Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
Sports => Football => Topic started by: Sam on June 30, 2017, 08:49:58 AM
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Allyuh know if ah SSFL game ever get sold out in de national Stadium.
I eh talking bout them small stadiums eh.
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No idea about the stadium.
But in 1979 the N. Zone final between Fatima and John D at the Queen's Park Oval had about 30 000 people.
The place was Ram. It was the third encounter between the two as the first two had been drawn.
I was a yute so if the older heads want to correct me, feel free.
VB
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dont know exact figures...but the final with Sando Tech vz Arima ( mid 80's).. ram ram ram.. before the all seater...so plus 25,000 for sure,,
even the semi..tech vz Signal hill...
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The stadiums was after I left. So I can't tell. But I know before the stadiums, the Oval and Skinner's Park used to be full capacity crowds for both zones and national finals.
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No idea about the stadium.
But in 1979 the N. Zone final between Fatima and John D at the Queen's Park Oval had about 30 000 people.
The place was Ram. It was the third encounter between the two as the first two had been drawn.
I was a yute so if the older heads want to correct me, feel free.
VB
There are pictures floating around of this encounter and you can see the stands are packed
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Not showing all the angles but would not doubt this was well over 20,000 ppl
(http://www.ttfootballhistory.com/files/images/1979-fatimajd.preview.jpg)
(http://www.ttfootballhistory.com/files/images/1979-craigperuintercolrotation.preview.jpg)
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St Anthonys vs St Benedicts in 1999 in either the Oval or National Stadium
St Benedicts vs Princess Town 2000 in Skinner Park
Both ram out
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No idea about the stadium.
But in 1979 the N. Zone final between Fatima and John D at the Queen's Park Oval had about 30 000 people.
The place was Ram. It was the third encounter between the two as the first two had been drawn.
I was a yute so if the older heads want to correct me, feel free.
VB
I too was a yute then but I don't think there was 30,000 people there because the oval only holds 25,000 so it could have been an easy 20,000. Meh breds who was playing for Fatima still have news paper clippings of that game.
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Not showing all the angles but would not doubt this was well over 20,000 ppl
(http://www.ttfootballhistory.com/files/images/1979-fatimajd.preview.jpg)
(http://www.ttfootballhistory.com/files/images/1979-craigperuintercolrotation.preview.jpg)
that tallman who ridin the john D player's shoulders i sure that is garnet craig, that fker was good boy!
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Yes, it is Garnet Craig.
And in the photo above, the white fella watching the ball is Graeme Rodriguez.
Rogdriguez told me that in 30 odd years of watching SSFL, the best he ever saw was Clauzelle and GC was a distant second.
Bear in mind this is from around '73-2005.
VB
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Intercol start playing in the Oval around 65 I think. At least in North. They moved from the Savannah. From what I was told it always had big crowds. The Oval capacity was smaller then. Intercol as far as I know always had big crowds. I would hear estimates from 15 to 20 thous. The QRCvs Saints rivalry and the Saints vs Belmont rivalry had big crowds. The one north final I played vs tranquil had about 12 to 13 thousand. That probably was small compared to others. Intercol changed when they instituted the zones. It became more inclusive. So the north schools influence waned. So Signal Hill, Arima, San Juan, Malick, St. Augustine started pulling the crowds from what I was told. But now the North schools would be lucky to pull 5 thousand for a intercol final.
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Deeks I never saw them play but that Belmont team with Bird, Sacky, Plucky, Blip et al was legendary. Heard stories from Sacky who coached me at U 14. Met either Bird or Plucky in Brooklyn many years later and he too has some interesting stories to tell.
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dont know exact figures...but the final with Sando Tech vz Arima ( mid 80's).. ram ram ram.. before the all seater...so plus 25,000 for sure,,
even the semi..tech vz Signal hill...
Yes I was there for that. sold out. The year after with El Dorado vs Pres also had a massive crowd.
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Intercol start playing in the Oval around 65 I think. At least in North. They moved from the Savannah. From what I was told it always had big crowds. The Oval capacity was smaller then. Intercol as far as I know always had big crowds. I would hear estimates from 15 to 20 thous. The QRCvs Saints rivalry and the Saints vs Belmont rivalry had big crowds. The one north final I played vs tranquil had about 12 to 13 thousand. That probably was small compared to others. Intercol changed when they instituted the zones. It became more inclusive. So the north schools influence waned. So Signal Hill, Arima, San Juan, Malick, St. Augustine started pulling the crowds from what I was told. But now the North schools would be lucky to pull 5 thousand for a intercol final.
I remember the 80's the schools fans used to be in the uncovered side of the stadium. QRC and St. Mary's had brass sections and all. I would say about 10,000. Now you can't even full the covered section. A little off topic but I even remember Netball opposite memorial park being a real big deal. It use to have real crowd for that too
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Che, you are quite correct about the netball and Breds, as far as I am concern, you not off topic. Those days is why we on this wonderful site are so passionate about Trini sport. Imagine them facilities were bare bones and fans use to come out and support.
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Deeks I never saw them play but that Belmont team with Bird, Sacky, Plucky, Blip et al was legendary. Heard stories from Sacky who coached me at U 14. Met either Bird or Plucky in Brooklyn many years later and he too has some interesting stories to tell.
Belmont was knocking on the door 67/68. They had a good bunch of players. Winfield St. Hill, George Romano, Joe Acqui, a goal keeper called Garcia, Trujillo.
Then in 69 they bust loose by beating QRC in the north intercol final in the oval. They had Pat Wilkinson in goal(ex QRC). The Laforests. Wayne Lewis. 70 and 71 it was strictly Saints-Belmont. With Saint coming out on top on both occasions. Trevor Leiba was top dog then. For them clashes, the oval and Fatima were packed to capacity.
In 72, QRC and Tranquil clash in the north final. My only run in the Oval. Tranquil won for the first time with a brilliant free from McIntyre. Tranquil won in 73 and 74. And 75 they beat Pres. quite comfortable. Tom Philips was the starboy of that game. Then 75 Belmont took over with Big Bird and Plucky.
I can't remember who won in 76. That is it in a nutshell. I was out of TT in Jan. 77. Guys, I eh exaggerating. Big crowds. Plenty excitement. Plenty hilarious characters. Peace and love era. Now is violence and and death era. That is part of the reason people don't go to football anymore. The senseless violence.
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1990 SSFL Intercol final between Malick and Signal Hill was a complete sell out. Malick won 3:0.
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No idea about the stadium.
But in 1979 the N. Zone final between Fatima and John D at the Queen's Park Oval had about 30 000 people.
The place was Ram. It was the third encounter between the two as the first two had been drawn.
I was a yute so if the older heads want to correct me, feel free.
VB
I too was a yute then but I don't think there was 30,000 people there because the oval only holds 25,000 so it could have been an easy 20,000. Meh breds who was playing for Fatima still have news paper clippings of that game.
c
Not necessarilly, official were infamous in those days for overpacking. I remember for more than one Concacaf youth match around 1984, having to sit on the steps of covered at the Nat. Stadium because all seats were sold.
When India came to the QPO 30 000 was the crowd give or take. Simply put, they oversold tickets. Today we have stricter laws in place.
VB
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VB, I probably was sitting next to you in the stadium for that game in 84. Clint Marcelle was the exciting player on that team. Yes the stadium was oversold for that game. Yes, the entire steps had people seated on them. The people used to support. We were runners up in that tournament, if I remembered correctly.
Yes, the QPCC definitely used to pack them in for big events. I can attest to some of them.
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Golden years of sport support based on the responses.
I think in modern times with the advent of cable TV where you can see top quality football on a weekly basis has taken away from the local fan movement.
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Just some of the consequences of globalization
Big bird Browne, Plucky Evelyn, Miutty Haynes, "Peru" Anderson, Garfield de Silva etc were all "legends" back in the day.
Today they would be deemed shithounds.
So it go
BTW....one of the best Colleges game I remember seeing was Mucurapo vs Fatima in 78. Clauzel, the White brothers, Emerson Dubisson, Clayton Morris etc vs Anton Corneal,Garnet Craig, Nancoo, Ramdoo, Lester Joseph etc
Talk about tension and excitement. Mucurapo won that match 2-1.
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https://www.facebook.com/SocaWarriorsTV/videos/970270326363648/
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Plenty hilarious characters.
If you went Tranquil, then you must know "Attack"
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Plenty hilarious characters.
If you went Tranquil, then you must know "Attack"
"Attack" was quite a character. He support Tranquil to the hilt. He was the number 1 mouth piece. Funny, he had two brothers going to QRC at the time. But looking back now, he was totally funny as hell. Funnier though, is the crowd running on the field when goals scored in them time. I know they had stopped that up North. Surprised to see that was happening in that video. That is some years after me.
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Tranquil used to have a tall red fella up front...think he name was Keith Weekes. Decent player.
Tom Phillip was de marquee player tho.
Thing is......many of the SSFL/ intercol "legends" went on to do very little in international football.
Outside of the days of Benedicts players and Gally and then Yorke, Latapy, Leonson generation.....most of them didn't do much playing for T&T
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Outside of the days of Benedicts players and Gally and then Yorke, Latapy, Leonson generation.....most of them didn't do much playing for T&T
palos, you right about that. When the NASLfell about around 84, the outlet for TT players were stymied. The ASL was around, but I can't remember much Trinis in it. Simmonds(Fatima/Howard) played for the Washinton team for a short period. Chinapoo went indoors. Other players who stayed in the game, played for regional and city leagues(especially NY and NE US) sponsored by small businesses. Under the table pro-leagues.There were no other incentives or outlets for Trinis to hone their skill abroad. The Euro first divisions were closed to most lower tiered countries like TT. Many TT players who played college had very few options. Like Chinapoo, some went indoors or played in a east coast regional league. If they come back home, is TTFA football. Remember Jack had kill the Arthur Suite inspired pro-league. What then for them.
But when the English leagues(Div 1) opened up to foreigners in the late 80s and early 90s, then we got the break. Dwight and Latas were at the right time. Latas getting his break in Portugal. They were talented diamonds in the rough. Plus They were mentally ready for the journey. Dwight was a huge success. Surpassing the legends of the 60s. Then Stern, Marcelle, Latas, Nakid, etc followed. Then the MLS opened and naturally TT players gravitated to the US again. It was easier to move to the US because many of the players played college ball there. That is my take on this topic.
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:beermug:
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Deeks,
you hit the nail on the head. Couldn't have said it better.
Except Nakhid made it in the mid 80s. The only US College player from TT to get such a break.
With the MLS defunct circa 1980 and Suite going buss (courtesy of Jack) in the 80s there was no inspiration or outlet.
Take into account there was an innate bias against college palyers (eg. Fatima, Saints, etc.) hampering men like Garnet Craig, Ronnnie Simmons, Skeene, Anton Corneal and a few others.
Some as great as they were simply could not necessarily make a TT first team (or at least on a regular basis).
VB
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Take into account there was an innate bias against college palyers (eg. Fatima, Saints, etc.) hampering men like Garnet Craig, Ronnnie Simmons, Skeene, Anton Corneal and a few others.
When I heard about bias against college players, I found that strange. Because in my time and before, college players was a major part of the national team system. But it appeared to be a bias against the north schools like Fatima and Saints. QRC did not factor because they have fallen in football by then. This bias maybe this bullshit that they are "whiteboy" school. I heard a lot of that crap hurled around in my time. I heard a lot about Graham Rodriguez. Never seen him play. Some people think he should have been on the national team. then there Stewart Thomasos, Mario Garcia who I only saw in DC. They were very good players. A next thing, back then, there should have had been a U-21 and U-23 squads to keep them guys interested. CFU(JW again) did not have the smarts to create a CFU U21 and U23 tournaments. It would have prepared the guys for senior football.
Never seen Skeene or Anton play. Heard they were good too. I saw and played against Ronnie Simmonds. If allyuh checked some of my post of the past. This guy was one who got away. This dude had all the facets to be a great player. The time was not right. Saw Garnet Graig on tv playing for TT in 2 WC games. I can't remember if it was for the Spain WC or or the Mexico WC. But TT played both games in the US and lost 2-1 and 1-0. He and an army boy named Garcia played in the hole. Derek Lewis at RB. Clayton Morris in the middle Tom Phillips up front. Can't remember the rest of the squad. This Craig guy was fairly tall and won every ball in the air. Cool defender. Again a very good prospect who faded away because the opportunities were limited.That was the only times I saw him play. Don't know where he is now.
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Take into account there was an innate bias against college palyers (eg. Fatima, Saints, etc.) hampering men like Garnet Craig, Ronnnie Simmons, Skeene, Anton Corneal and a few others.
When I heard about bias against college players, I found that strange. Because in my time and before, college players was a major part of the national team system. But it appeared to be a bias against the north schools like Fatima and Saints. QRC did not factor because they have fallen in football by then. This bias maybe this bullshit that they are "whiteboy" school. I heard a lot of that crap hurled around in my time. I heard a lot about Graham Rodriguez. Never seen him play. Some people think he should have been on the national team. then there Stewart Thomasos, Mario Garcia who I only saw in DC. They were very good players. A next thing, back then, there should have had been a U-21 and U-23 squads to keep them guys interested. CFU(JW again) did not have the smarts to create a CFU U21 and U23 tournaments. It would have prepared the guys for senior football.
Never seen Skeene or Anton play. Heard they were good too. I saw and played against Ronnie Simmonds. If allyuh checked some of my post of the past. This guy was one who got away. This dude had all the facets to be a great player. The time was not right. Saw Garnet Graig on tv playing for TT in 2 WC games. I can't remember if it was for the Spain WC or or the Mexico WC. But TT played both games in the US and lost 2-1 and 1-0. He and an army boy named Garcia played in the hole. Derek Lewis at RB. Clayton Morris in the middle Tom Phillips up front. Can't remember the rest of the squad. This Craig guy was fairly tall and won every ball in the air. Cool defender. Again a very good prospect who faded away because the opportunities were limited.That was the only times I saw him play. Don't know where he is now.
Deeks,
there was the "white boy school" hang up. But Craig, Simmons and David Mohammed (the cricketer who captained Naps and South U-19 in football) certainly weren't white. A fair complexion simply made it worse.
Re. the two games vs the US in the US. I think that was for the 86 WC. Jack sold our home rights and basically our chance to qualify for the WC.
Some of those names I don't know. But it was around '85. There would've been men llike Brian Williams, Ron La Forest, Maurice Alibey, . But then again there was an impasse between Warner and players in Suite's leage and we played with a second 11 for a few years. So Icould be wrong about who was there. No idea of a Tom Phillips in the 80s.
Always believed that Garnet and Simmons should've been with the Strike Squad.
Post Strike squad, A Corneal took over. He immediately brought in Simmons, Skeene and Anton. Adn they fitted right in.
Alvin never had the hang up about College players - thank God. And those that he brought in always handled their business.
VB
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The 86 WC campaign was doomed by that impasse between jack and the ASL/pro league "rebels". So basically that was a b squad. Alibey, Ron Laforest, Spann, Brian Williams and so other good players did not play. The late Roderick Warner(RIP) was the coach. Then the WC for Italy, Gally was in charge, and he brought in some youth with the experience and the rest was history.
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The 86 WC campaign was doomed by that impasse between jack and the ASL/pro league "rebels". So basically that was a b squad. Alibey, Ron Laforest, Spann, Brian Williams and so other good players did not play. The late Roderick Warner(RIP) was the coach. Then the WC for Italy, Gally was in charge, and he brought in some youth with the experience and the rest was history.
Gally was averse to having those "college" players in his team...even though some of those same college players helped him to qualify for the Hex in the first place....in particular Chinapoo, Skeene, and Anton Corneal all of whom played in that deciding match in Tegucigalpa that qualified us for the Hex in 1989. It was Skeene's cross that Chinapoo challenged and resulted in Hutson Charles tapping into a nearly empty net for the tie.
None of Chinas, Skeene, or Anton played in the Hex. Nakhid was ignored.....allegedly because he dared to question Gally's tactics? And Verron Skinner....who was also highly thought of at the time and another college boy out of Trinity....was also not drafted in. Same for Shaka...."who's dad had a disagreement with Jack" if I not mistaken.
Gally had his boys and it was his right. The only major addition to the core of his strike squad team was Elliot Alleyne. Hard luck for the rest of them...especially the college boys...who were being heavily touted by Alvin Corneal in particular.
My personal belief is that Gally was determined to prove that a completely "local" based squad....with players not playing "outside" would qualify for the world cup.
Ironic if that's the case given that Gally himself was one such player in the 73 squad. That he came so close to achieving that goal is no small feat for Gally. But also remember that US was a bunch of college boys at the time and there was no Mexico to contend with.
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My personal belief is that Gally was determined to prove that a completely "local" based squad....with players not playing "outside" would qualify for the world cup.
Palos, I think the same as you. Gally had the ears of the local boys, and he really groom them to believe in his system. They would do anything for him. They saw themselves as part of an important destiny. And he believed in them also. It was a two-way thing. I really can't blame him for that. But I think those guys should have been on the squad because they were as good as anyone on his "local " based squad. One thing though, it was easier to coach a local based team because they right at home. Not like now where players have to come 5 days before a game from 4 to 5 thousand miles away. Whether or not you disagree with Gally, you to give him credit for fostering one of the best team effort for a WC campaign. It failed but it helped in the long for the 2nd Germany WC campaign, where BeenHakker got his due credit. And quite rightly so. That is the way it goes sometimes.
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Princes Town vs Naparima 2001 Intercol Finals at Manny Ramjohn. Guaranteed sold out. I believe that stadia is 10000 capacity.