Is Jack that bad

[kingman]

I know that we spoke about this guy more than one occasion on this site. I need to know though, is Jack Warner that bad of a person? Yes, he has been found guilty of some counts of corruption. But don't you guys think that all the good things to help Trinidad football move forward over shadowed his corrupted acts? I believe if was not for Jack we might not have even been in the World Cup. It is he that introduced that 4th team option, he got Dr Joao Havelange to help fund the Center for Excellence (now known as the Marvin Lee Stadium), he personally funded all Marvin Lee’s medical expenses, he personally supported the Trinidad and Tobago football team with his own finances, he brought the 2001 FIFA World Cup to Trinidad and Tobago, he brought the idea of a professional football league to Trinidad and Tobago and personally sponsored a team, he got involved in our players personal conflicts and helped resolved it (Nakhid in Lebanon), he  helped our plays got release from their clubs when they were given problem and then hired private jets/helicopter to fly our players back to their clubs as soon as they are done with national duty. This is just touching the surface. I think he should not be bashed as much as he should. Although, I do agree that he may be some what corrupt. But who isn't in some way or the other?

Kingman

[Socapro]

How much did JW offer you for posting this?! 

[kingman]

How much did JW offer you for posting this?! 

LOL, Nothing man. I just does watch how some people does bash the man and decide to give them some food for thought. You feel you.

Kingman

[Augi]

Kingman I have to agree with yuh there.De man did a lot for T&T football.Invested many hours and millions of dollars. The ticket fiasco was Warner's attempt to get a return on his investment.I can't blame him for that, but the conflict of interest was just to glaring ...he should have know better.

[kingman]

Kingman I have to agree with yuh there.De man did a lot for T&T football.Invested many hours and millions of dollars. The ticket fiasco was Warner's attempt to get a return on his investment.I can't blame him for that, but the conflict of interest was just to glaring ...he should have know better.

So true. 

Kingman

[sin]

Kingman I have to agree with yuh there.De man did a lot for T&T football.Invested many hours and millions of dollars. The ticket fiasco was Warner's attempt to get a return on his investment.I can't blame him for that, but the conflict of interest was just to glaring ...he should have know better.

I cannot agree. Are you saying that he 'deserves' to hold the monopoly on ticket sales, to the detriment of every T&T national and/or die-hard supporter? Are you saying that he should have done it in a less 'obvious' way and that would have been alright?

Yes, Mr. Warner has done alot for T&T football. He has given much to charities. That does not and cannot justify the extent of the corruption that has come to be associated with him, his family and their ventures.

This casual acceptance that we Trinis for the politricks and machinations of our so-called leaders has got to change.

[kingman]

Kingman I have to agree with yuh there.De man did a lot for T&T football.Invested many hours and millions of dollars. The ticket fiasco was Warner's attempt to get a return on his investment.I can't blame him for that, but the conflict of interest was just to glaring ...he should have know better.

I cannot agree. Are you saying that he 'deserves' to hold the monopoly on ticket sales, to the detriment of every T&T national and/or die-hard supporter? Are you saying that he should have done it in a less 'obvious' way and that would have been alright?

Yes, Mr. Warner has done alot for T&T football. He has given much to charities. That does not and cannot justify the extent of the corruption that has come to be associated with him, his family and their ventures.

This casual acceptance that we Trinis for the politricks and machinations of our so-called leaders has got to change.

You have a point there too sweet heart. But i still feel he brought more good than bad to Trinidad football. Would you agree with that?

Kingman

[sin]

I've been thinking about this for awhile. We all know the platitudes - it good to have a Trini on FIFA, how else we woulda get (everything from CONCACAF seeding to the World Cup Draw). I can't deny that Jack is a brilliant administrator, someone who turned CONCACAF around and made us an international force to be reckoned with.

At the same time, no, he's not good for T&T football. We are an international laughing stock - nuff people in England is be like, oho, Jack Warner - ent he real corrupt? We are steadily losing any respect that our Warriors earned by qualifying. FIFA is institutionally corrupt, from top to bottom, but do we have to be so closely associated with that corruption? The man tried to deny Lasana accreditation - ah mean, Liburd is a damn good writer. And all of this UNC/PNM simmy dimmy - when people have to ask if the reason the TTFF not supporting the LOC cultural contingent to Germany have to do with the Jack-PNM divide - how that could be a good ting?

[dcs]

Kingman this is going to be an ongoing debate.
I saw this article this morning.

Trinidad Express
Cudjoe: Warner deserves praise
Sunday, March 26th 2006

   
Professor Selwyn Cudjoe, president of NAEAP, during his addresses at yesterday's forum.

FIFA Vice President Jack Warner, who was recently accused of "conflict of interest" in the selling of World Cup 2006 tickets through the Simpaul Travel Agency which he had owned, should be praised for his accomplishments rather than criticised.

This was the view expressed by President of the National Association for the Empowerment of African People (NAEAP) Selwyn Cudjoe while speaking yesterday NAEAP conference on the PNM 50th anniversary held at the Centre of Excellence, Macoya.

He noted that though Warner "has his problems" he should be applauded for what he has achieved, including being a Trinidadian on the executive board of FIFA and assisting the national football team in reaching the World Cup.

"Leh we give Jack his jacket," Cudjoe urged the packed audience. He said that the tendency to point out failures and shortcomings was part of the self contempt endemic to Third World countries. He related this behaviour to discussions of the PNM, noting that people complained about the negative and neglected the party's achievements.

He said that, similar to the PNM, citizens are eager to magnify the shortcomings and minimise the achievements of the first Prime Minister Eric Williams. He also chastised the present leadership of the party for not doing a "good job" in educating citizens about the party's achievements over its 50 years in existence. He said that people should begin to celebrate and reflect on the memories of the early achievements of the party.

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[Trini _2026]

The man tried to deny Lasana accreditation - ah mean, Liburd is a damn good writer.

Warner real nasty fuh doing that man.

[rippin]

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

Jack is the reason why the TTFF so incompetent. His old boys club has probably done more harm to Trinidad and Tobago football than we will ever know. The only time the TTFF does get off the a$$ is when Jack crack the whip. The only time Jack does crack the whip is when he have something to gain.

Why do we constantly praise Jack for doing his job. The man get a 4th spot for Concacaf. AND!!!
Every federation trying to get an extra spot. Jack did not personally fund or help implement  Mexico's or USA's development program. Hence it is only fair to give him credit for doing his job.

The problem with us Trini's is that we all live for today. Jack is good for the short term. What is he doing to ensure continued development. I am sure that everyone on this board can name someone who they think can contribute greatly to T&T's foot ball legacy and never will because of Jack's Crooney's

[Agent Jack Bauer]

There is corruption in every aspect of life and sports.  Jack has done a great deal for Trinidad and Tobago.  He should of been a bit more subtle in pulling his scam so he could make a profit.  He is no different than any other person of authority in Trinidad and Tobago.   Just be a little smoother next time Jack.

[Blue]

Kingman I have to agree with yuh there.De man did a lot for T&T football.Invested many hours and millions of dollars. The ticket fiasco was Warner's attempt to get a return on his investment.I can't blame him for that, but the conflict of interest was just to glaring ...he should have know better.

I cannot agree. Are you saying that he 'deserves' to hold the monopoly on ticket sales, to the detriment of every T&T national and/or die-hard supporter? Are you saying that he should have done it in a less 'obvious' way and that would have been alright?

Yes, Mr. Warner has done alot for T&T football. He has given much to charities. That does not and cannot justify the extent of the corruption that has come to be associated with him, his family and their ventures.

This casual acceptance that we Trinis for the politricks and machinations of our so-called leaders has got to change.

You have a point there too sweet heart. But i still feel he brought more good than bad to Trinidad football. Would you agree with that?

Kingman

I agree with you, Kingman. If we are talking about football, then I think Jack has had a positive effect on our football. Many of our players would not have had the opportunities they have had were it not for him and we would arguably not be where we are today.

As for squabbling with a football writer, or taking the profits from d tickets (as opposed to some other travel agency taking d profit) - in my view that has nothing to do with whether we win or lose games.

[JDB]

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

Jack is the reason why the TTFF so incompetent. His old boys club has probably done more harm to Trinidad and Tobago football than we will ever know. The only time the TTFF does get off the a$$ is when Jack crack the whip. The only time Jack does crack the whip is when he have something to gain.

Why do we constantly praise Jack for doing his job. The man get a 4th spot for Concacaf. AND!!!
Every federation trying to get an extra spot. Jack did not personally fund or help implement  Mexico's or USA's development program. Hence it is only fair to give him credit for doing his job.

The problem with us Trini's is that we all live for today. Jack is good for the short term. What is he doing to ensure continued development. I am sure that everyone on this board can name someone who they think can contribute greatly to T&T's foot ball legacy and never will because of Jack's Crooney's

Thank you. Great post.

The TTFF is a failure as an organization and if he has been running it for the past 15 years he has to be held accountable for its failure.

[Augi]

JDB we are the smallest nation ever to make it to a World Cup.I am sure you will agree with me that is no small achievement, by no stretch of the imagination.Failure? I think not. You should also agree that the TTFF deserves some credit for this accomplishment and since Jack's been running it for the past 15 years he deserves some credit too.

[lickslikefire]

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

Jack is the reason why the TTFF so incompetent. His old boys club has probably done more harm to Trinidad and Tobago football than we will ever know. The only time the TTFF does get off the a$$ is when Jack crack the whip. The only time Jack does crack the whip is when he have something to gain.

Why do we constantly praise Jack for doing his job. The man get a 4th spot for Concacaf. AND!!!
Every federation trying to get an extra spot. Jack did not personally fund or help implement  Mexico's or USA's development program. Hence it is only fair to give him credit for doing his job.

The problem with us Trini's is that we all live for today. Jack is good for the short term. What is he doing to ensure continued development. I am sure that everyone on this board can name someone who they think can contribute greatly to T&T's foot ball legacy and never will because of Jack's Crooney's

Thank you. Great post.

The TTFF is a failure as an organization and if he has been running it for the past 15 years he has to be held accountable for its failure.

Hi Folks
Most Times , people who achieve high positions, are driven by self interests.
So that Jack has done remarkably well to achieve these lofty positions.
FIFA also has done great things for Football, but is also very corrupt. So in such a corrupt environment, and to achieve high status , you have to be very good, and also be able to condone a lot of corruption.
So that when the opportunity arises, to benefit, it is easy to do like the others.
So we are proud to have one o' we in this "great ' association, but you have to be like them, to be among them. So YOU achieve for yourself and should be generous to those you represent.
But as we are nearing one of our greatest accomplishments in Sport, I think we should just see the best in others and be positive, and hope that the greatness of our soca-boys rub off on us.
Can we not lobby for sportsmen/entertainers who gain international status, receive some kind a pension for life.
 There should be some measure to reward our " Heroes". People like Sparrow , Rudder or past greats like Gally etc, after say selling  #s records or playing #s matches or winning # medals , should receive some award , which would entitle them to some kind of  additional pension after 65.
Political Ambassadors and politicians get it, so why not our real ambassadors

[sin]

Can we not lobby for sportsmen/entertainers who gain international status, receive some kind a pension for life.
 There should be some measure to reward our " Heroes". People like Sparrow , Rudder or past greats like Gally etc, after say selling  #s records or playing #s matches or winning # medals , should receive some award , which would entitle them to some kind of  additional pension after 65.
Political Ambassadors and politicians get it, so why not our real ambassadors

  Now that is class. Cultural ambassadors - lord knows we need them. As Explainer said - how we does treat our heroes so!

[JDB]

JDB we are the smallest nation ever to make it to a World Cup.I am sure you will agree with me that is no small achievement, by no stretch of the imagination.Failure? I think not. You should also agree that the TTFF deserves some credit for this accomplishment and since Jack's been running it for the past 15 years he deserves some credit too.

F A I L U R E

You can't even begin to defend the incompetence of the TTFF in managing local football.

What is acheived by our local footballers is, for the most part, IN SPITE OF the TTFF.

[Blue]

[Can we not lobby for sportsmen/entertainers who gain international status, receive some kind a pension for life.
 There should be some measure to reward our " Heroes". People like Sparrow , Rudder or past greats like Gally etc, after say selling  #s records or playing #s matches or winning # medals , should receive some award , which would entitle them to some kind of  additional pension after 65.
Political Ambassadors and politicians get it, so why not our real ambassadors

Licks, with regard to the pension idea for entertainers - although they might be special to us, they are not selling records for altruistic reasons - they were doing it for their own financial gain.  What you're saying is that people who are successful should be awarded with even greater (financial) success. From a financial perspective, it wouldnt be sensible for a government to do this.

[sin]

Ah, you see I disagree. Whether or not men like Sparrow and Kitch was doing things to make money, they are our cultural icons, and we shoulda taken better care. Why we must build a house for Lara and have people like Chalkie living in obscurity to all but the few?

[big dawg]

The man tried to deny Lasana accreditation - ah mean, Liburd is a damn good writer.

Warner real nasty fuh doing that man.

I 2nd that

[Blue]

Ah, you see I disagree. Whether or not men like Sparrow and Kitch was doing things to make money, they are our cultural icons, and we shoulda taken better care. Why we must build a house for Lara and have people like Chalkie living in obscurity to all but the few?

Lara was representing Trinidad as part of the West Indies team.

Chalkie was not representing TnT. I think National Awards are an excellent way of rewarding entertainers. If they are successful entertainers and ambassadors then they should have no need for compensation from the government. Bob Marley would be my example (but I think we are going off-topic...   )

[sin]

eh, so Kitchener et al, our musicians, are unrepresentative of T&T because they don't belong to a team? David Rudder as an exponent of the form? I mean, there's a HUGE difference between the contempt shown by people like Naipaul and the contributions of the John La Rose's of this world, who died without anyone knowing what he'd done for the country.

....but yes, we definitely off topic.

[Blue]

eh, so Kitchener et al, our musicians, are unrepresentative of T&T because they don't belong to a team? David Rudder as an exponent of the form? I mean, there's a HUGE difference between the contempt shown by people like Naipaul and the contributions of the John La Rose's of this world, who died without anyone knowing what he'd done for the country.

....but yes, we definitely off topic.

smi, I agree with you that the government should provide funding for the local entertainment and arts industries. My gripe was more to do with Licks' idea about a pension based on number of records sold - I think that idea is impractical.

But, while I agree that they are representative of TnT, I think we will have to agree to disagree on whether they are directly representing TnT.

[lickslikefire]

eh, so Kitchener et al, our musicians, are unrepresentative of T&T because they don't belong to a team? David Rudder as an exponent of the form? I mean, there's a HUGE difference between the contempt shown by people like Naipaul and the contributions of the John La Rose's of this world, who died without anyone knowing what he'd done for the country.

....but yes, we definitely off topic.
[/quot. My gripe was more to do with Licks' idea about a pension based on number of records sold - I think that idea is impractical.

All I am saying is that we should compensate our heroes/real ambassadors, whether it is sportsmen or artists, and we should find some way to measure their accomplishment whether its medals or airplay etc.

Too many of our artists, sportsmen  etc ketching hell, and are forgotten after bringing recognition to their country, while politicians etc are well rewarded (perks, pensions etc)  for their "paid " service.

 Enough said.

[bryonji]

i originally thought this was a thread about kelvin jack.......then i see it was bout the other jack.......................and yes he that bad

[R45]

A corrupt man, whether they try to redeem themselves using corruption, is still corrupt. We should have a no tolerance policy on corruption, even if we benifit from it. That's the problem with T&T, how can you tell the government they should tief when you get the opportunity to benifit from it and turn a blind eye?

[Jefferz]

stewpssssssss KINGMAN...

HE IS A CORRUPT, UNETHICAL MAN...

HE BELIEVES HE'S GOD.


YUH KNOW HOW MANY MAN GEH HOSPITALIZED BY APPOSING HIM...?


He is ah complete mafia man...

so please dun dis shit talk before we go through all dis rubbish again...

FAWK need tuh start buyin soma dem guns comin in from Venezuala oui... (sigh)

[Jefferz]

The man tried to deny Lasana accreditation - ah mean, Liburd is a damn good writer.

Warner real nasty fuh doing that man.

Stewpsssssss

and you wasnt de same man saying Lisana was unreasonably attackin Warner.


Ah glad like yuh change yuh mind.

[Ponnoxx]

stewpssssssss KINGMAN...

HE IS A CORRUPT, UNETHICAL MAN...

HE BELIEVES HE'S GOD.


YUH KNOW HOW MANY MAN GEH HOSPITALIZED BY APPOSING HIM...?


He is ah complete mafia man...

so please dun dis shit talk before we go through all dis rubbish again...

FAWK need tuh start buyin soma dem guns comin in from Venezuala oui... (sigh)

How much men get hospitalised? Name one....The man helped us reach WC...A move which could change the way Football is played and how it is looked at in T&T and even the Caribbean...He has made some shady moves but what he has done could change History for us....Is he that bad??? none of us could answer that correctly because his character contradicts itself....Go T&T