Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum
Sports => Football => Topic started by: Tallman on November 01, 2019, 02:42:22 PM
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As usual, any updates/scores, shout-outs, reports, predictions, views, etc, on the Ecuador vs T&T game on the 14th of November 2019 will be posted here, this way, we can maintain the message board and not make it look too scrappy with un-necessary or related headlines and postings on game day.
For the internet users, you can follow the game at:
To be updated.
Possible Online Streams.
To be updated.
Possible TV Station.
To be updated.
Trinidad & Tobago Squad
Goalkeepers:
Defenders:
Midfielders:
Forwards:
Coach - Dennis Lawrence (TRI).
Ecuador Squad
Goalkeepers
° Johan Padilla (Nacional)
° Pedro Ortiz (Delfín)
° Brian Heras (Dep. Cuenca)
Defenders
Andrés López (U. Católica)
Bryan Carabalí (Emelec)
Félix Torres (Santos Laguna, MEX)
Xavier Arreaga (Seattle Sounders, USA)
Moisés Corozo (Macará)
Franklin Guerra (Liga de Quito)
Midfielders
Diego Palacios (Los Ángeles FC, USA)
Gustavo Cortez (U. Católica)
Leonel Quiñónez (Macará)
Gonzalo Plata (Sporting Lisbon, POR)
Renato Ibarra (América, MEX)
Pedro Perlaza (Delfín)
Romario Ibarra (Pachuca, MEX)
Marcos Caicedo (BSC)
José Cifuentes (América de Quito)
Jhegson Méndez (Orlando City, USA)
Jefferson Orejuela (Liga de Quito ←Fluminense, BRA)
Alan Franco (IDV)
Ángel Mena (León, MEX)
Jordan Sierra (Querétaro, MEX)
Forwards
Fidel Martínez (BSC)
Michael Estrada (Macará)
Enner Valencia (Tigres, MEX)
Alejandro Cabeza (IDV)
Updates to follow as we get more info, so keep checking back.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJIZ_7TXsAAxSKF.jpg)
Tickets cost more than they did last time, but understandably so. They were $1, $2 and $3.
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So we socawarriors fans does know the possible other team lineup before we know our own. :rotfl: :rotfl:
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So we socawarriors fans does know the possible other team lineup before we know our own. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Dude, doh laught too hard, yuh belly go buss!
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So we socawarriors fans does know the possible other team lineup before we know our own. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Dude, doh laught too hard, yuh belly go buss!
Deeks, yuh read meh mind yes.
VB
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Dennis lawrence the wanker. every team this side of the atlantic declare their line ups days in advance, but this lawrence bloke has to do things differently. I hope we never hire another local coach especially from the former soca warriors who went germany in 2006, not for federation president, head coach ( latapy and lawrence) nor minister of sports ( Brent sancho), these guys has proven that they’re not to be trusted with power.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_banners/2409683900/1573163171/1080x360)
The match referee and ARs are from Peru; 4th official from Colombia.
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Dennis lawrence the wanker. every team this side of the atlantic declare their line ups days in advance, but this lawrence bloke has to do things differently. I hope we never hire another local coach especially from the former soca warriors who went germany in 2006, not for federation president, head coach ( latapy and lawrence) nor minister of sports ( Brent sancho), these guys has proven that they’re not to be trusted with power.
Dude, you going over the top. Is only the names. You have a fair idea whose going to be on the team. Deleon and Bostock will not be there.
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Dennis lawrence the wanker. every team this side of the atlantic declare their line ups days in advance, but this lawrence bloke has to do things differently. I hope we never hire another local coach especially from the former soca warriors who went germany in 2006, not for federation president, head coach ( latapy and lawrence) nor minister of sports ( Brent sancho), these guys has proven that they’re not to be trusted with power.
Dude, you going over the top. Is only the names. You have a fair idea whose going to be on the team. Deleon and Bostock will not be there.
ive been trying my best not to argue with anyone, it’s just not worth it. if you think those guys are worth venerating then may that be on you, but I’ve seen better players who came into disrepute, players who would open their veins and give their blood for their country like christiano, pele, deigo maradona, zlatan, dhino gaucho, and the list goes on.
IMO men like Brent sancho, russel latapy, kelvin jack, stern John , cornel glen, dennis lawrence are all out for themselves, never mind opening their veins, they wouldn’t take as much as a cal pet for this country. just look how cornel glen dogged Steven hart for not selecting him, have you ever considered why Carlos edwards quit the team in the middle of the hex? he was not very happy with dennis at the end. these guys are not as blameless as you think, and I’m not particularly tickled by them as you are.
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I just check the Express and Newsday and not one mention of the game today. SMH.
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Well I can say for sure, Hyland and Cyrus on the team!
The head coach and Stern will be there too! I saw them all at Miami airport on Tuesday.
I saw a few others too but didn't recognize them...hope this helps, at least we know for sure two who are on the team ;D
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T&T Men face Ecuador in Manta
TTFA Media
Trinidad and Tobago’s Senior Men will face Ecuador in an international friendly at the Estadio Reales Tamarindos at 8:00 pm TT Time (7:00pm local time) as they continue preparations for the important CONCACAF Nations League qualifier versus Honduras in San Pedro Sula on Sunday.
The T&T team arrived in Manta, a three hour drive from Guayaquil early on Wednesday morning. Head coach Dennis Lawrence conducted a training session on Wednesday evening. Joining the squad in Manta was Begium-based defender Sheldon Bateau and Malta-based forward Rundell Winchester while team captain Khaleem Hyland, who missed the 15-0 win over Anguilla on the weekend, also traveled with the squad.
Trinidad and Tobago Squad
Goalkeepers:
Marvin Phillip (Neroca FC / India),Nicklas Frenderup (IL Stjørdals-Blink / Norway), Glenroy Samuel (La Horquetta Rangers / T&T)
Defenders:
Daneil Cyrus (Mohun Bagan AC / India), Sheldon Bateau (KV Mechelen / Belgium), Aubrey David (Deportivo Saprissa / Costa Rica), Mekeil Williams (Oklahoma City Energy FC / USA), Alvin Jones (Oklahoma City Energy FC / USA), Carlyle Mitchell (La Horquetta Rangers / T&T), Keston Julien (AS Trenčín / Slovakia), Ross Russell Jr. (La Horquetta Rangers / T&T)
Midfielders:
Khaleem Hyland (Al Faisaly FC / Saudi Arabia), Nathan Lewis (Central FC / T&T), Duane Muckette (Memphis 901 FC / USA), Ataulla Guerra (Charleston Battery / USA), Jomal Williams (A.D. Isidro Metapán / El Salvador), Andre Fortune (North Carolina FC / USA), Aikim Andrews (La Horquetta Rangers / T&T), Aaron Lester (Defence Force / T&T), Matthew Woo Ling (AC Port of Spain, T&T), Kevon Goddard (Central FC / T&T), Jomoul Francois (La Horquetta Rangers / T&T)
Forwards:
Marcus Joseph (Gokulam Kerala / India), Rundell Winchester (Gudja United / Malta), Ryan Telfer (York9 FC / Canada), Daniel Carr (Apollon Limassol FC / Cyprus)
Technical Staff
Head Coach: Dennis Lawrence
Assistant Coach: Stuart Charles-Fevrier
Assistant Coach: Stern John
Goalkeeper Coach: Ross Russell
Doctor: Akash Dhanai
Medic: Mac Allister Estrada
Trainer: Dexter Thomas
Massage Therapist: Sion Cain
Equipment Manager: Michael Williams
Logistics Manager: Wayne Cunningham
Team Manager: Richard Piper
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This morning I had the pleasure of contextualizing the match on Ecuadorian radio in Q & A for the audience of one of Ecuador's most respected voices on football. The segment lasted about 15 minutes. I'll try to source the segment.
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https://www.youtube.com/v/DdNL0dO5ZrE
he get a call based on ??? is judah there ??
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Based on dialogue on these very pages.
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what happen to rajitsingh molino and jovin jones ???
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This morning I had the pleasure of contextualizing the match on Ecuadorian radio in Q & A for the audience of one of Ecuador's most respected voices on football. The segment lasted about 15 minutes. I'll try to source the segment.
I have the clip.
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what happen to rajitsingh molino and jovin jones ???
Dey limin wid de brothers Garcia.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EJXl1yAXYAAyQFs?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
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Possible Streams:
https://soloveo.com/goltv.php
http://www.rojadirectatv.tv/cnt-ecuador-en-vivo.php
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Does anyone have a link for this game
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Strap on allyuh seatbelts. Earlier today I described things as still being experimental. So it is.
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Cyrus again....every frigging time. Bullied off the ball, horrible positioning, not sure why he is still on the team.
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30': Goal by Alan Franco gives Ecuador a 1-0 lead over Trinidad and Tobago.
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Link expire seemed kinda iffy though weird hacky behavior after ah while not chancing it on meh phone too easy to circumvent
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This game is like a shooting range for Ecuador. We can't get pass the midfield (can't remember the last time we had one), and we letting get a million passes on top of the box, while we have more than half the team sitting in the box standing around marking grass :banginghead:
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Try facebook..
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This team have no direction...no unit play ....halfassed pressing and when we actually press and win d ball is back to pedestrian passing and movement.... steups
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Cyrus again....every frigging time. Bullied off the ball, horrible positioning, not sure why he is still on the team.
Not even bullied. He's just not physically up to it. Either it's voluntary retirement or forcible retirement, but retirement at international level is coming. The conversation is inescapable. Either with himself or with the coach. Frankly, I'm disappointed that DL, a CB himself, won't accept the cold hard truth here. Yuh have assets and yuh have liabilities and this is a liability with a forensic trail.
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HALF-TIME: Ecuador 1-0 Trinidad and Tobago. Goal by Alan Franco (30'). #ECUvTRI
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So we socawarriors fans does know the possible other team lineup before we know our own. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Within Ecuadorian media outlets, reporters had been postulating on the starting XI based on practice sessions and several hit the nail on the head.
In a sense I get what Dennis was about but as far as revealing the travelling contingent I think a better balance could have been struck all things considered.
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Cyrus is off, thank you omg.
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HALF-TIME: Ecuador 1-0 Trinidad and Tobago. Goal by Alan Franco (30'). #ECUvTRI
Just won the Copa Sudamericana. Value increasing by the second.
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This team have no direction...no unit play ....halfassed pressing and when we actually press and win d ball is back to pedestrian passing and movement.... steups
The half ass press is truly mind boggling. Just like you said, when we win the ball, which is like .1 percent of the time, we have none or make any passing lanes, due to our lack of a midfield, so we pass it all the way back and lose the ball. Same formula, same madness, same results.
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Well I can say for sure, Hyland and Cyrus on the team!
The head coach and Stern will be there too! I saw them all at Miami airport on Tuesday.
I saw a few others too but didn't recognize them...hope this helps, at least we know for sure two who are on the team ;D
Did you tell Cyrus "he's not friggin Lucio"? :devil:
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asylumseeker, is this Ecuador side anything close to their frist team?
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And may we add ball control as well? Seems like no one on the team can complete this task, the ball is bouncing all over the place or rebounding back to the Ecuadorian.
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is this game in Quito
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is this game in Quito
Portoviejo
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Does DL even teach these guys how to pass, or even counter attack? We can't even get short passes together.
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for the love of god, these people could have at least put the starting line up, what kind of lazy journalism is this? can anyone give the starting line up.
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Who’s the #3 bloke, the lad is severely lacking, has no football brain and no technical skills.
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asylumseeker, is this Ecuador side anything close to their frist team?
Somewhat, yes in terms of recognized and ready talent (but there arguably are some established players who could still command a place in the squad (for example Felipe Caicedo if he was inclined ) and others who could be progressed from the U23s that are currently prepping for South America's Olympic qualifiers (under the same coach)). Also there are a couple talented young players already in Europe who have been left to grow a bit (for instance the first player Ronaldo acquired at Valladolid, a player named Stiven Plaza).
That stated, this coach sees his role as one of highlighting players who are knocking on the door insistently and others who have been overlooked in recent cycles under recent coaches Quinteros and Gomez. This coach is also tacitly interested in the job, but by taking this approach he is also covering his ass a bit, especially not wanting a repeat of the 6-1 he suffered vs Argentina. There isn't much significant sentiment in his favor though, despite his undeniable success at U20 level (WC bronze medallists).
If Jose Pékerman takes the job, he will have a different elaboration of a 23-man squad, but many of these players would automatically be initial contenders.
Other consideration: 4 players went back to their club squads because their clubs are in a cup final on Saturday and there was constant pressure on the federation and caretaker coach to ignore it being a FIFA date.
Finally, Independiente del Valle (just won the Sudamericana) is stacked with young homegrown talent and only 2 players from that club are in this squad ... So the theme I discussed this morning was that the process of "recambio' in Ecuador contrasts with our retention of older players, although the randomized selection of Woo Ling and Lewis call for acknowledgement of recognizing that DL either sees it or is hitting in the dark.
Last thing, if you look at the GKs for Ecuador ... all are playing locally and they have an average age of 26 ... all are under 30. So in this sense it is good to see Frenderup on the pitch. And the questions raised about what Glenroy Samuel should be doing linger. So position by position although the Ecuador squad is anything but settled, many of the players selected are consensus NT material.
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71': Enner Valencia doubles Ecuador's lead from the penalty spot, on a handball by Mekeil Williams. Ecuador 2-0 Trinidad and Tobago.
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BTW this whole back lines needs to change. come on mikel how long have you been in the game for f**k sake man this is basic things we learn in under 14 camp mate, you defenders aught to know better.
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Does DL even teach these guys how to pass, or even counter attack? We can't even get short passes together.
i have seen one truly good counter recently and dat is only because Bateau can carry ah ball with d grace of ah genuine B2BM...I would honestly experiment with him in d pivot...or give him license carry d ball when ever possible man like aubrey dat doh do nutten goin forward can drift inside to cover him
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:banginghead: :banginghead: :banginghead: :banginghead: :banginghead: :banginghead:
Another lame brain performance, we looked like cones on the field. Pile of shit we play OMG!
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FINAL: Ecuador 3-0 Trinidad and Tobago. Goals by Alan Franco (30') and Enner Valencia (71', 85').
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We have to play better opposition so we can improve as a team....doh kill de messenger eh
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for the love of god, these people could have at least put the starting line up, what kind of lazy journalism is this? can anyone give the starting line up.
Frenderup, Russell, M. Williams, Cyrus, N. Lewis, Hyland, Mitchell, Fortune, A. Jones, Lester, Carr
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It funny how Frenderup getting action but salt for Ranjitsingh
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Well I can say for sure, Hyland and Cyrus on the team!
The head coach and Stern will be there too! I saw them all at Miami airport on Tuesday.
I saw a few others too but didn't recognize them...hope this helps, at least we know for sure two who are on the team ;D
Did you tell Cyrus "he's not friggin Lucio"? :devil:
;D ;D ;D ;D...asylum, you quoting me there right?
Anyway, I understand men frustration with Cyrus, I gave up on him years now! And that ball he gave away against Mexico in the center circle the other day, I have never seen anything like that in international football!
When we get a new coach, Cyrus will be thanked for his years of service, plain and simple.
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It funny how Frenderup getting action but salt for Ranjitsingh
Exactly
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It funny how Frenderup getting action but salt for Ranjitsingh
It have to be something went on behind the scenes. I refuse to believe is a footballing decision.
I just hoping is not no foolishness like ‘he does keep to himself’ or some shit.
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WATCH: Highlights of Trinidad and Tobago's 3-0 loss to Ecuador
https://www.youtube.com/v/AVlwKfys4r0
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After the handball penalty, I turned off the game. I don't understand men at this level of profession making mistakes like that. I was watching the U17 world cup the other day, and even those young fellas, tuck their hands behind their backs on crosses like those.
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Look Martinique draw with Honduras 1-1
So add relegation in the Nations league to the admins stellar accomplishments.
Lock hard!
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It funny how Frenderup getting action but salt for Ranjitsingh
It have to be something went on behind the scenes. I refuse to believe is a footballing decision.
I just hoping is not no foolishness like ‘he does keep to himself’ or some shit.
i’m hoping it’s not what i think it might be, and if it is then dennis lawrence really stinks.
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After the handball penalty, I turned off the game. I don't understand men at this level of profession making mistakes like that. I was watching the U17 world cup the other day, and even those young fellas, tuck their hands behind their backs on crosses like those.
the whole defense wreaks of shit. not one of these defenders could make it in the english championship and i’m being gracious, the reality is that i seriously doubt they could cut it in league two. their organization is like a domino house one slight shake and the whole defense collapse.
I’ve seen it vs martinique and honduras where we saw cyrus giving away the ball in midfield with him being the last defender, bateau heading a ball across the goal mouth that was going out for a goal kick, and now the williams hand ball and carlyle mitichell obvious give away try to play midfielder. these lads are not ready for this level,we need a whole new defense and two solid central midfielders.
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So we have another goal keeper who wants to get in on the defensive duty? if this guy wasn’t so eager to leave his line then the two goals from open play could have been averted. why do our keepers love to rush off their line at the slightest sense of danger, why not trust and allow the defenders to handle the attackers and stop trying to play last stopper.
as for cyrus, please guy your are not international material, why not go learn a trade and leave international football alone. please.
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The defence has been weak for years, sorry but that's the reality. We've always had more up-top, perhaps because of how the SSFL slots into our Youth development and mentality.
I won't for the life of me understand picking Mitchell so much. When Yohance Marshall was at his level a couple years ago, and Mitchell was picked despite being unfit, still couldn't understand it. You know I'm biased for Marshall, but he could play ball AND tackle, and never got a consistent try out in favour of Abu Bakr (who imo wasn't agile or quick enough). Bateau has been the only defender to do a job in the past 5 years for me.
Cyrus has always been good technically and had a lot of potential, but the mentality and intelligence are poor for his quality level and this has been a weakness for nearly a decade. Part of this is never playing at the right level - he's stagnated in T&T and never had to develop his game to face opposition. He is truly one person failed by our shitty FIFA ranking, preventing a move to a better country (or more specifically a League One/Two team). O
ur left/right backs have always played as converted wingers, with not enough defensive positioning or tackling to make up for it - Williams has been the only exception, but he's worse as he plays like a converted Centre Back - works well sometimes, but found out too often.
Our players overall have stagnated in the past 5 years and on top of DJW's overwhelming incompetence this has compounded our misery. So many of our players have seen their potential dashed - Woo Ling in Malta? Molino stuck in the US? Joevin Jones stuck in T&T so long? Cyrus only just escaping to Saudi, where training is part time and in the evening (from what I hear from other players in the middle-east)? Guerra nearly 30 before getting a 2nd shot outside? Shannon Gomez stuck in lower leagues in US? Same for Aikim, but Canada? Kadeem Corbin has had 4 clubs in T&T by 23? Jabari Mitchell had a month in Albania?
And what will happen next, where are the Isaiah's heading? JP Rochford is still in the Super League?
Our football is in crisis, not because of the crap results, but because our future. Our youth has no outs, no way to get quality opposition consistently to develop their fitness, intelligence and mentality. Our lack of a proper football league over the past year has made this significantly worse.
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The GK position is a unique role. We all pretty much understand that. But there's one point I want to flesh out a bit.
When a defender or a mid or a fwd hasn't been playing much with his club, typically we accept that, in the scheme of things, competition for inclusion in a squad renders a player with fewer minutes a likely casualty of a coach's axe.
Although ideally in the case of GKs, you would want three GKs who see week-in week-out action at club level, the critical element about the nature of GK psychological preparation is that they are ready to go on the drop of a dime ... upon any change in fortune. Our most emblematic example of this was what happened to Shaka in Germany.
Similarly there are NT keepers who have not been number 1 at their clubs, but are #1 on their NT.
Although GR's role with Orlando has been a secondary one this year, that by itself ought not be enough to remove him from the conversation and contention.
I would note too that playing time with T&T would have transformed GR's marketability at the end of the club season. Now I think he's faced with a delicate balance at club level. It may be along the line of an international roster spot and a similar calculus to what JMW is faced with at Halifax (based on an article I read).
If Foncette is the #2 and he's not in Ecuador, what does it say about Samuel when you bring NF and insert him in the lineup and grant him the start. I'm not sure we've ever had our best three keepers together for a match.
Frankly, I think in the context of responsiveness to a Technical Committee there needs to be a specific component body that comprehensively revamps everything that happens with GKs, their development, selection policy etc. to reduce subjectivity in evaluations and to keep coaches accountable.
Of course, private conversations have occurred but this is an area of concern that is worrisome.
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So we have another goal keeper who wants to get in on the defensive duty? if this guy wasn’t so eager to leave his line then the two goals from open play could have been averted. why do our keepers love to rush off their line at the slightest sense of danger, why not trust and allow the defenders to handle the attackers and stop trying to play last stopper.
as for cyrus, please guy your are not international material, why not go learn a trade and leave international football alone. please.
I disagree. He resolved the two clear situations of danger that could have resulted in a goal (the lobbed ball and the distribution error that was a technical error as well).
The 3 goals were from unforced errors that didn't have much to do with the GK. If anything, NF was playing with perhaps too much confidence in the quality of the defenders around him.
Cyrus ... everything about that 1st goal points to Cyrus ... from the time the entry pass came in.
NF can't be blamed for the penalty.
The 3rd goal is woeful from the defender's misplaced pass etc. ... Mitchell. Nothing about that run of the mill situation of NF making that pass should have led to a goal.
I think NF showed his quality. He brings something to the table.
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The defence has been weak for years, sorry but that's the reality. We've always had more up-top, perhaps because of how the SSFL slots into our Youth development and mentality.
I won't for the life of me understand picking Mitchell so much. When Yohance Marshall was at his level a couple years ago, and Mitchell was picked despite being unfit, still couldn't understand it. You know I'm biased for Marshall, but he could play ball AND tackle, and never got a consistent try out in favour of Abu Bakr (who imo wasn't agile or quick enough). Bateau has been the only defender to do a job in the past 5 years for me.
Cyrus has always been good technically and had a lot of potential, but the mentality and intelligence are poor for his quality level and this has been a weakness for nearly a decade. Part of this is never playing at the right level - he's stagnated in T&T and never had to develop his game to face opposition. He is truly one person failed by our shitty FIFA ranking, preventing a move to a better country (or more specifically a League One/Two team). O
ur left/right backs have always played as converted wingers, with not enough defensive positioning or tackling to make up for it - Williams has been the only exception, but he's worse as he plays like a converted Centre Back - works well sometimes, but found out too often.
Our players overall have stagnated in the past 5 years and on top of DJW's overwhelming incompetence this has compounded our misery. So many of our players have seen their potential dashed - Woo Ling in Malta? Molino stuck in the US? Joevin Jones stuck in T&T so long? Cyrus only just escaping to Saudi, where training is part time and in the evening (from what I hear from other players in the middle-east)? Guerra nearly 30 before getting a 2nd shot outside? Shannon Gomez stuck in lower leagues in US? Same for Aikim, but Canada? Kadeem Corbin has had 4 clubs in T&T by 23? Jabari Mitchell had a month in Albania?
And what will happen next, where are the Isaiah's heading? JP Rochford is still in the Super League?
Our football is in crisis, not because of the crap results, but because our future. Our youth has no outs, no way to get quality opposition consistently to develop their fitness, intelligence and mentality. Our lack of a proper football league over the past year has made this significantly worse.
listen up mate, the poor results we are seeing now is not as a result of the UK shutting their doors in our faces because apart from england the doors are open every where else and these lads have been going and coming like the four seasons with no one sticking in one place for more than two years or so, and that’s every last one of them, so who do we blame?
there is an old biblical saying “you reap what you sow”. for years we had an old man sitting in the seat of power allowing his wealthy influential old man friend to run football and increase his wealth at the expense of football in this country. these old fellows did absolutely nothing for football not even a make shift school to teach the basics to improve the level of play on these twin sister isles, and while other countries like panama honduras jamaica and a few small islands were implementing developmental programs, we were busy counting how many shell cups we’ve won while turning our noses down on other islands like we were as wealthy with talent like brazil.
fast forward two decades later and we are now seeing the fruits of our labor, professional ball players who can’t make a proper 20 yard pass without giving away the ball, players who can’t properly shield a ball from attackers, players who can’t travel comfortably with a ball at their feet save a few ( molino , jovin , hyland), it’s quite obvious that we didn’t produce a good crop, and now these islands have caught up to us and are exposing us for the frauds that we are.
it’s safe to say that our defenders are the absolute worst in league A and B, and all the goals scored in our last 7 games with martinique honduras mexico venezuela and ecuador have all been due to poor silly elementary text book defensive errors, something a foreign coach would send players packing for. ever wondered why none of our guys ever stays anywhere for more than a season and never makes a step up, instead they are relegated to poorer leagues? cato, gomez, kavan george, mikel williams, aubrey david, hyland, cyrus, mitchell, this is no coincidence.
right now our focus should be on developmental programs, let’s forget making a world cup for now and concentrate on winning a gold cup, let’s break down this old house and build an academy, then two more academies, then three more, one in each region with foreign coaches from germany itally spain argentina teaching these children the basic fundamentals of football, something that so many of our home grown professional players lack.
that’s where we need to start, that’s where our focus should remain, it’s our only hope if we are ever to be a proper footballing nation, and money hafi spend and plenty of it too. let’s forget about cyrus and bateau they are the fruits of our labor.....or lack thereof. we need to start over in a big way, a better league and much more developmental programs and plenty money have to spend spend spend.
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We are at the stage now where I feel is time to scratch and start over with u20 and u23 as a nucleus with about d ..with 5-6 of d still useful seniors and bring in Angus Eve or a foreign coach dat have experience with mostly young teams....watch the England game yesterday d average age of dat team is 26 and dem going guns ....Ajax and chelsea average age is 23 doing well....honestly feel dat something brave like dat is needed alongside general targets for improving football at all national levels(slowness and poor basics is an issue at all levels even SSFL) and write off this current period to an extent....I honestly think d TTFA disaster we are forced to endure leaves us with little choice at this stage.
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WATCH: Trinidad and Tobago MNT Head Coach provides post-match comments regarding Trinidad and Tobago's 3-0 loss to Ecuador on November 14, 2019. He mentions the absence of Molino and Jones, unanticipated injuries and medically ruled out players.
https://youtube.com/v/8a9G3Jf8NUc
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So we have another goal keeper who wants to get in on the defensive duty? if this guy wasn’t so eager to leave his line then the two goals from open play could have been averted. why do our keepers love to rush off their line at the slightest sense of danger, why not trust and allow the defenders to handle the attackers and stop trying to play last stopper.
as for cyrus, please guy your are not international material, why not go learn a trade and leave international football alone. please.
I disagree. He resolved the two clear situations of danger that could have resulted in a goal (the lobbed ball and the distribution error that was a technical error as well).
The 3 goals were from unforced errors that didn't have much to do with the GK. If anything, NF was playing with perhaps too much confidence in the quality of the defenders around him.
Cyrus ... everything about that 1st goal points to Cyrus ... from the time the entry pass came in.
NF can't be blamed for the penalty.
The 3rd goal is woeful from the defender's misplaced pass etc. ... Mitchell. Nothing about that run of the mill situation of NF making that pass should have led to a goal.
I think NF showed his quality. He brings something to the table.
never said it was his fault, but those goals were quite savable if he didn’t panic leaving his line on the first goal not getting the ball with an empty net for a tap in, and on the last goal his positioning was awful standing all the way on top the six yard box when he should have been on his line allowing valencia to pass the ball effortlessly in the goal, a very savable goal had the keeper been on his line.
there’s a reason why teams spend big money on certain players, it’s because they are assets to any team. you should pay close attention to navas and zack stefan, those guys understand ball speed and distance to a science, they seldom leave their lines, and when they do 95% of the time they either come up with the ball or disrupts the play.
they allow their defenders to avert the danger before stepping in and act as the last line of defense. you will never see navas more than one foot from his line when there’s attacker in his area, he watches eagerly and is on his toes waiting for the strike but stays close to his goal line. our keepers need to watch and learn from the best, but they seldom seem to learn, it’s very hard to watch.
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So you have to look at it this way..
TTFA does not have the infrastructure in place to develop domestic players (pyramid for development), so players have to look at outside options..
-NCAA- Not a development option, but a showcase option- gets you to USL/MLS
-The Federation have to bleed in more players , the current administration/coaches, does not take chances in the “friendly” games to introduce new players to the set up.
-Have camps (serious ones and not money making schemes) outside of Trinidad to identify new talent
-Proper scouting and not depending on Wyscout to do your work.
- I honestly think forum members like Trini 2018/Flex/Tallman can be very effective scouts, they have been doing it for many years (check the posts) and continue to be ignored..(sad)
-It is a bit of chicken and egg , as agents/established clubs will look at players who have international experience and then our current “selectors” will only look at players who are at a decent club.
When we solve some of these issue, we will start to see a change…right know it is like a re-watching a bad dream every game, with the same folks making the same mistakes, and the same spin in the post game interview-
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Trinidad and Tobago fall 3-0 to Ecuador
TTFA Media
Trinidad and Tobago Men’s Senior team were downed 3-0 by Ecuador in Thursday’s international friendly at the Estadio Reales Tamarindos in Portoviejo.
Goals on either side of the half gave the hosts the win in front of their home fans as T&T head coach Dennis Lawrence used the exercise to fine tune his troops for Sunday’s all important CONCACAF Nations League and Gold Cup qualifier against Honduras in San Pedro Sula.
As it stands, following Martinique’s 1-1 draw with Honduras in Fort-de-France on Thursday, T&T must now carve out a victory to finish in second place in the group and in the process seal a place in the 2021 CONCACAF Gold Cup.
Already facing the setbacks of missing injured players for the Ecuador encounter, T&T traveled to San Pedro Sula on Friday morning with a depleted squad as up to eight players will miss the encounter with a further two doubtful. With Levi Garcia, Mekeil Williams, Leston Paul and Alvin Jones out through suspension, T&T also lost forward Rundell Winchester with a calf injury, Neveal Hackshaw with a torn meniscus and skipper Khaleen Hyland and Aikim Andrews are both doubtful with hamstring injuries while US-based duo Kevin Molino and Joevin Jones chose to make themselves unavailable for both matches after being called up, according to Lawrence.
“That’s football. Football is when you got all these moments and then you got to dig deep and use all your resources. That’s why tonight we tried as best as possible to use the players wisely because I didn’t want to take the risk in some of them getting on the pitch,” Lawrence told TTFA Media after the match.
“Very, very disappointed with the Khaleem one because he was only meant to play 45 minutes and we didn’t even get to 45 minutes. Ataulla had to play longer than I wanted him to play So it’s a bit of a concern…Rundell Winchester coming here and then having the abscess. From an injury front it’s a difficult one but what we just need to do now is roll our sleeves. We need to find a way. Now we need to dig deep. We need to come together and face what is front of us. We have to go out there and give it our best,” Lawrence stressed.
On the field, T&T conceded goals cheaply with 21-year-old debutant Alan Franco slotting past goalkeeper Nicklas Frenderup for the opener in the 29th minute. The Danish-born goalkeeper had a solid showing between the sticks and deserved credit for a couple of impressive stops. Michael Estrada tried to lob him in the 26th but he was up to the task, stretching full length to prevent the ball from entering the net. Ten minutes later he used his legs well to deny Estrada. Seven minutes before Ecuador broke the deadlock, T&T lost Hyland who pulled up with a hamstring strain and was replaced by Ataulla Guerra. Along with Frenderup’s showing, there were promising displays from midfielder Aaron Lester while Alvin Jones and Williams kept things organised at the back alongside Carlyle Mitchell and Daneil Cyrus. Matthew Woo Ling also came off the bench and looked capable in the middle of the park.
Mekeil Williams had an effort for T&T in the second half but Ecuador would keep a clean sheet and added a penalty goal in the 69th from Enner Valencia and he would add his second in the 84th.
“I thought we came up against a very good team. They moved the ball well, technically they are a very, very good team, I was pleased with the way we managed the game technically. I wasn’t pleased with the way we conceded the three goals. I thought they were three very cheap goals, in particular the third one so we need to improve on that.
“It was difficult for our boys. we struggled badly physically tonight, But all in all I think we got something out of the game which was a workout for some of the boys that needed to get some minutes under their belt. And now we just try to recover to get over into Honduras,” Lawrence said.
The squad left for Guayaquil by bus on Thursday night from the match venue to catch a connecting flight to El Salvador en route to Honduras ahead of Sunday’s encounter.
Trinidad and Tobago: 22. Nicklas Frenderup (GK); 5. Daneil Cyrus (vice-captain), 4. Sheldon Bateau 46′), 16. Alvin Jones, 17. Mekeil Williams; 8. Khaleem Hyland (captain) (9. Ataulla Guerra 22), 23. Aaron Lester, 12. Carlyle Mitchell, 7. Nathan Lewis (11. Ryan Telfer 62′), 3. Ross Russell Jr; 14. Daniel Carr (9. Jomoul Francois 60′), 15. Andre Fortune (19. Matthew Woo Ling 79′),
Subs not used: 1. Marvin Phillip (GK), 21. Glenroy Samuel (GK), 2. Aubrey David, 6. Keston Julien, 2. Kevon Goddard, 18. Duane Muckette, 18. Aikim Andrews, 20. Jomal Williams, 10. Marcus Joseph, Rundell Winchester.
Head Coach: Dennis Lawrence
Ecuador: 1. Johan Padilla (GK); 23. Bryan Carabali, 2. Félix Torres, 14. Xavier Arreaga (6. Moises Corozo 73), 3. Diego Palacios; 8. Jhegson Mendez, 21. Alan Franco (24. Jordan Sierra 57′); 5. Renato Ibarra (9. Joao Rojas 66′), 1 7. Romario Ibarra (11. Marcos Caicedo 43′); 19. Michael Estrada (13. Enner Valencia 57), 10. Angel Mena (27. Cabeza 75′),
Subs Not used: 12. Jorge Pinos, 17. Andrés Lopez, 4. Gustavo Cortez, 20. Gonzalo Plata, 15. José Cifuentes, 22. Brian Heras, 26. Leonel Quiñonez,
Head Coach: Jorge Célico
RELATED NEWS
Valencia scores twice as Ecuador whip T&T.
By Joel Bailey (Newsday).
TRINIDAD AND Tobago men’s football team were downed 3-0 by Ecuador in Thursday’s international friendly at the Estadio Reales Tamarindos in Portoviejo.
Goals on either side of the half gave the hosts the win in front of their home fans as T&T coach Dennis Lawrence used the exercise to fine tune his troops for tomorrow’s all-important Concacaf Nations League and Gold Cup qualifier against Honduras in San Pedro Sula.
As it stands, following Martinique’s 1-1 draw with Honduras in Fort-de-France on Thursday, T&T must now carve out a victory to finish in second place in the group and in the process seal a place in the 2021 Concacaf Gold Cup.
Already facing the setbacks of missing injured players for the Ecuador encounter, T&T travelled to San Pedro Sula yesterday morning with a depleted squad as up to eight players will miss the encounter with a further two doubtful. With Levi Garcia, Mekeil Williams, Leston Paul and Alvin Jones out through suspension, TT also lost forward Rundell Winchester with a calf injury, Neveal Hackshaw with a torn meniscus and skipper Khaleen Hyland and Aikim Andrews are both doubtful with hamstring injuries while US-based duo Kevin Molino and Joevin Jones chose to make themselves unavailable for both matches after being called up, according to Lawrence.
T&T conceded goals cheaply with 21-year-old debutant Alan Franco slotting past goalkeeper Nicklas Frenderup for the opener in the 29th minute. The Danish-born goalkeeper had a solid showing between the sticks and deserved credit for a couple of impressive stops. Michael Estrada tried to lob him in the 26th but he was up to the task, stretching full length to prevent the ball from entering the net. Ten minutes later he used his legs well to deny Estrada.
Seven minutes before Ecuador broke the deadlock, T&T lost Hyland who pulled up with a hamstring strain and was replaced by Ataulla Guerra. Along with Frenderup’s showing, there were promising displays from midfielder Aaron Lester while Alvin Jones and Williams kept things organised at the back alongside Carlyle Mitchell and Daneil Cyrus. Matthew Woo Ling also came off the bench and looked capable in the middle of the park.
Mekeil Williams had an effort for T&T in the second half but Ecuador would keep a clean sheet and added a penalty goal in the 69th from Enner Valencia and he would add his second in the 84th.
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Trinidad and Tobago fall 3-0 to Ecuador
TTFA Media
...
“It was difficult for our boys. we struggled badly physically tonight, But all in all I think we got something out of the game which was a workout for some of the boys that needed to get some minutes under their belt. And now we just try to recover to get over into Honduras,” Lawrence said.
The squad left for Guayaquil by bus on Thursday night from the match venue to catch a connecting flight to El Salvador en route to Honduras ahead of Sunday’s encounter.
...
Playing in Portoviejo is going to be a hike. Might have been easier to get to the Galapagos. :P
I hope those 6-7 hours don't prove costly given the compressed calendar! Because the travel time cumulatively will reach into double figures before the players can truly rest before taking to the field on Sunday.
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No wonder Jones and Molino said no - imagine being a professional footballer with proper coaches and accounting for rest time between matches, only to be asked to play 3 games in 9 days in 3 different countries, with almost a day's worth of travel to weaken your body. I 100% don't blame them - T&T have shown in the past too little concern for the fitness of our NT players and threatening your livelihood under a regime that has explicitly stated they are sacrificing results doesn't seem reasonable.
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No wonder Jones and Molino said no - imagine being a professional footballer with proper coaches and accounting for rest time between matches, only to be asked to play 3 games in 9 days in 3 different countries, with almost a day's worth of travel to weaken your body. I 100% don't blame them - T&T have shown in the past too little concern for the fitness of our NT players and threatening your livelihood under a regime that has explicitly stated they are sacrificing results doesn't seem reasonable.
if jones and molino are not injured then that’s bull crap on their part. last night roman torres and Jordan morris played 90 minutes for their country because they understand what was at stake, a gold cup spot and a chance at the hex.
if these players think they’re doing anything to dennis lawrence or DJW then they’re sadly mistaking. lawrence and DJW will go back to what they were doing before the national team, the one would go back to running his football club and the other back to europe probably helping martinez with the Belgian national team, but molino Jones and all the other players will be dormant and locked out of all regional competitive games for the next three years. if they know what’s best for them they better win that game tomorrow.
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We ent winning that game no matter what. We win one game with a asterix for the year. Them fellas read the writing on the wall and say f**k that. The nightmare almost over. Why risk yuh livelihood. I with them.
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We ent winning that game no matter what. We win one game with a asterix for the year. Them fellas read the writing on the wall and say f**k that. The nightmare almost over. Why risk yuh livelihood. I with them.
Players can always mutiny by playing the football they know rather than the brand expected.
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So we have another goal keeper who wants to get in on the defensive duty? if this guy wasn’t so eager to leave his line then the two goals from open play could have been averted. why do our keepers love to rush off their line at the slightest sense of danger, why not trust and allow the defenders to handle the attackers and stop trying to play last stopper.
as for cyrus, please guy your are not international material, why not go learn a trade and leave international football alone. please.
pull stones, a lot of your comments shows your total frustrations. Not to say we are not all frustrated You blaming the keeper again. You think Glenroy or Foncette could have done any better ? Again our already shakey defense is always prone to the odd mistake. I am being generous. What are our mid-field and attacking players doing? I saw one shot at their keeper. To be honest, I am so glad our keeper got his first game. It could have been 5-0.
While I am leaning on removing Dennis, I understand the frustration he is going thru having to deal with this bunch of dejected players. These guys are professionals. Even if they playing in a far away countries. They are pros. This group just not ready. If we have another coach, I can't see much change, unless we get about 5 or 6 players out of the blue.
How on earth can DL get these guys to play like 15 yrs ago in 5 day periods when we have international games? He should have had a good rapport with them by now. He has had enough time. He should be communicating with them about they improving on their skills when they are with their clubs. There is very little he could do other than encouragement and tactics when they come home for internationals. How can he teach proper passing, heading and first touch at this stage in their professional lives? That is for U-19 and below. U-20 and above they should be ready. They eh ready. They just not ready.
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Deeks this team with many of the same players were playing a lot better previously. We've regressed over the past few years. This is DL's first gig as a head coach and it shows.
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Deeks this team with many of the same players were playing a lot better previously. We've regressed over the past few years. This is DL's first gig as a head coach and it shows.
I agree to a point. I still feel the senior men with the experience during Hart tenure should be carrying this team on their back. If they dejected, doh play. Watching these guys going thru the motion is not a nice thing to watch.
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asylumseeker, is this Ecuador side anything close to their frist team?
Somewhat, yes in terms of recognized and ready talent (but there arguably are some established players who could still command a place in the squad (for example Felipe Caicedo if he was inclined ) and others who could be progressed from the U23s that are currently prepping for South America's Olympic qualifiers (under the same coach)). Also there are a couple talented young players already in Europe who have been left to grow a bit (for instance the first player Ronaldo acquired at Valladolid, a player named Stiven Plaza).
That stated, this coach sees his role as one of highlighting players who are knocking on the door insistently and others who have been overlooked in recent cycles under recent coaches Quinteros and Gomez. This coach is also tacitly interested in the job, but by taking this approach he is also covering his ass a bit, especially not wanting a repeat of the 6-1 he suffered vs Argentina. There isn't much significant sentiment in his favor though, despite his undeniable success at U20 level (WC bronze medallists).
If Jose Pékerman takes the job, he will have a different elaboration of a 23-man squad, but many of these players would automatically be initial contenders.
Other consideration: 4 players went back to their club squads because their clubs are in a cup final on Saturday and there was constant pressure on the federation and caretaker coach to ignore it being a FIFA date.
Finally, Independiente del Valle (just won the Sudamericana) is stacked with young homegrown talent and only 2 players from that club are in this squad ... So the theme I discussed this morning was that the process of "recambio' in Ecuador contrasts with our retention of older players, although the randomized selection of Woo Ling and Lewis call for acknowledgement of recognizing that DL either sees it or is hitting in the dark.
Last thing, if you look at the GKs for Ecuador ... all are playing locally and they have an average age of 26 ... all are under 30. So in this sense it is good to see Frenderup on the pitch. And the questions raised about what Glenroy Samuel should be doing linger. So position by position although the Ecuador squad is anything but settled, many of the players selected are consensus NT material.
Here's a graphical comparison of Ecuador's pre-Copa America provisional list (40 players) with the squad that faced us on 11/14 (27 players).
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6zFFJpWkAA96Ba?format=jpg&name=small)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIyv-NIXUAEwcks?format=jpg&name=small)
Goalkeepers
Johan Padilla (Nacional)
Pedro Ortiz (Delfín)
Brian Heras (Dep. Cuenca)
Defenders
Andrés López (U. Católica)
Bryan Carabalí (Emelec)
Félix Torres (Santos Laguna, MEX)
Xavier Arreaga (Seattle Sounders, USA)
Moisés Corozo (Macará)
Franklin Guerra (Liga de Quito)
Midfielders
Diego Palacios (Los Ángeles FC, USA)
Gustavo Cortez (U. Católica)
Leonel Quiñónez (Macará)
Gonzalo Plata (Sporting Lisbon, POR)
Renato Ibarra (América, MEX)
Pedro Perlaza (Delfín)
Romario Ibarra (Pachuca, MEX)
Marcos Caicedo (BSC)
José Cifuentes (América de Quito)
Jhegson Méndez (Orlando City, USA)
Jefferson Orejuela (Liga de Quito ←Fluminense, BRA)
Alan Franco (IDV)
Ángel Mena (León, MEX)
Jordan Sierra (Querétaro, MEX)
Forwards
Fidel Martínez (BSC)
Michael Estrada (Macará)
Enner Valencia (Tigres, MEX)
Alejandro Cabeza (IDV)
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Whatever happened to the post-match press conference of DL with the Ecuadorian media? We saw a video of DL speaking to Fuentes separately, but what did he say in the official post-match comments?
Did they ask him about Jones and Molino? Did they ask him about the tactical orientation of the match? Did he tell them the same things he told us by way of explanation?
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No wonder Jones and Molino said no - imagine being a professional footballer with proper coaches and accounting for rest time between matches, only to be asked to play 3 games in 9 days in 3 different countries, with almost a day's worth of travel to weaken your body. I 100% don't blame them - T&T have shown in the past too little concern for the fitness of our NT players and threatening your livelihood under a regime that has explicitly stated they are sacrificing results doesn't seem reasonable.
if jones and molino are not injured then that’s bull crap on their part. last night roman torres and Jordan morris played 90 minutes for their country because they understand what was at stake, a gold cup spot and a chance at the hex.
if these players think they’re doing anything to dennis lawrence or DJW then they’re sadly mistaking. lawrence and DJW will go back to what they were doing before the national team, the one would go back to running his football club and the other back to europe probably helping martinez with the Belgian national team, but molino Jones and all the other players will be dormant and locked out of all regional competitive games for the next three years. if they know what’s best for them they better win that game tomorrow.
Lets say Trinidad asks you to haul your ass to do your exact job, but for the country, for a 5 day period, but with less professional management and with people you don't know. It's riskier and involved a whole day's travel, and they're not going to pay you for it (match fees unpaid). When you turn up, despite being one of the better (insert your job here), you're likely to just sit there and watch other people cock up the job you're better at. Worse still, you're competing against another country who are run better, paid better, and have professional management. Oh and if you get injured and need time off work, they slap you on the back, put you on a plane, and say "so long and thanks for all the fish" whilst you take a serious cut to your pay check (none of which is covered) and potentially get let go in a couple months.
There's love of country, but that needs to be reciprocal and needs to be respected. These people often have families they are supporting in a job that ends before 35. Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
bull. International football is not a money making venture its a labor of love. no player goes to play for his country expecting a paycheck. taylor twellman said it best when the usa lossed to us and the players were complaining about field conditions he said, Belgium played Bosnia in a cow pasture and grinned out a win, there’s no excuse for not giving your all for your country, it’s about national pride.
When a player gets called up for his country on an international date his club is obligated to take care of the player in the event of an injury, that player is also supposed to be insured by his federation and club in the event of a career ending injury. under fifa rules no federation is obligated to nurse a player back to health or take on personal responsibility of any player, neither can any club barr any player from representing his nation on a fifa sanctioned date.
when you look at jamaica, mexico, costa rica, honduras and the usa their fans come out even if they’re playing a low ranking team. their stands are full to capacity the teli has the game on tap and the players are brimming with pride and you see it when the anthem is played the passion and the commitment is evident.
these people play for their country and their fans are aware of it, maybe that’s why their stands are full and not ours, because us as fans are not aware of any such commitment on the part of these saga boys masquerading as footballers.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
bull. International football is not a mo ey making venture its a labor of love.
It is both. And it has to be both in the era of professional football. It is romantic to think of it in any other terms. The 2006 13 would disagree with you.
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Lets say Trinidad asks you to haul your ass to do your exact job, but for the country, for a 5 day period, but with less professional management and with people you don't know. It's riskier and involved a whole day's travel, and they're not going to pay you for it (match fees unpaid). When you turn up, despite being one of the better (insert your job here), you're likely to just sit there and watch other people cock up the job you're better at. Worse still, you're competing against another country who are run better, paid better, and have professional management. Oh and if you get injured and need time off work, they slap you on the back, put you on a plane, and say "so long and thanks for all the fish" whilst you take a serious cut to your pay check (none of which is covered) and potentially get let go in a couple months.
There's love of country, but that needs to be reciprocal and needs to be respected. These people often have families they are supporting in a job that ends before 35. Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
There are two constituent groups that need to get their act together in T&T: players and coaches. Both groups are captured and will be unable to effect the most efficient outcomes unless they have a higher degree of organized and sensible solidarity as distinct groups.
If the players only avenue is to treat each percolating matter as a hostage crisis negotiation then they are only treating each individual symptom and not the roots ... but say what, domestic and pro football in T&T is football in name only ... for now. And now has been a long time.
The coaches are opportunists.
The players are the one group that can make a lot of our problems go away, but they need to understand their power.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
bull. International football is not a mo ey making venture its a labor of love.
It is both. And it has to be both in the era of professional football. It is romantic to think of it in any other terms. The 2006 13 would disagree with you.
mate I don’t care what nobody says, I know for a fact that jovin and Kevin’s absence last night was a coup d’etat and no one could convince me otherwise. it was also done to Steven hart and maybe contro had it wrong all along when the sabotage could have been coming from the players themselves and not the president.
jovin wanted us to lose and maybe so did the whole bloody team, did you see anything so bizarre, a whole team full of absentees? what’s bothering me is that they should have known that by the next game dennis should and probably would not have a job, so why risk it?
I’ve been asking myself why after such good performances did we allow teams we normally beat easily to toss us aside like lettuce, grenada st vincent guyana when we were beating panama guatemala and el salvadore. Steven hart was losing his shirt in his last several outings and the players looked disinterested, I think these players either hated hart’s no nonsense cut and dry disciplined approach or they didn’t want to play for DJW and decided to sobotage him, time will tell all. I anxiously await the conclusion.
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Man still talking 'labor of love' in 2019?
You think Aguero leaving Man City breakroom to go Kosovo for free? You think Harry Kane dem ain't negotiating how much money in their pocket? Or the terms of what happens if they get hurt?
'Labor of love' is guilt tactics so you could continue to oppress people and use their bodies without reciprocity.
We reach here because of all that, 'Ease we up, nah. Oh gosh, give a bligh,' ass foolishness we does allow.
Come correct or doh come. Until that mindset is ingrained, we in trouble.
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Man still talking 'labor of love' in 2019?
You think Aguero leaving Man City breakroom to go Kosovo for free? You think Harry Kane dem ain't negotiating how much money in their pocket? Or the terms of what happens if they get hurt?
'Labor of love' is guilt tactics so you could continue to oppress people and use their bodies without reciprocity.
We reach here because of all that, 'Ease we up, nah. Oh gosh, give a bligh,' ass foolishness we does allow.
Come correct or doh come. Until that mindset is ingrained, we in trouble.
harry Kane? I don’t know who you know but I was fortunate to be friends with a class mate who played in the english first division and went on to play in the premiership. before he went on to play professionally we would talk about being called up for the lions, and let me tell you this, every english footballer’s dream is to be an international player. I know players who would give their right arm just to be capped for england including my former class mate.
I understand what you’re saying but Kane and company don’t need that money as much as they want to be capped and doubt if any english player or even irish or Scottish would have left their country in the lurch like Kevin an$ jovin did last night.
yes all the things that you underline are very important I will agree, but Jesus christ man jovin and them knew what they were gettin themselves into when they signed up to play international football and they had the option to abstain like bostock, zamora, innis , j loyd samuel and many more who blanked the federation. the thing is why now when your country really need you, what bloody fans would pay their money to see players who wont play for love of country and would not take one for the team? but that’s just my opinion and I could be very very wrong.
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pull stones, no one likes to work when he or she is not happy or not feeling fulfilled. A footballer is no different. In fact if yuh head is not in the game it literally shows.
Also, there's a big difference to dreaming about being capped and having been capped over 70 times ... at that stage the analysis is different.
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pull stones, no one likes to work when he or she is not happy or not feeling fulfilled. A footballer is no different. In fact if yuh head is not in the game it literally shows.
Also, there's a big difference to dreaming about being capped and having been capped over 70 times ... at that stage the analysis is different.
yes I agree, but my point is that they have done this before. do you remember when we went to the gold cup for the first time in 4 years and hart was a new coach,they knowing fully well that the federation was strapped for cash yet they threatened to boycot the games if they weren’t paid back wages? timkee had to scramble to get the government to help pay to avert a crisis.
then when DJW took over they boycotted again......I think it was just before the Guatemala game, the last game to berth a spot in the hex lead by jan Micheal Williams , DJW had to find money to pay them. these players are not angels and I saw that with hart how they deliberately let him down lead by molino, IMO.
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Well I can say for sure, Hyland and Cyrus on the team!
The head coach and Stern will be there too! I saw them all at Miami airport on Tuesday.
I saw a few others too but didn't recognize them...hope this helps, at least we know for sure two who are on the team ;D
Did you tell Cyrus "he's not friggin Lucio"? :devil:
;D ;D ;D ;D...asylum, you quoting me there right?
Anyway, I understand men frustration with Cyrus, I gave up on him years now! And that ball he gave away against Mexico in the center circle the other day, I have never seen anything like that in international football!
When we get a new coach, Cyrus will be thanked for his years of service, plain and simple.
Of course! That was some funny shizzle. :rotfl:
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This morning I had the pleasure of contextualizing the match on Ecuadorian radio in Q & A for the audience of one of Ecuador's most respected voices on football. The segment lasted about 15 minutes. I'll try to source the segment.
About to post content that reflects in part what what was discussed and that was provided in written form elsewhere.
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Chambi Sey: Preparándose para matar un tiburón con un pececillo, el caso dudoso de Trinidad y Tobago
Trinidad y Tobago llega a Ecuador finalmente logrando su primera victoria en 15 partidos, una semana antes del saque de salida en Portoviejo y catorce meses después de derrotar a los Emiratos Árabes Unidos por dos goles a cero, en un encuentro esencialmente jugado a puertas cerradas en España. El logro fue cumplido mediante la programación conveniente de Anguila, el equipo de más bajo ranking de todas las 209 asociaciones miembros de la FIFA. Aparte de países rivales de dentro la CONCACAF, durante el transcurso de la sequía de derrotas y empates, los oponentes no CONCACAF que Trinidad y Tobago han enfrentado son Tailandia, Irán, Gales, Japón y Venezuela. Ecuador será el cuarto oponente de fuera de CONCACAF que encara Trinidad y Tobago en 2019 y de manera optimista solo el segundo país en esta categoría que Trinidad y Tobago derrotaría durante el mandato de este cuerpo técnico y sus 28 partidos.
Anguila es una pequeña dependencia británica, delimitada por el Océano Atlántico Norte, enclavada en el Caribe al este de Puerto Rico. Su territorio es de 91 kilómetros cuadrados y la isla tiene una población de menos de 19,000 habitantes. En el rango de edad de 15 a 24 años, Anguila tiene una población masculina de 1500 personas. Esta estadística proporciona una indicación refinada de la poca base de jugadores disponibles a Anguilla y del absurdo de la propuesta inicial. A pesar de haber tenido ocasionalmente algunos elementos de las ligas inferiores ingleses, la selección anguilana no cuenta verdaderamente con jugadores que puedan ganarse la vida con el fútbol.
Antes del encuentro los Soca Warriors eran dueños de un récord, poco favorecedor, de una victoria, nueve derrotas y cuatro empates y la única noción de paridad y coincidencia futbolística entre los dos equipos eran que ambos no habían ganado un partido durante 2019. Anguila presentó un equipo muy inexperto cuya mejor actuación fue una derrota por tres a dos ante Puerto Rico, pero misteriosamente Trinidad y Tobago nombró un conjunto de titulares con experiencia internacional creíble, sin pensar ampliamente en la próxima generación de seleccionados nacionales. Quede claro que el cuerpo técnico se preocupó más por eliminar la mancha del registro estadístico poco halagador a toda costa y se comprometió lograr un ritmo de juego entre el núcleo de jugadores establecidos para poder ubicar algún vestigio de beneficio psicológico después de una mala racha, pero, de manera realista, el partido hubiera sido más adecuado como un partido de exhibición de pretemporada que para las condiciones a la víspera de un compromiso serio de hacer o morir.
Desde la última vez que las selecciones ecuatorianas y trinitenses se enfrentaron en julio de 2017, si bien el fútbol ecuatoriano a nivel de la selección nacional ha experimentado cambios fundamentales y la estructura de gestión y el modelo de negocio del fútbol profesional ecuatoriano ha transformado radicalmente, el panorama del fútbol élite en Trinidad y Tobago ha sido estático y paralizante y ha quedado frustrado sin cambio radical, por no haber logrado un consenso entre los principales interesados, para superar los impases polémicos o para implementar las recomendaciones de un grupo experto de la UEFA sobre cómo consolidar y mejorar las operaciones de fútbol en el país.
Por el contrario, mientras que Javier Tebas, el jefe de La Liga, entre otras personas, ha aplaudido la visionaria toma de decisiones y el liderazgo de la LigaPro y la federación ecuatoriana con presagios para futuros impactos positivos a los clubes y la selección nacional, la liga profesional de Trinidad y Tobago ha estado plagada de inercias y obstáculos financieros que han resultado en la interrupción operacional de partidos profesionales desde diciembre del año pasado. Aunque hasta cierto punto los desafíos del fútbol profesional trinitense han influido en la falta de coherencia de juego de la selección nacional, la mayoría de los jugadores relevantes están empleados fuera de Trinidad y Tobago. Así que, los resultados de rendimiento del equipo se explican mejor por las deficiencias tácticas en el enfoque de juego, las consecuencias psicológicas de ese enfoque estilístico y las brechas físicas, fisiológicas y técnicas a nivel individual y colectivo.
Si bien solo hay dos futbolistas de nacionalidad ecuatoriana en la USL, la segunda división de fútbol profesional en los Estados Unidos, hay diecisiete jugadores trinitarios que representaron clubes de la misma liga durante la presente campaña. Si bien es poco probable que incluso los fanáticos más ardientes del fútbol ecuatoriano conozcan los nombres de los jugadores ecuatorianos de la USL, los jugadores trinitenses no son productos desconocidos respecto a su importancia para llenar la lista de selección nacional de Trinidad y Tobago. Esta distorsión también resalta las distintas circunstancias de las dos selecciones nacionales y cómo se espera que los equipos se desempeñen en competencia entre ellos.
Antes de la victoria de Trinidad y Tobago frente a los Estados Unidos que negó el paso de los estadounidenses a la Copa Mundial de Rusia 2018, habían varios jugadores en la MLS. En 2017 hubo seis jugadores reconocidos de Trinidad y Tobago en la MLS, cinco de los cuales se presentaron regularmente para la selección trinitense durante aquel período. Desde entonces, tres de los seis jugadores han bajado a la división inferior y otro, Kenwyne Jones, un trasplante destacado de la liga Premier de Inglaterra, se ha retirado. En 2019 hay ocho jugadores afiliados a clubes de la MLS que son elegibles para vestirse la camiseta de Trinidad y Tobago, pero dos de esos jugadores están prestados a equipos de la segunda división estadounidense y cuatro de ellos aún no se han debutado a nivel de la selección nacional. En contraste, hay cinco ecuatorianos en las listas de equipos de la MLS y tres de ellos han sido seleccionados para los próximos amistosos contra Trinidad y Tobago y Colombia. A comparar, para razones que no son claras, no hay jugadores trinitenses de la MLS incluidos dentro el plantel de Trinidad y Tobago que enfrentará Ecuador.
El partido de esta noche es una reunión entre dos entrenadores, uno de los cuales realmente está al comienzo de un proceso experimental y de recambio con su selección nacional, y otro que, a pesar de estar al frente de la selección hace casi tres años, todavía se presenta como si estuviera encerrado en un proceso experimental, no obstante haber aprovechado una retórica de planificación a largo plazo. También es una pelea entre un entrenador que desea presentar a su afición una mejor actuación que la derrota por 6-1 ante Argentina y otro entrenador que fabricó una destrucción 15-0 del equipo de menor rango de la FIFA aparentemente para explorar patrones de juego y la ejecución fiel de sus instrucciones, a pesar de encarar el adversario más débil posible cuando realmente fue para sentar las bases de una nueva plataforma psicológica, esperando que permitiera a sus cargos visualizar y enmarcar goles frente a Ecuador y Honduras. Nosotros suponemos que si nada ha funcionado, use lo que pueda funcionar, incluso si es fantasía.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
bull. International football is not a money making venture its a labor of love. no player goes to play for his country expecting a paycheck. taylor twellman said it best when the usa lossed to us and the players were complaining about field conditions he said, Belgium played Bosnia in a cow pasture and grinned out a win, there’s no excuse for not giving your all for your country, it’s about national pride...
I get you Pull Stones and I understand your point - given your other post you perhaps understand my view point give I'm an Englishman myself. However, over time, having been in the working world for too long now, I find it incredulous that players are being asked to risk their only source of income, short as it is anyway, to play half-way across the world with no protection. Is it right we ask these players to risk their whole careers, their safety and security in middle and old age, for their country, when the TTFA doesn't insure them against injury and doesn't take adequate provision for their care.
You can be proud of your country and love the game, and still reach the conclusion that playing internationally simply isn't the right thing to do. When I was a kid I couldn't understand anyone not wanting to play for their country, but as someone with a family, debt, life insurance and planning for a pension to ensure my family are well cared for for the duration of their lives, whether I'm around or not, I can definitely see why such a risk wouldn't be worth taking.
Look at the example I gave you - not sure what field you work in but would you do all that for Trinidad right now? Especially if DJW was in control of the operation?
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Preparing to kill a shark with kettle fish, unfortunately that's the reality of how the rest of the world outside of CFU views us.
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Given the disgraceful management by the TTFA, I'm both shocked and awed by any player who will still put a shirt on for us, and certainly don't hold it against those who don't.
Could not agree with this statement more.
bull. International football is not a money making venture its a labor of love. no player goes to play for his country expecting a paycheck. taylor twellman said it best when the usa lossed to us and the players were complaining about field conditions he said, Belgium played Bosnia in a cow pasture and grinned out a win, there’s no excuse for not giving your all for your country, it’s about national pride...
I get you Pull Stones and I understand your point - given your other post you perhaps understand my view point give I'm an Englishman myself. However, over time, having been in the working world for too long now, I find it incredulous that players are being asked to risk their only source of income, short as it is anyway, to play half-way across the world with no protection. Is it right we ask these players to risk their whole careers, their safety and security in middle and old age, for their country, when the TTFA doesn't insure them against injury and doesn't take adequate provision for their care.
You can be proud of your country and love the game, and still reach the conclusion that playing internationally simply isn't the right thing to do. When I was a kid I couldn't understand anyone not wanting to play for their country, but as someone with a family, debt, life insurance and planning for a pension to ensure my family are well cared for for the duration of their lives, whether I'm around or not, I can definitely see why such a risk wouldn't be worth taking.
Look at the example I gave you - not sure what field you work in but would you do all that for Trinidad right now? Especially if DJW was in control of the operation?
listen up mate. if jovin had blanked the federation on account he didn’t feel protected by the them or their needs weren’t taken into consideration or for lack of financial gratification or physical well being I would say kudos to you lad it’s your basic right and in this day and age of football he would be in order and I would support him in that regard, but none of what I described was the catalyst for his omission.
his discontentment was based on his treatment and lack of consideration by the manager. don’t you think jovin knows that it is highly possible that DJW more than likely will lose the election and lawrence would be soon out of a job and out of the way? remember William Wallace was the team manager during hart’s tenure and the players all know him and from what I’ve been hearing he’s a favorite among men and has the ears of the players, dont you think those men aren’t in touch with each other?
my view is that jovin did what he did last night as a last attempt to stick it to dennis for the way he was mishandled, it was revenge served very cold. he didn’t stop for one second to consider the damage it would have done to the country’s chances of losing out on the gold cup and World Cup hex, that never occurred to him, it was all about jovin and how he felt.
do you remember when we were trying to get into the gold cup and we had to play haiti and surename? Tom sanfiet was the coach and hart was recently fired, jovin and bateau organized a game where carenage played st anns, it was the very weekend we played with a C team and lost to surename and haiti while the coach had to scramble for players throughout the length and breath of trinidad while these guys made themselves unavailable.
what about when Cummings was injured in the shooting and we needed all the help we could musta it was going into the copa america centenario and jovin excused himself only to be seen on a jet ski liming in the middle of the sea by a member who was on a party boat and happened to see him.
what about over the years while jovin was playing for oto fister and Steven hart he also would be playing minor league football in carenage and if i’m mistaking that played a role in getting him dismissed from the team by oto fister both him and guerra, that and turning up late for practice and not showing up sometimes at all. hart also took offense to jovin’s minor league escapades and so did raymond timkee who spoke to him about his conduct.
and there was cordel cato showing up for camp late with his woman in tow and having an attitude in the dressing room, the Lester peltier shananigans, molino and his boat rides, him and mikel Williams and the list goes on. like i said, these guys are no angels i will be very careful how i defend them. I don’t care who disagrees with me, but what him and molino did last night was vengeful to the tenth degree, and now dennis will be on his way to europe the fat boss back to connection and there’s no football for we until after 2022, and that’s jacked up and spiteful on so many levels.
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I am old enough to see a certain pattern in our football that causes some players to diss the TTFA. This has been going on for years. While some of the players could be blamed, the lion share of culpability lies with the TTFA. Here is a list of events of the past.
1969 Concacaf tournament in CR. Players rebelled because of the accommodation and the food. On the return, some players were banned. But the most notable person on the list was the trainer, Trevor Smith, aka, "Burnt Boots", the sport writer. He got a permanent ban. He and his Havard
crew ceremoniously burnt his boots at the Roxy roundabout and buried them in the Lapyrouse cemetery.
1971:Prior to the Concacaf tournament which was held in TT that year, TT play Ven. about 3 games here. TT destroyed the Venzuelans in the 3 games. Apparently the Vens. thought TT was a walkover and they sent their university national team. TT had no pros for this goodwill tour.
So the Vens. invite TT to come Ven and play in a return goodwill tour. This time the Vens used pros from their league. TT was all amateurs. TT lost all 2 or 3 games. Then and there the bachannal started. The players strike for money. Some claimed that when they go on tour they do not get pay from their jobs and that the TTFA should compensate them. TTFA ban them and decided that they would use some of the school boys on the the team for the upcoming Concacaf tournament in TT. They brought in Spann, Peter Mitchell and some I can't remember off hand. Eventually they had a settlement. One player refused. That was Jimmy Springer from Maple, possibly the best mid fielder in TT at the time. He was a stand your ground kind of man. He never played first class or international again. He went on a self imposed exile. He died a couple years ago.
When the Concacaf tournament came around, all the pros in the NASL did not make themselves available. DeLeon, Archibald,Selris Figaro and I think Jan Steadman(not sure) refused the compensation that the TTFA offered. Gally did not play because he was injured. Suffice to say we did not perform well in our home field. We did not perform well at all.
1973: The Concacaf tournament was being held in Haiti. It doubled as the WC qualification for Germany 1974. The TTFA had elected Ken Galt who had a high position in Neal and Massy. He played for TT in the pre independence days. He had a strong passion for the game. They settled their differences with some of the players. With his connection, Mr. Galt brought in some much needed cash for the association. Archibald, Figaro and Gally Cummings agreed to go. Deleon refused and also Sammy LLewellyn(who was the up and coming forward refused). He worked on the port, and that was close to Christmas, and that is when the port is extra busy. Plenty OT.
I must agree the TTFA under Galt did a great job in preparing the team. They brought in Ken Verity from England on short notice and they almost performed a miracle in Haiti. After performing so badly in the tournament at home to almost going to Germany.
So allyuh see this is nothing new to TT football.
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
Springer went QRC
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
Springer went QRC
Ok thanks TM. I felt like Trinity had a Springer as well, he was a former player then coach in the 80's I think.
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
Springer went QRC
Ok thanks TM. I felt like Trinity had a Springer as well, he was a former player then coach in the 80's I think.
Yeah, Jimmy went QRC in the early 60s. Was a very good player. I think he was good enough to make it England or US after seeing him play against Chelsea in the Oval and listening on radio when TT played Southampton at Skinner’s Park. The Springer that went Trinity could have been related especially if he was from Tunapuna.
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
Springer went QRC
Ok thanks TM. I felt like Trinity had a Springer as well, he was a former player then coach in the 80's I think.
Yeah, Jimmy went QRC in the early 60s. Was a very good player. I think he was good enough to make it England or US after seeing him play against Chelsea in the Oval and listening on radio when TT played Southampton at Skinner’s Park. The Springer that went Trinity could have been related especially if he was from Tunapuna.
Deeks you must be a prophet, the guy I'm thinking about I believe his name is Vernon Skinner and not Springer and he played in the 70's.
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Deeks did Jimmy Springer from Maple play for Trinity College as well?
Springer went QRC
Ok thanks TM. I felt like Trinity had a Springer as well, he was a former player then coach in the 80's I think.
Yeah, Jimmy went QRC in the early 60s. Was a very good player. I think he was good enough to make it England or US after seeing him play against Chelsea in the Oval and listening on radio when TT played Southampton at Skinner’s Park. The Springer that went Trinity could have been related especially if he was from Tunapuna.
Deeks you must be a prophet, the guy I'm thinking about I believe his name is Vernon Skinner and not Springer and he played in the 70's.
Ok Veron Skinner. I know him. He was after my time. Never seen him play in TT. Saw him play in NY a number times. Pretty good player. So many good players go by the wayside and left the game in frustration. And there is the very sad case of Bert Neptune. RIP.