Soca Warriors Online Discussion Forum

Sports => Football => Topic started by: Tallman on December 24, 2005, 08:49:25 PM

Title: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Tallman on December 24, 2005, 08:49:25 PM
Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets.
By Lasana Liburd (Express).


Part I

Lasana Liburd probes FIFA VP Jack Warner's relationship with the T&TFF in a three-part series. Trinidad and Tobago football fans desperate to see the national team's historic debut appearance at the 2006 World Cup tournament in Germany must wait a bit longer to discover why it is so expensive to do so and if they are being exploited by a suspect alliance.
FIFA vice-president and Trinidad and Football Federation (T&TFF) special adviser Jack Warner and T&TFF president Oliver Camps refused to say whether it was ethical for the country's ticket allocation to be diverted to Warner's private company and exactly how many tickets were sent by FIFA.

Camps, who is responsible for the country's share of tickets, told the Sunday Express that he did not know whether Warner owned Simpaul Travel Service-the company which has claimed to have purchased all Trinidad and Tobago's World Cup tickets.
"I do not know that is happening," said Camps, when asked why Warner was allowed to divert tickets to his own private company. "Do you know who the owner of Simpaul is? Let us not go there."

Camps refused further comment and claimed that he was sworn to silence by a gag order from his T&TFF subordinates on the executive committee.
"The (T&TFF) executive asked that no one answer any questions at the moment," said Camps.
Camps suggested that the T&TFF will allow questions in a future media conference, although he did not yet know the time or place.
Warner was also in no mood to be questioned on Trinidad and Tobago's tickets and whether it was ethical for his company to profit on tickets that only he could obtain. 'You write what you want to write,' said Warner. "I have nothing to discuss with you."

A company search at the Ministry of Legal Affairs confirmed that Warner is a director of Simpaul Travel Services Limited along with his wife Maureen and sons Daryan and Darryl Warner. Former owner, Simone Petit, also confirmed that she sold her travel agency to Warner in the mid-1990s. But the word "Simpaul" prompted curt responses from anyone involved in the T&TFF or the Warner family.

Maureen Warner, a company director, claimed to be overcome by a combination of fatigue and flu when asked about Simpaul's stranglehold over the Trinidad and Tobago's World Cup tickets at 4.45 p.m. on Wednesday.
"You caught me sleeping," said Warner (M). "I have the flu and I am sleeping."
Trinidad and Tobago's distribution of World Cup football tickets is in stark contrast to its fellow 2006 competitors.
The Football Federation of Australia (FFA), whose only other World Cup final appearance came 32 years ago, informed Australian fans that 8,500 tickets for its opening three group matches would be made available before they went on sale on December 20.

Fans had the option of buying tickets individually, select seats from four categories, purchase all three group tickets in one package or acquire an all-inclusive package, which included airfare and accommodation.
Three Category One group tickets-situated near the half line at both sides of the field-were offered to fans at $528 (Australian dollars) or TT$2,475, which allowed the FFA a profit of TT$204 for each ticket sold.
In Trinidad and Tobago, though, Simpaul insisted that fans must purchase all three tickets along with accommodation-even in cases where fans already made their own arrangements for shelter in Germany.

Simpaul's package costs $30,000, which is exclusive of airfare and ground transport while all hotel rooms are double occupancy. The travel agency's price also ignores the fact that some of its tickets are for Category Two seats, which are situated near the field's corner flags.
At a cost of $2,254 for three Category One tickets, according to the FIFA website, Trinidad and Tobago football fans must pay an additional $27,746 for 12 nights accommodation in Germany.

The Sunday Express contacted Germany's Best Western Hotel, a reputable three-star hotel, which has rooms available from $751. Twelve days, at that rate, would cost $9,012.
Minus a supporter shirt, wristband, flag and travel bag, generously estimated at $400, and the Warner family can rake in $18,334 for each package sold.
If they sold a similar allocation as the FFA, the Warners could be $50 million richer from ticket sales alone. Simpaul is yet to reveal which hotels would house its clients.
On December 13, Warner claimed, in a T&TFF press conference, that Simpaul-his company-paid the T&TFF, the organisation he helps run, $500,000 to be its official travel agent.
Warner refused comment on the ethics of such a deal.
In a further twist, the Sunday Express unearthed a Simpaul Travel legal document which allowed accountant Kenny Rampersad to act on its behalf.
Rampersad is the director of accounting firm, Kenny Rampersad and Company, which audits the T&TFF.

Warner also boasted that 150 persons from Washington, USA, had booked for Simpaul's package as of December 13. If so, his company could already made $2.25 million on its investment.
In the same press conference, Warner said the T&TFF's estimated budget of $75 million might be insufficient to get the "Soca Warriors" to the World Cup and warned that their participation was at risk.
"Our federation is in serious financial difficulties right now,"Warner told the press. "f we do not pay down money for our stay in Germany, when the finals come around, some other team could have taken up our space." Simpaul Travel has no such feelings of insecurity.

Simpaul official Gerald Baptiste, the project manager for the World Cup package, claimed to have no idea whether the Warners were involved with the company and refused to say how Simpaul arrived at the present valuation for its package and whether it was overpriced.
Rival Trinidad and Tobago travel agencies look on with awe.
Anthony Harford, head of All Sports Promotion, planned a charter for Germany and already has 300 willing clients. However, Harford, who arranged Trinidad and Tobago's charter to Bahrain for a decisive qualifying match, claimed to be stunned at Simpaul's coup.

"I learned like everyone else that everyone who has to buy tickets has to buy through Simpaul," said Harford. "I am trying to get Simpaul to sell me from their allocation and I am still in the process of negotiating with them."
Despite Baptiste's protests of ignorance about the Warners' influence, Harford revealed that he was engaged in cordial negotiations with Daryan Warner and Baptiste about the tickets.
Harford doubts that a plausible compromise can be met.
"Simpaul's package does not include things like ground transport, airfare or sight seeing,""he said. "When you add all those costs, it has to be affordable to my clients."

Nigel Camacho, founder of the Trini Posse supporters' group, had also planned a charter to take his supporters to Germany but claimed that things got very complicated when Simpaul Travel was named as the authorized ticket distributors.
"I am a little bit confused about what is going on," Camacho told the Sunday Express. "It raises a few eyebrows but I don't think anything illegal has been done."

There might be questions regarding ethics and conflicts of interest though. Warner similarly cashed in when Trinidad and Tobago hosted the 2001 FIFA World Youth Cup. Then, his companies controlled exclusive contracts to supply air tickets to all competing foreign teams as well as catering and IT deals for all the stadiums. Camps and the Warner household are not ready to discuss the matter just yet.
Jack Warner: A very special adviser.
By Lasana Liburd (Express).


Part II

Trinidad and Tobago still reverberates to the 'thud' of Dennis Lawrence's headed goal against Bahrain, which booked the country a historical berth at the 2006 FIFA World Cup football tournament in Germany.

On November 16, Trinidad and Tobago became the smallest country ever to qualify for a FIFA senior World Cup and Prime Minister Patrick Manning, President George Maxwell Richards and the rest of the population swore their love for the team, dubbed the "Soca Warriors".
More than a month later, the national players have not received a cent as tangible reward for the accomplishment.
FIFA vice-president and Trinidad and Tobago Football Federation (T&TFF) special adviser Jack Warner is not so patient or charitable.

Warner's family owned company, Simpaul Travel Services Limited, emerged without any public tender as the authorised ticket sellers for the World Cup tournament. And tickets that FIFA priced at $2,254 and $1,339 are being sold, by Simpaul, for $30,000 with the addition of lodging for 12 days in Germany and a national flag, replica shirt and wristband.

Oliver Camps, president of the Trinidad and Tobago Football Federation (T&TFF), was given the chance to explain the deal between his organisation and Warner and whether patriotic fans were being financially exploited.
Camps refused on the grounds that he was told not to speak to the press just yet.
Trinidad and Tobago football fans, it appears, are at the mercy of someone who has no tangible post within the local running body.
The post of "special adviser", which falls under the category of "honorary member" in the T&TFF constitution, is not allowed to vote at general council meetings or make decisions.
But Warner boasts of hiring and firing coaches, paying players and receives cheques on behalf of the Federation.

FIFA's motto is "For the good of the game" but it is possible that Warner, one of 13 FIFA vice-presidents, might have modified this watchword.
Exactly what is the relationship between Warner, Camps (as T&TFF head) and the general public, though? And how did it become thus?
Warner, a former school teacher and football linesman, emerged on the national scene in 1974 "soon after T&T's infamous and unsuccessful attempt to qualify for the 1974 World Cup in Germany" and served as general secretary for nearly two decades before reinventing his role to that of special adviser.

The honorary position gave Warner the ability to peer into T&TFF affairs but not to affect it. For Warner to maintain his influence, he needed a supportive president.
Camps, who replaced Peter O' Connor as president in 1992, had just taken the reins and the pair quickly formed an alliance.
Warner publicly supports Camps and declared that, were the president to be ousted, he would immediately insist on collecting money owed to him by the T&TFF and, quite possibly, force the local organisation into bankruptcy.

It is virtually impossible to quantify the money owed to Warner for several reasons.
The T&TFF books are audited by Kenny Rampersad and Company, a small accounting firm.
Article 13.2 of the T&TFF Constitution explains that the local body must hire "a firm of qualified accountants" who hold no office in the Federation for obvious reasons of transparency.
Although Kenny Rampersad is not a T&TFF member, Express investigations did unearth a document authorising the accountant to act on behalf of Warner's Simpaul Travel business.

The T&TFF is therefore relying on a man who, at the least, acted as Warner's business partner in the past to give them credible information on how much is owed to Warner.
Considering Warner's relationship with Camps, T&TFF affiliates may also be concerned by a possible conflict of interests when they are briefed on the Federation's financial position.
There was a notable change to the T&TFF constitution as well under Camps' stewardship. In 1994, local clubs lost their right to vote at the general elections. Instead, only regional football associations and "properly constituted bodies" like the Trinidad and Tobago Football Coaches Association and Football Referees' Association are allowed to vote.

In the 1980s, Warner almost lost his position when clubs, buoyed by the financial promise of the Arthur Suite League, tried unsuccessfully to unseat the veteran administrator.
Former Jamaica Football Federation (JFF) president Captain Horace Burrell was ousted from his post after cries of financial mismanagement from the country's club teams soon after the Reggae Boyz appeared in the 1998 World Cup.
Eleven years ago, Camps-possibly with help from a clever adviser-ensured that it could never happen here and even a vibrant local professional football league could never threaten his position. At present, Camps is the longest consecutive serving president in the history of local football.

While Camps got the power, Warner benefited financially.
The T&TFF constitution allows the general council to "delegate any of its powers to any committee or sub-committee". More often than not, committees are set up outside the T&TFF offices when large sums of money are involved like the Football Company of Trinidad and Tobago (FCoTT) and the 2006 World Cup Local Organising Committee (LOC). The now defunct FCoTT and the present LOC were both chaired by Warner.

The administrator repeatedly boasts of the money he has put into the game without offering a detailed accounting report. This report, done by an impartial accountant, should provide information on the money flowing into the game such as television rights, sponsorship deals, gate receipts and endorsement contracts.
Simpaul is the highest profiled example of a Warner-owned company benefiting directly from the T&TFF. But the Jamad Limited cleaning company, Emerald Plaza and Coal Pot restaurant also received good business from local football.
The Express continues to investigate other companies regularly associated with the T&TFF.
There is still much about the T&TFF that requires explanation in spite of-or precisely because of-our qualification for Germany. Camps is not saying anything just yet.
Finding out Jack.
By Lasana Liburd (Express).
[/size]

Part III

The Trinidad and Tobago national football team had hoped for a better Christmas season.
Six weeks ago, the self-titled "Soca Warriors" created history by qualifying for their first senior FIFA World Cup tournament and, in the process, became the smallest country ever to play at such a high level.
But there was nothing in team captain Dwight Yorke and his teammates' stockings on Christmas Day. Not so much as a "Happy Christmas" card.

Bonuses and tangible signs of appreciation might still be on their way to the national football team. But, on the evidence of the past month, the visual picture of the country's sporting heroes has become blurred.
On November 16, the Trinidad and Tobago footballers beat Bahrain1-0 to snatch a spot in the 2006 World Cup tournament in Germany. Yet, it is FIFA vice-president and Trinidad and Tobago Football Federation (T&TFF) special adviser Jack Warner and his cohorts who appear to be making the lucrative lap of honour.
Warner stands to considerably enhance his personal wealth from the success of the country's football team even before a fitting tribute is paid to the players. It goes against the principle of sport administration, which is catered towards serving the athlete.

The manner in which contracts were passed out-and, in particular, a deal authorising Simpaul Travel to act as the T&TFF's official ticket distributor-without public tender is particularly disturbing.
Eyebrows were sure to be raised when the T&TFF handed such a plum contract exclusively to Simpaul, which is owned by Warner and his wife, Maureen, and sons, Daryan and Darryl.
The Trinidad and Tobago public needed convincing that Simpaul was indeed the best organisation to distribute tickets and the interests of football fans were sacrosanct.
Instead, Warner announced Simpaul's coup at a press conference without once mentioning that he was a company director while Simpaul official Gerald Baptiste and T&TFF president Oliver Camps also pleaded ignorance of the fact.

And worse, fans interested in purchasing World Cup tickets at a street value ranging between $780 and $2,254 were told to pay $30,000.
For Warner and the Trinidad and Tobago public, it is the continuation of a love-hate relationship that stretches back almost two decades.
In 1989, Warner-as he later admitted in his biography-printed 16,500 additional tickets for the country's crucial 1990 World Cup qualifying match against the United States despite repeated claims to the contrary at the time. It created a potentially dangerous situation at Port of Spain's National Stadium which was overfilled while thousands of fans with paid tickets were unable to get inside.
Warner claimed he was not trying to cash in on the success of the football team, who were then referred to as the "Strike Squad".

The team then comprised of mostly local-based amateur players who went unpaid.
A promise of housing for players by the ruling NAR party went unfulfilled as did a deal for a share of gate receipts in the aftermath of the failed 1990 campaign. At present, retired magistrate George Hislop, whose son Shaka is a current national player, claims that the Strike Squad is still owed $100,000 from the local organising body.
Four years ago, Trinidad and Tobago was again dizzy from World Cup fever as the country staged the 2001 FIFA Under-17 Youth Championship.
Warner was a key member of T&T's bidding committee to host the tournament, which brought talented young players like Florent Sinama Pongolle (Liverpool/France), Carlos Tevez (Corinthians/Argentina) and Fernando Torres (Atletico Madrid/Spain) to local shores.

Again, controversy swirled around his family businesses such as Simpaul Travel, De Coal Pot and the Emerald Plaza Hotel which copped lucrative deals while his son, Darryl, landed a handsome IT contract supplying internet kiosks to all five stadia.
Warner, the deputy chairman of FIFA's Finance Committee, is known internationally for his wheeling and dealings as well.
From 1984 to 1998, under ex-FIFA president Joao Havelange, Warner received television rights for the Caribbean region for just $1 which he sold on to regional television stations.
Warner stands to earn much more from Trinidad and Tobago's participation in Germany. His right to make a living for himself and his family is unquestioned.
Yet surely, Warner's position within FIFA and the T&TFF should make him especially careful not to give the impression of someone abusing his influence for personal gain.

The average Trinidad and Tobago football fan is caught in the crossroads.
Trinidad and Tobago's focus on the 2006 World Cup has shifted from two dozen talented, determined players and an expectant nation to an administrator. Fans might be more concerned about Simpaul than England's Steven Gerrard. The powers-that-be should ensure that T&T's World Cup dream does not become a nightmare long before the first ball is kicked.

Related flash-back News.

Caribbean question turns Sepp into silent type. (http://www.socawarriorssc.com/swonline/smf/index.php?topic=9806.msg85938#msg85938)

Time for a clean-up - Blatter accused of corruption. (http://www.socawarriorssc.com/swonline/smf/index.php?topic=9807.msg85939#msg85939)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Cowen on December 24, 2005, 08:59:37 PM
This just keep getting worst everyday. Jack the ripper at it again.

Somebody tell me please ..... how we supposed to get tickets with these kinda crooks running lose.  >:(
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 24, 2005, 09:11:45 PM
With clear apparent conflict of interests, and the possible availabiity of hard evidence to wrong doings by Jack Warner and his cohorts, why hasn't some legal action been taken?  I don't live in T&T, but in effect this case appears to be one that could be prosecuted as a Civil case AND a Criminal case.  Are not those that represent the citizens hearing the outcry?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 24, 2005, 09:18:19 PM
PAGING ROTATO POTI & PEG!..and all odders who does BLINDLY support Austin....

STAND AND DEFEND!



Defend de indefensible!   Allyuh special....like dem chirren in de St. Margarets Home special...LOL!
Allyuh so full ah shit ah getting de stench all de way in Virginia.

But is Christmas and unlike Scrooge and de flicking Gringe..allyuh can take ah bligh!

Let us get our Trinity Cross ready for Mr. Warner.

Valentino Singh..ah calling you out too!

You and yuh guardian cohorts feel warner need de Cross....well anyway according tuh allyuh he is de saviour..so why not let him have he cross.

STEUPS....!

Well leh we see wey dis sour grapes man Liburd going with dis story eh Rotato?  facts and innuendo..misplaced allegations and plain old lies.  Right?   ;)

All de old talk I does be resting on de forum about Mr. warner is hating...ent?

Allyuh real good oui.

Look at bacchanal.....!

Now nuff man go come out de wood work and start bashing Jack...but when I was doing it..ah was ah jackass and ah hater.

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

I know de true waggonist dem on dis board...all who eh know what jack really is!

Take allyuh AWATT tickets...even some AWATT Officers have tuh ticket deyself!


Just tuh remind allyuh who ah talking about:

http://www.socawarriorssc.com/swonline/smf/index.php?topic=8404.0
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: palos on December 24, 2005, 09:22:15 PM
Excellent JOURNALISM by Lasana here.  This guy gets my respect more and more.

We are seeing a recurring theme which will surprise no one as it has been in use for a long time.

1 - Warner has links to everything...ticketing, TV rights, etc.

2 - Once again a threat that T&T cannot make it's commitments if the TTFF don't get more money

3 - Everybody involved goes mum when questioned.


After being in a position to pretty much call the cards with his financial backing of T&T throughout the campaign, Jack's apparent greed appears to have offset even that position of strength into one of liability.  Which makes one realize that even the "smartest" of people can be downright dotish when they ready.

But who is me to call anybody dotish anyway?  I and many others have been turning a blind eye to all these goings on as long as we have some success on the field.  If is anybody who dotish, is me.


Wonder what Spalk will have to say about all these allegations?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 24, 2005, 09:34:34 PM
Excellent JOURNALISM by Lasana here.  This guy gets my respect more and more.

We are seeing a recurring theme which will surprise no one as it has been in use for a long time.

1 - Warner has links to everything...ticketing, TV rights, etc.

2 - Once again a threat that T&T cannot make it's commitments if the TTFF don't get more money

3 - Everybody involved goes mum when questioned.


After being in a position to pretty much call the cards with his financial backing of T&T throughout the campaign, Jack's apparent greed appears to have offset even that position of strength into one of liability.  Which makes one realize that even the "smartest" of people can be downright dotish when they ready.

But who is me to call anybody dotish anyway?  I and many others have been turning a blind eye to all these goings on as long as we have some success on the field.  If is anybody who dotish, is me.


Wonder what Spalk will have to say about all these allegations?


ent..but you ah could forgive ...because ah know you did always know better and was jes overcome with de joy ah going Germany...de dream ah de big dance materialized....

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: royal on December 24, 2005, 09:51:14 PM
So tell meh nah,when Warner say he give 17m to de football team and so on and he give dis and dat,who money he really giving to de team ?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 24, 2005, 10:06:25 PM
So tell meh nah,when Warner say he give 17m to de football team and so on and he give dis and dat,who money he really giving to de team ?

Listen Warner doh "give" nutten.

Whne eh threatened to leave T&T football alone, Camps come bawling like ah mewling cat saying Jack is owed much $$$ by de TTFF.

so when he "gives"  it is given in the form of a loan.

From what I know about loans..dem have to get paid back....and usually with interest.

If yuh feel is jes so Jack giving way he money den allyuh eh know nutten about business.

A fool and his money are soon parted...where did I read dis?

Ok

it wa from Rotato Poti's book on common sense

steups.

Listen fella.

FIFA's books are not made public..much like the TTFF's.

de same peole who auditing de TTFF...working for Jack's Simpaul Travel Service...nepotism again.

Jack spouts figures from his mouth all de time...a sensible individual would assume that the TTFF has some budgt etc.

yet why de hell dey cyar provide de government with one yet?

Man here decrying mr Boynes much..but if yuh notice de T&T Business world not to hurry to give Jack money fuh de team eh...yuh ever ask why?

Some time ago..Jack son was de treasurer ah de TTFF.

De broadcasting rights ah WE national team owned by who?

How dat happen?  Why dat happen?  IS dat legal I wonder?  Me eh no lawyer eh..but ah guess de TTFF sell it or lend it tuh Jack ent? We jes play ah big game against Bahrainin Bahrain and we only make 80,000TT dollars from dat?  and dat game show all over de world?

How much dey charge fuh dat?  Or is de TTFF only getting ah small portion ah de prceeds becasue dey owe Jack (rememebr his giving?) for all his loans?

Ah cyar wait fuh Lasana's part Deux!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 24, 2005, 10:20:28 PM
f**k jack warner ah man who perpetually throws his hero status into de f**kin gutter. I am so tremendously fed up of him an is chrsitams and im drunk and i cyah affoprd tuoh go tuh germany.

Merry christmas Jack!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 24, 2005, 10:59:15 PM
The way we handle these issues, with the BS we are willing to take, and the battles we are willing to fight, is a direct reflection on our society. 
The sad thing is, if no sort of serious official investigation takes place to look into possible price fixing, illegal monopoly, conflict of interest, and fraud, then T&T in my book may very well stand the risk of basically looking like nothing more than a banana republic.  And that'll be a damn shame.  I hope we prevail. 
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 24, 2005, 11:28:55 PM
FIFA IS AH COMPLETE MAFIA
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Rotato Poti on December 24, 2005, 11:43:46 PM
Ha Truetrini .. Merry Christmas to you too.

I still maintain my position on recognition for Jack Warner's unwavering  support of the Sr. Football Team. He put HIS money where his mouth is. That's not changing if that was what you would expect - so no stocking stuffers there for you.

However, I will give you a little trinket and voice my displeasure on the ticket monopoly. Well just like you - and the rest of the forumites, I do have to pay for my tickets regardless of all the "supposed" connections I have with the Warner's and TTFA ... F.   ;)
Hence, if push comes to shove in the next three weeks and the tickets I thought I would receive all of a sudden becomes unavailable, I will be forking over my USD $5K to sit in Category 2 type seats come next June.

Even though the WC is a unique experience, made moreso by our debut on the World footballing stage - the economics of the situation will show that demand will way outstrip supply - but given that we do live in a free market economy - it opens up avenues for businessmen to capitalise - something that yes, Jack Warner is shrewdly arranging and cleverly proceeding with. It also means that some consumers will be priced out of the market because other consumers are willing to pay a premium for consumption of that product, and thus prices will follow - that's from my book on common sense.

Thus, the question then becomes, how much is it worth to you to see TT play in Germany?
Are you willing to put aside bias and go regardless, even if it means paying a "criminal" price for tickets?

eBay and the rest of the ticket brokers and scalpers should be in prime form once the redistribution of TST is awarded - will Jack's ... umm Maureen's package seem more attractive at that point?

You and I are in a business where we see people refinance their homes to go to the Superbowl in February .... and that's a once a year opportunity.

But like the offical card of the World Cup states indeed, everything with Mastercard is priceless.

I just hope your list made it to Santa in time. I'm waiting up this year with all forms of bribes to trade for WC tickets.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Rotato Poti on December 24, 2005, 11:46:22 PM
FIFA IS AH COMPLETE MAFIA

Actually talking about Mafia, I'll be over by Frankie Knuckles neighbours this weekend - usually he shows up in the afternoon because he loves JW Blue. I'll ask him if he knows anyone named Sepp or Jack.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: kounty on December 25, 2005, 12:10:52 AM
rotato, you outdoing yourself again.  You real speaking piles.  you need to come back to the real world and stop talking BS about inelastic supply and demand and supply models.  Fidel I preaching what you saying long time, this is a crime against the people of Trinidad and Tobago, somebody need to put this man in jail quick.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 25, 2005, 12:16:23 AM
...the economics of the situation will show that demand will way outstrip supply - but given that we do live in a free market economy - it opens up avenues for businessmen to capitalise - something that yes, Jack Warner is shrewdly arranging and cleverly proceeding with. It also means that some consumers will be priced out of the market because other consumers are willing to pay a premium for consumption of that product, and thus prices will follow - that's from my book on common sense.

Thus, the question then becomes, how much is it worth to you to see TT play in Germany?
Are you willing to put aside bias and go regardless, even if it means paying a "criminal" price for tickets?

eBay and the rest of the ticket brokers and scalpers should be in prime form once the redistribution of TST is awarded - will Jack's ... umm Maureen's package seem more attractive at that point?

You and I are in a business where we see people refinance their homes to go to the Superbowl in February .... and that's a once a year opportunity.

Rotato, a true free market economy is one where the market representing possible buyers and sellers get to decide on price, thus arriving at the particular price/supply equilibrium.  Based on the article (not saying that the article should or should not be taken as fact), what Jack Warner appears to be doing is unfairly creating a price without the market's involvement in the decision making process.  The price of the package quoted by Simpaul's has nothing to do with prevailing market conditions.  Granted, the demand may in all likelihood outstrip supply, thus raising prices relatively, however, the accusation against JW deals with the fact that he took away the opportunity for the market to naturally decide on fair pricing based upon all available information.  Clearly that is not the definition of a free market.  It is the antithesis of a free market.

Sadly, yes, many of us may end up paying for the package, thus empowing JW moreso.  Sadly, that makes us part of the problem.  That may make me part of the problem.    
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: g on December 25, 2005, 12:18:53 AM
If Simpauls really paid the TTFF $500k for exclusive rights then they could sell d tickets however dey want to. But my thing is was this process of rights acquisition tendered publically with a transparent bidding process. I would like to hear more about that tendering process if it was legit. If it was then Simpauls could do what they want ethics doh mean shit when $$$ passing.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Themanfriday on December 25, 2005, 01:30:40 AM
I never thought that a Trinbagonian would do that to his ppl :devil:
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: concerned on December 25, 2005, 05:06:55 AM
The Manfriday......please take this article and forward it to your contact at FIFA
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 06:07:57 AM
Ha Truetrini .. Merry Christmas to you too.

I still maintain my position on recognition for Jack Warner's unwavering  support of the Sr. Football Team. He put HIS money where his mouth is. That's not changing if that was what you would expect - so no stocking stuffers there for you.

Jack indeed put his money where his mouth is.  He also puts his foot where his mouth is.  It seems that he also stuffs something in your stockings.  His unwavering support is for Jack and Jack's family..not for T&T football.  Get it straight.

However, I will give you a little trinket and voice my displeasure on the ticket monopoly. Well just like you - and the rest of the forumites, I do have to pay for my tickets regardless of all the "supposed" connections I have with the Warner's and TTFA ... F.   ;)
Hence, if push comes to shove in the next three weeks and the tickets I thought I would receive all of a sudden becomes unavailable, I will be forking over my USD $5K to sit in Category 2 type seats come next June.

I absolutely refuse to pay Jack Warner one red cent for the tickets!  Every other Federation is making a profit.  Is the TTFF making any profit?  NOPE!  Jack Warner is the one who continues to handsomely profit from T&T Football to the detriment of the development of the sport and the players!  The only connection you have to the TTFF is your political support to the UNC and as Jack is your UNC saviour..well we all know he doh give ah Jack about anyone.  He is high handed, despotic and downright unethical.  Yet you turn a blind eye.  Why is dat?  I have a theory,,but I will discuss that privately ;)

Even though the WC is a unique experience, made moreso by our debut on the World footballing stage - the economics of the situation will show that demand will way outstrip supply - but given that we do live in a free market economy - it opens up avenues for businessmen to capitalise - something that yes, Jack Warner is shrewdly arranging and cleverly proceeding with. It also means that some consumers will be priced out of the market because other consumers are willing to pay a premium for consumption of that product, and thus prices will follow - that's from my book on common sense.

JAck Warner is profiteeering.  It is nepotism!  It is downright wrong.  Those tickets DO NOT BELONG TO JACK WARNER!  THEY BELONG TO THE FEDERATION!  But then again according to you, Jack put his money where his mouth is, so he deserves to tief we blind ent?  So all this talk about6 selfless sacrifice he made,,is jes old talk..nah..Is jes shit talk from shit talkers den?  De true patriot that he is, he can capitalise and monopolize and downright rip poor people off?

And dat is de man you tout to be ah Jedi Warrior and de next leadere ah de UNC?  hahahahah take ah hard look at de men you support.....bandits all.  May God destroy de UNC~!


Thus, the question then becomes, how much is it worth to you to see TT play in Germany?

Is it worth your integrity to justify the black market profiteering of Austin Jack Warner?  Notice how his cronies and Lackies all disavow any knowledge of his connection to Simpauls?  hahahahahaha  spineless, cowardly no-balls fools.....!  And now you support that by declaring some will be out priced?  You are a fake..phony....and spineless too!
Are you willing to put aside bias and go regardless, even if it means paying a "criminal" price for tickets?

eBay and the rest of the ticket brokers and scalpers should be in prime form once the redistribution of TST is awarded - will Jack's ... umm Maureen's package seem more attractive at that point?

Do you really believe all the shit you write? Or do you get a rise out of your putrid diatribe?

You and I are in a business where we see people refinance their homes to go to the Superbowl in February .... and that's a once a year opportunity.

I am in no such business, and if I were, I would strongly advise against such fool hardiness!  Besides what does thaqt have to do with Jack's treachery?

But like the offical card of the World Cup states indeed, everything with Mastercard is priceless.

What is priceless is your little dance to avoid the reality of what your boy Jack really is.  You have in the past proclaimed that his detractors were liars, sensationists and haters.  I see that true to form you maintain your stance of blind support.  time to open your eyes....he will rape you.  LOL!   why not use some of your "education"   dont waste mommy and daddy's money son.

I just hope your list made it to Santa in time. I'm waiting up this year with all forms of bribes to trade for WC tickets.

Never mind my list..I stopped believing in fairy tales long ago.  Let me clue you into something:

There is no Santa Claus, No Easter Bunny, but there is a boogie man..and his name is Jack Warner.  Make your bribes, mortgage your your home, sell your soul, but sont try to fool others into thinking that what Jack is doing is legitimate business.

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: concerned on December 25, 2005, 06:55:02 AM
This article is FRONT PAGE NEWS

(http://www.geocities.com/bhosam123/warner/TrinidadPaper.jpg)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 07:14:46 AM
And to think some men here complaining about Crime in T&T with one breath but idolising ah crook and glorifying crime in another breath.

steups.

Posted on: Today at 01:18:53 AMPosted by: g 
Insert Quote
If Simpauls really paid the TTFF $500k for exclusive rights then they could sell d tickets however dey want to. But my thing is was this process of rights acquisition tendered publically with a transparent bidding process. I would like to hear more about that tendering process if it was legit. If it was then Simpauls could do what they want ethics doh mean shit when $$$ passing. 


so yuh agree dat warner could sell warner the tickets?  and in any other nation in de world...warner would have been barred ethically from bidding on dem tix...come on man.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Trini _2026 on December 25, 2005, 08:46:15 AM
No the government doh really like to give the ttff money.There is another part to the story continued tomorrow 

then there is warners side of the story so lets  wait on dat
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: sub1 on December 25, 2005, 08:55:39 AM
Like the song goes " you aint seen nothing yet.........buh buh buh baby you aint seen nothing yet" friend and business partner  ex fifa referee  Ramdhan got the contract to sell socawarriors merchandise. And people want to know why Warner so tight with Panday. Hmmm I wonder why? I wonder what they both have in common?

The johnnys-come-lately sing his praise and say how much he has done for football not having a clue as to how much he has harmed football.

If he is spending now i dont say thanks ....I say its about time and why so little since you have made millions off the backs of Trinbagonians and the concacaf votes.

Imagine Roy Augustus, his childhood friend and ex principal now has a TTff and fifa role thanks to Warner. But Roy is also big in the UNC dance.

More to come....stay tuned.......
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Sam on December 25, 2005, 09:44:37 AM
Dwight Yorke must be does shake he head when he read these sort of things yes....

How a man will do anything for money and de men (all de players) who make T&T proud dont get nothing.....

Jack invest 10 million and its ok if he gets back his 10 million, thats only fair if he have to go that route,,,,, but when he done is like 50 million he go collect and flea.

Politics..... when yuh feel Jack was doing this becuase he was a fan, it really seems like just another business deal for him....

For a man of his calibre, its embrassing, no wonder no one respects TTFF. Is only wheel and dealing does go on there....

Have a heart Jack, for once, money is NOT everything Pardna, yes I will be happy to get some myself, but not the way you do it.... it will never last....

God dont like ugle, he will forgive you, but you WILL have to paid for your deeds, so enjoy it while you can... because it dont last...
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: superoli on December 25, 2005, 09:51:47 AM
how can people defend jack I will never understand, this is the guy who had me standing on November 19th because 8,000 extra people were in the stadium
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: FF on December 25, 2005, 09:52:06 AM
The Manfriday......please take this article and forward it to your contact at FIFA


AND MANFRIDAY..... Please also forward your emails and findings to Lasana Liburd!!!

Ppl I not seeing enough letters.... ah tell allyuh weeks now write some bleddy letters  >:(
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 25, 2005, 10:06:01 AM
Camps, who is responsible for the country's share of tickets,

This is such a scary thought that Ollie Camps is in chardge of anything


"I do not know that is happening," said Camps,

A further indictment of the incompeptence of our President, either that or a big lie.


Camps, who is responsible for the country's share of tickets, told the Sunday Express that he did not know whether Warner owned Simpaul Travel Service-the company which has claimed to have purchased all Trinidad and Tobago's World Cup tickets.

This is a bold-faced lie.


Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Big Magician on December 25, 2005, 10:16:59 AM
mama
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: morvant on December 25, 2005, 10:23:13 AM
well me and shotta go buy ah big tv and watch and allyuh enjoy it fuh me cause like meh ticket aint comming >:(
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: pass(10trini) on December 25, 2005, 11:19:40 AM
Beore ah start let me say ah Merry Christmas  to one an all. .

Everybody know me eh no Warner fan buh leh we know dat is he money dat pay for de boys an dem qualification so he have to get all preference when coming to any money making adventure in TNT Football . Nobody should be surprised to note dat Jack have ah hand in tings where making money is foremost .

So gih de man ah breeze and leh he hold he business eh . He ha tuh mek back dem millions he put out . It take two hands tuh clap as meh late Granny use to say........ he give ah great portion to de team so is only natural he be given de opps to get it back .
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Tenorsaw on December 25, 2005, 11:31:49 AM
Boss is 2001 all over again.  And in dem times, Blatter ain't say shit when  it was revealed that Warner had even the catering contract under his belt.  Camps is ah dummy.  Talking bout he ain't want to go there.  Now ah see why Boynes and dem kinda ah hesitant to give money with no budget forthcoming from the TTFF. Is one man running the show, Jack the Ripper.  So the poor man on the street, the real die-hard supporter, can't go and see the team.  Boss, this is real shit.  We make the World Cup, but maybe in the long run Trinidad and Tobago football will be better off when we purge the TTFF of Warner and his sycophants.  Fellas, it have real men on this website with the business acumen and athletic administration experience to do a much better job of running the TTFF.  This is becomiong a very powerful faction of supporters for the Soca Warriors, and we must eventually get to the point where our voice is heard and a taken into account.  Is real shit going on down there.  Jack running this thing like ah dictatorship.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 11:46:59 AM
Beore ah start let me say ah Merry Christmas  to one an all. .

Everybody know me eh no Warner fan buh leh we know dat is he money dat pay for de boys an dem qualification so he have to get all preference when coming to any money making adventure in TNT Football . Nobody should be surprised to note dat Jack have ah hand in tings where making money is foremost .

So gih de man ah breeze and leh he hold he business eh . He ha tuh mek back dem millions he put out . It take two hands tuh clap as meh late Granny use to say........ he give ah great portion to de team so is only natural he be given de opps to get it back .

Dat is real shit talk dey fella.  Yuh have tuh be ah Warner fan to talk dat ta-ta.  What about de Broad cast rights?  Dat is he own..yet he making money and de Federation always begging.

De travel and accomadation rights is he own..he making money and de Federation always begging fuh money.

De tickets are allocated for fans..he own dat and making money...plenty money..so what right?  he put money in ent?  Man dat is so much ta-ta it eh funny.  allyuh cyar see de forest fuh de trees.

If Jack did care bout football and T&T he would not move so.  Is all business fuh he.  Why we eh have no transparency in de TTFF?   ow come Camps and dem eh know he own Simpauls yet de entire country know dat?

I agree dat if Jack loans de TTFF money dey should [ay him back...but since we NEVER get to see how much he really put in..and the terms ah de so-called loans it leaves it open up fuh tiefing like mad and dat is what dey doing fuh years now!

Is only man without commonsense dat go agree with that kinda bullsh!t!

allyuh quick to bad talk de government...but is Jack fault.

No business want to deal with his crooked ass ways.  And apparently neither do the government.

Would you invest money in an organization dat does not reveal expenditures and income?

De man who auditing de TTFF also hired by de TTFF in other capacities...yuh doh find dat starnge and counter to openness?

steups.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Trini_fan on December 25, 2005, 11:48:08 AM
Maybe Tallman could answer my questions:

Can't the gov't step in?

What power can they exercise with reagrds to the TTFF?

Can they veto decisions such as selling rights to Jack Warner?

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 25, 2005, 11:57:39 AM
Maybe Tallman could answer my questions:

Can't the gov't step in?

What power can they exercise with reagrds to the TTFF?

Can they veto decisions such as selling rights to Jack Warner?



Any such intervention by the Gov't, if successful, would result in the TTFF being suspended by FIFA.

Until Camps and company are voted out, we are at their mercy.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: doc on December 25, 2005, 11:59:37 AM
There are a couple questions that need to be answered by those in the know .... Fuentes are you reading this ???
What is the operational structure of the TTFF ... where are the checks and balances ???
What is the role of the special advisor (Its not outlined in the constitution)
Is Fuentes JW's media officer or the TTFF's ???

Fuentes, you need to clear the air!!!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 12:02:40 PM
Maybe Tallman could answer my questions:

Can't the gov't step in?

What power can they exercise with reagrds to the TTFF?

Can they veto decisions such as selling rights to Jack Warner?



Any such intervention by the Gov't, if successful, would result in the TTFF being suspended by FIFA.

Until Camps and company are voted out, we are at their mercy.

Not exactly eh.  first of all the govt. not messing in de running of de TTFF, but they can intervene in anti-trust dealings if T&T have such laws.

there should be laws governing this misbehaviour in T&T..if not we real backwards

de TTFF not beyond de law and neither is FIFA.

Something should be done about this continued tief ting.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: doc on December 25, 2005, 12:06:07 PM
Maybe Tallman could answer my questions:

Can't the gov't step in?

What power can they exercise with reagrds to the TTFF?

Can they veto decisions such as selling rights to Jack Warner?



Any such intervention by the Gov't, if successful, would result in the TTFF being suspended by FIFA.

Until Camps and company are voted out, we are at their mercy.

If we put the TTFF and all other sports' governing bodies under the Ministry of sports, would that provide the oversight necessary ??? (A copy of the French model!)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 25, 2005, 12:22:36 PM
Maybe Tallman could answer my questions:

Can't the gov't step in?

What power can they exercise with reagrds to the TTFF?

Can they veto decisions such as selling rights to Jack Warner?



Any such intervention by the Gov't, if successful, would result in the TTFF being suspended by FIFA.

Until Camps and company are voted out, we are at their mercy.

If we put the TTFF and all other sports' governing bodies under the Ministry of sports, would that provide the oversight necessary ??? (A copy of the French model!)

From what I understand if the TTFF is the body recognized by FIFA outside forces cannot exert influence on them unless they choose to allow it.

If Government wer to impose any measures that amounted to the usurping of the TTFF's power and management of local football there would be a problem.

As paradoxical as it sounds any restructuring of the TTFF has to come from within the TTFF.

What we need to know is how the elections system works, how are clubs regional associations and stakeholders in local football represented/

Do they care that Camps and they are not the best for our football? Do they just accept the status quo?

Do we?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 25, 2005, 12:32:33 PM
Not exactly eh.  first of all the govt. not messing in de running of de TTFF, but they can intervene in anti-trust dealings if T&T have such laws.

there should be laws governing this misbehaviour in T&T..if not we real backwards

There are no such laws being enforced in TnT, if they exist.

Giving business to yourself your friends and your family for goods and services purchased with public funds is nothing new.

Sad but true. PNM, UNC, Small businessman, big businessman same story.

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 25, 2005, 12:34:49 PM

Dat is real shit talk dey fella.  What about de Broad cast rights?  Dat is he own..yet he making money and de Federation always begging.

De travel and accomadation rights is he own..he making money and de Federation always begging fuh money.

De tickets are allocated for fans..he own dat and making money...plenty money..so what right?  he put money in ent?  Man dat is so much ta-ta it eh funny.  allyuh cyar see de forest fuh de trees.

...Why we eh have no transparency in de TTFF?    

I agree dat if Jack loans de TTFF money dey should [pay him back...but since we NEVER get to see how much he really put in..and the terms ah de so-called loans it leaves it open up fuh tiefing like mad and dat is what dey doing fuh years now!

Would you invest money in an organization dat does not reveal expenditures and income?

De man who auditing de TTFF also hired by de TTFF in other capacities...yuh doh find dat starnge and counter to openness?

steups.


Very good points, TrueTrini.  For those that really don't get it, allow me a lil' leeway of plagiarism just to highlight de important points you made:

(1)  No Transparency:  Since the financial statements seem to be closed to de citizens of T&T, JW through his affiliations with Simpauls etc, is able to gain an unfair advantage when it comes to the allotment of tickets, and as such, it's pricing.

(2)  Funds loaned to the TTFF by JW:  As "kind" (lol) as this may seem by JW, in the absence of all sytematic checks and balances by independent auditors, the most he would have deserved in eventual repayment would have been his principal plus a fair rate of interest based on the prime rate of T&T.  Anything more than that should be subject to investigation.

(3) The clear existence of Conflicts of Interest:  JW owns the company, "Simpauls", that wins the "closed" bid on the World Cup tickets allocated by FIFA for T&T.  Simpauls gets to decide on packaging, allocation, and price.  The market was left out of the decision making process, creating a pricing structure without regard to the natural market forces.

We are at a crossroads right now.    We can take it lying down, accepting things for what they are, and how things work.  Or we can fight, and make noise, and call out for justice to be served.
 
History will judge our generation on how we handle this challenge.        
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 25, 2005, 01:10:54 PM
This is the BIG problem I have with the Gov't reimbursing people for money already spent.

Firstly it is the TTFF's job to budget this includes finding sources of income BEFORE a WC campaign or adjusting to suit.

When the money is spent we have to basically trust that it was spent well. If the money is spent on services from companies OWNED by people in the TTFF adminstration how do we know what the true costs are?

What makes it really bad is when you see the price that they charge for a WC package you have to wonder whether all of the travel arrangements provided by Simpaul's or other companies that comprise part of the 16 Million dollars were over-priced as well.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 01:18:47 PM
This is the BIG problem I have with the Gov't reimbursing people for money already spent.

Firstly it is the TTFF's job to budget this includes finding sources of income BEFORE a WC campaign or adjusting to suit.

When the money is spent we have to basically trust that it was spent well. If the money is spent on services from companies OWNED by people in the TTFF adminstration how do we know what the true costs are?

What makes it really bad is when you see the price that they charge for a WC package you have to wonder whether all of the travel arrangements provided by Simpaul's or other companies that comprise part of the 16 Million dollars were over-priced as well.

Obviously! 

But according to Rotato Poti...dat is shrewd business!

I say monkey business...but what I know..I eh bright nor educated as he.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: maxg on December 25, 2005, 01:33:37 PM
I hear the noise, and ah agree with all what is being said...if...if...true..
ah jus would like to comment on a few points...jus my take
1. The tickets should not and would not be for everybody. Tenor, poor man/man in the street cannot go Germany..one of the probs. in trini is many feel they should have everything everybody else have, regardless of their choices and stations in life..so when they doh have it, it ok to take it from somebody else, cause in Trini, why should dem have and we don't...eventually the youths in their developing minds, start elieving that crap...I living in Canada, sacrificed to get an education, freezin meh tail orf an  wukkin for the last 31 years, have a sizeable family yes, but married to a professional , and I can tell yuh now...ah doh know if ah would be able to afford a ticket to germany....ah not talking bout affording the time or anything else...jus finances....buh ah bussin meh tail some more tryin..
2. Jack doh have the only tickets and obviously not the cheapest to Germany.
3. As palos said "in the confusion of the win", we all tried to believe, everything was fine...the country go pull together, T&T on the map, big time, and who was crook before go turn samaritian, we going as one T&T...who was incompetent, will now try to improve...all ah we willing to pull together and help...the dream come true.....now here go the alarm...back to reality....there is no event, none, sporting or otherwise can do that...yes, under-pressure, we would pull together for a common goal, but once achieved, is every man/group for self...problem is whichever group you choose, good or bad, is still a group, and a matter of opinion..human nature & society
4.  this is still dispicable, and whichever group you choose, make yuh foreign contacts,for Germany or Barbados and boycott Simpaul Travel service forever.. ...buy no tickets in T&T...those that could be affording a trip to Germany...
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 01:49:04 PM
I hear the noise, and ah agree with all what is being said...if...if...true..
ah jus would like to comment on a few points...jus my take
1. The tickets should not and would not be for everybody. Tenor, poor man/man in the street cannot go Germany..one of the probs. in trini is many feel they should have everything everybody else have, regardless of their choices and stations in life..so when they doh have it, it ok to take it from somebody else, cause in Trini, why should dem have and we don't...eventually the youths in their developing minds, start elieving that crap...I living in Canada, sacrificed to get an education, freezin meh tail orf an  wukkin for the last 31 years, have a sizeable family yes, but married to a professional , and I can tell yuh now...ah doh know if ah would be able to afford a ticket to germany....ah not talking bout affording the time or anything else...jus finances....buh ah bussin meh tail some more tryin..
2. Jack doh have the only tickets and obviously not the cheapest to Germany.
3. As palos said "in the confusion of the win", we all tried to believe, everything was fine...the country go pull together, T&T on the map, big time, and who was crook before go turn samaritian, we going as one T&T...who was incompetent, will now try to improve...all ah we willing to pull together and help...the dream come true.....now here go the alarm...back to reality....there is no event, none, sporting or otherwise can do that...yes, under-pressure, we would pull together for a common goal, but once achieved, is every man/group for self...problem is whichever group you choose, good or bad, is still a group, and a matter of opinion..human nature & society
4.  this is still dispicable, and whichever group you choose, make yuh foreign contacts,for Germany or Barbados and boycott Simpaul Travel service forever.. ...buy no tickets in T&T...those that could be affording a trip to Germany...

1.  While it is true that not everyman can well afford to go to Germany..the ticket allocation should be made available to everybody.  Look at an earlier post and you will see dat one man done boasting dat he going to shell out he $5000.00  US to travel to Germany.  He eh care he says Jack deserve it due to savvy business deaslings.  what ah moron!

2.  Jack eh have de only tickets, but by keeping control and deciding who going abritarily, without pricing dem tix legitmately..and selling dem thru he own company he nasty no arse.

3.  Yes you and Palos correct..but ah warning man since we qualify dat de bachannal now start.  More money fuh me (sung to de song more rum fuh me)!  I understand that in teh euphoria we come together fuh ah whie, but as time elapses we revert..but what is the role of government if they cyar keep de laws and de people safe from scoundrels who only seek self gain?

4.  Yes it is despicable and downright wrong what jack and dem doing fuh years now.  Palos right is like ah woman marrying ah woman beater because she feel he go change becasue dem get married.

we need to divorce Jack and as yuh say boycott he and all ah dem bastards fuh ever...but why ah feel dat go never happen?

I know why....we come like dem people in de roman empire....once we get ah little bone every so often we does forget de licks we getting all de time
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: maxg on December 25, 2005, 02:18:47 PM
"
In any society HARD work and SAVING money is THE only way!
Right Maxg?

nah doh, that is my choice, it is not the only way..it is a society because it is made up of all kinds of people who have all kinds of beliefs...so my way different to my neighbours, but we all have something different to offer the whole..I neither work extremely hard or save very well, because it is really all relative... Ihave met some guys wukkin 3 jobs and never takin a holiday in 20+ years...not me... I not workin weekends unless ah matter of Life & death, yet many must work weekends just to make ends meet, or vrious other reasons ..so the crook/bandit  in our society has some other contribution, but I wouldn't say he doh work hard or save...ah met ah few, (nb. can't say ah know dem eh) and some were the nicest and the most considerate people I met, some were even highly educated, and some had none at all...however, ah never did business with dem...if I did ah mighta see/feel  a different side...
truetrini we could talk till we blue, if trinis in trini doh act...we would probably get laffed at for being differnt, chupid and blue
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: weary1969 on December 25, 2005, 04:42:24 PM
For all who taught that spent the money because he loved TNT. It is time to wake up from your stupor.

As for SPALK in the pre love affair with Jack he would have commented, but Jack no longer makes the steups section. He already said on Umballa programme that the man have a right to make back his money.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 25, 2005, 04:44:23 PM
i go pelt ah big big stone at he when i geh tuh dortmund on my bloody own.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 25, 2005, 04:58:30 PM
Doh worry Jefferz, ah go supply de stones... :devil:     :rotfl:    :rotfl:    :rotfl:
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: ballfever on December 25, 2005, 05:26:05 PM
truetrini, as we all know, talk is cheap, :yapping: especially when it comin from one or two sources who de jefes see as insignificant. For what it's worth, ah read d article an ah support both yuh argument and yuh position on d matter 100%. ah ha 2 question though: 1. does anyone on this forum, or all of us collectively have the WILL to DO anything about this? 2. if so,how do we convert d talk here into a demonstrable an meaningful statement to d powers that be that enuff is enuff? ah thinkin about dis ting sometime now,buh yet to come up with any suggestions, except tuh say dat we (socawarriors.net) ha tuh raise we profile a bit, because we is small fries wey dem fellas is concerned. d kinda discussions dat does go on here iz meaningful, well intentioned,an in some cases well researched material, buh is like blinkin in d dark: u know yuh doin it, buh who tuh see aint seein.......
Ah supportin any sensible, well thought out move by anybody or group dat cud deal wit dis :bs: situation for good....  
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 05:52:36 PM
truetrini, as we all know, talk is cheap, :yapping: especially when it comin from one or two sources who de jefes see as insignificant. For what it's worth, ah read d article an ah support both yuh argument and yuh position on d matter 100%.
 ah ha 2 question though: 1. does anyone on this forum, or all of us collectively have the WILL to DO anything about this?

Unfortunately you are very correct.  If the governement in T&T encourages such wanton and blatant transgression of the law without any penalties for those who mistreat the citzenery with impunity...then we are somewhat stymied.  That is not to say that a concerted effort from one or many cannot bring change. but when we have people like Rotato Poti and others who blindly support Mr. Warner based on political affiliation and issues of race (yes race, I said it), we are handcuffed even more.   I am issusing a challenge here and now to the memebers of Warrior Nation to come up with a plan to address this issue.  I have ideas, but I am seeking input, because two heads better than one!

2. if so,how do we convert d talk here into a demonstrable an meaningful statement to d powers that be that enuff is enuff? ah thinkin about dis ting sometime now,buh yet to come up with any suggestions, except tuh say dat we (socawarriors.net) ha tuh raise we profile a bit, because we is small fries wey dem fellas is concerned. d kinda discussions dat does go on here iz meaningful, well intentioned,an in some cases well researched material, buh is like blinkin in d dark: u know yuh doin it, buh who tuh see aint seein.......
Ah supportin any sensible, well thought out move by anybody or group dat cud deal wit dis :bs: situation for good....  

Steps have been taken to raise our profile, but as you rightly said, talk is cheap and we Trinis have very short memories.  I can remember the outpouring of love fuh de same Jack Warner after the Team qualified for the World Cup.  That man was canonized and was being promoted as a PRIME CANDIDATE fuh de Trinity Cross.

I see that Valentino Singh of the Guardian is hard at work pushing for Jack to be awarded the Cross too.  I know both Camps and Tino from my days at Harvard.  Maybe there lies the connection.  But for the love of God I cannot understand how ah real grassroots man like Tino supports Jack Warner..Maybe someone can help me understand ???

Ok, back to the topic...maybe we can start to bombard the TTFF and the Newspapers and the Radio Stations and the UNC and the PNM with petitions and letters, demanding changes?

Maybe we can organize a march like de death march against Corruption in T&T and use that platform to highlight the TTFF as well as the Government and the Opposition???

I too will do all I can including flying down to T&T to be part of any sensible course of action against such rotten and damn corrupt behaviours.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Feliziano on December 25, 2005, 06:49:36 PM
hmmm..allyuh ent think we shoulda done the right thing as true supporters and bought the Trinidad & Tobago Team Specific Tickets(TST) when they were available for all at the time prior to our qualification..and then take the bounce of the administartion fee if we didnt make it in the end?

this tells me we all is a bunch ah waggonist too..me included..cause we basically jump on de bandwagon looking and begging for tickets after we qualify..whereas if we say we 100% behind the team going to Germany and we wanted to be there..we woulda had our tickets in had beforehand.

btw this TTFF thing is one big mess..how come a dumbass like Ollie Camps still is President after doing shit after shit for bout 20 years?..he really have to be a puppet leader.
also i think if the govenrment do intervene..we might get sanctioned by FIFA.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 06:56:32 PM
hmmm..allyuh ent think we shoulda done the right thing as true supporters and bought the Trinidad & Tobago Team Specific Tickets(TST) when they were available for all at the time prior to our qualification..and then take the bounce of the administartion fee if we didnt make it in the end?

this tells me we all is a bunch ah waggonist too..me included..cause we basically jump on de bandwagon looking and begging for tickets after we qualify..whereas if we say we 100% behind the team going to Germany and we wanted to be there..we woulda had our tickets in had beforehand.

btw this TTFF thing is one big mess..how come a dumbass like Ollie Camps still is President after doing shit after shit for bout 20 years?..he really have to be a puppet leader.
also i think if the govenrment do intervene..we might get sanctioned by FIFA.

Maybe some of us did just that???

The point is the TTFF has a right to make the tickets available to ALL!

REGARDLESS!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Feliziano on December 25, 2005, 07:00:22 PM
yeah ah know TTFF have a right to make tickets available to everybody..but yuh think we would be bitching bout it so much if we didnt have any tickets right now?lol
if we had we tickets already..as soon as a man make a post to complain bout tickets..we woulda call him a waggonist  ;D

but yeah everybody shoulda have access to tickets to go Germany regardless if they are true fans or just going for the lime.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Lower St. John on December 25, 2005, 07:18:40 PM
No comment!!  Hopefully I am lucky to get a tciket in some form and fashion without having to pay $30,000.

I will say this though, the notion of men trying to justify Jack's alledged actions is even more pathetic.  Too many men are ignorant of the runnings of the TTFF and FIFA by extension to add value to this age old argument of "Jack" being a Villain or a Hero to the people of Trinidad and Tobago.  There will never be a consensus. 

What is in the dark will always come to light.

Bless Up!!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 07:21:17 PM
merry christmas..  answer yuh phone tony.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 25, 2005, 08:26:44 PM
Another sad thing about the corruption in the TTFF, FIFA, and the entity that is Jack Warner, is that this kind of corruption is also endemic within the Olympic committee, and the United Nations.  When we hear stories of the underhand bribing of the "too-glad-to-accept-bribes" Olympic officials that takes place in order to secure a vote for the particular city to host; or even the Oil for food debacle that took place in Iraq, in which UN officials basically accepted bribes in the form of millions of barrels of oil each, by Saddam Hussein, to look the other way...and the world for the most part stayed silent by-the-way (oh, yeah, they did blamed de US...hmmmmmmm). 

Look, we ourselves have to decide what part are we to play in bringing the arms of justice to grab hold of the guilty parties.  Silence, inaction, and scapegoating will not cut it.  Jack Warner should face the justice system in T&T, and we should not look back with regret when it happens.     
Title: In direct response to your claims of racism.
Post by: Rotato Poti on December 25, 2005, 09:29:31 PM
but when we have people like Rotato Poti and others who blindly support Mr. Warner based on political affiliation and issues of race (yes race, I said it), we are handcuffed even more.   


To be fair sir, insinuating that I am some sort of racist by means of my support for Jack Warner's recognition based on his monetary support of the TT Mens' Sr. Team is outrageous.

Your vendetta against me started when I commented that Jack should be rewarded with the Trinity Cross, and if he was not, it would be because of HIS political affiliation with the UNC. Not mine - but his.
While it seems clear to the rational folk on the street, that the square off between Jack in the UNC corner and Roger in the PNM corner obviously has a political twist to it - and how that has escalated to all Jack "award backers" being profiled as bigots and racist is clearly a diversion on your part to hide your own insecure interests.

Apparently my echo of support for Jack must have set off some political bias in you and fired up your own forum backers who came out from even the badlands of Trincity to "bu'n out all of my type"

I'm not going to ask that you withdraw your comments - you're entitled to them, but I do ask that before you run off calling names, you actually think about your allegations.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Rotato Poti on December 25, 2005, 09:39:23 PM
hmmm..allyuh ent think we shoulda done the right thing as true supporters and bought the Trinidad & Tobago Team Specific Tickets(TST) when they were available for all at the time prior to our qualification..and then take the bounce of the administartion fee if we didnt make it in the end?

this tells me we all is a bunch ah waggonist too..me included..cause we basically jump on de bandwagon looking and begging for tickets after we qualify..whereas if we say we 100% behind the team going to Germany and we wanted to be there..we woulda had our tickets in had beforehand.


I never thought I would say this about a Naps man .... but hats off to you sir.

Between this, and MAXG's

1. The tickets should not and would not be for everybody. Tenor, poor man/man in the street cannot go Germany..one of the probs. in trini is many feel they should have everything everybody else have, regardless of their choices and stations in life..so when they doh have it, it ok to take it from somebody else, cause in Trini, why should dem have and we don't...eventually the youths in their developing minds, start elieving that crap...I living in Canada, sacrificed to get an education, freezin meh tail orf an  wukkin for the last 31 years, have a sizeable family yes, but married to a professional , and I can tell yuh now...ah doh know if ah would be able to afford a ticket to germany....ah not talking bout affording the time or anything else...jus finances....buh ah bussin meh tail some more tryin..

Finally someone seeing the light.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 09:48:38 PM
where did I call you a racist?  Not me sir.  I did lump you into the category of blind supporter....and in that category I had those who supported Jack based on race.

But your defensiveness is duly noted.

I hold no vendetta against you...personally...per se...but your idiotic backing of Jack and your cursory dismissal of credible journalists as gossip columnists..lends you to continued ridicule.

As for me and politics..I can stand none of it.

I can not forget you...I see you as you truely are..no apologies from me on that!

Understand.

By the way..I am way superior to ypou in ALL ways and in every conceivable manner...so keep your condesending shit away...ok?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 09:51:58 PM
hmmm..allyuh ent think we shoulda done the right thing as true supporters and bought the Trinidad & Tobago Team Specific Tickets(TST) when they were available for all at the time prior to our qualification..and then take the bounce of the administartion fee if we didnt make it in the end?

this tells me we all is a bunch ah waggonist too..me included..cause we basically jump on de bandwagon looking and begging for tickets after we qualify..whereas if we say we 100% behind the team going to Germany and we wanted to be there..we woulda had our tickets in had beforehand.


I never thought I would say this about a Naps man .... but hats off to you sir.

Between this, and MAXG's

1. The tickets should not and would not be for everybody. Tenor, poor man/man in the street cannot go Germany..one of the probs. in trini is many feel they should have everything everybody else have, regardless of their choices and stations in life..so when they doh have it, it ok to take it from somebody else, cause in Trini, why should dem have and we don't...eventually the youths in their developing minds, start elieving that crap...I living in Canada, sacrificed to get an education, freezin meh tail orf an  wukkin for the last 31 years, have a sizeable family yes, but married to a professional , and I can tell yuh now...ah doh know if ah would be able to afford a ticket to germany....ah not talking bout affording the time or anything else...jus finances....buh ah bussin meh tail some more tryin..

Finally someone seeing the light.

again you dismiss the rest of Feliz's arguement as well as Maxg's to keep your support riding high for Jack...why?

Maxg was right..the tickets were not going to be affordable to all trinis..so what is your popint?  I acknowledge that readily.

And as for Feliz' point...well he ahs no point at all.

M<aybe some people don't have credit cards..and they were awaiting the allocation in T&T to purchase.

Also a lot of people clearly did not understand the pre-sale of the tickets as evidenced by all the threads about that very issue on this self same board.

You are an ass.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Feliziano on December 25, 2005, 10:31:39 PM
yeah me ent have no point at all  ;D
it was just an observation on my part bout this whole ticket thing lol
btw not to be mean or run people down..but yuh think it right for people wanting to go to Germany and they ent even have a credit card?
i see we might end up in that arguement again like the taking out of loans for Germany again lol
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 25, 2005, 10:39:49 PM
yeah me ent have no point at all  ;D
it was just an observation on my part bout this whole ticket thing lol
btw not to be mean or run people down..but yuh think it right for people wanting to go to Germany and they ent even have a credit card?
i see we might end up in that arguement again like the taking out of loans for Germany again lol

I have ah millionaire living right down de road from me and he eh have ah credit card..besides yuh ehs ee dey offer ah bank draft option..ah wonder why?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 25, 2005, 11:28:27 PM
Guys, this has nothing to do with who has a credit card, or who can or cannot afford to purchase the tickets and go to Germany, or who had the opportunity to purchase tickets prior to our actual qualification.

The issue at hand is (granted the accuracy of the article), Jack Warner and his cohorts through the ownership of Simpauls, gained an unfair advantage in the acquisation, packaging, and then re-sale of the tickets.  If the allegations are accurate, it would appear that JW has decided on the pricing of the tickets without the natuaral market of possible buyers playing a part in reaching a fair price/supply equilibrium.  JW took the opportunity away from all possible "credible buyers."

The question remains: What gives JW the right to do this?  Is this legal?  If anyone on this forum is an expert on Trinidad & Tobago jurisprudence, then please come forth with an answer to a simple question.  If all allegations are totally accurate, and there is indeed a direct link between JW and Simpauls, have any laws been breached by the fact that JW received these tickets?  Also, if  T&T is out of jurisdiction as this is a FIFA issue, could T&T still seek action based on fraud?
Bottom-line, which entity has jurisdiction in a case like this?  FIFA in a civil suit of some sort, and/or T&T in a civil or criminal suit? 

Or no one?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: doc on December 25, 2005, 11:49:47 PM
Another sad thing about the corruption in the TTFF, FIFA, and the entity that is Jack Warner, is that this kind of corruption is also endemic within the Olympic committee, and the United Nations.  When we hear stories of the underhand bribing of the "too-glad-to-accept-bribes" Olympic officials that takes place in order to secure a vote for the particular city to host; or even the Oil for food debacle that took place in Iraq, in which UN officials basically accepted bribes in the form of millions of barrels of oil each, by Saddam Hussein, to look the other way...and the world for the most part stayed silent by-the-way (oh, yeah, they did blamed de US...hmmmmmmm). 

Look, we ourselves have to decide what part are we to play in bringing the arms of justice to grab hold of the guilty parties.  Silence, inaction, and scapegoating will not cut it.  Jack Warner should face the justice system in T&T, and we should not look back with regret when it happens.     

If you haven't read FIFA's code of ethics, I'd suggest you do :devil: :devil:
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 26, 2005, 12:01:11 AM
Another sad thing about the corruption in the TTFF, FIFA, and the entity that is Jack Warner, is that this kind of corruption is also endemic within the Olympic committee, and the United Nations.  When we hear stories of the underhand bribing of the "too-glad-to-accept-bribes" Olympic officials that takes place in order to secure a vote for the particular city to host; or even the Oil for food debacle that took place in Iraq, in which UN officials basically accepted bribes in the form of millions of barrels of oil each, by Saddam Hussein, to look the other way...and the world for the most part stayed silent by-the-way (oh, yeah, they did blamed de US...hmmmmmmm). 

Look, we ourselves have to decide what part are we to play in bringing the arms of justice to grab hold of the guilty parties.  Silence, inaction, and scapegoating will not cut it.  Jack Warner should face the justice system in T&T, and we should not look back with regret when it happens.     

If you haven't read FIFA's code of ethics, I'd suggest you do :devil: :devil:

Why don't you enlighten us, Doc? ;)    I'm quite interested to learn if a member of FIFA's executive body is exempt from questionable practices  leading to obvious conflicts of  interests.   What does the FIFA statutes or their Code of Ethics say about that, Doc?  ;)     
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Feliziano on December 26, 2005, 05:30:14 AM
Guys, this has nothing to do with who has a credit card, or who can or cannot afford to purchase the tickets and go to Germany, or who had the opportunity to purchase tickets prior to our actual qualification.

The issue at hand is (granted the accuracy of the article), Jack Warner and his cohorts through the ownership of Simpauls, gained an unfair advantage in the acquisation, packaging, and then re-sale of the tickets.  If the allegations are accurate, it would appear that JW has decided on the pricing of the tickets without the natuaral market of possible buyers playing a part in reaching a fair price/supply equilibrium.  JW took the opportunity away from all possible "credible buyers."

The question remains: What gives JW the right to do this?  Is this legal?  If anyone on this forum is an expert on Trinidad & Tobago jurisprudence, then please come forth with an answer to a simple question.  If all allegations are totally accurate, and there is indeed a direct link between JW and Simpauls, has any laws been breached by the fact that JW received these tickets?  Also, if  T&T is out of jurisdiction as this is a FIFA issue, could T&T still seek action based on fraud?
Bottom-line, which entity has jurisdiction in a case like this?  FIFA in a civil suit of some sort, and/or T&T in a civil or criminal suit? 

Or no one?

yes we knew this was a thread bout Jack and his pot of Gold tickets..but i was just making the observation bout if some of us had tickets..we wouldntve cared bout who didnt have access or can afford them...we woulda been calling all ah dem waggonist.
also maybe it have nothing else better going on to bitch bout  ;D ..full day of English football on tv ahead.

but anyway Jack is wrong..whether is good business or not..or that he reaping his rewards from the TTFF.

oh another thing i didnt like was that Jefferz coming on here trying to get tickets for he Trini Posse buddies..if them claim to be so big..they could fend for themselves...ah sure them have the right connections too  ;)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: JDB on December 26, 2005, 06:07:35 AM

yes we knew this was a thread bout Jack and his pot of Gold tickets..but i was just making the observation bout if some of us had tickets..we wouldntve cared bout who didnt have access or can afford them...we woulda been calling all ah dem waggonist.
also maybe it have nothing else better going on to bitch bout  ;D ..full day of English football on tv ahead.

but anyway Jack is wrong..whether is good business or not..or that he reaping his rewards from the TTFF.

Whether men have tickets or not this is an objectionable situation.

Even though I believe that tickets will go on sale after this package has run its cost they will still be difficult to get.

But most importantly we had an opportunity to go FORWARD with this qualification, to progress. This erodes whatever little public trust the people had in the TTFF. Yes people will forget over time but why should they.

Then they will complain when they can't get 25,000 people in the stadium regularly.

But they are doing nothing to help themselves and help the football. WHICH IS SUPPOSED TO BE THEIR JOB.

At best this whole scene is poor management at worst pure greed and at th eend of the day TnT football is worse off than it would be if we DO THINGS RIGHT.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: fishs on December 26, 2005, 08:07:42 AM
Maybe most men here is real WAGGONISTS tuh local football.
Ah coulda see dis coming from ah mile away.
But Jack thinking is dat he was almost solely responsible for trini being where we are and his reasoning will always be Jack's reasoning,
Payback time.
No calculation fuh what is ah reasonable profit to make on tickets, to hell with everybody who feel ah is ah tief because is my business making de money, actually allyuh ungratefull, after all we wouldna be having dis shit if wasn't for me Jack Warner.

This thing is normal Jack MO and I going to tell men here we will talk about it for years after like 89' fiasco, but yuh know what ?
It eh changing de price ah macaroni because Jack doing want Jack want and to hell with everybody.

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 09:53:35 AM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 26, 2005, 10:03:46 AM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Quote
Hell yeah, Give him de cross oui!!!. Self interest or no self interest he was very instrumental in getting us to the Big Fete!!!


seems like apathy is yuh forte?

Come on man..yuh cyar be serious right?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 10:10:48 AM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Quote
Hell yeah, Give him de cross oui!!!. Self interest or no self interest he was very instrumental in getting us to the Big Fete!!!


seems like apathy is yuh forte?

Come on man..yuh cyar be serious right?

Nah Point Fortin is my forte(get it, Fortin and forte...same pronunciation ;D )

on ah serious note, how should tickets for the games be disbursed to the public? What is the procedure or process for making that possible? Also what are your feelings on the socawarriors paraphanalia issue ie who gets exclusive rights to produce items bearing the socawarriors logo/name etc.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 26, 2005, 10:20:58 AM
Simple..add a premium and put dem for sale..first come first serve..or a lottery system..like how dey writing man name in ah copy book.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: concerned on December 26, 2005, 10:23:54 AM
18000 $ profit by 2000 packages is a wopping 36 million profit....with NO refund policy
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 26, 2005, 11:43:06 AM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 01:17:47 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 26, 2005, 02:13:38 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   

Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 26, 2005, 02:28:49 PM
like truetrini say,

"Jack for Trinity Cross!"
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 03:10:23 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 26, 2005, 03:57:11 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 04:44:39 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: OutsideMan on December 26, 2005, 05:00:25 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)

If you read my earlier posts on this matter from yesterday, you would see that I make it clear that it all depends on the accuracy of the allegations etc.  Anyway, every battle starts from somewhere.  All the other issues, airport scandal, money laundering by politicians of ill gotten gains etc, should also be taken seriously.  But the issue at hand in this dicussion was JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF...period.  We can talk of corruption in the Roman Empire, to the Czars of Russia pre 1917.  But it's neither here nor there in relation to JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF.  Anyway, let's see where this goes.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pointman on December 26, 2005, 05:04:21 PM
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)

If you read my earlier posts on this matter from yesterday, you would see that I make it clear that it all depends on the accuracy of the allegations etc.  Anyway, every battle starts from somewhere.  All the other issues, airport scandal, money laundering by politicians of ill gotten gains etc, should also be taken seriously.  But the issue at hand in this dicussion was JW, Simpauls, and the TTFF...period.  We can talk of corruption in the Roman Empire, to the Czars of Russia pre 1917.  But it's neither here nor there in relation to JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF.  Anyway, let's see where this goes.
:rotfl: awright boss yuh make meh laugh
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: FATZ on December 26, 2005, 06:50:09 PM
Well boy, i just came back into the country and was watching through the old papers and saw this damn headline big and bold, i also saw stories about murders, car crashes and other shit but this one topic had to be read first and right now i'm waiting for the 2nd part but to all JACK Warner 'bamsy flies' like potato toti and the others, this is what the man doing to Trinidad again and again and allyuh fools just supporting blindly. This is as bold faced and bold face can be, the biggest criminal in T&T is Jack Warner. >:( >:(
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Sam on December 27, 2005, 11:08:35 AM
Fellas I spoke to Jack Warner and he said he can understand my anger, which anger is no doubt based on ignorance but by Monday next everything shall be revealed, do have some patience, my friend.

So I (Sam) will wait patiencely before I say anything more on this issue.
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: truetrini on December 27, 2005, 11:16:04 AM
OK Sam I waiting too.

Jack buying some time to come up with an explaination..so I hope is ah damn good one.

I cyar wait!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Pasdah Beatz on December 28, 2005, 09:09:06 AM
Yea jack does it again.... yuh feel any ah we broke @$$ niggaz go be able tuh afford any tickets now, Jack go make ah killing... Like when he said centre of excellence wouldah be ah skool fuh football,,, skool my left nut him making real money....



Ah alyuh feel it done dey..... he sold the rights to the adidas uniform to He refree buddy so ah normal kit starts at bout $300 yuh go see the price now!!!!  

ah set ah bloody tief running de football now but me nah frighten.... as meh mama always used tuh say.....
5 DAYS FUH TIEF ONE DAY FUH POLICE


Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: ricky on December 28, 2005, 10:01:54 AM
Fellas I spoke to Jack Warner and he said he can understand my anger, which anger is no doubt based on ignorance but by Monday next everything shall be revealed, do have some patience, my friend.

So I (Sam) will wait patiencely before I say anything more on this issue.

Sam thanks for the update from Cactus Jack but i personally think come monday he going to be telling us the tickets all sold out or some other news we do not want to hear.
If he come out Monday and puts Tickets only for sale, the people who bought from simpaul already will be PISSED, so I  think its too late for him to go back from here.....
WE SCREWED
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 28, 2005, 10:17:37 AM
I just know i goin wit about 20 ah meh freinds we apply for we tickets we screem ah seriously cheap travel  plan and we ROUGHIN IT. At this point i couldnt care less for this short, balding chip mout......

J-J-J-Ja-Jack! Wu-Wu-Wu-Warner!

JUST GIVE MEH, MEH BIG STONE WHEN WE GET INTO DE STADIUM IN DORTMUND AND I WILL TAKE CARE OFF THIS WHOLE, Caribbean dictatorship problem.


Beenhakker for Concacaf President!
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: gothic on December 29, 2005, 02:04:52 AM
i normally just read the post here but this time JW forced me to post..

this is just blatant man...i have every thing else organize for Germany but it look like i(and 9 friends) will have to hope for tickets from fifa or stand outside de stadiums now cause i ent paying TT30,000 for a package i could organize better for myself just to get jack richer
Title: Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
Post by: Jefferz on December 29, 2005, 02:09:37 AM
same here.
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