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Offline ZANDOLIE

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #300 on: November 18, 2019, 12:44:32 AM »
Anyone with an ounce of personal integrity would step aside as head of a national federation, or as head coach in shame after this debacle. But I hear these men talking as though they are just getting started setting up things for the future, and its us the fans who are short sighted and selfish. AFAIC, Lawrence's heroics in 2005 have been superceded by his shambolic failures as a coach and a sense that he is entitled to carry on as usual regardless of performance/results. Its depressing to imagine where football will be in 4 years under a re-elected DJW tenureship.
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Offline Flex

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #301 on: November 18, 2019, 01:26:48 AM »
T&T drubbed 4-0 by Honduras.
T&T Guardian Reports.


Trinidad and To­ba­go’s hopes of ad­vanc­ing to the next phase of the Con­ca­caf Na­tions League were shat­tered last night af­ter they were drubbed 4-0 by a well-oiled Hon­duras at the Es­ta­dio Olímpi­co Met­ro­pol­i­tano in Hon­duras.

A dou­ble from mid­field­er Al­berth Elis was more than enough to give the home side vic­to­ry and con­fine the So­ca War­riors to yet an­oth­er hu­mil­i­at­ing 4-0 loss in four days.

In a game in which T&T were put un­der de­fen­sive pres­sure from the first whis­tle by a slick Hon­duran mid­field which grabbed con­trol of the game, Elis first con­vert­ed a penal­ty in the sec­ond minute of time added on for stop­pages in the first half. Af­ter de­fend­er Aikim An­drews brought down Hon­duran winger Jonathan Toro­hia in the penal­ty area, Elis stepped up and buried a right-foot­ed shot in­to the bot­tom right-hand cor­ner of T&T goalie Mar­vin Phillip’s net to in­crease the ad­van­tage to 3-0.

Elis com­plet­ed his dou­ble in the 52-minute when he latched on­to a through ball from Toro­hia in­side the penal­ty area and un­leashed a right-foot­er which gave a now weary Phillip no chance again.

Toro­hia had ear­li­er giv­en Hon­duras the lead af­ter just five min­utes when he beat Phillip with a right-foot­er from just out­side the box off a free-kick.

In­flu­en­tial mid­field­er Brayan Moya, who pulled most of the strings in the mid­dle of the field for his team, then gave them a 2-0 cush­ion 15 min­utes lat­er with a left-foot­er in­side the penal­ty area off a feed from Félix Crisan­to.

T&T, beat­en 3-0 in a mid-week friend­ly by Ecuador, tried their best in the sec­ond half but sim­ply did not have the depth to launch a come­back. To add in­sult to in­jury, coach Den­nis Lawrence lost both Jo­mal Williams and Car­lyle Mitchell and to in­juries.

(Teams)

Trinidad and Tobago (4-2-3-1): 1.Marvin Phillip (GK); 18.Aikim Andrews, 2.Aubrey David, 4.Sheldon Bateau (captain), 3.Ross Russell Jr (12.Carlyle Mitchell 55 [5.Daneil Cyrus 69]); 23.Aaron Lester, 8.Kevon Goddard; 20.Jomal Williams (16.Jomoul Francois 74), 9.Ataulla Guerra, 11.Ryan Telfer; 10.Marcus Joseph.

Unused substitutes: 21.Glenroy Samuel (GK), 7.Nathan Lewis, 19.Matthew Woo Ling, 17.Jerrel Britto.

Coach: Dennis Lawrence

Honduras (4-2-1-3): 22.Luis Lopez (GK), 2.Félix Crisanto, 15.Denil Maldonado, 3.Maynor Figueroa (captain), 5.Éver Alvarado; 8.Carlos Pineda, 10.Alexander López; 13.Brayan Moya (20.Edwin Rodríguez 86); 17.Alberth Elis, 11.Rubilio Castillo, 12.Jonathan Toro Rubio (16.Rigoberto Rivas 78).

Unused substitutes: 1.Harold Fonseca (GK), 18.Jose Zúñiga (GK), 4.Marcelo Santos, 6.Bryan Acosta, 7.Emilio Izaguirre, 9.Jorge Benguché, 14.Kevin Arriaga, 19.Juan Ramón Mejía, 21.Kevin López, 23.Edwin Solano.

Coach: Fabián Coito

Concacaf Nations League Result

(Sunday 17 November 2019)

Honduras 4 (Jonathan Toro Rubio 5, Brayan Moya 20, Alberth Elis 45+1 pen, 53), Trinidad and Tobago 0 at San Pedro Sula.

RELATED NEWS

Honduras whip woeful T&T in Nations League.
By Joel Bailey (Newsday).


HONDURAS whipped a woeful T&T outfit 4-0 last night, at the Olimpico Metropolitano, San Pedro Sula, Honduras, in their Concacaf Nations League, League A Group C encounter.

The Hondurans have qualified for both the Concacaf Nations League semi-finals and the 2021 Concacaf Gold Cup.

T&T, on the other hand, were relegated to League B and will enter the Gold Cup qualifying second round.

Honduras finished top of the three-team League A Group C with 10 points from four matches, followed by Martinique (three points) – who also qualified for the next Gold Cup, and T&T (two points).

For T&T coach Dennis Lawrence, this result mirrored Thursday’s 3-0 win away to Ecuador, in a friendly international. The T&T team, who recorded their largest ever victory last Sunday – 15-0 over Anguilla – hardly offered a threat on the offensive end, and their defence were routinely picked apart by their hosts.

It was virtually a new-look T&T team, with a number of players absent due to suspension, choice, injuries or inability to enter Honduras due to an issue with their vaccination cards.

Aikim Andrews, who plays as a midfielder with Terminix La Horquetta Rangers, was inserted as the right back by Lawrence, and the make-shift defender was culpable for Honduras’ opener, after five minutes.

Andrews chested a long-ball from a Honduras player and failed to spot a lurking Jonathan Rubio who took the loose ball and drilled a low right-footed shot, from the edge of the penalty box, to the right of goalkeeper Marvin Phillip.

Another full-back, Aubrey David, was left for dead by overlapping defender Felix Crisanto who made a run down the flank and squared the ball for Brayan Moya who slotted a left-footed effort to the bottom right-hand corner in the 20th minute.

Honduras virtually assured themselves of victory when Alberth Elis converted a penalty, in first half stoppage time, after Moya’s shirt was pulled, inside the box, by a hapless Andrews.

And Elis put the icing on the cake in the 54th minute. T&T’s captain Sheldon Bateau’s poor pass was intercepted by the midfield and the ball was relayed to Elis who was free as a bird as he strolled into the penalty box and finished with a powerful right-footed shot.

Marcus Joseph came close to getting an elusive goal for T&T, with a left-footed shot which forced a good save from Luis Lopez, after 61 minutes.

« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 02:47:49 AM by Flex »
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Offline Deeks

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #302 on: November 18, 2019, 01:56:11 AM »
Let's see if  DeLeon and Bostock really want to play for TT now.

Offline pull stones

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #303 on: November 18, 2019, 03:24:56 AM »
Let's see if  DeLeon and Bostock really want to play for TT now.
there’s no World Cup and no gold cup to be had so i seriously doubt it. what the new administration should do if they are elected(knock on wood) is to get rid of the whole overage backl line. those guys are very slow as we saw last night where defenders were grabbing the Honduran players when beaten for pace. we need young smart agile speedy defenders.

I think we should start the rebuilding process with a youthful team with no one over 25, which means we only keep levi garcia, ryan telfer, neval hackshaw, and Alvin jones, the rest should be thanked for their services and released. JMO.

PS. After the USA game at ato boldon dennis claim he would venture into a rebuilding stage with a young crop, then he went back on his word bringing back hyland and that old back line including marvin dirty sheet phillip out of retirement,  i was very surprised he didn’t suit up latapy and Yorke by the rate he was going.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 03:27:45 AM by pull stones »

Offline sjahrain

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #304 on: November 18, 2019, 03:52:13 AM »
Signed sealed and delivered into oblivion...and thats a wrap...time to clean house....

Offline Tiresais

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #305 on: November 18, 2019, 03:53:52 AM »
I roughly agree we look to the future, but you need some older heads in there - people with the right attitude and professionalism who can help the younger ones integrate into a squad, pass on any wisdom, and otherwise be leaders on the pitch and in the camp.

No one immediately jumps to mind...

Offline pull stones

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #306 on: November 18, 2019, 04:37:03 AM »
I roughly agree we look to the future, but you need some older heads in there - people with the right attitude and professionalism who can help the younger ones integrate into a squad, pass on any wisdom, and otherwise be leaders on the pitch and in the camp.

No one immediately jumps to mind...
did you read the article with jovin talking about why he excluded himself from last night’s game him and molino? as important as last night’s game was especially with the injuries and suspensions to key players and how much our football would have been affected for the next few years if we were to lose that game, and making a selfish decision like that, would you wants that kind of mentality around a young impressionable team?

in case you have forgoten jovin was rejected by oto fister the German coach because he was a discipline problem, and because of molino’s antics he may have stirred up the dressing room that triggered the string of Steven hart’s losses to teams he should have beaten easily causing us to miss out not only on the copa america, but also the gold cup.

remember it was Lawrence who brought molino back on the team, molino missed out on the first two games vs costa rica and honduras in the hex and came back in time to play panama where he scored. IMO we don’t need these guys that badly, it’s not like they are essential players like Weston mc kennie who’s output is insane or a albert ellis who is an instant game changer or an andreas guadado or even a josey altador,

please these guys go games without a goal or an assist, especially of late, why do we need them so much? I say we’re better without them in the dressing room. jovin should have kept his mouth shut because no coach likes hearing crap like that.

Offline Tallman

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #307 on: November 18, 2019, 05:59:35 AM »
WATCH: Highlights of Trinidad and Tobago's 4-0 loss to Honduras. #HONvTRI #SocaWarriors

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY</a>
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Offline pull stones

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #308 on: November 18, 2019, 06:42:46 AM »
WATCH: Highlights of Trinidad and Tobago's 4-0 loss to Honduras. #HONvTRI #SocaWarriors

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY</a>
as much as we love to dog the defense for much of our losses (and rightfully so) while we give the keeper a pass, could anyone watch these highlights and actually blame the defense for any of the goals? looking at these highlights I see the goalie and the midfield at fault.

 on the first goal a man takes a shot from 30 yards out and not even in the box the defense was well positioned and somewhat organized and that goal scored, just look at Marcus Joseph’s shot where López pushed the ball wide, by all accounts that was supposed to score but that’s what good keepers do,they save their teams from embarrassment. marvin had a right to save that first goal, there’s no way that would have scored on any of the top six concacaf goalkeepers.

on the second goal we all knew what ellis was going to do. he normally runs the flanks and pass backward to an on running attacker, jesus wept it’s his M O why wasn’t any of the midfielders tracking and picking up that on coming attacker for Christ sake? then marvin is caught flat footed again and that shot was supposed to be an easy save but not with flat footed marvin.

for those with eyes the third goal was a BS call. the ref messed up on the previous call and owed honduras a penalty so he gave it on that bogus play, but that was certainly not a penalty, very bad call. and on the last goal ellis is running down the right side, the midfield absent again allowing all kind of space for attackers to make cleaver runs and that they did.

ellis is being picked up, for the love of god keeper hold your line at least let him take a shot instead of running out and making it easy for him, what is wrong with our goalies who’s bloody coaching these clowns?

yes our defenders are woeful but I see a midfield putting so much pressure on our defenders causing them to over defend when they should at least take some of that pressure on themselves and off the defense by leaving less space in the middle of the park and holding possession.

all I could hope for is that whoever the next coach is, he familiarize himself with tapes of the last 10 years and study this anomaly closely because this has been our achilles heal for the past 30 years where our defense is easily unraveled with a simple counter attack and rapid ball movement. it’s so very embarrassing.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 06:50:17 AM by pull stones »

Offline pull stones

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #309 on: November 18, 2019, 06:59:52 AM »
WATCH: Highlights of Trinidad and Tobago's 4-0 loss to Honduras. #HONvTRI #SocaWarriors

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY</a>
as much as we love to dog the defense for much of our losses (and rightfully so) while we give the keeper a pass, could anyone watch these highlights and actually blame the defense for any of the goals? looking at these highlights I see the goalie and the midfield at fault.

 on the first goal a man takes a shot from 30 yards out and not even in the box the defense was well positioned and somewhat organized and that goal scored, just look at Marcus Joseph’s shot where López pushed the ball wide, by all accounts that was supposed to score but that’s what good keepers do,they save their teams from embarrassment. marvin had a right to save that first goal, there’s no way that would have scored on any of the top six concacaf goalkeepers.

on the second goal we all knew what ellis was going to do. he normally runs the flanks and pass backward to an on running attacker, jesus wept it’s his M O why wasn’t any of the midfielders tracking and picking up that on coming attacker for Christ sake? then marvin is caught flat footed again and that shot was supposed to be an easy save but not with flat footed marvin.

for those with eyes the third goal was a BS call. the ref messed up on the previous call and owed honduras a penalty so he gave it on that bogus play, but that was certainly not a penalty, very bad call. and on the last goal ellis is running down the right side, the midfield absent again allowing all kind of space for attackers to make cleaver runs and that they did.

ellis is being picked up, for the love of god keeper hold your line at least let him take a shot instead of running out and making it easy for him, what is wrong with our goalies who’s bloody coaching these clowns?

yes our defenders are woeful but I see a midfield putting so much pressure on our defenders causing them to over defend when they should at least take some of that pressure on themselves and off the defense by leaving less space in the middle of the park and holding possession.

all I could hope for is that whoever the next coach is, he familiarize himself with tapes of the last 10 years and study this anomaly closely because this has been our achilles heal for the past 30 years where our defense is easily unraveled with a simple counter attack and rapid ball movement. it’s so very embarrassing.
just before the penalty, look how bateau was chasing marvin back to his goal line. one of the things I can’t stand with local keepers is how they run out and gets nothing making it easier for the attackers to score, at least if your leaving your line please get the ball or at least disrupt the momentum, these keepers run out gets nothing interrupt the defense and make it easier to concede, don’t these players reflect on past games?

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #310 on: November 18, 2019, 07:17:34 AM »
WATCH: Highlights of Trinidad and Tobago's 4-0 loss to Honduras. #HONvTRI #SocaWarriors

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/kSJy4FeKCJY</a>
as much as we love to dog the defense for much of our losses (and rightfully so) while we give the keeper a pass, could anyone watch these highlights and actually blame the defense for any of the goals? looking at these highlights I see the goalie and the midfield at fault.

 on the first goal a man takes a shot from 30 yards out and not even in the box the defense was well positioned and somewhat organized and that goal scored, just look at Marcus Joseph’s shot where López pushed the ball wide, by all accounts that was supposed to score but that’s what good keepers do,they save their teams from embarrassment. marvin had a right to save that first goal, there’s no way that would have scored on any of the top six concacaf goalkeepers.

on the second goal we all knew what ellis was going to do. he normally runs the flanks and pass backward to an on running attacker, jesus wept it’s his M O why wasn’t any of the midfielders tracking and picking up that on coming attacker for Christ sake? then marvin is caught flat footed again and that shot was supposed to be an easy save but not with flat footed marvin.

for those with eyes the third goal was a BS call. the ref messed up on the previous call and owed honduras a penalty so he gave it on that bogus play, but that was certainly not a penalty, very bad call. and on the last goal ellis is running down the right side, the midfield absent again allowing all kind of space for attackers to make cleaver runs and that they did.

ellis is being picked up, for the love of god keeper hold your line at least let him take a shot instead of running out and making it easy for him, what is wrong with our goalies who’s bloody coaching these clowns?

yes our defenders are woeful but I see a midfield putting so much pressure on our defenders causing them to over defend when they should at least take some of that pressure on themselves and off the defense by leaving less space in the middle of the park and holding possession.

all I could hope for is that whoever the next coach is, he familiarize himself with tapes of the last 10 years and study this anomaly closely because this has been our achilles heal for the past 30 years where our defense is easily unraveled with a simple counter attack and rapid ball movement. it’s so very embarrassing.
just before the penalty, look how bateau was chasing marvin back to his goal line. one of the things I can’t stand with local keepers is how they run out and gets nothing making it easier for the attackers to score, at least if your leaving your line please get the ball or at least disrupt the momentum, these keepers run out gets nothing interrupt the defense and make it easier to concede, don’t these players reflect on past games?

You are absolutely right. That is his MO, but we are dealing with a patchwork job of who is on the field and who plays where. Nonetheless, our MO is that we never to rarely have trailing midfielders. What you're highlighting is not isolated.

Brodda pull stones, I think you are not accepting that the problems are systemic and not mutually exclusive.

You highlight the midfield as being culpable on the reverse ball goal but that is an issue of defensive organization that is not exclusively the responsibility of one line of defense.
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Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #311 on: November 18, 2019, 07:59:50 AM »
WATCH: Dennis Lawrence's pre-match comments on Honduras vs Trinidad and Tobago

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/GQkgk1ZmQKw" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/GQkgk1ZmQKw</a>
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 08:07:21 AM by asylumseeker »
"It is not possible to make successful policy in a state of ignorance or indifference to what goes on in the real world." --- Martin Daly.

Offline trini supporter

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #312 on: November 18, 2019, 08:43:40 AM »
With DL and this current crop of players we are not making any major tournaments soon. Looked at the first half of   the game last night, we looked slow to the ball. When we had to ball seems the players wont sure what to do with it. Overall we are at the worst point in our football's history.I have to ask are we serious about this sport , you telling players couldnt travel because of vaccination cards??  Smh

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #313 on: November 18, 2019, 08:52:28 AM »
With DL and this current crop of players we are not making any major tournaments soon. Looked at the first half of   the game last night, we looked slow to the ball. When we had to ball seems the players wont sure what to do with it. Overall we are at the worst point in our football's history.I have to ask are we serious about this sport , you telling players couldnt travel because of vaccination cards??  Smh

Hard to argue with this. The team looks bereft of ideas and the leadership in the office is rudderless.
"It is not possible to make successful policy in a state of ignorance or indifference to what goes on in the real world." --- Martin Daly.

Offline sjahrain

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #314 on: November 18, 2019, 09:08:31 AM »
The disfunction in this FA reminds me so much of what took place under the last wicb administration...almost a carbon copy....

Offline grskywalker

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #315 on: November 18, 2019, 09:28:13 AM »
DENNIS GUIDES US THROUGH HIS 7 MAN DEFENSE TACTICS   :bs: :bs:   :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

https://youtu.be/Zln801vV_6o

Absolutely nothing described here in this video has worked for us!!!!!
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 09:30:20 AM by grskywalker »

Offline asylumseeker

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #316 on: November 18, 2019, 09:58:28 AM »
DENNIS GUIDES US THROUGH HIS 7 MAN DEFENSE TACTICS   :bs: :bs:   :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

https://youtu.be/Zln801vV_6o

Absolutely nothing described here in this video has worked for us!!!!!

They did Dennis a disservice by putting that online.
"It is not possible to make successful policy in a state of ignorance or indifference to what goes on in the real world." --- Martin Daly.

Offline Tiresais

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #317 on: November 18, 2019, 02:08:24 PM »
I roughly agree we look to the future, but you need some older heads in there - people with the right attitude and professionalism who can help the younger ones integrate into a squad, pass on any wisdom, and otherwise be leaders on the pitch and in the camp.

No one immediately jumps to mind...
did you read the article with jovin talking about why he excluded himself from last night’s game him and molino? as important as last night’s game was especially with the injuries and suspensions to key players and how much our football would have been affected for the next few years if we were to lose that game, and making a selfish decision like that, would you wants that kind of mentality around a young impressionable team?

in case you have forgoten jovin was rejected by oto fister the German coach because he was a discipline problem, and because of molino’s antics he may have stirred up the dressing room that triggered the string of Steven hart’s losses to teams he should have beaten easily causing us to miss out not only on the copa america, but also the gold cup.

remember it was Lawrence who brought molino back on the team, molino missed out on the first two games vs costa rica and honduras in the hex and came back in time to play panama where he scored. IMO we don’t need these guys that badly, it’s not like they are essential players like Weston mc kennie who’s output is insane or a albert ellis who is an instant game changer or an andreas guadado or even a josey altador,

please these guys go games without a goal or an assist, especially of late, why do we need them so much? I say we’re better without them in the dressing room. jovin should have kept his mouth shut because no coach likes hearing crap like that.

No argument from me, hence the comment about no one jumping to mind. The more professional, positive influences have mostly passed on or not able to play at the level required. Unless something unexpected happens in the next couple years, one of the less obvious legacies of this period may be the sheer lack of leadership.

Offline lefty

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #318 on: November 18, 2019, 11:21:43 PM »
DENNIS GUIDES US THROUGH HIS 7 MAN DEFENSE TACTICS   :bs: :bs:   :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

https://youtu.be/Zln801vV_6o

Absolutely nothing described here in this video has worked for us!!!!!

They did Dennis a disservice by putting that online.
O.k. it all makes sense now he's an advocate of "pussy" ball to quote ah youtuber I follow, d thing about that is yuh hadda be brave some of the time and explosive along with rigid into yuh shape, doh see none ah dat going on dey ??? hmmmm :-\
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 11:24:37 PM by lefty »
I pity the fool....

Offline Trini boi

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #319 on: November 19, 2019, 02:39:54 AM »
I've never seen us run a 4-3-3.  Seems like it's always 4-5-1 or 5-4-1, or that what it feels like.  More often than not it feels like 4-6 since we have no offense at all (and no midfield).  It's all down to coaching.  No matter how anyone spins this, it's all down to coaching. 

Offline Deeks

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #320 on: November 19, 2019, 04:26:35 AM »
I've never seen us run a 4-3-3.  Seems like it's always 4-5-1 or 5-4-1, or that what it feels like.  More often than not it feels like 4-6 since we have no offense at all (and no midfield).  It's all down to coaching.  No matter how anyone spins this, it's all down to coaching. 

T boi, maybe one of the reason why I never went into coaching, is that I don't put too much stock in formations. Not to say that it is not important. It damn important. A coach set up formation depends on two things. The opposition and the quality of the players on his team. 4-4-2, 4-3-3, 5-4-1, etc, etc. Don't matter what! The players have to attack and they have to defend. Our players can't seem to do either at this point in time. Our players are either dispirited or just not good enough. Or both! I want to believe they dispirited. But a substantial amount of forumites would say otherwise.

Offline lefty

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #321 on: November 19, 2019, 05:24:32 AM »
Deeks we have always function as two department in local football attack and defense and one does feel they don't have to help the other.....how much goals we concede were d defense is completely abandoned to fend for themselves when an attack breaks down, we can't keep viewing defense as just d GK and backline and dat is a staple of we football philosophy....d u15s was vexing for dat after a while teams were overloading us at will because have d team would not fallback to help...WOULD NOT....dat is a normal scene in we football and it is by instruction, very bad outdated instructions and players get seasoned in it, it jus more noticeable now....even under Hart it would creep in....I remember a WCQ against  USA Kenwin miscontrol ah pass and lose d ball for what had to be no more than 4 feet away and he just stopped dead....USA immediately goes up the field on a quick counter boom goal and dais a normal scene dat does play off with we. There is no philosophy of collective responsibility in our football at a coaching or developmental level, I ah football peong damn near all years my 42yrs on this earth and remember this issue being very old it jus worst now....from my earliest memory Latapy always had to be covered for in defense now is striker, d wingers, even d DMs doesn't fall back or pressure at times but dis is ah old problem
I pity the fool....

Offline pull stones

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #322 on: November 19, 2019, 06:45:25 AM »
I am very surprised after all the years of failure and loses to the same teams in the very said manner regardless as to whom is coaching decade after decade that no one ever attempt to get all the stake holders of football together in one room to comprehensively discuss how to remedy our ineptitude and fix this problem once and for all.

I think Leo benhakker once mentioned to the pro league that it’s quality was not good enough to prepare players for international football but since it was coming from a white man i guess the football heads missed the message and in their pettiness did not see the constructive component of his criticism, thus his advice was totally ignored.

what’s really surprising to me is that we firmly believe the answer to our prayers is a first class coach which is :bs:, our problem really lies in the whole construction of football on this island, the people in football, the mentality of footballers and our general football culture and the way we see ourselves on the whole.

go to any local forum online and hear the share nonsense people see as the contributing factors to our failures and it’s either falls on the administration, the coach or some players but they seldom mention lack of resources, the lack of intervention by the right people who has the power to change football, lack of developmental programs, lack of cooperate sponsorship, lack of just conscientiousness surrounding football in general and more importantly lack of care by our players.

for years we depended on the colleges league to supply us with the next generation of footballers and that was true to form until the pro league was formed, now the pro league heavily relays on the same league (SSFL) as a well spring to supply young talent, but the school league only runs for three or four months and coaching is not on going or developmental like in the countries we compete against in concacaf.

taylor twellman alluded to that when the usa failed to make it to russia, he actually placed the blame on the federation for not having proper developmental academies scattered around the country and a proper youth league like the ones in europe to incubate and introduce the next generation of talented young players to the MLS directly as a feeding channel for the league, instead of solely depending on the college's system for the next generation of pros, and he was so right.

Last night should have been the final wake up call for all those who claim to love football in trinidad and tobago. we are our own worst enemy and those of us with any sense has known this now for years but because of our stink mind and our illusions of grandeur, we believe that because we have a few stadiums and a pro league where most caribbean people flock too that we are somehow a footballing power house in the region, when nothing could be further from the truth.

the truth is we are no better than them by any stretch........in fact our mentality is poorer than those of other islanders, and given what we have at our disposal they will rise farther above us, and jamaica bermuda and curacao is living proof of that.

I am glad dennis lawrence and DJW came along when they did to buss our bubble, because under hart we were blinded by the limited success we experienced during his tenure which lead us to believe that we would be fine if only we had the right coach on board, but it’s evidently clear that when when a stellar coach leaves the bad habits and the poor mentality remains, it’s like putting perfume on a dead dog, and we saw it when we went to the World Cup, benhakker had us organized and playing with purpose but look what happened when he left, we went back to our old habits of slack defending and lazy attacking and this more than ever is what’s is needed to be broken, and we break it by implementing first class academies with european coaches as teachers.

our players show up for international duty half match fit mentally disheveled and distracted, the coach would have given them home work to complete and things to work on while they are back at their clubs, you would think that these players would heed his instructions right? WRONG! these guys go right back to doing what they do and football is nothing but a paycheck to them and not a passion.

last night by the 65th minute those guys were through, they were winded  tired  bun  out of gas and honduras knew it, that’s why ellis was finding acres of space to exploit, and the funny part is that they would go back to their clubs and sit and wait for the next call up not working on a single aspect of their game, and it would not dawn on them that they have to work harder, but not the jamaicans or the americans,

they go back to their clubs and put in more work than before and push themselves to the limit, and that’s the difference maker, and our mentality and approach to this game has to change from captain to cook or else the same ole shit will happen to us again, and not even mancini  zagalo  or even the great sir alex could fix this problem. we must change this lazy upity snobbish mentality that we are a footballing nation, no we're not.

we need schools for football only and foreign teachers to break us out of this stink mind set and teach our boys to think international, our clubs and league needs help, we ate in desperate need of better coaches better neighborhood facilities where the local people could come out and support their team, we need international coaches, not these OJT locals who feel they could coach like dennis. we need all the help we can get, yes we need help and we need it fast, but we’re ashamed to admit it or even ask for it. but we need help bad.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 07:54:36 AM by pull stones »

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #323 on: November 19, 2019, 09:23:44 AM »
I hear you Pull Stones. To go with what you're saying, after the election (hopefully things turnout positively for our football) one of our first hires should be a technical director to oversee all national programs. That individual should be one with international experience in coaching and player development, someone who can bring structure. Most importantly they need to be committed to the task, not gone for 9 months of the year but involved and laying the ground work. From there that individual should be involved in selecting coaches for the teams. They will also work with the coaches directly, give them guidance and will keep them accountable. From senior teams down to the youth levels.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #324 on: November 19, 2019, 09:56:14 AM »
Hopefully this is DL last game as head coach. What a shame
it is mate, even before the game started. DJW days were numbered after the last gold cup and Wallace is definitely trying to bring back hart as we speak.
Are you  saying that these guys are going to get rid of this loser to hire another loser.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #325 on: November 19, 2019, 10:13:31 AM »
I hear you Pull Stones. To go with what you're saying, after the election (hopefully things turnout positively for our football) one of our first hires should be a technical director to oversee all national programs. That individual should be one with international experience in coaching and player development, someone who can bring structure. Most importantly they need to be committed to the task, not gone for 9 months of the year but involved and laying the ground work. From there that individual should be involved in selecting coaches for the teams. They will also work with the coaches directly, give them guidance and will keep them accountable. From senior teams down to the youth levels.
hopefully they could hire benhakker or some big name brazilian like scolari to be the TD, when they hired Lincoln phillip and Anton corneal I knew they weren’t serious. just as you said we need a real work horse TD, even one who could reach out to the pro league and assist them with raising the level of the game in TT.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #326 on: November 19, 2019, 10:18:08 AM »
Hopefully this is DL last game as head coach. What a shame
it is mate, even before the game started. DJW days were numbered after the last gold cup and Wallace is definitely trying to bring back hart as we speak.
Are you  saying that these guys are going to get rid of this loser to hire another loser.
get serious ff no one is saying that, I too would be disappointed if we rehire hart, I was simply making a point that dennis is on his way out. as for hart well i think he’s better than dennis, but we need another benhakker, a no nonsense coach who recognizes talent one who actually won titles and is a proven winner, but please no more trinidadians.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #327 on: November 19, 2019, 10:35:47 AM »
Hopefully this is DL last game as head coach. What a shame
it is mate, even before the game started. DJW days were numbered after the last gold cup and Wallace is definitely trying to bring back hart as we speak.
Are you  saying that these guys are going to get rid of this loser to hire another loser.
get serious ff no one is saying that, I too would be disappointed if we rehire hart, I was simply making a point that dennis is on his way out. as for hart well i think he’s better than dennis, but we need another benhakker, a no nonsense coach who recognizes talent one who actually won titles and is a proven winner, but please no more trinidadians.

I would take my chances with Hart again. He is in a good position to even give some prospects a sweat in the CPL.. the same league that Ryan Telfer is developing in.

Hart was sabotaged by DJW. There is a correlation with the drop in form for thr mens national team and the election of DJW.. In fact there is a correlation with the drop in form for all teams in the national set up and the election of DJW. We went from tying Mexico on two occasions to barely tying Guyana.

June 2020 is when we have our Gold cup qualifications. There is a good chance we might face Guyana or even Guatemala.. something to think about.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #328 on: November 19, 2019, 11:05:37 AM »
Why so much romanticism in the sentiment about who should come next ... the return of Beenie, the return of SH. What next, the return of the Jedi?
"It is not possible to make successful policy in a state of ignorance or indifference to what goes on in the real world." --- Martin Daly.

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Re: Thread for T&T vs Honduras Games (10-Oct & 17-Nov-2019)
« Reply #329 on: November 19, 2019, 11:23:41 AM »
http://ssfltt.com/index.php/2017/09/20/from-then-to-now-three-decades-of-ssfl-football/

From Then to Now – Three Decades of SSFL Football
The class of the 20th century.."From Then To Now"
By Garth Wattley.   09-Jan-2000 [/size]


In this feature written by Garth Wattley and published in the Trinidad Express in 2000, three decades of Secondary Schools Football is recaptured.

Thirty-six years old, how does it feel? From Leroy De Leon to Arnold Dwarika, schoolboy football has experienced a world of change in its time. In three decades, the Colleges Football League has experienced more than a difference in its style of play.

The name is no longer the same. The CFL is now the SSFL -Secondary Schools Football League.

The change in designation has had wider implications for the league.

What began as a contest among six schools has become a truly nationwide series of competitions involving some 27 teams playing in the championship division. The gloried but very exclusive contests of the early 20th century are long gone.

In their place is a structure that allows tiny Toco the opportunity to topple once mighty QRC and the folks across the sea in Tobago to gain the type of national recognition not afforded them in other spheres.

But in 36 years, has all change been good change?

And as the 20th century begins to fade from memory, what will be the legacy of the SSFL in Trinidad and Tobago? Is expansion a significant part of that legacy?

Former Fatima College principal Clive Pantin answers in the affirmative.

“They brought a new perspective to the league,” he says of the secondary schools and senior comprehensives that arrived in the 1970s and 80s.

“The expansion,” he adds, “has given more young men the ability to shine, to do things. In a smaller league they would never have got the opportunity.”

And where indeed would national football have been in the last two decades had John Donaldson Technical Institute not introduced Clayton Morris, Tranquillity Secondary Russell Latapy, Mucurapo Senior Comprehensive Hutson Charles and Clint Marcelle, Signal Hill Dwight Yorke, Arima Senior Comprehensive Kerry Jamerson, St Augustine Senior Comprehensive Jerren Nixon and El Dorado Senior Comprehensive Stern John.

The CFL/SSFL is where they all got their start. It is from there they developed the competitive instincts. These were the type of players who gave the national youth teams of the 1980s and 1990s in particular such an exciting flavour.

But change has not come without a price.

Quantity has not, in many cases, improved quality.

Hear current SSFL president Roy Jagroopsingh.

“Now in south, apart from St Benedict’s, Naparima and Princes Town, the quality is sub-standard. That is why I favour six quality teams in the league.”

To reduce from 27 to six teams seems drastic.

But Jagroopsingh is not alone in believing that smaller is better.

“With a very narrow league of eight teams,” notes former national youth coach Keith LookLoy, “if you wanted to play Intercol, you had to get into one of those teams. Nowadays anybody can play.”

The lack of fire on the field has also cooled some of the fervour in the stands.

The 1999 Intercol semi-finals and finals held at Skinner Park reportedly grossed $.1 million. But those were isolated instances.

The crowds for the Intercol contests played in the North and East combined in 1999 would have been hard-pressed to match the 18,000 that the John Donaldson/Mucurapo North Intercol final of 1978 drew to the Queen’s Park Oval. The estimated 20,000 that saw San Fernando Technical and Arima play the 1985 Intercol final at the National Stadium would not have fitted into the Park.

There is no one answer for this. But a significant factor is star quality…rather the lack of it. “Skill does not come with commitment,” notes former national skipper turned commentator Sedley Joseph.

“In my opinion, it seems there were a lot more skilful individuals in the ’60s, ’70s and ’80s than we see now.”

Joseph will get no argument from former Maple player Andy Ganteaume. Ganteaume watched and played his football in an era when a five-forward line-up – not five defenders – was the norm, when offence was the best defence.

“In every team,” he says, “you had at least two forwards who could lash the ball. There were not many dull moments. But it is so regimented now.

“When these different systems came in, players lost their individuality.”

The problem is not unique to these parts.

Argentina’s 1986 World Cup winning coach Carlos Bilardo and former heroes Pele and Johan Cruyff have also lamented the lack of emphasis on technique in the world game.

But in the T&T context, at youth level, the problem is more acute.

“Although we have more clinics, I don’t think people are spending as much time on the technical aspect of the game.”

This from a current SSFL coach, Malick’s Ken Franco.

LookLoy, himself once attached to Malick, is more pointed.

“Nobody,” he says, “wants to invest time in the unglamorous work of training Under-14 boys.”

Naparima coach and ex-St Benedict’s star Jan Steadman is even more blunt.

The tail is wagging the dog in football and everything here,” he declares. “The people who are coaching the football don’t have a clue about the build-up. Everybody wants to be a star coach. Everybody wants to go into a system when the guys can’t even trap! They don’t know the game.”

The effect of such negligence is seen first hand by people like professional coach, Jamal Shabazz.

Many are the schoolboy stars that he has seen who have lost their way in the more technically demanding arena of club soccer.

“Coaches have gone overboard in wanting to win the Secondary Schools Football league and totally miss the point,” he says.

“A lot of times,” he adds, “coaches are hoodwinking themselves. We should be thinking about developing players.”

National coach Bertille St Clair is also concerned about the quality of coaching at the schools level. His counter has been to bring some of the youth squads – the national Under-23s in particular – under his direct supervision. He also suggests organizing a coaching network among the SSFL’s various zones.

But one thing St Clair cannot coach is spirit.

And that perhaps is the greatest indictment of the modern era, its lack of passion.

“Our game was not as much a self-centered game as now,” observes Ian Jeffers, QRC captain in 1966 and 1967.


“Players now focus on their game much more,” he adds.

With the several scholarship and professional opportunities now available, such a narrower focus is understandable, he concedes.

But Jeffers and his contemporaries played at a time when player power meant taking responsibility on the field.

“We were just more involved in the game as players,” he says.

“We used to pick our own teams. Now the coach seems to be the centre of the team.”

Taking charge also sometimes meant taking a hit.

“Take a hit for the team,” was a CIC slogan back in 1970 when Luciano Woodley played.

“People did not play for themselves, they played for their school. Every player gave 100 percent – plus!” he says.

“I don’t know if when they opened up the football to all the schools whether that Intercol rivalry started to die,” muses former CIC player of the ’64 vintage, Richard De Souza.

“But the whole meaning of wearing a blue and white jersey is not the same.”

Both Woodley and De Souza have worked with the players of he present time. And the latter recalled with amazement a case of one of his charges coming to an Intercol team meeting wearing the sky blue shirt of another school!

That would have been sacrilege in the time of the legendary Pa Aleong and Joffre Chambers. They were coaches who inculcated in their numerous pupils both technique and a love of the game.

The late Roderick Warner was another passionate man.

Ask Keith Weekes.

“I don’t think I have passed under a coach who could have motivated players like him,” says the man who played for Warner’s Tranquillity sides of eh early ’70s.

“He could psyche you up for a game.”

A taskmaster at times, Warner could also be the father figure.

“He was into your life,” says Weekes. “He would always give you money to go home, help you buy your boots and even come and talk to your parents to get you to play.”

Colourful Roderick is gone now, and so too are many of his breed.

But is it necessary to bring back the old days?

Perhaps the answer lies in learning new ways to suit the new age.

“We have depended on the Colleges League to develop our players ad it has got us nowhere,” declares Shabazz. “A whole new approach is needed.”

Harsh words perhaps, but in the cold light of the approaching new dawn, necessary ones.

Because once there are goalposts up, the schoolboys will be at play. And the fans will go to see them, confident that from beneath the muck, the highest class will rise again.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 11:32:35 AM by maxg »