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Author Topic: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???  (Read 7694 times)

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Offline Pasdah Beatz

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #30 on: March 08, 2008, 07:46:27 AM »
Personally BM its personally due to their relationship with Jack Warner. The lack of BALLS (no pun intended) to deal with the issues concerning management and players. Jack say jump they jump and then ask how high. I also have a problem with Lincoln phillips. I think for Trinidad football to grown get rid of those managers without BALLS

Offline Coop's

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2008, 10:25:20 AM »
Personally BM its personally due to their relationship with Jack Warner. The lack of BALLS (no pun intended) to deal with the issues concerning management and players. Jack say jump they jump and then ask how high. I also have a problem with Lincoln phillips. I think for Trinidad football to grown get rid of those managers without BALLS
         I agree with you to get rid of those managers without balls but can you give me the name of one manager with balls in T&T Football.

Offline Fantastic

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2008, 12:13:09 PM »
Corneal has done good things.......some of de time. He has also done lots of unethical, thiefing, bad mind, arrogant, ignorant things. He has a hot temper....which has gotten him into numerous dicey situations over the years and shows respect for people only when he feels like it. I don't begrudge him for being a businessman and hustling opportunities like many other Trinis do, I just have 1st hand knowledge of alot of the things he has done to profit himself that have been really unfair to others. All said, I still do not hate de man or his son who I see as trying to do a professional job regardless of how de opportunities have come about.
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Offline Ponnoxx

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2008, 12:17:10 PM »
People dislike the Corneals because of the friend-friend selection and poor results despite badmouthing everyone else. I also think that is partly their fault because the abusing the power they got, but I think other coaches are to blame for not getting proper certification. I think their are loads of coaches who can do a great job at the National level however they need to be certified like the Corneals in order to compete with them for the job. Jan Steadman for instance literally create a legacy for Naps. He produce a team in 1999 that is probably the most consistent and fit I have seen in recent years. Mind You I doh like Naps eh(In Future If my son make a mistake and say he want to go Naps instead of Pres is licks ;D)....Anyhow I think their are coaches that could relate to players and get the right stuff out of them...Corneal and dem fellas feel they does shit ice cream and could treat players anyhow....Lemme tell you if a local coach with good charisma and have the know how on the level of fitness and technique our players need...I think we will flourish as a Football Nation....That is why I think TTFF should provide such ventures for local coaches to go outside and educate themselves...anyhow that is another story...Go T&T !!!

Offline Big Magician

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2008, 05:18:49 PM »
thanks all.......
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Offline GunnerStunner

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2008, 06:07:43 PM »
because culturally we hate to hear self truths,
feel we know it all,
and fight down anyone with a different view which more than likely is a better one

Offline JDB

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2008, 07:20:51 PM »
People doh like Jack and anything remotely related tuh Jack becomes verboten...whether he wrong or right...is de same tired 'jackula' or 'tie tongue tief' comments...yadda yadda yadda.  Same becomes true of those associated with Jack.  I hear man say that Alvin sell out tuh get wuk with Jack/FIFA.  Did Lincoln Phillips sell out too?  Maybe he and Alvin sell out...maybe they didn't, but too often men are too quick to think in terms of absolutes when it comes to the TTFF and the people affiliated with it.

Except that is not the case in this situation. I was the one who use the term sell out and it is not based on merely being affiliated with Jack. I know people who get licks for being associated with Jack who I respect dearly so I am very mindful of guilt by association.

The situations of Corneal and Lincoln are very different. Lincoln only return to the local scene recently and has been more working around Jack than for him. So much so that Jack has been critical of Lincoln's role.

Corneal used to be a vocal critic of Jack because it served his own agenda but as Jack became the consummate FIFA power broker and a millionaire football team owner Corneal has decided to come on board. Maybe sell out is a bad term because he was for himself before and is still for himself, which is the general criticism. He just decide, or realize, that the best way to serve himself is to be Jack's ally as opposed to his adversary.

Personally I am not one for the broad demonization of Jack. "Tie tongue tief" and "Jackula" are terms that I have never used to describe the man. When I criticize the man it is on things that are self evident, lack of professionalism, poor management, horrible accounting practices, an autocratic style that does not allow for new ideas etc. I never even accuse the man of stealing money because I can't prove that. For all we know the money just get wasted in typical administrative largesse. So this is not an example of not liking things because they are related to Jack.
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Offline ZANDOLIE

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2008, 08:05:26 PM »

Personally I am not one for the broad demonization of Jack. "Tie tongue tief" and "Jackula" are terms that I have never used to describe the man. When I criticize the man it is on things that are self evident, lack of professionalism, poor management, horrible accounting practices, an autocratic style that does not allow for new ideas etc. I never even accuse the man of stealing money because I can't prove that. For all we know the money just get wasted in typical administrative largesse. So this is not an example of not liking things because they are related to Jack.


That is a very thoughtful and fair-minded critique. However repeated transgressions of lack of professionalism, poor management and horrible accounting practices combined with a lack of transparency and autocracy sends a strong "bobol" signal to the casual and not-so casual onlooker. That includes ordinary citizens, politicians and journalists. To not steal money when one could steal it, in large quantities to boot, or profit from one's position vis-a-vis things like ticket sale etc, in the face of such weak governance structures would mean our Jack is an exemplary human being blessed with great moral fortitude.



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Offline WestCoast

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #38 on: March 08, 2008, 08:08:29 PM »
To not steal money when one could steal it, in large quantities to boot, or profit from one's position vis-a-vis things like ticket sale etc, in the face of such weak governance structures would mean our Jack is an exemplary human being blessed with great moral fortitude.
eeeeff ;)
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Offline Bakes

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #39 on: March 08, 2008, 08:34:07 PM »
People doh like Jack and anything remotely related tuh Jack becomes verboten...whether he wrong or right...is de same tired 'jackula' or 'tie tongue tief' comments...yadda yadda yadda.  Same becomes true of those associated with Jack.  I hear man say that Alvin sell out tuh get wuk with Jack/FIFA.  Did Lincoln Phillips sell out too?  Maybe he and Alvin sell out...maybe they didn't, but too often men are too quick to think in terms of absolutes when it comes to the TTFF and the people affiliated with it.

Except that is not the case in this situation. I was the one who use the term sell out and it is not based on merely being affiliated with Jack. I know people who get licks for being associated with Jack who I respect dearly so I am very mindful of guilt by association.

The situations of Corneal and Lincoln are very different. Lincoln only return to the local scene recently and has been more working around Jack than for him. So much so that Jack has been critical of Lincoln's role.

Corneal used to be a vocal critic of Jack because it served his own agenda but as Jack became the consummate FIFA power broker and a millionaire football team owner Corneal has decided to come on board. Maybe sell out is a bad term because he was for himself before and is still for himself, which is the general criticism. He just decide, or realize, that the best way to serve himself is to be Jack's ally as opposed to his adversary.

Personally I am not one for the broad demonization of Jack. "Tie tongue tief" and "Jackula" are terms that I have never used to describe the man. When I criticize the man it is on things that are self evident, lack of professionalism, poor management, horrible accounting practices, an autocratic style that does not allow for new ideas etc. I never even accuse the man of stealing money because I can't prove that. For all we know the money just get wasted in typical administrative largesse. So this is not an example of not liking things because they are related to Jack.


My commments weren't directed at you...frankly I didn't pay attention to who said what but in a couple posts the insinuation was there that he was critical of Jack until he recognized an opportunity to capitalize on Jack's standing in FIFA.  In your case it may not be an instance of not liking Corneal because of the association...but reading between the lines, others have implied that exact sentiment.  Can't say that I necessarily disagree...anyone who is too close to jack in the TTFF you kinda have to wonder about...but at the same time this shouldn't be the sole reason for not liking the Corneals.  As we know with LP, there are scrupulous individuals who have no choice but to shake hands with the football devil in order to push the local sport forward.  Whether this is true of the Corneals as well is a matter of conjecture.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2008, 09:10:45 PM by Bake n Shark »

Offline JDB

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #40 on: March 08, 2008, 08:46:14 PM »

Personally I am not one for the broad demonization of Jack. "Tie tongue tief" and "Jackula" are terms that I have never used to describe the man. When I criticize the man it is on things that are self evident, lack of professionalism, poor management, horrible accounting practices, an autocratic style that does not allow for new ideas etc. I never even accuse the man of stealing money because I can't prove that. For all we know the money just get wasted in typical administrative largesse. So this is not an example of not liking things because they are related to Jack.

That is a very thoughtful and fair-minded critique. However repeated transgressions of lack of professionalism, poor management and horrible accounting practices combined with a lack of transparency and autocracy sends a strong "bobol" signal to the casual and not-so casual onlooker. That includes ordinary citizens, politicians and journalists. To not steal money when one could steal it, in large quantities to boot, or profit from one's position vis-a-vis things like ticket sale etc, in the face of such weak governance structures would mean our Jack is an exemplary human being blessed with great moral fortitude.

Zando I hear yuh completely, yuh wouldn't hear me defending suspect actions. The problem is when yuh make some of the criticisms too speculative, the factual easily provable ones get tainted in the process. If we want Jack and his crew out it is better to have provable criticisms.

There is no doubt that Warner is corrupt in his dealings as a football executive. Contracts to self and family, no transparent bidding process and the ticket scandal is a case where they clearly get caught.

Problem is that in the environment of FIFA all those things are par for the course, corruption is the way that business is done.
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Offline WestCoast

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #41 on: March 08, 2008, 08:54:38 PM »
Problem is that in the environment of FIFA all those things are par for the course, corruption is the way that business is done.
Could I add a small opinion.....
Fair enough JDB, but some people say that change starts with one person.

Maybe in this case change may start with the smallest country to qualify for the world cup thus far. So that is where I hope that exposing all of the suspect dealings may lead....change...with the help of people like jennings and also FPATT. ;)
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Offline JDB

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2008, 09:04:43 PM »
Problem is that in the environment of FIFA all those things are par for the course, corruption is the way that business is done.
Could I add a small opinion.....
Fair enough JDB, but some people say that change starts with one person.

Maybe in this case change may start with the smallest country to qualify for the world cup thus far. So that is where I hope that exposing all of the suspect dealings may lead....change...with the help of people like jennings and also FPATT. ;)

Change did start with qualification.

You know what the change was?

Jack Warner deify himself as the man who take TnT to the World Cup.

He has become even more bold, arguably more powerful in FIFA (probably because he has had to show his hand his determination to bring others down if necessary), and despite the general sentiment on this board the general public does just laugh off Jack's "indiscretions".

FPATT didn't from because we make the World Cup, they form because Jack amp up his mistreatment of the players and put things into sharp focus. Jennings was also criticising Jack long time but jack's arrogant actions post qualification give him much more fodder.

I am not saying that corruption is accepted but leveling those charges against him to FIFA don't make sense because after FIFA sit down and look at the situation, he has done nothing wrong.
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Offline ZANDOLIE

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2008, 09:17:28 PM »
In my opinion the problem with Warner is that he is brazenely milking his cash cows in our faces, and we are seemingly powerless to do anything about it. That does make people real angry.

As for the Corneal's I reserve judgement on Anton. He is attempting to advance himself as an institutional coach via TTFF. For a truely talented coach I don't believe that is the right approach. I figure if our players can be big in European leagues, why can't a Trini coach a premier league team one day? But the closest thing we have now to a coach advancing themselfves from club status to national level is Shabazz.
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Offline sjahrain

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2008, 10:29:21 PM »
Alvin is just another disgruntled old man,holding on to jack warner coatails,prevnting progress and stagnating we football

I remember he telling one of my friends back in the 80`s,if he did not stop playing for Carenage United and come play for Maple he was never going to play for the under 19 team and true to his word, my friend did not make the team

That man sad and bad mind from a long time
Can you tell me when he scored a centry for Trinidad I cannot recall that one

Offline Trininho

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #45 on: March 08, 2008, 11:03:13 PM »
Can you tell me when he scored a centry for Trinidad I cannot recall that one

He scored 123 against Guyana in 68/69 and 103 not out against Jamaica in 69/70.

Offline Jahyouth

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #46 on: March 09, 2008, 09:10:57 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level?  Anyone have an answer?  BM?

If so, how successful was he?


Offline Trininho

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #47 on: March 09, 2008, 02:20:31 PM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

Offline Midknight

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #48 on: March 09, 2008, 03:25:34 PM »
the only thing I hate about the Corneal's is Alvin commentating and the way he fight down Beenhakker Birchall et al...

What I must say is that they're an easy target. Alvin represents in his own way, everything that is wrong with TNT (you could make a parallel with politics/politicians in TNT). In a small society with very little history, you have one man who been around (it seems) since rock of ages was a pebble, who have a disproprotional influence in his domain, and who through the (perceived) strings he has been able to pull for his son (who has since also achieved quite a bit in the domain) is building some sort of a dynasty...

Very easy to pull 'hate' on that alone Now I am sure you will probably find that most people in Trini don't have a problem with nepotism unless it not beneffiting them, but that is besides the point... I'm sure if you add some of his questionable criticism of other coaches, his treatment of other players/coaches, his yesmanism towards Jack etc etc that is sufficient motivation.
Anton is mostly collateral damage...
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Offline frico

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #49 on: March 09, 2008, 05:01:00 PM »
I am sorry about the what I posted on 07-03-08 about Alvin Corneal,it was stupid and I am very sorry.

Offline freakazoid

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #50 on: March 09, 2008, 06:12:37 PM »
I am sorry about the what I posted on 07-03-08 about Alvin Corneal,it was stupid and I am very sorry.

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Offline fishs

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #51 on: March 10, 2008, 01:54:40 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

What biased about it star ? Is a CV, what your CV like ? Unbiased ?
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Offline fishs

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #52 on: March 10, 2008, 01:59:52 AM »

 All the people in here who saying dey ent like Corneal about this or that or they friend or cousin say so jus full of .....

 Come out plain and say " mih blood jus ent take him" or whatever other irrational prejudiced reason and stop trying to come up with nonsense to justify.

 And for those that doh like him because FIFA does pay him and that imply that Jack is his sponsor , well think about all the hundreds of people that working for Jack and the thousands that he probably sponsored also and by extention yuh have to hate or dislike them too. Trinidad is a small place it probably have family in dey.
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Offline Trininho

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #53 on: March 10, 2008, 06:41:41 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

What biased about it star ? Is a CV, what your CV like ? Unbiased ?

Hence the parentheses.

Offline fishs

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #54 on: March 10, 2008, 07:10:49 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

What biased about it star ? Is a CV, what your CV like ? Unbiased ?

Hence the parentheses.


What difference that make ? This whole thread is almost full fledged character assasination based on all kind of 2nd and 3rd hand experience real or unreal and seta smartass innuendoes
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Offline Trininho

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #55 on: March 10, 2008, 08:59:39 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

What biased about it star ? Is a CV, what your CV like ? Unbiased ?

Hence the parentheses.


What difference that make ? This whole thread is almost full fledged character assasination based on all kind of 2nd and 3rd hand experience real or unreal and seta smartass innuendoes

Fishs, I used his CV to give a factual basis of his accomplishments, around which we can build a discussion. The whole point was to present a balanced view of his history, and not simply engage in "character assassination". I actually hold both Corneals in high regard based on their accomplishments, if you consider my original post of this thread.

At the same time like all CV's, including mine, it puts a positive spin on things.  It presents only one side of the coin.  A man cannot be judged by his CV alone.  That's why when we apply for a job, we require both personal and professional references. That's why I used the word "biased", which now I see was naive and redundant.

Fishs, I apologize if my contribution to this thread has degenerated into something that has offended you.

Offline Jahyouth

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #56 on: March 10, 2008, 09:05:29 AM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.

Note that I asked about ANTON, not Alvin Corneal.

Let me ask again. 

Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Offline Bakes

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #57 on: March 10, 2008, 10:29:17 AM »


Fishs, I apologize if my contribution to this thread has degenerated into something that has offended you.
You ent have nutten to apologize for in my book...I doh see the "character assassination" that Fishs talking about.  A solid 80-90% of what has been contributed is information that is either already in the public domain or information that is readily available.  The other contributions have been personal anecdotes.  If their public record casts aspersions on their characters then so be it.  If their private dealings with individuals on here casts aspersions on their characters then so be it. 

How much 'character assassination' Warner, Camps, Manning et al have been subjected to on here? Fishs ah really eh understand whey yuh coming from on this one at all dred.

Offline Rodney

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #58 on: March 10, 2008, 03:51:40 PM »
Hate is a very strong word, but with regard to his football activities I have to say I am in the 'Dislike Alvin Corneal Camp'. My opinion on Anton is very irrational as I am dubious about Anton purely because he seems to have very close football links with his father.......who I dislike! He did a good job with the U-17's, but his U-20 stint was poor so I need to see more success at something before I have a truly positive opinion about him.

Why do I dislike Alvin Corneal? (Please remember it's a personal opinion!) While growing up in T&T I always found him to be a very negatively opinionated individual, always seemed to know better than the coach on the field, they never seemed to be able to do anything right. At first I thought little of it as you expect that from so called 'subject matter experts' hired by the media, it's their job after all. Through meh Dad's job I occasionally attended functions where I managed to experience the guy in person. He always gave me the impression of a person who thinks quite a lot of himself, his achievements and (perceived) experience. That ain't so bad in itself, but he also gave the impression of a person that gives lip-service to the opinions of others unless your views are in-tune with how he views things. People like that have always riled me. No matter what your line of work is, If you have ever worked with a person like that you will understand why I have always found it difficult to stomach the guy ever since.

I have great respect for Lincoln and Gally and even Bertile. Their achievements are tangible, Lincoln (correct me if I'm wrong) is our most successful local coach to ply his trade in foreign football (ASL/NASL), Gally was the first local coach to produce a genuinely competitive (and mostly local) national team. Bertile, considering his playing CV is not as impressive as Mr.Corneal, has achieved much more success in the international arena. I know what they have done and I've seen documented records to back it up what I haven't. All I have for Alvin Corneal is his CV and some very average national team performances.

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Re: Why do we HATE The Corneals ???
« Reply #59 on: March 10, 2008, 04:15:37 PM »
Has Anton Corneal ever coached a senior team at the club level? Anyone have an answer? BM?

If so, how successful was he?

Check out his CV at this link:
http://alvinacorneal.com/biographymore.html

This shows a very comprehensive (though biased) history of Alvin.


Ah wonder if he pick he wife because she name started with A?