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Offline royal

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2011 NBA Finals Thread
« on: May 28, 2011, 05:24:58 AM »
DALLAS -- No matter how fitting the chance for the Dallas Mavericks to come full circle since the 2006 Finals meltdown against the Miami Heat, forward Dirk Nowitzki has no interest in playing the revenge card.

"It doesn't really matter that much to me," Nowitzki said after Friday's practice. "We had a huge chance in '06 and let it slip away, so we've got another crack at it. You never know in this league if you ever get another chance, and we're able to get to this stage again and it feels good."

Nowitzki is so intently focused on the task at hand that he didn't even allow himself to soak in the moment of capturing a second Western Conference title. He bolted from the trophy presentation, hopping over the scorer's table and disappearing into the tunnel before he could even be interviewed on national television.

"Now we've just got to go for it and do all the things that got us here," Nowitzki said. "And that's play some defense, rebound the ball and ball movement on the offensive floor."

The Mavericks took a 2-0 lead on the Heat in the '06 Finals and took their talents to South Beach with a head of steam and championship parade plans in the works at City Hall.

Dallas led Game 3 in Miami by 13 points with 6:42 left in the game when everything went haywire. Led by Dwyane Wade's parade to the free throw line, the Heat rallied for the win and never lost again.
 

It might not have mattered to Nowitzki if the Chicago Bulls had come out of the Eastern Conference instead, but he has never let go of just how close the Mavs were to winning a championship or the struggles in the seasons since that have come to define the franchise and Nowitzki.

"Obviously, it was one of the toughest losses we've ever gone through as a franchise," Nowitzki said. "Me personally, to be up 2-0 and not a find a way to win another game, that was tough. But, you've got to give Miami credit ... It took us a long time to get back to this stage."

Nowitzki and Jason Terry are the only remaining members from the '06 Finals team, plus assistant coach Darrell Armstrong. Wade and Udonis Haslem, freshly returned from a season-long foot injury, are the only holdovers on the Miami side.

The Heat prospered from the offseason's free-agent coup, combining superstar LeBron James and Chris Bosh with Wade and surrounding the trio with a group of low-salaried role players. The Mavs' '06 team did not include Jason Kidd running the point, Shawn Marion making significant contributions on both ends at small forward or the emotional and defensive leadership of center Tyson Chandler.

Terry, Dallas' point guard in his second season in '06 and now a potent scoring weapon as the sixth man, has consistently contended that the '06 title rightfully belonged in Dallas. After defeating the Oklahoma City Thunder to win a second Western Conference title on Wednesday, Terry seemed a bit little conflicted about his emotions regarding the Heat.

"That's not the same team," Terry said. "Pat Riley's not even coaching. I've always said it, though, every time we've played the Heat it's always been something special, even in the regular season those five years."

Jeff Caplan covers the Mavericks for ESPNDallas.com.


Offline Controversial

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2011, 12:13:58 PM »
Go HEAT  :beermug:

Offline weary1969

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2011, 09:55:18 PM »
Me eh even realize is 2nite was game 1 is meh sis post on fb make me realize. Game 1 2 Lebron etal.
Today you're the dog, tomorrow you're the hydrant - so be good to others - it comes back!"

Online Peong

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2011, 11:51:36 PM »
Lebron + Wade is a highlight machine.
Highlights for me: Lebron's charge and dunk right through the middle, Wade to Lebron for an ally-oop in all kinda traffic,  Wade's block and then run to the other end to hit a three.
Those fellas really feed off of adrenaline.
The Heat's last few 4th quarters have been fantastic.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 11:54:11 PM by Peong »

Offline weary1969

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2011, 09:50:33 PM »
GAME 2 MAVSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

Today you're the dog, tomorrow you're the hydrant - so be good to others - it comes back!"

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2011, 10:09:15 PM »
Great game... almost undone by poor officiating.  Incredible poise by Dallas, not just to come back from 15 down with 6 mins left, but to overcome some really baffling and flat out horrible calls by the officials.  Spoelstra showed again why he's still growing into the role.  Miami went into celebration mode after the Wade 3 put them up 88-73 with six and change to play.  They scored 5 points the rest of the way, and three of those came with 24 seconds left in the game.  Credit to the Mavs defense, but Miami degenerated into poorly executed screen and rolls with either Wade or James forced into some near impossible shot at the end of the possesion.  Dallas did its job and broke serve... game on now.

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2011, 10:54:11 PM »
At this level, poor play is punished severely.  No reason to let your opponent go on such a run.
Maybe Miami made their push too early and ran out of gas.
At the end there Dallas played like veterans while Miami ran around like rookies.
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2011, 11:13:58 PM »
At this level, poor play is punished severely.  No reason to let your opponent go on such a run.
Maybe Miami made their push too early and ran out of gas.
At the end there Dallas played like veterans while Miami ran around like rookies.
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

They have home court advantage... but as they know all too well, that by itself says nothing.

Offline royal

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2011, 12:14:17 PM »

Heat's cocky moves fuel Mavs' comeback

The Heat had come so far, so fast, and now here was the moment when it all came unglued, when they went right back to their worst tendencies. Oblivious. Cocky. Just unnecessary. When they play hard they reach seemingly unattainable heights. When they think things will be easy, even for just a moment, they can crater out with unfathomable fury.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=dw-wetzel_heat_mavericks_collapse_celebration_game2_finals060311

Online Peong

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2011, 12:34:36 PM »
At this level, poor play is punished severely.  No reason to let your opponent go on such a run.
Maybe Miami made their push too early and ran out of gas.
At the end there Dallas played like veterans while Miami ran around like rookies.
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

They have home court advantage... but as they know all too well, that by itself says nothing.
Sometimes it does say something, plus they won 1 in Miami so it's not by itself.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2011, 04:45:19 PM »
Sometimes it does say something, plus they won 1 in Miami so it's not by itself.

In 2006 they had the home court advantage, won the first two games... then proceeded to lose 4 straight, including the clinching game at home.  Home court advantage has meaning, but a deep, talented, veteran team can easily neutralize any home court advantage as Dallas showed last night.  They now need to hold serve at home, whether they can do so remains to be seen, therefore home court advantage by itself isn't going to mean a whole lot.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2011, 04:52:50 PM »

Heat's cocky moves fuel Mavs' comeback

The Heat had come so far, so fast, and now here was the moment when it all came unglued, when they went right back to their worst tendencies. Oblivious. Cocky. Just unnecessary. When they play hard they reach seemingly unattainable heights. When they think things will be easy, even for just a moment, they can crater out with unfathomable fury.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=dw-wetzel_heat_mavericks_collapse_celebration_game2_finals060311

The leaping chest bumping and punches rubbed me the wrong way too... especially with so much time left.  That said, Terry and them need to STFU... is that what they needed to wake them up from the cut-ass Miami was putting on them?  That's what they needed in order to finally  start hitting open shots or to stop giving the ball away? Forget turning the ball over... big veteran like Kidd was jumping to pass and getting caught up in the air and turning it over for fast break dunk.  A next time Stevenson cross mid-court and pass him the ball, he caught it and looked to pass it back but Stevenson had turned his back.  In holding onto it Kidd traveled for yet another silly turnover.  Some mild celebration is what they needed to finally start playing basketball with 7 mins left?  Please.

That said... great win again.  Dirk Nowitzsky showed exactly why he's such a phenomenal player.  Turned Bosh out like ah $2 hoe on that last play.

Online Peong

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2011, 07:31:56 PM »
At this level, poor play is punished severely.  No reason to let your opponent go on such a run.
Maybe Miami made their push too early and ran out of gas.
At the end there Dallas played like veterans while Miami ran around like rookies.
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

They have home court advantage... but as they know all too well, that by itself says nothing.


Sometimes it does say something, plus they won 1 in Miami so it's not by itself.

In 2006 they had the home court advantage, won the first two games... then proceeded to lose 4 straight, including the clinching game at home.  Home court advantage has meaning, but a deep, talented, veteran team can easily neutralize any home court advantage as Dallas showed last night.  They now need to hold serve at home, whether they can do so remains to be seen, therefore home court advantage by itself isn't going to mean a whole lot.

So yuh tune change now from "doh mean nutting" to "doh mean a lot".  Ok I will take dat.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2011, 08:24:35 PM »
So yuh tune change now from "doh mean nutting" to "doh mean a lot".  Ok I will take dat.

Maybe you should read a little closer before you start nitpicking.  I won't even bother getting into the fact that "says nothing" and "doh mean nutting" are two different things, so since you want to equate them we'll roll with that.  Different words, same substance... reiterating my position, home court advantage by itself says nothing. 

« Last Edit: June 04, 2011, 08:26:29 PM by Bakes »

Online Peong

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2011, 09:03:56 PM »
So yuh tune change now from "doh mean nutting" to "doh mean a lot".  Ok I will take dat.

Maybe you should read a little closer before you start nitpicking.  I won't even bother getting into the fact that "says nothing" and "doh mean nutting" are two different things, so since you want to equate them we'll roll with that.  Different words, same substance... reiterating my position, home court advantage by itself says nothing. 

You changed your story, now you want to revert, cool.
I not sure why you bent on talking about home court advantage by itself though.
You can talk about the Dallas situation in its entirety, you don't have to fixate on what home court advantage says all by itself.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2011, 11:40:30 PM »
You changed your story, now you want to revert, cool.

You either have a literacy problem or a cognitive one.  My statements are there for all to scrutinize and arrive at their own conclusions.  I stand by every statement I have made in this thread and in the "Playoffs" thread.  Not only that... but off the top of my head 99% of them have come to pass.  I have no reason to now start changing anything or backtracking from anything.  In a qualitative discussion (where we aren't measuring actual quantities), the difference between "nothing" and "isn't... a whole lot" is infinitissimal at best.  If that is what you want to hinge your argument on then be my guest.



Quote
I not sure why you bent on talking about home court advantage by itself though.
You can talk about the Dallas situation in its entirety, you don't have to fixate on what home court advantage says all by itself.

This is what you said.

Quote
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

Seems to me that you are here predicating Dallas' "advantage" on the basis of them having the next three home games.  That is what I was specifically responding to.  Having home court is an advantage only if you win at home... you still have to go out and play the game.  This I thought was explained to you by my reference to them losing four straight in 2006... history has shown that home court advantage without more means nothing... or lest you should accuse me of being inconsistent with my words, history has shown that by itself it says nothing.

If you have other factors for me to comment on besides home court, I'm more than happy to weigh in.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2011, 04:02:18 PM by Bakes »

Offline sinned

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2011, 02:20:32 PM »
Just to get this thread back on track - Go Mavs! Interesting to see the game 3 adjustments from both teams

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2011, 04:09:51 PM »
Just to get this thread back on track - Go Mavs! Interesting to see the game 3 adjustments from both teams

Lost in all of this has been Nowitzki's rebounding... he lead all players last game with 11, and over the two games averaging 9.5, more than his season average of 7.0 and more than his career average of 8.4.  Now you could say that for a 7-footer he should be averaging more, but this is his highest figure so far for the playoffs, year and career.  I sure what happen in Game 1 of the Conference Finals against Chicago not lost on Dallas... get second chance buckets.  On the other side I expect Miami to try and get Bosh going inside early, and whether it's him or whomever Nowitzski guards, have them make him work defensively so that he can't keep carrying the Mavs at the end of games.

Offline sinned

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2011, 04:22:24 PM »
Lost in all of this has been Nowitzki's rebounding... he lead all players last game with 11, and over the two games averaging 9.5, more than his season average of 7.0 and more than his career average of 8.4.  Now you could say that for a 7-footer he should be averaging more, but this is his highest figure so far for the playoffs, year and career.  I sure what happen in Game 1 of the Conference Finals against Chicago not lost on Dallas... get second chance buckets.  On the other side I expect Miami to try and get Bosh going inside early, and whether it's him or whomever Nowitzski guards, have them make him work defensively so that he can't keep carrying the Mavs at the end of games.
Yep rebounding will be key. Dirk actually has a career playoff rebound average of 10.4 so it's not totally unexpected. Chandler and him need to continue to hit the boards hard.

Dallas needs to really limit turnovers - I know the Heat defense forces a lot of turnovers but last game, many of them were unforced - dribbling off their feet, losing the handle etc.

Dallas's D has actually been pretty good. A lot of zone in Game 1, a lot of man to man in Game 2. I expect a mix in game 3.

I'm quietly confident in this game.

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2011, 06:56:04 PM »
Dallas playing stupid ball!

Online Peong

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2011, 07:56:19 PM »
Quote
This is what you said.

Quote
Dallas has three home games next. I would say they have the advantage.

Seems to me that you are here predicating Dallas' "advantage" on the basis of them having the next three home games.  That is what I was specifically responding to.  Having home court is an advantage only if you win at home... you still have to go out and play the game.  This I thought was explained to you by my reference to them losing four straight in 2006... history has shown that home court advantage without more means nothing... or lest you should accuse me of being inconsistent with my words, history has shown that by itself it says nothing.

If you have other factors for me to comment on besides home court, I'm more than happy to weigh in.

Why would you assume that my reasons for saying that are ONLY what I include in my post?  That is very strange.
I don't need to touch on every reason or factor that affects why I think that Dallas has an advantage in my post.  You have ESPN and TNT for that. 

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2011, 08:05:48 PM »
You changed your story, now you want to revert, cool.

You either have a literacy problem or a cognitive one.  My statements are there for all to scrutinize and arrive at their own conclusions.  I stand by every statement I have made in this thread and in the "Playoffs" thread.  Not only that... but off the top of my head 99% of them have come to pass.  I have no reason to now start changing anything or backtracking from anything.  In a qualitative discussion (where we aren't measuring actual quantities), the difference between "nothing" and "isn't... a whole lot" is infinitissimal at best.  If that is what you want to hinge your argument on then be my guest.

This part I was just pulling yuh leg over the slight though definite difference in what you said.
Now that you mentioned your 99% success rate with statements that come to pass, well that is real impressive.  I'm sure somebody is interested in that.

Offline Bakes

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2011, 09:24:37 PM »
Great game for the neutral tonight... if you're a partisan you want your team to win comfortably, but if you're a neutral fan you want excitement to the end and in that light the teams did not disappoint.  I'm scratching my head trying to pinpoint a reason why Dallas lost this game, and having not looked at the stats, nothing really jumps out at me. Dwayne Wade just imposed his will on the game, even though Dallas kept him more in check near the end.  Have to tip my hat to the Heat defense overall... they made Nowitzski work for every point tonight and he missed shots that normally he'd make... like that one at the end of the game.  That's just how the ball bounces sometimes... literally.

Tyson Chandler is a beast on the boards... I personally haven't seen a rebounder that dominant since Rodman.  It seems clear now that New Orleans gave up on him too soon following his injury.

Offline futbolfan

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2011, 06:33:39 AM »
Great game for the neutral tonight... if you're a partisan you want your team to win comfortably, but if you're a neutral fan you want excitement to the end and in that light the teams did not disappoint.  I'm scratching my head trying to pinpoint a reason why Dallas lost this game, and having not looked at the stats, nothing really jumps out at me. Dwayne Wade just imposed his will on the game, even though Dallas kept him more in check near the end.  Have to tip my hat to the Heat defense overall... they made Nowitzski work for every point tonight and he missed shots that normally he'd make... like that one at the end of the game.  That's just how the ball bounces sometimes... literally.

Tyson Chandler is a beast on the boards... I personally haven't seen a rebounder that dominant since Rodman.  It seems clear now that New Orleans gave up on him too soon following his injury.
Chandler is ah beast on the boards, but Kevin Love from the T'Wolves is a much better rebounder and  contributes far more on offense. That said both New Orleans and  Chicago gave up on him too early.

This series like the previous Chicago series should have been a sweep. If Miami was not so complacement and lacking in concentration for long stretches of the game, this would not even be a contest.
The darkest hour is just before the dawn.

Offline capodetutticapi

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2011, 02:11:48 PM »
Great game for the neutral tonight... if you're a partisan you want your team to win comfortably, but if you're a neutral fan you want excitement to the end and in that light the teams did not disappoint.  I'm scratching my head trying to pinpoint a reason why Dallas lost this game, and having not looked at the stats, nothing really jumps out at me. Dwayne Wade just imposed his will on the game, even though Dallas kept him more in check near the end.  Have to tip my hat to the Heat defense overall... they made Nowitzski work for every point tonight and he missed shots that normally he'd make... like that one at the end of the game.  That's just how the ball bounces sometimes... literally.

Tyson Chandler is a beast on the boards... I personally haven't seen a rebounder that dominant since Rodman.  It seems clear now that New Orleans gave up on him too soon following his injury.
Chandler is ah beast on the boards, but Kevin Love from the T'Wolves is a much better rebounder and  contributes far more on offense. That said both New Orleans and  Chicago gave up on him too early.

This series like the previous Chicago series should have been a sweep. If Miami was not so complacement and lacking in concentration for long stretches of the game, this would not even be a contest.
Dallas eh no cakewalk,this goin to de wire.my money still on dallas.
soon ah go b ah lean mean bulling machine.

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #25 on: June 06, 2011, 02:24:26 PM »
Great game in truth.  Mavs had a run of calls that went there way.  The double dribble call on Lebron was that legit?  Didn't a Mavs player hit it?

Offline soccerman

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2011, 02:28:06 PM »
Well since the NBA went to the 2,3,2 homecourt format for the finals, the winner of game 3 when the series is 1-1 has never lost, so let's give Miami the trophy now and keeping everyone in suspense.

Anyway last night's games was a great one to watch, D Wade was spectacular and Dirk was impressive as usual, except for the last shot and if you recalled he hit the identical shot earlier in the game and scored. All I can say is if Dallas don't win game 4 the series is over....then again what I talking about? Miami won game 3 so the series is over ;D

Offline sinned

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #27 on: June 07, 2011, 02:28:32 PM »
Chandler is ah beast on the boards, but Kevin Love from the T'Wolves is a much better rebounder and  contributes far more on offense.
But Love is a below average man defender and a below (some would say poor) help defender. Chandler is very good at both.

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #28 on: June 07, 2011, 05:11:40 PM »
I not even sure how Love reach in this talk to be honest.  Love is a very good player, but I doubt he commands the attention that Chandler has been commanding this post-season.... let's say that again POST-season.  It matters not what you do but when you do it.... taking nothing away from Love but when he starts performing on the big boy stage then we'll bring him in the talk.


On another note... congrats to Mark Jackson on being named new Warriors head coach.  Kinda bizarre if you ask me.

As for tonight's game... Mavs need more from Terry and Marion if they are to have any chance.  Coming into the series all the talk was about the Mavs bench being better than the Heat's.  Doesn't seem to be the case now, does it?  So much for Dallas having the "advantage" too.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 07:52:17 PM by Bakes »

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Re: 2011 NBA Finals Thread
« Reply #29 on: June 07, 2011, 07:26:50 PM »
Great game for the neutral tonight... if you're a partisan you want your team to win comfortably, but if you're a neutral fan you want excitement to the end and in that light the teams did not disappoint.  I'm scratching my head trying to pinpoint a reason why Dallas lost this game, and having not looked at the stats, nothing really jumps out at me. Dwayne Wade just imposed his will on the game, even though Dallas kept him more in check near the end.  Have to tip my hat to the Heat defense overall... they made Nowitzski work for every point tonight and he missed shots that normally he'd make... like that one at the end of the game.  That's just how the ball bounces sometimes... literally.

Tyson Chandler is a beast on the boards... I personally haven't seen a rebounder that dominant since Rodman.  It seems clear now that New Orleans gave up on him too soon following his injury.
Chandler is ah beast on the boards, but Kevin Love from the T'Wolves is a much better rebounder and  contributes far more on offense. That said both New Orleans and  Chicago gave up on him too early.

This series like the previous Chicago series should have been a sweep. If Miami was not so complacement and lacking in concentration for long stretches of the game, this would not even be a contest.

kevin love gets a lot of shots because timberwolves probably miss twice as many shots as other teams so he gets some offensive rebounds and some points... ;D