Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum

Sports => Football => Topic started by: AB.Trini on April 16, 2005, 05:08:12 PM

Title: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: AB.Trini on April 16, 2005, 05:08:12 PM
Three Caribbean players, Trinidad and Tobago's

Leslie Fitzpatrick and Marlon Rojas

Jamaican Wolde Harris, are set to appear in today's US Major League Soccer (MLS) clash between Real Salt Lake (RSL) City and the Colorado Rapids.

 
Caribbean players are also appearing at Giants Stadium in New Jersey - where the Kansas City Wizards, with Jamaicans Khari Stephenson and Shavar Thomas and Trinidadian Scott Sealy, tackle the MetroStars - and at The Home Depot Centre where Vincentian Ezra Hendrickson's Chivas USA meet FC Dallas, who have Trinidadian Cornell Glen on their roster.



I would think that this  league would assist with our player development as the style of play is very reminiscent of the CONCACAF region.

Note to Jack & investors: what is the feasability of  stacking a side in the MLS with trinis? dat could be the base for our national team:  Think 2010. WCQ.
 Just to make Winnipeg fury happy, we could stack one in Canada too.
Title: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Bally on April 16, 2005, 05:50:11 PM
The MLS is not the best place for T&T players my reasoning for this is simple the MLS have a limit on foreign players so at any time if the team can sign a player from a more recognize league they will drop the Trini player because face it they have no respect for our players two they don’t pay enough and with the way they trade players you mite be playing for a different team every year just look at Jamaicans Andy Williams he has been trade to almost every team in the league.       
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Winnipeg Fury on April 16, 2005, 06:17:55 PM
Agreed completely.

On top of that, they want to cater to specific ethnic groups in the US, and I don't think T&T is one of them (Canada in the same boat).

And you are right about the money.  They pay peanuts compared to second tier Euro leagues.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: dcs on April 16, 2005, 07:41:06 PM
What about the standard of play?
Would Rahim be better off bouncing around MLS teams(and at least playing) rather than benching for Falkirk?

I'd say most of T&T's players who have been there have done ok.  A few didn't really do too well but we have a better success rate in the MLS for our players.  And I thought the cap on number of Int'l players would help us cuz they won't want to sign you just to be a squad player.
Cornell in a different situation...Dallas have the hottest frontline in the league right now and I don't think they knew about Ruiz before they signed Glenn.

One thing I would be interested in finding out about is the comparative benefits as per player development.  I trust the Yanks more as I think they have more to gain by developing our players once they sign them whereas in the UK they might shelve you if they lose interest or change the manager.  I've also noticed that both Brian Haynes and Ancil Elcock have had some involvement with their clubs even after they stopped playing (coaching etc)...not too sure about the details but if the MLS is sustainable I think it may have alot to offer Caribbean players.

Also, there was a Trini RHYTHM SECTION at the New England Revolution's home game against the Crew and it was some sweet iron dey was playing.  I cud tell you Shalrie Joseph from Grenada is definitely a fan favourite.  With the abundance of raw talent in the Caribbean and the close ties with the US with our players already in their College Ranks I believe the MLS teams are well aware the Caribbean can add value to their football.  Whether we should send our best there or to the UK is another story but the MLS have plenty to offer.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: jusme on April 17, 2005, 07:56:14 PM
I see that this thread has virtually the same topic as another one.  I am posting here instead of there because there are a few replies here already.

Anyhow: the MLS is a great place for T&T players.

1) there are limits on foreign players everywhere, especially since we are not members of the European union.

2) MLS teams play a good quality of football.  I am not going to say that the MLS winners could beat the top european teams, but in my opinion I think it's reasonable to say that the MLS teams would be competitive with the teams in the bottom half of the Premiership, Primera Liga etc.  I remember watching the San Jose Earthquakes beat Sporting Lisbon (a good team in a medium level euro league) 4 -1 sometime last year.  Other evidence for the quality of MLS football is the fact that a team built around then-MLS players made it to the quarterfinals of the last world cup, eventually losing to Germany. 

The MLS is superior to our local league in that we have 2 good teams and some decent teams.  The MLS has a lot more parity.  There are no whipping-boys and level of competition is near constant throughout the MLS season.  Also most of our current crop of players in Europe (and now 1 in Japan) are not even playing in the top level leagues in those countries.  Case in point: Carlos Edwards, one of our star players and a player of undisputed ability, is playing in the third division of English football, and fighting relegation to boot.

3) The MLS is close to us geographically and their season is similar to ours as far as time of year is concerned.  This should make it easier for us to incorporate MLS-based players into whatever ongoing national team plans we have.   
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Savannah boy on April 18, 2005, 10:49:14 PM
Wha wrong wit dat Rhythm Section, dey ketch ah vaps or wha?
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Bally on April 19, 2005, 02:56:27 PM
I repeat the MLS is not the best place for players name three players from Trinidad to have a successful career in the MLS. If the players want to play close to home I suggest they play in the Mexican league. I’m not saying the MLS is a bad league by no means it’s a bad league but its not the best place for our players no matter how good Cornel Glen is he will keep getting traded maybe last for two seasons at best look at how much players from T&T PLAYED IN THE MLS where have there career end up.     
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Tallman on April 19, 2005, 03:28:38 PM
Here is a list of past and present MLS players:

PlayerTeam
Kevin AdamsColumbus Crew
Craig DemminTampa Bay Mutiny
Ancil ElcockColumbus Crew
Leslie FitzpatrickReal Salt Lake
Gary GlasgowKansas City Wizards
Cornell GlenNY/NJ Metrostars, FC Dallas
Brian HaynesDallas Burn
Avery JohnNew England Revolution
Stern JohnColumbus Crew
Travis MulraineSan Jose Earthquakes
David NakhidNew England Revolution
Adrian NarineSan Jose Earthquakes
Marlon RojasReal Salt Lake
Scott SealyKansas City Wizards
Keyeno ThomasColorado Rapids
Rick TitusColorado Rapids
Mickey Trotman (RIP)Dallas Burn, Miami Fusion
Dimelon WestfieldNew England Revolution
Evans WiseNew England Revolution, Tamp Bay Mutiny

From dat list, de only ones dat established demselves were Elcock, Stern and Brian Haynes. Whatever de reason, we have not made that much of an impact on dat league.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: dcs on April 19, 2005, 03:57:12 PM

Nahkid is the only one on that list that has established himself elsewhere.
The others haven't really established themselves in any other league save for maybe Glasgow...Wise??

If not the MLS then where you guys think these players would have established themselves other than the Pro League?

A. John was in Ireland....Wise somewhere in Germany....Westfield went some place/s

Both Avery and Cornell were starters last year but so far this season are on the bench...Avery did well last year....Cornell was a lil below average for a starter.

That list longer than I realised....hopefully the current players will do better.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: maxg on April 19, 2005, 04:07:53 PM
But how are our players suppose to get into these more established leagues that will be better for them again? They just go and they will be selected?

I missed that part.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: jusme on April 20, 2005, 01:37:09 AM
the fact that not many ppl have established themselves in the league is not necessarily a reflection on the MLS and its incompatibility with the trini player. 
If we were to be honest, other than yorke and latapy and maybe a few that don't come to mind right now, for the most part all of our pros have been journeymen wherever they go.   Leonson had a decent stint with Academia in the Portuguese 2nd division I think,  Nakhid was a superstar in Lebanon and Switzerland, etc etc etc.  Its the same story everywhere: mediocre teams in mediocre leagues.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: dcs on September 11, 2005, 06:11:53 AM

I would say Sealy, A. John and Cornell have established themselves in MLS this year.
Cornell coming around.  Sealy might get Rookie of the Year...and Avery is only get bench for coming to play for us and his team leading the league.

We shud try and get some clips of Spann playing in Japan....have no idea what the quality out there is like.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Touches on September 11, 2005, 06:42:50 AM
Tallest Brian Haynes get plenty pips in MLS

I think he even coaching they reserve team.........check out that.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Tallman on September 11, 2005, 06:59:31 AM
Tallest Brian Haynes get plenty pips in MLS

I think he even coaching they reserve team.........check out that.

What party yuh went last night :party: ? Like yuh still groggy :beermug: ? I did mention his name as one of those who established themselves in de league. He has been an assistant coach wit FC Dallas fuh de last four years.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: saga pinto on September 11, 2005, 07:18:37 AM
The Mexican League I don't know about that one,I was hearing some talk months ago that them mexicans racist like hell especially to english speaking caribbean countries,I don't know how true that is maybe someone could let me know,but as far as I care if we have good players that could make a difference they should play anywhere of there choosing,if the team would have them,as far as the mls most american players like the idea of central american,caribbean countries playing in the mls,the more they get accustom to our style of play the easier they could dish we up in the concacaf region.by the way could anyone tell me how many black players in the mexican league.        
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Mr Mc on September 11, 2005, 07:21:30 AM
I dont see why if many of our players have been on MLS teams but only a few have been able to stand out, that is a fault of MLS and not a good place for our players.
Look at the list of MLS players who have 'graudated' and moved on to higher leagues, not just our own Stern John but some of the US players as well. Tallman could tell us who.
Of that list below how many would have made it in other better leagues? if they couldnt make in MLS?
IF the MLS quality as a league falls even below some of the lower Euorpean leagues, then players who are only of that quality will have to play in that league, I know if i was a player and I was good enough I would not settle for the MLS but if that is the only place I could make it, then that is where I have to play my ball. and right now for players like Avery, Cornell and Sealy, getting a regular run in the MLS is a good situation for them even if only as a jumping off point, if Cornell and Sealy keep up their play other leagues may come looking for them or if they have a good agent they can go looking for teams in other leagues.
But for some players, the MLS is just fine, ah dont know what is up with Rahim (Tallman?) but a few months ago i was sure he would be happy for a spot in the MLS.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Observer on September 11, 2005, 07:48:49 AM
I repeat the MLS is not the best place for players name three players from Trinidad to have a successful career in the MLS. If the players want to play close to home I suggest they play in the Mexican league. I’m not saying the MLS is a bad league by no means it’s a bad league but its not the best place for our players no matter how good Cornel Glen is he will keep getting traded maybe last for two seasons at best look at how much players from T&T PLAYED IN THE MLS where have there career end up.     

Bally how many Mexican Teams have offered Trini's contracts??? players playing where they wanted. The Mexican league is the biggest league in the West. Best organization, attendance, salaries, facilities etc. But the fact is the only foreigners in that league are mainly South American players from argentina, Brazil and Colombia. A couple of Spanish players have also played their. For a Trini player to get into that league he would have to be one of our top players.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: real madness on September 11, 2005, 08:20:42 AM
I repeat the MLS is not the best place for players name three players from Trinidad to have a successful career in the MLS. If the players want to play close to home I suggest they play in the Mexican league. I’m not saying the MLS is a bad league by no means it’s a bad league but its not the best place for our players no matter how good Cornel Glen is he will keep getting traded maybe last for two seasons at best look at how much players from T&T PLAYED IN THE MLS where have there career end up.     

I doubt TnT players will get contracts to plaay Mexico...they target South and Central American players.  Another factor such as altitude will definitely hamper a local player from securing a contract there.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: real madness on September 11, 2005, 08:21:59 AM

Nahkid is the only one on that list that has established himself elsewhere.
The others haven't really established themselves in any other league save for maybe Glasgow...Wise??

If not the MLS then where you guys think these players would have established themselves other than the Pro League?

A. John was in Ireland....Wise somewhere in Germany....Westfield went some place/s

Both Avery and Cornell were starters last year but so far this season are on the bench...Avery did well last year....Cornell was a lil below average for a starter.

That list longer than I realised....hopefully the current players will do better.


Avery and Cornell is starting...Avery is usually on the bench for the first game after WC duty.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: dcs on September 11, 2005, 08:52:35 AM
Yea...I hadda agree few of our players could manage in Mexico but we could get someone to break into it.

And what about our goalkeepers. They could more than hold their own over there against them midgets.

We not getting into their by invitation but by force.  I would latas coulda make there...perhaps he could have gone there instead of Scotland but he had other things to consider when making that move.

Carlos Edwards maybe...he have the Spanish name already    :D  He and Span might do ok...if not their top flight just below....they not players to make a big impact.

Our players know all about European style but nothing of their own region.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: Filho on September 11, 2005, 09:21:35 AM
It comes down to the quality of the player and the quality of their agents. I think 1 or 2 players are better than their current club, but for the most part, they are where they deserve to be. We need to stop making excuses for Trini players shortcomings...the good ones will make it in any decent league. The poor ones are exactly where they supposed to be. Breds, if you struggling in MLS, you probably going to struggle in Mexico. Mexico pays big money and their foreigners include Brazilians, Argentines, Uruguayans and other Latin_Americans who they believe are better players and adapt more easily to the language and culture....and foreign player caps exist everywhere.
Title: Re: The MLS is not the best place for T&T players
Post by: maxg on September 11, 2005, 09:23:37 AM
I repeat the MLS is not the best place for players name three players from Trinidad to have a successful career in the MLS. If the players want to play close to home I suggest they play in the Mexican league. I’m not saying the MLS is a bad league by no means it’s a bad league but its not the best place for our players no matter how good Cornel Glen is he will keep getting traded maybe last for two seasons at best look at how much players from T&T PLAYED IN THE MLS where have there career end up.     

Bally, Are Mexican League teams offering our players tryouts, and contracts ? Are our players refusing better leagues, and choosing the MLS ? What are you suggesting, The players refuse the MLS(after college or whatever), because a better league will eventually come and offer them a contract ?  
You might know of offers to our players, that I never hear bout..or you have the impression that our players are/could be/ in the top players in the MLS, though I haven't seen that at present. 2 of our top potential National players(Glen & Sealy), probably would not be selected amongst the top 10 in there position. So who Trini players that would obviously be not as good than them, you want Teams, MLS or Otherwise to sign ?
If is between Jab & Metrostars, where yuh think a up and coming player would have a chance of 1. making money. 2. Being seen. 3. Gaining experience. 4. Improving Technically. 5. Being the best he can be, as an individual.
The best place for me to live would be ah nice beach house in Blanch. on a crime free island of Trinidad. So how come I cyar make that happen just so man ?


modification/addition : Sorry I didn't realize this was ah old post, and discussion, and many points were already expressed....sorry to repea, i didn't read the whole link properly
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Tallman on February 02, 2011, 02:11:06 PM
With nine of our players currently on trial with MLS teams, I decided to compile a list of our players who have either been on trial or have had a contract with an MLS team. Ah sure ah missing some.

Chicago Fire: Osei Telesford
Colorado Rapids: Craig Demmin, Keyeno Thomas, Rick Titus, Javed Mohammed (t), Shahdon Winchester (t), Joevin Jones (t)
Columbus Crew: Kevin Adams, Ancil Elcock, Cornell Glen, Stern John, Andrei Pacheco
DC United: Julius James, Avery John, Travis Mulraine
FC Dallas/Dallas Burn: Brian Haynes, Marvin Phillp (t), Brent Rahim (t), Mickey Trotman, Cornell Glen, Shaka Hislop
Houston Dynamo: Julius James, Lester Peltier (t)
Kansas City Wizards/Sporting Kansas City: Sheldon Bateau (t), Daneil Cyrus(t), Arnold Dwarika (t), Edson Elcock (t), Angus Eve (t), Gary Glasgow, Scott Sealy
Los Angeles Galaxy: Chris Birchall, Cornell Glen, Yohance Marshall, Brent Rahim (t), Sheldon Thomas, Evans Wise (t)
Miami Fusion: Mickey Trotman
New England Revolution: Avery John, David Nakhid, Shastri Spencer (t), Dimelon Westfield, Evans Wise
New York Metrostars/Red Bulls: Andre Charles (t), Aklie Edwards (t), Cornell Glen, Kerwin Jemmott (t), Bevon Lewis (t), Darin Lewis, Randi Patterson
Philadelphia Union: Radanfah Abu Bakr (t), Keon Daniel (t), Thorne Holder (t)
Portland Timbers*: Darin Lewis, Brent Sancho
Real Salt Lake: Leslie Fitzpatrick, Marlon Rojas
San Jose Earthquakes: Ancil Farrier (t), Cornell Glen, Travis Mulraine, Adrian Narine, Scott Sealy. Conrad Smith (t), Hayden Tinto (t)
Seattle Sounders: Akeem Adams (t), Kerry Baptiste (t), Densill Theobald (t)
Tampa Bay Mutiny: Craig Demmin, Evans Wise
Toronto FC: Julius James, Collin Samuel
Vancouver Whitecaps*: Joel Bailey, Anthony Noreiga, Terry St. Louis, Rick Titus

* - Our players were on these teams when they were in the USL/A-league. Steve David, Leroy De Leon, and Leroy Spann played for the Earthquakes when they were in the NASL.
t - trial
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: fish on February 02, 2011, 02:27:32 PM
Darryl Roberts got drafted by Toronto FC and owned his rights when he made his move to Sparta.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: FF on February 02, 2011, 02:29:32 PM
Who is Sheldon Thomas?
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Tallman on February 02, 2011, 03:39:54 PM
Darryl Roberts got drafted by Toronto FC and owned his rights when he made his move to Sparta.

I know it was reported in de press, but when I ask him dat a few years ago, he say he eh know nutten about dat.

Date: February 29 2008
Tallman : I read somewhere that Toronto FC has your MLS rights for two years. What does that mean?
Darryl Roberts : (2:30 PM EST) Toronto has no rights on me. This has come as a surprise to me.



Who is Sheldon Thomas?

A forward from Benedicts who played in de 1998 Caribbean Cup.

L.A. Galaxy calls up Kevin Legg, Sheldon Thomas and Craig Waibel (http://www.socawarriors.net/foreign-based/3090-la-galaxy-calls-up-kevin-legg-sheldon-thomas-and-craig-waibel.html)
Sheldon Thomas, who grew up playing soccer in Trinidad, now is scoring goals for Titans (http://www.socawarriors.net/foreign-based/3090-la-galaxy-calls-up-kevin-legg-sheldon-thomas-and-craig-waibel.html)
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Tenorsaw on February 02, 2011, 03:55:33 PM
Let's be honest...We are not churning out many world class players at the moment, so the MLS is the logical next step for some of our players that might not make the grade in Europe.  It's either the MLS or a lower division in Europe for most of our players.  I'd prefer our younger players try to go across to Europe at a young age and work their way up the chain.  If yuh going to play for small money, yuh migght as well go to a league where you're constantly in the eyes of scouts looking for talent.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: DeSoWa on February 02, 2011, 04:04:52 PM
You have Glen in all his clubs except the one he last played for - San Jose Earthquakes  ;D

Big Up!
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Deeks on February 02, 2011, 04:30:30 PM
Let's be honest...We are not churning out many world class players at the moment, so the MLS is the logical next step for some of our players that might not make the grade in Europe.  It's either the MLS or a lower division in Europe for most of our players.  I'd prefer our younger players try to go across to Europe at a young age and work their way up the chain.  If yuh going to play for small money, yuh migght as well go to a league where you're constantly in the eyes of scouts looking for talent.

You right on that. Since Dwight, latas, Stern and KJ????, we have not produced a player who is consistent on the international circuit. The closet right now is that guy in Belgium, Hyland. Let's see what happens for the next 2 years with him.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Tallman on February 02, 2011, 04:53:19 PM
You have Glen in all his clubs except the one he last played for - San Jose Earthquakes  ;D

Big Up!

Yeh, Cornell Glen is de Clint Marcelle of de MLS. Ah fix it and also added Kevin Adams and Hardest.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: fish on February 02, 2011, 09:37:38 PM
Darryl Roberts got drafted by Toronto FC and owned his rights when he made his move to Sparta.

I know it was reported in de press, but when I ask him dat a few years ago, he say he eh know nutten about dat.

Date: February 29 2008
Tallman : I read somewhere that Toronto FC has your MLS rights for two years. What does that mean?
Darryl Roberts : (2:30 PM EST) Toronto has no rights on me. This has come as a surprise to me.



Who is Sheldon Thomas?

A forward from Benedicts who played in de 1998 Caribbean Cup.

L.A. Galaxy calls up Kevin Legg, Sheldon Thomas and Craig Waibel (http://www.socawarriors.net/foreign-based/3090-la-galaxy-calls-up-kevin-legg-sheldon-thomas-and-craig-waibel.html)
Sheldon Thomas, who grew up playing soccer in Trinidad, now is scoring goals for Titans (http://www.socawarriors.net/foreign-based/3090-la-galaxy-calls-up-kevin-legg-sheldon-thomas-and-craig-waibel.html)

Seerious? I thought once you go up for the draft, and a team picks you, they have your rights as a players for a whatever time frame they agree upon.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Sando on December 11, 2016, 12:56:48 PM
Nice post.

Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: kounty on December 11, 2016, 02:59:52 PM
was checking out the level of play in that final ...and wondering in which league in the world I would see that level of play, losing the ball so cheaply, throw way etc.
I think molino & joevin could step up to other leagues..argentina, mexico, ...and it would improve their games. It is a taste of reality though that the majority of our players can't even make the starting 11 in this league...I don't know but the contract thing but barring that I think is a decent level to aim for for the weakest of our players (not the strongest).
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: Deeks on December 11, 2016, 03:59:17 PM
kounty, I watched Manu and West Ham this morning, and both teams many a times doing the same thing you are questioning. The MlS is by no way on par with the top Euro league in terms of team unit skills. But they do have quite a few skillful players. It will still take some time.The MLS still play a heavy dose of hit and run ball.That is still part of the American psyche. Speed, fitness and score.
Title: Re: Is the MLS a solid league for our players?
Post by: g on December 12, 2016, 06:02:24 AM
was checking out the level of play in that final ...and wondering in which league in the world I would see that level of play, losing the ball so cheaply, throw way etc.
I think molino & joevin could step up to other leagues..argentina, mexico, ...and it would improve their games. It is a taste of reality though that the majority of our players can't even make the starting 11 in this league...I don't know but the contract thing but barring that I think is a decent level to aim for for the weakest of our players (not the strongest).


Unfortunately I think a lot of the current crop of players consider the MLS the pinnacle of a football career. Even if they are not a designated player they could easily make 80-120K USD (520-780k TTD) per year.

Consider the Pro League which may pay between 48-72K TTD per year, A young man if not coming form a background of wealth will think that kind of money he can take care of himself and his family, he playing in front of sold out stadia every week, major fan support unlike what we get even at a local international game. Let's not discount the ability to live in the United States and the first world experience of that for a young man and possibly his family as well for safety, education and healthcare.

In the interview with Jan Michael Williams a few weeks ago he made an interesting point. This current crop of players are motivated by different things, more than just putting on the shirt. I dont think we can discount that. I think as fans we all think that all players want to aspire play in top European leagues and champions league and every thing else is mediocre but we probably have only a handful of players ever to play at that level. I sure in the mind of some of our players that once they feel they can make a wage that allows them to look after themselves then they are good.