoE and a detention order to get evidence to prosecute someone under the ordinary criminal law. During a detention period any statement or confession that is allegedly given would not be admissible,” the former attorney general said.
SO WHA DE MOROCOY REALLY GOING ON HERE?
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So Bourbon , I'm not an expert but lemme ask a question, I just saying eh. If there was a plot and the authorities conducted investigations without the PM and Government spooking the whole national security infrastructure and a couple days after making a public statement on the basis a preliminary report of a possible threat then men could have actually been charged and who knows even convicted.
smh
Every last of those guys going home.
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So Bourbon , I'm not an expert but lemme ask a question, I just saying eh. If there was a plot and the authorities conducted investigations without the PM and Government spooking the whole national security infrastructure and a couple days after making a public statement on the basis a preliminary report of a possible threat then men could have actually been charged and who knows even convicted.
smh
Every last of those guys going home.
Not exactly.
The report was dated November 23rd. The country became aware of the plot about the 23rd as well right? So even before the announcement...investigations were already underway..in fact sufficiently so to warrant a report being issued.
So the question is.....why or who leaked the plot when by the time of the leak a report already possibly existed stating there was no plot?
Secondly...the PM as i recall didnt make the announcement...the media was tipped off...and the rumour spread like wildfire...and then there was a government statement. (PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG). But....this "report" shoulda been in the hands of the national security council...or the PM herself.....so..subsequent to the rumour being created....it could have been cut off just like that by the PM (assuming that she saw the report.)
Then again....the PM herself said "the alleged plot". So by that time....she possibly KNEW that there was no credible plot..but issued no statement saying that.
Yet....all those detentions were done...under the premise that they were in connection to the plot....random men.......not detained on credible evidence...but under SOE detention orders. Even if they had evidence....the evidence woulda be inadmissable according to Ramesh Lawrence Maharaj.
Or maybe I dreamed this entire thing.
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Decision on detained 16 today: DPP: I was not consulted
Published: Mon, 2011-12-05 18:54
Geisha Kowlessar
Rnand Ramlogan Attorney General Anand Ramlogan says the law must take its course and if there is no evidence against the 16 detainees, then they must be set free. Saying that the law must be respected at all times, Ramlogan added: “The rule of law must be respected at any and all costs and Government is committed to the rule of law. “If there is insufficient evidence to justify the laying of charges, then the detainees must be set free in accordance to law,” he said in an interview yesterday. The Attorney General also made it clear that the laying of charges was a matter for the police in consultation with the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP).
Asked what charges, if any, were expected to be laid on the detainees, Ramlogan said he was not advised whether or not charges would be laid. “But I am not surprised because this is not a matter that involves the executive arm of the State,” he said. “It is a matter exclusively for the police and for the DPP who would advise if and when consulted.” Up to late yesterday afternoon, the State did not approach DPP Roger Gaspard to seek advice whether or not charges should be laid against 16 detainees. Contacted yesterday, Gaspard said he was in office up until 7 pm and had no consultation with any one. “Nobody has sought my advice in relation to bringing any criminal charges,” he said.
“I’m in my office doing my normal work and I have not been consulted on this matter...No one has opted to have an audience with me,” Gaspard said. But a senior lawyer, who asked not to be identified, said given the nature of the allegations, it would have been “obviously appropriate” for the police to maintain a close connection with the office of the DPP and to seek advice regarding what nature of charges could be laid. The attorney said investigators, depending on what charges they were pursuing, were not duty-bound to consult the DPP and could go ahead and lay the charges. On the other hand, however, the DPP must give the directive to lay certain charges which would include perjury, sedition and charges relating under the Prevention of Corruption Act,” the attorney explained.
“These charges can only be sanctioned by the DPP,” the lawyer added. Gaspard, however, reiterated that in the case of special prosecutors, his office was the sole authority to prosecute criminal matters. He said in the event that a special prosecutor had to be appointed outside the office of the DPP any matter, he (the DPP) was the sole person to grant a fiat to that particular attorney or attorneys to prosecute. Attorney representing Khalil Karamath, Senior Counsel Pamela Elder, in an interview yesterday, said the State had found itself in a difficult position. She said the State went ahead and served orders which indicated that the 16 were dangerous people who were likely to endanger the lives of the public.
“So if these are indeed dangerous people, how would the public be protected on the expiration of the state of emergency?” Elder said. She added that after detention orders were initially served on the 16, they were then served with particulars which were subsequently served on Friday. Detention orders were slapped on the 16 men for allegedly being involved in a plot to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three senior Government ministers. Others were identified as allegedly being behind a plot to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic. The orders were made by the National Security Minister Brigadier John Sandy, in accordance with paragraph two of the second schedule to the Emergency Powers Regulations, 2011.
The Plot
Particulars for detention order obtained by The Guardian regarding plot to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic:
On October 28, 2011, an officer of the Special Branch Unit of the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service received credible information from a confidential informant that there was being planned, a plot to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago and cause major panic and that the detainee was the mastermind behind the plot. The information from the said confidential informant was that the detainee was the leader of a extremist Islamic group which meets at Chaguanas and that the detainee regularly espouses extremist and radical Islamic beliefs at these masjids.
The said confidential informant also said that the detainee had recruited members of his religious group to carry out the detainee’s plan to destabilise Trinidad and Tobago. On September 18, 2011, three men all believed to be members of the detainee’s radical Islamic group were arrested at Wallerfield, after a period of surveillance conducted by members of the Criminal Intelligence Unit (CIU). Upon the arrest of certain people the following items were seized by the police:
• One Glock 17 pistol
• 30 round of 0.40 mm ammunition
• 24 rounds of 9 mm ammunition
• 10 rounds of 9 mm ammunition
• 6 firearm magazines
• 1 rifle firearm with scope
• 2 bulletproof vests
• 2 Police Velcro patches
• 1 blue sweater resembling that used by members of the Guard and Emergency Branch
• Trinidad and Tobago Defence Force camouflage jacket and pants
• 2 stolen vehicles.
• 1 computer on which was stored anti-terrorist and weapon training material originating from the United States’ Federal Bureau of Investigations and Special Air Services
Information received from the said confidential source was that a detainee was responsible for purchasing ammunition for the said plot. In 2010, the detainee was arrested and charged with possession of more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition after said ammunition was found at his home along with a number of high-powered rifles, including AK47 assault rifles and a large quantity of narcotics. Intelligence received has linked the detainee to the importation of sophisticated weapons that were capable of long range assassination and together a central businessman whose home was searched and a large cache of high powered rifles were recently found, is suspected in the importation of such weapons.
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So how the report get out?
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So how the report get out?
Same way the rumour get out. It was leaked.
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Where is the shake your head in dismay button?
Y we wanted change and we got it. I sit down and buckle up 4 d ride long time.
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And a next ting.
When Trinidad and Tobago Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar gave Chávez a bottle of “holy water” from a sacred mountain in her country, he vowed to visit the site and take a swim.
Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/12/03/2530158_p2/latin-and-caribbean-leaders-forge.html#ixzz1fdJE9DDD
Chavez assured leaders he will survive cancer, reiterating that he underwent recent tests in Cuba after finishing chemotherapy and they found no "malignant cells in any part of my body, thanks to God."
Trinidad's prime minister gave Chavez a vial of what she described as holy water, and Chavez thanked her, saying "soon we will have a summit of those of us who've beaten cancer."
Read more: http://www.thestate.com/2011/12/02/2066818/chavez-new-regional-group-revives.html#ixzz1fdJLqcJQ
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Some think Caura river water does cure soberness
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http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/HOME_FREE-135008743.html
SEVENTEEN men detained by police in connection with an alleged plot to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Government ministers will likely be released without charge as time runs out on investigators.
The State has until midnight, when the State of Emergency ends, to either charge the detainees or release them.
Sixteen of the detainees were served with detention orders signed by National Security Minister Brig John Sandy last week. The life of those orders will expire with the end of the State of Emergency.
The 17th suspect remained in custody at the Belmont Police Station up to last night.
Yesterday, reliable and confidential sources close to the investigation told the Express that they did not have sufficient evidence to charge the 17 detainees with any offences and they may be released later today.
One investigative source said even though the police have information linking some of the detainees to certain conversations, they did not have evidence to support the information that could lead to criminal charges.
Investigators, responding to criticisms that they moved too soon to arrest the men, said the arrests had in effect prevented any potential harm from being done.
Opposition Leader Dr Keith Rowley on Friday accused the Government of blowing the situation out of proportion and demanded that the detained men be immediately released.
Rowley disclosed that he had a copy of a security evaluation of the intelligence report which detailed the alleged assassination plot.
He said the document noted that no leaders were identified in the plot, and no linkage was established between the two groups who were supposed to be acting in concert to kill the PM and destabilise the country.
The security evaluation, a copy of which was received by the Sunday Express, dated November 23, stated the "chronological sequence of events was inconsistent".
Contacted yesterday on reports that the detainees are expected to be released because of no evidence to charge them, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan said he was not aware of such and the rule of law should take its course.
Ramlogan added if there is insufficient evidence against the men then they should be freed.
He said: "I have no reports (on that) but that will be a matter for the police. The police procedures will be that the police will confer and consult with the DPP in these matters in accordance with the usual and established procedures.
"The Government does not have a role to play in such matters as the police are mandated by law to investigate and the DPP to prosecute," he said.
"The rule of law must be respected and if there is insufficient evidence and charges cannot be laid (against he detainees) they must be freed and this is a matter for the judgment of the police and the DPP," Ramlogan added.
Deputy Commissioner of Police Mervyn Richardson, who has been spearheading the investigations, said he could not say for certain that the men will be released later today.
He said, "At this time I cannot say that now because I know what is happening at another front. I just got two telephone calls and I can't say that. But we continue to investigate as we speak. It's engaging the attention of a lot of people right now."
"If they are released, that isn't the end of the investigation and it doesn't mean that we cannot lay charges against anyone and at the appropriate time it will be done," Richardson said.
Director of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard maintained yesterday that the police investigating the alleged terror plot had not consulted him at any point in respect of filing any criminal charges.
A team of attorneys havebeen hired by the Government to advise the police in relation to the investigation and draft the detention orders.
Persad-Bissessar, speaking to reporters at the Executive Jet Centre of the Southern Terminal, Piarco after her return from Venezuela on Saturday said, should the police decide not to charge the detainees, the Government would observe and respect he rule of law.
The PM had attended the plenary session of the inaugural Community of Latin American and Caribbean States Summit (CELAC) in Caracas, Venezuela.
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Yesterday, reliable and confidential sources close to the investigation told the Express that they did not have sufficient evidence to charge the 17 detainees with any offences and they may be released later today.
I don't know how much redress these men have after being served with detention orders during an SoE but I find this life changing. I waiting until the end of the day but it stands to reason that they would have been charged already if they did have something on them.
A team of attorneys have been hired by the Government to advise the police in relation to the investigation and draft the detention orders.
More of Anand's friends I suppose.
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Some think Caura river water does cure soberness
definitely not stupidity
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I don't know why the press keeps running to Anand on criminal matters... actually I do, because he keeps posturing as though he is the authority on criminal matters, or more accurately, matters pertaining to prosecuting crime and misconduct, when in fact that is Gaspard's purview. No wonder Anand doh know what the law is. Not that the local media are any the wiser.
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No charges against the 17 persons held.
Monday, 05 December 2011
By Administrator
http://i955fm.com/news-blogs/news/3574-no-charges-agaist-the-17-persons-held.html
The police service is confirming, it cannot lay charges against any of the 17 persons held in connection with a reported plot to kill the prime minister and destablise trinidad and tobago.
At its daily news conference a short while ago, sgt Wayne Mystar said the men will be released.
Up to news time the director of public prosecutions still had no file before him, regarding the 12 persons detained under the emergency powers regulations.
The 12 are among the 17 persons held speaking with newscenter five earlier, DPP Roger Gaspard said he remains in the dark and has not yet been consulted. He said it is not necessarily a stipulation that the police should confer with a DPP before laying charges but given the events which unfolded in the courts during the state of emergency, it was recommended by many.
Over 200 persons charged under the anti gang act were allowed to walk free due to a lack of evidence. The government and the police faced severe criticisms as a result. Over the weekend prime minister Kamla Persad Bissessar said government cannot and should not get involved.
The 17 men held include sgt Earl Elie, businessman Khalil Karamath, muslim cleric ashmeed mohammed and Selwyn "Robocop" Alexis.
As the countdown to the end of the state of emergency continues, the police spokesman sgt mystar is saying there was success during the measure. The state of emergency was declared on august 21st. the prime minister last saturday said there will be no attempt on the part of her government to extend it.
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All 16 released
Published: Tue, 2011-12-06 21:27
Camille Clarke
http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2011/12/06/all-16-released
(http://www.guardian.co.tt/sites/default/files/event/released.jpg?1323138031)
From left: Central businessman Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis leaves the Eastern Detention Correctional and Rehabilitation Centre, Santa Rosa, Arima, last night. Valsayn businessman Khalil Karamath got into a waiting vehicle shortly after his release. David “Buffy” Millard and an unidentified detainee leave the facility. Ashmeed Mohammed, right, leaves last night. Photos: Marcus Gonzales
Selwyn “Robocop” Alexis shouted “Freedom” as he and 14 other detainees were released from the Eastern Correction Facility in Santa Rosa Heights, Arima, last night. At approximately 7.15 pm, shouts of “Allah Ackbar” were heard from from outside the facility. As they left the detention centre, most of them kept their faces covered with T-shirts and ran to several vehicles waiting for them. Police Sergeant Earl Eli, who was kept at the Golden Grove Prison separately from the other inmates, also was freed.
David “Buffy” Millard was the first to leave the compound and expressed his concern over the allegations. “I am very happy to be free. There is absolutely no truth in that and let me say all praise to Allah and my family and Mr Hawks for giving me advice,” Millard said. Millard added he did not intend to take any legal action against the Government. Another detainee, who refused to give his name, said the allegations were lies. He said his name was published in newspapers and did not wish to speculate if it was a plot against the Muslim community.
Alexis claimed it was a plot hatched by a corrupt police officer. “Definitely, I will take legal action. There are certain officers that misled the Prime Minister. I support the Government. How I go kill them,” he added. He said terrorist allegations were false. “It was a total lie. I campaigned for Stephen Cadiz and I was in UNC long before Cadiz,” Alexis said, adding that he plans to spend time with his family.
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I would be very interested to find the cost of the detentions/imprisonments of all of the people arrested during the SOE and released without charge.
It would also be nice to know the number of successful prosecutions during the same period.
The only good thing to come from the SOE in my opinion is that no government should ever make these same mistakes in the future. This is a blueprint for how not to operate an SOE. So we can say "at least the govt tried something different" but you have to wonder what they can do now to curb the rise in crime that will certainly follow.
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I would be very interested to find the cost of the detentions/imprisonments of all of the people arrested during the SOE and released without charge.
It would also be nice to know the number of successful prosecutions during the same period.
The only good thing to come from the SOE in my opinion is that no government should ever make these same mistakes in the future. This is a blueprint for how not to operate an SOE. So we can say "at least the govt tried something different" but you have to wonder what they can do now to curb the rise in crime that will certainly follow.
I was just about to make the same comment. To expand on that ... even beyond the fiscal aspect of the venture, there are and there will be other costs.
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In most other countries in the world, if something like this goes down, the press might not even hear about it.
I know for a fact here in the US, if you pick up your cell phone and call ANYONE ELSE and say certain specific words that are connected to terrorism, the US presidency, etc etc in one conversation, I can guarantee you a big black van will pull up outside your house, storm your place and detain you...
You will be held under special US legislature and your family won't even know what happen to you.
Your entire life will be surgically examined, every person you communicated with in the last few months will be checked out, and even if there is a sniff of something, you might be shipped off to God knows where, where the best of the best of the CIA/FBI/Mossad will have fun with you.
The point I am making is that any threat, whether its alleged or just a hint, must be investigated fully, because of the potential symbolic risk. We very lucky in T&T, cause we so small, and everbody know everybody, its very hard for a Govt to secretly round up people...
Its like now how you can't even say certain phrases while in the airport in the US, you will be reported and detained.
When the SOE started, we began to hear reports of gangsters being upset and were promising retaliation when they got out.
Add that to the picture they found of Kamla in Robocop's house, the large cache of arms in Valsayn last year, the radical Islamic link, and you have more than enough to at least warrant detailed investigation.
I am sure we the public are only privy to about 30% of all that is going on, its no secret the CIA has full time operations in Trinidad, hell its been even in the news that the Govt working together with them.
Now whether the threat is really as serious as it is being made out to be, the Govt has a duty to inform the population once (if) these men are charged by Monday. I will not be surprised if they are released, it seems we have some incompetent people in law enforcement, but with external help it may work.
I for one do not listen to any reports of family who say their people not involved in this, or its political in nature - most of the 9/11 suicide bombers' family spoke of how gentle and loving their people were.
I slightly skeptical on this whole issue, but I giving the Govt till Monday to inform us.
All the bad talk they badtalk the previous administration for bringing in all that Israeli spy equipment, its that same thing they using now for these threats...
Trinidad has had 2 uprisings in its past, we have been home to radical terrorists who threaten the western world, we have had attempts on a president's life, a former attorney general murdered. Whether we like it or not, there are things afoot in sweet T&T that we would not like to believe is reality.
Any govt of the day has the duty, right and hopefully the common sense to investigate these things properly, exactly as Robocop said in the press.
I remember Panday being threatened, I remember Manning as well, but both those issues quickly disappeared. Will this be any different?
We need some answers come Monday when either they are charged or released.
Actually no....once those codes words are triggered then a federal warrant to issue a wiretap would be requested...yes they can eavesdrop without one ...the wiretap would then be used to build a case against the person and what is subsequently done is that a matrix of all the calls incoming and outgoing is created to see what links there may be. It is not as easy as you state otherwise every republican in the south would be arrested for their hatred of President Obama.
The thing is that Federal attorneys operate within the scope of the law and they build their case off of that ...so that when a warrant is issued it states why and on what charges they are being served.
However, what is interesting is that in TnT they are using the emergency powers of the SOE to detain people and then build a case. Logic would dictate that if these people were indeed plotting against the Gov't then wouldn't the Ministry of National Security be the one who would build the case against them? But given the rum shop type of governance we've been seeing in T&T it is not surprising that Martin Joseph, who should be front and center on this issue, has been unusually silent.
I think that is because he has long been removed from any primary post in this govt. He is not really expected to comment on these matters. I wondering if is not Brig John Sandy you really referring to :thinking:
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Yep you are right he is the one I meant :)
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I had to cross-post this one
http://www.youtube.com/v/Kb8MCDEdgD4
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I had to cross-post this one
http://www.youtube.com/v/Kb8MCDEdgD4
I think this PP government is trying to ensure that this song by Impulse becomes a massive hit!! :-[
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WTF !!! ;D
I cantr believe a whole SOE pass and is the first time I hearing this song. I must be listening to the wrong stations jed.
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WTF !!! ;D
I cantr believe a whole SOE pass and is the first time I hearing this song. I must be listening to the wrong stations jed.
apparently :)
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So whappen to the plot?
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So whappen to the plot?
Dey still plottin
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So whappen to the plot?
Dey still plottin
:rotfl:
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So whappen to the plot?
Dey still plottin
sounds like dat could be a good name for a kaiso..
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Ah hear Robocop have some aces on members of the ruling party daiz why they locking him up all the time to try and search he properties to see if they could find it. They searching all he family house too. Don't know how true it is.
Weary you hear dat?
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Ah hear Robocop have some aces on members of the ruling party daiz why they locking him up all the time to try and search he properties to see if they could find it. They searching all he family house too. Don't know how true it is.
Weary you hear dat?
No but I can investiquire lil difficult meh source out these days.
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http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/friday-january-6-2012/sandy-stripped-4-security-units
Sandy stripped of 4 security units
Published:
Friday, January 6, 2012
Curtis Williams
John Sandy
National Security Minister John Sandy has been stripped of his responsibility for four units that fell under his ministry and they have now been placed under the direct control of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar. The move was made over the Christmas holidays and involves the Helicopter Unit that belonged to the Special Anti-Crime Unit; the highly-trained anti terrorism squad, called the Direct Action Team; the Canine Section and the radar equipment used to monitor drug smuggling along Trinidad and Tobago coastlines. Cabinet sources say the decision to remove the units was made while Sandy was out of the country and also has led to the removal of the head of the Joint Operations Unit, Lt Col Ricardo Garcia, who has been sent to the National Security Training Academy. His replacement is Rear Admiral Richard Kelshall.
In an exclusive interview yesterday Kelshall admitted the units now reported to the Prime Minister but he said Sandy was made aware of it before it was done and gave his blessings.
“I was told that the National Security Minister was told of it and the decision was made with his concurrence,” he said. Asked why Garcia was removed from his post, Kelshall said that was a question for the Government to answer. However, he said, Garcia was highly competent and that he would have had no problem working with him. He also denied the removal of the units from the Ministry of National Security had anything to do with Sandy who was Chief of Defence Staff when Capt Gary Griffith left the Coast Guard. Kelshall said the removal of the units and the placing of the soon-to-be instituted National Security Operations Centre under the control of the Prime Minister made sense. He said it was necessary because the Government had embarked on putting together a National Security Operations Centre that would involve all the arms of national security and civilian operations. He said that was going to be a multi-agency operation centre and in the circumstances it was felt that when created it should fall under the control of the Office of the Prime Minister.
He added: “It would have stayed in National Security If the centre was dealing with Police, Army, Coast Guard and Customs.
“All of these things came from the same ministry with the exception of customs, now we are looking at a much bigger national picture—floods, health, major accidents, major disaster—all of these things would be best handled under one agency, not that that agency would be in charge, but that would be an agency in which all the information was available.” Asked why there was a need for the National Operation Centre that fell under the direct control of the Prime Minister to have its own tactical unit, Kelshall said that was done because the Government wanted to keep the strike force together and not return them to their original units. The T&T Guardian has been told the Direct Action Team is the most elite unit available to local law enforcement and its members were trained by the US in anti-terrorism operations.
Kelshall also dismissed concerns that the Prime Minister was using the helicopters that now fell under her control when they should be used in the fight against crime. He said it was an effective way to move the Prime Minister around, especially since she was was under threat. In addition, Kelshall pointed to the regular use of helicopters by other VIPs, saying there was no issue. He said modern day security was intelligence-driven and in the past you had a scenario where intelligence was gathered in different places and all the agencies did not have access to it. He promised that should the National Operations Centre be given a chance to work it would lead to a significant reduction in crime. Kelshall said he was only appointed to establish the agency and would be in the job for the next three months.
Manning is a dictator..!!! ::) ::) ::)
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We must be RIDICULOUSLY stupid.
Kelshall also dismissed concerns that the Prime Minister was using the helicopters that now fell under her control when they should be used in the fight against crime. He said it was an effective way to move the Prime Minister around, especially since she was was under threat.
But release 16 men?
National Security Minister John Sandy has been stripped of his responsibility for four units that fell under his ministry and they have now been placed under the direct control of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar. The move was made over the Christmas holidays and involves the Helicopter Unit that belonged to the Special Anti-Crime Unit; the highly-trained anti terrorism squad, called the Direct Action Team; the Canine Section and the radar equipment used to monitor drug smuggling along Trinidad and Tobago coastlines. Cabinet sources say the decision to remove the units was made while Sandy was out of the country and also has led to the removal of the head of the Joint Operations Unit, Lt Col Ricardo Garcia, who has been sent to the National Security Training Academy. His replacement is Rear Admiral Richard Kelshall.
It have so much to bawl in dismay bout this one paragraph here...i eh sure where to start. :frustrated:
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And is Kelshall dem put in charge? Steups........oh gardo
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Congo I see you bold something there, thanks.
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Griffith: Return security units to Sandy’s ministry
Published:
Saturday, January 7, 2012
Curtis Williams
National Security Adviser Cpt Gary Griffith says he will fight “tooth and nail” for the four units that were removed from the control of National Security Minister Brig John Sandy and placed under the control of the Prime Minister to be returned to the Minister of National Security. Insisting that it was his “personal opinion that the day-to-day running of the National Security Operations Centre should remain with the Minister of National Security and not with the Office of the Prime Minister,” Griffith said he had every confidence in Sandy and that they had both fought significant battles in the Government, “including convincing the Cabinet to institute last year’s state of emergency. “I have the highest regard for Brig Sandy who, like me, is trained in law enforcement and understand the challenges and thinks outside of the box to get solutions,” Griffith told the Guardian yesterday in a telephone interview from India, where he is travelling with the Prime Minister.
Griffith’s comments follow a revelation in yesterday’s Guardian that the Prime Minister had stripped Sandy of four units, including the helicopter unit, the canine section of what was once SAUTT, the Direct Action Team and the radar system and placed it under her direct control. Insisting that the formation of the National Security Operations Centre was in its embryonic stage, the National Security adviser said things were still open to change. His opinion appears at variance with that of the man who has been tasked with the responsibility to establish the NSOC, Rear Admiral Richard Kelshall who defended the centre being under the Prime Minister, saying, “It would have stayed in National Security if the centre was dealing with Police, Army, Coast Guard and Customs.
“All of these things came from the same ministry with the exception of Customs...now we are looking at a much bigger national picture—floods, health, major accidents, major disaster—all of these things would be best handled under one agency, not that that agency would be in charge, but that would be an agency in which all the information was available,” he said. “This is why the agency will fall under the Office of the Prime Minister.” Asked why there was a need for the National Operation Centre that fell under the direct control of the Prime Minister to have its own tactical unit, Kelshall said that was done because the Government wanted to keep the strike force together and not return them to their original units.
The T&T Guardian has been told the Direct Action Team was the most elite unit available to local law enforcement and its members were trained by the US in anti-terrorism operations. But Griffith said he was strongly of the view that the operational capabilities of the National Security Operations Centre should remain in National Security. Asked if that meant returning the assets to the Ministry of National Security, Griffith was initially reluctant to answer, saying that would have to be studied by the Rear Admiral, but when pressed further he said: “If I say that the operational capabilities should remain in National Security then by extension I am saying that it should be returned to Brig Sandy, but let me stress this is my personal opinion and I will strongly recommend this to the Prime Minister and I will fight tooth and nail for it.
http://www.guardian.co.tt/griffith-return-security-units-sandy%E2%80%99s-ministry
So The Minister of National Security didn't know about this move and now the Prime Minister's security advisor is against this move. So who exactly is advising this woman and what are her true motives?
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Kelshall not easy, His daughter is a big time world recognized expert on security matters....world renowned and well regarded...he could run rings around anything Griffith come with!
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So The Minister of National Security didn't know about this move and now the Prime Minister's security advisor is against this move. So who exactly is advising this woman and what are her true motives?
Talk your mind.
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my government so jokey it not even funny
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my government so jokey it not even funny
CUE KING STUPID
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Plot was not real
Cops find no evidence to support plan to kill PM, Moonilal, AG, Sharma
By Akile Simon
THE police investigation into allegations that 17 men were part of an alleged plot to assassinate Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Cabinet Ministers has been completed with no evidence to suggest the allegations were true.
The ministers identified in the alleged plot were Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, Local Government Minister Chandresh Sharma and Housing Minister Roodal Moonilal.
The probe, which was led by Supt John Daniel of the North Eastern Division, was wrapped up late last month and the file sent to Commissioner of Police Dwayne Gibbs.
Sources who participated in the probe said the investigation showed there was no physical evidence to support allegations of an assassination and destabilisation plot.
"Should anything pop up it will be looked at. It's better to be safe than to be sorry," a senior investigator told the Sunday Express last week.
Attempts to reach Daniel for a comment proved futile as he was said to be attending several meetings last week.
Contacted yesterday Deputy Commissioner of Police Mervyn Richardson, who previously said that the threat was real, refused to comment on the conclusion of the probe.
Richardson said the matter was something he did not wish to speak about given its sensitive nature.
Richardson wasn't the only person who stated that the threat was real.
Commissioner Gibbs, National Security Minister Brigadier John Sandy, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan and security adviser Gary Griffith were among those who said the threat was real.
But police investigators say they have not found any evidence to suggest that.
"It was based on hearsay information and nothing tangible," another officer said.
On November 26, commenting for the first time on the alleged threat, Minister Sandy told the Sunday Express, "The threat is real and I am saddened to learn that some people who ought to know better are trivialising it."
Sandy's response came on the heels of statements made by Opposition Leader Dr Keith Rowley during a press briefing at Tower D at the International Waterfront Centre in Port of Spain recently.
Rowley described the Government's response to the alleged plot as "hysterical political expediency".
On November 24 last year, at a post-Cabinet news briefing at the Diplomatic Centre, St Ann's, Persad-Bissessar described the alleged plot as an evil, devious act of treason.
She said the alleged threat was as a result of the implementation of the State of Emergency and limited curfew restrictions which resulted in the seizures of guns, ammunition, drugs and the arrest of hundreds of suspects.
Even though Persad-Bissessar gave the reasons behind the alleged plot, the police have not been able to establish its truthfulness or a motive behind it.
The file on the investigation never reached the office of Director of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard for advice as is the procedure when police are dealing with high-profile investigations.
"It's because there was nothing to present or to ask Gaspard for his advice on," another source said.
"Information was received by the police and we did what we normally do, act on the information and try to determine whether there is truth to it or not, and in this case, there wasn't and that's the end of the matter until something new comes up," another source said.
Asked where the politicians got their information from when they said the threat was real, the police source responded, "That's a matter for them. You'd have to ask them that question because we haven't found any evidence which suggests it's true."
Even after Persad-Bissessar spoke about the alleged plot, CoP Gibbs, when questioned by reporters, would only say the threat was real and it was being investigated by the police.
Persad-Bissessar disclosed far more information on the alleged plot than Gibbs.
Commissioner Gibbs gave no motive nor disclosed any information relating to the alleged threat even though police had already detained several suspects at that time.
A total of 17 men, all Muslims, were detained under the Emergency Powers Regulations of 2011 but were released without charge hours before the SoE expired on December 5 last year.
Most of the former detainees, among them a police sergeant and a former US soldier, have threatened to take legal action against the State over their detention.
They have all denied knowledge and involvement in the alleged plot.
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(http://i25.tinypic.com/103tok7.jpg)
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Asked where the politicians got their information from when they said the threat was real, the police source responded, "That's a matter for them. You'd have to ask them that question because we haven't found any evidence which suggests it's true
Now remember these men were detained by orders issued by the Minister of National Security and were not arrested by the police. If the police is saying there was no evidence then what evidence did the government have to detain these men ?
Let me give the government the benefit of the doubt and presume that they actually received information about a plot and they didn't fabricate the story. If so wouldnt the correct course of action be to immdieately increase the security detail of the PM and carry out surveilance of the parties in question to determine the validity of the threat.
KPB and her government got spooked and mobilized the entire national security infrastructure to respond to this hearsay information. What's more than this is she actually went public and made unfounded allegations that the motive behind said plot was in response to the government's brave and just war against crime .smh. She simply couldn't resist the opportunity to gain sympathy in the wake of the absolutely disastrous SoE .
Both Mr. Panday and Mr. Manning confirmed that plots and threats are altogether rare occurrences and this simply not the way to deal with the issue. It is not even halftime in this unc game and the KPB's credibility and judgement has been seriously impugned.
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They did not get spooked!
They fed us lies to get.approval for the useless, baseless, and groundless SoE
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steups u real analyzin dis ting, not tryin to get down on yuh but I knew this was bunk d moment they decide to add sharma name to the mix............the man is a "do nothing" joke, clown and pathological "wolf crier" that no one takes seriously...much less to assassinate steups
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Plot was not real
Cops find no evidence to support plan to kill PM, Moonilal, AG, Sharma
*Inhales sharply* Really??!! You don't say!!!.....:o :o :o ::) ::) :bs:
Bourbon, yuh killing mih with that post..... :rotfl:
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Plot was not real
Cops find no evidence to support plan to kill PM, Moonilal, AG, Sharma
Bourbon, yuh killing mih with that post..... :rotfl:
ENT
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Resign ,resign ,resign right now and save some face .
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Resign ,resign ,resign right now and save some face .
u assume our politicians have integrity and most of all shame............the three hot controversies that now weigh on their shoulders will be calmly brushed off like all the others we in for ah rough ride
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Remember her...look at Yesina's predictions for 2011...not much truth to any of them eh.
2011 predictions (http://www.trinidadexpress.com/woman-magazine/Sex_scandal_and_major_challenges-124118084.html)
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sandy is a rel disappointment in so many ways...too damn mooksy...i so glad when he was brigadier tnt aint had cause to go to war cuz we woulda be speakin ah different language all now
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sandy is a rel disappointment in so many ways...too damn mooksy...i so glad when he was brigadier tnt aint had cause to go to war cuz we woulda be speakin ah different language all now
:rotfl: se habla espanol
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Nah a cyah believe it. When is election?
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http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/nri/nris-in-news/trinidad-and-tobago-prime-minister-kamla-persad-bissessar-touches-pratibha-patils-feet/articleshow/11427926.cms
JAIPUR: Trinidad and Tobago Prime Minister Kamla Persad Bissessar today surprised everyone when she touched the feet of President Pratibha Patil after being presented with the 'Pravasi Bhartiya Samman' award.
Bissessar, who was the first to be awarded with the 'Pravasi' medallion and a citation by the President, made hundreds of NRIs and PIOs remember their traditional roots as she bent down to touch the feet of Patil who immediately held her by her shoulders and hugged her in a gesture of blessing.
A number of Overseas delegates broke into thunderous applause and were seen wiping tears trickling down the cheeks when they saw the gesture.
"It is like a daughter meeting her mother...she did the gesture with so much humility and displaying her Indian roots," a NRI from Canada said.
Bissessar's family hails from Bihar before they migrated to the Caribbean nation.
Bissessar, who is also the chief guest of the three-day event being held here, announced to the crowd that she made it a point to wear a traditional Rajasthani saree and decked up with jewellery, 'bindi' and vermilion, the way married Indian women dress.
"I asked a local resident present in my security detail to suggest me a Rajasthani dress. ..this is what I was suggested and I am wearing," Bissessar said, drawing even a big applause from Patil.
Patil, in her speech, made a special mention of Bissessar and said "somebody very close has come (to meet us).
"She has become the first woman Prime Minister of her country... it is an achievement that the world-wide Indian community applauds and I thank her for coming all the way to be with us," Patil said.
Patil, who honoured 14 other NRIs/PIOs along with Bissessar, pinned the special 'Pravasi' badge on the Prime Minister who greeted her with a traditional 'Namaste'.
We in the middle of chaos at home and the PRIME MINISTER going around India touching people feet.
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We in the middle of chaos at home and the PRIME MINISTER going around India touching people feet.
Doh feel she know dat? Dahs why she savoring every moment away.
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NO HARD PROOF
Gibbs confirms not enough evidence to lay charges in 'plot' to kill PM
By Akile Simon
COMMISSIONER of Police Dwayne Gibbs yesterday confirmed the police have not found enough evidence linking 17 men to an alleged assassination plot against Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and three Government ministers.
The Sunday Express reported exclusively this weekend the police probe into the allegations, which was led by Supt John Daniel of the North Eastern Division, was completed late last year.
Daniel submitted the file indicating there was no evidence to suggest the 17 former detainees were involved in an alleged assassination or destablisation plot.
A senior source who was part of the investigative team had told the Express the information surrounding the alleged plot was based on hearsay but they have not found anything tangible which could support the allegations.
Commenting on the matter when questioned by reporters yesterday, Gibbs however noted that even though there is no evidence at this time to support the claim, the probe will continue.
He spoke briefly with members of the media at the Hyatt Regency hotel in Port of Spain after attending the opening of the 21st Conference of Speakers and Presiding Officers of the Commonwealth.
Gibbs said: "There was information, intelligence that would suggest that there was a plot. That's the information that we acted on. We'd be remiss if we hadn't acted on that information to ensure the safety and security of the individuals involved.
"Coming out of that, of course our investigations so far have not revealed that there is enough evidence to take some of the charges, or to take charges to court, so we will continue on that. We'll wait for the final evaluation on all our investigations from that point."
Meanwhile, acting National Security Minister, Justice Minister Herbert Volney, yesterday stated Persad-Bissessar did not need any evidence to act on intelligence that there was an alleged plot to assassinate her and three Government ministers.
Volney, during a telephone interview with the Express, said the police were investigating whether any act of treason was committed after the intelligence was passed to them and their investigations have revealed no such offence had been committed.
"There is no such criminal offence of a plot. There is an offence called treason and there is no evidence of treason (and) I expect the police to have reported that. As to whether there was a plot is a national security issue and that does not require evidence for the security forces to advise the PM to act," Volney said.
Volney, who sought to differentiate between intelligence and evidence, saying there appears to be some misunderstanding with the two by members of the media, made it quite clear the law was observed by the Government and the subsequent detention of 17 men was done based on the intelligence and not evidence.
He maintained the alleged plot, based on intelligence gathered, was real and the issue of there being a plot was a matter of national security and had nothing to do with the police.
Volney said: "What happened in this particular case is that given the intelligence that was obtained by the intelligence-gathering facilities of the State, it was determined that there was a clear and present danger to the lives of certain members of the Government. That did not rise to the level of a police investigation of treason.
"It was a national security issue and, accordingly given the powers of the Minister of National Security, he signed detention orders in respect of those persons that the intelligence-gathering organisations of the State had determined were involved in this (alleged) attempt at destablisation of the country. This information was subsequently turned over to the Commissioner of Police in order for him to see whether there is any criminal offence," Volney said.
He said there is a distinction between arresting a person on suspicion of committing an arrestable offence which is a police matter and detaining a person under State of Emergency Regulations which is not a police matter, but that of National Security.
"What has happened is that while the national security interest determined that persons should have been detained, and they were detained under the regulations of the SoE, the police looked at what was available and the intelligence for one reason or the other that I would not go into for national security considerations."
Sometimes, Volney said, persons who give intelligence are not prepared to come forward and sign statements in order to provide evidence to the police.
"That is just one example of how national security intelligence gathering sometimes does not turn into evidence when it is that the police investigate. So both sides are likely to be correct. Intelligence was gathered on that basis the minister (Sandy) signed the detention orders, quite legitimately and persons were detained. The police then investigated for the commission of criminal offences and they came up short with evidence, for reasons best known to them," Volney said.
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is I alone seeing and smelling loads of shit in dat statement.............if you have credible evidence of a plot wouldn't the intelligence services next move be to secure the right to tap and then monitor chatter to ascertain the credibility of said threat....ah mean yuh have names already what it taking to track these fellas until yuh have someting solid to move on.............even preemptive measures must have some kinda credibility behind it, if only to safeguard the integrity of the actions taken, right.......but den again.... bush didn' find no WoMD so.......anyhow dias my dose ah "indian hate" ::) ent war ::) ...... for d day
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is I alone seeing and smelling loads of shit in dat statement.............if you have credible evidence of a plot wouldn't the intelligence services next move be to secure the right to tap and then monitor chatter to ascertain the credibility of said threat....ah mean yuh have names already what it taking to track these fellas until yuh have someting solid to move on.............even preemptive measures must have some kinda credibility behind it, if only to safeguard the integrity of the actions taken, right.......but den again.... bush didn' find no WoMD so.......anyhow dias my dose ah "indian hate" ::) ent war ::) ...... for d day
Like how they get the names of the targets in the first place ent or how they know who to detain ? I remember some talk about a missing firearm. What happened to that ?
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Like how they get the names of the targets in the first place ent or how they know who to detain ? I remember some talk about a missing firearm. What happened to that ?
ah mean my faith in we intelligence infrastructure ent high particularly since d reshmi fiasco.........but I feel is some idleness get pickup on and some idiot decide to run with it, despite advice to d contrary, to try ah ting to save face for the SOE ......um didn't it have ah report dat stated just dat i.e. it was idle chatter at best.
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http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2012-01-22/griffith%E2%80%88i-have-no-credible-info-ssa-set-plot
Griffith: I have no credible info on SSA set up plot
Published:
Sunday, January 22, 2012
Anika Gumbs-Sandiford
Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar greets children after formally opening the Talparo Portable Water Treatment Plant yesterday. At left is Jairam Seemungal, MP for the La Horquetta/Talparo. PHOTO: ABRAHAM DIAZ
As investigations into the assassination plot on the lives of Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar and members of her Cabinet continues, new information surfacing has revealed that the Government has been allegedly mislead by “PNM operatives” within the Strategic Services Agency (SSA) and Police Service. Information obtained by Sunday Guardian revealed that security adviser Captain Gary Griffith expressed concerns over the credibility of the information which indicated that a threat was being made on the lives of Persad-Bissessar, Attorney General Anand Ramlogan and Housing Minister Dr Roodlal Moonilal. The information stated that Griffith raised issue with respect to Government being “set up” by the SSA, formerly the Security Intelligence Agency (SIA), as several operatives were hired under the former People’s National Movement (PNM) administration.
A Government official noted that SSA gave “this great assassination plot and embarrassed us,” whereby up to now they cannot show what evidence or intelligence they had that this plot was credible. The official noted that he was advised that the Government was indeed set up by operatives in SSA and TTPS (Trinidad and Tobago Police Service). The official also warned that any move to shift the National Security Operatives Centre (NSOC) back to the Ministry of National Security would result in the Government losing an opportunity to purge the agency of PNM operatives. Sunday Guardian understands the official claimed they would simply be transferring PNM operatives “just as we erroneous did from SIA to SSA.” The SIA, the official noted, comprised less than 170 people. However, he noted, the move was to ensure “that the PNM boys would keep their jobs and have access to work against us (PP).” Plans to have the SSA “established to over 500”, the official claimed, “is really to absorb the PNM Special Anti Unit T&T (Sautt) people”.
“The reason for this hostility, is because it was hoped that the hundreds of PNM operatives who were in SAUTT would simply be rolled over to NSOC, such as what happened with SIA to SSA,” the official claimed. However, when contacted yesterday Griffith denied that he had information indicating that SSA operatives allegedly “set up” the plot. “No, no, I have absolutely no such information. What I did was to bring the accusations that were brought to me to some people pertaining to the issue. It was all hear say, so to speak. I have not seen any credible information to verify that this was true. I would have brought to the attention of people that these claims were made but there is no information to verify the claims. People claimed that the assassination plot was set up to make the Government look bad but there is no credible evidence,” Griffith stated. Meanwhile, Sunday Guardian understands that Minister of National Security met with various heads of law enforcement units regarding the move of the NSOC on Thursday, shortly after publicly condemning Rear Admiral Richard Kelshall.
Griffith, Sunday Guardian understands, also took issue with this, deeming it as disregarding directives from the Prime Minister. Information obtained by Sunday Guardian revealed a Government official stated: “This has put us in a delicate situation, as the PM and Cabinet agreed on something, and the PM from India, authorised a media release on such yet it is being questioned in public by a minister.” Attempts to reach Commissioner of Police Dwayne Gibbs proved futile.
:bs:
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http://www.guardian.co.tt/columnist/2011/12/07/assassination-plot-fiasco-govt
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Assassination plot - A fiasco for govt
Published:
Wednesday, December 7, 2011
Tony Fraser
When Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar accepted the advice of Commissioner of Police Dwayne Gibbs that the police had uncovered a plot that was hatched to assassinate her and three of her senior ministers and adds her political responsibility to it, then that decision becomes her own. When she took on board the wisdom of her national security adviser, Gary Griffith, that she should make information on the plot public, then she also takes political responsibility for the disclosure and the decision is then her own. In addressing the news conference on November 24, Prime Minister Persad-Bissessar dem-onstrated in clear view of the national community that she had indeed grabbed hold of that political responsibility and added the considerable weight of the office of the Prime Minister to it.
If the CoP was careful, disclosing little more than the police had uncovered the assassination plot and had detained 12 people, Prime Minister Persad-Bissessar contextualised the plot in relation to her Government’s boldness to establish the state of emergency and curfew. “These nefarious elements…are finally confronted by a government which possess the political will, courage and strength of conviction to stoutly defend and protect the citizens of the country,” said the Prime Minister in a fighting mood, convinced of the political rightness of her course of action. She went further to say that the plot had been the result of the taking off the streets illegal drugs to the value of $1.5 billion, 13,000 plus rounds of ammunition, 173 guns and other assorted weapons.
On the related issue of making an official public announcement of the plot at a time when the police had gathered little evidence to substantiate the claim, there has been what can only be a deliberate attempt to confuse the Government’s taking of the information gleaned by the security forces seriously (unlike what was said to have been done in 1990), and the second decision to make the information public. The two decisions cannot be conflated; they are separate and apart. So the Prime Minister and her Government had every right to take the intelligence gathered by the police seriously; but then had the option of when to make the information known to the public. On the day before the official announcement, there was the obviously orchestrated leak of information to the media. This strategy then sought to give legitimacy to the public statements of November 24.
Question is: why did Kamla Persad-Bissessar and her Government, those who had prior knowledge of the announcements, take this risky course of action to place the reputation of the Prime Minister and her Government on the line? There will always be speculation on such questions about the thinking of politicians. What has been demonstrated quite clearly is that politicians always have a hidden agenda to major decisions taken. Here is one possible motivation. The SoE was coming to an end and there was quite an amount of scepticism about the value of declaring the emergency. There was quite a large segment of public opinion as displayed on all media, conversations in public places, feeling that nothing fundamental was achieved by way of dismantling the gangs and smashing of the criminal culture.
Government, aware of this vein of opinion among segments of the population (reportedly even within the Cabinet), both the aligned and the non-partisan, saw in the reported assassination plot justification enough for the implementation of the SoE and an irresistible propaganda opportunity to “palance” with, and the Prime Minister grabbed it with both hands. And it must be remembered that the first known justification for the declaration of the emergency, the claim that because the security forces had intercepted a major drug bust there would be reaction that would make 1990 look like Sunday school time, remains an outstanding doubt.
True or false the announcement of the alleged assassination plot was an opportunity to boast that so successful had the emergency been that the Government had the drug dealers on the run and desperate enough for them to want to eliminate the source of their pain of losses and strife. Clearly little time was spent on thinking the matter through and allowing the security forces to unearth the hard evidence before running with the announcement. Try as they may to spin around this debacle of the alleged assassination plot, lay blame on who they wish to choose, a hapless CoP, a diabolical and anti-PP cabal in the intelligence forces, “no water is going to wash” the Prime Minister clean of this disaster. Security officials may advise and recommend, ultimately the leader takes political action and responsibility for such action.
As the Americans say, “the buck stops here” at the door of the head of executive power, the Prime Minister. Incidentally, or not too incidentally, the tenure of CoP Gibbs must surely be threatened by the outturn of the events. And that is also instructive on the vulnerability of a police commissioner who is on a contract that amounts to no more than a short leash that can be jerked around to suit the will of a government in office. What of the legislation that needs amending to allow for a local commissioner to be appointed with full tenure? Is the Government going to await another crisis moment to then continue the appointment of a CoP on a short-term contract?
Quality communication with the public remains a major deficiency of the People’s Partnership Government. Vital to the communication process is the fundamental premise from which commu- nication is launched. Clearly too much of the communication is hinged around attempting to distort reality and imbedded in Anancy politics. In the Reshmi affair, which has never been transparently explained, this young woman’s appointment was clearly based on some form of political partisanship. Therefore all the expected checks and balances in selecting someone for such an important and sensitive job were ignored. Having been found out, then no effort was spared to spin a way out of the predicament, including attempting to beat the media into submission to “move on.” As the Government spends its political currency like millionaires, the trade union movement is lining up against what it must believe is a government weakened by the assassination plot fiasco.
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Dis blasted PNM again. So...to prevent instances of this....purge the SSA..and hire PP operatives to make sure things like this doh happen.
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(http://www.guardian.co.tt/sites/default/files/field/image/greets%20children.png)
Isn't she lovely
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(http://www.guardian.co.tt/sites/default/files/field/image/greets%20children.png)
Isn't she lovely
Round she chest looking like box-ish. She wearing a bullet proof vest or wha?
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They need to stop now. They starting to dig a hole for themselves.
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They need to stop now. They starting to dig a hole for themselves.
Nah continue dey goin gr8.