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Offline pull stones

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If this doesn't motivate us.........
« on: October 13, 2017, 10:45:41 AM »
last night I finally came down off my high I just couldn't sleep well for the past two nights simply because of maybe overachievers anxiety who knows but while in my state of sleeplessness I wondered around the web quite a bit after watch Taylor twellman's rave which brought me to a bunch of independent blogs moaning about how really bad their soccer programs are and how much they need developmental programs and more so youth development and more shockingly was that they have been beaten.....not by the worst team in the hex nor the worst team in CFU but by the very worst team in the whole of concacaf! which mad me very bloody angry! AND IF THIS DOESNT MOTIVATE US THEN NOTHING WILL. how very insulting.

These people are so self important and self entitled that they only found out yesterday that they needed youth development, they didnt see that for the last 28 years and 7 consecutive World Cup appearances that they needed youth development? What about after winning the gold cup in july, didnt they realize that they needed a developmental program on the youth level? I heard twellman lalas wanaldo bob lee and all of the pundits heaping praises on dempsey nagbe and pulisic about their victory vs jamaica by winning the gold cup but no mention that things could be better and they are taking false pride in a failing system.

on ending, I hope every national player would visit the Internet and see all these little blog sites mainly on youtube dispicably describing our football as utta rubbish and down playing our achievement by beating them while containing them to very little ball movement like they were used too and saying that their team was lathargic when in fact dennis lawrence and his staff finally found a solution to contain these teams in concacaf, and they were contained, but no we gets no credit for that, and Bruce arena knew it that's why he said we played a great game.

 and if they weren't so arrogant they would have taken note because no team ran over us at home not mexico not honduras not costa rica, and if they weren't self absorbed and disrespectful they would have took note of friday's game where mexico had to pull a rabbit out their ass to beat us, but Bruce when ask the question prior to tuesday's game he said he didn't have trinidad in mind. I bet he wished he did now.

our players our administrators our clubs need to keep this in their heads that we need to do better and maintain a standard because Lawrence sol and stern has showed us a way to best these arrogant bastards both mexico and the usa and its up to us now to keep the torch burning, and like I said above, if after all the insults and the cheap shots, if this doesn't motivate us then nothing will.

mods please don't merge right away. it would be interesting to hear what the forum had to say about the abuse we have been receiving after this disappointing usa loss by these heady high minded americans.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 10:58:28 AM by pull stones »

Offline kounty

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2017, 12:18:53 PM »
Usually I don't get hype up by the media, and I jus barely bring myself to actually see the twellerman rant, but I think the title of your post is spot on, and I think Trinis will respond to that.
I saw how deeply upset Shaka was in response, having played and lost so many times to them same arrogant dudes, and I think (God keep us please from taking any further steps backwards from this point) as you say, I don't know any red blooded trini who will take being look down upon. The perfect motivation to seek them out every time and look to cut dey arse over and over  - a classico of renewed intensity...or else as you say, I dunno what will motivate dem boyz if not this. At least against the US.

Offline congo

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2017, 03:27:06 PM »
Newsflash, Europe looks down on the USA/Mexico etc.....Comes with the territory....America is unique because it is a global sporting superpower that dominates every other sport except "soccer/football". They still haven't cracked the code and they have actually invested in their programs and infrastructure. They have a right to feel short changed. They weren't operating on vaps. We operate on vaps.

Another fact is that MLS as a footballing product is nothing to be admired yet our players are begging to reach and play there. We need to start looking inward for solutions. America has less to fix than us and more resources to do so with. I pray that the day when the best american athletes start looking towards soccer for a future never comes. That would be a game changer. Let's hope that their best athletes keep gravitating towards basketball/nfl football. Could you imagine a Lebron James in goal etc. He's taller and more athletic than Peter Crouch will ever be.

The victory was good but let's be honest...Americans only reacting exactly like we react when we lost to teams such as Bermuda etc. Guys let's be honest with ourselves. We could do well to get off our high horses.

Offline pull stones

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2017, 03:51:46 PM »
Newsflash, Europe looks down on the USA/Mexico etc.....Comes with the territory....America is unique because it is a global sporting superpower that dominates every other sport except "soccer/football". They still haven't cracked the code and they have actually invested in their programs and infrastructure. They have a right to feel short changed. They weren't operating on vaps. We operate on vaps.

Another fact is that MLS as a footballing product is nothing to be admired yet our players are begging to reach and play there. We need to start looking inward for solutions. America has less to fix than us and more resources to do so with. I pray that the day when the best american athletes start looking towards soccer for a future never comes. That would be a game changer. Let's hope that their best athletes keep gravitating towards basketball/nfl football. Could you imagine a Lebron James in goal etc. He's taller and more athletic than Peter Crouch will ever be.

The victory was good but let's be honest...Americans only reacting exactly like we react when we lost to teams such as Bermuda etc. Guys let's be honest with ourselves. We could do well to get off our high horses.
dude I know you're trying to be objective and even minded but you need to carfully read my post because you totally missed the point. They're blaming their loss on a lack of player development and gave no thought to the fact that they were outplayed and we were the better team on the day. Never have they cried about player development in the past when they were handing it to us, but as soon they fell to us they  went in search of excuses under the cat the dog and the rug instead of admitting that we were better on the day. I guess that's yankee arrogance for you.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 07:43:43 PM by pull stones »

Offline congo

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2017, 04:50:00 PM »
Ammmm were they outplayed or did they just not play good? What is it you really trying to say?

You talking like we played some boss game or something. I think they alluding to the fact that their entire campaign has been shambles for a while. That is where the youth development talk comes from. Let's be honest, all they have to show for their youth development is Pulisic etc. That is not good returns for all that they invest. You can't even count the players that mls developing because american players overseas haven't really stood the test of times (Donavon etc). I think you may be reading too much into what they are saying. We are the minnows and we are the automatic 3 points for teams. We lament here about not even making gold cup and not winning caribbean cup for years but vex because american commentators "talking down" to us. The same commentators we want looking at us favorably so that our players can get a "bligh" in mls or usl. You want them to admit that we were better on the day, after a defeat that ended in them failing to qualify for a world cup? In a match where they fielded players from the English Premier League and German Bundesliga?

We have too much false pride. Just take the victory and be happy. We have sooo much work to do here. Let's focus on us.

PS.....It so scary the kinda animosity that trinis have towards the USA etc yet that is the first country they run to for any sort of betterment. Trinis have soo much animosity towards America yet starbucks always full

Trinis ::) ::) ::)

Offline pull stones

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2017, 07:38:50 PM »
Ammmm were they outplayed or did they just not play good? What is it you really trying to say?

You talking like we played some boss game or something. I think they alluding to the fact that their entire campaign has been shambles for a while. That is where the youth development talk comes from. Let's be honest, all they have to show for their youth development is Pulisic etc. That is not good returns for all that they invest. You can't even count the players that mls developing because american players overseas haven't really stood the test of times (Donavon etc). I think you may be reading too much into what they are saying. We are the minnows and we are the automatic 3 points for teams. We lament here about not even making gold cup and not winning caribbean cup for years but vex because american commentators "talking down" to us. The same commentators we want looking at us favorably so that our players can get a "bligh" in mls or usl. You want them to admit that we were better on the day, after a defeat that ended in them failing to qualify for a world cup? In a match where they fielded players from the English Premier League and German Bundesliga?

We have too much false pride. Just take the victory and be happy. We have sooo much work to do here. Let's focus on us.

PS.....It so scary the kinda animosity that trinis have towards the USA etc yet that is the first country they run to for any sort of betterment. Trinis have soo much animosity towards America yet starbucks always full

Trinis ::) ::) ::)
i think its you and not me who's digging way too deep or as you say reading to much into it.  I never said anything about playing a boss game as you claimed, all I said was that we out played them on the night and did our leg work, while they said their team did not show up, and when last the usa has never showed up to play us especially in a must win game?

FYI outplaying a team does not always translate into a great or flawless game sometimes it could mean an unexcited game of chess by stifling the other team's offense and interrupting their flow while emploring your own offensive and defensive strategy.

and who cares how much they put into their football, that is no concern of mine, if they had mounted a come back and scored three or four goals in the second half and defeated us on tuesday you would have heard a different tune altogether of how brilliant Bruce areana was and nothing would have been lacking from their football like on Friday when they tore apart panama, and had it been dempsey and pulisic who did the honors, they would have song their praises to the high heavens. So you could go right on ahead and be civilized courteous unbiased and even minded if you want, you were damn right about one thing, i will enjoy this victory... I probably will for the next four years with my trunk full of animosity.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 07:44:21 PM by pull stones »

Offline congo

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #6 on: October 13, 2017, 08:59:21 PM »
But aren't singing our team praises right now. The same exact thing that you criticizing them about, you doing right now. Nice, they win...well done. They beat the mighty US of A down in Couva. A game that basically means less than a friendly to us they won. Slow  :notworthy: :notworthy: With nothing to lose, they manage to beat a USA team that is considered one of the oldest and worst performing teams in a while. Only a handful of their players even play outside of the USA.

Pal, as much as I happy for the victory and taking it. TTFA still can't tell us who we playing for the next international break. That's where our football is. USMNT probably have their schedule mapped out for the next 18 months. I was in England for the game when we beat Iceland 2-0. I thought WC2006 was going to be a turning point. A time when teams would come to POS and not expect an easy ride etc. We all know how that turn out.

We need to stop looking for outside validation and just put in work. The plaudits will come with the results. Stop worrying about how they view us. The fact remains that we are ranked 99th in the world. The narrative will always be that the USA played poorly. There can be no other narrative. Not when you are ranked 99th.

Syria almost made it to the world cup. Iraq has a team in the u17 world cup. What really is our excuse again?

We have teams in the middle of war still making progress.

We need to look inward to solve our problems. A next one on the board think it have some conspiracy to "keep us down". Never mind the indiscipline players who ducking curfew to go boat cruise etc. Never mind the administrative cuck ups....A conspiracy.
We need to stop looking for outside validation and just put in work. The plaudits will come with the results. Stop worrying about how they view us. The fact remains that we are ranked 99th in the world. The narrative will always be that the USA played poorly. There can be no other narrative.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 09:03:57 PM by congo »

Offline soccerman

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2017, 09:07:19 PM »
Yes we won and the victory was sweet, I'd even agree that we threw them off their game. I'm also adamant that they've been arrogant when it comes to the other teams in the region with the exception of Mexico and maybe Costa Rica. Bruce never respected us and I'm glad we put them in their place. Where I give them credit is that their "pundits" are recognizing their system is flawed in terms of youth development and they're actually calling for change by putting pressure on the federation.
We on the other hand also hand a failed campaign and in getting payback to the US for 1989 we're sort of sweeping the fact that we didn't achieve our objective in the HEX.
I really hope this motivates our players but what is our federation's plan going forward. Up to now I haven't heard a peep from DJW, at least Sunil Gulatti came out and faced the music and answered the press. Although I don't agree with what he said, that is not my concern, I worry about us. Is TTFA taking responsibility? Are we going to change/adjust our developmental pattern going forward? Is their plans to bring a qualified TD with a plan and vision to work with our programs? Or are we going to ride this wave for the next year or two? I will love to see our media put pressure on them to let them we need to shake things up and we do have standards because if we continue at this rate we may not even make the next HEX.

Offline pull stones

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2017, 12:42:03 AM »
But aren't singing our team praises right now. The same exact thing that you criticizing them about, you doing right now. Nice, they win...well done. They beat the mighty US of A down in Couva. A game that basically means less than a friendly to us they won. Slow  :notworthy: :notworthy: With nothing to lose, they manage to beat a USA team that is considered one of the oldest and worst performing teams in a while. Only a handful of their players even play outside of the USA.

Pal, as much as I happy for the victory and taking it. TTFA still can't tell us who we playing for the next international break. That's where our football is. USMNT probably have their schedule mapped out for the next 18 months. I was in England for the game when we beat Iceland 2-0. I thought WC2006 was going to be a turning point. A time when teams would come to POS and not expect an easy ride etc. We all know how that turn out.

We need to stop looking for outside validation and just put in work. The plaudits will come with the results. Stop worrying about how they view us. The fact remains that we are ranked 99th in the world. The narrative will always be that the USA played poorly. There can be no other narrative. Not when you are ranked 99th.

Syria almost made it to the world cup. Iraq has a team in the u17 world cup. What really is our excuse again?

We have teams in the middle of war still making progress.

We need to look inward to solve our problems. A next one on the board think it have some conspiracy to "keep us down". Never mind the indiscipline players who ducking curfew to go boat cruise etc. Never mind the administrative cuck ups....A conspiracy.
We need to stop looking for outside validation and just put in work. The plaudits will come with the results. Stop worrying about how they view us. The fact remains that we are ranked 99th in the world. The narrative will always be that the USA played poorly. There can be no other narrative.
whatever you say mate so let's leave it there have the last word. BTW we were ranked 49 in 2016, does that mean anything?

Offline Deeks

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2017, 01:47:41 AM »
I don't think people in TT are mooks when it comes to football. Did you not see the attendance for the game. More empty seats than people. People in TT know football. They have had Jack for 25 yrs, and now DJW for maybe  a next 8 yrs. They not buying this victory as some mighty triumph. Everybody in TT know the team failed. But who in their right mind would not have some fun at the expense of the overconfident US. Nobody eh dead because of the game. People getting killed in TT for absolutely NOTHING, RIGHT NOW. IS HATE, HATE, HATE!!! And some complaining that the fans should not express their feeling. The fans and public have had no patriotic connection to the TTFA for the past 30 yrs. What will their opinions and protests change. Not one f--king thing. Their only course of action is to stay away, and go to lower league or minor league football, where they play for the love of the game.

What I think most of us are upset about is the way the US pundits have criticized their federation which will have drastic and immediate changes. FoxSport will lose 200 mil. because of that "debacle" at Corvah".  What is happening with our federation. They probably savouring the "the revenge of 89". Well. "We should be glad they starting a grassroots program". Take note that is in quotes. Well, I would like to know, how may Indians kids are being encouraged to come out and at least try ah ting. At least fail. Are they trying to engage the parents to  encourage the boys and yes, girls to come out and at least try ah thing.  When was the last time you see a Ahmad Charles, Bobby Sookram, Ellis Sadaphal, Steve Khan. That is donkey years. That is the meaning of grassroots, in my opinion. Many US pundits know their development programs have faults. Some of the more skillful kids are falling thru the cracks of their system because they can't get into the "elite" programs. Those  with money and affluence makes the decisions on who goes forward. I could go on and on ......

Offline sjahrain

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2017, 03:31:07 PM »
That was one game....how many were lost before this one victory
Chill let me see the next performance..then we can say progress or regress
We must develop a wining mentality...then side line jockeys...will sing your song

Offline Tobago28

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2017, 09:01:37 PM »
And the worse team in the Hex beating the second worse team in the Hex is motivation? Why?

Our motivation can only come from us establishing high standarda and developing a plan to meet those standards.

A reaction to the USA response to us beating them can not be our motivation for excellence. What type of dodoo is that? We give 19 goals in the Hex, get motivation to be co.pact in defense. In 10 games we did not score 8 goals
 and you want motivation to come from USA response. Come on 2 Pull

Offline pull stones

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2017, 07:51:31 AM »
It's weird to hear all the opposing points of view and most of it going on a different course than I originally charted and the negative remarks about us not being a good team and how we should not take anything from the usa game except that we beat a very poor usa team and how very poor we ourselves were.

 look guys if you really want to be objective had we not self destruct in the last 10 minutes in mexico we could have handed them their first defeat at home with them at full strength and they are head and shoulder above the rest the best team in the whole region yet they has never outplayed us in this hex needing the help of the officials to beat us narrowly by one single goal in trinidad. so what's all the this about beating the second worst team in concacaf when the difference between costa rica honduras panama and the usa were a point or two with usa having an even better goal average and having to wait to the very last minute to decide whether who was in and who was out.

steven hart said it himself that we were good enough to beat any team in concacaf all we need to do is believe in our ability but still we hear fans including fans from other countries down grade us like were severely out classed in every match of the hex. we all know that our federation bums so does our youth development programs and our pro league and if you ask the question do we have a lot of work to do? the answer would be, you bet we do, and we need to get cracking as of yesterday. but to say we take no motivation from this game because it came too little too late, I strongly disagree with that mode of thinking. i say we take a lot not only from the game it self but from the way their fans and others view us.

this should serve as a wake up call to the players that they need to do better and when they put on that national uniform because they're not just playing for the right to wear it, but for the image of the whole 3 million trinis and not just the 1.5 million at home but the 1.5 million that are in the diaspora, all of us  combined because when trinidad and tobago aches we all in the diaspora feels it. this is my point and I don't care if we defeated the worst usa team ever, the history books will show that we defeated them with a second string team when it really mattered to them in a must win situation and there's a lot to be taken from that.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 07:58:45 AM by pull stones »

Offline 100% Barataria

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2017, 08:29:09 AM »
Both arguments on this thread are right.  We need a proper admin with proper planning, players motivated to give 100+% at all time and leverage all motivators to achieve (internal and external)

For us the above is utopia right now, hopefully it can be reality.  I am of the opinion it can, don't think so with DJW, but maybe he can prove us wrong...
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 12:58:06 PM by 100% Barataria »
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Offline futbolfan

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2017, 10:10:29 AM »
Congo....

I believe that there is a misconception which insinuates  that if the US best athletes switched to football, the world will have to watch out...

Last time I checked being a super human athlete didn't equate to one being superior on the football field.

Messi, Neyamar, and Ronaldo are not the biggest or most physical athletes to play this game but they are all dominant.

This is akin to the suggestion that size of a country should equate to overall dominance in a sport, in this case football.

I agree that  the US have made significant inroads in the sport, but they are still light years away  from being
a major player.
Not saying it is impossible, but I don't think we will see any major status changes in our life time.

We on the other hand have the 'potential' to surpass them if and only if the stakeholders/public come together.
The darkest hour is just before the dawn.

Offline Controversial

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2017, 02:15:25 PM »
Motivate?

Did we qualify with a coach and team we wanted?

With a president we wanted?

2006 was motivation , motivation to get a president who cares, who can lure the private sector since the govt only concerned with theifing money and not giving to sport


Offline Deeks

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2017, 02:53:24 PM »
who can lure the private sector since the govt only concerned with theifing money and not giving to sport

Nothing stopping the private sector from contribution to any sport. They not interested. If you have people to form your own pro team or sponsor a pro team, why don't you get on with it. Right now is the govt who putting most money in sports. Who has to maintain all the facilities, with the exception of the Oval. Is the govt.

Offline Adam Lake

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2017, 07:09:17 PM »
Honestly, while i'm happy about the victory and being able to avenge the loss of '89. We gotta get serious, and put our house in order. We've been begging for years to get a proper development plan in place, but like everything else in this country, we always jump up hot n sweaty to start something and don't ever see it through. Time will tell if anything changes.

Regarding the issue about the USA's attitude towards us, I cud give a rats ass and really not bothered. We do the same thing when playing countries in the CFU. I remember when Bermuda gave us a run for our money in a qualifier game some years back, as well as Guyana who knocked us out when Shabazz coached them. Trini fans went to town on the Players and Coaches, but we were also full of it and very arrogant about getting a cut ass from those countries that we thought were beneath us. We never gave Guyana credit for being a better side than us on the day.

We got to be realistic about where we are as a country, we have verrrry far to go. Yes we have shown signs of improvement and have some very talented players with natural abilities, that occasionally give teams in CONCACAF a run for there money, but we are very inconsistent. Only through proper planning and a better structure will we be able climb the ladder and become a force to be reckoned with and maybe one day get the respect from other nations. Right now we honestly doh deserve shit!   

Offline Deeks

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2017, 12:06:53 AM »
I remember when Bermuda gave us a run for our money in a qualifier game some years back, as well as Guyana who knocked us out when Shabazz coached them. Trini fans went to town on the Players and Coaches, but we were also full of it and very arrogant about getting a cut ass from those countries that we thought were beneath

Adam, this has always been the case. I old enough to remember in the 70s and 80s, there were harsh crticisms when we failed in WC qualifications. Whether Suriname, Barbados, Haiti, Guatemala, Honduras and CR. All involved used to get Bwah.

Offline Rastaman

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2017, 08:32:14 AM »
Wow...I cant believe the amount of negative reactions to Pull Stone's opinion. Some of allyuh really need to chill.

Offline Deeks

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2017, 10:35:32 AM »
I eh criticizing "pull stones". I agree with much of what he said. I just expressing my opinion. I feel that the fans enjoy the national team beating the  US in such an important game(for the US at least). That is what fans are supposed to do. Right now, the arrow and fingers are pointing at TTFA. What is their pla of action for the national women's and men's team. Don't for 2 weeks before the next CFU to start training.

Offline soccerman

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2017, 12:20:14 PM »
I eh criticizing "pull stones". I agree with much of what he said. I just expressing my opinion. I feel that the fans enjoy the national team beating the  US in such an important game(for the US at least). That is what fans are supposed to do. Right now, the arrow and fingers are pointing at TTFA. What is their pla of action for the national women's and men's team. Don't for 2 weeks before the next CFU to start training.
What he said :beermug:

Offline congo

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Re: If this doesn't motivate us.........
« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2017, 02:12:28 PM »
Congo....

I believe that there is a misconception which insinuates  that if the US best athletes switched to football, the world will have to watch out...

Last time I checked being a super human athlete didn't equate to one being superior on the football field.

Messi, Neyamar, and Ronaldo are not the biggest or most physical athletes to play this game but they are all dominant.

This is akin to the suggestion that size of a country should equate to overall dominance in a sport, in this case football.

I agree that  the US have made significant inroads in the sport, but they are still light years away  from being
a major player.
Not saying it is impossible, but I don't think we will see any major status changes in our life time.

We on the other hand have the 'potential' to surpass them if and only if the stakeholders/public come together.

They may not be the "biggest" athletes but what they benefit from is the fact that football/soccer is the most popular sport in their countries.

That is all that I am saying. What would happen if America becomes soccer mad and really make significant investments in football/soccer?

 Right now, soccer is a 'rich kids" sport in America compared to the sport in other countries where it's really the poor and downtrodden who see it as a way to get out of poverty etc.

In America, the sports of choice to get out of poverty/inner cities are football(nfl) and Basketball. That is what I am alluding too.

The average youth involved in soccer in America is way more privileged that the average kid in Brazil for example.

Most American soccer players probably came from middle class backgrounds etc. Ronaldo's dad swept the streets for a living. Sanchez worked in a salt mine in his teens. Tonnes of Brazilian players came from the favelas.