Roy Keane - "Warner's a clown"

[Sando prince]

Even if you are right its not wise to call a FIFA Vice president a clown....now the poweful clown has a grudge for you that can posssibly ruin your career in the future...

Trinidadian mentality coming to the fore.

DO NOT QUESTION AUTHORITY EVEN WHEN THEY ARE WRONG

Warner publicly attacked him. Keane responded as is his right regardless of Warners position and shed a lot of light on why Yorke was withdrawn. Basically, Warner (true to form) used his authority to throw a lot of wild accusations out there in the public domain to discredit Keane, in very much the same way that he would locally. Warner seems to think the rest of the World employs the same level politics that he does...

As for men relating  this issue to Kenwyne and Carlos, it does not make sense, cause they have not retired from international football and is protected to play for their country by FIFA..Now if Keane wants to bench  them for representing their country  then yes he is arrogant and dotish cause he will never do the same with his english and irish players..

The chances of Keane doing that sort of thing to them is remote. I'm amazed people on here are even contemplating it. Drop players for representing their country? Come on.

You see its your trini mentality that have you understanding my response like u did....its not the fact that you must not question authority....This industry gives alot of power to the FIFA authorities so you have to play the game accordingly...Now calling out you boss as a clown is NOT a smart way to question him or play the game....

But Warner IS NOT Keanes boss. Warner is the vice president of an organisation that governs football on the whole. Warner CAN'T FIRE Keane. Warner DOES NOT PAY Keanes wages, neither do FIFA for that matter. Niall Quinn has that authority. The most Warner can do is slap some sort of reprimand on him and I doubt even he would get enough support from Blatter to do that.

Jesus, use your brain.

You see you not thinking.. use your brain and think before you right with emotions...Warner is not Keane most direct boss  and we know Warner cant fire him...lol...Now have you ever heard of the "chain of command"...you may work for the police and your boss may be a sargeant but who is the boss of your boss?..eventually the police commissioner is your boss too right?..now who set policies for the commisioner and the police?..Isn't it the government?..which is a different entity from the police!..so therefore the deputy head of the government entity can influence your career, you who is just a regular police corpral who does not think before you publicly criticise!..So now apply this same concept to this discussion

[Pur_Trini]

Even if you are right its not wise to call a FIFA Vice president a clown....now the poweful clown has a grudge for you that can posssibly ruin your career...
As for men relating  this issue to Kenwyne and Carlos, it does not make sense, cause they have not retired from international football and is protected to play for their country by FIFA..Now if Keane wants to bench  them for representing their country  then yes he is arrogant and dotish cause he will never do the same with his english and irish players..

Wise or unwise, Keane speak his mind on the matter and I think that is to be admired.  I'm sure he had much worse to say to JW on the 'phone.

In respect of Kenwyne and Carlos, give Keane the benefit of the doubt.  He has not sought to bench any of our players out of spite and I don't see him going down that road.  If time proves me wrong, so be it.

read my post that you have quoted again...I'm sure I said "if"...and the reason why I acknowlege that issue is because some posters before me were obviously worried about keane not letting Kenwyne and carlos rep our country..so I addressed their fear in my response (post)

Ah hear and understand yuh!  I jus saying give Keane the benefit of the doubt.

[kev]

Warner can do absolutely nothing to Keane, all he can do is make it awkward with Kenwyn & Carlos when they are injured making them fly out to go somewhere for a medical.  

Correct me if I am wrong but you don't have a strong club level in T&T in England as with the rest of Europe the power is with the club FA's not FIFA.  He gets his publicity tricks from Blatter.  

The club won't give a stuff what Warner of FIFA think, indeed it was Warners use of FIFA's letterhead that sparked this response.

There will be no recrimations on Dwight, Carlos or Kenwyn from the club on this, the only possible thing I can see is that if the players become too much hassle the club will move them on.  If your honest that won't impact Dwight, unless Carlos form improves a lot he is likely to be moved on for football reasons anyway, that will only leave Kenwyn and I am sure if a big enough offer came in he would be sold aswell.  

I will repeat again, Keane called Warner a clown this has very little to do with T&T and all to do with Warners ego.

[BlackCat]

Fifa have no power over Keane or any club team.  All they do is arrange events and set the rules.  Theres no way on this earth that Warner can effect Keane's progression in any way.  All he can do is keep making press statements.

[FF]

Fifa have no power over Keane or any club team.  All they do is arrange events and set the rules.  Theres no way on this earth that Warner can effect Keane's progression in any way.  All he can do is keep making press statements.

Thank you...

Kev too.. also superoli... and Teh venerable one...

[Sando prince]

Fifa have no power over Keane or any club team.  All they do is arrange events and set the rules.  Theres no way on this earth that Warner can effect Keane's progression in any way.  All he can do is keep making press statements.

 

You dont hink that's some power?

If their power is irrelevant then why dont the English FA say no to FIFA rules?

If FIFA was to set a policy of football games having two referees you think the FA wont adhere to that policy?...you must be joking

 FIFA has major influence of all football administrations...and who are the men who have major inputs in these decisions (we know fuh sure Warner is one of them)..and anyone with that type of power in an industry can harm the career of a club coach...its not going to be a one day battle..its more going to be like a war

[BlackCat]

Sky Sports say JW has apparently responded - trying to find it on PA sport wise.  Abusing Keane.

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

Warner is not Keane most direct boss  and we know Warner cant fire him

Changed your tune, haven't you.

Now have you ever heard of the "chain of command"

This is not the military.

...you may work for the police and your boss may be a sargeant but who is the boss of your boss?..eventually the police commissioner is your boss too right?..now who set policies for the commisioner and the police?..Isn't it the government?..which is a different entity from the police!..so therefore the deputy head of the government entity can influence your career, you who is just a regular police corpral who does not think before you publicly criticise!..So now apply this same concept to this discussion

See my previous comment.

If you're going to use examples, use some good ones.

So...the organisational and hierarchical structure of the police force and the government is the same as a football governing body? I'd laugh if it wasn't so stupid.

The roles within those examples are totally different to those within a governing body like FIFA.

Read Kevs post, basically backs up what I'm saying.

[BlackCat]

Can't find it, but Warner brought up comments about Keane turning his back on his country in World cup when he feel out with the coach Mic McCarthy.

[Sando prince]

Warner is not Keane most direct boss  and we know Warner cant fire him

Changed your tune, haven't you.

Now have you ever heard of the "chain of command"

This is not the military.

...you may work for the police and your boss may be a sargeant but who is the boss of your boss?..eventually the police commissioner is your boss too right?..now who set policies for the commisioner and the police?..Isn't it the government?..which is a different entity from the police!..so therefore the deputy head of the government entity can influence your career, you who is just a regular police corpral who does not think before you publicly criticise!..So now apply this same concept to this discussion

See my previous comment.

If you're going to use examples, use some good ones.

So...the organisational and hierarchical structure of the police force and the government is the same as a football governing body? I'd laugh if it wasn't so stupid.

The roles within those examples are totally different to those within a governing body like FIFA.

Read Kevs post, basically backs up what I'm saying.

you wrote alot but said little...go back and read my previous posts cause answering you is like saying the same thing two, three times

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

Fifa have no power over Keane or any club team.  All they do is arrange events and set the rules.  Theres no way on this earth that Warner can effect Keane's progression in any way.  All he can do is keep making press statements.

 

You dont hink that's some power?

If their power is irrelevant then why dont the English FA say no to FIFA rules?

If FIFA was to set a policy of football games having two referees you think the FA wont adhere to that policy?...you must be joking

 FIFA has major influence of all football administrations...and who are the men who have major inputs in these decisions (we know fuh sure Warner is one of them)..and anyone with that type of power in an industry can harm the career of a club coach...its not going to be a one day battle..its more going to be like a war

I've noticed as this discussion goes on your views change to avoid tackling the errors that you have made in previous posts.

and anyone with that type of power in an industry can harm the career of a club coach

You just said that 'you know that Warner can't do that' which was a contradiction of what you originally said...now where back to your original statement. Wow. See my previous post...

FIFA cannot do anything to harm Keanes career.

You fail to understand this and I don't know why.

If a manager criticises a member of a governing body and his career is harmed or ruined as a result, there would be anarchy. Around a quarter of the managers in Europe would already be unemployed as a result, by now if that were the case.

FIFA make the rules, they don't even have much of a say at European club level because UEFA governs those clubs and even they can't influence the outcome someones career at club level. They do not have any power on who gets fired at a club either. FIFA cannot do anything to Keane, neither can Warner and if they do it would be categorised as a witch hunt, besides Keane has a right to respond and say what he has to say, as does Warner. Warner can't make statements like that and NOT expect a response.

Warner accused him of 'callous' and biased against small nations. Strong words, and Keane responded in kind by putting the record straight with regards to Yorkes omission.

 

[FF]

Can't find it, but Warner brought up comments about Keane turning his back on his country in World cup when he feel out with the coach Mic McCarthy.

See the extent of Warner's power over English club coaches ^

Petty insults... this will be a war of words and that is it

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

Can't find it, but Warner brought up comments about Keane turning his back on his country in World cup when he feel out with the coach Mic McCarthy.

Well, Warner is just embarassing himself now.

What Keane has done as a player has no bearing on this issue. Good ol' fashioned Trini mudslinging.

If you can't beat 'em, smear 'em.

Warner is making himself look like a prime tool and to think that he's an ambassador of this country (in the way that he holds a high position in a global organisation).

[BlackCat]

The war of words between Roy Keane and Jack Warner has intensified with the FIFA vice-president making a personal attack on the Sunderland manager, after the Irishman had called him "a clown".

Warner is special advisor to the Trinidad and Tobago FA and incurred Keane's wrath for criticising his decision to withdraw Dwight Yorke from international duty.

The Sunderland boss described Warner as "a clown" and said: "If he is vice-president of FIFA, then God help us", and suggested he wrote letters on FIFA-headed writing paper "just to impress everybody".

Now Warner has retaliated with a new letter attacking Keane - and making a dig about the Irishman's conduct in walking out on his country before the 2002 World Cup.

Friday's letter says: "The disrespectful tone of your reported comments further demonstrates the total disrespect that you and others of your ilk have generally for players and officials from 'small' countries.

"It is obviously difficult for you to accept the fact that someone from a 'small' country could rise to become a vice-president of FIFA.

"I chose to respond on a FIFA letter-head because that is a privilege afforded me owing to my said status and the fact that your callousness showed utter disregard for FIFA's regulations re the release of players for international duty. Regrettably, but not surprisingly, you did not grasp the message.

"In closing may I remind you that a player's greatest honour is to represent his country in spite of the fact that you chose to walk away from yours during the 2002 Korea/Japan World Cup after publicly abusing your manager... indictment that you will no doubt be proud of up to today. Poor Sunderland."

Ha ha ha its getting petty.  Handbags at dawn!

[FF]

Can't find it, but Warner brought up comments about Keane turning his back on his country in World cup when he feel out with the coach Mic McCarthy.

Well, Warner is just embarassing himself now.

What Keane has done as a player has no bearing on this issue. Good ol' fashioned Trini mudslinging.

If you can't beat 'em, smear 'em.

Warner is making himself look like a prime tool CLOWN and to think that he's an ambassador of this country (in the way that he holds a high position in a global organisation).

Fixed

[elan]

Don't worry nah alyuh, FIFA will spend all their time going after Keane for calling Warner by he middle name. That I would like to see.

Talking about "chain of command" if a police officer verbally abuse you, you have all rights to loud him up in return. If your boss abuse you in front the entire office you can loud him up to and seek further redress. The boss have to be more diplomatic than the employee, unless the boss doh mind losing he job.

JW is in the wrong. Get over it.

[Pur_Trini]

The war of words between Roy Keane and Jack Warner has intensified with the FIFA vice-president making a personal attack on the Sunderland manager, after the Irishman had called him "a clown".

Warner is special advisor to the Trinidad and Tobago FA and incurred Keane's wrath for criticising his decision to withdraw Dwight Yorke from international duty.

The Sunderland boss described Warner as "a clown" and said: "If he is vice-president of FIFA, then God help us", and suggested he wrote letters on FIFA-headed writing paper "just to impress everybody".

Now Warner has retaliated with a new letter attacking Keane - and making a dig about the Irishman's conduct in walking out on his country before the 2002 World Cup.

Friday's letter says: "The disrespectful tone of your reported comments further demonstrates the total disrespect that you and others of your ilk have generally for players and officials from 'small' countries.

"It is obviously difficult for you to accept the fact that someone from a 'small' country could rise to become a vice-president of FIFA.

"I chose to respond on a FIFA letter-head because that is a privilege afforded me owing to my said status and the fact that your callousness showed utter disregard for FIFA's regulations re the release of players for international duty. Regrettably, but not surprisingly, you did not grasp the message.

"In closing may I remind you that a player's greatest honour is to represent his country in spite of the fact that you chose to walk away from yours during the 2002 Korea/Japan World Cup after publicly abusing your manager... indictment that you will no doubt be proud of up to today. Poor Sunderland."

Jack is ah ass and an embarrassment to T&T football.  I woulda say he was an embarrassment to FIFA, but he and FIFA made for each other.  

To those who say he standing up for T&T, I respectfully disagree.  He trying to flex his muscles publicly and all he is doing is making T&T look bad.  Somebody should politely take Jack aside and tell him to hush he ass!

[JDB]

You see you not thinking.. use your brain and think before you right with emotions...Warner is not Keane most direct boss  and we know Warner cant fire him...lol...Now have you ever heard of the "chain of command"...you may work for the police and your boss may be a sargeant but who is the boss of your boss?..eventually the police commissioner is your boss too right?..now who set policies for the commisioner and the police?..Isn't it the government?..which is a different entity from the police!..so therefore the deputy head of the government entity can influence your career, you who is just a regular police corpral who does not think before you publicly criticise!..So now apply this same concept to this discussion

That is a stretch.

Sunderland is a private entity. keane's boss is Niall Quinn and his investors. Sunderland has to answer to the FA. FIFA has nothing to do with that.

For Warner to use his FIFA influence to put pressure on the FA to bring some type of punishment to Sunderland is laughable. That would be a bigger scandal than selling tickets or buying votes.

Warner's only recourse is, as the head of the TTFF, to complain to FIFA IF Keane refuses to release Yorke to travel during an approved international break.

That did not happen, Yorke returned willingly.

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

The war of words between Roy Keane and Jack Warner has intensified with the FIFA vice-president making a personal attack on the Sunderland manager, after the Irishman had called him "a clown".

Warner is special advisor to the Trinidad and Tobago FA and incurred Keane's wrath for criticising his decision to withdraw Dwight Yorke from international duty.

The Sunderland boss described Warner as "a clown" and said: "If he is vice-president of FIFA, then God help us", and suggested he wrote letters on FIFA-headed writing paper "just to impress everybody".

Now Warner has retaliated with a new letter attacking Keane - and making a dig about the Irishman's conduct in walking out on his country before the 2002 World Cup.

Friday's letter says: "The disrespectful tone of your reported comments further demonstrates the total disrespect that you and others of your ilk have generally for players and officials from 'small' countries.

"It is obviously difficult for you to accept the fact that someone from a 'small' country could rise to become a vice-president of FIFA.

"I chose to respond on a FIFA letter-head because that is a privilege afforded me owing to my said status and the fact that your callousness showed utter disregard for FIFA's regulations re the release of players for international duty. Regrettably, but not surprisingly, you did not grasp the message.

"In closing may I remind you that a player's greatest honour is to represent his country in spite of the fact that you chose to walk away from yours during the 2002 Korea/Japan World Cup after publicly abusing your manager... indictment that you will no doubt be proud of up to today. Poor Sunderland."

Oh God, does Warner live in some alternate reality or something?

It is obviously difficult for you to accept the fact that someone from a 'small' country could rise to become a vice-president of FIFA.

In a roundabout way, he's playing the race card. So predictable.

So Keanes response would have been different if what some white man from developed country?

Y'know, if Warner didn't have so on Blatter, FIFA would have gotten rid of him long ago...

In closing may I remind you that a player's greatest honour is to represent his country in spite of the fact that you chose to walk away from yours during the 2002 Korea/Japan World Cup after publicly abusing your manager

HAHA, but he didn't publicly accuse Mick McCarthy. It was done at their training camp in private and made public by McCarthy and a couple of players.

Keane did not walk out on Ireland.

He was SENT HOME by Mick Mccarthy.

I await Keanes reply, but if I were him I'd just sit back and let Warner embarass himself further...

[kaliman2006]

If Dwight's deal was agreed to on the condition that he's retired from international ball, then the real villain in all of this is Dwight.  He making promises he can't keep to both sides.

Agreed.  What really is the situation here?  Has Dwight retired or hasn't he?  Wasn't his appearance at the England game supposed to signal a farewell?

Don't get me wrong - I feel Dwight could still have a crucial role to play for T&T, but he seems to be in and out of retirement and the only person who could put all this to rest is Dwight.  He needs to come out and make his position clear to club and country in no uncertain terms.

I think Dwight has to come out and shed light on this matter. I don't think that Keane is being unreasonable at all. After all, Dwight is in his mid-thirties and is no longer a spring chicken (football speaking, of course).

And, if Keane's side of the story is to be believed, then Dwight really has to make his position clear to his club and the TTFF.

He has to pick one or the other.

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

If Dwight's deal was agreed to on the condition that he's retired from international ball, then the real villain in all of this is Dwight.  He making promises he can't keep to both sides.

Agreed.  What really is the situation here?  Has Dwight retired or hasn't he?  Wasn't his appearance at the England game supposed to signal a farewell?

Don't get me wrong - I feel Dwight could still have a crucial role to play for T&T, but he seems to be in and out of retirement and the only person who could put all this to rest is Dwight.  He needs to come out and make his position clear to club and country in no uncertain terms.

I think Dwight has to come out and shed light on this matter. I don't think that Keane is being unreasonable at all. After all, Dwight is in his mid-thirties and is no longer a spring chicken (football speaking, of course).

And, if Keane's side of the story is to be believed, then Dwight really has to make his position clear to his club and the TTFF.

He has to pick one or the other.

Exactly.

People forget that Yorke has publicly retired from international football.

He has not made a public statement saying that he has come out of international retirement...

[BlackCat]

I await Keanes reply, but if I were him I'd just sit back and let Warner embarass himself further...

Agreed!   

[Giggsy's Chestwig]

For those of you who have no problem with Warners actions...

Can you imagine the furore that would ensue if Sepp Blatter used his position in FIFA to influence decisions for his native Switzerland?

[WestCoast]

this just in
Jack Ass was seen on a flight out of Chicago

[kev]

Ok this is going to be fun.

Doesn't Warner understand what he is letting himself in for.  

On one hand you have a FIFA vice president who doesn't really get that much attention (which given his history might be a good thing) with a PA and a typist. Now Keane has a pre match press conference every Friday with at least 3 national broadcasters with TV Camera's, umpteen reoprters and various other media outlets.  Most of these conferences are shown on prem shows through out Europe et al.  He is responding by letter and insulting.  You just know reporters are going to keep on asking questions.

Its like 2 politicians competing 1 with a megaphone on an apple box, the other with a world wide Television Network.

Yet Warner seems not have realised that Keane doesn't give a stuff that he is Vice President of FIFA, despite Warners attempts to remind him again.

[Trini boi]

For those of you who have no problem with Warners actions...

Can you imagine the furore that would ensue if Sepp Blatter used his position in FIFA to influence decisions for his native Switzerland?

is Blatter on the Switzerland Football Federation??

not condoning anyone's action, but Blatter and Warner is in two different positions.  And who are you to say that Blatter hasn't used his influence to assist Switzerland???  He just wasn't as stupid as Warner fortunately.  Both Warner and Keane is wrong, so whichever side you take (depending on race or the matter at hand) you are still wrong.  Both Keane and Warner are immature in this case for even taking it to the media, and both are ignorant for not being the bigger man to cease the blatant and childish name-calling.

[WestCoast]

Ok this is going to be fun.

Doesn't Warner understand what he is letting himself in for.  

On one hand you have a FIFA vice president who doesn't really get that much attention (which given his history might be a good thing) with a PA and a typist. Now Keane has a pre match press conference every Friday with at least 3 national broadcasters with TV Camera's, umpteen reoprters and various other media outlets.  Most of these conferences are shown on prem shows through out Europe et al.  He is responding by letter and insulting.  You just know reporters are going to keep on asking questions.

Its like 2 politicians competing 1 with a megaphone on an apple box, the other with a world wide Television Network.

Yet Warner seems not have realised that Keane doesn't give a stuff that he is Vice President of FIFA, despite Warners attempts to remind him again.

KEV, maybe you dont realise that Jack Ass is one of the most VINDICTIVE people in Football that you will EVER meet
maybe you should read the Warner thread to get the Gist of his mind set.

[kev]

For those of you who have no problem with Warners actions...

Can you imagine the furore that would ensue if Sepp Blatter used his position in FIFA to influence decisions for his native Switzerland?

is Blatter on the Switzerland Football Federation??

not condoning anyone's action, but Blatter and Warner is in two different positions.  And who are you to say that Blatter hasn't used his influence to assist Switzerland???  He just wasn't as stupid as Warner fortunately.  Both Warner and Keane is wrong, so whichever side you take (depending on race or the matter at hand) you are still wrong.  Both Keane and Warner are immature in this case for even taking it to the media, and both are ignorant for not being the bigger man to cease the blatant and childish name-calling.

The problem being though this is not warners first dig at Keane, the club have not really responded before so I would imagine Keane made the decision ignoring didn't work so whats the harm, because its obvious he thinks this is more about Warner playing the I am man, threatening the club without fear of any reprocussions, than anything to do with T&T.  If you watch the video clip I think that comes across fairly forcefully.

[Pur_Trini]

For those of you who have no problem with Warners actions...

Can you imagine the furore that would ensue if Sepp Blatter used his position in FIFA to influence decisions for his native Switzerland?

is Blatter on the Switzerland Football Federation??

not condoning anyone's action, but Blatter and Warner is in two different positions.  And who are you to say that Blatter hasn't used his influence to assist Switzerland???  He just wasn't as stupid as Warner fortunately.  Both Warner and Keane is wrong, so whichever side you take (depending on race or the matter at hand) you are still wrong.  Both Keane and Warner are immature in this case for even taking it to the media, and both are ignorant for not being the bigger man to cease the blatant and childish name-calling.

I hear yuh - but Warner start this.  He write a stupid letter that he release to the media.  Roy Keane doing an interview, and they ask him his views.  He say what was on his mind.  So I can't agree that Keane had any part of bringing the dispute to the media.  The damage was done when Jack's letter was published.

[BlackCat]

 You just know reporters are going to keep on asking questions.

I can see Keane not taking this any further and just saying something like "You know and he knows my views in the matter.  Thats all there is to it".  Moving on...