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Offline AB.Trini

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Racism Thread
« on: April 11, 2007, 11:10:16 AM »
Well well look at this article:

Extra! January/February 2000

Anything but Racism
Media make excuses for "whitewashed" TV lineup

By Janine Jackson


Confronted by protests from the NAACP and others about discrimination in their primetime lineup, the four leading TV networks (ABC, CBS, NBC and Fox) did what powerful institutions often do in such situations: They feigned affront, denied the facts, made excuses and attacked the messenger, then offered patchwork "solutions" and returned to business as usual.

The NAACP's Kweisi Mfume denounced the big four's slate of 26 new primetime shows, none of which feature people of color in lead roles, as a "virtual whitewash in programming," and was immediately echoed by such groups as the National Hispanic Media Coalition and the Media Action Network for Asian-Americans. The initial official reaction was upbeat and bland: CBS said that "the issue raised by the NAACP was extremely important," while NBC claimed that "including minorities on the air is an issue that has been a top priority for some time and it continues to remain an important priority." (All Things Considered, 7/28/99)

Asked to comment, individual executives sounded variously defiant: "We want to put on the best shows possible, and I don't care if the casts are blue, green, yellow or orange," declared Fox Entertainment president Doug Herzog (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, 7/28/99). Or hapless: "When you get into picking your pilots and casting...sometimes in the speed of that you don't recognize the larger picture," explained ABC Entertainment co-chair Stu Bloomberg (Plain Dealer, 8/15/99). Or just surly, like the unnamed exec who told Entertainment Weekly (7/30/99): "It's become a no-win proposition. Unless you're putting on an hour-long show about a black brain surgeon helping Third World children, you're insulting the race."

No more serious engagement of the issue was discernible from the networks' news coverage. ABC and CBS gave the protests brief nods (7/12/99) on the nightly news, but the story was otherwise relegated to a scattering of mentions on morning shows. Among the more in-depth of these was a July 13, 1999 Good Morning America, in which host Diane Sawyer gave Mfume approximately four minutes to combine discussion of the NAACP's TV protests with the group's campaign against gun sales.

Counting the wrong thing

If dismissiveness was the predominant tack, a more combative industry response to charges of minority underrepresentation was to say that protesters suffered from a narrow view; if they had only counted something else, the true diversity and fairness of the industry would have shone through. Numerous executives pointed to individual people of color who had succeeded (virtually always Bill Cosby), or individual directors who have made successful interracial shows (virtually always Steven Bochco), as if these exceptions disproved the rule. CBS's Leslie Moonves seemed the most confused: "It's not fair that our network, which features Bill Cosby in two shows, Ed Bradley, Bryant Gumbel, Della Reese, Cheech Marin, Arsenio Hall and Sammo Hung, be accused of not recognizing the minority audience," he complained (Boston Herald, 7/27/99).

Others said the NAACP was wrong to exclude those who "lend strong dramatic support to white leads" (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, 7/28/99). Or that, to be fair, they really should have included everyone appearing on all of television: "If you look at daytime, cable, syndication, public television," explains CBS writer-producer Lee Goldberg (Plain Dealer, 8/15/99), "there's incredible diversity."

Of course, no one denies that the roster of leading roles in the new season's lineup is just a snapshot of the TV industry. It is, however, a meaningful picture. Network primetime still attracts biggest number of viewers, and as a result, the largest amount of ad dollars (Plain Dealer, 8/15/99). Why shouldn't it be subject to scrutiny?

And there's no shortage of other evidence of imbalance. Against Moonves poignant claim to "Bill Cosby in two shows" stand numerous indicators of the overall underrepresentation of blacks, Latinos, Asian-Americans and Native Americans in television writing, acting and producing jobs.

A survey by the NAACP's Beverly Hills/Hollywood chapter found that of 839 writers currently working on primetime shows, just 55 are black, 11 Latino, three Asian-American and none Native American, meaning minorities make up just 7 percent of primetime network writers.

According to the Screen Actors Guild, the number of primetime parts for blacks and Latinos declined in 1998, with blacks filling around 12 percent, and Latinos just 3 percent. Asian-Americans represented a little more than 1 percent of parts on primetime shows.

A 1998 Directors Guild of America report showed that minority (and women) directors (in TV and film) worked fewer days in 1997 than the year before, despite an increase in work for directors overall (L.A. Daily News, 7/17/98).

As for the executive ranks, an investigation by Entertainment Weekly (which has done exceptional reporting on this issue) found only a handful of minorities in television's corridors of power, including Scott Sassa, the Asian-American head of NBC West Coast. (Sassa, along with Cosby and Bochco, is frequently offered as proof that diversity's on the march in TVdom, despite his own comments to the contrary.) Notes Entertainment Weekly (10/18/99), "These are the exceptions, and most of the creative executives come from the cable side," not from broadcasting.

Such numbers are valuable indicators. But the executives are right that numbers don't completely capture racism's complex nature. Discrimination, for example, also takes the form of segregation. The vast majority (83 percent) of the 55 African-American primetime writers worked on shows with primarily black casts. "White writers, however, routinely make the crossover to write on shows with predominantly minority casts," as the Los Angeles Times observed (10/27/99). CBS has 144 writers; the two that are black both work on Cosby.

And of course there are countless anecdotal examples that suggest pervasive problems. Like Jay Dyer, the successful African-American writer whose agent was told flatly: "This isn't a black show. We don't need a black writer." (Entertainment Weekly, 7/30/99) Or the casting director who wasn't satisfied that auditioning actor Garrett Wang was doing a "Japanese accent" until "I took the most exaggerated Cantonese-Chinese accent, you know... 'Oh I give you two free egg roll if you bring laundry into my store.'… And she said, 'That's it. That's the one.'" (All Things Considered, 10/27/99)

Black, Latino, Asian-American and Native American actors cite the frustration of being considered only for "specifically ethnic" roles, the countless opportunities they miss because of someone's parochial idea of what a "neighbor" or a "bank teller" should look like (see, e.g., Hollywood Reporter, 9/14/1999). On the flip side, minority writers say they can only get started in the business by avoiding issues relating to ethnicity: "If you do a spec script for a white show with white characters, at least you'll get a foot in," writer Daryl Nickens told the Chicago Tribune (8/8/93).

The misunderstanding of the systemic, institutional nature of discrimination was also reflected in the scramble by some of the networks to "tack on" token minority characters to existing shows later in the season. "What we keep hearing," explained Milwaukee Journal Sentinel TV critic Joanne Weintraub (All Things Considered, 7/28/99), "is, 'Oh we didn't have any black people or brown people in our pilot, but wait'll you see episode four. We're going to introduce Steve and he's black, and he's going to interact like mad with all the white people.' Sometimes it sounds just that silly."

Not black and white, just green

Even as they more or less acknowledged a hiring system built overwhelmingly on personal networks, the relative absence of minorities in executive roles, and a stubbornly stereotypical approach to casting, the media industry argument in the wake of complaints had a tone best described as, "It's not racism; it's...." That blank was filled various ways, but the hands-down most popular was "it's economics."

"This year's lily-white TV season isn't about racism. It's about ratings. For the networks, diversity just doesn't pay," says the Fort Worth Star Telegram (9/5/99). "Remember that TV is all about numbers," the Orlando Sentinel explained (9/12/99) in a story headlined "Advertisers, Not Networks, Influence the Minority Roles on TV." "Shows succeed—and more often, fail—on ratings. The higher the ratings, the more attractive a show becomes to advertisers. More advertisers equals more money—and a hit show." "Blame Demographics," counsels the Indianapolis Star (7/15/99): "The big networks shoot for the bigger slice of the pie—the 70 percent of viewers who are white." Diane Sawyer (Good Morning America, 7/13/99) summed it up in a question to Kweisi Mfume: "They do go where the money is. So if there were money in it, they would go there. Can you blame them for doing basically what they're constituted to do, which is [be] a network that makes money?"

It's somewhat noteworthy to see media acknowledge the powerful role sponsors play in the content of programming. But this "economics, stupid" line, which pretends to be a dry-eyed, straight-up look at things, actually stops short of the whole story.

The WB's Felicity draws similar numbers of 18-to-49 year-olds as the net's two highest-rated black series, the Steve Harvey Show and the Jamie Foxx Show. But last season, Felicity commanded more than twice as much money per 30-second commercial than either show ($80,000 vs. less than $40,000). In the first week of the new season, The Steve Harvey Show pulled in 500,000 more viewers than Dawson's Creek; but Dawson's Creek gets $63,000 more for a 30-second spot. (All Things Considered, 10/17/99) How can that be simple ratings?

The fact is "economics" do not explain the disparate treatment of white and non-white audiences by sponsors, and consequently by programmers. Advertisers pay less for programs that garner non-white audiences, in a widely acknowledged policy called "discounting." Some flatly refuse to buy ads on stations or shows that reach primarily non-white audiences, the so-called "no urban/no Spanish dictate."

Such policies are not based in "market sense." When Emmis Broadcasting, operators of a New York radio station with a primarily black listenership, approached their local Volvo dealers group about buying ads, they supplied market research showing that "their black/urban listeners were just as able and likely to buy cars in Volvo's price range as the radio audiences Volvo dealers were currently paying to reach, suburban whites." (Forum Connection, Civil Rights Forum on Communications Policy, 9/30/99) The company couldn't deny the facts, but said no anyway. What it came down to, according to station manager Judith Ellis, "was the head of the dealership who said, 'I just don't want to. We just don't want it on that radio station.'"

Last year, an internal memo from media representation firm Katz Media Group came to light, in which the company advised its sales staff not to place ads on so-called "urban" stations, explaining that businesses want "prospects, not suspects." (Black Enterprise, 7/31/99)

The FCC has collected plenty of such evidence, illustrating a range of racist assumptions about non-white customers openly cited by advertisers as reasons to pay less for ads in ethnic markets, or not to buy them at all. There's the buyer for Ivory soap who refused to purchase time on a Latino-formatted station because "Hispanics don't bathe as frequently as non-Hispanics." (FCC study, "When Being No. 1 Is Not Enough: The Impact of Advertising Practices on Minority-Formatted Broadcast Stations," 1/99) Companies have cited worries that "our pilferage will increase," if they advertise on minority stations, or said simply, "Your station will bring too many black people to my place of business." If that's not racism, what is?

Yet mainstream media consistently sought out ways to explain this situation while emphatically maintaining that it wasn't discrimination. Often the disconnect between a show's ratings and its ad rates was actively obscured, in constructions like this from USA Today (7/20/99): "Privately, network executives say their lack of interest in black shows reflects simple economics. Recent black shows haven't reached the young, upscale viewers who translate into success, as measured by Nielsen ratings, premium ad prices and syndications revenue."

Or race and class were simply collapsed together without explanation (Virginian-Pilot, 8/31/99): "Others say the parade of new shows with young white casts isn't about racism. It's about economics. It's about attracting the hard-to-get audience of white 18-to-34 year olds with vast buying power—the Felicity crowd."

"Is TV's Racism Black and White or Just Green?" asked the popular framing (Plain Dealer headline, 8/15/99). The phrasing points up the obscurantism permeating media coverage—coverage that left unclear whether TV's racist practices were being denied, or just excused on the grounds that they are making some people very wealthy.

That may be the most disconcerting aspect of the media response to the NAACP protests: the way that, having stumbled upon the open secret of the media world—that, platitudes aside, its commercialism fundamentally impedes its democratic and creative promise—journalists carefully tip-toed away.



See FAIR's Archives for more on:
Race and Racism



Offline Dutty

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Re: Anything but Racism ....FAIR magazine
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2007, 01:53:44 PM »
In the 7 years since this article was written. I'm sure AB you have seen changes
Perhaps not as quickly as you would like...but nevertheless there have been changes


as an example

There's the buyer for Ivory soap who refused to purchase time on a Latino-formatted station because "Hispanics don't bathe as frequently as non-Hispanics." (FCC study, "When Being No. 1 Is Not Enough: The Impact of Advertising Practices on Minority-Formatted Broadcast Stations," 1/99)


In 2007 any  corporation that dosent cater to the hispanic community in the states....hang deyself
Dem fellahs does bend over backward and even put de ads in pure spanish......niche and target marketing is the order of the day now

I have seen a lot of high end consumer companies target blacks in print and radio and even tv ads....including volvo

The changes may seem glacial in speed but the reality is...the vast majority of the viewing audience with neilsen ratings boxes are white.......the producers are simply playing to their audience




Besides, dem fellahs did done make ah black version of the bachelor almost 30 years ago

Dey did call it ah different name back then is all  ;D

« Last Edit: April 11, 2007, 01:57:15 PM by Dutty »
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Offline zuluwarrior

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Racism Thread
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2008, 01:40:59 PM »
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Offline Daft Trini

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Racism in T&T - The Thread.
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2011, 07:26:52 AM »
I will go on record as to say, "If I could get away with it, i'd wash his mouth with dog piss." What a sc**t...

Sudama: NAR to blame
By by Denyse Renne denyse.renne@trinidadexpress.com
Story Created: Apr 26, 2011 at 11:44 PM ECT
Story Updated: Apr 26, 2011 at 11:44 PM ECT
Former minister Trevor Sudama has placed blame squarely on the shoulders of the National Alliance for Reconstruction (NAR) for the 1990 insurrection.
Testifying yesterday at the third session of the commission of enquiry into the July 1990 attempted coup, Sudama said the failure of the then NAR government to take a firm stance against the Jamaat-al-Muslimeen led to the uprising.
"They (NAR) were not vigilant enough with security, they did not act firmly in dealing with the Muslimeen," Sudama said.
Referring to the issue involving the Mucurapo land acquired by the Jamaat, Sudama said had the NAR government acted on the stance taken by the Muslimeen, things may have been different. The NAR government was led by former prime minister Arthur NR Robinson.
"If they (NAR) had dealt with it firmly in the beginning, this (coup attempt) may not have occurred. A lot of what the Muslimeen were doing went undetected. Instead, by failing to act, the NAR government condoned the Muslimeen actions," Sudama said.
The former minister, who was being led into evidence by Senior Counsel Avory Sinanan, also admitted there was great conflict with the coalition government which included himself, Robinson and Basdeo Panday.
Sudama said the coalition had inherited a drained treasury from the People's National Movement (PNM) and, as such, "the stability of the country was undermined and the government was forced to carry out harsh measures in order to get money from the IMF (International Monetary Fund)".
Sudama said in order to get money from the IMF "we needed to cut back on expenditure, and COLA (Cost of Living Allowance) was cut".
Sudama said the issue of ethnic imbalance also raised its head and a decision was taken "not to have an Indian in power, since some members were of the opinion that Indians were not part of the struggle".
"The PNM never had a Hindu in their Cabinet and there was distrust for Indians and Hindus. They were not seen as an inclusive party.
"The view was also held that Indians are dominant in professions of medicine, law and business and if they were allowed in the corridors of power, it will create a huge ethnic imbalance and Africans will be marginalised," Sudama said.
As a result of this, Sudama said Panday could not be Prime Minister and shortly after Robinson assumed the Prime Minister's portfolio, things started to unravel.
Sudama said the Panday faction had recommended the names of individuals to sit on State boards and Robinson had hired Ken Gordon as his Trade and Industry Minister. Sudama said checks were made and it was discovered that four per cent of the people recommended by Panday to be appointed to State boards were of East Indian descent. Sudama said: "We thought it was one love, togetherness and then this happened."
He said questions were raised, following which Gordon then made more appointments, bringing the percentage to ten per cent.
"There was a serious disjuncture at what is said on the platform level and when you get into government and this started with recommendations for State boards," Sudama said.
Sudama said Robinson yielded limited support in Tobago, yet he was in charge and "calling all the shots".
"It was hurtful for us. Here is a man with limited support in Tobago and he was calling the shots. "We felt members were not being given a fair deal," Sudama said. Admitting that the relationship between Robinson and Panday was at times testy, Sudama said it was not in Panday's nature to talk about a problem.
"His style was confrontational, while Robinson used his authority to put people in their place," he said.
Recounting the events of being held hostage at the Red House, Sudama said he got the impression that the Muslimeen had an agenda of implementing an Islamic state, and removing government was the first step to accomplishing this.
Describing the second night of the attempted coup as being the most critical, Sudama said, "I had the feeling that something was going to happen. I had a feeling of doom and gloom. The Muslimeen were carrying out the final rites of a doomsday scenario."
Hearing resumes today, with the continued testimony of former head of news and current affairs at the now defunct Trinidad and Tobago Television (TTT) Jones P Madeira.

Offline Jumbie

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When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2012, 11:09:22 AM »
Daughters came home yesterday and said they had a confrontation with some teenage girls who've been bullying them in school twitter and Facebook. Seems they've heard my dad talk about how bad myself and my siblings (sisters and brother) were during our school days and how we never took shit from others. Well, they stood up for themselves and had the girls scampering. During the melee, it seems some names were called and it's the first time they've such racist words directed at them. They just didn't know how to respond.


Have you prepared your children for racism? How do you as a parent act or respond? What do you expect of your children when such a thing happens. What if it was your child guilty of racism?

The youngest was home when I just got in and said that she went to the principal office and reported it.. she's still messed up from it (didn't realize that it hit her so hard) and had to come home from school early today. Now the older sister is in school and that chile have crazy blood... she wasn't there when the racist names were directed at the younger sister... if she lashes out at these girls, should I be mad?


Thoughts? Comments?

Offline elan

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2012, 12:31:38 PM »
I does tell my girls deal with it how they seem fit, just know that word like N@gger have nothing to do with dem, but more so the one saying such nasty things.

Actually, recently in an indoor soccer game a blonde lil cutie call her a N@gger B@tch. Well she dismantle that with some beat and some goal then blast her with the ball a couple times and she can hit that ball.

Just got through a R.A.D program with her, so she can hit rel hard and put them down quick, so let them mess.
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Offline Touches

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2012, 12:56:08 PM »
Let them know it is real...it exists...and it is your reaction to the offensive words and actions that impacts on the situation.

You either embrace the name and own it...then show them what you can do in a positive light.

You either ignore and carry on...succeeding and doing the best that you can do. (this and the above piss them off more)

Or you could tun c&*% and hit them a bellers, cuss them back, feel a sense of internal satisfaction and deal with the consequences after ( as well as the remark see dais how dey does geh orn)

Each of the above are to be used at a certain time and scenario...the trick is to know when to use it.

Jumbie they are young ladies...doh let them turn jagabat...let them stand up and confront the offender and say ok we do not like being called these names and that is offensive to us, (fack off)...but we cant change how we come out and who our parents are...but deal with it diplomatically, using the principal, teachers etc and report the issue. Do not let physical harm come to them and do not encourage violence.

« Last Edit: March 02, 2012, 12:58:44 PM by Touches »


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Offline Dutty

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2012, 01:03:09 PM »
dais a tough one dey jumbie

Viscerally ah inclined to say shook de big rotweiller behind dem....but dat eh go really do nuttn but reinforce stereotypes in dem redneck minds

When my daughter was bout 7 or 8 I had already taught her about the kinda words somebody might call her on the playground....just so she wouldnt be stunned to respond or clueless (I also teach she a few choice ethnic slurs as well,, but at 7 she probably woudnt a remember any)

Fortunately she has never been on the sharpened end of any verbal racial barbs even though she get into a couple fights......maybe ah shoulda teach she to hit some hard bullet like elan's kid

Make sure the principal doh sweep the whole issue under the carpet
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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2012, 01:04:11 PM »
We've had tuh deal wit dat ah few times, and believe me it eh pleasant when yuh have tuh help yuh yutes navigate dem treacherous waters. A lot of it is education, education, education. At times teachers and parents were brought in, becz in many instances de offenders does pick it up from dey household. But it doh have no quick fix or one time ting yuh could do or say. Is ah ongoing process. And as Touches say, different circumstances warrant different reactions, and dat can only be gained through experience.
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Offline Socafan

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2012, 01:20:31 PM »
Dread....yuh just have to make sure that yuh kids have so much self esteem that shit like that directed at them does just make them amused, and come home and relate the story to yuh matter of factly. They must know that that stuff exists only in the minds of idiots and when some fool starts to spit racist words at them, all they must be is bemused, feel some pity and yes, a sense of superiority. They must understand that as long as hand eh pass, them words really apply to the people/person that saying it.

Now if hand pass all that highfalutin shit must go out the window and they must be prepared to be real ignorant and aggressive, and still call the cops after, afterall, its a hate crime, doh let it slip.
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Offline just cool

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2012, 04:26:29 PM »
Tough luck dey jumbie, the best way i think is tuh let yuh kids learn about their history, now i don't know your ethnicity, but assuming it's african, then you should show and teach your kids of all the great things that african ppl have achieved, past and present.

the pyramids, the moors in spain and the technology they brought to the dark ages of europe when ppl didn't bathe for months @ a time, the great navigators of north africa, "ancient egyptian" history and so forth, even modern day inventions by ppl of african decent, ( get this book by, JA rogers, 100 inventions by black people).

 you must also teach them of the uncivilized nature of european culture even though it might be tough, and disturbing to hear, but it's the truth. white folks basically came out of ah harsh unforgiving region with limited food and resources, so they tend to be a bit less forgiving and grudging, all this has mold them into the kind of ppl they are today.

i know nuff ppl love to ignore this, but it's the truth, as harsh as it may be.

white folks (for the most part) don't have any problem in demonizing and teaching their kids falsehood about other races, especially black, so why should we be apprehensive about teaching our kids of the true nature of white folks. once yuh kids know that this is an uncivilized culture, then they would have less of a problem dealing with manifestations of such kind, wisdom and knowledge is the best tools you could give your children in combating bigotry, once they understand it, then they could navigate around any racist encounter with relative ease.


as for the ppl who think being civilized has anything to do with infrastructure, then think again! ppl could live in great cities with all the modern amenities and still be as backward and unsophisticated as animals in the wild. concrete and gadgets don't make you civilized. just look @ how white folks interact with other races, and that alone would teach you of their uncivilized unsophisticated culture.

they normally hate co existing with folks of another ethnicity since time immemorial, and if they do, then it's out of absolute necessity. if they are compelled to to coexist with another race by mandate, then they could resort to brute force in order not to integrate, and if they do decide to integrate (against their initial judgment), they must have the only say on how things are administrated.

if ppl are willing to put their emotions in their back pockets and research the history of the european, they would come up with ah trunk full of reasons and answers as too how uncivilized of ah race these folks truly are, and i'm not talking about individuals, NO! i'm referring to culture!

they hoard the world's wealth amongst them selves for over a thousand yrs, they rape and pillaged and colonized most of the worlds cultures and helped themselves to their resources, hek, even mother earth was ravaged despite of her cries. they stole and lied and hid history in order to justify their greed and barbarism, and these are the things we need to teach our children, i assure you, this will not make them hateful, but rather, wise.

it's funny how we could teach our kids that lions tigers and poisonous snakes are dangerous, bc if you get close to them, especially in the wild, chances are more than likely they are liable to inflict serious harm on them, even possible death, but we refuse to teach the realities of human danger.




you got to show your kids the great culture and civilization they derived from, and make them proud of it, and another thing we as black ppl need tuh know, the word "nigger" actually means "BLACK" in latin.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2012, 07:56:22 PM by just cool »
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Offline Sam

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2012, 05:58:52 AM »
Teenages should not be on facebook and tweeter and other sites like that.

Yuh live de American way, yuh have to deal with de pain that comes with it.

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Offline just cool

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2012, 06:04:29 AM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.
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Offline Mr Fix-it

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2012, 02:03:08 PM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

But I like you  :'( :devil: :beermug:
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Offline vb

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2012, 10:10:08 AM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

I does barely notice you. But judging from the way you are speaking apparently you've had issues with others. I go pay more attention to you from  now on.

VB
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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2012, 10:14:42 AM »
Jumbie,

I am not going to profess to know enough to guide you as I've never had kids and had such an issue.
As an individual I've experienced it enough times, sadly usually from black people who don't seem to mind pelting slurs your way.

Usually I've ignored it, responded a few times and pelt one or two lash.

But I can only imagine that it's more painful to see your kids have to deal with it.

I have two much younger brothers. Their mum is Chinese and looks wise they have taken after her. I must ask them if they ever had to deal with this.

Both are 2nd Dans in Tae Kwon Do with the older one being an ex Canadian Champ (boys) so I have a feeling if there was a problem they were probably ok.

Sometimes you bring up your kids in the best neighbourhoods, and best schools but it still filters through.

VB

« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 11:22:45 AM by vb »
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Offline Jumbie

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2012, 11:46:43 AM »
Thx for the advice  and shared thoughts on the subject. They already went to the principal and I plan on following up on Monday morning. I take this serious and will make it an issue at the school.

JC, the funny thing is (and some people here know or have seen my children)... other than the ethnic features (face), if you saw them you'd think they were full white.. especially in the winter when their skin gets lighter. In the warmer months they could easily pass for Sicilians. People who have been around other cultures pick on on their ethnicity very fass though. Their background is very mixed and we've tried our best to not just make them very proud of their unique mixture, but we've introduced them to everything culturally as we can and they are surrounded by many positive aspects of their mixed heritage.

Again, thx for everyone's contribution.

Offline Bakes

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2012, 12:03:28 PM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

Dread you real sensitive sometimes yes... it ever occur to you that some people might just be out of answers?  Me personally I don't have any children so I don't know what I would tell dem.  De ole ni**a in me does have me ready to run up people chest, but I know that is not the best response, hence I sitting dis one out.

Offline kaliman2006

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2012, 04:29:24 PM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

@ Just Cool: I personally don't have a problem with you. It is difficult for me to form an opinion of someone who goes by an online pseudonym and who I have never met personally. Judging from the content of your posts, you seem fairly knowledgeable and although I do not agree with everything that you write, I respect your right to write it.

@ Jumbie: I do not have children, so I will be very cautious in my comments. Assuming that your daughters are the ethnic minority in their school, I think that Just Cool's suggestion that you teach them their history is very good advice. If they are of African descent, this is especially very important and lies at the heart of the many identity crises that African-descended youths suffer from in the African Diaspora. However, I would not focus on the inadequacies of the European race for the reason that they will have to interact with Caucasians on a daily basis and it would be wiser resist the tempatation to cast aspersions on the entire Caucasian race. This is just as bad as the racism that the redneck in Alabama would display towards a person of African descent.

As for lashing out, I do not think that initiating a physical confrontation is the answer, especially considering the fact that they are young ladies and culturally speaking, fighting is considered more unbecoming for a young woman. If they are subject barbs, it would be best to ignore it and walk away, or to inform the offenders that verbal taunts are unacceptable. I know it is easier said than done and it is difficult to be rational and restrained in the face of such obvious provocation. In the event that they feel so insulted that they are tempted to engage in a physial altercation with the offenders, it is better for them to walk away.

Offline just cool

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2012, 04:44:53 PM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

I does barely notice you. But judging from the way you are speaking apparently you've had issues with others. I go pay more attention to you from  now on.

VB
Eh VB, doh try tuh jim carey me nah boss, bc i'm seriously on top of things without even trying. doh forget, iz not no snotnose lil johnny come lately, is ah coco scorpion yuh dealin wid here boss, so save it for the next guy.
The pen is mightier than the sword, Africa for Africans home and abroad.Trinidad is not my home just a pit stop, Africa is my destination,final destination the MOST HIGH.

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2012, 05:01:24 PM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

Dread you real sensitive sometimes yes... it ever occur to you that some people might just be out of answers?  Me personally I don't have any children so I don't know what I would tell dem.  De ole ni**a in me does have me ready to run up people chest, but I know that is not the best response, hence I sitting dis one out.
Woh sensitive you talking bout ? stuueepppssss! breds, this board is small ting compare to the other aspects of my life, so i not even trying to go there wid ppl, it's just that it have ppl on here who like gang up ting, and i just putting it to the forefront.

is like you eh know what sensitive is ? if i was sensitive i woulda never engage you in any debate again since yuh talk outa timin bout my kids, not that i want tuh revisit that, but just drawing an example.

it have men on here who i didn't hit it off wid when i first joined up, and uptil now dem men still holding ah grudge and don't even respond to my post, even when i tried to engage them and reach out. now that is sensitive, not to mention passive aggressive.

if you had said that i was passionate, and tend tuh go over board, then yes, that would've been a correct assessment, but my God sensitive on ah blog site, no way bro.

breds in true and living color, it have men who does cuss me out and malign me left and right with every chance they get, and i does go on like i didn't even hear dem and still hail dem up when i see dem, that's how cool i does go on, but when it come to the truth and social issues, (which is close to my heart) i tend to over react, but personal attacks , never!


yuh got me pegged wrong saddiss.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 06:25:04 PM by just cool »
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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2012, 06:03:21 PM »
Thx for the advice  and shared thoughts on the subject. They already went to the principal and I plan on following up on Monday morning. I take this serious and will make it an issue at the school.

JC, the funny thing is (and some people here know or have seen my children)... other than the ethnic features (face), if you saw them you'd think they were full white.. especially in the winter when their skin gets lighter. In the warmer months they could easily pass for Sicilians. People who have been around other cultures pick on on their ethnicity very fass though. Their background is very mixed and we've tried our best to not just make them very proud of their unique mixture, but we've introduced them to everything culturally as we can and they are surrounded by many positive aspects of their mixed heritage.

Again, thx for everyone's contribution.
Jumbie, far be it from me to tell ah man/ woman how tuh raise their children, and what values to give them in regards to racial identity.

i myself have biracial kids, and i made it ah law unto my self to teach my children that no matter how white their mother and her side of the family were, they are still  "BLACK" african americans.

i did this bc of the racial climate of this country that we call home. i did not want some smirk snub nose mean spirited white stuff shirt hater to give my yutes ah rude awakening and a lesson in biology and sociology by letting them know not on their best day, they would never be considered or have anything to do with being white.

i make it my duty to teach my yutes of what to expect from all ppls, and how to maneuver them, i also teach my yutes of their rich african heritage, the one that no one talks about which was not recorded or mentioned in the european history books. so when some clown decides to malign them, my yutes will just look @ them like real fackin backward monkeys.

you have no idea how enpowering the history and heritage of ah ppl can be

 good luck with your yutes bro.                positive.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 06:06:42 PM by just cool »
The pen is mightier than the sword, Africa for Africans home and abroad.Trinidad is not my home just a pit stop, Africa is my destination,final destination the MOST HIGH.

Offline Bakes

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2012, 07:52:03 PM »
is like you eh know what sensitive is ? if i was sensitive i woulda never engage you in any debate again since yuh talk outa timin bout my kids, not that i want tuh revisit that, but just drawing an example.

I did?  Dred... YOU described your own kids as 'mongrels', not me.  Much later, I then said something to you to the effect of "your 'mongrel' kids, as you yuhself call them."  Since then you keep claiming I talk bad about yuh kids.  I don't even know yuh kids.

Note also, I didn't call you sensitive, I said you are real sensitive sometimes.  You call it being passionate and overreacting at times... I really don't see the difference, in this context.

Offline just cool

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2012, 11:26:05 PM »
is like you eh know what sensitive is ? if i was sensitive i woulda never engage you in any debate again since yuh talk outa timin bout my kids, not that i want tuh revisit that, but just drawing an example.

I did? Dred... YOU described your own kids as 'mongrels', not me.  Much later, I then said something to you to the effect of "your 'mongrel' kids, as you yuhself call them."  Since then you keep claiming I talk bad about yuh kids.  I don't even know yuh kids.

Note also, I didn't call you sensitive, I said you are real sensitive sometimes.  You call it being passionate and overreacting at times... I really don't see the difference, in this context.
Breds, i really had 2nd thoughts about responding to your post, even bringing this particular incident up bc i knew you would major on this one small example and ignore the main reason i responded, which was to say that you have me pegged wrong on the sensitive comment, which in reality, i'm definitely not!

breds, i will never call my kids out in such a derogatory manner, bc my yutes is my life and i'll die for my kids without thought, in other words, i doh play wid my yutes! you need tuh produce that comment bc i doubt those words ever came out my mouth, and if it did, then it was in a jesting manner, of which i seriously doubt.

this is exactly the reason why i said in the previous post, i did not want to revisit that, i just wanted to convey my point so i used it as a reference, that's all. now please lets move on, bc it's not that serious.

positive.
The pen is mightier than the sword, Africa for Africans home and abroad.Trinidad is not my home just a pit stop, Africa is my destination,final destination the MOST HIGH.

Offline vb

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2012, 12:53:53 AM »
Ah see what it iz goin on here wid allyuh members, but doh worry, many more will have tuh suffer, many more will have tuh cry.

when iz ah thread on maccoing and bacchanal business ppl does weigh in in droves, but when it's about serious issues that affecting lives which could provoke positive as well as negative responses ppl could care less, matter of fact they does run an hide like some lil wossies!

i also notice when i weigh in on ah subject the thread that automatically run cold, like if i does come on the board on ah vampire scene.

it's OK not to like me, as ah matter of fact i prefer it that way, i'm not here to be liked, but @ least don't go on like some little panzies by not responding, say how allyuh really feel, if allyuh dislike just cool no sweat! but @ least grow ah fackin beard and say it out loud so i would refrain from responding when allyuh post, but the passive aggressive behavior is for lil school girls and PMSing broads, not big grown arse men.

I does barely notice you. But judging from the way you are speaking apparently you've had issues with others. I go pay more attention to you from  now on.

VB
Eh VB, doh try tuh jim carey me nah boss, bc i'm seriously on top of things without even trying. doh forget, iz not no snotnose lil johnny come lately, is ah coco scorpion yuh dealin wid here boss, so save it for the next guy.

No clue what you on about.  But I'm beginning to think the best thing to do is ignore certain posts of yours.

VB
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Offline Bakes

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2012, 03:48:13 AM »
breds, i will never call my kids out in such a derogatory manner, bc my yutes is my life and i'll die for my kids without thought, in other words, i doh play wid my yutes! you need tuh produce that comment bc i doubt those words ever came out my mouth, and if it did, then it was in a jesting manner, of which i seriously doubt.

Okay, it's been 4 1/2 years and de ole memory ent what it used to be, so I not above admitting when I wrong.  You did NOT call your kids "mongrel kids"... but neither did I.  I tried explaining this to you I dunno how many times.  Here is the conversation:

as you know i have mixed race kids and i never chase after no woman white nor black, it was allways mutual intrest.

as you know i have mongrel kids and i never chase after no woman white nor black, it was allways those negresses who chase after me.

Is too much to get into here in this unrelated thread (without derailing it further) so I just posting the original source.  You posted a diatribe against white people, in such a manner that it portrayed you as a black racist.

To demonstrate how the shoe might feel on the other foot, I assumed the mindset of a white racist and mimicked your entire post word for word.  Where you stated you had mixed race kids, I (the white racist) stated I had "mongrel" kids.

You then took offense, and fuh de past 4+ years on this thing about how I insulted yuh kids.  Hopefully this will be the last time I have to explain... because as I say I doh even know yuh kids to be saying anything about them like that.

Offline just cool

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2012, 05:09:21 AM »
breds, i will never call my kids out in such a derogatory manner, bc my yutes is my life and i'll die for my kids without thought, in other words, i doh play wid my yutes! you need tuh produce that comment bc i doubt those words ever came out my mouth, and if it did, then it was in a jesting manner, of which i seriously doubt.

Okay, it's been 4 1/2 years and de ole memory ent what it used to be, so I not above admitting when I wrong.  You did NOT call your kids "mongrel kids"... but neither did I.  I tried explaining this to you I dunno how many times.  Here is the conversation:

as you know i have mixed race kids and i never chase after no woman white nor black, it was allways mutual intrest.

as you know i have mongrel kids and i never chase after no woman white nor black, it was allways those negresses who chase after me.

Is too much to get into here in this unrelated thread (without derailing it further) so I just posting the original source.  You posted a diatribe against white people, in such a manner that it portrayed you as a black racist.

To demonstrate how the shoe might feel on the other foot, I assumed the mindset of a white racist and mimicked your entire post word for word.  Where you stated you had mixed race kids, I (the white racist) stated I had "mongrel" kids.

You then took offense, and fuh de past 4+ years on this thing about how I insulted yuh kids.  Hopefully this will be the last time I have to explain... because as I say I doh even know yuh kids to be saying anything about them like that.
Sharks, ah wah yuh listen to me carefully, i not holding no grudge bredder, the only reason i mention this old topic iz bc you said that i was sensitive, and i really hate to think that i could be guilty of that in cyber space, so i drew on ah reference to substantiate my claim of being on top of my emotions, never did i bring this up to make you or anyone feel bad or to insinuate that i'm hold a grudge.

that incident as you mention was yrs ago, and i not carry around all that baggage for small ting sooooo long.

in reality breds, i passed that and moving forward. like i said, i should not have even mentioned that, bc i did not want to revisit it. it's gone and we moved on, and if i came over has petty or holding a grudge, then i sincerely apologize, it was not my intention.   my bad.                                       positive.   :beermug:

« Last Edit: March 05, 2012, 05:10:56 AM by just cool »
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Offline kicker

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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2012, 09:44:08 AM »
JC...From what I remember in pics Jumbie is not of African descent, and I think his wife is white... so I eh know if the pro-afro teachings are relevant.

Apart from highlighting the dark-side of European history, which I don't think is an appropriate message for minors, I think you make a good point in saying that it's important to teach kids confidence and self esteem and make them proud of who they are, whether through the teachings of history or otherwise....

I think a strong sense of self would help kids through stuff like this. I doh have kids so I can't say, but I do believe that there are alot of influences over which we have little control that form the minds and affect the self esteem of kids from a very young age...Exposure to racism would probably just add a large amount of insult to injury... Particularly in the western world (dominated by white people), kids form impressions very very early about what is popular, attractive, more accepted etc... I know of very young non-white kids who have expressed dissatisfaction about their hair texture and skin color, and these are kids who haven't even been directly exposed to racism...

I'm a firm believer that it's never too early to instill a strong sense of self esteem... I also agree with touches about discouraging violence...
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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2012, 10:45:50 AM »
Look how allyuh Hijack di man sumthin nuh cheups..  Hope all goes well with you kids brother growing up kids are rough . Let us know how it went man . I dealt with situation  like dat several months ago . It was tough . Hope all goes well...

war
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Re: When Your Children Encounter Racism.
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2012, 12:45:09 PM »
Where possible: humanize the situation ... break bread with those involved. Shared meals oftentimes provide a sound platform on which to broker divisions.

 

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