Gays Thread.

[truetrini]

I think it is implied!

Genesis 2:22-24

And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

Matthew 19:4-6.....Jesus speaking:

"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

Malachi 2:14 seems to point to marriage being a covenant before God, according to the Bible.

Jes saying, I feel if two man want to get married I eh have no problem with it.  But it appears to me logically, marriage was meant to be man and woman.

—Genesis 2:18-25 seems like God created a female and not another male.   

I know that it does not specifically say man and woman alone eh, but it sure implies that.

[Bakes]

I think it is implied!

Genesis 2:22-24

And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

Matthew 19:4-6.....Jesus speaking:

"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

Malachi 2:14 seems to point to marriage being a covenant before God, according to the Bible.

Jes saying, I feel if two man want to get married I eh have no problem with it.  But it appears to me logically, marriage was meant to be man and woman.

—Genesis 2:18-25 seems like God created a female and not another male.   

I know that it does not specifically say man and woman alone eh, but it sure implies that.

In short we imputing words to God that aren't there... as I am sure you saw me say elsewhere.  Opponents of gay marriage love quote that Matt 19 scripture, but that wasn't addressing the constituency of marriage (who it's comprised of), just the unbreakable unity of the marriage bond.  There's a huge difference, except to those who refuse to see it.

[truetrini]

You disregarding Genesis 2: 22-24?

And I really doubt that you believe that according to what was written in the Bible that a marriage is referenced as anything but a man and a woman.

As I said I doh subscribe to the Bible as the literal word of God eh, but to me it is clearly implied that marriage was between man and woman and not man/man or woman/woman.

Historically I challenge anyone to show marriages of man/man or woman/woman, well except for France lol.

[Preacher]

Bakes nobody ain't imputing anything on God.  TC add Genesis 2:18.  Fellas this is the beginning and if you observe how God work.  He start with the complete and then it reproduces after itself.  If there's any imputing on God it would be making a case that God wasn't clear enough what marriage consists of. 

EDIT:  And TC I'm with you.  Let them get "married" if they want to.  It won't be marriage though.    See? 
And here is where the dilemma lies with the role of Government.  Government like marriage is also an institution established by God and they have a responsibility before God and their people.  They can't just go redefining stuff that they didn't implement. 

[Daft Trini]

Haaaaeeeeyyyyyy!

[pecan]

You disregarding Genesis 2: 22-24?

And I really doubt that you believe that according to what was written in the Bible that a marriage is referenced as anything but a man and a woman.

As I said I doh subscribe to the Bible as the literal word of God eh, but to me it is clearly implied that marriage was between man and woman and not man/man or woman/woman.

Historically I challenge anyone to show marriages of man/man or woman/woman, well except for France lol.

what about man/woman+woman+woman+...+nth

that is a common occurrence with biblical figures

[D.H.W]

Religion again.....

[kounty]

Well I like to support what God set originally.  I've been on the world long enough to know that people does sometimes just make up stuff innately contrary to God's purpose and God doesn't kill em for it.  Sometimes, people does feel they actually doing good with a good heart but they does be sincerely wrong.   In studying the bible it's important to understand which was given by Description (God described what He wanted) and what was Prescription (leaders made decisions based on what they thought was best.)   As far as I'm concerned God made Adam an Eve and He said "It is good."   You know what good means in that context?   It means perfection, it mean complete.  It means everything needed to care for the earth was in place.  So that's where you have to take up your issue.  The old testament has a lot of old world history and practices in it that simply doesn't apply today.  Many of it were just people doing stuff as they saw it.   Whoever want to challenge God, go ahead.  God ain't sweating, the breath we breathing is His anyway.   Tic Toc for everybody.   God is so gracious that at the end nobody could say that they didn't get enough rope.  God's ways are so above our ways that we can't even begin to quantify His wisdom, mercy and above all His love for mankind.  Look, marriage is an institution enacted by God Himself.  He set the parameters and endorsed it as good.  Now just like that chart Pecan post, men can do whatever they feel they need to do, follow lies, geneticist or demons.  Do whatever you want but anything outside of those parameters does not get the seal from the big man as marriage.  You can call it marriage but it won't be marriage and it won't have the blessing of the Most High.   He's given marriage many blessings.  To lay down with your wife and have her open up for you.   To share a baby and raise a child that look like both of you.  To have a woman on your side to support and strengthen you, believe in you. (A help meet not a man meat)   To struggle through life together sharing dreams, aspirations and failures.   These things are blessings that God only gives to marriage as He set it up.   

I think all these things would be true of a gay marriage also.  except the underlined...but I know plenty heterosexual couples that can't have children from since Abraham, and I don't think that mean that their  marriage is not blessed.

Bakes nobody ain't imputing anything on God.  TC add Genesis 2:18.  Fellas this is the beginning and if you observe how God work.  He start with the complete and then it reproduces after itself.  If there's any imputing on God it would be making a case that God wasn't clear enough what marriage consists of. 

EDIT:  And TC I'm with you.  Let them get "married" if they want to. It won't be marriage though.    See? 
And here is where the dilemma lies with the role of Government.  Government like marriage is also an institution established by God and they have a responsibility before God and their people.  They can't just go redefining stuff that they didn't implement. 

what about people who doh subscribe to the bible preacher? can they get "married" too?

btw. I wouldn't really go outa my way and march and 'support' no gay marriage...maybe in the future i might say alright like obama.  but I doh dig how alyuh evangelicals does want to impose your bible (and a very silly interpretation of it too) on everybody.

[truetrini]

Many old testament Biblical figures had more than one wife and concubines.   Those wives were taken to increase the size of households, gain alliances, forge new alliances and to make children to work and increase wealth. 

Marriage was supposed to be between man and woman, but like all things evolve so did marriage and we understand more now and human sexuality is much more complex than was understood back in the days when the Bible was being written.

[ribbit]

Religion again.....

is either that or talk about the employment numbers.

gay marriage is only an issue for gays and ministers. ah hear de rev. al sharpton, does support gay marriage - he probably marry some gay couples already. rev. jeremiah wright too.

[kicker]

Love how people conveniently talk on behalf of God lol... Allyuh eh playin' allyuh self righteous nuh. Next ting yuh gonna tell me is God who wrote the bible.  Why allyuh doh just leave the judging to God?

How many f*cking adulterers it have out there enjoying the full rights and benefits of heterosexual marriage? How come that doh bother allyuh moral conscience.

As ah say, let God judge. 

[kicker]

"Ramesh" hold your ground buddy.. the whole catholic church crowding that cave you held up in. Cud care less about who marrying who, but when ah man can't voice his opinion or at least have an opinion, makes me wonder how much of a democracy we living in. But then.. being gay is the new black jew..right! Can't say shit without being branded.

Jumbie alot of people who are of the opinion that gays should be able to get married are generally called way worse...Don't act like that opinion doesn't come under fire and persecution (unless you been living under a rock) - democracy my arse brother - if yuh only cryin' democracy when yuh opinion is on the losing end, yuh not supporting any democracy.  Plus, it's one thing to have an opinion but if want to supporting referring to homos with slurs such as bullerman and categorize a step towards equal rights as "supporting de bullermen dem", then yuh arguing a different point. 

 "if yuh only cryin' democracy when yuh opinion is on the losing end, yuh not supporting any democracy". This should not be about winning or losing. Who is the winner here? The gays who continue living as they always did or the guy who feel he can't support that?

I've never been one to degrade others by name calling etc (i may fling a 'c**t' here and there), so that is not my agenda. I just feel we need to be more open about things (have people voice how they feel), so we have a clearer picture as to where we are and where we need to be. Ramesh have a fackup way of expressing himself, but his saying homo etc and the people who have the same feelings but keeping quiet, is no different.

You miss my point about losing end.  I meant the traditional perspective losing popularity - not who is winning or losing based on what Obama is advocating. 

I have no issue with someone how disagrees with the principle of gay marriage - Can't endorse a fight against equal rights though. 

[lefty]

"Ramesh" hold your ground buddy.. the whole catholic church crowding that cave you held up in. Cud care less about who marrying who, but when ah man can't voice his opinion or at least have an opinion, makes me wonder how much of a democracy we living in. But then.. being gay is the new black jew..right! Can't say shit without being branded.

Jumbie alot of people who are of the opinion that gays should be able to get married are generally called way worse...Don't act like that opinion doesn't come under fire and persecution (unless you been living under a rock) - democracy my arse brother - if yuh only cryin' democracy when yuh opinion is on the losing end, yuh not supporting any democracy.  Plus, it's one thing to have an opinion but if want to supporting referring to homos with slurs such as bullerman and categorize a step towards equal rights as "supporting de bullermen dem", then yuh arguing a different point. 

 "if yuh only cryin' democracy when yuh opinion is on the losing end, yuh not supporting any democracy". This should not be about winning or losing. Who is the winner here? The gays who continue living as they always did or the guy who feel he can't support that?

I've never been one to degrade others by name calling etc (i may fling a 'c**t' here and there), so that is not my agenda. I just feel we need to be more open about things (have people voice how they feel), so we have a clearer picture as to where we are and where we need to be. Ramesh have a fackup way of expressing himself, but his saying homo etc and the people who have the same feelings but keeping quiet, is no different.

You miss my point about losing end.  I meant the traditional perspective losing popularity - not who is winning or losing based on what Obama is advocating. 

I have no issue with someone how disagrees with the principle of gay marriage - Can't endorse a fight against equal rights though. 

everybody who opposed conveniently tiptoeing around that point.......

[Toppa]

Well I like to support what God set originally.  I've been on the world long enough to know that people does sometimes just make up stuff innately contrary to God's purpose and God doesn't kill em for it.  Sometimes, people does feel they actually doing good with a good heart but they does be sincerely wrong.   In studying the bible it's important to understand which was given by Description (God described what He wanted) and what was Prescription (leaders made decisions based on what they thought was best.)   As far as I'm concerned God made Adam an Eve and He said "It is good."   You know what good means in that context?   It means perfection, it mean complete.  It means everything needed to care for the earth was in place.  So that's where you have to take up your issue.  The old testament has a lot of old world history and practices in it that simply doesn't apply today.  Many of it were just people doing stuff as they saw it.   Whoever want to challenge God, go ahead.  God ain't sweating, the breath we breathing is His anyway.   Tic Toc for everybody.   God is so gracious that at the end nobody could say that they didn't get enough rope.  God's ways are so above our ways that we can't even begin to quantify His wisdom, mercy and above all His love for mankind.  Look, marriage is an institution enacted by God Himself.  He set the parameters and endorsed it as good.  Now just like that chart Pecan post, men can do whatever they feel they need to do, follow lies, geneticist or demons.  Do whatever you want but anything outside of those parameters does not get the seal from the big man as marriage.  You can call it marriage but it won't be marriage and it won't have the blessing of the Most High.   He's given marriage many blessings.  To lay down with your wife and have her open up for you.   To share a baby and raise a child that look like both of you.  To have a woman on your side to support and strengthen you, believe in you. (A help meet not a man meat)   To struggle through life together sharing dreams, aspirations and failures.   These things are blessings that God only gives to marriage as He set it up.   

Where does God say anything about 'marriage'... or that it's exclusively between man and woman?

Evidence abounds that God homosexual relationships are prohibited in the Bible. That should clue everyone is on the fact that marriage is between a man and a woman. Anyway...

Genesis 2:4

“A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.”

Matthew 19:4
In reply he said: “Did YOU not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’?

The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.”


Hebrews 13:4

'Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.'

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

[lefty]

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

So why then does god allow them to be created........I had a neighbor few house dong from me....... dat boy was born male ......and that's pretty much all she wrote there on that topic.......dat fella was gayer than ah goose from day1............father, "normal" brother.....i.e. enough stereotypical male influence and dat state never change ........dat eh no perversion, dat etched in dey design.............so god have to be one ruthless practical joker if he so detests someting he "intentionally" created..........yes intentionally ....he is after all  "All knowing" not so. and the saints wrote d bible not god.......and they were men with opinions of there own and there opinions heavily influenced there writings .......Leviticus 25-27 could easily qualify as "sociopathy" if those writings wont part of d bible

[Preacher]

You disregarding Genesis 2: 22-24?

And I really doubt that you believe that according to what was written in the Bible that a marriage is referenced as anything but a man and a woman.

As I said I doh subscribe to the Bible as the literal word of God eh, but to me it is clearly implied that marriage was between man and woman and not man/man or woman/woman.

Historically I challenge anyone to show marriages of man/man or woman/woman, well except for France lol.

what about man/woman+woman+woman+...+nth

that is a common occurrence with biblical figures

Like I said not everything in the bible is by Description some things were Prescribed by men.  It would be a good study to find out the initial sociology on it though.  I'm sure there were reasons beyond wanting to have sex with many women. 

Kounty gay couples may share love but it would never be the same as male and female.  If you don't believe there was an original intent for the creation of male and female then sure you can make an argument.  But don't take BMW by Honda to fix, only the manufacture backs their brands.

As for those who don't subscribe to the bible they can get married also according to law upheld by another God given institution call Government. 

[Bakes]

You disregarding Genesis 2: 22-24?

And I really doubt that you believe that according to what was written in the Bible that a marriage is referenced as anything but a man and a woman.

As I said I doh subscribe to the Bible as the literal word of God eh, but to me it is clearly implied that marriage was between man and woman and not man/man or woman/woman.

Historically I challenge anyone to show marriages of man/man or woman/woman, well except for France lol.

I am not disregarding anything... God describes woman as being the perfect mate for man.  Of course it is implied that the perfect union is between man and woman... and logically it makes sense, life can only come from heterosexual unions.  But implications aside, nowhere is same sex marriage expressly prohibited, as opponents of same sex marriage would like to have us believe.

The best they can do is point to the teachings of Paul... left to whom women would be home scrubbing floors and none ah we would be bulling.

[Preacher]

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

So why then does god allow them to be created........I had a neighbor few house dong from me....... dat boy was born male ......and that's pretty much all she wrote there on that topic.......dat fella was gayer than ah goose from day1............father, "normal" brother.....i.e. enough stereotypical male influence and dat state never change ........dat eh no perversion, dat etched in dey design.............so god have to be one ruthless practical joker if he so detests someting he "intentionally" created..........yes intentionally ....he is after all  "All knowing" not so. and the saints wrote d bible not god.......and they were men with opinions of there own and there opinions heavily influenced there writings .......Leviticus 25-27 could easily qualify as "sociopathy" if those writings wont part of d bible

Lefty doh hurt yuh head with the bible and who write it etc etc.  It simpler than that.  Do you believe there is a God?  What do you believe His stance is on the matter?  Then let every man follow their own conscience.  Easy as pie.  I do have a minister friend and she is studying at a seminary that endorse gay and lesbian ministers.  So she have many friends that are gay. She has said that in her conversations almost all have had some kind of sexual abuse. 

This is what mankind is fighting
Eph6:12
For we are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places.

[Bakes]

btw. I wouldn't really go outa my way and march and 'support' no gay marriage...maybe in the future i might say alright like obama.  but I doh dig how alyuh evangelicals does want to impose your bible (and a very silly interpretation of it too) on everybody.

Yuh see it?  Me eh marching fuh nobody, but the Christians who pushing this setta bible talk on everybody have me real shaking my head... and I staunchly Christian too eh.

[Bakes]

Evidence abounds that God homosexual relationships are prohibited in the Bible. That should clue everyone is on the fact that marriage is between a man and a woman. Anyway...

Genesis 2:4

“A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.”

Matthew 19:4
In reply he said: “Did YOU not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’?

The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.”


Hebrews 13:4

'Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.'

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

None of this saying anything.

[Preacher]

You disregarding Genesis 2: 22-24?

And I really doubt that you believe that according to what was written in the Bible that a marriage is referenced as anything but a man and a woman.

As I said I doh subscribe to the Bible as the literal word of God eh, but to me it is clearly implied that marriage was between man and woman and not man/man or woman/woman.

Historically I challenge anyone to show marriages of man/man or woman/woman, well except for France lol.

I am not disregarding anything... God describes woman as being the perfect mate for man.  Of course it is implied that the perfect union is between man and woman... and logically it makes sense, life can only come from heterosexual unions.  But implications aside, nowhere is same sex marriage expressly prohibited, as opponents of same sex marriage would like to have us believe.

The best they can do is point to the teachings of Paul... left to whom women would be home scrubbing floors and none ah we would be bulling.

You being unfair to Paul but since you know his teaching so well. 

Rom.1:24-28
24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Though they know God's righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.

To you it seems like God ain't clear enough.   I'll take my chances with the 'Righteous Judge.'  To only One that will judge to living and the dead.  I can guarantee nobody getting off on no technically.  To me it loud and clear. 

[kicker]

she have many friends that are gay. She has said that in her conversations almost all have had some kind of sexual abuse. 

And...

Is that fair grounds to deny equal rights?

[Preacher]

she have many friends that are gay. She has said that in her conversations almost all have had some kind of sexual abuse. 

And...

Is that fair grounds to deny equal rights?

What you talking bout?  Who denying rights?  Aren't the states voting?  How come that ain't good enough?

[kicker]

she have many friends that are gay. She has said that in her conversations almost all have had some kind of sexual abuse. 

And...

Is that fair grounds to deny equal rights?

What you talking bout?  Who denying rights?  Aren't the states voting?  How come that ain't good enough?

Opposition to same-sex marriage is ultimately opposition to certain rights based on sexual orientation...

So if you're in favor of denying gays the right to get married, you are ultimately in favor of denying them certain rights based on their sexual orientation...

So again I ask you - In your opinion, does your observation (or your friend's observation) of sexual abuse as a pattern among gay people serve as grounds for 1) opposing same-sex marriage, and 2) ultimately intending the to deny the rights of some, based on their sexual orientation?

And if not, then what is your point?

[JDB]

Evidence abounds that God homosexual relationships are prohibited in the Bible. That should clue everyone is on the fact that marriage is between a man and a woman. Anyway...

Genesis 2:4

“A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.”

Matthew 19:4
In reply he said: “Did YOU not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’?

The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.”


Hebrews 13:4

'Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.'

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

Um what if I don't subscribe to the Bible? or any religion for that matter?

[D.H.W]

Evidence abounds that God homosexual relationships are prohibited in the Bible. That should clue everyone is on the fact that marriage is between a man and a woman. Anyway...

Genesis 2:4

“A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.”

Matthew 19:4
In reply he said: “Did YOU not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’?

The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.”


Hebrews 13:4

'Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.'

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

Um what if I don't subscribe to the Bible? or any religion for that matter?

Good question..

[Cantona007]

she have many friends that are gay. She has said that in her conversations almost all have had some kind of sexual abuse. 

And...

Is that fair grounds to deny equal rights?

What you talking bout?  Who denying rights?  Aren't the states voting?  How come that ain't good enough?

Individual states should not determine universal human rights. If left to the states, where would blacks and women be?

[Preacher]

And...

Is that fair grounds to deny equal rights?

What you talking bout?  Who denying rights?  Aren't the states voting?  How come that ain't good enough?
[/quote]

Opposition to same-sex marriage is ultimately opposition to certain rights based on sexual orientation...

So if you're in favor of denying gays the right to get married, you are ultimately in favor of denying them certain rights based on their sexual orientation...

So again I ask you - In your opinion, does your observation (or your friend's observation) of sexual abuse as a pattern among gay people serve as grounds for 1) opposing same-sex marriage, and 2) ultimately intending the to deny the rights of some, based on their sexual orientation?

And if not, then what is your point?
[/quote]

Kicker you just jumpin my thing an trying to twisting it.  You obviously didn't ready my response to Lefty.  No scene though I does do it to.  Anyways based on friend these are the same that claim that they were born this way.  It was her opinion that they all confessed sexual abuse in their past that triggered certain things.   That was my point to Lefty.  Let the states vote on it.  And let the voice of the people stand and don't criticize me for my vote.  You know how much schools across America imposing Homosexuality on little children and parents ain't even getting to vote?  Stop believing them sound bites.  Stay on God side and keep straight. 

[Bakes]

You being unfair to Paul but since you know his teaching so well. 

Rom.1:24-28
24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Though they know God's righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.

To you it seems like God ain't clear enough.   I'll take my chances with the 'Righteous Judge.'  To only One that will judge to living and the dead.  I can guarantee nobody getting off on no technically.  To me it loud and clear. 

I think you need to better acquaint yuhself with Paul before you tell me that I am being 'unfair' to him.  What I state is hardly my own opinion, although I did arrive at it independent of others. 

All them scriptures yuh cite dey... Paul sure is clear enough, if yuh subscribe to the notion that Paul absolutely speaking for God then yeah, 'God' is pretty clear.

You talking about yuh'll take yuh chance with the "righteous judge" as though is you they bulling.  You sinning yuh soul by saying "yeah, let them get married if they want to"?  God holding you responsible for the actions of homosexuals now?  What kinda unfair God is that?  Not the God I serve.

...and yeah, "states" doh vote on individual rights, not sure where you get that from.

[pecan]

Well I like to support what God set originally.  I've been on the world long enough to know that people does sometimes just make up stuff innately contrary to God's purpose and God doesn't kill em for it.  Sometimes, people does feel they actually doing good with a good heart but they does be sincerely wrong.   In studying the bible it's important to understand which was given by Description (God described what He wanted) and what was Prescription (leaders made decisions based on what they thought was best.)   As far as I'm concerned God made Adam an Eve and He said "It is good."   You know what good means in that context?   It means perfection, it mean complete.  It means everything needed to care for the earth was in place.  So that's where you have to take up your issue.  The old testament has a lot of old world history and practices in it that simply doesn't apply today.  Many of it were just people doing stuff as they saw it.   Whoever want to challenge God, go ahead.  God ain't sweating, the breath we breathing is His anyway.   Tic Toc for everybody.   God is so gracious that at the end nobody could say that they didn't get enough rope.  God's ways are so above our ways that we can't even begin to quantify His wisdom, mercy and above all His love for mankind.  Look, marriage is an institution enacted by God Himself.  He set the parameters and endorsed it as good.  Now just like that chart Pecan post, men can do whatever they feel they need to do, follow lies, geneticist or demons.  Do whatever you want but anything outside of those parameters does not get the seal from the big man as marriage.  You can call it marriage but it won't be marriage and it won't have the blessing of the Most High.   He's given marriage many blessings.  To lay down with your wife and have her open up for you.   To share a baby and raise a child that look like both of you.  To have a woman on your side to support and strengthen you, believe in you. (A help meet not a man meat)   To struggle through life together sharing dreams, aspirations and failures.   These things are blessings that God only gives to marriage as He set it up.   

Where does God say anything about 'marriage'... or that it's exclusively between man and woman?

Evidence abounds that God homosexual relationships are prohibited in the Bible. That should clue everyone is on the fact that marriage is between a man and a woman. Anyway...

Genesis 2:4

“A man will leave his father and his mother and he must stick to his wife and they must become one flesh.”

Matthew 19:4
In reply he said: “Did YOU not read that he who created them from [the] beginning made them male and female and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’?

The Hebrew word “wife,” according to Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “connotes one who is a female human being.”


Hebrews 13:4

'Let marriage be honorable among all, and the marriage bed be without defilement, for God will judge fornicators and adulterers.'

God commands that the marriage should be 'honourable amongst all.' Would a homosexual 'marriage' be viewed as honourable to the Creator? No. He regards homosexuality as something 'detestable'.

Evidence abounds that many God homosexual relationships things are prohibited or endorsed in the Bible.  But we don't observe them. The following might be food for thought from a woman's perspective:

Genesis 2:18: NIV
The LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him." 

Yep. those women are help, not equals

Leviticus 12:2. NIV
"Say to the Israelites: 'A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period.

Leviticus 12:5, NIV
If she gives birth to a daughter, for two weeks the woman will be unclean, as during her period. Then she must wait sixty-six days to be purified from her bleeding.

Leviticus 15:19 NIV
"'When a woman has her regular flow of blood, the impurity of her monthly period will last seven days, and anyone who touches her will be unclean till evening.

maybe we should be quarantining women when dey menstruating or just give birth - they are so unclean!! - and look thing - 2 weeks if the baby is female and then another 66 days to be purified!









So if one insists on using the Bible to define marriage, then I maintain these statements about women should be enforced too.