What should the TTFF audited accounts look like?

[dinho]

Alot of discussion is going into the disparity between the spreadsheet account provided to the players by TTFF and what an audited account should actually look like and the big issue is the idea that Jack Warner and the TTFF misrespresented the World Cup revenue before publishing.

For the sake of getting an idea of exactly what the players are actually owed based on the original 30%/50% promise, and what we know of the revenue and expenditure from press releases, I'm trying to figure out what a real TTFF audited account should say.

I know some of you here more familiar with all the news that went by pre and post world cup re: sponsorship deals etc so maybe you can input here... If you can respond I can edit this original post so we can come up with some final figures to better speculate on.

As far as I know, some listings on the account should be...



REVENUE:

FIFA grant for all qualifying nations -
Adidas sponsorship -
Government grant -
Ebay sponsorship deal -
TV Rights for Warm-up games -
World Cup TV rights -
Ticket sales from warm up games -
TTFF sale of allocated tickets -
Private sector sponsorship -
Sale of Merchandise -
World Cup participation fee -

EXPENDITURE:

Player salaries -
Coach salaries -
Uniforms/Equipment -
Airfare -
Accomodation -
Transportation -
Entertainment -
Insurance -
Administrative Fees -

[oconnorg]

Alot of discussion is going into the disparity between the spreadsheet account provided to the players by TTFF and what an audited account should actually look like and the big issue is the idea that Jack Warner and the TTFF misrespresented the World Cup revenue before publishing.

For the sake of getting an idea of exactly what the players are actually owed based on the original 30%/50% promise, and what we know of the revenue and expenditure from press releases, I'm trying to figure out what a real TTFF audited account should say.

I know some of you here more familiar with all the news that went by pre and post world cup re: sponsorship deals etc so maybe you can input here... If you can respond I can edit this original post so we can come up with some final figures to better speculate on.

As far as I know, some listings on the account should be...



REVENUE:

FIFA grant for all qualifying nations -
Adidas sponsorship -
Government grant -
Ebay sponsorship deal -
TV Rights for Warm-up games -
World Cup TV rights -
Ticket sales from warm up games -
TTFF sale of allocated tickets -
Private sector sponsorship -
Sale of Merchandise -
World Cup participation fee -

EXPENDITURE:

Player salaries -
Coach salaries -
Uniforms/Equipment -
Airfare -
Accomodation -
Transportation -
Entertainment -
Insurance -
Administrative Fees -

Incentives and bonuses should be added. Or did you lump that under Player and coach Salaries ?

[WestCoast]

you have forgotten the compensation package for the "Special Advisor"

[Football supporter]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.

I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

[E-man]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.

I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

Yes there was a Local Organizing Committee (LOC) for Germany 2006 formed of which JW was the Chairman.
http://www.socawarriors.net/forum/index.php?topic=5046.msg38620#msg38620

[dcs]

of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

if that is the case how is the contract binding on a separate entity?  it would depend on whether the LOC is a TTFF subsidiary right?

This verbal contract does not specify details...that is the main problem with it.

[kentsoulman]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.

I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

Yeah, I think they call it LAYERING in money laundering terms. You create a business to collect the money on behalf of another business. Then you run up so much expenses and pay wages and bonuses that only a small part of that money is returned to the original business. Then they pay the shareholders (or in this case, players) their agreed share of whats left. 50% of nothing is nothing.

In effect a WC company could collect funds and pay an amount to a federation who then pays all the expenses and divide whats left amongst the players, while a large part of the original money is retainted by the WC company and distributed as it sees fit.

Wonder if anyones looked into this?? What ya say FPATT-you gonna chase this down?

[redtrinigirl]

Look, until the day TTFF allows it self to be audited by Ernst & Young, or Price Waterhouse Coopers, I maintain they are a set ah damn tief!!!!!

If you are doing as you should, and money is being spent as it should, and going where it should, then what on earth yuh hiding for? Even the bloody UK and US governments have all their documents and accounts open to the public via the Freedom of Information Acts.

Who de hell is de TTFF to have secrets? Big multi-million dollar financial instiutions have their records available, but you telling me that ah lil pissing tail back water football office cyah have proper accounts?

Look, I feel I going and tap into my banking background and get they damn records and put dem on de forum. How bout dat?  

Jackula really doh understand what time it is yuh know. Dis is 2007, the age of electronics. You can find out anything bout anybody once you have access to the net. And ah serious nerd. I sure I could find two Pakistani boys in Uni who could hack into a Swiss bank system, or off shore bank system in de Bahamas, and get all he files.

[Brownsugar]

Look, until the day TTFF allows it self to be audited by Ernst & Young, or Price Waterhouse Coopers, I maintain they are a set ah damn tief!!!!!

If you are doing as you should, and money is being spent as it should, and going where it should, then what on earth yuh hiding for? Even the bloody UK and US governments have all their documents and accounts open to the public via the Freedom of Information Acts.

Who de hell is de TTFF to have secrets? Big multi-million dollar financial instiutions have their records available, but you telling me that ah lil pissing tail back water football office cyah have proper accounts?

Look, I feel I going and tap into my banking background and get they damn records and put dem on de forum. How bout dat?  

Jackula really doh understand what time it is yuh know. Dis is 2007, the age of electronics. You can find out anything bout anybody once you have access to the net. And ah serious nerd. I sure I could find two Pakistani boys in Uni who could hack into a Swiss bank system, or off shore bank system in de Bahamas, and get all he files.

De TTFF is ah small part of ah bigger organisation called FIFA....and big daddy say nobody eh have to reveal nothing to nobody....dat is why de chile could hide all it want.....sssstteeeuupppss....when ah tell yuh de whole thing does get mih blasted vex!!!...

Redtrinigirl.....seek out de informant who pass Camille info to Ganga Singh....

[E-man]

Look, until the day TTFF allows it self to be audited by Ernst & Young, or Price Waterhouse Coopers, I maintain they are a set ah damn tief!!!!!

If you are doing as you should, and money is being spent as it should, and going where it should, then what on earth yuh hiding for? Even the bloody UK and US governments have all their documents and accounts open to the public via the Freedom of Information Acts.

Who de hell is de TTFF to have secrets? Big multi-million dollar financial instiutions have their records available, but you telling me that ah lil pissing tail back water football office cyah have proper accounts?

Look, I feel I going and tap into my banking background and get they damn records and put dem on de forum. How bout dat?  

Jackula really doh understand what time it is yuh know. Dis is 2007, the age of electronics. You can find out anything bout anybody once you have access to the net. And ah serious nerd. I sure I could find two Pakistani boys in Uni who could hack into a Swiss bank system, or off shore bank system in de Bahamas, and get all he files.

The TTFF has had to pass docs to the gov't to get money any from them. And TT gov't does have a freedom of information act. http://www.foia.gov.tt/

[weary1969]

I eh care what books dey use unless is my account they cyah explain how is 5000 TT a man.

[WestCoast]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.
I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

Yeah, I think they call it LAYERING in money laundering terms. You create a business to collect the money on behalf of another business. Then you run up so much expenses and pay wages and bonuses that only a small part of that money is returned to the original business. Then they pay the shareholders (or in this case, players) their agreed share of whats left. 50% of nothing is nothing.
In effect a WC company could collect funds and pay an amount to a federation who then pays all the expenses and divide whats left amongst the players, while a large part of the original money is retainted by the WC company and distributed as it sees fit.
Wonder if anyones looked into this?? What ya say FPATT-you gonna chase this down?

Aye, Kentsoulman, you come like Claude Noel, fighting to claim the Championship.
One set ah body blows...all we have to do is keep it up till the "Champ" cant take it no more, and the Towel is thrown in by the Management team, FIFA....
Aye, I really HOPE all the best for FPATT eh
The time for all this "tom foolery" to end is near.

Layering!!!...well Yes......HIT DE CHAMP
buss he mout 

[Football supporter]

No matter how clever someone is, theres gonna be a paper trail-even if money is paid in cash, its gonna leave a withdrawl somewhere.
It just depends how seriously someone wants to find it.

As I've said before, Al capone was only jailed for tax evasion.

[Football supporter]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.

I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

Yeah, I think they call it LAYERING in money laundering terms. You create a business to collect the money on behalf of another business. Then you run up so much expenses and pay wages and bonuses that only a small part of that money is returned to the original business. Then they pay the shareholders (or in this case, players) their agreed share of whats left. 50% of nothing is nothing.

In effect a WC company could collect funds and pay an amount to a federation who then pays all the expenses and divide whats left amongst the players, while a large part of the original money is retainted by the WC company and distributed as it sees fit.

Wonder if anyones looked into this?? What ya say FPATT-you gonna chase this down?

Well, mate, this is a serious accusation and FPATT certainly can't publicly accuse anyone of this kind of operation. However, its an interesting thought. Maybe theres a lawyer or journalist out there who could search for the truth, but I don't think it's part of FPATTs remit to enter these areas. After all, we will have to eventually work with TTFF and Jack Warner. As I've pointed out before, we have to look to the future, not the past. Hopefully, by the next World Cup campaign there will be a lot more transparency and agreements will be in place to ensure these misunderstandings are prevented.

[oconnorg]

I believe Mr Warner was employed as the world cup campaign manager. His wages and expenses would be covered.
There were also additional people recruited by TTFF, but I have no idea what role they played. The agent, Mike Berry was one such consultant.

I may be wrong, but I think I read somewhere that a seperate company or agency was formed to represent TTFF at the World Cup and manage expenses. If this were the case, then TTFF's spreadsheet may have been accurate, however, of course, the players would want to see the WC company's books, in that case.

Yeah, I think they call it LAYERING in money laundering terms. You create a business to collect the money on behalf of another business. Then you run up so much expenses and pay wages and bonuses that only a small part of that money is returned to the original business. Then they pay the shareholders (or in this case, players) their agreed share of whats left. 50% of nothing is nothing.

In effect a WC company could collect funds and pay an amount to a federation who then pays all the expenses and divide whats left amongst the players, while a large part of the original money is retainted by the WC company and distributed as it sees fit.

Wonder if anyones looked into this?? What ya say FPATT-you gonna chase this down?

Well, mate, this is a serious accusation and FPATT certainly can't publicly accuse anyone of this kind of operation. However, its an interesting thought. Maybe theres a lawyer or journalist out there who could search for the truth, but I don't think it's part of FPATTs remit to enter these areas. After all, we will have to eventually work with TTFF and Jack Warner. As I've pointed out before, we have to look to the future, not the past. Hopefully, by the next World Cup campaign there will be a lot more transparency and agreements will be in place to ensure these misunderstandings are prevented.

FPATT cannot make the accusations , but people on here certainly can.. 

[arrow]

Look, until the day TTFF allows it self to be audited by Ernst & Young, or Price Waterhouse Coopers, I maintain they are a set ah damn tief!!!!!

Not sure if you knew but the TTFF is audited by KPMG.  As for the world cup related revenues & expenses that would come under the separate LOC so I'm not sure that would also be audited.

[dcs]

Somehow for the next WC I don't think the bonus offered going to be anything substantial....if any is offered at all.  Might not be a bad thing if everything is agreed upon is reasonable and straight.

[kentsoulman]

For the next world cup, FPATT will negotiate, and you can bet it will be tighter, better formulated contract based on other nations contracts.

TTFF gonna get dragged into the 21st century!

They are gonna have to get their marketing act together, and get everything out in the open.

[dcs]

I hope so.

But I don't think there will be anything in it relating directly to revenue generated.

[WestCoast]

here is what the US gave their players.

U.S. men

USSF, player's union reach deal through 2010.
CHICAGO (Monday, December 19, 2005) -- The United States Soccer Federation and the U.S. men's player's union headed off the possibility of a labor dispute disrupting World Cup preparations when the two sides agreed to a five-year deal today.

The result of collective bargaining between the USSF and the U.S. National Soccer Team Players' Association was an agreement that will run through 2010, including next summer's World Cup in Germany and the 2010 Cup in South Africa.

"We are pleased to have reached an agreement with the U.S. National Soccer Players' Association on a collective bargaining agreement through the 2010 FIFA World Cup," USSF president Robert Contiguglia said in an e-mailed statement. "We have been confident throughout this process that an amicable agreement would be reached that would positively address the desires of both parties, and that is what we have accomplished together. Our focus now, as it has always been, is to move forward and continue our preparation for the 2006 FIFA World Cup in Germany."

A contract quarrel between the sides endangered the U.S. effort in this year's World Cup qualifying. After the USSF threatened to use replacement players in the final round of qualifying if an accord wasn't reached, the parties agreed January 21 to a no-strike pledge through 2005.

Under the new pact, U.S. players will earn $37,500 for making the World Cup roster, $3,750 for each Cup appearance and $3,000 per friendly, Associated Press reported. During World Cup qualifying, bonuses of $1,350 to $6,000 will be paid to each player for victories and draws, depending on the opponent. Bonuses for friendlies range from $750 to $5,250.

The World Cup squad will cumulatively earn $150,000 per standings point earned in the first round, which includes three games, and $2.775 million for advancing to the knockout stage, the Round of 16.

The federation will pay the players a total of $2.25 million for making the quarterfinals, $2.625 million for advancing to the semifinals, $3 million for going to the final and $3.75 million for winning the tournament. Winning the third-place game would be worth $500,000.

In 2002, the bonus for making the quarterfinals was $1.5 million, the semifinals $1.75 million amd the final $2 million, while winning the championship would have garnered $2.5 million, AP said. In that World Cup, the 23 players on the roster, plus injured midfielder Chris Armas and defender Greg Vanney earned $200,543 apiece.

Under the new agreement, retroactive to 2003, the players received $1.35 million for qualifying for the World Cup for the fifth straight time. This marked an increase from $900,000 in 2002.

"The players are pleased that they will continue to prepare for the 2006 World Cup with an agreement in place that benefits both sides," USNSTP executive director Mark Levinstein said in a statment. "We hope this agreement will be the first step in bringing together the millions of individuals and many organizations that support soccer in the United States to work to advance our sport."

The U.S. was drawn into the difficult Group E with Italy, Ghana and the Czech Republic for Germany 2006, which starts on June 9.

The U.S. men recently concluded a successful 2005 by winning the final round of World Cup qualifying for CONCACAF for the first time. The CONCACAF region includes North America, Central America and the Caribbean.

The Americans also captured their third CONCACAF Gold Cup title during the summer. The U.S.'s 13-3-4 record represented the most victories ever for a calendar year and its .750 winning percentage was also its best ever.

Coach Bruce Arena will hold a training camp for 30 players, starting January 4, at the Home Depot Center in Carson, Calif. It will include almost exclusively players from Major League Soccer, since players based in Europe are in the midst of their league season.

The U.S. will host Canada January 22 at Torero Stadium in San Diego and Norway January 29 at Home Depot Center. The team will also take on Japan February 10 at SBC Park in San Francisco.

The Americans will also face Germany March 22 at Westfalenstadion in Dortmund.

http://www.soccertimes.com/usteams/2005/dec19.htm

here is what some other countries paid their players.

World Cup rewards vary greatly. Saudi Arabia players were awarded $17,500 and a Mercedes Benz for qualifying for the 2002 World Cup and would have gained $1 million each for winning the championship. England was offering $280,000 to each player for a 2002 World Cup win, which is about two weeks' worth of salary for some Chelsea players. Italy's payoff was to be $154,000 per man.

If the U.S. wins every game in the World Cup, the team will divide $16,466,252, or $715,924 per player. If the U.S. matches its 2002 quarterfinal performance, the players will divvy up $5.625 million, plus about $2 million already earned for qualifying for the finals (slightly more than Mexico's payoff for qualifying). These would be significant earnings for a U.S.-based performer, but nothing exceptional for a top-class European club player, signifying that the national team still means more than dollar (or euro or pound) figures for most of the world.

In West Africa, for instance, expectations have gradually increased since Cameroon began making a strong impression in the '80s. West African countries often reward players with automobiles and villas if they qualify for the World Cup. But there is a double-edged sword -- if they fail to advance, those very properties can be placed at risk. The home of Inter Milan's Pierre Wome (plus business establishments belonging to his friends) were attacked after he missed a penalty kick in a tie with Egypt which cost Cameroon a place in the '06 Cup.

This raises the question of why Wome would bother coming back to Cameroon in the future. But Ivory Coast players did just that; under president Robert Guei, they were placed in detention camp, and now, with the Elephants having edged out Cameroon, Laurent Gbagbo has presented each player with a house worth about $52,000 and the honor of Knight of the National Order.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/columns/story?id=352876&root=us&&cc=5901

[Football supporter]

Note that these figures are for on field performance. There would have been seperate agreements for bonuses from sponsorship, marketing and tv rights. These can only be negotiated on a tournament by tournament basis as nobody would know the income available years in advance.

However, this is exactly the kind of agreement FPATT would like to have in place as soon as possible.

[Tallman]

Here are what the USSF's audited financial statements look like:
http://www.ussoccer.com/about/federation-services/resource-center/financial-information

[Cowen]

Here is what the USSF's audited financial statements look like:
http://www.ussoccer.com/about/federation-services/resource-center/financial-information

chalk and cheese