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Author Topic: $800,000 a month for what?  (Read 15351 times)

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Offline supporter

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #90 on: January 09, 2006, 05:50:35 AM »
look back in the thread and re-read. im not going to retype something over and over because you dont want to read the posts. ah done with you.
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Offline spideybuff

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #91 on: January 09, 2006, 10:15:29 AM »
He should ask the same question of all the CEO's in the country...or the world for that matter. Millions of dollars to sit in their office and attend meetings?

You get paid as recompense for your experience and qualifications regardless of what you actually do in a job. And the more specialist the market, the higher the salary...regardless of what you actually do. Otherwise, the policeman on the street who facing bullets everyday should be paid more than the commissioner safely in the office. It's just the way the world works, so doh attack Beenie salary especialy when it not even on par to the two other european coaches we facing in our world cup group(I doh know the Paraguay coach range so i can;t include him jus so)
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Offline vibetrini

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #92 on: January 09, 2006, 10:49:57 AM »
TT$800,000 per month  =  US$33,000 per week ... this is about average for top head coaches around the world. The man is a WC coach, this is about standard for this level.


Offline Tenorsaw

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #93 on: January 09, 2006, 01:08:29 PM »
We really can't speculate about what Beenie's role is, but he presents the idea that he is a coach in absentia.  Seems like he uses every free moment to not be in Trinidad.  Don't know the reason why he doesn't stay back home when the national team is not actively preparing for a match.  His title though, is "coach", and that is different from TD.  Lincoln Philipps is the man responsible for structuring our football and making sure that it has a bright longterm success.  At the same time, we have a man at the helm who has coached great players at clubs such as Real Madrid, Ajax, Feyenord, to name a few.  We definitely need to have knowledge transfer from him to our local coaches.  That is my biggest gripe, to date about Beenie; we are not milking him for his unquestioned knowledge and vast experience.  He might not be to blame totally, cause he has invited our local coaches to observe his training methods and they seem very disinclined to accept the invitation.  Coaches should be "tapping up" this man, but they seem to be more concerned about trying to prove that local coaches are up to the task of successfully leading a national team than trying to learn from this man.  So, while Beenie could probably ride the plane less, it is up to our administrators to maybe coax him a little more into leaving a legacy to our local coaches. 

Offline dutchman

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #94 on: January 09, 2006, 08:31:53 PM »
We really can't speculate about what Beenie's role is, but he presents the idea that he is a coach in absentia.  Seems like he uses every free moment to not be in Trinidad.  Don't know the reason why he doesn't stay back home when the national team is not actively preparing for a match.  His title though, is "coach", and that is different from TD.  Lincoln Philipps is the man responsible for structuring our football and making sure that it has a bright longterm success.  At the same time, we have a man at the helm who has coached great players at clubs such as Real Madrid, Ajax, Feyenord, to name a few.  We definitely need to have knowledge transfer from him to our local coaches.  That is my biggest gripe, to date about Beenie; we are not milking him for his unquestioned knowledge and vast experience.  He might not be to blame totally, cause he has invited our local coaches to observe his training methods and they seem very disinclined to accept the invitation.  Coaches should be "tapping up" this man, but they seem to be more concerned about trying to prove that local coaches are up to the task of successfully leading a national team than trying to learn from this man.  So, while Beenie could probably ride the plane less, it is up to our administrators to maybe coax him a little more into leaving a legacy to our local coaches. 

Perhaps milking him there will exhaust him and get him out of focus?
Or he just thinks it isn't worth it to be there when he needs to talk to Mario & other dutch for the preps here. But now that half the Feyenoord staff is working for Leo I'm still waiting for the first young Trini to be signed for Feyenoord ? Why doesn't TTFF do something for that, try to bring some 17 year olds to Rotterdam. Guus Hiddink already has 2 Aussies at PSV.
Any T&T coach that really wants to learn someting can also just sign up for international training courses. Look at this Jamaican, I don't know if he is a good coach but sure has qualifications.
edit: I read it again but perhaps he didn't pass the dutch course since it says attended & not completed



he Calabar coach is a highly qualified professional. The holder of a master's degree in Business Administration (MBA) with emphasis on marketing, Hunt has attended several courses in football administration and coaching since 1978. His first was a FIFA Coca-Cola World Development Programme Administration course held in Kingston in 1978. Among the numerous other courses he attended was a one-month Organisation of American States (OAS) Mexican Olympic Solidarity training course in Mexico City in 1984.

In mid-1993 Hunt also completed the highly regarded English FA International Coaching Preliminary Award coaching course. Earlier this year he attended the KNVB Academy international coaching course in the Netherlands and a month later did the National Soccer Coaches of America Youth Diploma Course in Kingston.

http://www.sportsjamaica.com/read_article.php?id=4625

« Last Edit: January 09, 2006, 09:02:29 PM by dutchman »
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Offline cm103

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #95 on: January 09, 2006, 09:12:53 PM »
Isn't that 800k paying for Beenie and the assistant coaches also?

If so how much is Beenie really getting out of that?

Offline TnTVillan

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #96 on: April 16, 2006, 11:12:13 PM »
$800,000 a month for what?
By David Maynard (T&T Mirror)


WHAT value for dollar is Trinidad and Tobago getting from Leo Beenhakker at $800,000 a month?

Granted that this is “chick feed” for international coaches, and that a top-level international coach would have cost us two or three times that.

After all, strong overtures were made to retain Kevin Keegan, until he declared his expected salary (“in the millions”, some say).
 
That is all well and good; a man must be well-paid for his expertise, but what about value for dollar?

What are we getting for this … over $22 million from FIFA for qualifying?

Over $11 million to sport Adidas outfits before billions of television viewers, along with myriad undisclosed endorsements, deals and benefits?

(And I’m not talking here about who or whose company is actually getting this as either adviser, rights owner, etc., etc., etc.)

And is that sufficient … money?

If so, should the acquisition of money through World Cup qualification justify paying Dutchman Leo Beenhakker over $800,000 a month?

My point is, in exchange for what?

Beenhakker is not required to take a hands-on approach to TnT’s football development.

That is left to local coaches: the same local coaches whose combined salary for their part in producing national players does not even amount to $800,000 a year.

His job is basically to come here five days before the match, when all foreign-based players are available, and have them play scrimmages so he could decide on a starting 11.

When they leave, he leaves.

I guess that is one of the conditions he set for coming out of virtual recluse after getting a string of one-season jobs.

He is not required to stay in TnT and move around to see matches in the Pro League or Schools League.

In fact, he has already declared local players too poor to be worth his while.

So, the end result is that he would leave here without having helped developed a single local player and, in so doing, put us on course for preparing for the next World Cup qualifying campaign.

It is strange because he is the one who publicly stated that the team that qualified would not be the team that plays in the finals.

To back up his point, he noted the age of the players, saying the team averaged 28 years. Unless this was a psychological ploy to force Russell Latapy and Dwight Yorke into getting and keeping in top shape or face the sack, Beenhakker, having stated his intention to exclude local players, was saying he intends to look only beyond these shores for replacements. (Now note his propensity for readymade stuff. He has no intention of developing us for the future).

The average age of these foreigners is left to be seen, as is the question of whether it permits them to represent TnT with any credit in the next qualifying campaign.

His approach is unfortunate. And the technical director, noticing the shortfall, hurriedly organised a Goal 2014 youth training camp, with which he is quick to associate the national coach by saying Beenhakker would be monitoring the short listed talent pool and new player database.

So, from all appearances, Beenhakker is part of a grand plan for the future: but that is not really so.

It has been a month and a half since TnT qualified for the World Cup and, outside of that training camp with vacationing university-based players in mind, there has been no semblance of preparedness for this World Cup or the next; no capitalisation on the revived hopes of local players; no search to unearth that missing link in some remote community; and definitely no involvement whatsoever of Beenhakker.

And there won’t be until March in the brief period around that World Cup warm-up; and it won’t involve locals.

Never mind that veritable ad in the Express captioned “Beenhakker returns January 15” (two months after World Cup qualification).

Don’t be fooled by its claim that he would be here to “further look at some of the home-based players”; that is a blatant lie.

The last time he was back here was to secure his contract extension so he could parade with the other three Dutch coaches who would be leading teams into the finals.

This time, January 15, he would be here for another big public relations event: the World Cup trophy display parade that Franz Beckenbauer is now embarking upon. Some people would say otherwise but don’t be fooled.

Yes, new assistant coach Anton Corneal is keeping himself active and plans may indeed come true to have fellow Dutch assistant Wim Rijsbergen join him one week before Beenhakker’s arrival and Beenhakker may even make planned a guest appearance before the cameras.

But, again, don’t be fooled: This is no opportunity to see the guys on the team “and also to see some others”.

It is spin doctoring to cover up Beenhakker’s pronouncement on local players.

It is window dressing to give the impression that something has been done in the two months since World Cup qualification.

It is imagery to make fools feel that, with this hint of activity, $50 million on a so-called budget is money well-spent even though there won’t be enough warm-ups for that $50 million to make TnT a better prepared team at the World Cup finals.

And with a single appearance at the advertised local training this month, one would be left the impression Beenhakker is worth $800,000 a month.

At that cost, a respectable country would expect to get more out of a coach that would ensure continuity for a long time after that coach ceases to be associated with the country. One would expect to make the same demands on him as is made on local coaches. Beenhakker’s predecessor Bertille St. Clair, for example, was made to work with all-local technical staff in spite of his wishes.

No similar demand has been made of Beenhakker. He is allowed to use an all-foreign staff -- even in the area of physical fitness.

Beenhakker comes to TnT when he wants but local national coaches must be on the job at all times.

Beenhakker can discriminate against the quality of players here, being made to work at raising their level, yet St. Clair was ridiculed for “discriminating” on disciplinary grounds (such as deportment).

Beenhakker is allowed to focus only on foreign scouting while his predecessor took licks for persisting with a local core since the foundation stages of the campaign (like the Digicel Cup appearance), that included Anton Pierre, Nigel Pierre, Kerwyn Jemmot, Angus Eve, Atiba Charles, Kerry Baptiste and Kerry Noray.

And the former, local coach was said to be asking for too much, yet $800,000 -- not from the money circulating in football but from our tax dollars -- must go to Beenhakker without question.

Alvin Corneal has a point when he said something to the effect that this is because of our fear and misplaced respect for those of European extract.

But who is to blame?

None other than the local coaches: The ones who snoop on each other then run off to e-mail news to “Massa”; the ones who set up each other to be fired in exchange for a bone.

They need to straighten their act and unify.

If not, go get yourselves properly qualified so as to remove those insecurities.

They are stinking up the game.

As for Beenhakker, let’s see if he manages to do as much for us as Rene Simoes did for Jamaica, in that, let’s see if, as a result of his work here TnT qualifies for every other youth finals over the next few years.

Fools may see my point then.

By that time, though, his extended vacation, which we have so spiced up, would have been long over and he would have returned to the serious work of football development elsewhere, with a lot of petro dollars in his pockets.

I thought someone said somewhere “this time” Trinidadian and Tobagonians would be getting more out of their oil.
 


This in the mirror.

Talk done the mirror is the shitiest newspaper on this earth.

This man wanna know what we getting for $800,000.

I'll tell ya what we getting, we getting the greatest day in Trinidad and Tobago History, We going to a world cup, WE CAME TOGETHER UNITED AS ONE ON NOVEMBER 12TH AND 16TH, 2005 AND WE WILL BE UNITED AS ONE ON JUNE 10TH,15TH AND 20TH, 2006.

THIS MAN HAS DONE SOMETHING THAT 20+ COACHES BEFORE HIM COULDN'T DO.

WE GETTING THE GREATEST COACH IN DE WORLD.

TALK DONE.

Offline Jefferz

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #97 on: April 17, 2006, 12:19:18 AM »
$800,000 a month for what?
By David Maynard (T&T Mirror)


WHAT value for dollar is Trinidad and Tobago getting from Leo Beenhakker at $800,000 a month?

Granted that this is “chick feed” for international coaches, and that a top-level international coach would have cost us two or three times that.

After all, strong overtures were made to retain Kevin Keegan, until he declared his expected salary (“in the millions”, some say).
 
That is all well and good; a man must be well-paid for his expertise, but what about value for dollar?

What are we getting for this … over $22 million from FIFA for qualifying?

Over $11 million to sport Adidas outfits before billions of television viewers, along with myriad undisclosed endorsements, deals and benefits?

(And I’m not talking here about who or whose company is actually getting this as either adviser, rights owner, etc., etc., etc.)

And is that sufficient … money?

If so, should the acquisition of money through World Cup qualification justify paying Dutchman Leo Beenhakker over $800,000 a month?

My point is, in exchange for what?

Beenhakker is not required to take a hands-on approach to TnT’s football development.

That is left to local coaches: the same local coaches whose combined salary for their part in producing national players does not even amount to $800,000 a year.

His job is basically to come here five days before the match, when all foreign-based players are available, and have them play scrimmages so he could decide on a starting 11.

When they leave, he leaves.

I guess that is one of the conditions he set for coming out of virtual recluse after getting a string of one-season jobs.

He is not required to stay in TnT and move around to see matches in the Pro League or Schools League.

In fact, he has already declared local players too poor to be worth his while.

So, the end result is that he would leave here without having helped developed a single local player and, in so doing, put us on course for preparing for the next World Cup qualifying campaign.

It is strange because he is the one who publicly stated that the team that qualified would not be the team that plays in the finals.

To back up his point, he noted the age of the players, saying the team averaged 28 years. Unless this was a psychological ploy to force Russell Latapy and Dwight Yorke into getting and keeping in top shape or face the sack, Beenhakker, having stated his intention to exclude local players, was saying he intends to look only beyond these shores for replacements. (Now note his propensity for readymade stuff. He has no intention of developing us for the future).

The average age of these foreigners is left to be seen, as is the question of whether it permits them to represent TnT with any credit in the next qualifying campaign.

His approach is unfortunate. And the technical director, noticing the shortfall, hurriedly organised a Goal 2014 youth training camp, with which he is quick to associate the national coach by saying Beenhakker would be monitoring the short listed talent pool and new player database.

So, from all appearances, Beenhakker is part of a grand plan for the future: but that is not really so.

It has been a month and a half since TnT qualified for the World Cup and, outside of that training camp with vacationing university-based players in mind, there has been no semblance of preparedness for this World Cup or the next; no capitalisation on the revived hopes of local players; no search to unearth that missing link in some remote community; and definitely no involvement whatsoever of Beenhakker.

And there won’t be until March in the brief period around that World Cup warm-up; and it won’t involve locals.

Never mind that veritable ad in the Express captioned “Beenhakker returns January 15” (two months after World Cup qualification).

Don’t be fooled by its claim that he would be here to “further look at some of the home-based players”; that is a blatant lie.

The last time he was back here was to secure his contract extension so he could parade with the other three Dutch coaches who would be leading teams into the finals.

This time, January 15, he would be here for another big public relations event: the World Cup trophy display parade that Franz Beckenbauer is now embarking upon. Some people would say otherwise but don’t be fooled.

Yes, new assistant coach Anton Corneal is keeping himself active and plans may indeed come true to have fellow Dutch assistant Wim Rijsbergen join him one week before Beenhakker’s arrival and Beenhakker may even make planned a guest appearance before the cameras.

But, again, don’t be fooled: This is no opportunity to see the guys on the team “and also to see some others”.

It is spin doctoring to cover up Beenhakker’s pronouncement on local players.

It is window dressing to give the impression that something has been done in the two months since World Cup qualification.

It is imagery to make fools feel that, with this hint of activity, $50 million on a so-called budget is money well-spent even though there won’t be enough warm-ups for that $50 million to make TnT a better prepared team at the World Cup finals.

And with a single appearance at the advertised local training this month, one would be left the impression Beenhakker is worth $800,000 a month.

At that cost, a respectable country would expect to get more out of a coach that would ensure continuity for a long time after that coach ceases to be associated with the country. One would expect to make the same demands on him as is made on local coaches. Beenhakker’s predecessor Bertille St. Clair, for example, was made to work with all-local technical staff in spite of his wishes.

No similar demand has been made of Beenhakker. He is allowed to use an all-foreign staff -- even in the area of physical fitness.

Beenhakker comes to TnT when he wants but local national coaches must be on the job at all times.

Beenhakker can discriminate against the quality of players here, being made to work at raising their level, yet St. Clair was ridiculed for “discriminating” on disciplinary grounds (such as deportment).

Beenhakker is allowed to focus only on foreign scouting while his predecessor took licks for persisting with a local core since the foundation stages of the campaign (like the Digicel Cup appearance), that included Anton Pierre, Nigel Pierre, Kerwyn Jemmot, Angus Eve, Atiba Charles, Kerry Baptiste and Kerry Noray.

And the former, local coach was said to be asking for too much, yet $800,000 -- not from the money circulating in football but from our tax dollars -- must go to Beenhakker without question.

Alvin Corneal has a point when he said something to the effect that this is because of our fear and misplaced respect for those of European extract.

But who is to blame?

None other than the local coaches: The ones who snoop on each other then run off to e-mail news to “Massa”; the ones who set up each other to be fired in exchange for a bone.

They need to straighten their act and unify.

If not, go get yourselves properly qualified so as to remove those insecurities.

They are stinking up the game.

As for Beenhakker, let’s see if he manages to do as much for us as Rene Simoes did for Jamaica, in that, let’s see if, as a result of his work here TnT qualifies for every other youth finals over the next few years.

Fools may see my point then.

By that time, though, his extended vacation, which we have so spiced up, would have been long over and he would have returned to the serious work of football development elsewhere, with a lot of petro dollars in his pockets.

I thought someone said somewhere “this time” Trinidadian and Tobagonians would be getting more out of their oil.
 


This in the mirror.

Talk done the mirror is the shitiest newspaper on this earth.

This man wanna know what we getting for $800,000.

I'll tell ya what we getting, we getting the greatest day in Trinidad and Tobago History, We going to a world cup, WE CAME TOGETHER UNITED AS ONE ON NOVEMBER 12TH AND 16TH, 2005 AND WE WILL BE UNITED AS ONE ON JUNE 10TH,15TH AND 20TH, 2006.

THIS MAN HAS DONE SOMETHING THAT 20+ COACHES BEFORE HIM COULDN'T DO.

WE GETTING THE GREATEST COACH IN DE WORLD.

TALK DONE.

well the mirror do have some good articles sometimes written by some very good writers while other papers constantly go by propagnada standards...


HOWEVER...


this article is pitiful... the man is throwing out figures and completely ignoring the fact that T&T are in the world cup...


I really wouldnt have taken the chance picking another coach if we were doing this again and 800,000 dollars a month so that we go to the WORLC CUP where only 32 teams are allowed to be put on a silver platter and polished to glisten infornt of 1.5 billion viewers......................



um yea... I think it was worth it... becuase paying some half ass coach 10,000 dollars per month for four years and getting no where is probably not...


It's this whole trinidadian disgruntle corner cutting mentality... you see it in most of the road works and transport sytems the goverments have in place...


The writer of this article obviously knows LITTLE of the history of the world cup and its sacredness...






Maybe if this article's aim was to throw in as many big figures as poorly as possible it would get rave reviews however I have created bowel movements more inspiring than this shit...
« Last Edit: April 17, 2006, 12:22:19 AM by Jefferz »
since ah born or at least circa Copa Caribe

Offline scooby

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #98 on: April 17, 2006, 07:02:57 AM »
To be quite truthful I did noy bother to read the whole article that was written by dave, for I am thankful that we got a coach of beenie stature for as cheap as $800,000 a month. Dave a paid reporter and is just doing a story to earn his pay check by trying to creat some of controversey. The $800, 000 was money well spent and the end did justified the means. I would say differently if someone or somebody can name  one local coach would the ability and carisma to take us from where we were and take us the worlds biggest stage for any team sport, this is the world we are talking about get, get real Dave lets talk about all those dead politians, crocked cops, and so call leaders religious or other wise who are stealing the futher our youths by blinding them with false hope. Beenie deverses a bonus, which should be paid straight out of Jack Warner pocket

Offline maxg

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #99 on: April 17, 2006, 07:22:44 AM »
To be quite truthful I did noy bother to read the whole article that was written by dave, for I am thankful that we got a coach of beenie stature for as cheap as $800,000 a month. Dave a paid reporter and is just doing a story to earn his pay check by trying to creat some of controversey. The $800, 000 was money well spent and the end did justified the means. I would say differently if someone or somebody can name  one local coach would the ability and carisma to take us from where we were and take us the worlds biggest stage for any team sport, this is the world we are talking about get, get real Dave lets talk about all those dead politians, crocked cops, and so call leaders religious or other wise who are stealing the futher our youths by blinding them with false hope. Beenie deverses a bonus, which should be paid straight out of Jack Warner pocket

1st this is an old topic, and relevance and timing is always an issue in article, so before you read a piece of any article, 1st read when it was written..you also did not read the whole post - all the comments - so you also don't know what was said before..lastly, when you go play pot & kettle, and ask ppl to get real, make sure you would make statements that can be taken as such....this is not a new topic, it was referenced by me, as someone did not see it previously, that discussion is, was done....your comments therefore are outdated, as we are over 3mths later....let this topic move on...there is another more current, where yuh could get to waste down somebody else. ;)

Offline Pointman

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #100 on: April 17, 2006, 02:38:47 PM »
Anyone that knows soccer knows that Leo has not done anything spectacular in terms of team and player development. Yes we qualified under him, but all that makes him is smarter than his predecessors. As the article said there is nothing in place for the future. A lot of members here who know so much about football talking about how good he is ( which maybe be true according to what you're looking for), but all he has done is teach the team he is working with to be successful. Thats it. Is that worth $800,000? There is nothing to show that he is preparing Trinidad and Tobago for any consistent appearance on the world's stage.
Now mind you having the team be successful is an amazing accomplishment, but we need to have more for our money. Simoes had a great program in place with his staff towards the development of all football in Trinidad and Tobago. All our National football teams were progressing. But, in Trinidad the only kind of progress we see is winning. What happens after the summer in Germany?

that!! my good man, is PRICELESS!!!
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Offline marcel

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Re: $800,000 a month for what?
« Reply #101 on: April 20, 2006, 03:14:09 AM »

maybe t&t can NOT qualifie for FREE for the worldcup over four years!
would that be great! for free!

good luck!