Will you return home to live ?

[Jah Gol]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

[weary1969]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

U eh have 2 b a returning national 2 realize dat u have 2 give up customer care. D first time I went to the US I bought a dress in Atlanta my sister say nah u spend 2 much. We went to the branch in Maryland and I get back my money I say when in TNT that go happen NEVAAAAAAAAAAAA

[Pointman]

Would I return home to live? Hell yes!!

- All de holidays in de world
- De sweetest women in the world
- Roti and doubles
- Sunday lunch
- There's no Christmas like a trini Christmas
- Parang
- Carnival
- Fete after fete
- 2 hour lunch at de job is no scene
- De sweetest women in the world
- Lime
- Yuh could drink beers on de street
- No winter
- Yuh have a backyard i.e. yuh doh hadda pick up shit behind no dog
- Yuh could walk in yuh neighbor yard without calling first and lime, eat and drink free whole day
- Stress free living.. Ting to cry, yuh laughing
- Not everything hadda be about de almighty dollar
- Always something to break the monotony. From fetes -> Carnival -> easter -> jazz fest -> borough day -> tobago -> down de islands -> take ah lil trip for de summer -> band launch -> parang season -> fete again
- Tobago
- De beach right there
- Cosmopolitan. A black man, white man or chinee could dress in ah sari, eat roti, light deya and lime by yuh indian friends for Divali
- Yuh eh hadda deal with a society of mad people toting a setta stress and issues
- Yuh eh hadda cram on ah train or a subway
- De sweetest women in the world
Doh get tie up, trinidad real bad right now, but think of yuh computer as a magnifying glass.

It does look ten times worse than when yuh home and actually living in it.

I would love to move back home but allyuh see whey ah highlight dey? that go mash up the family!! cyar risk that atall.

[Sando]

Okay some Stats.


Infant Mortality Rate

USA - 6.26/1000 live births
T&T - 29.93/1000 live births

Life Expectancy Rate

USA - 78.11 years
T&T - 70.86 years

Literacy Rate

USA - 99% - 15 years and over that can read and write
T&T - 98.6 - 15 years and over that can read and write


School Life Expectancy

USA - 16 years
T&T - 11 years


Education Expenditure

USA - 5.3% of GDP (2005)
T&T - 4.2% of GDP (2002)

I know what you all will pick out in these stats to use against T&T, but think about it carefully before you do so cause it could work against your argument in the long run.

Where you get that Stats (Wiki ?)

Nobody here denying they are proud Trinibagoians and we all wish for a better T&T and the only reason we could lash out is because T&T has some much pontenial and yet we are so poorly managed.

Half them things on Sam list can be eliminated, like poor schools and hosptials. Animal, women and children abuse, going green, protecting our culture, local food prices etc etc.

What about corruption. Both in the government and Police force.

Imagine my sister husband died at the age of 33 and left her with 3 kids (small, 2, 4, 7) and the government gives her $500.00 TT a month. She have to pay rent, buy food, babysitter, passege to work, school books, cloths passege and support 3 kids with that. She does have a job but how much you think she gets paid ?

[Sando]

Nobody here denying they are proud Trinibagoians and we all wish for a better T&T and the only reason we could lash out is because T&T has some much potential and yet we are so poorly managed.

Half them things on Sam list can be eliminated, like poor schools, roads and hospitals. Animal cruelty, women and children abuse, going green, protecting our culture, local food prices, agriculture etc etc.

What about corruption. Both in the government and Police force.

Imagine my sister husband died (Both tax payers) at the age of 33 and left her with 3 kids (small, 2, 4, 7) and the government gives her $500.00 TT a month. She have to pay rent, buy food, babysitter, passage to work, school books, cloths, passage to school and support 3 kids with that. She does have a job but how much you think she gets paid ?

In the US they take care of single Moms and kids. Just some people does abuse it, but the point is, they look out.

[verycute1]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

Perhaps my dear you could persuade Marcia Henville to write some articles or two??? I am sure that her quality of writing, and the undercover work she could do, she will produce glowing articles about how the well mannered, well spoken, productive members of Lavantille managed to wrest one of their own away from the hands of the corrupt cops. She can even mention that the residents had their own ballistics experts on hand 

In all truth Weary, the online express and guardian is the only daily updates many of us have bout the country. Unless the BOMB and Punch have them too (them papers still around?) You can't blame us for reading what the local papers are printing daily and forming conclusions based on that. Why not get a bunch of people together and start your own unbiased reporting website? I'd check it out daily. We make do with what we have. Right now that is the express and Guardian. truthfully I stop looking at them very much though. I have family based in brooklyn, everyday that woman used to call me in tears "Oh god I just get done reading the newspapers and it bad back home.... they kill XXX more people and is how they kill them" I had to tell her stop calling me with them shyte. I tell her I want to enjoy meh vacations with out feeling like I have to look over my shoulder. Gone home now, want to go visit old "haunts" moms say "we really do go down there anymore nah, place dead and it have some people live there only want to rob you" Is them get me so scared of the Beetham, I feel like I need Obama entourage to be drivin through there.

Anyhow, I will be there soon and I feel like making a lime down the islands, after I check you at the Buddah of course 

[100% Barataria]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

Good post JG, note, not all foreign-based posters will not return, many left TT for some of the reasons you highlighted above, but many would return in a heart-beat but for one reason or another have not yet done so, many folks w/whom I went to undergrad and grad school and in the same or close cohorts have returned...it may just seem from the foreign-based posters on this forum as if the majority would not return, I myself am familiar w/many who have....would be an interesting poll to see what that distribution truly looks like

[Jah Gol]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

Good post JG, note, not all foreign-based posters will not return, many left TT for some of the reasons you highlighted above, but many would return in a heart-beat but for one reason or another have not yet done so, many folks w/whom I went to undergrad and grad school and in the same or close cohorts have returned...it may just seem from the foreign-based posters on this forum as if the majority would not return, I myself am familiar w/many who have....would be an interesting poll to see what that distribution truly looks like

The Caribbean has some of the highest immigration rates in the world. It really would be interesting to see how many of us return home.

[weary1969]

Okay some Stats.


Infant Mortality Rate

USA - 6.26/1000 live births
T&T - 29.93/1000 live births

Life Expectancy Rate

USA - 78.11 years
T&T - 70.86 years

Literacy Rate

USA - 99% - 15 years and over that can read and write
T&T - 98.6 - 15 years and over that can read and write


School Life Expectancy

USA - 16 years
T&T - 11 years


Education Expenditure

USA - 5.3% of GDP (2005)
T&T - 4.2% of GDP (2002)

I know what you all will pick out in these stats to use against T&T, but think about it carefully before you do so cause it could work against your argument in the long run.

Where you get that Stats (Wiki ?)

Nobody here denying they are proud Trinibagoians and we all wish for a better T&T and the only reason we could lash out is because T&T has some much pontenial and yet we are so poorly managed.

Half them things on Sam list can be eliminated, like poor schools and hosptials. Animal, women and children abuse, going green, protecting our culture, local food prices etc etc.

What about corruption. Both in the government and Police force.

Imagine my sister husband died at the age of 33 and left her with 3 kids (small, 2, 4, 7) and the government gives her $500.00 TT a month. She have to pay rent, buy food, babysitter, passege to work, school books, cloths passege and support 3 kids with that. She does have a job but how much you think she gets paid ?

So if she was in d US and d husband had died she would b taken care of perfect. At $500 a month what benefits is that she getting? Did he ever work and pay NIS so she can get Widows and Orphans. Even if is only that she getting. Enrol d 4 yr old in a govt preschool and d 7 yr old should b in primary school gettin books and could get lunch and breakfast if the school have it.

TNT is more of a wlfare state than nuff places we eh sweden or Norway but we eh so badly off.

[weary1969]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

Perhaps my dear you could persuade Marcia Henville to write some articles or two??? I am sure that her quality of writing, and the undercover work she could do, she will produce glowing articles about how the well mannered, well spoken, productive members of Lavantille managed to wrest one of their own away from the hands of the corrupt cops. She can even mention that the residents had their own ballistics experts on hand 

In all truth Weary, the online express and guardian is the only daily updates many of us have bout the country. Unless the BOMB and Punch have them too (them papers still around?) You can't blame us for reading what the local papers are printing daily and forming conclusions based on that. Why not get a bunch of people together and start your own unbiased reporting website? I'd check it out daily. We make do with what we have. Right now that is the express and Guardian. truthfully I stop looking at them very much though. I have family based in brooklyn, everyday that woman used to call me in tears "Oh god I just get done reading the newspapers and it bad back home.... they kill XXX more people and is how they kill them" I had to tell her stop calling me with them shyte. I tell her I want to enjoy meh vacations with out feeling like I have to look over my shoulder. Gone home now, want to go visit old "haunts" moms say "we really do go down there anymore nah, place dead and it have some people live there only want to rob you" Is them get me so scared of the Beetham, I feel like I need Obama entourage to be drivin through there.

Anyhow, I will be there soon and I feel like making a lime down the islands, after I check you at the Buddah of course 

I know dat is yuh connection 2 home when I in d US I on it evry day 2 c what happening at home. My sis stop reading it because of d same crime left right and centre. D point is most of u have somebody back home 2 give u a view that will not make u feel dat we teachin chirren 2 stop/drop/roll in school.

So my sis came home 2 yrs ago and knock and yes d Beetham bad but when was it good?

[just cool]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

Good post JG, note, not all foreign-based posters will not return, many left TT for some of the reasons you highlighted above, but many would return in a heart-beat but for one reason or another have not yet done so, many folks w/whom I went to undergrad and grad school and in the same or close cohorts have returned...it may just seem from the foreign-based posters on this forum as if the majority would not return, I myself am familiar w/many who have....would be an interesting poll to see what that distribution truly looks like

The Caribbean has some of the highest immigration rates in the world. It really would be interesting to see how many of us return home.

To each is own. it have ppl who could live in T&T BC they have a solid base, friends, a thriving career, strong and loving family ties, iron clad support system with circle of friends and loveones tuh rely on. but some of us don't have that @ all.

take me forinstance, all my relatives are here, i have an aunt by marriage and a few worthless cousins in T&T, but that's it.

yeh i have some frienimies, but i can't depend on them tuh kill ah fly of me, let alone rely on them for any kinda moral support.

when i go home i does stay in ah hotel, and i doh visit no relatives as of late. llike i said , i have ah few frienimies who always have their hands out, so i don't have that much of a draw tuh T&T, it's sad but true!

 i always believe if yuh going home to live, then it should be comfortable. ppl should not have tuh worry about criminals and safty!

if i have tuh leave NYC tuh live in T&T and lose all the convenience of living in the develope world, to go live in an unmanage society, then what is the point! to me it's giving up a lot to recieve less!

i rather go live on one of them little islands where ah fella could @ least live with some sort of peace of mind, knowing the society have law men who looking out for the ppl, and the tourist , also where the criminals are not so brazen. 

not in a place where the cops scared and the ppl more scared, what kinda forkry is that. sttuueeepppsss!

[weary1969]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

This exactly the way I feel about the discussion.

Migration is innate to civilization. People have always chosen to leave their native land to settle in places which ,in their view, provide the best opportunity to protect and further their own interests. All the foreign based posters on the board have left T&T's shores for this reason either on their own accord or that their relatives.

Reverse migration is not uncommon. However it is not without consideration to these same interests.  I think this is why so many posters are speaking about the services 'delivered' here and the generally poor level of public administration. I can understand why the security situation will be a deal breaker to many expats. However I think some posters have an apocalyptic view of T&T that will not be readily shared by many citizens of T&T.

I think ultimately anyone who's experienced a higher level of social organisation and returns to T&T has to forfeit some of the benefits previously derived from their second home. Conversely those people ought not to be surprised by the benefits enjoyed by resident T&T citizens.I am as proud to be Trinbagonian as I am proud to live in Trinidad and Tobago. 

Good post JG, note, not all foreign-based posters will not return, many left TT for some of the reasons you highlighted above, but many would return in a heart-beat but for one reason or another have not yet done so, many folks w/whom I went to undergrad and grad school and in the same or close cohorts have returned...it may just seem from the foreign-based posters on this forum as if the majority would not return, I myself am familiar w/many who have....would be an interesting poll to see what that distribution truly looks like

The Caribbean has some of the highest immigration rates in the world. It really would be interesting to see how many of us return home.

To each is own. it have ppl who could live in T&T BC they have a solid base, friends, a thriving career, strong and loving family ties, iron clad support system with circle of friends and loveones tuh rely on. and some of us don't have that @ all.

take me forinstance, all my relatives are here, i have an aunt by marriage and a few worthless cousins in T&T, but that's it.

yeh i have some frienimies, but i can't depend on them tuh kill ah fly of me, let alone rely on them for any kinda moral support.

when i go home i does stay in ah hotel, and i doh visit no relatives as of late. llike i said , i have ah few frienimies who always have their hands out, so i don't have that much of a draw tuh T&T, it's sad but true!

 i always believe if yuh going home to live, then it should be comfortable. ppl should not have tuh worry about criminals and safty!

if i have tuh leave NYC tuh live in T&T and lose all the convenience of living in the develope world, to go live in an unmanage society, then what is the point! to me it's giving up a lot to recieve less!

i rather go live on one of them little islands where ah fella could @ least live with some sort of peace of mind, knowing the society have law men who looking out for the ppl, and the tourist , where the criminals are not so brazen. 

not in a place where the cops scared and the ppl more scared, what kinda forkry is that. sttuueeepppsss!

If u have no ties 2 d place y would u come back. U keep harping on d crime d scene dat play out in Picton eh d norm in TNT. D vast majority of d 200plus peeps who get kill is gang related yes innocent peeps could get rob and kill like my gfriend fadder in jan but taxi drivers get kill everywhere.

I wuk police 4 over 2 yrs d majority is hard wukin peeps now I in education d majority of d teachers are hard wukin but d bad eggs does b highlighted. Dat is what u guys see the worse side of TNT. Just look at dis site peeps become tight just postin on a MB. Brown makin sure she meet and tag Jah so he eh go lost in bago. Dat is d Trini way

[verycute1]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

Perhaps my dear you could persuade Marcia Henville to write some articles or two??? I am sure that her quality of writing, and the undercover work she could do, she will produce glowing articles about how the well mannered, well spoken, productive members of Lavantille managed to wrest one of their own away from the hands of the corrupt cops. She can even mention that the residents had their own ballistics experts on hand 

In all truth Weary, the online express and guardian is the only daily updates many of us have bout the country. Unless the BOMB and Punch have them too (them papers still around?) You can't blame us for reading what the local papers are printing daily and forming conclusions based on that. Why not get a bunch of people together and start your own unbiased reporting website? I'd check it out daily. We make do with what we have. Right now that is the express and Guardian. truthfully I stop looking at them very much though. I have family based in brooklyn, everyday that woman used to call me in tears "Oh god I just get done reading the newspapers and it bad back home.... they kill XXX more people and is how they kill them" I had to tell her stop calling me with them shyte. I tell her I want to enjoy meh vacations with out feeling like I have to look over my shoulder. Gone home now, want to go visit old "haunts" moms say "we really do go down there anymore nah, place dead and it have some people live there only want to rob you" Is them get me so scared of the Beetham, I feel like I need Obama entourage to be drivin through there.

Anyhow, I will be there soon and I feel like making a lime down the islands, after I check you at the Buddah of course 

I know dat is yuh connection 2 home when I in d US I on it evry day 2 c what happening at home. My sis stop reading it because of d same crime left right and centre. D point is most of u have somebody back home 2 give u a view that will not make u feel dat we teachin chirren 2 stop/drop/roll in school.

So my sis came home 2 yrs ago and knock and yes d Beetham bad but when was it good?

 An what you going do when the views of your peeps back home mirror the views expressed in the papers? MY moms sometimes says, the place not really bad but you just have to know where not to go, which seems to be everywhere

Some of her lectures from my last visit

Like don't drive up to Maracas with just two people, take at least 5
Doh go down high st in sando.
Doh go by the wharf in sando
DOh park in the parking lot by Sando general Hospital
Doh go down frederick st unless you have to
Long Circular Mall is no longer a nice mall shop at west mall instead, or trincity
Parking in Gulf City make it easy to get rob so doh go there unless you have to. Or until they finish construction
wallerfield is no longer a nice area,  dont drive down there anymore


and so on....

[weary1969]

All who have a problem with TNT stay by Uncle Sam, Cousin Liz, Brother Harper and leave we in we crime ridden, dengue dying existance.

Look how you taking it personal! all we doing is contructively critiqing the place we once called home.

hek, for the most part the reason we left was BC we was looking for opprtunities we couldn't acess @ home, so don't  take it the wrong way, rather try and understand.

yuh know the reason our country is in the delapidated state it's in is BC allyuh locals doh like no kinda constructive criticism, allyuh rather mamaguye than the truth.

mybe that's why the country running away like ah that. and the only reason i could come up with it's BC the citizens are not active and stand up enough to challenge the govt. and hold them responsible. i see allyuh had a rally against crime and ppl beating bottle and drinking like is carnival.

if T&T ppl was more stand up , then the govt. would've had no other choice but tuh take the ppl seriously and put their shoulders to the wheel tuh ensure a safer more effecient running society.

is real money T&T have you know, there's no reason for the way that country is being runned into the ground, there's no way that place should be in the state it's in, no way!!

Me eh takin nutten personal I just fed up of Trinis overseas reading d online express and guardian and feel we livin in hell here. Yes we have nuff problems d vast majority of our own doin. It eh have nutten 2 do wit Manning or Panday. Last week at a Primary School sport at the barracks it had to end because a female parent was cussing. D police talk 2 her she slap d police. Dey arrest she and d sports done. D chile cryin and a parent snapping the child. So who is to blame for dat yes we in a hott mess. But guess what I read hit man get hire to kill cheerleader in d US. the world on a downward slide some just sliding faster.

So again I say stay where all yuh happy leave we in TNT some ah we happy here.

Perhaps my dear you could persuade Marcia Henville to write some articles or two??? I am sure that her quality of writing, and the undercover work she could do, she will produce glowing articles about how the well mannered, well spoken, productive members of Lavantille managed to wrest one of their own away from the hands of the corrupt cops. She can even mention that the residents had their own ballistics experts on hand 

In all truth Weary, the online express and guardian is the only daily updates many of us have bout the country. Unless the BOMB and Punch have them too (them papers still around?) You can't blame us for reading what the local papers are printing daily and forming conclusions based on that. Why not get a bunch of people together and start your own unbiased reporting website? I'd check it out daily. We make do with what we have. Right now that is the express and Guardian. truthfully I stop looking at them very much though. I have family based in brooklyn, everyday that woman used to call me in tears "Oh god I just get done reading the newspapers and it bad back home.... they kill XXX more people and is how they kill them" I had to tell her stop calling me with them shyte. I tell her I want to enjoy meh vacations with out feeling like I have to look over my shoulder. Gone home now, want to go visit old "haunts" moms say "we really do go down there anymore nah, place dead and it have some people live there only want to rob you" Is them get me so scared of the Beetham, I feel like I need Obama entourage to be drivin through there.

Anyhow, I will be there soon and I feel like making a lime down the islands, after I check you at the Buddah of course 

I know dat is yuh connection 2 home when I in d US I on it evry day 2 c what happening at home. My sis stop reading it because of d same crime left right and centre. D point is most of u have somebody back home 2 give u a view that will not make u feel dat we teachin chirren 2 stop/drop/roll in school.

So my sis came home 2 yrs ago and knock and yes d Beetham bad but when was it good?

 An what you going do when the views of your peeps back home mirror the views expressed in the papers? MY moms sometimes says, the place not really bad but you just have to know where not to go, which seems to be everywhere

Some of her lectures from my last visit

Like don't drive up to Maracas with just two people, take at least 5
Doh go down high st in sando.
Doh go by the wharf in sando
DOh park in the parking lot by Sando general Hospital
Doh go down frederick st unless you have to
Long Circular Mall is no longer a nice mall shop at west mall instead, or trincity
Parking in Gulf City make it easy to get rob so doh go there unless you have to. Or until they finish construction
wallerfield is no longer a nice area,  dont drive down there anymore


and so on....

When dat happen then we go have a mad mad scene but we know where close 2 dat. As 4 yuh mom lecture it seems dat it have very little u can do. Any where u can get rob not only Gulf in fact dey tiefin yuh car most in Trincity. Fredrick St if yuh tell meh Charlotte.

Just b careful and use would be back in d US. It eh have peeps lurking 2 grab u I will say it again d murders is gang related and of course d domestic violence. U could get rob anywhere. In 84 as a form 4 student d spanish class went Caracas. We went coney island as d roller coaster pull off a yute grab a girl chain. So she screamin twice. Crime is everywhere. I sure if yuh remove d gang stats from every state d crime rate will look betta.

[Bourbon]

Yuh know how long I trying to avoid opening dis thread because i know i go see some folly to get me vex.

First off....yuh hearing people claiming is constructive criticism. Me eh hear or see one solution yet from anybody who say dey eh coming back. Is always a blame ting. Oh is de govt. supposed to keep people in line..so tell me dis....a third of de population supposed to be normal citizens, a next third supposed to be police over the first third and the last third supposed to be the police to police the previous police? Be real. Trinidad and Tobago is in the state it in because of watless Trinis. Those who doh see no reason to do what they supposed to..cause they wont be held accountable, and dey could blame it on somebody else. Like yuh go hear oh it eh dem men in picton fault..police too wicked...dey poor..dey dis dey dat de other. It have HYPE..MUST...all kinda program where men could learn a skill and get something productive to do. But nah..it easier to rob a man who working of wha he have because he eh want to work. I remember i was talking with a TA from MUST..de man say he organise a youth man from Laventille with a job because that's how the program works. De boss of de place tell de youth man..."Yuh good with yuh hands boy....yuh want to stay permanent?" De youth man say nah..it easier to get a gun and rob people...de money go be more too. Wha yuh could do again for people with the attitude like dat? Buh nah..is always somebody else fault.

The public sector damn slack. In fact Trinis know that they eh go be held accountable...so dey doh take their responsibilities seriously. It so ironic that we lacking in our national watchwords, discipline, production and tolerance. But the thing is...is we have it so. Dahs de bottom line. Every agency in Trinidad slack. I used to work WASA and i could tell yuh....WASA forever hadda depend on the government because people doh pay dey bills. People doesn't want to pay dey bills because de billing system estimated...and still de basic system dey used since WASA inception. Dey trying to move towards metered billing, but, to implement, is real work, and de staff just slack and dragging dey foot. Ting dey could do in dey normal work day....dey go sit down and lime...and den if dey doing it..dey doing it only when dey could get pay overtime. I remember when they assign me..de man who showing me around de warehouse when he done..he say..well..is almost 12....and today is Friday..so lunch time is from 12 to 4. We laugh bout it..buh dahs de attitude. Buh i accustom working and doing wha i hadda do.....in my period there i knock off all my responsibilities and going and helping men with others and working. It was rel pressha on me but...it had some positives..so much so dat some men get shame and start to do what they had to do with a degree of seriousness. Nobody could tell yuh anything if yuh done all your work...yuh done..so if yuh want to breeze off..is no scene. Admittedly it doh always happen so...sometimes people watching yuh and vex with yuh cuz yuh doing wha yuh hadda do...and dem looking bad. In several state agencies that is de major problem...de old deadweight killing yuh zeal. And if any higher powers try to make dem accountable..de public service union go step in and make a setta backside noise. Here we have an attitude of rewarding mediocrity. Behaviours are learnt..if yuh eh getting no negative consequences for a negative action...den yuh go keep doing it. And it have no negative consequences for de slackness dat abounds in every sphere of local life. And dahs why it is how it is.

My major point is.......griping and trying to assign blame and say who at fault eh go do one damn ting. I hadda make out..and be able to stand on my own two feet. I does hadda spend 35 dollars a day in transport alone....doing a degree dat I wouldn't have been able to do if it wasn't for GATE. It hard yes...but i hadda make it. De same way and more I woulda be ketching my ass if i did take up dat scholarship in Howard cuz I did get 1480 in SAT. Buh in addition to knowing how the life is out there..and the ripple effect me leaving would have on my family...one thing i didn't want..is to come back with the attitude that I find most disgusting from most exports...dat here is de most backward waste of time place on earth...it eh have nuttin good...all it good for is to come and shake yuh backside for carnival for a week...and den buss it. Folly. Dey eh go study dat because we academic system more intensive dan the States that they able to excel and get where they are.

My philosophy in life is..nobody owe yuh nuttin.....so when somebody give yuh a bligh....say thanks..make the most of it..and return the favour to dem if possible...and if it eh possible....help out somebody else cause you know what it is to be helped. You cannot expect to be spoon fed and have everything fall into yuh lap. If nothing eh happening for you..then make something happen! Utilize every opportunity...yuh cyar be sitting down expecting ting to come easy. De only ting a black man does get easy is trouble..and I learn dat from an early age. I have a debt to this country that I would be glad to repay. I have a appreciation of persons differences that would help me be able to aclimitize to any culture in the world because i accustom seeing and appreciating persons and their similiarities and their differences. Imagine i went to school all the years of my life with the tuition fees paid. Thank God for dat too because imagine having to pay for school fees and on top of dat books..passage...all kinda ting. I make de most of wha i had so far..and I hoping to keep on advancing and contribute positively. Is one ting to say things bad..which i admit...things here can be better. But me sitting down and complaining and griping and deciding I eh coming home because tings too bad etc eh fixing nuttin. Den yuh does want to know why trinis talkin like dem from de yard and ting...because we as Trinis doh have no kinda blasted patriotism and genuine love for where we from.

If allyuh eh want to come back here...dahs aight. We done ketching we tail here with de dead weight it have already...if yuh eh going and make it better....den doh make it worse.

[Jah Gol]

Bourbon I fed up experience that. The line "Wham boy, how you workïng so hard , yuh trying to make we look bad or wha ?" is quintessentially Trinidadian.   

[ribbit]

all the local-based chiming in when the thread clearly addressed to those in foreign that considering a move back.

is not the people in trini that is the problem. is the norms and expectations and particularly the status quo, "we like it so" complacent mentality. to be blunt, some feel that is de mark of patriotism. this myth needs to be challenged. hopefully is like jc and sam say, the older generation taking these low expectations with dem when dey gorn.

weary, is not just express people reading, check the oecd and wec statistics on t&t. you think everything gang-related? if you doh know someone in t&t that affected by crime that NOT gang-related, go get yuh vision/hearing/senses checked.

elan, yuh leave out one of the most highly publicized stats in t&t - the murder rate since 2000.

makavelli - change schools. york u have a bad rep   is de jamaicans have jane & finch so.

omar, stress eh about making a living. stress is having to "move smart" all the time.

no one mention health care in t&t. that alone give serious pause to going back.

the other thing is the exchange rate.

[Jah Gol]

all the local-based chiming in when the thread clearly addressed to those in foreign that considering a move back.

is not the people in trini that is the problem. is the norms and expectations and particularly the status quo, "we like it so" complacent mentality. to be blunt, some feel that is de mark of patriotism. this myth needs to be challenged. hopefully is like jc and sam say, the older generation taking these low expectations with dem when dey gorn.

weary, is not just express people reading, check the oecd and wec statistics on t&t. you think everything gang-related? if you doh know someone in t&t that affected by crime that NOT gang-related, go get yuh vision/hearing/senses checked.

elan, yuh leave out one of the most highly publicized stats in t&t - the murder rate since 2000.

makavelli - change schools. york u have a bad rep   is de jamaicans have jane & finch so.

omar, stress eh about making a living. stress is having to "move smart" all the time.

no one mention health care in t&t. that alone give serious pause to going back.

the other thing is the exchange rate.

Clearly the question was intended for foreign based posters mainly. However that doesn't preclude local-based posters from contributing. I for one joined the discussion late for this same reason. I wanted the gauge the view of the members and make my own assessment.

[Organic]

all the local-based chiming in when the thread clearly addressed to those in foreign that considering a move back.

is not the people in trini that is the problem. is the norms and expectations and particularly the status quo, "we like it so" complacent mentality. to be blunt, some feel that is de mark of patriotism. this myth needs to be challenged. hopefully is like jc and sam say, the older generation taking these low expectations with dem when dey gorn.

weary, is not just express people reading, check the oecd and wec statistics on t&t. you think everything gang-related? if you doh know someone in t&t that affected by crime that NOT gang-related, go get yuh vision/hearing/senses checked.

elan, yuh leave out one of the most highly publicized stats in t&t - the murder rate since 2000.

makavelli - change schools. york u have a bad rep   is de jamaicans have jane & finch so.

omar, stress eh about making a living. stress is having to "move smart" all the time.

no one mention health care in t&t. that alone give serious pause to going back.

the other thing is the exchange rate.

Am i allowed to chime in? i Recently moved back or am i Local now and its not aimed at me?
 People settle where they feel comfortable or happy. I know a significant of foreigners who have recently migrated to Trinidad. Yes Trinidad has problems that is as apparent as some posters biased. However its not any reason to act as anyone who chooses to  move back dotish, or making a poor decision.

Those who ney saying talking out of a feeling of regret that things changing. Things changing for both the better and worse in Trinidad. the worse just seems to be a little more blatant.

Crime is bad getting worse.
Health care not the best but its far from the worst especially if you have money its pretty good.
The same flawed education system have some ah allyuh talking big now fighting it down. But again this education system is FAR from the worst in the world.


For those who dont think they could move back..thats fine....but your experience is different from someone else's. what u want out of life is not necessarily what the other person wants. Same goes for those who chose to move back. But the vibe that allyuh fighting down trini is a bad one. Its not constructive at all.

 Crime is a reality all over the world. yes trinidad its smaller and yes it makes it worse, however the "quality" of the crimes perpetrated in trinidad pales to some committed in places you guys feel comfortable in. MUrder is murder and its inherently bad, but it says something about a society in which a students runs into a school and shoots 20 odd people etc?

As touches said earlier if you have a good income in Trinidad and have family, friends and what ever u looking for out of life  Trinidad sweet.

Omar raised a good point which i noticed while living abroad. Same "trinis" who lazy and slack here will go foreign and word 2 jobs long hours and live in one rundown place to make ends meet. Why not pull your hand like that for"your" country?

some who say they will move back to trinidad in 10-15 years when things better, why not come back now and try to make that difference? To me if this is really your home that makes more sense. Fix your place first.
 Probably whats keeping your from doing that is that your afraid you will fall back in the same old let the government do it for we mold while you back here so u just waiting to help out when things good. typcial..no?? then maybe allyuh really still trinis to the bone.

[elan]

all the local-based chiming in when the thread clearly addressed to those in foreign that considering a move back.

is not the people in trini that is the problem. is the norms and expectations and particularly the status quo, "we like it so" complacent mentality. to be blunt, some feel that is de mark of patriotism. this myth needs to be challenged. hopefully is like jc and sam say, the older generation taking these low expectations with dem when dey gorn.

weary, is not just express people reading, check the oecd and wec statistics on t&t. you think everything gang-related? if you doh know someone in t&t that affected by crime that NOT gang-related, go get yuh vision/hearing/senses checked.

elan, yuh leave out one of the most highly publicized stats in t&t - the murder rate since 2000.

makavelli - change schools. york u have a bad rep   is de jamaicans have jane & finch so.

omar, stress eh about making a living. stress is having to "move smart" all the time.

no one mention health care in t&t. that alone give serious pause to going back.

the other thing is the exchange rate.

Am i allowed to chime in? i Recently moved back or am i Local now and its not aimed at me?
 People settle where they feel comfortable or happy. I know a significant of foreigners who have recently migrated to Trinidad. Yes Trinidad has problems that is as apparent as some posters biased. However its not any reason to act as anyone who chooses to  move back dotish, or making a poor decision.

Those who ney saying talking out of a feeling of regret that things changing. Things changing for both the better and worse in Trinidad. the worse just seems to be a little more blatant.

Crime is bad getting worse.
Health care not the best but its far from the worst especially if you have money its pretty good.
The same flawed education system have some ah allyuh talking big now fighting it down. But again this education system is FAR from the worst in the world.


For those who dont think they could move back..thats fine....but your experience is different from someone else's. what u want out of life is not necessarily what the other person wants. Same goes for those who chose to move back. But the vibe that allyuh fighting down trini is a bad one. Its not constructive at all.

 Crime is a reality all over the world. yes trinidad its smaller and yes it makes it worse, however the "quality" of the crimes perpetrated in trinidad pales to some committed in places you guys feel comfortable in. MUrder is murder and its inherently bad, but it says something about a society in which a students runs into a school and shoots 20 odd people etc?

As touches said earlier if you have a good income in Trinidad and have family, friends and what ever u looking for out of life  Trinidad sweet.

Omar raised a good point which i noticed while living abroad. Same "trinis" who lazy and slack here will go foreign and word 2 jobs long hours and live in one rundown place to make ends meet. Why not pull your hand like that for"your" country?
some who say they will move back to trinidad in 10-15 years when things better, why not come back now and try to make that difference? To me if this is really your home that makes more sense. Fix your place first.
 Probably whats keeping your from doing that is that your afraid you will fall back in the same old let the government do it for we mold while you back here so u just waiting to help out when things good. typcial..no?? then maybe allyuh really still trinis to the bone.

That right there is big time. I work over here like dog. I will never do that at home, never. I meet pardners on the train who I eh see for years and they can't stop to talk or take ah lil drink. They busy heading to another job or something. In trini having two jobs is almost a sin.

[just cool]

That right there is big time. I work over here like dog. I will never do that at home, never. I meet pardners on the train who I eh see for years and they can't stop to talk or take ah lil drink. They busy heading to another job or something. In trini having two jobs is almost a sin.

Breds who's fault is that! yuh want tuh blame that on america? the fact that a man could get two jobs is amazingly great bro. when i left trini, i couldn't even get ah messenger job, could you imagine holding down 2 jobs.

who said to be busy like that is ah sin, that's what great dreams are made of, man working hard towards their goals and coming through with flying colours.

when i lived in trinidad, the few places i was fortunate tuh land ah job , i saw ppl stayed home when the rain fell, or if the weather man predicted rain.

in foreign , nothing don't go like that, ppl go to work regardless and to me that's what makes these countries great, they don't stop @ nothing, maybe if T&T were to have that kinda work ethic i believe we would be further ahead and able to compete amongst the worlds greatest producers, but we luv tuh lime and drink, even during work hours!

maybe if we had the work ethic, drive and pride in achieving excellence, then just maybe we would've never been in this situation. the fact is trinbagonians need to be challenged, we are way too complaisant, and with the kind of potential we have i could see our twin island nation going places , only if we embrace hardship and commitment to excellence.

put down the bear @ 12 noon,  go the extra mile, stop running of to maracas wid yuh Secretary @ 2 pm,  start putting in the extra hour for your country's benefit, instead of limin after work volunteer your time to a yute program.

ppl are ashamed tuh admit just how really backward we are! like wim said , fellas rather hangout under a tree in maracas with ah scotch and coconut water in their hand.

the west didn't achieve all their accomplishments that help and benefit mankind the world over by liming and goofing off.

if the world was waiting for the caribbean tuh brace them with the technology we have today, we would've been stuck in the early 1900s!

nothings wrong wid hard work bro, it's what dreams are made of, trini's should try it sometime. even kevoughn connell talked about latas work ethic in training, he's never experienced that with gally, bertille and pancho, all 3rd worlders.

 yuh think latas woulda have such an intensity in his regiment if he remained in T&T and not lived abroad where he learned this work ethic and trade?

[verycute1]

OK so regardless of who the thread was directed at, here's what comes out.

The question get asked "foreign based would you move back"

Foreign based say no, none of that for me I ent like what I see/read/ hear/  Not the right time for me to move back, I based here, family here. Man get slammed for answering the question because local based dont like the answer.  

Local based saying allyuh stupid for leaving and even more stupid for not wanting to come back.

Man talking bout foreign based should come home and make a change. You really feel that will work? Who we going and fine to work an honest living? Import guyanese? Reading through this thread, there is a common theme, it have people who want it easy and dont want to work. Whats the use of coming back and trying to do good if you would hardly a reliable workforce? Peep will want to roll in whenever, take 2 hour lunches and leave at noon on friday. And don't say is the Trini way because if you talking bout coming back and making a change ent some of the work habits have to change too?  All of you who like it easy and like you half a day friday and you not paying your water/electric bill and cussing the man who come to disconnect so bad he leave and ent disconnect, would you really be willing to give that up in the name of progress?

 I was looking into coming back and starting one of those call centers. You know how if you based in US and you call tech support or your credit card info or customer service, you get india? I was looking into doing something like that at home.
I get put in meh place, when it was pointed out to me, that given the type of verbal abuse some of them call centers does take from frustrated customers, and they still manage to remain polite and say thank you very much, someone ask me if I really feel that type of thing will work in T&T. Rep get cuss by a frustated customer, and will cuss them back, and the number one rule of customer service is "the customer is always right" All it would take would be one angry rep cussing out a customer to lose the whole department.  Then they brought up to me the chronic lateness Trini have. Shift supposed to start at 8, trini roll in at 9:30. How you go run a business like that. And allyuh know that is the way it is. If a man show initiative, he go get talk down for making fellow co-workers look bad. Read the thread. So scratch that idea. Nobody want to do a job where you start at the bottom and work your way up, everyone want to start on top and get paid big dollar. barring that, they going tief you.

In answer to the question would you move back, for me temporarily yes for the sake of the kid's schooling, permanently right now, no.  One of the kids already in school in Trini the next one is old enough now and if we send her, I will go too to be with both of them and before anyone start jumping on me bout taking advantage of the "free education", the boy  go private school. It ent cheap in T&T but with the conversion rate it sure as hell cheaper than the tuition here for good private schools. Here for one child cost as much as my car. So we got a good school, small, private in Trini. At the end of the year, I ent even paying quarter of what I would pay here. But the education better.

Other than school, from an economic standpoint, if me and the man move here together, we will take a huge loss. I check the hospitals and private clinics for him and the money not there. If I move back, I ent coming home to take it easy and relax, I coming to have a good life for my family. That requires work.  Based on what we saw, and the real estate prices and the salaries that were offered for both of us in our fields, it better to stay US work hard, buy a house in TT pay it off and retire there in a few years. If I come with the other child, then based on what we saw, it better for him to stay US and work and send the yankee dollar. IS not that I ent want to return. is just based on what I see, I dont think it makes sense. No use coming to try and make a change if the society ent want it.

[giggsy11]

Would I return home to live? Hell yes!!

- All de holidays in de world
- De sweetest women in the world
- Roti and doubles
- Sunday lunch
- There's no Christmas like a trini Christmas
- Parang
- Carnival
- Fete after fete
- 2 hour lunch at de job is no scene
- De sweetest women in the world
- Lime
- Yuh could drink beers on de street
- No winter
- Yuh have a backyard i.e. yuh doh hadda pick up shit behind no dog
- Yuh could walk in yuh neighbor yard without calling first and lime, eat and drink free whole day
- Stress free living.. Ting to cry, yuh laughing
- Not everything hadda be about de almighty dollar
- Always something to break the monotony. From fetes -> Carnival -> easter -> jazz fest -> borough day -> tobago -> down de islands -> take ah lil trip for de summer -> band launch -> parang season -> fete again
- Tobago
- De beach right there
- Cosmopolitan. A black man, white man or chinee could dress in ah sari, eat roti, light deya and lime by yuh indian friends for Divali
- Yuh eh hadda deal with a society of mad people toting a setta stress and issues
- Yuh eh hadda cram on ah train or a subway
- De sweetest women in the world
Doh get tie up, trinidad real bad right now, but think of yuh computer as a magnifying glass.

It does look ten times worse than when yuh home and actually living in it.

I would love to move back home but allyuh see whey ah highlight dey? that go mash up the family!! cyar risk that atall.

  Temptation to bad, I sprain muh neck jus lookin!

[just cool]

Yuh know ppl in the caribbean blood very close to their skin! so any kinda criticism would be taken extemely personal.

 man taking this foreign ting way too serious when there's no need to.

i believe all i saying is ppl livin here in north america and the U.K. livin basically hectic but safe lives, and would rather deal with the hustle and bustle of work than crime and medical incompetance.

i livin in NYC and does feel real safe here, even though sh!t could go down @ any time. when i in trini i does be scared and uneasy, and rightfully so, i had the displeasure of seeing friends and loveones murdered for zilch. and a few got mugged and shot but survived.

so all i saying is when the police and the govt decide tuh put crime as top prority on their list and keep it there, together with the minsitry of health, then i would concider moving back home.

 my breddren from childhood died from jundus when he didn't have to. BC they had no medication in the hospital tuh treat him after he was there for a few day.

when these simple things are denied the public,who in their right minds would want tuh leave stable north america/ U.K. for T&T, no matter how warm and sweet it may be.

in a nut shell, ppl just want to be safe and be taken care of when they get sick, but safty would be my #1 priority! i could always pay some money in st clair medical center if nessesary.

[Bourbon]

So Jus cool...leh me ask this question.....dis zeal and fevour that exports does get when dey reach america and ting....where dey does get it from? Uncle Sam does spray pherohormones into de atmosphere in every american city dat does cause yuh to want to work hard? You kno how much places looking for people to work now and nobody taking it up? Yet people cussing when dey bring in de chinese and dem to work...buh look wha happening...dem willing to work..and dem working hard. Yuh eh hadda worry bout dem coming all kinda one hour late and ting..and taking extra lunch time and ting...dem know wha dey about..and dey doing it. So why locals cant have that same attitude? Every job i ever work i approaching it just so.....do my work..done de ole talk. So why de locals who here cyar do dat too? Wha stopping dem? Dey know damn well if dey do dat in america dey go starve. But here is always somebody looking for de easy way out. No kinda consequences for anyting.

My father went england to work a time.....and de kinda work he putting down...de locals and all shame...he eh know bout tea time and ting like dat...he come to work...and he doing it. We could work..jus de problem is doing it! Dat eh nobody fault but yours if you eh want to work. I does fed up hear stories bout men who does have a tremendous work ethic when it come to repsol, BP, BG and all dem companies..and how dey does change when dey reach Petrotrin. All because dey know is a state enterprise..it local....dey attitude doh hadda be serious.

I realise dat yuh hadda be serious to get anything here..so i am. My work ethic go be de same anywhere in the world i end up because why...anything worth doing is worth doing well. And dis watlessness we have ingrained in our psyche is wha does have our football de state it in...and add to that..people getting vex and cussing wim when he say de damn truth. How much work most Pro League players does do on dey own? How much men does be like a jumbie hitting freekicks by deyself....practicing trapping..or just running for de hell of it? The only time sucess could come before work is in de dictionary...and we doh realise dat. How much national scholarship winners have a poor work ethic? How much people who achieved on the world stage achieved by having a lackadastical attitude? Not many...if any at all. Buh nah..is always somebody else fault.

As i said..behaviours does be reinforced or re-evaluated by consequences. If Trinidad was to get a dictator dat hand heavy with discipline yuh go hear complaints. Buh dis lack of discipline and dis selfishness is wha have de country in de state it in. Police corrupt....cuz dem care bout dem and dem alone. Liscencing office corrupt..cuz it paying more to do the right thing..and dey hardly likely to get ketch. Anyting could do once yuh know de correct person....a bottle of Johnny does go a long way..all kinda folly. Machine readable passport taking all kinda 18 months to get..when keith salick who never had one before get he own in a matter of days because he had to travel on tour. It eh to say it cant be done....is just dat many refuse to do it because it doh matter if dey do..or if dey dont. So when dey feel to..they do it. And if you go contrary to the grain...dey looking to buss your throat cuz you makin dem look bad.

Change hadda start with me. Tings didnt get so overnight...so yuh cyar expect it to fix overnight. Buh if it hadda fix in any short period of time..a heavy hand hadda be employed. Buh many people eh go be able to handle dat...people does done open dey mouth for petty nonsense here...everyting is a problem. So....let tings remain as they are. I know if I eh part of de solution..ize part of de problem. So..i doing wha i hadda do..might be insignificant in the whole big picture....but..at least at the end of the day..my conscience clear.

It have rel plenty more i could say eh..buh.....people go get vex.

[STEUPS!!]

So Jus cool...leh me ask this question.....dis zeal and fevour that exports does get when dey reach america and ting....where dey does get it from? Uncle Sam does spray pherohormones into de atmosphere in every american city dat does cause yuh to want to work hard? You kno how much places looking for people to work now and nobody taking it up? Yet people cussing when dey bring in de chinese and dem to work...buh look wha happening...dem willing to work..and dem working hard. Yuh eh hadda worry bout dem coming all kinda one hour late and ting..and taking extra lunch time and ting...dem know wha dey about..and dey doing it. So why locals cant have that same attitude? Every job i ever work i approaching it just so.....do my work..done de ole talk. So why de locals who here cyar do dat too? Wha stopping dem? Dey know damn well if dey do dat in america dey go starve. But here is always somebody looking for de easy way out. No kinda consequences for anyting.

My father went england to work a time.....and de kinda work he putting down...de locals and all shame...he eh know bout tea time and ting like dat...he come to work...and he doing it. We could work..jus de problem is doing it! Dat eh nobody fault but yours if you eh want to work. I does fed up hear stories bout men who does have a tremendous work ethic when it come to repsol, BP, BG and all dem companies..and how dey does change when dey reach Petrotrin. All because dey know is a state enterprise..it local....dey attitude doh hadda be serious.

I realise dat yuh hadda be serious to get anything here..so i am. My work ethic go be de same anywhere in the world i end up because why...anything worth doing is worth doing well. And dis watlessness we have ingrained in our psyche is wha does have our football de state it in...and add to that..people getting vex and cussing wim when he say de damn truth. How much work most Pro League players does do on dey own? How much men does be like a jumbie hitting freekicks by deyself....practicing trapping..or just running for de hell of it? The only time sucess could come before work is in de dictionary...and we doh realise dat. How much national scholarship winners have a poor work ethic? How much people who achieved on the world stage achieved by having a lackadastical attitude? Not many...if any at all. Buh nah..is always somebody else fault.

As i said..behaviours does be reinforced or re-evaluated by consequences. If Trinidad was to get a dictator dat hand heavy with discipline yuh go hear complaints. Buh dis lack of discipline and dis selfishness is wha have de country in de state it in. Police corrupt....cuz dem care bout dem and dem alone. Liscencing office corrupt..cuz it paying more to do the right thing..and dey hardly likely to get ketch. Anyting could do once yuh know de correct person....a bottle of Johnny does go a long way..all kinda folly. Machine readable passport taking all kinda 18 months to get..when keith salick who never had one before get he own in a matter of days because he had to travel on tour. It eh to say it cant be done....is just dat many refuse to do it because it doh matter if dey do..or if dey dont. So when dey feel to..they do it. And if you go contrary to the grain...dey looking to buss your throat cuz you makin dem look bad.

Change hadda start with me. Tings didnt get so overnight...so yuh cyar expect it to fix overnight. Buh if it hadda fix in any short period of time..a heavy hand hadda be employed. Buh many people eh go be able to handle dat...people does done open dey mouth for petty nonsense here...everyting is a problem. So....let tings remain as they are. I know if I eh part of de solution..ize part of de problem. So..i doing wha i hadda do..might be insignificant in the whole big picture....but..at least at the end of the day..my conscience clear.

It have rel plenty more i could say eh..buh.....people go get vex.

bourbon, talk yuh talk padnah, doh hold back nuttin. lewwe hear yuh views

[WestCoast]

Bourbon,
Talk ya Talk

[Organic]

Yuh know ppl in the caribbean blood very close to their skin! so any kinda criticism would be taken extemely personal.

 man taking this foreign ting way too serious when there's no need to.

i believe all i saying is ppl livin here in north america and the U.K. livin basically hectic but safe lives, and would rather deal with the hustle and bustle of work than crime and medical incompetance.

i livin in NYC and does feel real safe here, even though sh!t could go down @ any time. when i in trini i does be scared and uneasy, and rightfully so, i had the displeasure of seeing friends and loveones murdered for zilch. and a few got mugged and shot but survived.

so all i saying is when the police and the govt decide tuh put crime as top prority on their list and keep it there, together with the minsitry of health, then i would concider moving back home.

 my breddren from childhood died from jundus when he didn't have to. BC they had no medication in the hospital tuh treat him after he was there for a few day.

when these simple things are denied the public,who in their right minds would want tuh leave stable north america/ U.K. for T&T, no matter how warm and sweet it may be.

in a nut shell, ppl just want to be safe and be taken care of when they get sick, but safty would be my #1 priority! i could always pay some money in st clair medical center if nessesary.

The first highlighted part is the only remnants of caribeanness u seem to have at times. Few people in here blood does seem to boil like yours.

 as to the second highlighted statement. Herein lies my point. Why wait for people who doh seem like they want things to improve to try and make it better.  if the place means anything to you(ignoring your  signature for a minute, in the spirit of this conversation) and family notwithstanding, why wont u come back and make the difference? i wonder if u think u worked hard and did somehting positive for your present place of abode or if it was basically inconsequential?

VC1 why u assuming the people dont want the change? cause they voted pnm again? the usa voted bush in twice no? people do want things to get better. If it is that u think trinis to lazy to foster the change again i say all the people who outside and have all the ideas and ways to foster change, by all means come back and help us with your know how.

 there is an overall vibe u get that the foreign based who live in the states vehemently defend the US agaisnt any negative statements on this forum. And the same goes for canada. It also seems that the majority of the things they say about trini has a negative tone (and i am positive that its because they llike trini so much that they just want better for it always).


everyone feels the frustration of a society gone sour. however as sizzla said words without works cant sustain. i tell my students all the time, they should consider not criticizing an opinion or theory unless they have some suggestion of an alternative.
Lemme try ah different type of reference....... Obama's general inclination seems to be not just to criticize all the time but actually look for and implement some sort of positive change.

Overall i acknowledge there are huge problems that are being faced by Trinidad and Tobago. There are huge problems being faced by alot of places all over the world. The point that everyone seems to agree with its up to where u feel safe and or happy for what ever reason.
Just as my i may think moving back was good for me, you (plural) may not agree.  that doesnt mean i right or you wrong. Individual experience is what often determines your point of view.

[Bourbon]

Yuh jus hadda realise...sometimes it doh make sense telling people cuz dey go refuse to let de facts influence their opinion. Reading some ah de replies in that confrontation in laventille thread just underline dat for me. If yuh in a hole cause a man put yuh in de hole....yuh go sit down and complain and fight the other people in de hole when it have several tools dat yuh could use to get out? And even if yuh get out..yuh go leave de other people in de hole too? Take responsibility! Buh nah..it easier to blame somebody else.

I serious..some ah de attitudes i does sense from people...better allyuh doh come back for real. Doh even bother bout carnival.....cuz yuh most likely to get rob den too. De same common sense yuh hadda utilize anywhere in the world to avoid being a victim of crime...yuh hadda utilize here. It have jobs. Granted...Tobago i does feel sorry for people..jobs harder to get there....cuz when people have a job..dem holding on to it. Unless yuh know somebody....it go be difficult. But some does come here and work...so it could be done if you willing to. Once it have a will it have a way. Until we take responsibility..and say...yuh know....is people being watless have de place so.....and it cyar continue so....we go always be in dis state.

[weary1969]

Yuh jus hadda realise...sometimes it doh make sense telling people cuz dey go refuse to let de facts influence their opinion. Reading some ah de replies in that confrontation in laventille thread just underline dat for me. If yuh in a hole cause a man put yuh in de hole....yuh go sit down and complain and fight the other people in de hole when it have several tools dat yuh could use to get out? And even if yuh get out..yuh go leave de other people in de hole too? Take responsibility! Buh nah..it easier to blame somebody else.

I serious..some ah de attitudes i does sense from people...better allyuh doh come back for real. Doh even bother bout carnival.....cuz yuh most likely to get rob den too. De same common sense yuh hadda utilize anywhere in the world to avoid being a victim of crime...yuh hadda utilize here. It have jobs. Granted...Tobago i does feel sorry for people..jobs harder to get there....cuz when people have a job..dem holding on to it. Unless yuh know somebody....it go be difficult. But some does come here and work...so it could be done if you willing to. Once it have a will it have a way. Until we take responsibility..and say...yuh know....is people being watless have de place so.....and it cyar continue so....we go always be in dis state.

Pass d offering plate. D peeps in bago is like leavin yuh state 2 go elsewhere 2 work. It happens all d time. I agree doh come back because dey wit dey frighten friday look go make it easy 4 dem bandit.