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Author Topic: Why don't we ever learn?  (Read 3056 times)

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Offline PEG

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Why don't we ever learn?
« on: April 10, 2009, 02:18:44 PM »
Now that the quite predictable firing of Maturana has taken place, the reasonable question to ask is what is next.  It is now easy to see what happens when you impose people in the player/coach dynamic and the undermining of authority in any sphere of endeavor. Maturana and the players had to know that their next coach was on the bench/field? with them.  Contrast that with what Leo did when they wanted to impose Latapy on him.  There can only be one message heard and clearly that was not the case in this camp.  Can't be when the messenger has been so publicly undermined.

Then what of Latapy.  A player who was undisciplined at several stops in his career, who turned his back on the team as a player (which Maradona never did for all his demons) has been elevated to being the coach.  This literally while he was a member of the squad. Problematic for several reasons - no coaching experience, no distance between him and the players etc.  Are we serious?  We also hear that this is an interim appointment.  What does interim mean? One game, 2 games? Then what? If you want to appoint Latapy coach then appoint him coach.  Always bandaid solutions instead of strategic considerations.  We have set Latapy and ourselves up for failure

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2009, 04:41:23 PM »
yuh like ah bad case ah herpes, yuh always coming back to f**k up de party

Offline Socapro

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2009, 04:50:44 PM »
yuh like ah bad case ah herpes, yuh always coming back to f**k up de party

We could have predicted the sour grapes even before reading the 1st line!  ::)

After his last bout of sour grapes, we've had no post from Peg in ages & now this!!
What's new?  ;D
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Offline NUFF

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2009, 09:49:24 PM »
But de man make very good points.  I will be rooting for Latapy's success 100% but I think he should have waited until after this campaign was over to be head coach.  That way he could start fresh and build his program from scratch.

Offline STEUPS!!

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2009, 10:12:12 PM »
i jus wonderin why it have a NEXT latapy thread.  ::)
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Offline PEG

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2009, 11:12:29 PM »
allyuh should tell Lasana he also have sour grapes and out to f up the party since he say the same thing almost word for word. What idiots!

Offline mouie

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2009, 11:49:23 PM »
I want Latas to do well cause after all if he does well we all do well.But i find that peg is making a good point.

Offline 1-868

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2009, 04:31:13 AM »
Peg, why dont you shut to fack up... yuh too mudder c*nt negative
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Offline Midknight

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2009, 06:57:50 AM »
Talk yuh talk partner
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Offline JERSEY TRINI

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2009, 07:19:34 AM »
Listen hear nah, Latapy didn't hire heself as interim Head Coach yuh know, JW appoint him.  So give the man some support and hope fuh the best.

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2009, 07:45:19 AM »
Peg is a blasted fraud!  For years he used to support Jack warner, then he woud have BIG arguments with me about how jack is a boss etc.  He was a BIG porterfied supporter then too.  Now he has changed his tune..ok, no troubles.

Same way he change why Latapy cyar change and woith age has become more responsible/  de man eh have de team one week and he here bumping he gum with he naysaying.

And if his sentiments are exacly what Lasana has expressed already why make the remarks in a new thread?  Yuh is ah facking echo?  Yuh say it in dat thread yet yuh feel com-pelled to come here and make ah new thread with de same talk?  Whappen noone responded tuh yuh over in de odder post, so yuh feeling left out?

Besides dat obvious point...dese is yuh own words, yuh call for it, now it eh good enough..right/  Peggy ah guess changing yuh mind id a woman perogative ent/

Quote
on: September 24, 2008, 11:59:21 PM Lack of decisive Action. Instead of removing a man, we set up parallel structures around him to circumvent his authority and you end up with the worst of all worlds. See the Police Commissioner and Sautt.  If u want latapy as coach, do it properly appoint him to the job and fire the incumbent.  Instead, you appoint him asst. coach/player for 2/3 games and if it work out you may extend it.  What!!!Utter insanity!  I can predict this, we will not make the WC with Maturana as coach.  No coach worth his salt would tolerate this.

And to illustrate what I like about archives you also said this!

Quote
on: December 28, 2006, 09:49:13 PM 
i would hope that Yorke makes this season his last and hangs up his boots.  It is sad to see a former Treble winning Man U automatic selection fighting for a sweat on a mid-table Division 2 team.  What happening to him is why I love sports - reputation means nothing. You either producing or you not.  Clearly over the hill and at his age, having lost 2 steps not cut out for English football. A man like Keano will be man enough to tell him to his face that he's past his sell by date. 

Res ipsa loquitur

Offline PEG

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2009, 10:45:47 AM »
1.  I made my post prior to Lasana's article.

2. Not understanding how your 2 quotes contradict what i am saying now:
- They still undermining the coach (only this time is Latapy).
- Absolutely stand by the comment about Yorke.  Accomplished a lot but is past it (no disgrace in that for somebody 38)

Offline Bakes

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2009, 11:01:42 AM »
Peg is a blasted fraud!  For years he used to support Jack warner, then he woud have BIG arguments with me about how jack is a boss etc.  He was a BIG porterfied supporter then too.  Now he has changed his tune..ok, no troubles.

Same way he change why Latapy cyar change and woith age has become more responsible/  de man eh have de team one week and he here bumping he gum with he naysaying.

And if his sentiments are exacly what Lasana has expressed already why make the remarks in a new thread?  Yuh is ah facking echo?  Yuh say it in dat thread yet yuh feel com-pelled to come here and make ah new thread with de same talk?  Whappen noone responded tuh yuh over in de odder post, so yuh feeling left out?

Besides dat obvious point...dese is yuh own words, yuh call for it, now it eh good enough..right/  Peggy ah guess changing yuh mind id a woman perogative ent/

Quote
on: September 24, 2008, 11:59:21 PM Lack of decisive Action. Instead of removing a man, we set up parallel structures around him to circumvent his authority and you end up with the worst of all worlds. See the Police Commissioner and Sautt.  If u want latapy as coach, do it properly appoint him to the job and fire the incumbent.  Instead, you appoint him asst. coach/player for 2/3 games and if it work out you may extend it.  What!!!Utter insanity!  I can predict this, we will not make the WC with Maturana as coach.  No coach worth his salt would tolerate this.

And to illustrate what I like about archives you also said this!

Quote
on: December 28, 2006, 09:49:13 PM 
i would hope that Yorke makes this season his last and hangs up his boots.  It is sad to see a former Treble winning Man U automatic selection fighting for a sweat on a mid-table Division 2 team.  What happening to him is why I love sports - reputation means nothing. You either producing or you not.  Clearly over the hill and at his age, having lost 2 steps not cut out for English football. A man like Keano will be man enough to tell him to his face that he's past his sell by date. 

Res ipsa loquitur

What so 'fraudulent' about what he say?

Offline Babalawo

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2009, 11:23:54 AM »
Oh god let the man coach one game na man. Everybody have to be optimistic and can only guess what will happen in the future.  a coach cannot do anything but pick the best 11 he thinks that will win.  Let the man win or lose then you can say if it was a good choice or not.  Clearly Maturana was not by choosing players who questionably have players better than them

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2009, 12:45:09 PM »
well Latas is now de coach, what de f**k is his problem now, one minute he say he eh want him circumventing de coach..so he get he wish, time for him to shut up!

Offline Bakes

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2009, 01:34:51 PM »
well Latas is now de coach, what de f**k is his problem now, one minute he say he eh want him circumventing de coach..so he get he wish, time for him to shut up!

Why is it time for him to shut up... is it time for you to shut up?

Whatever your past beef with him the man made some good points... all along he's been critical of the process and of the TTFF indirectly.  Appointing Latas to the staff over the wishes of the head coach undermines his authority, and this isn't lost on the players.  If the players can't tell who's in charge why should they listen to Maturana?  This was his first point.

As harsh as his statements about Yorke might be, they're not that outrageous.

His criticism of Latapy is also spot on.  We might love him, but let's not delude ourselves... had he been a better professional then his career (and possibly our fate as a national program) could have been much more further advanced.  Latapy aside, the rest of his comments are again directed at the short-sighted ad hoc TTFF/Warner process.  What is the point of appointing him "interim" coach... and giving him a 2-3 game mandate?  Let him coach if he is to coach and stop being reactive rather than proactive.  Doh focus on the messenger, focus on the message... the man message is spot on, as redundant as it might be (similar points being made in other threads).

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2009, 09:11:53 PM »
Now that the quite predictable firing of Maturana has taken place, the reasonable question to ask is what is next.  It is now easy to see what happens when you impose people in the player/coach dynamic and the undermining of authority in any sphere of endeavor. Maturana and the players had to know that their next coach was on the bench/field? with them.  Contrast that with what Leo did when they wanted to impose Latapy on him.  There can only be one message heard and clearly that was not the case in this camp.  Can't be when the messenger has been so publicly undermined.

What does this have to do with Latapy? 

If Maturana was dissatisfied with the arrangement he could have resigned then! 

What kinda leader was he?  It is apparent that Maturana had no authority in the first place and he was merely a yes man, he reminds me of that Dutch ninny Wim.  He had all kinds of piss poor things to say about our team, our league, our players, but each month he got his pay and stayed in an unhappy job...why didn't he just ride out, same for Maturana...and his staff...why did they stay so long to resign if the situaion was untenable...says a lot about his lack of BALLS and poor leadership skills!


Then what of Latapy.  A player who was undisciplined at several stops in his career, who turned his back on the team as a player (which Maradona never did for all his demons) has been elevated to being the coach.

Ok, let me address this, Latapy played MANY games for T&T that had little meaning, in other words he travelled back to T&T to play glorified fete matches before, never with a grumble.

So while it is true that he did leave us during a campaign, he was NOT the first player to do so, as many other players, some greater, some lesser have done so before. 

You feel it right to conjure the name Maradona, that man embarrassed his nation by testing positive for illegal substances DURING a WORLD CUP finals! 

Back to Latas, he returned to us last campaign and was instrumental in assisting us to make it to Germany 2006....both he and the same Yorke you felt was struggling to make it on a middle of the table Sunderland...I remind you lest you forget!   

Not only did Latas return, but he had no small part in ensuring our improved play in the middle of the field, scoring an important goal and setting up several others too!   

SO HE HAS MADE AMENDS, NOT ONLY THROUGH THE QUALITY OF HIS PLAY, BUT BY HIS COMMITTMENT TO THE CAUSE AND VIBESING IT UP!


This literally while he was a member of the squad. Problematic for several reasons - no coaching experience, no distance between him and the players etc.  Are we serious?  We also hear that this is an interim appointment.  What does interim mean? One game, 2 games? Then what? If you want to appoint Latapy coach then appoint him coach.  Always bandaid solutions instead of strategic considerations.  We have set Latapy and ourselves up for failure

UNLESS YOU KNOW THAT A SUITABLE REPLACEMENT COACH IS READY, WILLING AND AVAILABLE, WHAT IS SO WRONG IN PUTTING SOMEONE THERE FOR THE INTERIM? 

And why is it not in our best interest to put Latas as that person? 

I know!  Because you feel that he is not a role model...right? 

Afterall he turned his back on a failed campaign before...why haven't you ascribed blame where it is truly due? 

To Porterfield who allowed tham the leverage to stay separately from the other players?   Again, the poor coaching/leadership made it easy for Yorke and Latas to have their way. 

Why would a coach allow two players rights others were not granted?  Yes the players have some fault, but if you look at the overall scheme of things, they were made bigger than the team....by the coaches!

That said, who can question the loyalty and dedication of Latas and Yorkie now?  Who else but you Peg? 
Quote
Last campaign you were a lone dissenter, better we sink or swin with the youth you said, Latas and Yorke should NOT be allowed back
 

You say he has no coaching experience, but is that a new thing in footballing circles?

To have a coach with little or no experience coaching? 

Maradona comes to mind, Klinsmann, Dunga and may others have done so, albeit with varied success. 

Leave Latas alone fella!  Go on nad criticize Warner, that is new to you after years of defending him...stick to that..Leave Latas alone![/color]
[/size]
« Last Edit: April 12, 2009, 12:10:49 AM by Trinity Cross »

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2009, 09:14:24 PM »
Oh and Bakes, nutten before its time, nutten!  Latas lived his life, and according to him ..he has little regrets.  Nutten Latas did or should have done had any impact on our program until his appointment as coach recently..and he eh even coach ah game yet.  We know who 'runs' our national program, and until he is gone....nutten much will change!

Offline Bakes

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2009, 11:02:05 PM »
Oh and Bakes, nutten before its time, nutten!  Latas lived his life, and according to him ..he has little regrets.  Nutten Latas did or should have done had any impact on our program until his appointment as coach recently..and he eh even coach ah game yet.  We know who 'runs' our national program, and until he is gone....nutten much will change!

Yuh blind or what?  Or yuh posting on yuh phone?

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2009, 11:12:55 PM »
Oh and Bakes, nutten before its time, nutten!  Latas lived his life, and according to him ..he has little regrets.  Nutten Latas did or should have done had any impact on our program until his appointment as coach recently..and he eh even coach ah game yet.  We know who 'runs' our national program, and until he is gone....nutten much will change!

Yuh blind or what?  Or yuh posting on yuh phone?

lol

Offline Bakes

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2009, 11:44:04 PM »
Oh and Bakes, nutten before its time, nutten!  Latas lived his life, and according to him ..he has little regrets.  Nutten Latas did or should have done had any impact on our program until his appointment as coach recently..and he eh even coach ah game yet.  We know who 'runs' our national program, and until he is gone....nutten much will change!

Yuh blind or what?  Or yuh posting on yuh phone?

lol

I try reading dat thing and get ah headache.. :-\

Offline PEG

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2009, 12:09:48 AM »
Trinity Cross,

For your benefit, I will clearly state what i said because you introducing a set of straw men in this discussion:

1. I believe I said explicitly in a post that Maturana could not be worth his salt if he is allowed himself to be treated in that fashion.

2. My main point had nothing to do with the fact that Latapy was appointed but the fact that with 2 months before the next competitive game he is appointed on an interim basis and where his chief benefactor comes out and publicly and explicitly says that he does not have full confidence in him and he is being evaluated on a game by game basis.

3. I wish Latapy well like anybody who puts on national colors.  However cheerleading is not analysis. I dont know what he has done in the coaching arena to make anyone believe he is up to the task.  However I could be wrong. As I said before he would not be my choice but I support him as he has been selected.  All I am saying is that the very manner in which he was selected does not augur well for him nor more importantly the team.  We have been down this road before.

Hopefully now you will not mischaraterize my point of view.

truetrini

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Re: Why don't we ever learn?
« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2009, 12:14:20 AM »
Maybe then, you should leave analysis for the analysts and dem.  What has Maradona done to warrant the confidence Argentina has in him?  Or Dunga for Brazil?

Come on man.  Yuh didn't have to say shit about his past indiscretions etc.  Yuh have axe to grind...tree to chop down?

Leave Latas alone.  We all will know soon enough if he can cut the proverbial mustard...until then hold yuh blasted tongue!

If he does not deliver, then I will say Peg is ah seer man!

 

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