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Author Topic: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately  (Read 14838 times)

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Offline Bakes

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2008, 07:29:25 PM »
Yall laughing and shit...The game can get canceled if this not resolved

.....and..... ???

And?  are you kidding me....How embarrassing it would be on a world stage...De TTFF , Government ,Nation... we will all look like jokers ...



I have to remind myself that you still young...and naive to even think this game anywhere close to getting cancelled.

Offline WestCoast

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2008, 07:35:18 PM »
Yes, you may be right, this could get troubling as the fee was agreed to, now the government increased the fee. The Govt cant act like Jack now

There was no prior fee agreed to... the arrangement Lalla is referring to is the fact that the gov't has been charging them a standard fee the past twenty years, so his argument is that the prior business dealings between them have established a set fee.  In reliance upon this fee (it is argued) that the TTFF budgeted what their expenses would be for hosting the event.

The Ministry of Sport could easily counter that the costs for this particular game has made it necessary to increase the rental fee...besides, it's imprudent to expect fees to stay the same for as long as 20 yrs, let alone beyond.  Even so, if you ask me $150,000 (given how much the TTFF is projected to rake in) still seems quite a bargain.
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Offline Victor

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2008, 07:36:43 PM »
Source: Trinidad Guardian

BY FRANCIS JOSEPH

THE international friendly dubbed A Score to Settle between T&T and England scheduled for June 1 is now in jeopardy.

This is because of a new dispute between the Minister of Sport Gary Hunt and the T&T Football Federation (TTFF) over the use of the Hasely Crawford Stadium.

The Minister of Sport has submitted a new draft lease agreement for the use of the stadium. But this has not gone down well with the TTFF, who insists there was a binding agreement made on March 15 that the TTFF used to negotiate for the June 1 encounter with the English Football Association (FA).

Lawyers acting for the TTFF have given the Minister of Sport until Friday morning to resolve this matter, failing which they intend to take the matter to the High Court to seek injunctive relief.

The cancellation of the T&T vs England match could also lead to legal action being taken by the English FA for losses incurred, sources said last night.

The match was organised to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the TTFF, and the healing of wounds between FIFA vice president Jack Warner and the English FA over comments made last year.

‘Same terms’

Om Lalla, attorney for the TTFF, in a three-page letter to the Minister of Sport yesterday pointed out that his client approached the Ministry by letter dated February 18 requesting the use of the stadium for the England match.

Lalla said a written response, dated March 11, was received from stadium manager Wilfred Stephen agreeing to the use of the facilities subject to the rescheduling of certain events at the stadium.

The TTFF, he added, was also informed that the rental charges would be forwarded at a later date.

TTFF general secretary Richard Groden met with Stephen on March 15 when it was agreed that the stadium was available for use by the TTFF and the only issue to be agreed upon was the rental cost.

Lalla said Stephen agreed that the terms of the rental of the stadium would be the same terms on which the TTFF had rented the stadium over the past 20 years for national and international matches.

The Guardian was informed that, in recent years, the TTFF was called upon to pay a rental of $3,000 plus VAT or ten per cent of the gate receipts, whichever sum was greater, plus $2,000 and VAT for electricity.

Having received oral confirmation, Groden entered into an agreement on behalf of the TTFF with the English FA on March 17 for the hosting of the game at the stadium.

According to Lalla, the terms and conditions of the agreement dealt with the use of the stadium for the purposes of advertising, tickets and access.

He said the TTFF also hosted officials of the English FA to the stadium in March and conducted an examination of the facility.

Lalla, in his letter, said the TTFF sent a letter dated April 12 requesting a waiver of the fees agreed to in March for the use of the stadium. He said the local federation withdrew the request by letter dated May 5 due to a lack of co-operation from the Minister.

‘Markedly different’

Lalla said the TTFF executive was shocked to receive a draft lease agreement from Stephen on May 15. He said the draft lease agreement contained terms and conditions that were markedly different to those agreed upon at previous meetings.

The Ministry of Sport, in a media release yesterday, said among the conditions contained in the draft lease agreement were:

n a rental sum of $150,000 plus VAT or ten per cent of the gross gate receipts, whichever sum was greater;

n a refundable deposit of $45,000 towards damage;

n provision of advertising space, at a cost, within the television arc; and,

n prohibition of alcohol and tobacco advertising.

Lalla said Groden sent off a letter yesterday to the Minister seeking an urgent determination of this matter. The TTFF attorney reminded Hunt that the contract entered between the parties on March 15, was binding.

“To renege therefrom would amount not only to a breach of contract, but will have serious consequences of loss, embarrassment and liability to my client,” he said.

“My client agreed to use the facilities of the national stadium solely on the basis of the agreement entered into on or about the 15th of March 2008.

“This 11th-hour draft release, which does not reflect the agreement between your Ministry and our client, with less than ten days before the scheduled game, is not only disingenuous, but will cause irreparable damage to the reputation of the TTFF and subject each and every citizen of T&T to shame and humiliation and will result in a breach of contract with the English FA and may result in a cancellation of the match.”

Lalla said the TTFF advertised and sold tickets locally and internationally for the match.

The Port-of-Spain attorney reminded Hunt that the match was scheduled to be televised worldwide.

“As a consequence, it is imperative that personal and political differences are buried at this crucial hour and the joint efforts of your Ministry and our client are mobilised in the national interest,” Lalla wrote.

Ban on alcohol ads baffles Carib
Colin Murray, sponsorship and events manager at Carib, said his company had entered into an agreement with the TTFF for billboard and other advertising at the stadium.

As the official beer of the match, Murray said Carib had no agreement with the Ministry of Sport.

He could not understand the prohibition of alcohol advertising at the stadium, saying Heineken and Carling featured prominently in the English Premiership, while other alcohol companies were main sponsors for sport around the world.

Warner: No more matches at stadium
FIFA vice president Jack Warner said last night the T&T-England match on June 1 would be the last international game at the Hasely Crawford Stadium.

Commenting on the sudden increase in rental at the stadium, Warner said Minister of Sport Gary Hunt wanted to put his back to the wall, “but he cannot do that; I am going after him, mark my words.”

Warner said the last sports minister Roger Boynes had waived the fees at the stadium for the World Cup qualifying matches for the 2006 campaign.

“Look at what this minister has done,” Warner said.

“He has asked for a rental of $150,000 or ten per cent of the gate receipts.

“This match is costing us $15 million. We have sold $7.8 million in tickets, that means he wants $780,000 for the rental of the stadium.

“Where is the rest of the money going to come from?”

Warner said the Ministry was charging $10,000 for each of the 32 advertising billboards within the television arc and $5,000 for other advertising.

“We agreed for the English FA to come with six boards, what are we to do now?” he asked.

Offline dcs

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2008, 07:41:38 PM »

I doh think the issue is over the fee. It is probably more over the advertizing space.

4 years of war....how is this going to affect our qualifying effort.

Offline kentsoulman

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2008, 07:43:52 PM »
Just an observation, but if the govt has been charging the same fee for 20 years, how the hell can the stadium be maintained satisfactorily?

Gary Hunt has come in and decided that sport should be run professionally. For 20 years TTFF have been increasing ticket prices, yet paying the same rent. Which means Jack makes the money while taxpayers subsidise TTFF.

I sense this is a move to antagonise Jack, but, lets face it, its about time he got his cumuppance. TTFF will still make money. Maybe, at last, Jack has found his nemesis?

Regardless of timing or the effects on the England match, you guys should see a new dawn on the horizon. Twice in two days Jack has got a bloodied nose.

The war is going nuclear!

Offline kentsoulman

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2008, 07:54:56 PM »
Silly me, but isn't  The Guardian was informed that, in recent years, the TTFF was called upon to pay a rental of $3,000 plus VAT or ten per cent of the gate receipts, whichever sum was greater, plus $2,000 and VAT for electricity.

the same as "He has asked for a rental of $150,000 or ten per cent of the gate receipts.

“This match is costing us $15 million. We have sold $7.8 million in tickets, that means he wants $780,000 for the rental of the stadium.


Ok, the initial figure is lower, but the 10% rule would apply either way. So Jacks really arguing about advertising. Now I have to admit, I've been to over 30 English matches this season and I do't remember any pitchside alcohol advertisements. Sponsorships such as the Carling Cup, yes, but no product adverts pitchside.

Personally, in this instance, if I was Hunt, I would waive the advertising fees for this game and take the $780,000.

Offline dcs

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2008, 08:10:34 PM »

Wonder if there was advertising with Carib prior to this....

all this is foolishness

Offline Eldo man

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #37 on: May 20, 2008, 08:13:20 PM »
Wazza,
            I don't care who feel embarassed. The world eh care about TT football anyhow. We need to rectify our football admin. once and for all. As much as I want this game to play, it it take embarassment to straighten out, so be it.

Deeks boy.....I second that.

Offline ckhan

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #38 on: May 20, 2008, 08:42:01 PM »
Oral agreement again?????....LOLOLOLOL

This is one heck of a time to pull off this updated change, 2 weeks before game time!!!!! Are you blasted kidding?????  I don't mind the gov't getting their fair share but 2 weeks dread???  What de hell?????  Its like two cars heading towards each other playing chicken, which one will back down first??? 

Anyhow, if this Stadium thing is not resolved, would the game move to de oval?
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Offline kandi_tt

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2008, 08:44:33 PM »
ticket for sale!!!

lookinh like i go watch it off ah feed on ah projector screen in kanditown...
iNnOcEnT aNd UnInFoRmEd...

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #40 on: May 20, 2008, 08:46:45 PM »
ticket for sale!!!

lookinh like i go watch it off ah feed on ah projector screen in kanditown...

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Offline Midknight

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #41 on: May 20, 2008, 08:56:45 PM »
My word. Jack hagging over the validity and binding nature of a ORAL contract. My goodness.

Dat is the first thing I see.

Is 5 am, I ent have the energy to read all the details, but from what I see, de government moving real dirty, but they have a convincing argument. If TTFF didn't batten down the hatches before budgetting, that is their problem.

Smelling blood is joke...Is a damn abbatoir we dealing with.
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Offline Bakes

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #42 on: May 20, 2008, 09:02:10 PM »
Oral agreement again?????....LOLOLOLOL

This is one heck of a time to pull off this updated change, 2 weeks before game time!!!!! Are you blasted kidding?????  I don't mind the gov't getting their fair share but 2 weeks dread???  What de hell?????  Its like two cars heading towards each other playing chicken, which one will back down first??? 

Anyhow, if this Stadium thing is not resolved, would the game move to de oval?

Is 5 am, I ent have the energy to read all the details, but from what I see, de government moving real dirty, but they have a convincing argument. If TTFF didn't batten down the hatches before budgetting, that is their problem.

Smelling blood is joke...Is a damn abbatoir we dealing with.

All ah allyuh who having issues with the timing and who feel the gov't moving 'dirty'...


Did allyuh NOT read about the state of the HC stadium just a couple months ago? 

Where do you suppose money was to come from to make the upgrades?

Why do you feel that the gov't could have come up with an earlier cost projection, which to factor into the lease terms?

Should the gov't even factor in the new costs...or should they continue to hand over the facilities to the TFF for baubles and trinkets?
« Last Edit: May 20, 2008, 09:04:03 PM by Bake n Shark »

Offline Midknight

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #43 on: May 20, 2008, 09:05:26 PM »
Is 5 am, I ent have the energy to read all the details, but from what I see, de government moving real dirty, but they have a convincing argument. If TTFF didn't batten down the hatches before budgetting, that is their problem.

Smelling blood is joke...Is a damn abbatoir we dealing with.

All ah allyuh who having issues with the timing and who feel the gov't moving 'dirty'...

Did allyuh NOT read about the state of the HC stadium just a couple months ago? 

Where do you suppose money was to come from to make the upgrades?

Why do you feel that the gov't could have come up with an earlier cost projection, which to factor into the lease terms?

Should the gov't even factor in the new costs...or should they continue to hand over the facilities for baubles and trinkets?
Quote

You're taking my quote out of context. By 'dirty' I mean they playing hardball,not necessarily insinuating is a bad or unnecessary thing. Is 5am, as I said. Doh blame me if the expression kinda sketchy.
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Offline WestCoast

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #44 on: May 20, 2008, 09:08:59 PM »
The Minister of Sport had to start some time to bring the whole process up to date and I believe that he is doing the right thing.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2008, 09:23:18 PM by WestCoast »
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Offline weary1969

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #45 on: May 20, 2008, 09:14:14 PM »
Kent u hit d nail on d head no wonder d stadium in a mess dey pay 1988 fees.
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Offline Bakes

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #46 on: May 20, 2008, 09:15:50 PM »
You're taking my quote out of context. By 'dirty' I mean they playing hardball,not necessarily insinuating is a bad or unnecessary thing. Is 5am, as I said. Doh blame me if the expression kinda sketchy.

I see whey yuh say "they have a very convincing argument"... but yeah 'dirty' kinda carries connotations that they acting less than fair.  I can't sit here and say for sure that it took them two months to come up with proper costs...but I can see it taking that long for a number of reasons.  construing the events in a light most favorable to the TTFF...let's not forget that this is TnT we talking about after all, with it's serpentine bureaucracy.

Offline ckhan

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #47 on: May 20, 2008, 09:21:49 PM »
I am
You're taking my quote out of context. By 'dirty' I mean they playing hardball,not necessarily insinuating is a bad or unnecessary thing. Is 5am, as I said. Doh blame me if the expression kinda sketchy.

I see whey yuh say "they have a very convincing argument"... but yeah 'dirty' kinda carries connotations that they acting less than fair.  I can't sit here and say for sure that it took them two months to come up with proper costs...but I can see it taking that long for a number of reasons.  construing the events in a light most favorable to the TTFF...let's not forget that this is TnT we talking about after all, with it's serpentine bureaucracy.


I am glad you said that B'n'S, because we all should know who we are dealing with.  Mine word, for twenty years you have been paying the same fees and now you decide to clean up....NOW!!! Nah, this is a little too coincidential.
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Offline ckhan

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #48 on: May 20, 2008, 09:24:26 PM »
ps...at least "grandfather" the TTF into the this change and not drop it just so.  I am not a fan of TTFF practices but the gov't could have moved differently on this one.
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Offline weary1969

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #49 on: May 20, 2008, 09:26:32 PM »
Y because we playin d Mother Country?
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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #50 on: May 20, 2008, 09:30:31 PM »
thief from thief does make God laugh.

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Offline Bakes

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #51 on: May 20, 2008, 10:30:33 PM »

I am glad you said that B'n'S, because we all should know who we are dealing with.  Mine word, for twenty years you have been paying the same fees and now you decide to clean up....NOW!!! Nah, this is a little too coincidential.

Coincidental?  How so?  Hunt has signaled from early that he plans on doing things much differently than in the past.  Even if we are to construe this as a tit for tat situation...let's not lose sight of who fired the first salvo by their refusal to make themselves accountable for the public money given to them by the gov't.

Nothing happens in a vacuum.

Offline just cool

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #52 on: May 20, 2008, 11:04:36 PM »
Yall laughing and shit...The game can get canceled if this not resolved

.....and..... ???

And?  are you kidding me....How embarrassing it would be on a world stage...De TTFF , Government ,Nation... we will all look like jokers ...


Again ?!!!! did i miss somthing!! when did we stop being jokers ?!!!  this don't happen in the UK, or the US. only in ah banana republic.  do the math.
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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #53 on: May 21, 2008, 04:35:45 AM »
Yall laughing and shit...The game can get canceled if this not resolved

.....and..... ???

And?  are you kidding me....How embarrassing it would be on a world stage...De TTFF , Government ,Nation... we will all look like jokers ...



....first dis game going to play....doh worry....

second....Jackula/TTFF are already an embarrasment to our football......stay dey and feel the world eh done alerted to how much of an embarrasment de TTFF and Jackula in particular are for us....
please note....the English fans are boycotting dis game over statements the Special Advisor made about their football....dey done see through he and his attempt to play politics with this game......

If only we Trinbagonians could see through de smoke screen too and boycott de blasted game too!!!....however since dat goh happen when pigs fly.....me and mih black juzzy will have to make do!!!...
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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #54 on: May 21, 2008, 04:41:13 AM »

I am glad you said that B'n'S, because we all should know who we are dealing with.  Mine word, for twenty years you have been paying the same fees and now you decide to clean up....NOW!!! Nah, this is a little too coincidential.

Coincidental?  How so?  Hunt has signaled from early that he plans on doing things much differently than in the past.  Even if we are to construe this as a tit for tat situation...let's not lose sight of who fired the first salvo by their refusal to make themselves accountable for the public money given to them by the gov't.

Nothing happens in a vacuum.
ya Know BnS,
it really amazes me HOW quick some forget Jackulas antics.

What I would ask everyone is to imagine HOW successful TnT football would really be if Jackula and his underlings Picked the BEST players and not their favorites as I have been told that Cornmeals love to do.
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
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Offline ckhan

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #55 on: May 21, 2008, 06:31:01 AM »

I am glad you said that B'n'S, because we all should know who we are dealing with.  Mine word, for twenty years you have been paying the same fees and now you decide to clean up....NOW!!! Nah, this is a little too coincidential.

Coincidental? How so? Hunt has signaled from early that he plans on doing things much differently than in the past. Even if we are to construe this as a tit for tat situation...let's not lose sight of who fired the first salvo by their refusal to make themselves accountable for the public money given to them by the gov't.

Nothing happens in a vacuum.

You are right, it is a tit for tat situation and b/c of the history between these two I guess there is no right way but moreso my way of handling.  I will continue to observe.

As for WC, no one will even know how it would have been if best players would be picked b/c favourtism is the rule of the day - especially in TnT football.
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Offline ann3boys

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #56 on: May 21, 2008, 06:43:19 AM »
All of you who are venting on the TTFF have obviously not had a good look at the facts.
1. If there is a rental in place for a period of time, a landlord cannot cannot change this without notice- more than 2 weeks.
2. The condition of the stadium before this match was not the fault of the TTFF or any football playing club. It was because of the fetes for carnival, and the presidential inauguration ceremony taking place at that venue.
3. Because of 2. the responsibility and cost of cleaning up the venue rests with the landlord. The landlord cannot penalise the NEXT renter for the PREVIOUS renters' misdeeds or damage to the property. That should have been covered by their deposits.

Yes, everybody may have a bone to pick with Jack, but fair is fair, and this reeeks of political victimisation. I am sure if the TTFF knew of this increase in fees, the prices for the match would have been higher to match the higher costs.

A question: why did the govt wait until the tickets were sold out before announcing this increase?

Think about this.

Offline Bourbon

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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #57 on: May 21, 2008, 06:46:59 AM »
All of you who are venting on the TTFF have obviously not had a good look at the facts.
1. If there is a rental in place for a period of time, a landlord cannot cannot change this without notice- more than 2 weeks.
2. The condition of the stadium before this match was not the fault of the TTFF or any football playing club. It was because of the fetes for carnival, and the presidential inauguration ceremony taking place at that venue.
3. Because of 2. the responsibility and cost of cleaning up the venue rests with the landlord. The landlord cannot penalise the NEXT renter for the PREVIOUS renters' misdeeds or damage to the property. That should have been covered by their deposits.

Yes, everybody may have a bone to pick with Jack, but fair is fair, and this reeeks of political victimisation. I am sure if the TTFF knew of this increase in fees, the prices for the match would have been higher to match the higher costs.

A question: why did the govt wait until the tickets were sold out before announcing this increase?

Think about this.

I doh think you take a good look at the facts. The agreement is $150000 or 10% of gate receipts which ever is greater. The previous agreement was 2000 or 10% of gate receipts which ever is greater. In either scenario, the amount of payment would be the 10% of gate receipts. So what is so different?
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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #58 on: May 21, 2008, 06:52:15 AM »
I doh think you take a good look at the facts. The agreement is $150000 or 10% of gate receipts which ever is greater. The previous agreement was 2000 or 10% of gate receipts which ever is greater. In either scenario, the amount of payment would be the 10% of gate receipts. So what is so different?
very simple really
10% it is
Whatever you do, do it to the purpose; do it thoroughly, not superficially. Go to the bottom of things. Any thing half done, or half known, is in my mind, neither done nor known at all. Nay, worse, for it often misleads.
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Re: Government institutes levy on use of Stadium effective Immediately
« Reply #59 on: May 21, 2008, 06:52:25 AM »
Look at alot of allyuh, because allyuh game  posisbly in jeopardy  allyuh willign to suffer jack jus for one match. This is a positive move. Accountability and progressiveness seems to be the new theme. Hlaf of allyuh who anti hunt anti pnm whihc has little to do with the football itsself. well unless where jack is concerned.
From day one when hunt say allyuh have to show accountability ...he said this to all de federations mind you, all the paritsans jump up and start to talk. I dont see any of this being bad. in the long run.
trinidadians still too shortsighted in thier outlook.
Perhaps the epitome of a Trinidadian is the child in the third row class with a dark skin and crinkly plaits who looks at you out of decidedly Chinese eyes and announces herself as Jacqueline Maharaj.- Merle Hodge

 

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