Manchester United vs Chelsea FA Community Shield 2009

[Mango Chow!]

Foster - not ready for the big teams yet, Fergie got it wrong with the goal keeping decision

Berbatov - Waste ah f@cking time and money, too slow for this United team, kills the attack too much.

Valencia - Did nothing coming on.... I'll give him some more time.

Evra -  Did well tonight, not sure why fergie made him take that penalty kick so early. He missed against Bayern too.

Ref - Poor refereeing, inconsistent with his calls and should have blown for the foul on Evra.


We need another magical player who can create something out of nothing, like Ronaldo use to do. Chelsea won tonight by penalties...congrats I guess . Let the season begin!!!!!

I disagree with you on Foster.  Other than a couple situations where he had balls played back to him and he may have looked a little unsettled with the opponents' resulting pressure on him (which a LOT of 'keepers would struggle with and more teams need to do like Chelsea did) I find he had a brilliant game and made some very good saves to keep manu in the game.

Brilliant?  We obviously saw two different games.  He was shaky on the back pass, and should have gotten enough on the second goal to deflect it around the post.  He looked short of match sharpness, and Sir Alex said that in his post match analysis of Foster's performance.  He is a good 'keeper, and I tip him to rebound from this.  He was definitely substandard yesterday.

   Yes, obviously we did.  I don't understand where you getting that a player (any player) would "...look short on match fitness...." in a pre-season game.  Please explain what it was about his game that showed a lack of "match fitness"? I mean, he was tired in the 50th minute or wha?  Yes he was shaky on two back passes, the first of which was one that his defender shouldn't have made because Drogba was within 10-15 yards of the 'keeper and he did what smart players should do more often and put pressure on the 'keeper.  Since the rule change on back passes, most 'keepers would still have trouble playing a back pass at their feet if an opponent put pressure on him.  To me you can take that with a grain of salt because more players need to do what Drogba did on both of those back passes.  He made at least two close range saves (Drogba again on one of them) that were most impressive and kept his team in the game.  Saying that he could have done better on the 2nd goal is like saying a 'keeper coulda do better on a penalty.  Lampard teed-up from 15 yards and most 'keepers might not have even gotten their hand to that shot.  I would quicker give Lampard credit for taking a good shot with the right amount of power and placement than to blame Foster on that goal.  the man was at least 4 yards off his line and while that might the goal a smaller target for Lampard, it also cuts down the 'keeper's reaction time.  Just getting a hand to it was impressive enough.   

[xixgon]

1. Nani's goal possibly should have been saved by Cech (possibly poor positioning, possibly confusion with Terry).

2. Park is clearly a situational player, used to shut down a dangerous threat/s in the opposition's team. I assume he was there to put additional pressure on the midfield and Chelsea's defense (and to be fair he kept Cole back for much of the match).

But let's just say having both him and O'Shea down the right is not exactly the most potent combination. Valencia will likely start there more often than not (with Park & Fletcher there in defensive pinches) and Nani, Tosic (& eventually Obertan) fighting it out on the left.

3. Berbatov will likely never be a go-to goalscorer for Utd - neither him nor Rooney are natural finishers. Rather the goals lost by the departure of Ronaldo (and to an extent Tevez) will have to be spread throughout the team - with the likely end of season club top scorers being Rooney, Berbatov, Owen, Valencia & Nani (Macheda will also get his opportunities, along with Diouf possibly being added to the mix in January).

4. Chelsea's first came from Nani not tracking Carvalho - which pretty much made his performance on the night a wash (goal scored, goal conceded).

5. Chelsea's second was left (as set in the rules) to the discretion of the ref and the players. If the ref deemed Evra to be sufficiently injured then he could have stopped the match - conversely Chelsea could have kicked the ball out. The gap left by Evra being out of the game meant a wide open shot for Lampard.

That said - Utd should have adapted to cover his position and Foster definitely should have saved the shot.

The goal was perfectly legal in the rules of the game - which is exactly what the ref will claim.

6. Rooney's goal was not offside - Cole played him on on the far side. What Chelsea's defensive line was doing so high - I have no idea. But there needs to be clear daylight between the attacker and the defender (with the attacker getting the benefit of any doubt) - Rooney's was thus a perfectly good goal.

7. The penalties are a crap shoot. They were poor by Utd, and to say Cech was a hero is hyperbole to the extreme. But shit happens in these things - Utd win them as much as they lose them - and u only have to ask John Terry what it means to miss them in a game that actually matters.

This game thankfully - outside of bragging rights - does not. That it gives u an edge in the season is unfounded considering until recently 8 of the winners in a row did not win the title - and that Utd started horribly to begin last season even though they triumphed in the CS.

To say Utd got lix after 2 soft goals and a penalty shootout, is quite simply baiting of the highest order


Thoughts for the start of the season:

Foster isn't ready (and I'm not convinced he'll ever be - nor can he seem to stay fit). His injury may be what Tomas needs to stake his claim.

Silva on Utd might be nice (though I'm not sure it makes sense financially or practically given his slight frame).

Utd need central midfield reinforcement - Chelsea overpowered them and Barca outplayed them - Carrick, Giggs, Anderson, Fletcher, Gibson, Scholes - looks less impressive than I'd like to say.

A fully fit Essien over a season makes Chelsea just that much more dangerous (the 1st player I would take from Chelsea if I had a chance).

Evra is a beast - Utd's most impressive player on the day for me - the penalty was awful but I don't count that against him.

Berbatov had an ok game - some nice touches - not not enough penetration. He needs to concentrate less on the flicks and tricks and be more of a CF for us this season - but facilitation really seems to be where he thrives. He would really be something next to a more direct striker - but Rooney has shown for England that he has the potential to be that. Can Berbatov be Wayne's Heskey? I guess only time will tell - size & style wise it seems unlikely though.


At the end of the day both teams seemed pretty evenly matched on a whole - I thought Utd looked more incisive, whereas Chelsea understandably lacked width and looked for the most part like the bulldozing Chelsea of old (Mikel ain't Makalele & Ivanovic isn't a RB). But 2-2 was about fair at the end of the day - no shame losing on penalties.

Bring on the real deal - let's get this party started!

[Mad Scorpion a/k/a Big Bo$$]

1. Nani's goal possibly should have been saved by Cech (possibly poor positioning, possibly confusion with Terry).

2. Park is clearly a situational player, used to shut down a dangerous threat/s in the opposition's team. I assume he was there to put additional pressure on the midfield and Chelsea's defense (and to be fair he kept Cole back for much of the match).

But let's just say having both him and O'Shea down the right is not exactly the most potent combination. Valencia will likely start there more often than not (with Park & Fletcher there in defensive pinches) and Nani, Tosic (& eventually Obertan) fighting it out on the left.

3. Berbatov will likely never be a go-to goalscorer for Utd - neither him nor Rooney are natural finishers. Rather the goals lost by the departure of Ronaldo (and to an extent Tevez) will have to be spread throughout the team - with the likely end of season club top scorers being Rooney, Berbatov, Owen, Valencia & Nani (Macheda will also get his opportunities, along with Diouf possibly being added to the mix in January).

4. Chelsea's first came from Nani not tracking Carvalho - which pretty much made his performance on the night a wash (goal scored, goal conceded).

5. Chelsea's second was left (as set in the rules) to the discretion of the ref and the players. If the ref deemed Evra to be sufficiently injured then he could have stopped the match - conversely Chelsea could have kicked the ball out. The gap left by Evra being out of the game meant a wide open shot for Lampard.

That said - Utd should have adapted to cover his position and Foster definitely should have saved the shot.

The goal was perfectly legal in the rules of the game - which is exactly what the ref will claim.

6. Rooney's goal was not offside - Cole played him on on the far side. What Chelsea's defensive line was doing so high - I have no idea. But there needs to be clear daylight between the attacker and the defender (with the attacker getting the benefit of any doubt) - Rooney's was thus a perfectly good goal.

7. The penalties are a crap shoot. They were poor by Utd, and to say Cech was a hero is hyperbole to the extreme. But shit happens in these things - Utd win them as much as they lose them - and u only have to ask John Terry what it means to miss them in a game that actually matters.

This game thankfully - outside of bragging rights - does not. That it gives u an edge in the season is unfounded considering until recently 8 of the winners in a row did not win the title - and that Utd started horribly to begin last season even though they triumphed in the CS.

To say Utd got lix after 2 soft goals and a penalty shootout, is quite simply baiting of the highest order


Thoughts for the start of the season:

Foster isn't ready (and I'm not convinced he'll ever be - nor can he seem to stay fit). His injury may be what Tomas needs to stake his claim.

Silva on Utd might be nice (though I'm not sure it makes sense financially or practically given his slight frame).

Utd need central midfield reinforcement - Chelsea overpowered them and Barca outplayed them - Carrick, Giggs, Anderson, Fletcher, Gibson, Scholes - looks less impressive than I'd like to say.

A fully fit Essien over a season makes Chelsea just that much more dangerous (the 1st player I would take from Chelsea if I had a chance).

Evra is a beast - Utd's most impressive player on the day for me - the penalty was awful but I don't count that against him.

Berbatov had an ok game - some nice touches - not not enough penetration. He needs to concentrate less on the flicks and tricks and be more of a CF for us this season - but facilitation really seems to be where he thrives. He would really be something next to a more direct striker - but Rooney has shown for England that he has the potential to be that. Can Berbatov be Wayne's Heskey? I guess only time will tell - size & style wise it seems unlikely though.


At the end of the day both teams seemed pretty evenly matched on a whole - I thought Utd looked more incisive, whereas Chelsea understandably lacked width and looked for the most part like the bulldozing Chelsea of old (Mikel ain't Makalele & Ivanovic isn't a RB). But 2-2 was about fair at the end of the day - no shame losing on penalties.

Bring on the real deal - let's get this party started!

Yeah ok, did you see a different set of camera angles than was shown on TV?

[acb]

3 Cup Finals lost in 4 months, 2 of their most influential players walk out on the squad, a bankrupt shirt sponsor and a shitty uniform.

glory glory.

[xixgon]

1. Nani's goal possibly should have been saved by Cech (possibly poor positioning, possibly confusion with Terry).

2. Park is clearly a situational player, used to shut down a dangerous threat/s in the opposition's team. I assume he was there to put additional pressure on the midfield and Chelsea's defense (and to be fair he kept Cole back for much of the match).

But let's just say having both him and O'Shea down the right is not exactly the most potent combination. Valencia will likely start there more often than not (with Park & Fletcher there in defensive pinches) and Nani, Tosic (& eventually Obertan) fighting it out on the left.

3. Berbatov will likely never be a go-to goalscorer for Utd - neither him nor Rooney are natural finishers. Rather the goals lost by the departure of Ronaldo (and to an extent Tevez) will have to be spread throughout the team - with the likely end of season club top scorers being Rooney, Berbatov, Owen, Valencia & Nani (Macheda will also get his opportunities, along with Diouf possibly being added to the mix in January).

4. Chelsea's first came from Nani not tracking Carvalho - which pretty much made his performance on the night a wash (goal scored, goal conceded).

5. Chelsea's second was left (as set in the rules) to the discretion of the ref and the players. If the ref deemed Evra to be sufficiently injured then he could have stopped the match - conversely Chelsea could have kicked the ball out. The gap left by Evra being out of the game meant a wide open shot for Lampard.

That said - Utd should have adapted to cover his position and Foster definitely should have saved the shot.

The goal was perfectly legal in the rules of the game - which is exactly what the ref will claim.

6. Rooney's goal was not offside - Cole played him on on the far side. What Chelsea's defensive line was doing so high - I have no idea. But there needs to be clear daylight between the attacker and the defender (with the attacker getting the benefit of any doubt) - Rooney's was thus a perfectly good goal.

7. The penalties are a crap shoot. They were poor by Utd, and to say Cech was a hero is hyperbole to the extreme. But shit happens in these things - Utd win them as much as they lose them - and u only have to ask John Terry what it means to miss them in a game that actually matters.

This game thankfully - outside of bragging rights - does not. That it gives u an edge in the season is unfounded considering until recently 8 of the winners in a row did not win the title - and that Utd started horribly to begin last season even though they triumphed in the CS.

To say Utd got lix after 2 soft goals and a penalty shootout, is quite simply baiting of the highest order


Thoughts for the start of the season:

Foster isn't ready (and I'm not convinced he'll ever be - nor can he seem to stay fit). His injury may be what Tomas needs to stake his claim.

Silva on Utd might be nice (though I'm not sure it makes sense financially or practically given his slight frame).

Utd need central midfield reinforcement - Chelsea overpowered them and Barca outplayed them - Carrick, Giggs, Anderson, Fletcher, Gibson, Scholes - looks less impressive than I'd like to say.

A fully fit Essien over a season makes Chelsea just that much more dangerous (the 1st player I would take from Chelsea if I had a chance).

Evra is a beast - Utd's most impressive player on the day for me - the penalty was awful but I don't count that against him.

Berbatov had an ok game - some nice touches - not not enough penetration. He needs to concentrate less on the flicks and tricks and be more of a CF for us this season - but facilitation really seems to be where he thrives. He would really be something next to a more direct striker - but Rooney has shown for England that he has the potential to be that. Can Berbatov be Wayne's Heskey? I guess only time will tell - size & style wise it seems unlikely though.


At the end of the day both teams seemed pretty evenly matched on a whole - I thought Utd looked more incisive, whereas Chelsea understandably lacked width and looked for the most part like the bulldozing Chelsea of old (Mikel ain't Makalele & Ivanovic isn't a RB). But 2-2 was about fair at the end of the day - no shame losing on penalties.

Bring on the real deal - let's get this party started!

Yeah ok, did you see a different set of camera angles than was shown on TV?

He was level as u can see from the 56th second onwards in this clip  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYPla_JFA6Q&fmt=18 (Andy Grey admits as much). If u think he was far enough ahead of the line for the official not to give him the benefit of the doubt, then you're having a laugh (& a very biased one at that).

Anyway, what do u care, ur team won. All 4 goals were legal in my opinion - even if this was the best of the bunch.

[Mad Scorpion a/k/a Big Bo$$]

He was level as u can see from the 56th second onwards in this clip  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYPla_JFA6Q&fmt=18 (Andy Grey admits as much). If u think he was far enough ahead of the line for the official not to give him the benefit of the doubt, then you're having a laugh (& a very biased one at that).

Anyway, what do u care, ur team won. All 4 goals were legal in my opinion - even if this was the best of the bunch.

Are you sure you watched that link, the frame on the 56th second shows him offside.  Unless the lines on the grass aren't straight you can see where Cole and Rooney are different distances from the edge of the grass shadow.  You may not want to accept it but it is there to see.  Like I said earlier I'm glad it wasn't called tho, because we have 2 controversial goals split between the 2 teams.  So no one can claim either team was cheated really.

[kicker]

Rooney looked like he was marginally ahead of Cole...Note that the linesman was also on Cole's side of the field- that could make a difference - i.e. tougher to make a call on a player collecting the ball on the far side when the linesman's point of reference is a player very close to him... Either way it was close enough for the attacker to get the benefit of the doubt

Did any of the defenders throw a hand up in appeal of the goal? - don't remember...  That's also a telling indication.

[xixgon]

He was level as u can see from the 56th second onwards in this clip  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYPla_JFA6Q&fmt=18 (Andy Grey admits as much). If u think he was far enough ahead of the line for the official not to give him the benefit of the doubt, then you're having a laugh (& a very biased one at that).

Anyway, what do u care, ur team won. All 4 goals were legal in my opinion - even if this was the best of the bunch.

Are you sure you watched that link, the frame on the 56th second shows him offside.  Unless the lines on the grass aren't straight you can see where Cole and Rooney are different distances from the edge of the grass shadow.  You may not want to accept it but it is there to see.  Like I said earlier I'm glad it wasn't called tho, because we have 2 controversial goals split between the 2 teams.  So no one can claim either team was cheated really.

Well you believe there is daylight between the players, I don't - simple as that I guess. The attacking player is meant to get the benefit of the doubt, and at the speed of this play there's no way that the official could have been sure either way - hence Rooney was allowed through.

The lack of protest by any of the Chelsea players (or bench) and the judgment (based on the replays) by Grey just makes me more certain about my own opinion (if not that he was onside, then it was ambiguous enough then and now for those involved to accept that it was a goal).

But like you say, it's a moot point. Just makes me question people's interpretation of the offside rule and bias towards Utd in general is all.

[Tenorsaw]

Foster - not ready for the big teams yet, Fergie got it wrong with the goal keeping decision

Berbatov - Waste ah f@cking time and money, too slow for this United team, kills the attack too much.

Valencia - Did nothing coming on.... I'll give him some more time.

Evra -  Did well tonight, not sure why fergie made him take that penalty kick so early. He missed against Bayern too.

Ref - Poor refereeing, inconsistent with his calls and should have blown for the foul on Evra.


We need another magical player who can create something out of nothing, like Ronaldo use to do. Chelsea won tonight by penalties...congrats I guess . Let the season begin!!!!!

I disagree with you on Foster.  Other than a couple situations where he had balls played back to him and he may have looked a little unsettled with the opponents' resulting pressure on him (which a LOT of 'keepers would struggle with and more teams need to do like Chelsea did) I find he had a brilliant game and made some very good saves to keep manu in the game.

Brilliant?  We obviously saw two different games.  He was shaky on the back pass, and should have gotten enough on the second goal to deflect it around the post.  He looked short of match sharpness, and Sir Alex said that in his post match analysis of Foster's performance.  He is a good 'keeper, and I tip him to rebound from this.  He was definitely substandard yesterday.

   Yes, obviously we did.  I don't understand where you getting that a player (any player) would "...look short on match fitness...." in a pre-season game.  Please explain what it was about his game that showed a lack of "match fitness"? I mean, he was tired in the 50th minute or wha?  Yes he was shaky on two back passes, the first of which was one that his defender shouldn't have made because Drogba was within 10-15 yards of the 'keeper and he did what smart players should do more often and put pressure on the 'keeper.  Since the rule change on back passes, most 'keepers would still have trouble playing a back pass at their feet if an opponent put pressure on him.  To me you can take that with a grain of salt because more players need to do what Drogba did on both of those back passes.  He made at least two close range saves (Drogba again on one of them) that were most impressive and kept his team in the game.  Saying that he could have done better on the 2nd goal is like saying a 'keeper coulda do better on a penalty.  Lampard teed-up from 15 yards and most 'keepers might not have even gotten their hand to that shot.  I would quicker give Lampard credit for taking a good shot with the right amount of power and placement than to blame Foster on that goal.  the man was at least 4 yards off his line and while that might the goal a smaller target for Lampard, it also cuts down the 'keeper's reaction time.  Just getting a hand to it was impressive enough.  

Boss we ain't talking bout any keeper here; we're talking about supposedly the heir to the England #1 shirt.  Foster seemed to be matching sharpness, and yeah it's only preseason, but the league starts this week.  We've seen 'keepers make those saves, and as a matter of fact, Foster did make a smart save low to his right that shows he is capable of making those types of saves.  He was inconsistent at best.  No way can you say he had an excellent game.  That back pass rule has been in existence for over 15 years now, so how is that a new rule?  He would have been playing to that rule ever since he started playing the position.  He was mediocre, and relative to his potential and capability, underperformed.