Letter from Shaka to Warner sent sunday 17th june

[kounty]

Jack will NEVER answer/reply to this letter and of all people T&T players should know Jack by now. Come on Shaka, yuh smarter than that...

16 players plus millions of supporters behind these man and none of us could stop ONE man Jack Warner. That is truly amazing....

Jack is a politician and he could fabricate and bluff real good, he knows when to talk and when not to, he will ignore this letter and make Shaka look stupid....

If them 16 players really put they head together they will accomplish a lot, but apparently only a hand full really pursuing or trying to fight, they look like they hanging on a string ready to jump back on the ship..

Over and Out....

good post but I think you failing to pay attention to the fact that Shaka don't need jack no more...for nuttin.  Even if Jack pull strings and ban him from football shaka could retire and get a manager wok or something....the real men who have the clout from here is Edwards and Scotty and Jones...but Berry and men like dem go advise them men against anything like writing a letter like this, or saying anything to the press like this.  Yorke and Latapy also could have a big voice and force this present issue to be resolved...but then jack go give up on this one, but they go have to deal with him later.  How much men believe in sacrificing comfort for what they believe..jihad bns  ?

[Bakes]

1) I never insinuated that Shaka was incapable of writing the letter himself.  My point was just that there is obviously some "legalese" in there which shows that a lawyer gave it a "visto bueno" prior to Shaka signing it.  Having a lawyer draft, or revise a letter means that the respondant will act in like manner with legal counsel of his own possibly leading to a long drawn out process.

2)Contrary to popular sentiment here on this board, and with an expectation that people will cuss for my saying this, I thought the letter was clever, but not very smart.  There was incendiary language throughout the letter which was simply needless, and may well prove to be counterproductive to bringing both parties to the table in good faith.

There is nothing incendiary in the language.

You on an island if you really think this letter was meant to bring anybody to any table.  FPATT is the only one with anything to gain here, the TTFF has dug in its heels and FPATT is presumably acute enough to recognize this.

3) I would love to know what FPATT expects to gain from this letter aside from public support.  Warner and his cronies will NOT take this attempt at public humiliation lightly, and is now self the process will be stalled.  Egos seem to have prevailed over common sense and an aim to work towards the greater good (first by Warner, and with this letter followed by FPATT).

4) Get accustomed to the Gold Cup team.

Now yuh cooking wid fire.  Rather than let the TTFF take potshots in the press and have FPATT left looking like a bunch of greedy players, this was precisely the strategy to undertake.  Fire back with pointed but accurate language.  There is nothing that Shaka said that cannot be substantiated by fact.  The tone of the letter conveys to the public that personal attacks on it's members would not be taken likely...which is precisely what a union is supposed to do...stand up for the rights of it's membership.

[Bakes]

jihad bns  ?

Lol...doh pull me in dat...Unkie Sam done ready tuh brand all ah we terrorist arready 

[grskywalker]

no probs  there bake (lol)  I' ll try braille next time

[pecan]

Hmmm

I read de letter twice ,maybe i Should read it a third time in more detail.

But in any letter like this, there has to be a specific request and expected outcomes

The letter, while full of interesting background, a restatement of what the players were seeking, but it does not explicitly make a request  (imho) to resolve the outstanding issues other than a round-about suggestion in the last sentence:

"The TTFF must now follow FIFA’s lead in recognizing and working with FPATT in an effort to take our game, both at the national and international levels, forward. I look forward to your response."

that last sentence should have been more direct, i.e asking for a meeting between TTFF and FPATT with a specif agenda, objectives and expected outcomes.

semantics maybe ... but this is not unlike a complaint letter to a vendor, or a request in a labour contract, or any kind of negotiations.

The indirect request for the TTFF to work with the FPATT does not obligate the TTFF to any action other than a meaningless response. 

In one read, I should have quickly know what the objectives were and expected outcomes.


just my analysis of the letter and its intentions,not meant to pass judgment or criticism on the intent of the letter which I believe is commendable, but will likely fall on deaf ears.

now i sitting on a limb like a bird on laglee waiting .....

[WestCoast]

jihad bns  ?

Lol...doh pull me in dat...Unkie Sam done ready tuh brand all ah we terrorist arready 

all expenses paid trip to Guantanamo

[kentsoulman]

Hmmm

I read de letter twice ,maybe i Should read it a third time in more detail.

But in any letter like this, there has to be a specific request and expected outcomes

The letter, while full of interesting background, a restatement of what the players were seeking, but it does not explicitly make a request  (imho) to resolve the outstanding issues other than a round-about suggestion in the last sentence:

"The TTFF must now follow FIFA’s lead in recognizing and working with FPATT in an effort to take our game, both at the national and international levels, forward. I look forward to your response."

that last sentence should have been more direct, i.e asking for a meeting between TTFF and FPATT with a specif agenda, objectives and expected outcomes.

semantics maybe ... but this is not unlike a complaint letter to a vendor, or a request in a labour contract, or any kind of negotiations.

The indirect request for the TTFF to work with the FPATT does not obligate the TTFF to any action other than a meaningless response. 

In one read, I should have quickly know what the objectives were and expected outcomes.


just my analysis of the letter and its intentions,not meant to pass judgment or criticism on the intent of the letter which I believe is commendable, but will likely fall on deaf ears.

now i sitting on a limb like a bird on laglee waiting .....

I take your point, Pecan, but I think you're trying to be a little too deep here man.

The letter has got a specific request and an expected outcome and that is basically

 BACK OFF WARNER, OR YOU'LL GET MORE OF THE SAME!!

Its telling Jack that he's not dealing with pussies anymore. This is not supposed to achieve anything more than speak up for the people Jack has lied about.

Meetings with TTFF are another issue. This is basically about a bully being told that if he keeps on, he'll get spanked, and should act as a warning to either behave or the gloves are coming off. Lets see if Warner steps away or fights. 

[grskywalker]

jihad bns  ?

Lol...doh pull me in dat...Unkie Sam done ready tuh brand all ah we terrorist arready 

 I ain't no terrurrist jed, yuh wah meh mash up yuh cyah-meh-ra or wha

[pecan]

Hmmm

I read de letter twice ,maybe i Should read it a third time in more detail.

But in any letter like this, there has to be a specific request and expected outcomes

The letter, while full of interesting background, a restatement of what the players were seeking, but it does not explicitly make a request  (imho) to resolve the outstanding issues other than a round-about suggestion in the last sentence:

"The TTFF must now follow FIFA’s lead in recognizing and working with FPATT in an effort to take our game, both at the national and international levels, forward. I look forward to your response."

that last sentence should have been more direct, i.e asking for a meeting between TTFF and FPATT with a specif agenda, objectives and expected outcomes.

semantics maybe ... but this is not unlike a complaint letter to a vendor, or a request in a labour contract, or any kind of negotiations.

The indirect request for the TTFF to work with the FPATT does not obligate the TTFF to any action other than a meaningless response. 

In one read, I should have quickly know what the objectives were and expected outcomes.


just my analysis of the letter and its intentions,not meant to pass judgment or criticism on the intent of the letter which I believe is commendable, but will likely fall on deaf ears.

now i sitting on a limb like a bird on laglee waiting .....

I take your point, Pecan, but I think you're trying to be a little too deep here man.

The letter has got a specific request and an expected outcome and that is basically

 BACK OFF WARNER, OR YOU'LL GET MORE OF THE SAME!!

Its telling Jack that he's not dealing with pussies anymore. This is not supposed to achieve anything more than speak up for the people Jack has lied about.

Meetings with TTFF are another issue. This is basically about a bully being told that if he keeps on, he'll get spanked, and should act as a warning to either behave or the gloves are coming off. Lets see if Warner steps away or fights. 

oh .. i forget to say that de letter should have consequences ...

 

[WestCoast]

yeah I took that letter as more of a first volley so to speak to get Mr Warner's attention.
If Mr Warner now chooses to be un business like about his response then it would set the direction that FPATT would then have in it's follow up letter.
It is a chess match with moves and counter moves.
jmho.

[daryn]

Hmmm

I read de letter twice ,maybe i Should read it a third time in more detail.

But in any letter like this, there has to be a specific request and expected outcomes

The letter, while full of interesting background, a restatement of what the players were seeking, but it does not explicitly make a request  (imho) to resolve the outstanding issues other than a round-about suggestion in the last sentence:

"The TTFF must now follow FIFA’s lead in recognizing and working with FPATT in an effort to take our game, both at the national and international levels, forward. I look forward to your response."

that last sentence should have been more direct, i.e asking for a meeting between TTFF and FPATT with a specif agenda, objectives and expected outcomes.

semantics maybe ... but this is not unlike a complaint letter to a vendor, or a request in a labour contract, or any kind of negotiations.

The indirect request for the TTFF to work with the FPATT does not obligate the TTFF to any action other than a meaningless response. 

In one read, I should have quickly know what the objectives were and expected outcomes.


just my analysis of the letter and its intentions,not meant to pass judgment or criticism on the intent of the letter which I believe is commendable, but will likely fall on deaf ears.

now i sitting on a limb like a bird on laglee waiting .....

I think the letter is only nominally to Jack Warner: it is as much a PR exercise as anything else.  Just as Jack's letter to Oliver Camps last week.

both sides know how to contact each other directly and none of this letter writing in the media changes any of the facts in the case.  It is however beneficial to have public opinion in your favour.  Jack is hoping that the players will get disillusioned and abandon the cause and the players realise that the more exposure the situation gets the greater their chance of either 1) getting their money or 2) their day in court.

[Mr Mc]

1) I never insinuated that Shaka was incapable of writing the letter himself.  My point was just that there is obviously some "legalese" in there which shows that a lawyer gave it a "visto bueno" prior to Shaka signing it.  Having a lawyer draft, or revise a letter means that the respondant will act in like manner with legal counsel of his own possibly leading to a long drawn out process.

2)Contrary to popular sentiment here on this board, and with an expectation that people will cuss for my saying this, I thought the letter was clever, but not very smart.  There was incendiary language throughout the letter which was simply needless, and may well prove to be counterproductive to bringing both parties to the table in good faith.
3) I would love to know what FPATT expects to gain from this letter aside from public support.  Warner and his cronies will NOT take this attempt at public humiliation lightly, and is now self the process will be stalled.  Egos seem to have prevailed over common sense and an aim to work towards the greater good (first by Warner, and with this letter followed by FPATT).

4) Get accustomed to the Gold Cup team.

jack gone in the papers and call the mne and them all kinda greedy and holding the country ransom, and allyuh want to have an issue witht he letter Shaka write...please!

again I ask what evidence was there that Jack was trying to sit down at any table, this process cyah get anymore stalled that it already was, this letter will hopefully be the jump start it needs.

[Bakes]

Hmmm

I read de letter twice ,maybe i Should read it a third time in more detail.

But in any letter like this, there has to be a specific request and expected outcomes

The letter, while full of interesting background, a restatement of what the players were seeking, but it does not explicitly make a request  (imho) to resolve the outstanding issues other than a round-about suggestion in the last sentence:

"The TTFF must now follow FIFA’s lead in recognizing and working with FPATT in an effort to take our game, both at the national and international levels, forward. I look forward to your response."

that last sentence should have been more direct, i.e asking for a meeting between TTFF and FPATT with a specif agenda, objectives and expected outcomes.

semantics maybe ... but this is not unlike a complaint letter to a vendor, or a request in a labour contract, or any kind of negotiations.

The indirect request for the TTFF to work with the FPATT does not obligate the TTFF to any action other than a meaningless response. 

In one read, I should have quickly know what the objectives were and expected outcomes.


just my analysis of the letter and its intentions,not meant to pass judgment or criticism on the intent of the letter which I believe is commendable, but will likely fall on deaf ears.

now i sitting on a limb like a bird on laglee waiting .....

I think the critical assumption you're making is that the letter was written in hopes of bringing about a specific course of action from the TTFF.  In case you haven't been following...private entreaties to negotiate have been rebuffed...then the players stance has been deliberately misconstrued.  There is no friendly way to bring the TTFF back to the table.  The only recourse is to hope for external pressure...be it from FIFA directly, or thru the public.  If you read the letter a fourth time you might realize that Shaka is really speaking AT Jack...and not TO him.

[Bakes]

I think the letter is only nominally to Jack Warner: it is as much a PR exercise as anything else.  Just as Jack's letter to Oliver Camps last week.

both sides know how to contact each other directly and none of this letter writing in the media changes any of the facts in the case.  It is however beneficial to have public opinion in your favour.  Jack is hoping that the players will get disillusioned and abandon the cause and the players realise that the more exposure the situation gets the greater their chance of either 1) getting their money or 2) their day in court.

Pretty much...

[DeSoWa]

This is what happens when you have someone who control an entity but not officially part of that entity 

What I gather from this letter, is that Shaka (FPATT) is writing a letter addressing MR. Warner as President of CONCACAF for his statement made towards the players on behalf of TTFF whis he is a special Advisor. This is not to the TTFF specifically trying to make a deal, I am sure they have other means of doing that. They are just protecting their members as a union should rightly do. Warner made the comments in the press, so Shaka rebuff said statement and sent it to Warner, with a press release 1 day after. It does not matter what Warner next move is concerning this, the truth is now out there..now is back to business for FPATT.

Big Up!

[Deeks]

Letter to TTFF, letter to Jack. Same "difference". !!!

[zuluwarrior]

SUCKER  yer days ah numberd ,yer give yer self enough authority so you can start counting from now .Begin now ,start counting , doh care how much days or weeks or months your powers iz dwindling away in front of yer very eyes and yer cant do nottin about it , yer had your time it iz now the worriors time . Big up FPATT big up . stand up for yer rights .

[Pointman]

If this impasse is allowed to continue T&T can illafford to send that Gold Cup team to represent us in WC qualifying as Jahyouth mentioned.

Pointman, go to this post by trini_bwoy, watch the video  and tell me what Warner has to say

Jack just took the wind out meh sails when he say Haiti before T&T oui

[pecan]

I think the critical assumption you're making is that the letter was written in hopes of bringing about a specific course of action from the TTFF.  In case you haven't been following...private entreaties to negotiate have been rebuffed...then the players stance has been deliberately misconstrued.  There is no friendly way to bring the TTFF back to the table.  The only recourse is to hope for external pressure...be it from FIFA directly, or thru the public.  If you read the letter a fourth time you might realize that Shaka is really speaking AT Jack...and not TO him.

i read it again and i tink see what allyuh saying ... so dat letter is posturing before de blows come??

 

so another question .. if all attempts at negotiation have failed, and from what I gather, there is already public awareness .. .why the pussy footing around? just to gain more public support?

I see WC say, dis is a warning shot? and TTFT response will dictate de next move.  So is dis de final, final warning, or is dere another final warning to follow.  Is Shaka giving Warner a final chance to come to de table before he unleashes all his ammo?  btw what is de ammo?

just trying to understand de strategy

[daryn]

I think the critical assumption you're making is that the letter was written in hopes of bringing about a specific course of action from the TTFF.  In case you haven't been following...private entreaties to negotiate have been rebuffed...then the players stance has been deliberately misconstrued.  There is no friendly way to bring the TTFF back to the table.  The only recourse is to hope for external pressure...be it from FIFA directly, or thru the public.  If you read the letter a fourth time you might realize that Shaka is really speaking AT Jack...and not TO him.

i read it again and i tink see what allyuh saying ... so dat letter is posturing before de blows come??

 

so another question .. if all attempts at negotiation have failed, and from what I gather, there is already public awareness .. .why the pussy footing around? just to gain more public support?

I see WC say, dis is a warning shot? and TTFT response will dictate de next move.  So is dis de final, final warning, or is dere another final warning to follow.  Is Shaka giving Warner a final chance to come to de table before he unleashes all his ammo?  btw what is de ammo?

just trying to understand de strategy

right now, jack is just basically trying to bully the players into backing down.  the more the issue is in the public eye the harder it is to hush it up. also, IF there's continued exposure, there is the possibility that at some point Jack/FIFA decide that all the negative publicity isn't worth it (akin to the WC 06 ticket scandal) .

as I understand it, the existence of the contract is not the issue.  the issue lies in the accounting.  all parties agreed to split the profits, now Jack is claiming that there were a lot less profits than everyone had expected, and he expects everyone to take his figure at face value.  the ammo is that at some point, if the process were to continue, he would have to justify the numbers he giving them.

[kentsoulman]

This is the situation as I see it.

Firstly, the blacklisted players are trying to resolve an issue between them and TTFF, but TTFF, as we know, have no say in the matter. Warner negotiated the contract and he's OFFICIALLY staying out of it. This means TTFF have nothing to say and nowhere to run to. They can't move without Jack and Jacks not getting involved in his role of special adviser. So the impasse continues. Even Minister Boynes is getting nowhere, because there is no one with the power to negotiate.

FPATT are trying to stay out of the issue. However, it is increasingly difficult because Jack is purposely blurring the lines. As CONCACAF president he has attacked the warriors, told untruths and made allegations of blackmail etc. He is also saying that players have no right to legal advice.

This cannot go undefended by FPATT for a number of reasons.
1 They must defend their members (albeit associate members)
2 Warner is effectively changing FIFA rules which affect ALL footballers
3 Warner cannot be allowed to be the only voice in this battle
4 Warner must be made to recognise FPATT publicly an force TTFF to do the same
5 World Cup 2010 contracts need to be negotiated pretty soon and TTFF must recognise FPATT as a formidable force and one to be respected.

FPATT did not start this war of words, but must prove to the public, to the players, to the football organisations and to the world that they intend to be strong and defend those that cannot defend themselves.

FPATT have a strategy and we probably haven't seen the last of this issue.

So many people on this site are picking holes in Shakas letter and FPATTs strategy. Ok, thats easy to do. You can do that with any statement or letter.

What I don't understand is, why?

This is what this site has been asking for since the blacklist began. Someone to stand up to the tyrant, someone to force transparency and return democracy. If TTFF fold, hopefully people like FPATT will have a say in who takes over and insist on transparency and democracy.

So who gives a shit if a commer is out of place? For Gods sake stop whining and get behind the boys. At last you have your Messiah, your Luke Skywalker, the guy to take on Warner. Support him.

These people read these sites. FPATT even post information here because people complained they did not know what is happening. And what happens? You still get people putting forward non constructive criticism. If you guys are so bright, why haven't YOU done something?

These guys must feel they just can't win right now.

Sorry, but I needed to get that off my chest!

 

[weary1969]

Whether Jack has been doin it since Rock of Ages was a pebble is not th eissue. It has to end here. If it means that man get blackilisted and neva wear th eRWB agin so b it but when th eunder 17 graduate to the national team the likes of Scamps and JW should not even be a footnote in we footballl history.

[E-man]

Made the LA Times:

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-corner20jun20,1,5128067.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-soccer&ctrack=2&cset=true

5 The row between Trinidad and Tobago's players and their national soccer federation over unpaid World Cup bonuses was ratcheted up Tuesday with the release by FC Dallas goalkeeper Shaka Hislop of a letter he had sent to Jack Warner, the president of CONCACAF and a FIFA vice president.

Hislop, the starting goalkeeper on Trinidad and Tobago's 2006 World Cup team, blasted what he termed Warner's "latest slanderous attack" on the players for sticking up for their rights and questioned Warner's impartiality.

"You have continually proven yourself heavily biased and opinionated in this matter," wrote Hislop, president of the Football Players Assn. of Trinidad and Tobago.

Fielding a young team, Trinidad and Tobago was eliminated in the first round of the Gold Cup.

[weary1969]

Eman u sent it to the times?

[pecan]

So many people on this site are picking holes in Shakas letter and FPATTs strategy. Ok, thats easy to do. You can do that with any statement or letter.

What I don't understand is, why?


Sorry, but I needed to get that off my chest!

 

aye Kentsoulman ..

I eh know if yuh was referring to me as one of the "so many people ....", but since it come so recently after my post, I will conclude that i was in that group

1) I was only making observations on what I saw and did not see in the intent of the letter, so I ask questions ..and men on de board attempted to answer .. and I thank dem because it gave me further insight.

2) I specifically said I was not passing judgment.  Based on my experience, when I write a letter to another party in a sensitive issue, there are certain strategies I adopt.  I did not readily see de strategy in dat letter so I asked de questions ..an guess what, I got rationale answers ..including yours

3) By and large, in my quick skim of the replies, I did not see people whining and not supporting de boys. 

3) Getting it off your chest .. that is what is so good about this forum, we can do so.

Peace

[Tongue]

big big shot leggo by Shaka yes.....like ah say before FIFA doh like bad press regardless if Jack is VP or not...at some point dem big boys go pullup Jamps and encourage him tuh get this ting sekkle.

[Football supporter]

Eman u sent it to the times?

Thanks to people on this site, we are managing to get the stories out, however, any more media contacts you have, please pass them on.

As an update, I have had loads of PMs offering help.

We have one member of SW/Wn who is hopefully going to be working with our English lawyer and another who we hope we can develop educational programmes with.

If anyone else can offer help or support, please PM me. We need footsoldiers as well as people with key skills.

It is apparent that the people of T&T are pretty much alone in their fight against tyranny and the development of football.

Our voice is being heard, but it is still a whisper. Lets make this whisper grow into a voice of justice heard around the world.

[WestCoast]

FPATT, I guess you know about http://www.transparencyinsport.org/ and http://www.playthegame.org/

[Football supporter]

FPATT, I guess you know about http://www.transparencyinsport.org/ and http://www.playthegame.org/

Yes, mate. Andrew Jennings has put him self on the line to defeat corruption. Top crusader.

[Bakes]

I think the critical assumption you're making is that the letter was written in hopes of bringing about a specific course of action from the TTFF.  In case you haven't been following...private entreaties to negotiate have been rebuffed...then the players stance has been deliberately misconstrued.  There is no friendly way to bring the TTFF back to the table.  The only recourse is to hope for external pressure...be it from FIFA directly, or thru the public.  If you read the letter a fourth time you might realize that Shaka is really speaking AT Jack...and not TO him.

i read it again and i tink see what allyuh saying ... so dat letter is posturing before de blows come??

 

so another question .. if all attempts at negotiation have failed, and from what I gather, there is already public awareness .. .why the pussy footing around? just to gain more public support?

I see WC say, dis is a warning shot? and TTFT response will dictate de next move.  So is dis de final, final warning, or is dere another final warning to follow.  Is Shaka giving Warner a final chance to come to de table before he unleashes all his ammo?  btw what is de ammo?

just trying to understand de strategy

I don't think there are 'blows to come' per se...I think what you are watching is the prelude to litigation.  To counter the image of the Soca Warriors as greedy blackmailers, Shaka decided to go on the offensive and counter some of the mischaracterizations of himself and his teammates and essentially put the issue 'out there' for the public to judge...before the real 'judgement' begins.


btw...I have no particular insight into what going on, I just speculating and offering opinion much like yuhself, so it's not like I definitely right and you wrong on this.


...but my version make more sense