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Author Topic: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990  (Read 29779 times)

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Offline Tallman

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Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« on: December 12, 2007, 11:47:16 AM »
Anybody ever read dis book? If so, what yuh thought about it? I try all how tuh read it, but ah cyar make ah note. De writing style is convoluted, and overall it has been a painful attempted reading experience.

The Conquering Lion of Judah shall break every chain.

Offline Dutty

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2007, 01:50:51 PM »
Well de fact that he call it Jihad...I done realize is fiction arready

Who is de author?..... a newspaper journalist or a 'intellectual' deportee
Little known fact: The online transportation medium called Uber was pioneered in Trinidad & Tobago in the 1960's. It was originally called pullin bull.

leroy

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2007, 05:04:08 PM »
I would love to have a copy of Jihad in T&T,I remember in 1990 a few months after T&T WC Qualifiers ended there was the Shell football cup going on in  Port of spain and A N R Robinson then President of the twin island republic was held hostage in Parliament with other Parliamentarians of T&T by Muslims,I remember how jamaican soldiers went into T&T via neigboring Barbados and went in to the Trinidad countriside,which cause a big outburts by T&T press which the situation was resolve internally.I remember very well that era when Mighty Sparrow had a song out called 'one goal to Italy' which if Trinidad had went to italy that song would have been sparrows best seller.Please post the iSBN # I would like to get a copy of the book.good post.

Offline WestCoast

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« Last Edit: December 12, 2007, 08:45:19 PM by WestCoast »
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
Lord Chesterfield
(1694 - 1773)

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2007, 05:28:01 PM »
Quote
I remember how jamaican soldiers went into T&T via neigboring Barbados and went in to the Trinidad countriside,which cause a big outburts by T&T press which the situation was resolve internally

Somebody with additional insight bring it nah.

Offline Tallman

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2007, 07:54:37 PM »
Who is de author?..... a newspaper journalist or a 'intellectual' deportee

This is his description on the back cover of the book:
Daurius Figueira is a social researcher living in Trinidad and Tobago, West Indies, the land of his birth. He holds a B.A. and and MPhil from the University of the West Indies at St. Augustine, Trinidad. He has published two books: Cocaine and the Economy of Crime in Trinidad and Tobago and A Spy in the Houses of Hate.
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Offline dcs

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2007, 03:57:50 AM »
Sad but this must be one of the few documented accounts of the coup....what else it have out there.  I know it have NO OFFICIAL REPORTS.  Not sure why   :whistling:

Offline Jah Gol

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2007, 07:34:42 AM »
I would love to have a copy of Jihad in T&T,I remember in 1990 a few months after T&T WC Qualifiers ended there was the Shell football cup going on in  Port of spain and A N R Robinson then President of the twin island republic was held hostage in Parliament with other Parliamentarians of T&T by Muslims,I remember how jamaican soldiers went into T&T via neigboring Barbados and went in to the Trinidad countriside,which cause a big outburts by T&T press which the situation was resolve internally.I remember very well that era when Mighty Sparrow had a song out called 'one goal to Italy' which if Trinidad had went to italy that song would have been sparrows best seller.Please post the iSBN # I would like to get a copy of the book.good post.
Robinson was the Prime Minister then.

Offline dinho

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2007, 07:50:21 AM »
Sad but this must be one of the few documented accounts of the coup....what else it have out there.  I know it have NO OFFICIAL REPORTS.  Not sure why   :whistling:


Just recently I was liming by a bar with a group of fellas and they were recounting the coup.. And the discussion went into just how much really went on behind the scenes of that coup and specifically the contributing factors, precursors and lead up to that fateful day... Under drinks, tongue get loose and talk jump out and man start to talk bout who they know was in what, and who knew about what and who was in league with who etc etc... I heard some things which cant be justified as fact, but certainly were plausible rumors/theories whatever you want to call it.. but had me thinking...

So i thought to myself i was kinda too young back then to appreciate everything else surrounding the coup other than there was a curfew. And i decided to do some research...

Nothing!  As an example, you can practically find anything on youtube from the old Trinidad days, but imagine no video footage of a coup which was shown live on TTT!  Other regular sources which you would expect to find something also came up short and wanting.. Check out this concise wikipedia account:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamaat_al_Muslimeen_coup_attempt

And led me to think.. Imagine so many people died over those fateful days.. So much damage was done to property, but more importantly, the psyche of a nation... And not one investigation or commission of enquiry or comprehensive review to uncover the real nitty gritty behind the 1990 coup..

who knew? who didn't know? who was told beforehand? who was involved? who supported it? who brought the guns? why dem fellas walking free? why people dead for nothing? etc etc... where de answers?

Its like we as a nation decided to collectively sweep the entire thing under the carpet and turn a blind eye, as if we prefer it never even happened. Every july 27,1990 is about 5 ppl commemorating the lost ones around de savannah while everybody else go about their business as normal.. remind me of the scene on that leonard dicaprio movie, "the beach" when the shark bite the fellah but he didnt die, so they get bury him to preserve their island paradise..

but the scars remain..

         

Offline WestCoast

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2007, 08:45:02 AM »
I have always wondered about the way TnT has treated their prisoners of conscience, political dissenters or conscientious objectors.
In my time I remember the students who returned to TnT from Canada who were responsible for the

protest and subsequent destruction on a Computer Lab in Sir George Williams University in Montreal on February 11, 1969

In Chapter 15, page 157, of this Book, Searching for Justice: An Autobiography, you can read more about the Sir William Incident.

Then the People who were responsible for the Coup of 1970's
and now the people who were responsible for the Coup of 1990

It seems to me that TnT Judicial System has dealt with the leaders of these protests in a way to bring them into the mainstream and NOT to further alienate them by incarceration or worse.
what allya think?
Anyone can add their more eloquent writings about these situations.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2007, 10:51:52 PM by WestCoast »
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
Lord Chesterfield
(1694 - 1773)

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2007, 10:14:54 AM »
'ldinho, Look at the events of '70 and you'll find a similar dampening ... when columnists in de papers write about it or refer to it by way of example i feel dey only reaching about 20 people who understand wey dey coming from ... '70 is not a reference or information point for most Trinis

now lehwe tie dat to West Coast's valid observation about 'bringing them into the mainstream' ... blurred lines ... muddied waters and we have a preamble for more drama

where's de catharsis and national introspection? i have not seen it ...

marginalisation by amnesia or wilful forgetting will return to bite us firmly on de gluteus maximus


Offline WestCoast

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2007, 03:20:28 PM »
where's de catharsis and national introspection? i have not seen it ...

marginalisation by amnesia or wilful forgetting will return to bite us firmly on de gluteus maximus
Aslyumseeker,
what do you feel should be done to "Get Over" or "Expound' on what has happened?
this has interested me, ever since 1969,  and I personally have no answer.
and do you think that if we look at the current problems in TnT from a holistic viewpoint that indeed our eggs are now hatching?


« Last Edit: December 13, 2007, 04:57:51 PM by WestCoast »
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
Lord Chesterfield
(1694 - 1773)

Offline Dutty

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2007, 03:51:15 PM »
Sad but this must be one of the few documented accounts of the coup....what else it have out there.  I know it have NO OFFICIAL REPORTS.  Not sure why   :whistling:

And led me to think.. Imagine so many people died over those fateful days.. So much damage was done to property, but more importantly, the psyche of a nation... And not one investigation or commission of enquiry or comprehensive review to uncover the real nitty gritty behind the 1990 coup..

who knew? who didn't know? who was told beforehand? who was involved? who supported it? who brought the guns? why dem fellas walking free? why people dead for nothing? etc etc... where de answers?

Its like we as a nation decided to collectively sweep the entire thing under the carpet and turn a blind eye, as if we prefer it never even happened. Every july 27,1990 is about 5 ppl commemorating the lost ones around de savannah while everybody else go about their business as normal.. remind me of the scene on that leonard dicaprio movie, "the beach" when the shark bite the fellah but he didnt die, so they get bury him to preserve their island paradise..

but the scars remain..



Hell of a ting eh,,look we have we own "9/11" style conspiracy issues to unravel since 1990 and somehow troo the magic of CNN repition we know more about the yankee one than our own

my old pardner lester de vignes lose his father because of Abu and he bunch ah c**ts
I eh see lester in real years, but I remember vividly how the death affect him and his siblings
Little known fact: The online transportation medium called Uber was pioneered in Trinidad & Tobago in the 1960's. It was originally called pullin bull.

truetrini

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2007, 06:13:48 PM »
a member of my family was involved in that Computer room debacle.

he even taught at fatima at one time.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2007, 06:17:46 PM by Jack_Manday »

Offline WestCoast

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2007, 07:18:58 PM »
a member of my family was involved in that Computer room debacle.
he even taught at fatima at one time.
so, give we some first hand observations nuh
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
Lord Chesterfield
(1694 - 1773)

truetrini

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2007, 07:20:46 PM »
will call him and get his perspective.

Offline Jahyouth

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2007, 10:07:31 PM »
Dr. Selwyn Ryan has also written a book on the July 27th coup.  If you are looking for a quality read on the subject that may be your best bet.

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2007, 07:48:24 AM »
where's de catharsis and national introspection? i have not seen it ...

marginalisation by amnesia or wilful forgetting will return to bite us firmly on de gluteus maximus
Aslyumseeker,
what do you feel should be done to "Get Over" or "Expound' on what has happened?
this has interested me, ever since 1969,  and I personally have no answer.
and do you think that if we look at the current problems in TnT from a holistic viewpoint that indeed our eggs are now hatching?




WC, here's a partial (and partly instinctive) response.

To properly address this concern a multiple constituency response was needed. Social constituencies, not political. Ultimately a people response. Groundswell.

However, our collective understanding of self does not lead to that sort of combustion. In part we understand that answers are to be sought and we may even recognise that some action is to be taken, but in the country there is the chilling effect of operating outside of the norm ... breaking the social pact of acquiescence ... doing or taking action outside of the standard regimen.

We failed to ACCEPT that we were presented with an exigent circumstance. We knew it was. We recognised it was, but we didn't accept it at the core. Had we done so some of the crap masquerading as a transformed Trinidad would not be taking place today.

Change is a funny thing. It can either be dramatic like a coup or it can be gradual and accretive such that one day yuh wake up and yuh doh recognise whey yuh living or recognise a place yuh left only a few years ago - nah, buh doh worry is still de cascadura theory in effect. Eat it and everything go be alright back in Trini.
 
I place the blame for this squarely at the feet of the political class.

What we are faced with is distinct from the lack of a culture of protest present in some islands. We know how to protest (in some circumstances). What we lack almost perversely is how to express meaningful national outrage collectively and responsibly. We fail at calling for and achieving accountability. Westminster has taught us that accountability is determined on a five-year schedule (or on the Prime Minister's prerogative). This works for the political class. But it also means we expect incisive responses and decision making from the very class that is loathe to make them.

What keeps us from waking up? The paralysis of fear. Disinformation, misinformation and lack of information. The fact that most of the natural actors (those we think should/would/ought to respond) are in our society very co-opted and invested in the present architecture of the state. 

Ultimately, there is a 'Government will handle it' national sentiment in place ... and this is where the crux of the problem lies ... because ...

By definition Gov't's interest is in tamping down the thing, dismissing it as manifest aberration, minimizing threat ... whatever needs to be done to return to a business as usual environment ASAP ... the fact that the death toll was not massive assisted this course of action as well ...

As Trinis we show metaphorically plenty cascadura traits: we have thick skins; we can breathe where the air is rare; we not particularly aggressive buh we resilient; we very accomodating to outsiders and difference; we are crowd-tolerant ... the problem is like the cascadura we may have poor vision in murky waters.

Offline Tallman

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2007, 08:44:21 AM »
Dr. Selwyn Ryan has also written a book on the July 27th coup.  If you are looking for a quality read on the subject that may be your best bet.

Tha book is called The Muslimeen Grab for Power: Race, Religion, and Revolution in Trinidad and Tobago. Figueira makes references to it in his book.
The Conquering Lion of Judah shall break every chain.

Offline fishs

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2007, 01:55:39 AM »

 Ah went to a stag party in Chag the night before.
Was sitting down on mih car wondering if ah could get the steelband in mih head to stop playing so that ah could get to see the game in the stadium.
Had mih tv on loud an then ah here noise like chair moving an ting next ting is Bakr sitting down next Dominic Kallipersad talking about how he now take control for the country's sake. A little later he come back on with the other TV man (ah cyar remember he name for some reason but he was head of news). Behind them ah man walking around with what look like ah 1942 SLR on he shoulder like if he is ah starboy.

Anyhow things deteriorate after that, shooting , looting , curfew etc.
Mih good pardner who was living with his 2 young kids at Woodford st call mih an tell mih it have men in his driveway with guns and they tell him stay inside, next day it was soldiers and bullets zinging left an right (in fact he hold up the phone for mih to here). They eventually got out of there on the Sunday.

Ah lose a good friend in that time as a direct result of the coup.
Mih pardner spend all night in a curfew party in Cricketwicket an next morning when he was going home he fall asleep whilst driving over the Lady Young and dive of the cliff and died
Ah want de woman on de bass

Offline Tallman

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2007, 03:22:36 PM »
Ah see it have one by Raoul Pantin named Days of Wrath: The 1990 Coup in Trinidad and Tobago
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Offline dcs

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2007, 04:33:20 PM »
Ah see it have one by Raoul Pantin named Days of Wrath: The 1990 Coup in Trinidad and Tobago

look like that one was published this year. I wonder if them thing in the NALIS librarires....can't seem to access the catalogs online.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2007, 04:37:41 PM by dcs »

Offline dinho

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2008, 04:52:20 PM »
Reading with Raoul   

http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/article_opinion?id=161293287

Friday, March 14th 2008


   

Riveted, I was reading Raoul Pantin's recently published book, Days of Wrath, his eye-witness account of the 1990 coup attempt, when I had to put it down and stare into the distance, having just read the following:

We had watched them, over the past 24 hours, assemble in groups, taking their turns at the elaborate Muslim prayer rituals. Men on their knees in prayer one minute, wielding automatic rifles and shotguns the next.

I felt the old Imam and perhaps Bakr himself and some of his closest companions probably shared the 'faith', and took its contradictions in stride. But when I looked more closely at some of the younger gunmen around me, I saw and sensed something else.

"How old are you?" I asked one young man guarding a corridor, the huge gun in his hand almost bigger than he was. He looked up at me, quickly dropping eyes.

He smiled sheepishly and lied:

"Seventeen."

If he was 15, he was plenty. And looking at this boy, a child really, I was certainly old enough to be both his father and grandfather. I suddenly felt a great sadness overwhelm me.

I felt we, the larger society, were responsible for his generation, responsible for his anger and even his despair. We had failed him-all these little boys with guns in their hands and their faith in this cause.

It came to me that we hadn't harnessed their idealism, all that youthful energy and enthusiasm and capacity to believe in something larger and grander than themselves. But Bakr had. Like a kind of modern-day Fagan, with an AK-47 in hand, Bakr had.

For in this boy, as among other younger gunmen all around me, I saw poverty, a lack of education and skills as the root of the problem. I saw unemployed and unemployable, without the means of earning an income as the weed that choked their spirits. I saw hopelessness and disillusionment replaced by the Bakr-taught ideals of Islam. This little boy could not have been more than 15 years old.

He, so many others like him, had probably been roaming the streets, foraging for food, ducking the police, getting involved in petty crime. And then he found himself down at the mosque at No 1 Mucurapo Road being offered food, shelter, hope, a faith, a wife or four, a gun.

The gun was important.

A couple nights later, Bakr would order the gunmen to stack their guns at night, and they'd do that. They stacked all the guns together in the middle of the room, except for the guns in the hands of the men on guard duty.

But this little boy lying next to me on the floor wouldn't stack his gun; instead he lay there, cradling the gun in his arms.

"You didn't hear the man or what?" I said to him. "He wants the guns stacked up."

"Not this gun!" the little boy whispered fiercely. "This gun is my freedom!"

By the time you read this, I would have returned to Raoul's terrifying TTT experience but, at the time of this particular reading, what stopped me in my tracks was not the then, but the now-my mind reeling over how the essence of scenario the journalist had unfolded was being replayed, even as I read, so many teenagers east, west, north and south of where I sat reading, believing that the gun was their pathway to freedom.

I sat there, thinking, last Wednesday night, about exactly what Raoul's 15-year-old meant-whether he meant he would be able to use the gun to shoot his way out should the soldiers outside come blasting in? Hardly likely, since the likelihood was that the soldiers would have shot him dead possibly even before he could get a single shot off. So what was this gun freedom that boy-child was talking about?

And, then, I thought of all those gun children whose pictures we keep seeing in the papers, either killed or having killed and I thought, too, that they, too, had seen in the gun that they had bought, stolen or borrowed, a means of liberation, their contemporaries living in and around me in Laventille, feeling that mere gun-possession put them notches above everybody else.

I have this idea that I am saying this badly and that whomever is reading is reading into my writing the view that having the gun gives these young boy holders the freedom to rob and kill and, yes, there are those gunderilitos who use the guns they have to do that, but it is not just that or even mainly that. It is that having a gun, in their minds, somehow gives them a value that they didn't think they had without it.

And as I keep thinking about that, as I weave my way through the vale of tears (our tears!) that is Raoul's remarkable, head of the class, reportage, I fear I am hurrying to the conclusion that the cracks that Abu Bakr saw and used have only widened since, the papers replete with links between the failed but amnesty-freed insurrectionists of 1990 and the gangland gangrene that has set in today, and it is all I can do to prevent myself from simply giving up all as lost and dropping on my knees to pray.

Raoul, though, is sure to remind me that our lot is to watch and write, if only to help those who come after to understand what really happened here-all the outstanding money talk, jet talk and, yes, jam and wining talk, notwithstanding.
         

Offline WestCoast

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2008, 05:49:44 PM »
The two most important paragraphs in my opinion....
"I have this idea that I am saying this badly and that whomever is reading is reading into my writing the view that having the gun gives these young boy holders the freedom to rob and kill and, yes, there are those gunderilitos who use the guns they have to do that, but it is not just that or even mainly that. It is that having a gun, in their minds, somehow gives them a value that they didn't think they had without it."
this is very moving indeed..and obviously, Bakr had to have realised.

"And as I keep thinking about that, as I weave my way through the vale of tears (our tears!) that is Raoul's remarkable, head of the class, reportage, I fear I am hurrying to the conclusion that the cracks that Abu Bakr saw and used have only widened since, the papers replete with links between the failed but amnesty-freed insurrectionists of 1990 and the gangland gangrene that has set in today, and it is all I can do to prevent myself from simply giving up all as lost and dropping on my knees to pray."
When will these cracks ever heal?
« Last Edit: March 14, 2008, 05:53:43 PM by WestCoast »
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
Lord Chesterfield
(1694 - 1773)

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2008, 04:57:51 AM »
Quote
He, so many others like him, had probably been roaming the streets, foraging for food, ducking the police, getting involved in petty crime. And then he found himself down at the mosque at No 1 Mucurapo Road being offered food, shelter, hope, a faith, a wife or four, a gun.

However, the supposition here isn't helpful.

Offline dinho

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2008, 11:55:48 AM »
18 years to the day today.
         

Offline TriniCana

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #26 on: July 27, 2008, 12:56:01 PM »
look at how time pass....18 years already.
all i remembered was my brother and i dressing to go to the stadium to watch a football match..(cyah remember who was playing - but we were late). My brother happened to put on dey TV for the news and saw this muslim man sitting down where Dominic Kalipersad 'suppose' to be sitting and Dominic standing next to him with arms folded.
First thing my brother said was 'ay ay like is ah new drama show coming out'  sigh

i only saw one newspaper mentioned the date by an interview with Robinson.

after 18 years, do you think Trinidad and Tobago, meaning the average man and business owners recovered financially and emotionally ??
« Last Edit: July 27, 2008, 12:59:42 PM by TriniCana »

Offline dcs

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #27 on: July 27, 2008, 01:57:40 PM »
after 18 years, do you think Trinidad and Tobago, meaning the average man and business owners recovered financially and emotionally ??

We have nothing official on the actual events or the repercussions.  I believe we supposed to be commemorating (mourning) the anniversary of the event every 5 years instead of every year...so the leaders say.

Offline dinho

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Re: Jihad in Trinidad and Tobago, July 27, 1990
« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2008, 11:20:29 PM »
look at how time pass....18 years already.
all i remembered was my brother and i dressing to go to the stadium to watch a football match..(cyah remember who was playing - but we were late). My brother happened to put on dey TV for the news and saw this muslim man sitting down where Dominic Kalipersad 'suppose' to be sitting and Dominic standing next to him with arms folded.
First thing my brother said was 'ay ay like is ah new drama show coming out'  sigh

i only saw one newspaper mentioned the date by an interview with Robinson.

after 18 years, do you think Trinidad and Tobago, meaning the average man and business owners recovered financially and emotionally ??

Trinidad vs Jamaica Shell C aribbean Cup Final
Ah want de woman on de bass

 

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