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Offline E-man

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[EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« on: August 31, 2007, 11:44:23 AM »
What happened to Clarke made me think...
by Paul Gilder, The Journal


  Aug 31 2007 

Kenwyne Jones became Sunderland’s third most expensive player when he completed his £6m move from Southampton this week, but his sizeable transfer fee does not concern a striker with more important things to think about.

THE misfortune Clive Clarke has encountered this week has touched all in English football, Sunderland’s on-loan Irishman having suffered double heart failure during the half-time break in Leicester’s Carling Cup second-round tie at Nottingham Forest.

A shocking episode that has affected different people in different ways. For supporters in the East Midlands, Clarke’s collapse ensured that fighting for local pride paled into insignificance, while for Roy Keane it put another pitiful performance into perspective.

For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.

“What happened to Clive made me sit up and think,” said the Black Cats’ latest signing, who told Southampton officials that he did not want to be considered for last week’s Championship fixture against Stoke having been told he would not be allowed to leave the South Coast club.

“As a sportsman, a footballer, you assume that you will be healthy for a long time. But then things like this happen and it makes you think. It made me realise that I’ve got to take every chance I get. It’s everybody’s dream to play in the Premier League and when you see players having to retire and players dying (Sevilla’s Antonio Puerta this week met such an end after suffering a cardiac arrest during a game against Gefate), you realise that you have to take your opportunities when they come. The time came for me and I had to take the chance.”

Keane – who learned about Clarke’s troubles during this week’s Carling Cup defeat at Luton – could not disguise his distress when informed. The Black Cats boss was last night attempting to speak to the recovering defender, while chairman Niall Quinn is planning to visit him in hospital this morning.

Although their Sunderland careers have not overlapped, Jones has given Clarke’s condition much thought in recent days and, like all in the footballing world, what has happened to Puerta has prompted profound thought.

Seven days ago, a player who had handed in a transfer request at St Mary’s was making unfortunate headlines having effectively gone on strike. One week on, perspective has been discovered.

“What happened at Southampton was taken out of context,” explained the Trinidad and Tobago international, who forced George Burley’s hand with his refusal to take part against Stoke last weekend. “It’s gone now and I’m just pleased to be here at Sunderland. It was a bit of a saga, it dragged on for a week or two, but what’s done is done.

“I left Southampton on good terms. I have no ill feelings towards anyone there, I’ve been there for three years and everyone down there’s a friend. Everyone down there – regardless of the circumstances – is pleased for me. I think people are pleased that I’ve made a step towards the pinnacles of my career.”

Jones is perhaps naive to think that all at St Mary’s are pleased with the manner in which he departed the Championship club, although satisfaction should be sought in the deal that ensured a protracted transfer progressed. To sign a striker with a mere two Premier League appearances to his name, Keane spent £6m, with Stern John joining Southampton as part of the deal. The Saints paid the Trinidad club W Connection just £100,000 to sign Jones three years ago.

Other than Craig Gordon and Tore Andre Flo, no player has cost the Black Cats more, but although a staggering transfer fee will bring understandable pressures, Jones has no concerns.

“The price tag doesn’t bother me,” said a striker who is expected to make his debut in tomorrow’s televised fixture at Manchester United. “No matter what league you’re playing in, you’re going to be under some pressure, but I won’t be worrying about the transfer fee. I’ll just be doing the best I can.

“Players have no input in what their price tag might be, it’s no one’s fault. Southampton wanted to get a good price and, to be fair, they’ve been in the Championship for two years and don’t have much cash. It’s not a concern for me. I’m just pleased it has been done.”

Keane has been as outspoken as ever this summer and earlier this month the Irishman criticised players for refusing to head north and for being obsessed with living near London. Having bucked the trend, a player prepared to uproot had no qualms about making such a big move.

“It wasn’t an issue,” said Jones, who has joined compatriots Dwight Yorke and Carlos Edwards on Wearside. “I moved 4,000 miles from Trinidad and Tobago to join Southampton so moving here wasn’t a problem at all. I just want to be playing in the Premier League.

“It was a simple decision to make and it always helps when you’ve got friends at a club. Dwight and Carlos being at Sunderland wasn’t a major factor for me, but it was a factor.

“I was speaking to them two or three times a week even before all this started to happen and they were always joking and saying, ‘When are you coming up here?’ Them being here is the icing on the cake for me.

“Regardless of what they’ve told me, everyone in England can see that Sunderland Football Club has great ambition. What happened last year showed that. People know what Sunderland is about. You don’t need words to persuade you to come here.”

“I’ve never set goal targets, I set performance targets. The aim is to be better each day, whether that’s in training or in games. I hope those performances will help me to score goals in the games.

“Everyone’s different and when you come to the Premier League you just have to find your own way and play how you play. I hope the way I play will enable me to be a success.”

The price-tag does not bother me . . . I’ll do the best I can
 

Offline Quags

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2007, 11:58:48 AM »
He should kill that talk ,ppl in England looking at it as a cop out .

Offline freakazoid

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2007, 12:06:15 PM »
stewie ah mean quagmire ;D, i see no reason 4 him to kill that talk,puerta was 22 jones is 22. u cant take things for granted. that was what push d man to make his decision.

but lets be real how much persuasion should one need to make a move from a lower divison to a higher one
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Offline Bakes

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2007, 01:24:59 PM »
He should kill that talk ,ppl in England looking at it as a cop out .
Maybe because it is a facking cop out.  He should know better than to try and justify his selfishness by capitalizing on these tragic events.

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2007, 01:30:18 PM »
He should kill that talk ,ppl in England looking at it as a cop out .
Maybe because it is a facking cop out.  He should know better than to try and justify his selfishness by capitalizing on these tragic events.

you is one ah d man brain cell o wat steupssssss. how many bids did derby make? if d man say that push him over , i have to accept that because i dont believe he so low down to use such a serious thing as a cover.

u basically saying the man is ah low down nasty dirty lier
seek ye 1st the kingdom of God & his righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you


Offline Bakes

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2007, 01:34:47 PM »
He should kill that talk ,ppl in England looking at it as a cop out .
Maybe because it is a facking cop out.  He should know better than to try and justify his selfishness by capitalizing on these tragic events.

you is one ah d man brain cell o wat steupssssss. how many bids did derby make? if d man say that push him over , i have to accept that because i dont believe he so low down to use such a serious thing as a cover.

u basically saying the man is ah low down nasty dirty lier

However de ass you want to interpret my statements is up to you...take it and run with it. 

Kenwyne Jones mind was already made up the moment he handed in his transfer request and decided he wasn't suiting up for Southampton.  If you so dotish and gullible to think that 3-4 days later he was still contemplating staying and playing for the Saints then you even more dunce than I was prepared to believe coming out de Berbatov thread.

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2007, 01:47:34 PM »
u is ah little boy in ah big man suit....my opinion on berbatov is my opinion.   pol pot and papa doc have to be your family'. i n note when he put in his transfer as to when the incidents happen but as u say that cool

 yes his transfer was placed b4 this all happened........... but havent u done something that anger alot of ppl and start to doubt yuhself if what u did was the right thing to do?

 the man cant be such ah dirty lier to  use this situation under false pretense. he not so nasty
seek ye 1st the kingdom of God & his righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you


Offline Bakes

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2007, 01:53:36 PM »
u is ah little boy in ah big man suit....my opinion on berbatov is my opinion.   pol pot and papa doc have to be your family'. i n note when he put in his transfer as to when the incidents happen but as u say that cool

 yes his transfer was placed b4 this all happened........... but havent u done something that anger alot of ppl and start to doubt yuhself if what u did was the right thing to do?

 the man cant be such ah dirty lier to  use this situation under false pretense. he not so nasty
Pol Pot is my great-grandfather on mih mudda side...I only know Papa Doc in passing.  Your opinion colors other people's perception of you and fact is yuh was talking ah pack ah ass in that thread, I not de only one who thought so, so doh feel like I persecuting yuh. 
Kenwyne hand in he transfer request since last week...and refused to play in the game last Saturday against Stokes.  Maybe yuh shoulda check those facts out before coming at me with yuh nonsense talk about me being one ah he brain cells  ;)  The day he was supposed to play is the day Puerta collapsed...what he clairvoyant now?

Kenwyne wasn't having no second-thoughts....read de statement again, de man was thinking about Sunderland specifically for weeks...talking with Yorke about it.  This isn't something that just come up this week.  If that is the case then fine...yuh want to leave Southampton, do yuh do.  Now after the fact he coming and bold-face lying and saying that is de man and dem falling out on de field that make him decide tuh leave??  ...steups

Funny though that you should come 'attacking' me fuh my opinions on this...then turn around and call me ah "li'l boy" when I respond in kind, lol.  Allyuh man funny yes.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 01:55:48 PM by Bake n Shark »

Offline DeSoWa

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2007, 02:20:06 PM »
Allyuh good oui  ;D Stop arguing bout nutten nah  :devil:

B&S, did you read the entire article? Kenwyne never said he used what happend to make his decision..

What he said was..what happened to Clarke and Puerta reinforced his decision, made him felt that he made the right one, since you never know what can happen to you. He took his chance to go the the prem and he felt he made the right decision because he don't know if he will ever have the opportunity again... :beermug:

Quote
For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.


Big Up!
« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 02:22:43 PM by DeSoWa »
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Offline Peong

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2007, 02:22:27 PM »
Steups.
Who would really think that Jones is saying that he went on strike because of Puerta?
Is that the only feasible answer?
I guess I need to say that no, it's not.

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2007, 02:23:45 PM »
The Puerta's comments aside, Kenwyne gave very intellectual answers to the questions....not many Trinis have that ability with the press....

Imagine..making your debut against Man U!
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2007, 02:26:55 PM »
no man bake and shark does get on like  his opinion is d only way....... that is dictator and terrorist mentality

d man getting on like he know kenwyne steups . i know d man wouldnt stoop so low. i dont need any facts 4 that

For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 02:42:35 PM by freakazoid »
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2007, 02:32:01 PM »
yes truth be known i am a kenwyne jones fan..... and i think he jus needs a half chance to string up van der sar ah hope them men take good corners and good freekicks.....buh 1stly i have to hope he fit enough to play.
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2007, 03:10:29 PM »
dont worry freakazoid...if you know someone talkin shit when they didnt even read the article then just ignore dey ass.
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2007, 06:01:28 PM »
Allyuh good oui  ;D Stop arguing bout nutten nah  :devil:

B&S, did you read the entire article? Kenwyne never said he used what happend to make his decision..

What he said was..what happened to Clarke and Puerta reinforced his decision, made him felt that he made the right one, since you never know what can happen to you. He took his chance to go the the prem and he felt he made the right decision because he don't know if he will ever have the opportunity again... :beermug:

Quote
For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.


Big Up!

Yeah man DeSoWa but this isn't the only article that informs my opinion:

Quote
"Every player's dream is to play in the Premier League and being at my age and seeing the events of players having to retire and, sadly, players dying, you want to take that chance when you get it to play in the Premier League.

"My time came and I wanted to do it".


The clear inference is that what's goin on with the tragedies affected his decision...no hint at reinforcement here.  Here's the link http://www.thisishampshire.net/sport/saints/display.var.1655319.0.kenwyne_spanish_tragedy_spurred_me_on_to_quit_saints.php

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #15 on: August 31, 2007, 06:03:13 PM »
dont worry freakazoid...if you know someone talkin shit when they didnt even read the article then just ignore dey ass.

Who needs ignoring is dumbasses like you, who don't know shit what going on but feel the need to weigh in from the facking peanut gallery, throwing word from the sideline.  You need to change your name from Supporter to Jock Strap...because balls is de only thing you good fuh supporting.

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #16 on: August 31, 2007, 06:07:49 PM »
no man bake and shark does get on like  his opinion is d only way....... that is dictator and terrorist mentality

d man getting on like he know kenwyne steups . i know d man wouldnt stoop so low. i dont need any facts 4 that

For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.
How de f*ck am I getting on like my opinion is 'de only way'?  I suppose to apologize in advance fuh jackasses like you?  Go back and look at the chronology...YOU, yuh dunce...you is de one who decide to take issue with my opinion on the issue...nobody was even addressing you specifically.  You took it upon yourself to take umbrage with my opinion...then getting vex with me when I defend it, lol.  You must be some special breed ah jackass.

Offline Peong

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #17 on: August 31, 2007, 08:15:49 PM »
Nowhere in those articles does Jones say or infer that he went on strike or decided that he wanted to move because of Puerta or Clarke.

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #18 on: August 31, 2007, 08:16:57 PM »
oh boy
 ::)
Just Cool you are so right
« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 08:18:35 PM by WestCoast »
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2007, 10:08:26 PM »
Nowhere in those articles does Jones say or infer that he went on strike or decided that he wanted to move because of Puerta or Clarke.


I thought it was just me but apparently Peong yuh read de same article  and realize de same thing like me .....Hear nah do meh ah favor plz, spread some ah dah wisdom around nah, hopefully ah certain poster that have he head so far up he rectum might be able to smile an see dat KJ never infer that.....but den yuh know de ole saying yuh cud lead ah thirsty jackass to de water but if he eh want to drink......

KJ hear what.. FACK all who vex with yuh decision,leh dem eat 'sh!t n ded' as far as I concern dey cud kiss yuh Trinbago baxide,you do wha yuh ha to do for you and yuh family who vex,facking lose.For de imps dat want to talk sh!t bout ''he was wrong'' an he ha no 'scruples' or 'morals', let any organisation offer to take dem to ah higher level in dey career and double or triple dey salary in the same line of wuk and see how loyal dey go be to dey old job....I eh know why this facking asswipe only bumping he gum.
 KJ boss just bust de net 2morro dread an silence dis faggot once and for all,  leh him keep talking bout scruples and morals while yuh cementing yuh place in the premiership and making TnT proud.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 10:11:17 PM by berris »
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Offline Bitter

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2007, 11:37:32 PM »
Because I can't sleep:

We don't have the actual interview for context, but your interpretation of the quote depends on how you parse it.

Direct quotes from the article above:

"“What happened to Clive made me sit up and think,”

Really? think about what?

“As a sportsman, a footballer, you assume that you will be healthy for a long time. But then things like this happen and it makes you think. It made me realise that I’ve got to take every chance I get. It’s everybody’s dream to play in the Premier League and when you see players having to retire and players dying (Sevilla’s Antonio Puerta this week met such an end after suffering a cardiac arrest during a game against Gefate), you realise that you have to take your opportunities when they come. The time came for me and I had to take the chance.”

This could mean:
a) People have retired/died/suffered tragedy and so I decided to jump ship

OR

b) Life is short, inlight of what has happened, I think I made the correct decision. Take the opportunities, you never know what's around the corner.

Do you chose a) or b)? That's the debate right there.
Most of the context for the other article is provided by the headline and the writer and not reflected in the quote.

Quote
"Every player's dream is to play in the Premier League and being at my age and seeing the events of players having to retire and, sadly, players dying, you want to take that chance when you get it to play in the Premier League.

"My time came and I wanted to do it".

Once again it depends on how you parse it.

a) It's our dream to play in the EPL. Looking at the events that have transpired, you don't want to let a chance to do so slip away. It may never come again.

OR

b) Look at the events that transpired. I saw that and decided I needed to leave.


As for the argument about the contract. I realise that a contract is a legally binding agreement which lays out the roles and expectations of both parties, however, There are always situations where one party will want to terminate the agreement for whatever reason. Industrial action is not unheard of (I mean, we from Trinidad, right) and is, I think, an accepted tactic.

Sportspeople from all nations have holdouts and strikes when seeking to maximize their earning ability, contract or not. Because of the short time they have to make top dollar in their trade, they will more quickly resort to extreme measures. Waiting 6 months, 6 weeks, or 6 days may be the difference between making the big times and selling lumber for your father-in-law.



« Last Edit: August 31, 2007, 11:46:22 PM by Bitter »
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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2007, 12:02:33 AM »
Because I can't sleep:

We don't have the actual interview for context, but your interpretation of the quote depends on how you parse it.

Direct quotes from the article above:

"“What happened to Clive made me sit up and think,”

Really? think about what?

“As a sportsman, a footballer, you assume that you will be healthy for a long time. But then things like this happen and it makes you think. It made me realise that I’ve got to take every chance I get. It’s everybody’s dream to play in the Premier League and when you see players having to retire and players dying (Sevilla’s Antonio Puerta this week met such an end after suffering a cardiac arrest during a game against Gefate), you realise that you have to take your opportunities when they come. The time came for me and I had to take the chance.”

This could mean:
a) People have retired/died/suffered tragedy and so I decided to jump ship

OR

b) Life is short, inlight of what has happened, I think I made the correct decision. Take the opportunities, you never know what's around the corner.

Do you chose a) or b)? That's the debate right there.
Most of the context for the other article is provided by the headline and the writer and not reflected in the quote.

Quote
"Every player's dream is to play in the Premier League and being at my age and seeing the events of players having to retire and, sadly, players dying, you want to take that chance when you get it to play in the Premier League.

"My time came and I wanted to do it".

Once again it depends on how you parse it.

a) It's our dream to play in the EPL. Looking at the events that have transpired, you don't want to let a chance to do so slip away. It may never come again.

OR

b) Look at the events that transpired. I saw that and decided I needed to leave.


As for the argument about the contract. I realise that a contract is a legally binding agreement which lays out the roles and expectations of both parties, however, There are always situations where one party will want to terminate the agreement for whatever reason. Industrial action is not unheard of (I mean, we from Trinidad, right) and is, I think, an accepted tactic.

Sportspeople from all nations have holdouts and strikes when seeking to maximize their earning ability, contract or not. Because of the short time they have to make top dollar in their trade, they will more quickly resort to extreme measures. Waiting 6 months, 6 weeks, or 6 days may be the difference between making the big times and selling lumber for your father-in-law.






''This could mean:
a) People have retired/died/suffered tragedy and so I decided to jump ship

OR

b) Life is short, inlight of what has happened, I think I made the correct decision. Take the opportunities, you never know what's around the corner.''

Ah have to disagree with the part above in bold....
Hear meh ...To believe the meaning of 'A', one would have to come to the conclusion that KJ is ah dunce and just outright lying becuz is no way that cud have happened, as de unfortunate incidents clearly came after and cud not have influence his decision.He wud have to be ah mad man to try and expect people to believe this.So imo 'B' is the only logical answer and this is where I have to question the accuracy of the reporter's quote from de first article and I do not believe KJ actually said this.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2007, 09:16:27 AM by berris »
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Offline saga pinto

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2007, 01:31:55 AM »
Allyuh good oui  ;D Stop arguing bout nutten nah  :devil:

B&S, did you read the entire article? Kenwyne never said he used what happend to make his decision..

What he said was..what happened to Clarke and Puerta reinforced his decision, made him felt that he made the right one, since you never know what can happen to you. He took his chance to go the the prem and he felt he made the right decision because he don't know if he will ever have the opportunity again... :beermug:

Quote
For Kenwyne Jones, the defender’s plight demonstrated that in football, as in life, opportunities must be taken. As the 22-year-old admitted last night, Clarke’s horrendous health problems have suggested that he was correct to pursue a controversial career path.


Big Up!

I thought it was only me that got it,well said!but what I would leave out is reinforced,He seems eager to show his ability at the highest level and opportunities like this come once in a lifetime.  I think the young man is maturing before our very eyes,,yuh see he knows tomorrow is not promised to anyone and current events whether tragic or otherwise in reflection makes us wonder if we made the right decision,remember choice and not chance is what determines your destiny.

 Go for it Kenwynne and while you're at it,try reaching for the stars. :) 
« Last Edit: September 01, 2007, 02:07:35 AM by saga pinto »

Offline Mango Chow!

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2007, 03:16:41 AM »
Me eh care wha Kenwyne say, when he say it or how he say it.  De man made a decision that, at the time that he made it, he felt was best for he and he famalee.  Dem club owner an' dem for generations have always had the upper hand over players and coaching staff alike when it came to the business of football, reinforced by labour laws and politics to tighten their grip on their employees.  If every now and then, one of the field negroes get to jump ship and tell massah to kiss he behind, so be it.    When massah ready to bench yuh, dey benchin yuh.  When dey ready to trade or sell yuh, dey tradin' or sellin' yuh (and all de laws are slanted in their favour to do what they please, mind you) and when dey sure damned ready to cut yuh loose and trow yuh off de boat, is a big "SPLASH!!" dem players makin' in de water upon impact.  Good for KJ. make yuh money and enjoy de ride.  I jes' would like to see him continue workin' on improvin' he firs' touch and final finishin' and I happy.


Not because a man ears long and he teet' long dat it make him a Jackass!

Offline sjahrain

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Re: [EPL] Kenwyne Jones: What happened to Clarke made me think...
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2007, 07:46:07 AM »
... :rotfl:   DON`T    WORRY     BE     HAPPY..... :rotfl:

                             GO  KJ   GO

Capitalism run things,it all about supply and demand

The demand is in the EPL and KJ is a willing supplyer....just bust the net early

The Trini have ambition,KJ just leave the baggage in Southampton,you are now with Sunderland

Southampton made a healthy profit from thier 100,000 pound investment


I have one question here.....will Roy tell KJ to cut out the gymnastics.... ???

 

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