Warriors fans split over lawsuit.

[WestCoast]

Nah Coast, apparently Gyal farm fete skettel is de big ting now, causing man (and real li'l boy too eh) to kill deyself and lick up whole carload on highway an' ting. If daiz yuh priority in life, yuh tink yuh have time to study Jackula? Steuppssss

oh ho, I real out of de loop as I did not know that, thanks

[davidephraim]

Ngozi, We doh know de problem is that they haven't gotten paid, its more of they haven't gotten paid enough as is their position (I suspect)  I or no one else has said to drop the lawsuit as a matter of fact I said that I was proud that they would stick up for themselves and not be exploited. How does this affect a current team? well ah hopin that new players would remember when dealing wid de TTFF that there are differences between what they say and what they sign off on in black and white. I would hope these new players would keep a paper trail, get documents signed so that if they have to bring forth a l;awsuit after de fact at least they would have a better legal foot to stand on. Also transparency helps as well. Let other people know (before the fact) what is promised. So citizens can help make demands on players behalf but at this 24 hour is only the courts that can help them now because obviously de TTFF is going down to the nail with this one. I does watch CSI too, when de evidence is compelling enough they does make an arrest but without enough evidence they have to sit and bite time.

Like yuh not watching enough CSI to realize that neither the TTFF nor the players are disputing the 50% agreement, whether a contract was signed or not. The players don't need evidence to prove that the agreement is there because if you look at any daily newspaper around the WC when Jack was trying to make the gov't look bad, the intentions of the TTFF were clearly stated in press conferences etc...in black and white.

Yes it is every team's issue, new or old, because contract or no contract, neither can ward against gross misrepresentation of funds which is the WC team's issue....they say they have to get half of 100M and the TTFF saying it is half of 10M. Yes we need transparency but we need transparecy on the part of the TTFF so that income and expenses can to properly accounted for, the players have no control over that.

Trini fan, I think like Super Grover, your onto another story. The transparency of de TTFF is not my immediate concern. I was talking about de players. A contract and an agreement is 2 different thing and you are trying to make it seem like it is de same. With a signed contract, I can go to court and obtain a judgement with an agreement however I have to hope that someone honors it... With all dem MCI commercial you mean to tell me that people didnt make de TTFF " put it in writing"  dat was de first flaw and if they did then thats why they have de footing to go ahead with said lawsuit and that would have been our warriors standin up for de players, demselves included and thats a beautiful thing. De faults of de TTFF are no secret nor can we fix them except for in an election and ah dont think Oliver Champs or Jack Warner does get de wok through an election process. Asking de TTFF for transparency is like asking Panday or Manning to open up de book and tell we why some people still hungry and have no shelter in Trinidad especially when they give 85% of their oil to USA which means that business runnin or de fact that our GDP and per capita is way over the likes of Jamaica, USA or Brasil for that fact.

misrepresentation of funds, you start talking about dat and you have left de contraints of de TTFF. Trinidad & Tobago Football Federation
is governed by the Trinidad and Tobago government. Dont blame Oliver champs if yuh not going to blame he boss and their boss and all de other bosses going all de way up to de top boss because they all eating. Jackula in this instance acts like de outside salesman bringing in business for de Bosses to split up. Somehow, somewhere in there de topic of football got lost and thats just it. These fellas not on football they on dollars and football is another means of attaining those dollars. I say Fire dem all but then where do you start and where do you stop?

[takenoprisoners]

Anybody knows if this is the same contract dey disputing? Fuentes say it signed.

News from the 6th of April 2006.

Soca Warriors sign up World Cup contracts.
By: Shaun Fuentes.

UK-based members of the Trinidad and Tobago National Senior team met with the management of the “Soca Warriors� in Manchester last week to discuss and finalize the terms of contract for the 2006 World Cup.
Manager Bruce Aanensen met with the core of players including captain Dwight Yorke where several issues were discussed including the upcoming schedule of events leading up to the World Cup as well as the run of events in T&T when the team assembles on May 7 for the match against Peru.
Among the items addressed in the contract are appearance fees and bonuses, daily per diem, image rights and the conditions of financial allocations to the players fund from sponsorships and other contributions. The specifics on code of conduct was also agreed upon.
Aanensen explained that regarding the image rights of the players, it was negotiated and agreed by the players that any image used by a sponsor or promoter in which six or more players appear, the image is property of the TTFF. But for any image with less than six players, the rights belong to the players and their permission is required before these images can be used. Additionally, all commercial value arising from this use of image, goes to the players fund. In the event of a player’s image being used, outside of the team, or if a player is involved in a promotion outside of a team activity whether it be with his club or other private arrangement, then all commercial value from this belongs to the sole individual.
“Everyone was cooperative and professional, and while the meeting lasted several hours, we had the opportunity to discuss all issues on the agenda prepared in conjunction with the players and everyone expressed satisfaction with the outcome of the meeting, Aanensen told TTFF Media. “The end result of the meeting means that the players will not have any contractual issues on their minds and they can prepare to go into the World Cup and the other activities around it, with a total focus on the job at hand.
Players based locally have also met with Aanensen this week and those based in the United States will have their contracts finalized early next week.
The players who have signed contracts but are not selected by Head coach Leo Beenhakker will automatically be released from the contract once the coach has announced his squad of 23 players, which has to be done before the FIFA deadline of 15th May 2006.

[Tallman]

Anybody knows if this is the same contract dey disputing? Fuentes say it signed.

As far as I know, this is something different

[Trini_fan]

Trini fan, I think like Super Grover, your onto another story. The transparency of de TTFF is not my immediate concern. I was talking about de players. A contract and an agreement is 2 different thing and you are trying to make it seem like it is de same. With a signed contract, I can go to court and obtain a judgement with an agreement however I have to hope that someone honors it... With all dem MCI commercial you mean to tell me that people didnt make de TTFF " put it in writing"  dat was de first flaw and if they did then thats why they have de footing to go ahead with said lawsuit and that would have been our warriors standin up for de players, demselves included and thats a beautiful thing. De faults of de TTFF are no secret nor can we fix them except for in an election and ah dont think Oliver Champs or Jack Warner does get de wok through an election process. Asking de TTFF for transparency is like asking Panday or Manning to open up de book and tell we why some people still hungry and have no shelter in Trinidad especially when they give 85% of their oil to USA which means that business runnin or de fact that our GDP and per capita is way over the likes of Jamaica, USA or Brasil for that fact.

misrepresentation of funds, you start talking about dat and you have left de contraints of de TTFF. Trinidad & Tobago Football Federation
is governed by the Trinidad and Tobago government. Dont blame Oliver champs if yuh not going to blame he boss and their boss and all de other bosses going all de way up to de top boss because they all eating. Jackula in this instance acts like de outside salesman bringing in business for de Bosses to split up. Somehow, somewhere in there de topic of football got lost and thats just it. These fellas not on football they on dollars and football is another means of attaining those dollars. I say Fire dem all but then where do you start and where do you stop?

Come and talk to the rest ah we when yuh learn to read an understand nah...the terms of the contract, agreement or whatever you choose to call it, whether signed or unsigned ARE NOT IN DISPUTE. The players were supposed to get 50% and the TTFF gave them 50%. It is 50% of what that is in dispute. Saying that the TTFF is never going to have transparency is saying that every single team that represent Trinidad is going to get screwed in the arse which is contrary to your original argument that once the new players sign a contract they cool. Because no contract they are going to sign will flat out state the amount they are going to get 50% of because these amounts like sponsorship deals cannot be determined beforehand and this is where the TTFF has the opportunity to present things as they like.

Like Grover I am now on to another story 

[pardners]

In my limited capacity for coming up with brilliant ideas....I see we have two choices.

Firstly, I get the feeling most forumites agree that the senior warriors are not being treated fairly according to the reports.  I also get the feeling that most forumites want to support the senior warriors in their struggle and also the support the young warriors in their embryonic development.

When I check it out, we have the next game against CR, which is an away game.  Then the next serious battle is in the GC in June, again away.  I suppose that in between there may be some warm-up games at home.

June is about 5 months away, which I feel is enough time for TTFF to come clean with the fellas, or at least for some ruling to decide the outcome.  I say we support the new team fully until June.  In the meantime we let TTFF know that they must seek to resolve the matter by then, if not we declaring full scale war.  We might have to take some drastic action like boycotting games for the rest of the year or until the matter is resolved.

Yuh see football doh belong to the TTFF, is WE own.  It belong to the people of T&T, and if yuh representing we, then yuh have to put yuh best foot forward and do it properly.  I feel two internationals in a empty stadium will send a clear message...even if they accustomed to incurring losses for every game, this go be different.

I know it would have men who want to see the team play and will say that if they go to the game, no big thing.  But throughout history, men had to make sacrifices for the betterment of future generations.  The sacrifice would only be for a short time.

The alternative would be for the courts to step in and FIFA to ban we....then yuh go see sacrifice, cause we wouldn't have a choice.  We will might very well be supporting Haiti or Jamaica in the next hex.

[Padams]

In my limited capacity for coming up with brilliant ideas....I see we have two choices.

Firstly, I get the feeling most forumites agree that the senior warriors are not being treated fairly according to the reports.  I also get the feeling that most forumites want to support the senior warriors in their struggle and also the support the young warriors in their embryonic development.

When I check it out, we have the next game against CR, which is an away game.  Then the next serious battle is in the GC in June, again away.  I suppose that in between there may be some warm-up games at home.

June is about 5 months away, which I feel is enough time for TTFF to come clean with the fellas, or at least for some ruling to decide the outcome.  I say we support the new team fully until June.  In the meantime we let TTFF know that they must seek to resolve the matter by then, if not we declaring full scale war.  We might have to take some drastic action like boycotting games for the rest of the year or until the matter is resolved.

Yuh see football doh belong to the TTFF, is WE own.  It belong to the people of T&T, and if yuh representing we, then yuh have to put yuh best foot forward and do it properly.  I feel two internationals in a empty stadium will send a clear message...even if they accustomed to incurring losses for every game, this go be different.

I know it would have men who want to see the team play and will say that if they go to the game, no big thing.  But throughout history, men had to make sacrifices for the betterment of future generations.  The sacrifice would only be for a short time.

The alternative would be for the courts to step in and FIFA to ban we....then yuh go see sacrifice, cause we wouldn't have a choice.  We will might very well be supporting Haiti or Jamaica in the next hex.

I hear yuh and am all in favour of what your suggesting, but do we really have the numbers on this forum to hurt the TTFF by boycotting games..We have what, approx 2000 (not sure, I stand to be corrected) members and how many are based in Trinidad.. The stadium will still have a bunch a waggonist who doh really care what goin on with the Senior team...all dey care about is goin to d game, drink some Beers and head to Crobar wen d game done.......

W.K OUT

[dreamer]

Pardners, I am sure you are very very well intentioned,... is just that I think that yuh making a tactical error in a subtle presumption (frequently made by others)  that we cyah multitask. Instead of boycotting, which can be easily made to backfire sometimes (and dais exactly Jackula's main weapon), leh we go out and support and enjoy the games with the warrior youngsters during these international games at home  BUT ALSO do it with banners, flags, statements, caps, infectious kaiso songs and embarrass Jackula's boys (ON LIVE TV) into retreat and eventual reversion of their ugly decisions.  Make a clear maximally-televised-and-broadcasted statement. This has to be organized like 2 weeks before to churn out the media-catching paraphernalia. I know it feels strange but it can be done. Yuh see its all about winning hearts and minds to win public opinion in the long run, and about who can discredit whom more.

The most brilliant departure from the norm was when the Warriors were in T&T fighting very publicly in the media against Jackula, Grodent and Scamps and AT THE SAME TIME playing their hearts out for the country. Fans OF ALL PERSUASIONS noticed this and were impressed by them and their ability to play on the field and fight corruption at the same time without any apparent effect on their effort on the field (scoring goals as a matter of fact) and it COMPLETELY NEUTRALIZED Jackula's tactics of portraying them as greedy. Now Daiz strategy! Is a chess game breds. Striking is a last last last resort when all else fails, which will not happen if we serious this time 

Doh let Jackula, Grodent and Scamps tek way we joy celebrating    with the baby warriors while we multitask and fire bun    J, G & S  at de

same time

[davidephraim]

Trini fan, I think like Super Grover, your onto another story. The transparency of de TTFF is not my immediate concern. I was talking about de players. A contract and an agreement is 2 different thing and you are trying to make it seem like it is de same. With a signed contract, I can go to court and obtain a judgement with an agreement however I have to hope that someone honors it... With all dem MCI commercial you mean to tell me that people didnt make de TTFF " put it in writing"  dat was de first flaw and if they did then thats why they have de footing to go ahead with said lawsuit and that would have been our warriors standin up for de players, demselves included and thats a beautiful thing. De faults of de TTFF are no secret nor can we fix them except for in an election and ah dont think Oliver Champs or Jack Warner does get de wok through an election process. Asking de TTFF for transparency is like asking Panday or Manning to open up de book and tell we why some people still hungry and have no shelter in Trinidad especially when they give 85% of their oil to USA which means that business runnin or de fact that our GDP and per capita is way over the likes of Jamaica, USA or Brasil for that fact.

misrepresentation of funds, you start talking about dat and you have left de contraints of de TTFF. Trinidad & Tobago Football Federation
is governed by the Trinidad and Tobago government. Dont blame Oliver champs if yuh not going to blame he boss and their boss and all de other bosses going all de way up to de top boss because they all eating. Jackula in this instance acts like de outside salesman bringing in business for de Bosses to split up. Somehow, somewhere in there de topic of football got lost and thats just it. These fellas not on football they on dollars and football is another means of attaining those dollars. I say Fire dem all but then where do you start and where do you stop?

Come and talk to the rest ah we when yuh learn to read an understand nah...the terms of the contract, agreement or whatever you choose to call it, whether signed or unsigned ARE NOT IN DISPUTE. The players were supposed to get 50% and the TTFF gave them 50%. It is 50% of what that is in dispute. Saying that the TTFF is never going to have transparency is saying that every single team that represent Trinidad is going to get screwed in the arse which is contrary to your original argument that once the new players sign a contract they cool. Because no contract they are going to sign will flat out state the amount they are going to get 50% of because these amounts like sponsorship deals cannot be determined beforehand and this is where the TTFF has the opportunity to present things as they like.

Like Grover I am now on to another story 

I understand and can appreciate your point. In the future I suggest that the players spend a little money (on attys before hand) to ensure their funds. I am not buying de bull of a blanket contract without a range or parimeters. Dat being said, it is very difficult to represent yourself in court... most people hire an attorney. I think they should have done this before the fact to track funds and ensure payment. It is unfortunate but their are professionals whose job it is to make sure people dont get screwed.

[WestCoast]

I was wonderinmg if OurManJack just strung our players along

Players: how much we goh make
OMJ: dis much (.................................)
Players: sweet, lets sign the deal
OMJ: what is the hurry
Players: WC coming jez now
OMJ: no rush, we go organise

after WC2006

Players: arm, where we money
OMJ: eh eh de government geh ya enuff
Players: you an we had a deal
OMJ: arm, who want to play for TnT again?
Players: cool, leh we buy Court Clothes

Most Football Associations in the World I would hope had established a paygrade before the World Cup.

[dreamer]

Fellas, keep the foot on de gas and doh let Jackula off de hook. The senior warriors have proven to be indispensable, with the babywarriors taking licks from a very experienced Costa Rican side containing Centeno, Solis and de rest.  Therefore Jackula, Grodent and Scamps are up de creek now and runnin' out of options. Sancho and company, keep da lawsuit coming and fire bun dem fellas. Remember to maximize the PR of reminding people that part of the money that you want is intended for charity. Just like in football, yuh apply pressure when the opponent is feeling insecure from a few well placed previous blows.   

[pardners]

Pardners, I am sure you are very very well intentioned,... is just that I think that yuh making a tactical error in a subtle presumption (frequently made by others)  that we cyah multitask. Instead of boycotting, which can be easily made to backfire sometimes (and dais exactly Jackula's main weapon), leh we go out and support and enjoy the games with the warrior youngsters during these international games at home  BUT ALSO do it with banners, flags, statements, caps, infectious kaiso songs and embarrass Jackula's boys (ON LIVE TV) into retreat and eventual reversion of their ugly decisions.  Make a clear maximally-televised-and-broadcasted statement. This has to be organized like 2 weeks before to churn out the media-catching paraphernalia. I know it feels strange but it can be done. Yuh see its all about winning hearts and minds to win public opinion in the long run, and about who can discredit whom more.

The most brilliant departure from the norm was when the Warriors were in T&T fighting very publicly in the media against Jackula, Grodent and Scamps and AT THE SAME TIME playing their hearts out for the country. Fans OF ALL PERSUASIONS noticed this and were impressed by them and their ability to play on the field and fight corruption at the same time without any apparent effect on their effort on the field (scoring goals as a matter of fact) and it COMPLETELY NEUTRALIZED Jackula's tactics of portraying them as greedy. Now Daiz strategy! Is a chess game breds. Striking is a last last last resort when all else fails, which will not happen if we serious this time 

Doh let Jackula, Grodent and Scamps tek way we joy celebrating    with the baby warriors while we multitask and fire bun    J, G & S  at de

same time

Dreamer, I  hear what yuh saying, and I thought about that too.  The reason why I say boycott was because it woulda be less revenue generated.  That more than banners woulda get Jack/TTFF attention.  Boy sometimes Ifeel them fellas immune to public embarrassment.  They accustomed to that already.  The public embarrassment could still come, before, during, and after the games.  WN members might be small in numbers, but it only takes a few to rally the masses.

[weary1969]

I does not support scabs in any formwhether they in a digicel cricket uniform or a football uniform. once Stern etal eh playin I eh goin.

[Brownsugar]

Pardners, I am sure you are very very well intentioned,... is just that I think that yuh making a tactical error in a subtle presumption (frequently made by others)  that we cyah multitask. Instead of boycotting, which can be easily made to backfire sometimes (and dais exactly Jackula's main weapon), leh we go out and support and enjoy the games with the warrior youngsters during these international games at home  BUT ALSO do it with banners, flags, statements, caps, infectious kaiso songs and embarrass Jackula's boys (ON LIVE TV) into retreat and eventual reversion of their ugly decisions.  Make a clear maximally-televised-and-broadcasted statement. This has to be organized like 2 weeks before to churn out the media-catching paraphernalia. I know it feels strange but it can be done. Yuh see its all about winning hearts and minds to win public opinion in the long run, and about who can discredit whom more.

The most brilliant departure from the norm was when the Warriors were in T&T fighting very publicly in the media against Jackula, Grodent and Scamps and AT THE SAME TIME playing their hearts out for the country. Fans OF ALL PERSUASIONS noticed this and were impressed by them and their ability to play on the field and fight corruption at the same time without any apparent effect on their effort on the field (scoring goals as a matter of fact) and it COMPLETELY NEUTRALIZED Jackula's tactics of portraying them as greedy. Now Daiz strategy! Is a chess game breds. Striking is a last last last resort when all else fails, which will not happen if we serious this time 

Doh let Jackula, Grodent and Scamps tek way we joy celebrating    with the baby warriors while we multitask and fire bun    J, G & S  at de

same time

Dreamer, I  hear what yuh saying, and I thought about that too.  The reason why I say boycott was because it woulda be less revenue generated.  That more than banners woulda get Jack/TTFF attention.  Boy sometimes Ifeel them fellas immune to public embarrassment.  They accustomed to that already.  The public embarrassment could still come, before, during, and after the games.  WN members might be small in numbers, but it only takes a few to rally the masses.

Combine both strategies.....go to the game(s) but stay outside with de banners, and posters etc.

[Babalawo]

Give the player they money.  Jack like to cheat people out of  $ any way he can, that why Fifa investigating him

[Fantastic]

Doh get tie up and feel that Jack need revenue at de stadium to continue he thiefing ways. Jack money does really come most times from just being in control behind de scenes for de big moments like world cup payout that he trying not to share with de players, contracts for de youth world cup in trini which he point towards he family and friends, tv rights for games like mexico trini or usa trini which he oversees. Gate revenue is usually small money for Jack.He in a position of power in FIFA where it very hard to dislodge him, but sooner or later de ammunition will be enough for dem to decide against him and we will be able to get him out of Trini system too. De only thing we could really do is not to support Jack projects like he ticket package fuh de world cup and to support de players when dey stand up against Jack. De players people, de players. That is de one thing Jack need. If dey broke and desperate he will always control them. We wasting we time until we could get to de point that when things not right no players willing to cross de line and play. What will Jack do then? Put on he boots? That is de only way people, support de players in dey stand against de JACKMAN. We still waiting for "THE ONE" to lead de struggle. Wonder if is TI?   

[dreamer]

Doh get tie up and feel that Jack need revenue at de stadium to continue he thiefing ways. Jack money does really come most times from just being in control behind de scenes for de big moments like world cup payout that he trying not to share with de players, contracts for de youth world cup in trini which he point towards he family and friends, tv rights for games like mexico trini or usa trini which he oversees. Gate revenue is usually small money for Jack.He in a position of power in FIFA where it very hard to dislodge him, but sooner or later de ammunition will be enough for dem to decide against him and we will be able to get him out of Trini system too. De only thing we could really do is not to support Jack projects like he ticket package fuh de world cup and to support de players when dey stand up against Jack. De players people, de players. That is de one thing Jack need. If dey broke and desperate he will always control them. We wasting we time until we could get to de point that when things not right no players willing to cross de line and play. What will Jack do then? Put on he boots? That is de only way people, support de players in dey stand against de JACKMAN. We still waiting for "THE ONE" to lead de struggle. Wonder if is TI?   

Very well said Fantas. Jackula also gets kickbacks when he grants host-nation status to desperate countries. Anything we can do to empower the players will make them less needy and less vulnerable to Jackula's, Grodent's and Scamp's manipulation. They definitely need support even if they gettin' dey tail wash against foreign teams. I'm 100% for de lawsuit. Behaviour change is only ensured by financial penalty.

[dcs]

Getting closer but this article doesn't have the details of the signed contracts.

Anybody knows if this is the same contract dey disputing? Fuentes say it signed.

News from the 6th of April 2006.

Soca Warriors sign up World Cup contracts.
By: Shaun Fuentes.

UK-based members of the Trinidad and Tobago National Senior team met with the management of the “Soca Warriors� in Manchester last week to discuss and finalize the terms of contract for the 2006 World Cup.
Manager Bruce Aanensen met with the core of players including captain Dwight Yorke where several issues were discussed including the upcoming schedule of events leading up to the World Cup as well as the run of events in T&T when the team assembles on May 7 for the match against Peru.
Among the items addressed in the contract are appearance fees and bonuses, daily per diem, image rights and the conditions of financial allocations to the players fund from sponsorships and other contributions. The specifics on code of conduct was also agreed upon.
Aanensen explained that regarding the image rights of the players, it was negotiated and agreed by the players that any image used by a sponsor or promoter in which six or more players appear, the image is property of the TTFF. But for any image with less than six players, the rights belong to the players and their permission is required before these images can be used. Additionally, all commercial value arising from this use of image, goes to the players fund. In the event of a player’s image being used, outside of the team, or if a player is involved in a promotion outside of a team activity whether it be with his club or other private arrangement, then all commercial value from this belongs to the sole individual.
“Everyone was cooperative and professional, and while the meeting lasted several hours, we had the opportunity to discuss all issues on the agenda prepared in conjunction with the players and everyone expressed satisfaction with the outcome of the meeting, Aanensen told TTFF Media. “The end result of the meeting means that the players will not have any contractual issues on their minds and they can prepare to go into the World Cup and the other activities around it, with a total focus on the job at hand.
Players based locally have also met with Aanensen this week and those based in the United States will have their contracts finalized early next week.
The players who have signed contracts but are not selected by Head coach Leo Beenhakker will automatically be released from the contract once the coach has announced his squad of 23 players, which has to be done before the FIFA deadline of 15th May 2006.