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Offline Remie

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Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« on: July 27, 2006, 03:37:20 AM »
Agents could hinder T&T chances of progressing to the next level. Look at what level these players could start next season

Sancho- English 3rd tier
Lawrence- English 4th tier
Edwards- English 2nd tier
Whitley- T&T 1st tier
Grey- T&T 1st tier
Glenn- USA 1st tier
Birchall- English 3rd tier

All of the players listed above, in my opinion, excelled and played over and above what was expected of them in the World Cup. Before the World Cup I would never have thought that players of the likes of Lawrence would have looked like such a rock at the heart of the defence.

After watching the English Premiership and Championship for a number of years I am pretty sure that based on their World Cup performances they would all be first team regulars in the Championship and could also cut it in Premiership squads.

Now that we have broken through onto the world stage we have to capitalise on the opportunities that come our way. However to get those opportunities some work needs to be done. The players have done their job on the football field now the agents have to do their job off it.

If the majority of our first eleven are in the Premiership or Championship it will increase the chances of promising youths in T&T being scouted by English clubs, thus taking T&T to the next level. When I say the next level I mean the next stage in our progression like the direction in which African teams seem to be moving. Promising young African footballers are getting contracts signed up left, right and centre. In this World Cup we saw Ghana come and knock out a few big teams. The Ivory Coast looked quite promising.

However, with only 2/3 weeks left before the English season gets underway it looks like we are not going to reap all the possible benefits of qualifying for the World Cup. I believe some of the blame must lie with the agents of these players.

What do you guys think?

Offline supporter

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2006, 05:36:58 AM »
skysports.com

Mike Newell has reiterated his contentment at Luton despite the departure of two of his top players.

The promising young tactician has seen his captain Kevin Nicholls depart for Leeds, while last season's top goalscorer Steve Howard has switched allegiances to Derby County.

An impressive tenth place finish last term did not go unnoticed elsewhere and Newell too was linked with several other higher profile clubs.

However, Newell has now rubbished speculation about a possible departure and on the contrary has revealed he will definitely be at Kenilworth Road this term.

''I have made my decision and I am staying here, so people worrying about that don't need to worry any more,'' said Newell.

''I need to sit down with the board of directors when I get back.''

With local rivals Watford keen to bring Carlos Edwards to Vicarage Road, Luton supporters are bracing themselves for more disappointment but again, Newell is quick to play down exit talk.

''Carlos Edwards is with us in Sweden at the moment and he is one of our players,'' he added. ''That's it.''
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Offline Remie

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2006, 06:00:14 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2006, 06:59:13 AM by Remie »

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2006, 08:12:21 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.

i totally agree with you, the english fight down business dont work for me, its time we get contacts with the spanish and italian leagues, even bundesliga and holland,instead of england, frige argentina and brazil also has great leagues, i hate how our players are stuck on england, its sickening.

Offline doc

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2006, 08:20:44 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.

i totally agree with you, the english fight down business dont work for me, its time we get contacts with the spanish and italian leagues, even bundesliga and holland,instead of england, frige argentina and brazil also has great leagues, i hate how our players are stuck on england, its sickening.
TI there is a business opportunity for you. Stop talking bout it and do something about it! 8)
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Offline doc

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2006, 08:30:39 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.


i totally agree with you, the english fight down business dont work for me, its time we get contacts with the spanish and italian leagues, even bundesliga and holland,instead of england, frige argentina and brazil also has great leagues, i hate how our players are stuck on england, its sickening.
TI there is a business opportunity for you. Stop talking bout it and do something about it! 8)

i have contacts in Canada, US and holland, but our coaching staff was dutch and is dutch, from ajax and feyernord respectively, they should be able to get players contracts in amsterdam and rotterdam, without even braking a sweat, especially the talent we have, so I didnt see a need tuh even do it, but say wha, lets see, bc wim is a feyernord man, so i dont understand why none of we players are going to holland? i know they are talented enough..
Go ahead bro, think it through. What can you conclude from what you've stated so far? They have contacts, yet nobody getting contracts. That's so because..... ??? :devil: :devil:
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Offline Remie

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2006, 08:34:32 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.

i totally agree with you, the english fight down business dont work for me, its time we get contacts with the spanish and italian leagues, even bundesliga and holland,instead of england, frige argentina and brazil also has great leagues, i hate how our players are stuck on england, its sickening.

TI i didn't say that our players should forget about the English leagues. I actually think the English leagues are the best realistic option for our players. Once our players break into the Premiership then other countries like Germany, Italy, Spain may start to take interst in our players.

However i do not want this to turn into a discussion about which leagues our players should be playing in. I want the attention focused on the agents that these players are currently dealing with. Why are the players i have listed not being signed up by clubs in the Premiership or Championship based on their World Cup performances?

Give me a few minutes and il come back with some players that have been signed in the Premiership just because they had a few good World Cup games.

Offline Trini _2026

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2006, 08:58:24 AM »
I know Carlos Edwards may get a move to the Premiership soon, however, it is not just Carlos Edwards that should me moving. Most if not all of the players i listed should be moving up the leagues.

Anyways Carlos Edwards was attracting Premiership interest before the World Cup. I am more interested to know why the other players have not been on the move.

i totally agree with you, the english fight down business dont work for me, its time we get contacts with the spanish and italian leagues, even bundesliga and holland,instead of england, frige argentina and brazil also has great leagues, i hate how our players are stuck on england, its sickening.
TI there is a business opportunity for you. Stop talking bout it and do something about it! 8)

i have contacts in Canada, US and holland, but our coaching staff was dutch and is dutch, from ajax and feyernord respectively, they should be able to get players contracts in amsterdam and rotterdam, without even braking a sweat, especially the talent we have, so I didnt see a need tuh even do it, but say wha, lets see, bc wim is a feyernord man, so i dont understand why none of we players are going to holland? i know they are talented enough..

get contract with out breaking a sweat  :rotfl: ajax and feyernord ???   which are among  the best youth systems in the world !!  aye they have to be good enough to at least get a trials. It nice to have faith but lets not get ahead of ourselves be careful what you type.

what drop dead talent do we have TI  :-\
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Offline Remie

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2006, 09:01:04 AM »
Luke Wilkshire (Australia). A lot of Premiership and Championship clubs were after him but it looks as though he has decided to go to FC Twente.

John Painstill (Ghana) on trial with West Ham. Pardew said he is impressed with Painstill's trial so far and Painstill may be the right back he is looking for.

John Mensah (Ghana). A host of Premiership clubs are interested in the centre back rated at £4m.

Seol Ki-Hyeon (South Korea) has been signed by Reading for £1.5m.

My source was www.skysports.com

The only T&T player on the list that I gave that would command a transfer fee above £1m is Edwards. All of the other T&T players will be bargains.

Offline Pompey

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2006, 09:04:11 AM »
If the players are good enough, the big clubs will find them.

Remember, it is in the agents best interests to get them a big deal, they get a percentage.

Offline Trini _2026

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2006, 09:07:37 AM »
Many factors

EPL managers were  MAYBE not impressed
They have to be sure what they are buying..
You have to consider the age
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Offline Baygo Boy

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2006, 11:45:41 AM »
Agents are not to blame. We must remember that football talent is a "dime a dozen".  Everywhere you venture you would find quality talent especially in SA and the African continent, language is another barrier, and of course it's cheaper to import an African than it is to import a Trinbagonian. Therefore for a Trinbagonian to be considered for the top level leagues he must be heads above in talent than everyone else, willing to learn the language quickly, and  MUST always play like if it is his last game, always an inspired performance, not that laid back approach our players have (ever watch most of our players during regular season). 

Apart from the above our domestic league/teams must become  household names in this footballing business. Our league is not understood, foreign coaches etc are not familiar with our systems (players development, training etc). A foreign coach in a top level league would find it difficult to sign a Trinibagonian player just based on a good trial, if a coach has to make a decision between a Brazilian that is equally as talented as a Trinbagonian there's a good chance he would go for the Brazilian simply because the coach is aware of the developmental systems/Structure etc in Brazil.

Agents like Berry have done quite alot for our players. By finding foreign pro spots for our players younger players are beginning to recognize that they now have a legit opportunity to make a decent living from the Almighty's gift to them :devil:

 

Offline marcpurcell

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2006, 11:48:49 AM »
This is what I was saying about two weeks ago. I know it is up to the player to impress but if you don't a good agent with good links it means nothing.

What brought this to my attention was the fac that Jamaican players through an agent were getting trials and contracts to Championship and EPL clubs.

We on the other hand have an agent linked to San Juan who has links to smaller clubs in England.

When you go to smaller clubs like Crewe and Wrexham your exposure on national tv is very limited. You have very small oppurnities to shine (FA Cup etc). I don't believe scouts from the Premeir League clubs are going all over England to see teams like Swansea and Gillingham play. They have better things to do.

It took Carlos getting to the World Cup to get the kind of exposure for him to get offers to play in the EPL. It starts with the agent with links to big clubs for a man like Whitley, Gray, Spann and Wolfe to get a shot at Championship or EPL. Other than that they will end up playing on small sides in England and Scotland.
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Offline Baygo Boy

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2006, 12:02:09 PM »
A few years ago, I had several phone and email conversations with a premiership scout, and posed the question regarding T&T players and if his club was aware of what they are doing at their clubs in England and Scotland, and he told me that his club has a database of almost all national team players in the top 50 of FIFA's ranking that are playing in England and Scotland, and they would go to see players (unannounced), or request tapes etc of players that are having good seasons.

Offline Filho

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2006, 01:15:13 PM »
Well..the Mexicans are on the move. I guess this is kind of what we were hoping for with a few of our players. The Mexicans will probably get stronger now that key players are leaving home and getting greater exposure to different styles of football. Even a man who get a drugs ban on the move..that is real sh**

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2006, 01:55:46 PM »
doh matta de better mexico look
de better we look when we beat dem

Offline SUPA

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2006, 05:01:58 PM »
Agents could hinder T&T chances of progressing to the next level. Look at what level these players could start next season

Sancho- English 3rd tier
Lawrence- English 4th tier
Edwards- English 2nd tier
Whitley- T&T 1st tier
Grey- T&T 1st tier
Glenn- USA 1st tier
Birchall- English 3rd tier

All of the players listed above, in my opinion, excelled and played over and above what was expected of them in the World Cup. Before the World Cup I would never have thought that players of the likes of Lawrence would have looked like such a rock at the heart of the defence.

After watching the English Premiership and Championship for a number of years I am pretty sure that based on their World Cup performances they would all be first team regulars in the Championship and could also cut it in Premiership squads.

Now that we have broken through onto the world stage we have to capitalise on the opportunities that come our way. However to get those opportunities some work needs to be done. The players have done their job on the football field now the agents have to do their job off it.

If the majority of our first eleven are in the Premiership or Championship it will increase the chances of promising youths in T&T being scouted by English clubs, thus taking T&T to the next level. When I say the next level I mean the next stage in our progression like the direction in which African teams seem to be moving. Promising young African footballers are getting contracts signed up left, right and centre. In this World Cup we saw Ghana come and knock out a few big teams. The Ivory Coast looked quite promising.

However, with only 2/3 weeks left before the English season gets underway it looks like we are not going to reap all the possible benefits of qualifying for the World Cup. I believe some of the blame must lie with the agents of these players.

What do you guys think?


Ah totally agree wid you, for example Lawrence, ah cud never understand why dis player is still in dat low division, after showing he cud hold out against some of de best attackers in de world. For the least he should be in de championship, but ah think he ready fuh de premier league. He is not young in terms of football, but he has a few years left in him. Dat is just one example, de other players, is ah different story, but same issue, dey should move on tuh bigger and better things also.
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Offline jai john

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2006, 06:18:03 PM »
Many factors

EPL managers were  MAYBE not impressed
They have to be sure what they are buying..
You have to consider the age

I agree . you wont put out dead money on old players as you cant sell on . when the conract ends if you dont want them they are worthless to you .

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2006, 07:57:19 PM »
Ppl feel it have contracts giving out just so ,we might think that our players did well at de WC and deserve to play on better teams and while that might be true,most of the teams had dey scouts at the WC looking for talent and to be fair this is ah time when agts mouth does water trying to get big money for their players which results in ah heafty check for demselves.
I still feel we have one or two players will be changing  clubs soon,all we cud do is wait and see.
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Offline Jefferz

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2006, 08:55:10 PM »
I dont see any managers that want to do well in their league ignore a certain player just to spite his career.


If our players are good enough... they will get signed plain and simple.
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Offline Quags

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2006, 09:03:15 PM »
Ah really don"t think it that plain and simple,it have traditional scouting areas,wheir not one.And fer some reason we getting overlooked and bypassed.Apparently clubs thinking they could get a talent like Carlos
elsewhere  ???...why,is he not unique,if he was south american he"d probably have a bigger contract .Something wrong.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2006, 10:08:40 PM by Compre »

Offline Remie

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2006, 02:35:34 AM »
If the players are good enough, the big clubs will find them.

Remember, it is in the agents best interests to get them a big deal, they get a percentage.

Maybe T&T player's agents don't have good enough contacts?

Agents are not to blame. We must remember that football talent is a "dime a dozen". Everywhere you venture you would find quality talent especially in SA and the African continent, language is another barrier, and of course it's cheaper to import an African than it is to import a Trinbagonian. Therefore for a Trinbagonian to be considered for the top level leagues he must be heads above in talent than everyone else, willing to learn the language quickly, and MUST always play like if it is his last game, always an inspired performance, not that laid back approach our players have (ever watch most of our players during regular season).

Apart from the above our domestic league/teams must become household names in this footballing business. Our league is not understood, foreign coaches etc are not familiar with our systems (players development, training etc). A foreign coach in a top level league would find it difficult to sign a Trinibagonian player just based on a good trial, if a coach has to make a decision between a Brazilian that is equally as talented as a Trinbagonian there's a good chance he would go for the Brazilian simply because the coach is aware of the developmental systems/Structure etc in Brazil.

Agents like Berry have done quite alot for our players. By finding foreign pro spots for our players younger players are beginning to recognize that they now have a legit opportunity to make a decent living from the Almighty's gift to them :devil:

 

Berry may have done an excellent job for us in the past, i am not disputing that. But we have moved up a level in our status in football and maybe it is time for our players to be dealing with agents who will progress their careers better? Football is a cut throat business.

For example Lawrence is 31 now . This could have been his last shot at playing in the top division of a top country. Whitley is 29 now. He should be playing week in week out with top players in a top division.

What i am saying is that if players like Lawrence and Whitley were to play in the English Premier League or Championship and excel it will open up greater opportunities for all the youths coming through in T&T. The future Lawrence's and future Whitley's will get better opportunities than the present Lawrence and present Whitley got when they were younger.

You can say that these players are touching their 30s but they are not costing any money in Premiership or Championship terms, and are playing on low wages in Premiership or Championship terms.

I do not believe the T&T player's agents have utilised this World Cup to its maximum, and it may have been a great opportunity missed to further progress T&T football.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2006, 02:42:27 AM by Remie »

Offline fishs

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2006, 03:16:22 AM »
I dont see any managers that want to do well in their league ignore a certain player just to spite his career.


If our players are good enough... they will get signed plain and simple.

If the WC was a basis for the premier teams (whatever country) signing our players, the only player in with a chance is Edwards.

Yeh we perform good in the WC as a team an make the nation proud an all of that (ah not make it sonund like nothing).
But what did the scouts see in the world cup ?

A team fully committed to deefence and nothing else of substance.
How could a scout make informed judgement about any players all round ability based on the individual players performances ?

2010 When we qualify it should be a different story.
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Offline dinho

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2006, 03:48:33 AM »
Aside from the agents, some other factors to consider:

Age:

The age at which players attain their highest value and marketability has drastically reduced in the last 10 years. Whereas 10 years ago, a player at his prime (age 26-29) would command the highest wage, the transfer market now focuses not only on talent but potential. So a player age 18-22 would fetch the highest value knowing that he can produce the goods at a younger age, and also be a profitable investment should the club desire to sell him on. Most of our best players fall outside the age of highest marketability and thus will not attract the attention of the better clubs. Even the best players in the world are not commanding the sort of interest they would have now because of their age eg. Crespo is 29, available on the cheap, but interest so far is not forthcoming.

Transfer Market:

The transfer market is tight right now with a focus on the best bargain for the least money. Gone are the days of inflated player fees like when Zidane was sold, where clubs would spend astronomical amounts on players. Now, apart from Chelsea and Real Madrid, it is rare to find a club spending over £20 million for a player. Clubs have become much more prudent with their investments and as such, for a club to take a chance on any of our Trinidad players, they would have to be guaranteed that their performance will bring instantaneous rewards. The TT player would have to be a cut above the rest and I dont think we have many players right now that we can guarantee will light up the higher leagues.

Global Availability of Talent:

Football has become such a global game now that quality players can be found in any corner of the planet. The last 2 World Cup has shown that the gulf in the class of national teams across continents has shrunk enormously. So whereas 10 years ago, if you were a manager, you know you could only get a good player from europe, south america, a few from Africa, minority from elsewhere, now you can pretty much get that anywhwere. This has increase the competition for the places available at clubs, and only the best talent is going to the best leagues. Consequently, whilst years ago, the world cup would be a venue to unearth hidden talent and a player could get a contract off performances, nowadays, everyone pretty much knows about all the players even before they get to the tournament. And even if our players did well there, its not a guarantee they can maintain that over the course of a season.

Style of play:

The World cup exhibited that the global game is changing such that success does not go to the team with the most talented players (Argentina, Brazil, Ghana) but rather the teams with the best tactical approaches (Italy, France, Germany). As such, not so much emphasis goes to a player who is blessed with talent to burn, than a player who is physically fit, disciplined and can best adhere to a tactical system. I suspect this is part of the reason why there's not as much confidence in our players as anticipated because there may not be the guarantees that our players can keep up the high standard of performances through the duration of a season.

Just some thoughts for consideration..
         

Offline Remie

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Re: Agents could hinder T&Ts progress
« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2006, 04:39:08 AM »
Aside from the agents, some other factors to consider:

Age:

The age at which players attain their highest value and marketability has drastically reduced in the last 10 years. Whereas 10 years ago, a player at his prime (age 26-29) would command the highest wage, the transfer market now focuses not only on talent but potential. So a player age 18-22 would fetch the highest value knowing that he can produce the goods at a younger age, and also be a profitable investment should the club desire to sell him on. Most of our best players fall outside the age of highest marketability and thus will not attract the attention of the better clubs. Even the best players in the world are not commanding the sort of interest they would have now because of their age eg. Crespo is 29, available on the cheap, but interest so far is not forthcoming.

Transfer Market:

The transfer market is tight right now with a focus on the best bargain for the least money. Gone are the days of inflated player fees like when Zidane was sold, where clubs would spend astronomical amounts on players. Now, apart from Chelsea and Real Madrid, it is rare to find a club spending over £20 million for a player. Clubs have become much more prudent with their investments and as such, for a club to take a chance on any of our Trinidad players, they would have to be guaranteed that their performance will bring instantaneous rewards. The TT player would have to be a cut above the rest and I dont think we have many players right now that we can guarantee will light up the higher leagues.

Global Availability of Talent:

Football has become such a global game now that quality players can be found in any corner of the planet. The last 2 World Cup has shown that the gulf in the class of national teams across continents has shrunk enormously. So whereas 10 years ago, if you were a manager, you know you could only get a good player from europe, south america, a few from Africa, minority from elsewhere, now you can pretty much get that anywhwere. This has increase the competition for the places available at clubs, and only the best talent is going to the best leagues. Consequently, whilst years ago, the world cup would be a venue to unearth hidden talent and a player could get a contract off performances, nowadays, everyone pretty much knows about all the players even before they get to the tournament. And even if our players did well there, its not a guarantee they can maintain that over the course of a season.

Style of play:

The World cup exhibited that the global game is changing such that success does not go to the team with the most talented players (Argentina, Brazil, Ghana) but rather the teams with the best tactical approaches (Italy, France, Germany). As such, not so much emphasis goes to a player who is blessed with talent to burn, than a player who is physically fit, disciplined and can best adhere to a tactical system. I suspect this is part of the reason why there's not as much confidence in our players as anticipated because there may not be the guarantees that our players can keep up the high standard of performances through the duration of a season.

Just some thoughts for consideration..

You make some very goods points there.

I dont see any managers that want to do well in their league ignore a certain player just to spite his career.


If our players are good enough... they will get signed plain and simple.

If the WC was a basis for the premier teams (whatever country) signing our players, the only player in with a chance is Edwards.

Yeh we perform good in the WC as a team an make the nation proud an all of that (ah not make it sonund like nothing).
But what did the scouts see in the world cup ?

A team fully committed to deefence and nothing else of substance.
How could a scout make informed judgement about any players all round ability based on the individual players performances ?

2010 When we qualify it should be a different story.
Fuh now just thank yuh blessings that some men gainfully employed

Our defensive unit of Edwards, Lawrence, Sancho, Gray, Birchall, Whitley all stood out and excelled themselves in the World Cup. That is why i only listed those players and Glenn in the list. Apart from Edwards these players could probably be bought for £100,000 or under which is nothing for English Premiership or Championship clubs. Those 6 in the defensive unit were holding their own against the likes of Ibrahimovic, Larsson, Owen, etc. From the World Cup you could see that they were up to at least English Championship standard. I just threw Glenn in there because he made every team panic with his pace.

There is no guarantee that we are going to the World Cup in 2010 and i am not satisfied with our players playing in mediocre leagues when they are capable and have proven they should be playing at a higher level.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2006, 04:41:12 AM by Remie »

 

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