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Offline triniboots

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the pace factor
« on: May 27, 2006, 05:35:33 PM »
Ok, I vex. Ah know dat we know about pace when it comes to carnival and so on, but I real concern about the pace of our game after watching Whales. While I found us to have a disciplined approach (a la Dutch influence), just looking at the Premier League games as well as some England matches, it seems that the Queen's men play at least 40% faster than us and yes, Yorke, Latas, John & crew play/played there, we really need to come with 1000% Warrior mentality in defence, middle and offence for the full game. To see how that second goal happened today was real disappointing. As i said we need a true Warrior mentality, take no prisoners approach. Bring the game to the opposition on all fronts cause if we do what we did today, especially in the last few minutes, backpeddling will get us in trouble. GO T&T!!!

Offline Warrior30

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2006, 05:44:33 PM »
While I agree with the pace factor there are a lot of positives to get out of this. First of all we keep possesion very well. This was a problem in the past. Wales did not help this with their approach to the game as well but there were good patient build ups by TNT and that can frustrate the likes of the teams in our groups. Also, Our wing backs we making some good over lapping runs and coming up to support in attack which is good. Carlos looked good, but his crosses can be better. Stern now score 2 in 2games and had a couple shots block. Birch... is Birch work hard and always finding himself supporting and getting some good looks. Hopefully he BLAST IT LIKE BIRCHILL when it matters. Dwight controlled the middle well and string his passes more or less excellently. Jack made a very good save in the first half to his right. Sammy Boy come on and prove that his pace is a factor just his final decision needs to be more consistent.And well de best for Last... LATAS..... BRAVO for 37. Created a couple chances for himself as well as Stern..... PEOPLE REMEMBER.... IT IS LIKE SWIMMING... DE MEN JUST TAPERING UP RIGHT NOW. THEY TRAINING HARD.... TWICE A DAY EVEN DE DAY BEFORE GAME....LEGS HEAVY. I am not affraid... we wont be embarass in de CUP and we could well sneak a surprise result or 2.  GOOOOO WARRIORS!!!!!
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Offline kicker

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2006, 05:45:41 PM »
Ok, I vex. Ah know dat we know about pace when it comes to carnival and so on, but I real concern about the pace of our game after watching Whales.

Well if you were watching Whales, I could understand why yuh frustrated with the lack of pace....Yuh shoulda be watching Wales.....

but in all seriousness, the lack of pace in our game has been an issue for a while, but I think we are compensating for it now with increased discipline and alot better possession....plus I think we have more tempo in us. Beenie alluded to the fact that the team is training twice a day and could be a little fatigued......... plus this was a practice match, so by nature it would be a little slower and less aggressive.

The thing about it is, we played our game and were not forced out of it......so whether it was slow or not, we still maintained control, and were still able to create numerous chances....we just need to finish them.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2006, 05:47:13 PM by kicker »
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Offline paddy

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2006, 06:03:42 PM »
T&T played well and yes there are some lessons to be learned but there are plenty of positives from tonight's game. they are playing as a unit and i am sure they will learn from any weaknesses, and they are trying out new ideas on the pitch - they will fine tune the operation and up the tempo - they are gonna work hard at it. we got some proven match winners and beenie is a fantastic coach.

Offline triniboots

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2006, 06:14:11 PM »
Oh gosh, Ah shame for days that I spelled Wales as "Whales." Better leave meh wok in USA and go back to New Town Boys for the some classes.  ;D

Offline kicker

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2006, 06:14:55 PM »
Oh gosh, Ah shame for days that I spelled Wales as "Whales." Better leave meh wok in USA and go back to New Town Boys for the some classes.  ;D

small ting...iz just jones
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Offline Midknight

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2006, 06:33:49 PM »
Reality Check

Since the iceland game I hearing people complaining about our lack of pace. Supposedly we are a more latin american  ::) team and should be playing pacy football. Anybody who been watching us play in the last 15 years should realise that next to teams like Costa Rica, at our fastest (with men like Dwarika and wise in their prime on at the same time) we resembled a group of tight revellers chipping behind a steelband on a jouvert morning (speed wise).

In any case pace is not so much the problem. It is CHANGE OF PACE which makes attacks much less predictable. Beenie has encouraged the team to work on its possession, and to be honest, in no game since we qualified have we looked panicked with posession in midfield as usd to be the case before, and maybe somewhat neglected that aspect of the game.

The change of pace can only come from two things. Individual speed merchants (Samuels, Whitley, may i say WISE) and nice one twos around the box (we saw a few involving birchall + edwards, latas and samuels samuels and birchall etc).

At the end of the day I won't read too much into the game in that department. The problem we had was scoring first and too early. T+T always play a bit laid back when we don't have a definite goal to chase, wuss yet in a friendly. Just as against PEru, once we fell behind guys started moving 3 steps faster.

I always thought "calypsoccer" was more our thing than soca football for that matter, but thats another story...
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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2006, 06:38:58 PM »

 plus this was a practice match, so by nature it would be a little slower and less aggressive.


this is our problem. We are 12 days away, playing in a WC warmup match and for some reason we think that its ok to be slow and not press? Our pace is not up to par at certain times of the match. Im not against slowing the pace down, in fact that has been great for us, but we just have better off the ball runs.. Pace or no pace, if we walk around the park all day we will have problems.
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Offline kicker

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #8 on: May 27, 2006, 06:47:21 PM »

 plus this was a practice match, so by nature it would be a little slower and less aggressive.


this is our problem. We are 12 days away, playing in a WC warmup match and for some reason we think that its ok to be slow and not press?

I think every World Cup team plays their friendlies at lower level of intensity, especially in these last days/weeks......everyone's a little cautious & somewhat conservative....I don't think it's just OUR problem....

what I'm concerned about is whether or not we can maintain the level of comfort on the ball, when the intensity does infact increase......A friendly is not the best stage to judge that, because as the name suggests they are just friendlies.....that's how I see it.
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Offline paddy

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2006, 06:51:37 PM »
pace isnt everything. no 1 you play as a unit so every player kniow what he is doing. then you can control the pace and dictate the pace. thats how you impose your game on the opposition and put them under pressure. ...

Offline palos

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2006, 07:14:48 PM »
Ah wonder if people who does be commentin about "de pace of de British Leagues" ever stop to consider dat dem same British Leagues does play from later August to March....when de flikkin weather COLE NO ASS...especially from November to February!

Ah wonder if dem same teams in de British Leagues would play 120 mph football if dey had was to play week een week out in 90 degree weather LIKE IT WAS TODAY IN AUSTRIA!!

I eh sayin we doh have to up de pace a we game.....but again people makin judgements based on what dey accustomed seein when de timin of de World Cup go be totally different. 

If allyuh comparin...try comparin apples to apples nah man....not apples to flikkin zaboca.
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Offline Ponnoxx

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2006, 07:20:53 PM »
 Pace is important but not everything...Pace on the wings is important...and I think we have that...If we look sluggish that is understandable....I think it has to do with our lackluster mentality, which Beenhakker has worked to oust...The problem is our defense and their lack of concentration..They lose concentration to easily and that results in 'soft' goals...However I am not scared...As long as they go out to World Cup hyped up and Adrenaline pumping it could be a totally different story...Win, Draw or Lose we fighting those games...I know that....Go T&T

Offline dwn

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2006, 08:10:40 PM »
The problem we had was scoring first and too early.

That makes no sense what so ever.

Offline Trinimassive

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2006, 08:18:34 PM »
Ah feel we playin to plan and building up well. We first have to keep possession as we are presently and as we perfect that we could play the same way with just more intensity. This is how we gonna be playin just at a faster pace. We had control of the game, kept the ball from the opposition and created opportunities.

Once the fellas keep playing together and get familiar with where each other is and where they would be next our speed will pick up. I'm not too worried.

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2006, 09:01:26 PM »
one more thing, not pace related, but how many times have we seen lawrence control the ball, as the last man in the back with a man on him hard, and pull a cheeky move to slip by him? Big Den, please try and rid that habit. too many times our defense is too casual on the ball.
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Offline Jah Gol

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2006, 09:11:31 PM »
Reality Check

Since the iceland game I hearing people complaining about our lack of pace. Supposedly we are a more latin american  ::) team and should be playing pacy football. Anybody who been watching us play in the last 15 years should realise that next to teams like Costa Rica, at our fastest (with men like Dwarika and wise in their prime on at the same time) we resembled a group of tight revellers chipping behind a steelband on a jouvert morning (speed wise).

In any case pace is not so much the problem. It is CHANGE OF PACE which makes attacks much less predictable. Beenie has encouraged the team to work on its possession, and to be honest, in no game since we qualified have we looked panicked with posession in midfield as usd to be the case before, and maybe somewhat neglected that aspect of the game.

The change of pace can only come from two things. Individual speed merchants (Samuels, Whitley, may i say WISE) and nice one twos around the box (we saw a few involving birchall + edwards, latas and samuels samuels and birchall etc).

At the end of the day I won't read too much into the game in that department. The problem we had was scoring first and too early. T+T always play a bit laid back when we don't have a definite goal to chase, wuss yet in a friendly. Just as against PEru, once we fell behind guys started moving 3 steps faster.

I always thought "calypsoccer" was more our thing than soca football for that matter, but thats another story...

I can't agree with you more. I probably don't have as much experience as a fan some of the veterans here but as far back as i remember we were known to have lots of pace. We always probably have 1 or 2 players who could give a decent sprint but we were never pacey on a team level. We are notorious for showing a lack of urgency when the score is 0-0 for, I remember men used talk about that since Porterfield days. The present coach is trying his best to remove that bad habit.

I think the Trinidad's style is to try to slow the play to a pace that is comfortable for us and then create space with some 1-2s and a beat or with a calculated longer pass. I don't think this is a negative but we need to enhance it. When I look at world class football and compare it to our club and national team football one thing that is glaring to me is the difference in the level of physical play. Generally we don't take physical development as seriously as we should. If there's one thing the Americans do which I think we can emulate is to have players who are strong and fast. If we could combine this with our skill I think we'll be a dangerous threat in the future.

Offline davidephraim

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2006, 09:19:16 PM »
Barca vs Arsenal. Arsenal was trying to keep the game pacey and did so for 46 minutes in which case they completely had Barca off guard. Barca, led by Ronaldhino dont know how to play dat pacey English brand and after slowing down de game, took charge and kept position.  Brasil play slow passing and explosive soccer.  Argentina still playing de ball thru Requelme for he to build. SLOW

I wish we wolud play with a South American  - Dutch flair because we will maintain position
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Offline Preacher

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2006, 10:12:28 PM »
Fellas Palos have a point dey. It was real hot on that field yesterday.  So no wonder Wales wasn't working as hard considering it that hot and is a friendly.  In that light you have to give the boys props because we still looked more dangerous at most times.  We were beaten technically both goals were technical errors. 

Also do you think that Beenie playing all fours with our opposition by purposely misleading them about the line up and approach?  Playing slow slow and ting.  Allyuh football men do coaches do that?
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Offline palos

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2006, 10:18:34 PM »
Barca vs Arsenal. Arsenal was trying to keep the game pacey and did so for 46 minutes in which case they completely had Barca off guard. Barca, led by Ronaldhino dont know how to play dat pacey English brand and after slowing down de game, took charge and kept position.  Brasil play slow passing and explosive soccer.  Argentina still playing de ball thru Requelme for he to build. SLOW

I wish we wolud play with a South American  - Dutch flair because we will maintain position

Allyuh think climate is a factor in determinin how teams play?  If we was a cole weather country...think we woulda be playin de same way?  Think we woulda be playin football period?

Lemmeh ask a nex question....

Which one is easier to adapt to allyuh think?

A cole weather team dat accustom playin at 120 mph havin to play in 90 degree weather?

Or a warm weather team dat accustom to knock and build up havin to play in de cole?

Think de cole weather team would or even COULD still play at 120 mph fuh 90 minutes in dah 90 degree heat?  Tink dey could play at dat pace fuh 20 minutes even?

How about d warm weather team?  Think dey would still play slow build up, knock football when it -10?
« Last Edit: May 27, 2006, 10:21:55 PM by palos »
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Offline palos

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2006, 11:07:48 PM »
Ah wonder if dem same teams in de British Leagues would play 120 mph football if dey had was to play week een week out in 90 degree weather LIKE IT WAS TODAY IN AUSTRIA!!
I keep forgetting that the humidity was high so there was a reason for the slower pace of the game, but very disappointed that TnT was not able to pulll a win

So are ALL of us....and nobody more so than de players.  They know they let a great opportunity slip away...practice match or no practice match.  But no sense dwellin on dat now.  Character is the ability to rebound from adversity and disappointment.  Let's see how our team responds in the next game.  Overall, I liked the performance today....not the result.  Let's move on.
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Offline Rastaman

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #20 on: May 28, 2006, 06:12:13 PM »
Reality Check

Since the iceland game I hearing people complaining about our lack of pace. Supposedly we are a more latin american  ::) team and should be playing pacy football. Anybody who been watching us play in the last 15 years should realise that next to teams like Costa Rica, at our fastest (with men like Dwarika and wise in their prime on at the same time) we resembled a group of tight revellers chipping behind a steelband on a jouvert morning (speed wise).

In any case pace is not so much the problem. It is CHANGE OF PACE which makes attacks much less predictable. Beenie has encouraged the team to work on its possession, and to be honest, in no game since we qualified have we looked panicked with posession in midfield as usd to be the case before, and maybe somewhat neglected that aspect of the game.

The change of pace can only come from two things. Individual speed merchants (Samuels, Whitley, may i say WISE) and nice one twos around the box (we saw a few involving birchall + edwards, latas and samuels samuels and birchall etc).

At the end of the day I won't read too much into the game in that department. The problem we had was scoring first and too early. T+T always play a bit laid back when we don't have a definite goal to chase, wuss yet in a friendly. Just as against PEru, once we fell behind guys started moving 3 steps faster.

I always thought "calypsoccer" was more our thing than soca football for that matter, but thats another story...

I can't agree with you more. I probably don't have as much experience as a fan some of the veterans here but as far back as i remember we were known to have lots of pace. We always probably have 1 or 2 players who could give a decent sprint but we were never pacey on a team level. We are notorious for showing a lack of urgency when the score is 0-0 for, I remember men used talk about that since Porterfield days. The present coach is trying his best to remove that bad habit.

I think the Trinidad's style is to try to slow the play to a pace that is comfortable for us and then create space with some 1-2s and a beat or with a calculated longer pass. I don't think this is a negative but we need to enhance it. When I look at world class football and compare it to our club and national team football one thing that is glaring to me is the difference in the level of physical play. Generally we don't take physical development as seriously as we should. If there's one thing the Americans do which I think we can emulate is to have players who are strong and fast. If we could combine this with our skill I think we'll be a dangerous threat in the future.
This is such a good point....we have always has smaller more skillfull players alla Lataly. Them teams would just bounce men off the ball or physically mark men out the game..Remember Yorke against Alexi Lallas

Offline Observer

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2006, 07:47:33 AM »
There are other factors to consider.
More than likely it will be hot and that should be in our advantage, this alone dictates the pace of games .

 The pace of play is not simply the physical speed of individuals, but the speed of the passing and speed of thought. The fields will be well watered before each game in Germany. This means that the ball can be played quicker along the ground. Our passing was quite good against Wales, but we were not under real pressure. We also did not penetrate quickly enough with our passing (IMHO) against Wales. This will allow disciplined defending teams like Sweden to get organized and more difficult to break down. Sweden in general is open to counter attacks, this is where the speed of our play will be essential.
The question becomes can we dictate the pace of the game and control it with our passing?
Can we speed it up and counter effectively?
If played in a situation where we are pressured quickly, can we pass quicker and think quicker under this pressure?
At what point will our game break down? Quite clearly T&T has problems in the opening minutes of games, if we could get through this shakey patch or if concentration can be improved upon, then we may settle and become more comfortable.
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Offline injunchile

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Re: the pace factor
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2006, 08:00:31 AM »
Hey Kicker- Thanks for the hearty laugh on this Memorial day. Wales instead of Whales, The truth of the matter is that no one wants to go hard into  the tackle  because of the injury factor. Secondly one expert in the match USA vs Latvia said that practicing twice a day takes a tool on the players and they need a day off to get back into fresh legs. Warm up matches is quite different from an actual competitive game.
 Against Wales offensively we have improved tremendously, I am still worried about the defence. I lookedat USA vs Latvia and Latvia had three chances to score and wasted it,
 The key to the world cup is to bury chances and make the most of half chances.

 

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