Touching base with Keith Look Loy.

[elan]

From Keith Look Loy.

I would like to contribute to the discussion regarding the suspension of Howard University from the NCAA in 1973.
 
The SWO members here are not focusing on the main issue. The case of the NCAA versus Howard University, whatever its legal merits or demerits, was never an issue of law or regulations.

It revolved around the desire of racist elements within the NCAA and the US soccer establishment, which was "lily white", to undermine Howard's rising star and to eliminate the all-black university with a foreign student team, as a meaningful soccer power.
 
In 1971 Howard University- the ONLY all-black university playing at that level of the game in the United States, NCAA Division One - won the title by defeating St. Louis University, which was the dominant power in US collegiate soccer, in the final.

This was unparalleled in US sporting history and all of black American society celebrated. In December 1972, my first year at Howard, we marched straight to the semi-final round, where we met St. Louis at the Orange Bowl in Miami.  By that time the NCAA had suspended two Howard players, including Keith Aqui, from representing the university.

To be safe, Lincoln Phillips decided that three other starting players, including yours truly, would not participate in the match so as not to jeopardize a possible victory. In the event we lost and St. Louis went on the win the final.
 
In 1973 Howard was suspended from NCAA competition for one year. The 1971 title was stripped from the university and expunged from the official record. All of this was part of the grand design to eliminate Howard as a soccer power.

All of 1973 was spent building towards 1974, which we knew would be a key year if the university were to return to the top of the US collegiate game. In 1974, we played for 20 matches undefeated, which remained a NCAA record for decades, and defeated the arch-enemy St. Louis University at Busch Stadium in St. Louis to win the title yet again.

In 1975, Howard went to the semi-final but lost to St. Louis University, Edwardsville. That marked the end of Howard University's "Golden Years" - 1971 to 1975. The University never repeated its successes thereafter.

I am proud to have been a part of those golden years, playing as a starter between 1972 and 1975, winning one NCAA title (1974) and collecting two semi-finalist trophies in the process (1972 and 1975).

Keith... glad to have you contributing to the forum, this is a welcomed development.  No doubt your official duties will keep you from contributing more, but feel free to weigh in via Flex if that works best for you 


Now, that said...

It very well could be possible that the NCAA's targeting of Howard was motivated by racial animus, but that doesn't address the legitimate fact that the University was in violation of NCAA rules.  Now correct me if I'm wrong since I wasn't around then, I just know of the case.... but Aqui entered Mausica in 1965, leaving in 1967.  Under NCAA rules his eligibility as a student-athlete then would have expired 4 1/2 years from his matriculation at Mausica.  Assuming he entered in September 1965, his eligibility would have expired in March of 1970.  He didn't enroll in Howard until August 1970, no?  In other words from the time he enrolled he was already ineligible to participate.

I imagine that Howard also used at least one student who was academically ineligible to participate, by failing to maintain at least a 1.6 GPA (or else the NCAA wouldn't have charged the school with that violation, and the courts, both on the District (trial) and appellate levels would not have agreed.  There must have been a factual basis for the charges.

As to the foreign student rule, one could argue (I suppose) that the rule was racially motivated (although xenophobia might be a more accurate charge than racism), but on its face the rule is race-neutral as it applies to foreign students no matter their race.  As for the penalty of stripping HU of its national title and expunging the records from the history books... that happens all the time.  I don't know how often it happened back then, but USC just had that happen to them last year after the NCAA ruled it won the national title (football) with an ineligible player, Reggie Bush.  Similarly, Memphis (even though it didn't win a title) had its 2008 records expunged from the history books for using an ineligible player that year... Derrick Rose, who now plays for the Chicago Bulls.  That sort of penalty is pretty commonplace.  I therefore have to disagree with the sentiment that this was "All of this was part of the grand design to eliminate Howard as a soccer power."  Howard had no one to blame for that situation but its own self, the athletic department should have done a better job in making sure only eligible players were used.  Again, we could speculate as to the racial part... and I don't know so I can't argue with you on that, but from a legal standpoint there was absolute merit to the charges.

All that said, I appreciate what you and posters like Tempo bring to the discussion, and all this should detract from the interview that you and Flex did, I welcome greater interaction and cooperation between the TTFF and the only official voice/representative of Soca Warrior fans worldwide.  Looking forward to more 

Bakes I agree, with your take on the racial part. I tried to argue that today with some friends. That whether or not the powers that be wanted to "take power away" from HU, they (HU) had to have given the NCAA something to get at them with.

[E-man]

Anyone want to read the court proceedings on HU v NCAA, it's here:
http://ttfootballhistory.com/node/1711

[Bakes]

Bakes, you are correct. The foreign player rule was decided at district court level and I left out the matter regarding 1.6 rule. 

Not a problem, I can't deny that racism played a part or that Howard was targeted... in fact I would bet this little black school with all them foreigners was in fact targeted.  But fact is the Athletic Department dropped the ball on this one, I dunno if they had compliance officers back then, but they needed to do a better job vetting those players.  You know that they always say, as a black man you have to work twice as hard just to play level in this country (at times).  That being the case we really should never give those who would undermine us any ammunition to do so.

I'm sure you have access to the opinion, but in case you don't... or for those who curious the Appellate Court's decision can be read online.  Feel free to skip past the discussion of Jurisdiction and focus on the Facts and the Constitutional discussion.

EDIT:  I see E-man posted a link to the opinion as well. 


p.s.  Good to see St. Louis University returning to prominence after a period of dominance by Indiana and the ACC schools.  Hopefully one day Howard will figure out how to right the ship as well.

[Insider]

Wrong again Insider. Howard under Lincoln won NCAA championships in '71 and '74. The NCAA vacated the '71 championship. However, Howard successfully sued the NCAA and forced the NCAA to change their rules regarding foreign students because the courts said such rules violated the 14th amendment equal protection rights of foreign students. However, the courts did not force the NCAA to reinstate the '71 championship for a variety of legal reasons I won't bore you with here. Howard could not participate in post season play in '73. In '74 under the banner of William Cullen Bryant's poem, 'Truth Crushed To Earth Shall Rise Again", Howard came back to win the '74 championship with a perfect 19-0-0 record; a record that stood for about 20 years.  Howard didn't renew Lincoln's contract in 1980 because he threatened to not return unless the program received more support. He was out of the college until the late 80's when he coached VCU.

You should really do some research before casually spreading mis-information. There is actually quite a bit of information on the Howard team.

LP hired a lawyer name Yallery Arthur and had an out of court settlement with HU. After he was fired from Howard University he never coached at Howard after that, a Bermudian guy was the new coach.

[Deeks]

Wrong again Insider. Howard under Lincoln won NCAA championships in '71 and '74. The NCAA vacated the '71 championship. However, Howard successfully sued the NCAA and forced the NCAA to change their rules regarding foreign students because the courts said such rules violated the 14th amendment equal protection rights of foreign students. However, the courts did not force the NCAA to reinstate the '71 championship for a variety of legal reasons I won't bore you with here. Howard could not participate in post season play in '73. In '74 under the banner of William Cullen Bryant's poem, 'Truth Crushed To Earth Shall Rise Again", Howard came back to win the '74 championship with a perfect 19-0-0 record; a record that stood for about 20 years.  Howard didn't renew Lincoln's contract in 1980 because he threatened to not return unless the program received more support. He was out of the college until the late 80's when he coached VCU.

You should really do some research before casually spreading mis-information. There is actually quite a bit of information on the Howard team.

LP hired a lawyer name Yallery Arthur and had an out of court settlement with HU. After he was fired from Howard University he never coached at Howard after that, a Bermudian guy was the new coach.

Insider,
          I enter HU in Jan 77. I played 4 yrs. It was mainly painfull. 77 season HU was 17-1. Lost 2-1 to GWU. We did not make the play-offs because NCAA said we had an ineligible player. The player had transferred to HU and LP let him play. The NCAA said he needed to sit out one year.  In addition to the 77 season suspension, NCAA suspended HU from the play-off competition for 78 and 79 season(that is why I say painful). That means we can win all our games, but no post season competition. The 1980 season, we were eligible for post season play and we did. HUlost to William and Mary. LP was the coach then. He was then terminated after that and Keith Tucker(Bermudian) got the job. Keith Tucker and I played under Lincoln. Just to let you know, Yallery Arthur also played  on LP's team that won the first championship. He and Keith Acqui, Steve Waldron, Alvin Henderson and Bain all played for LP first championship team.

[Sando]

12. I propose that we have a 4 tier league structure in T&T and allow for a promotion and relegation system, ex. 1) T&T Pro League (Pro League), 2) National Super League (NSL), 3) T&T Elite Football League (EFL), 4) National Zonal League (NZL).  There are too many small leagues that negatively affect the major leagues in T&T. It’s time to pool our resources and work together. Of course we may need the financial assistance of the T&T government to help promoted teams during their first year in the top flight. What are your thoughts on this?
KLL: Of course, there is already a relationship between the regional league and the TTFF Super League. The issue is to connect the TT Pro League to the rest of football and this is political. In early 2010, the TTFF hosted a seminar on Club Development and Administration, to which all regional associations, affiliated leagues and Super League clubs were invited to participate. This included the TT Pro League. The product of the four day activity was “The Port of Spain Declaration”, which included an analysis of the current football status quo and a call for certain measures to be adopted in order to move the game forward. One of the many critical measures identified is the creation of a four-tiered league, including “minor leagues” (division four), regional leagues (division three), Super League (division two) and TT Pro League (division one). The TT Pro League did not sign the document and has never delivered on its promise to “get back” to the TTFF on this matter.

Flex, I feel you should contact Dexter Skeene to hear his version of this ?

It must have some reason behind this !!

[Cocorite]

Ooh Guuuude. Is like de whole ah T&T play at HU.

[Errol]

What successes is KLL talking about?

Everything is on the ground in T&T football. We are talking current not PAST !!!!!!!!!!!

What are they doing and how long can they keep fooling the public?

National programs is a joke.

Dutch training, a German coach and two Trini assistants, this should be interesting.

[Sando]

17. Do you feel the Minister of Sport and Youth Affairs Mr. Anil Roberts is doing a good job for sports in T&T? It seems to the public that he is more involved in promoting concerts and parties.
KLL: I have no comment. I will not comment on political issues.

This was a good question Flex, and as expect Look Loy skip and I cant blame him for doing so, because its about politics and friends.

From a talk show host to the minister of youths and sports, a man who hated Jack Warner is now his best friend.

This would explain why he threw out the T&T team from playing CFU games in the Hasley Crawford Stadium to host a worthless concert that wasn't even sold out on a newely done pitch.

A monkey will always be a monkey, he cant be a lion.

[Sam]

13. In your opinion, what do you feel can be done to preserve and improve the SSFL in Trinidad and Tobago?
KLL: No serious football country gives the prominence to schools’ football that we do in Trinidad and Tobago. In a professional football environment schools football is a recreational, extra-curricular, activity and serious player development takes place within the clubs. To the contrary, in Trinidad and Tobago youth club competition ceases in July to allow the schools to play their three-month season which, including their pre-season, accounts for four months for the players in programmes of varying quality. Then comes the off-season and Carnival! I can just imagine Pep Guardiola saying to the young talent at La Masia (FC Barcelona’s training academy) in August – “Go ahead and play with your school. We will see you in March next year” (smile and possibly wave)… The Mexican team that just beat the stuffing out of our Under 20s in Guatemala (5:0) comprised first division professionals. We sent how many schoolboys? As long as we give pride of place to the SSFL – it is the country’s biggest and most popular league – and continue to avoid the hard political decision to promote club youth football ahead of schools’ football, we will continue to undermine the country’s ability to produce top level youth teams.

Look Loy say de SSFL is not good, but yet Kenwyne Jones say that 75% of his development came from playing school football.

Also making a contribution was Jones, who equalled the donation made by the Ministry.“It’s always good to be able to give back because in my case, I can say that 75% of my development came from playing school football,” Jones said “I always look back at those memories and take pride in them.”

Link to story.

De thing is, if the TTFF dont have a CONSISTENT development program for the youths, then we have no choice but to rely on the SSFL, until the TTFF start doing better in this area then Look Loy could come talk.

Dwight Yorke learn to play his football in the SSFL before he went Europe.

STORY HERE

[Sando]

Ask Look Loy if it did not have any SSFL how the TTFF would have gone about finding players and not only this how will a player get a chance to win a scholarship to play in North America like he did.

His best football came from his SSFL but yet he have no respect for it.

[Deeks]

I see the point KLL is making. At this juncture in our football, the SSFL is not producing the quality of players that can have an immediate impact on the the national as long ago. Maybe they good enough for U-19 and US college level but not for Gold Cup, PanAm, Olimpic and definitely NOT for for WC level football.

Keith developed his skills in SSFL. But it was different then. The league was smaller all the best players were concentrated in POS and Sando. All the best players gravitated to those schools in those two environs. It was basically a north/south competition. The football was different. The players were better because in the off-season all of them use to play for club teams. Them men love the game. So when they get called up for the national team, most of them were mentally ready.

Now with the intense professionalism in the game, the current SSFL has not produce a bunch of players to participate on the international and youth and senior level. TTFF can't prevent from playing for their school. The pro clubs have youth teams, but honestly it is no different from what I have seen in the past. If the pro clubs want them to be real pros they have to come better than that.

They have to give them a stipend and have their own schools so players can do their CXC. They can't have it both ways in this day and age. And forget about the government getting involved in pro football. The present and past gov't have built facilities. YES, BETTER maintenance is needed. They have also provided tax insentives for involvement in sports.The businessmen who have the passion for the game have to take "the bull by horn" and put their money in the game. I honestly think the clubs can do it, but they have to have deep pockets for that kind of investment.

[Sam]

Back in the days Deeks, we never qualify for any youth or senior world cup.

Now we have qualified for two under 20, two under 17 one as host and a senior world cup.

If the TTFF was doing more to develop young players then I would agree with Keith Look Loy, but they not, so we have no choice but to rely on de SSFL for now.

I feel the TTFF should just come out with a structure to improve the SSFL, Keith have to remember that the SSFL also helps the less unfortunate players who not bright enough to get into a decent school, but through football the player have a chance and a chance to also go abroad.

Look, if Jason Scotland see he name on a blackboard he go pass it straight, but now he making more money that man who have more education.

90% of our 2006 WC players made a name in the SSFL and went on to better things, so it cant be that bad, it just need better organization, but instead the SSFL, the Pro League and T&T teams not on the same page.

Because of the SSFL T&T was able to discover many good players.

The TTFF dont have a good scouting system, so they have no choice in the matter.

[Deeks]

Back in the days Deeks, we never qualify for any youth or senior world cup.

Now we have qualified for two under 20, two under 17 one as host and a senior world cup.

If the TTFF was doing more to develop young players then I would agree with Keith Look Loy, but they not, so we have no choice but to rely on de SSFL for now.

I feel the TTFF should just come out with a structure to improve the SSFL, Keith have to remember that the SSFL also helps the less unfortunate players who not bright enough to get into a decent school, but through football the player have a chance and a chance to also go abroad.

Look, if Jason Scotland see he name on a blackboard he go pass it straight, but now he making more money that man who have more education.

90% of our 2006 WC players made a name in the SSFL and went on to better things, so it cant be that bad, it just need better organization, but instead the SSFL, the Pro League and T&T teams not on the same page.

Because of the SSFL T&T was able to discover many good players.

The TTFF dont have a good scouting system, so they have no choice in the matter.

They did not have youth WC in Kieth days or it had just started. I think the 74 team would have qualified for the 2nd youth WC if they have made it. Mex won it and they went. I think Cuba may have gone to the first one(I am not sure on that). But we into senior WC since 66.

Yes KJ and them came from the SSFL and made it in the EPL. But the verdict is still on the current crop of players. I don't see any stand outs. I don't see any in Euro. except Roberts, Hyland, Peltier and another kid. But we lagging behind badly. So the clubs have to pick up the slack.  I don't see that happening. We have nothing like the US academy in Bradenton Florida. If we don't have or can't have anything like Bradenton then we will continue as is, hoping the SSFL will produce that batch of good players. The Pro clubs have to step up more and do something different.

Everybody clamouring for clubs to have youth system like the Euros. But unless we go all the way, we spinning top in mud. Can you imagine a club having an acadamy like Ajak, Chelsea, manu, liverpool, or even Mexican teams. They have to have facilities with about 6 fields, sleeping dorms and classroom for football studies and regular CXC studies. Then a stipend for the them. They may have to travel abroad for dallas Cup etc. You have to buy computers for them to keep up will class work etc. What may be the norm for 'poor' Mexico, may be wishfull thinking for 'rich' TT.

I would not discount  scouting players, but I ain't putting to much on that. TT ain't so big that you can't find good players. If we had a Caricom team then I can see clubs sending scouts up the islands for young talent.

[Sam]

Everybody bawling we dont have de talent and today we have the most amount of local players gaining foreign contracts.

In 1973, Gally went Mexico and a few others went in the US.

In 1989 we had 1 foreign player (Nakhid).

We always have the talent, maybe not as good as before, because the passion is not there, but you still cannot blame the SSFL.... there is talent out there, but the TTFF want exceptional talent instead of trying to improve the ones we have.

When Dwarika came out, he was a Malick player, not a Santa Cruz or Joe Public player, he was recognised in school, same for Keon Daniel, Yorke, Latapy, Lewis, Glen, Stern, Cyrus, Bateau etc etc...

Another problem is, the sport minister does not have a program in place to keep kids from going astray, in these times there is to many distractions, so its harder for kids to maintain, the generation we have now mentally disturbe.

We sport minister could throw a good fete though.

[Deeks]

there is talent out there, but the TTFF want exceptional talent instead of trying to improve the ones we have.

The task ahead is as you said, "trying to improve the ones we have"

[palos]

Look Loy is absolutely correct IMO.

No serious footballing nation that I know of uses schoolboy football as a premier development institution for young players.  They all use professional clubs

As long as we continue to glorify a league that does absolutely nothing for our football development and have the courage and fortitude to change to a proper structured environment, professional or not, we will continue to struggle at youth level and ultimately, at senior level

[Sando]

Look Loy is absolutely correct IMO.

No serious footballing nation that I know of uses schoolboy football as a premier development institution for young players.  They all use professional clubs

As long as we continue to glorify a league that does absolutely nothing for our football development and have the courage and fortitude to change to a proper structured environment, professional or not, we will continue to struggle at youth level and ultimately, at senior level

Palos, you right, no serious footballing nation, so that exclude's us.....

[president]

I am new to this site but there is so much that could be said in response to some of the commentary on this article. I will focus on the SSFL.  Players, like Kenwyne Jones, may be GRATEFUL for having the opportunity to play in a league that receives more fan support and media coverage than any other local league - it brings them into public focus - but that does not take away from the fact that the SSFL is essentially non-professional, extra-curricular, and recreational.

We need to extricate ourselves from the illusion that the schools' league creates players. It does not. Players come into this league having been introduced to the game elsewhere than the school - whether informally in their neighbourhood "sweat" or formally through membership in a clinic or club. Youth players spend most of their football lives playing in football clubs of varying quality. And the truth is that is most, if not all schools, the lower divisions are not given serious focus and the players do not receive quality coaching. This is restricted to the Championship division. Finally, on average, the SSFL occupies no more than four months of a young player's athletic year. Compare this recreational, part-time approach to the seriously professional football federations, which have clubs that devote significant resources, human and financial, to the training of young talent, five or six days per week, ten months a year, over the course of ten to twelve years, on average.

Despite all of these limitations the league continues to play an important role in the training of young players. Why? Because local clubs, professional and non-professional alike, continue to fail, most of them, to properly prepare the next generation of players. Indeed, the youth programme and competitions of the TT Pro League are in some ways farcical, with clubs "adopting" school teams for three months, thereby circumventing the league's requirement for each club to establish and maintain a proper youth development programme. Indeed, in that league we have seen the absurdity of an external youth club or coaching clinic representing more than one professional club in different divisions in the same competition.

So the point is not whether or not the SSFL is a good league. The point is that the SSFL is not good ENOUGH to allow us to compete consistently in serious international competition. Where, in serious footballing nations, the professional clubs work hard at developing top young players, in Trinidad and Tobago the TT Pro League, the TTFF Super League and the regional association leagues cease their youth football, generally held between April/May and July,  in order to avoid conflict with the SSFL, which begins in September and runs until November! And we want to compete?

Until and unless the hard political decision is taken by all concerned to relegate the SSFL to what its true status - recreational league - and to cease its (no doubt well-meaning) undermining of youth player development, so long will we continue to complain about our national youth teams inconsistent performance and results in international competition. And THAT is the truth.

[Errol]

I am new to this site but there is so much that could be said in response to some of the commentary on this article. I will focus on the SSFL.  Players, like Kenwyne Jones, may be GRATEFUL for having the opportunity to play in a league that receives more fan support and media coverage than any other local league - it brings them into public focus - but that does not take away from the fact that the SSFL is essentially non-professional, extra-curricular, and recreational.

We need to extricate ourselves from the illusion that the schools' league creates players. It does not. Players come into this league having been introduced to the game elsewhere than the school - whether informally in their neighbourhood "sweat" or formally through membership in a clinic or club. Youth players spend most of their football lives playing in football clubs of varying quality. And the truth is that is most, if not all schools, the lower divisions are not given serious focus and the players do not receive quality coaching. This is restricted to the Championship division. Finally, on average, the SSFL occupies no more than four months of a young player's athletic year. Compare this recreational, part-time approach to the seriously professional football federations, which have clubs that devote significant resources, human and financial, to the training of young talent, five or six days per week, ten months a year, over the course of ten to twelve years, on average.

Despite all of these limitations the league continues to play an important role in the training of young players. Why? Because local clubs, professional and non-professional alike, continue to fail, most of them, to properly prepare the next generation of players. Indeed, the youth programme and competitions of the TT Pro League are in some ways farcical, with clubs "adopting" school teams for three months, thereby circumventing the league's requirement for each club to establish and maintain a proper youth development programme. Indeed, in that league we have seen the absurdity of an external youth club or coaching clinic representing more than one professional club in different divisions in the same competition.

So the point is not whether or not the SSFL is a good league. The point is that the SSFL is not good ENOUGH to allow us to compete consistently in serious international competition. Where, in serious footballing nations, the professional clubs work hard at developing top young players, in Trinidad and Tobago the TT Pro League, the TTFF Super League and the regional association leagues cease their youth football, generally held between April/May and July,  in order to avoid conflict with the SSFL, which begins in September and runs until November! And we want to compete?

Until and unless the hard political decision is taken by all concerned to relegate the SSFL to what its true status - recreational league - and to cease its (no doubt well-meaning) undermining of youth player development, so long will we continue to complain about our national youth teams inconsistent performance and results in international competition. And THAT is the truth.

Mr President [I always wanted to say that], let me be the first to welcome you.

For most parts I agree with your post, however, when you use a remark saying that because local clubs, professional and non-professional alike, continue to fail and not add the TTFF to that list it makes me wonder.

I believe all football entity in T&T should hold some responsibility. Because when there is no SSFL games the TTFF do not take advantage of players free time, they rely and put all responsibilities on the club and not try to play a part, then they rush off and prepare a team a month in advance not giving the players ample time to gel to play important games and then the team fail.

Our Technical man in the TTFF Keith Look Loy did this interview as you can see and he himself if I am not mistaking benefitted from the SSFL, so what was the difference between his time and now ?

Otherwise, good post.

[Deeks]

Our Technical man in the TTFF Keith Look Loy did this interview as you know and he himself if I am not mistaking benefitted from the SSFL, so what was the difference between his time and now ?

the yutes now are defficient in skills(ball control, first touch), stamina, etc. They cannot compete at the international level.

[president]

In the 1960s and 1970s the SSFL filled an important void and played a critical role since, outside of of the schools' league, essentially there was no organized youth football. Moreover, prior to that era the school teams played in open, men's leagues, POSFL, SFL, etc, and for that reason schoolboys could hold their own against men and even played for the national team. As an example, Look Loy himself was selected to the North men's team for the inter-zonal tournament of 1971, while still at St. Mary's College. This is hardly the case now, when the average age of a school team must be seventeen, and there is an abundance of youth clubs, coaching clinics and youth programmes. Unlike the 1960s and before, the issue now is not quantity but quality. No comparison, I'm afraid.

[Sam]

This is why I feel the SSFL is important today even though it maynot be as good as the ones in the past.

1. They provide opportunities for kids to play for better schools in T&T and even gain a scholarship to play abroad. I remember players getting picked to play for Pres, St Anthony's, Benedicts, Naps, etc and they pass common entrance for a Junior Seconday.

2. Its the biggest league in T&T, so why not build on it. Furthermore, have requirements for coaches who coach in the SSFL where they must posses a valid TTFF/FIFA license.

3. The TTFF rely on the league to scout players because they have no scouting network.

There is some valid points Flex made here, allyuh need to read it.
http://www.socawarriors.net/forum/index.php?topic=53611.msg738445#msg738445

I never knew our school boys played in the big leagues in T&T, hhhhmmmmm, very interesting, but good idea.

My question is, why is there so much seperation in the leagues in T&T ? maybe they TTFF is not respected, maybe everybody in every league wants to be a hero ? whats the problem with the men who control the leagues in T&T ?

[president]

A few bullet point responses:

- In a seriously professional environment the SSFL would have a role to play. To provide recreation for those boys not good enough to make it into a professional club environment.
- The TTFF does not rely on the SSFL to identify players. In fact, the national coaches look at the TT Pro League for most of their selections.
- Playing for an SSFL member school does not get you into a US university. Playing for a national team AND your SAT score is the best guarantee for that.
- The TTFF and the TT Pro League need to make the political decision to establish a serious national youth league that runs for eight or nine months a year, regardless of the SSFL response to that.
- Part-time youth football is guaranteed to continue our inconsistent international record at youth level.

[Deeks]

In the 1960s and 1970s the SSFL filled an important void and played a critical role since, outside of of the schools' league, essentially there was no organized youth football. Moreover, prior to that era the school teams played in open, men's leagues, POSFL, SFL, etc, and for that reason schoolboys could hold their own against men and even played for the national team. As an example, Look Loy himself was selected to the North men's team for the inter-zonal tournament of 1971, while still at St. Mary's College. This is hardly the case now, when the average age of a school team must be seventeen, and there is an abundance of youth clubs, coaching clinics and youth programmes. Unlike the 1960s and before, the issue now is not quantity but quality. No comparison, I'm afraid.

A variety of systems were used. I remember when there was juvenile football in the POSFL in the early seventies. Maple, Malvern, Regiment, etc had teams. I think Providence win it. Guess what? I was told Providence was Tranquil. Roderick Warner who use to teach there at Tranquil and he played for Providence. Some players were actually playing for clubs. They would come off the bench. But the players really honed there skills in the many minor leagues around the countries. Most of them were very organized and got fans support. It was amazing. The big daddy of them all was the Eddie Hart league. Amateur, Pros, juniors, senior, over 30 all use to clash in that league. And money(under-the-table) used to pass big time. Playing in the 4 month SSFL alone is not enough to enhance your skill. I remember Dr. Alvin Henderson and his big brother, Robert, had a team called Via Madrid and used to in the Sunday morning league in St. Joseph savannah

[Sando]

The SSFL is well supported, if we stop the league, how will the fans connect to the national team ?

Every supporter go out there to support they school, our league is not connected to the communities and our national team play two games a year.

My point is, football needs to go back to the communities and a youth league needs to be created, until then we have no choice but to rely on the SSFL.

We have Anil Roberts a man who is close to the TTFF and he is in government, why cant he actually start working for his money and do something about the youths in T&T ?

PS: We cannot continue to blame the SSFL for our failure at international youth level. We do not prepare our teams properly and expect success. I can guarentee you now that our under 17 and under 20 teams have fail the team will be disbanded and we may not see any of them in action until a month before the next tournament.

[Cocorite]

Just a thought.

We in T&T should be careful not to be too quick to discard what has been working for us. I mean, for instance, the US uses their college league and USL as feeders to their MLS. To strip SSFL of its role instead of strengthening it with a more professional set-up may be a mistake. That is, unless we have a better replacement that can guarantee the interest and fan support etc.

[president]

You clearly don't follow our national youth teams. These teams are in continuous action, training on a weekly basis, ahead of youth World Cup qualifying. What DOES present an obstacle to this preparation is the SSFL schedule, the parents who want their son to be in the school team, the players who want to be seen on TV and in the dailies and get some girls, and the school officials who believe the school team is more important than the national team. They ALL give priority to the school at the expense of the nation. Indeed, the last Under 17 team is now "disbanded" until December in order to allow the players time to participate in TT Pro League and SSFL competitions. You can't have your cake and eat it...

[president]

...and Cocorite, I hear you, but the truth is that the MLS clubs have long ago seen the limitations of the collegiate system as a feeder. The MLS clubs all have junior teams that increasingly recruit players directly and avoid four wasted years in college. Could you imagine Messi turning pro at 22? Meantime, the USSF has also established its academy system for elite youth clubs. The fact is that "US soccer" is moving away from the high school and university as the basis for its professional game and national teams.

[Deeks]

The SSFL is well supported, if we stop the league, how will the fans connect to the national team ?

The SSFL will always be there. As Coops says, it will be there for the guys who don't make the pro-clubs or are not  interested in Pro ball. Some body asked why there is a gap between the SSFL and the TTFF. Good reason. The old CFL always distanced themselves from the TFA because they feared(justifably) that they(TFA) wanted to control and run school football. The CFL made money because the schools had their own grounds. Plus intercol was as big as North-South classics or even international games. But now the SSFL is actually struggling to keep its autonomy. This government can forced them to comply with TTFF. Anil and Jack. For instance, last year only 1 round of football was played because of the women's WC. 2 rounds could have been played,  but them SSFL official  bowed to  jack to follow the leader.

One thing about the past CFL. With exception of QRC and Sando Tech, all the school which played in the old colleges league division1 were non government schools. The power was in the hands of Saints, fatima, Belmont, Benedicts, Naps, Pres. I would add QRC in this group even though gov't took it over. But when the league was expanded, the so-called big schools lost their power(both in the administration and on the field of play).