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Offline lizzard1910

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T&T vs Haiti 1974
« on: November 28, 2005, 04:22:01 AM »
In German TV there was a report about de Soca Warrioirs. Also about there history. The showed a match between Haiti and TT. TT scored 4 goals all of them were denied. The only mentioned that the referee was banned for lifetime. Anybody knows more about it? Who payed for the referee ans stuff? ???
« Last Edit: November 28, 2005, 10:02:51 AM by Tallman »

Offline Rodney

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Re: 1974
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2005, 05:20:53 AM »
In German TV there was a report about de Soca Warrioirs. Also about there history. The showed a match between Haiti and TT. TT scored 4 goals all of them were denied. The only mentioned that the referee was banned for lifetime. Anybody knows more about it? Who payed for the referee ans stuff? ???

This is mentioned quite a lot on this site...surprised you haven't heard about it before  ???

Anyway, the final qualifying group for Germany 74 was held in Haiti at the time the notorious 'Papa Doc' was in charge. It involved Haiti, T&T, Mexico, Honduras, Guatemala and another team I can't remember that came last and didn't win a game. T&T lost their first game to Honduras 2-1 and in their Second game played the Hosts and also lost 2-1, however they scored a additional 4 goals that were disallowed. This turned out to be the key result in the tournament as T&T then won all their other games while Haiti lost to Mexico. T&T had a far superior goal difference so would have qualified if they had drawn or won that game. What made the situation worse was the match was reviewed and the refereeing decisions were deemed so dubious that the referee was banned for life...yet in those days the oringinal decision was final and could not be overturned. There were rumours of bribery, blackmail and threats to officials but I have no idea if anyone ever admitted to anything. It is still a sore point for all T&T football supporters as that team in many people's opinion was T&T's best ever. They certainly would have given a better account of themselves in Germany than Haiti as from all reports they were the class team in the Concacaf at that time.

Offline fishs

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Re: 1974
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2005, 05:30:38 AM »
Ah know this is a loooong post , but the info was on a PDF file and I could not create a link. However it is good reading and important for people to understand the history.
Baby Doc Duvalier was the president for life in Haiti and it was widely speculated that the officials were faced with take the money or death.

Having gained Independence eleven years earlier on August 31, 1962, Trinidad and Tobago had
every reason to prove to the rest of the world that it was ready to stand on its own when it began its
bid in 1973.
Several of the players had been exposed to professional and semi-professional football.
Among them were New York based Warren Archibald, Selris Figaro, Selwyn Murren, Everald
‘Gally’ Cummings and semi-professional Anthony Douglas who was based in Canada.
The Football Association had also hired an International coach in Englishman Kevin Verity who
was assisted by locals Edgar Vidale (assistant coach), Ken Henry (trainer) and Polly Regis
(physiotherapist).
Ivan Carter was chef de mission and Oliver Camps, manager.
The full team team was: Gerald Figeroux, Kelvin Barclay, Devenish Paul (goalkeepers), Russell
Tesheira, Raymond Moraldo, Selwyn Murren (captain), Selris Figaro, Winston Phillips (defenders),
Cummings, Dennis Morgan, Sydney Augustine, Leon Carpette, Anthony Douglas, Peter Mitchell
(midfielders), Steve Khan, Wilfred Cave, Ray Roberts, Leo Brewster, Steve David and Warren
Archibald (forwards).
Earlier the team had bulldozed its way through the first round where it headed group six with 11-1
and 2-1 victories over Antigua and a 1-all home result and 2-1 away win against Suriname.
All that remained between them and Germany was Haiti, Mexico, Guatemala, Netherland Antilles
and Honduras.
Trinidad lost its first game 0-1 to Honduras and knew that it was vital to collect two points in the
second game against the host.
They put up one of their best performances from a local team in major football competitions,
scoring five goals but at the end of the game, the score read Haiti 2 Trinidad and Tobago 1.
The game will forever remained etched in the minds of the local fans as one in which their team
was robbed and denied of an opportunity to play in the World Cup.
It was marred by some of the worst officiating in a match of such magnitude and later, the referee
Jose Enrique of El Salvador and Canadian linesman James Higuet were both banned for life by the
FIFA.
A report of the match in the Trinidad Guardian of December 6, 1973, written by Keith Sheppard
who covered the tournament tells the story:Sheppard wrote:
“If I had not seen it with my own eyes, I would not believe it. Trinidad and Tobago scored five
times and should have gotten a penalty in each session but lost 1-2 to Haiti in a very one-sided
match at the Sylvia Cator Stadium here last night. They say goals win matches. This is one time
they didn’t.
I know it will be hard for the pessimistic fans home to believe. But our boys played over through
and around the home team from start to finish so much so that Philippe Vorbe, voted Player of the
tournament in Trinidad two years ago, looked like an ordinary schoolboy and even the Haitian
people hardly noticed that he voluntarily left the field eight minutes before time.
Perhaps it was voodoo working against us but for those who do not care for the supernatural, I can
blame it on the very strange decisions of referee Jose Enrique (El Salvador) and James Higuet
(Canada).
They virtually nailed us to the cross. Because of last night, the team which played like champs are
now likely to return home as chumps.
Henrique who does not understand a word of English, decided it was a goal in the 12th minute
when a long throw from Winston Phillips landed in the net after brushing off a Haiti defender. It
looked legal to me and to the referee on the spot. But with the ball ready to be kicked off, Haitians
in the crowd drew the players attention to the fact that the linesman Higuet’s flag was up. I do not
know what Higuet could have said but his action, signifying that the goalie had been jostled were
strange since Rudy Roberts was the only player close enough to worry the goalie and did nothing of
the sort suddenly found favour with the referee whom I repeat had been on the spot and had said
goal.
This was just the first of many strange decisions which caused players and officials to be in tears
when the final whistle came and many Haitians to line the streets and cheer us on the way back to
the hotel.
At the time of the first disallowed goal, TT was trailing 0-1 on a ninth minute goal from Emmanuel
Sanon - his third of the series. He was on spot to tap home a low cross from right winger Claude
Bartholomew which had eluded the TT defenders.
Two minutes after this setback, however, Steve David notched the second goal of the series to win
a case of beer bet with one of TT’s leading pessimists ‘Short Mikey’ from Belmont. Archibald
went up the left flank and sent over a low pass for David to do the rest.
That was the signal for an all out onslaught on the Haiti goal. In the 30th minute, another Phillips
throw tweaked goalie Henri Francillon fingers and landed in the net. No goal, of course.
Seconds later, a Cummings crack had Francillon diving to hold and the same player shot off a
bullet from about 20 yards which was back in play off the upright before Francillion could move.
It was really vintage soccer and Archibald made the unofficial half time score 4-1 by heading in the
ball after Cummings had taken it to the line before squaring it back. Why was it disallowed? Ask
linesman Higuet. He ruled offside.
The second half was a carbon copy of the first. The midfield trio of Douglas, Moraldo and
Cummings so dominated play that Haiti had only two cracks from well outside the box before
getting the winner during a scrimmage in the 87th minute from left winger Roger St Vin.
In the 61st minute a Roberts’ flick bounced off Francillon’s shoulder and fell on an obliging Steve
David head. Again the decision went against us. It was ruled a foul on the goalie.
After the match everyone was sympathetic towards us. But who cared. We were robbed for sure.
No hand shake will change that.
“I will never forget this night as long as I live,” said English professional coach Kevin Verity.
Ron Newman, coach of the US pro soccer team Dallas Tornado also had a comment. “You can
quote me on this. You were robbed. I have never seen anything like this in my life.”
Needless to say our boys are disgruntled. Some are saying they are not feeling to play any more. I
can understand that feeling. It was real tough luck...”
With much to prove, the local team went back into action and won their next three games,
including a 4-0 whipping over tournament favourites, Mexico.
Cummings scored in a 1-0 win against Guatemala and he added two more against Mexico while
David and Archibald also got on the score sheet.
David, however, stole the show against the Netherlands, getting a beaver-trick.
He eventually won the prize for the most goals. Cummings was voted ‘Player of the tournament.’
and Kelvin Barclay was the best goalkeeper .
Trinidad and Tobago also collected $47,000 for placing second in the tournament while each player
was presented with a gold wrist watch by ‘Baby Doc’ Duvalier, president of Haiti.
But these were no consolation as Haiti had ended the series with eight points, including the dubious
two from their victory against Trinidad and Tobago who fiished second with six points.
Manager Oliver Camps later described the Haiti game as one of the most difficult in his life. “Big
men were crying like babies. Some lost the urge to get off the ground and return to the dressing
room. I don’t know which match the referee and linesman were seeing but it certainly wasn’t the
one between Haiti and Trinidad and Tobago.”
Trinidad and Tobago eventually filed a protest and although all the officials were banned, the
results stood.
Ah want de woman on de bass

Offline lizzard1910

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Re: 1974
« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2005, 05:42:07 AM »
[
Quote

This is mentioned quite a lot on this site...surprised you haven't heard about it before  ???

Quote

I guess because I only have time to read some oft the topics  ::)
Anyway, thanks to both of you.

Offline vb

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Re: 1974
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2005, 05:46:30 AM »
I saved this story years ago for my files...and every time I see it...I get sad...I can only IMAGINE how the playes must feel when they remember this tragedy.

Peace,
VB
VITAMIN V...KEEPS THE LADIES HEALTHY...:-)

Offline Rodney

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Re: 1974
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2005, 05:49:00 AM »
Just Some comment on Fish's post on the Haiti game. I always remember T&T losing 2-1 to Honduras with Steve David scoring for T&T in the second half. Checked on the RSSSF site and they agree with me. Also they say David ONLY  :angel: scored a Hattrick against the N.Antillies. Still that is insignificant to the robbery that occured.

Here is the Link to the qualifier stats from RSSSF:

http://www.rsssf.com/tables/74qual.html

scroll down to the Concacaf qualifiers.

Offline fishs

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Re: 1974
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2005, 05:55:42 AM »
Cheers Rodney, ah jus downgrade mih history report to ah B-  ;D ;D ;D
By the way I got this from the story of football in Trinidad and Tobago 1893-2004,
No author.
Ah want de woman on de bass

Offline Rodney

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Re: 1974
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2005, 06:10:57 AM »
Cheers Rodney, ah jus downgrade mih history report to ah B-  ;D ;D ;D
By the way I got this from the story of football in Trinidad and Tobago 1893-2004,
No author.

No problem....according to the TTFF website that was done by Valentino Singh. I have it too, infact, I think most of the old school on this site have that on dey harddrives. Very Informative! 

Offline trinibug

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Re: 1974
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2005, 07:35:46 AM »
At least Short Mikey get a case of beers.
I wonder if we ever beat Mexico 4-0 again after that?
Can you imagine a Mexico squad getting that result today - coach will havt to pack his bags following the final whistle.
Must rhyme with an O

Offline Peong

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2005, 11:54:59 AM »
lizzard by chance do you have access to a digital copy of the report?

Offline Pointman

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Re: 1974
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2005, 01:06:41 PM »
That is why I say that the People of Trinidad and Tobago should include the 1974 team in the Celebrations for our getting to 2006. If any player from 1974 is no longer around, invite a family member to be there.
LET US DO IT TNT it is the least we can do
in fact I was so mad with FIFA then that I now believe that FIFA should pay to include those players in these lead up celebrations now!
I sure if Jack Warner is a REAL boss man he will include them in the celebrations for 2006!!!!

I couldn't agree more. This is a very sore topic for me as I was witness to that '73 game, although I was just a small boy of 10. I remembered actually seeing big men I knew from my neighbourhood, who we all respected, in TEARS and everybody in a really depressed state. People who didn't even follow football that much(ie my aunt) were talking about that incident. Those '73 fellas were fantastic ballmen...I have Haitian friends who to this day remember how Warren Archibald was terrorizing the wing. If we don't do anything for these fellas it would be shameful.
Trini to de bone; Pointman to de bone.

Offline Trini

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2005, 01:23:56 PM »
So who u propose pay the $30,000 by 20 ($600,000TT) to send up the 1974 team to Germany just for nostalgia's sake?

Offline Pointman

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2005, 01:34:20 PM »
So who u propose pay the $30,000 by 20 ($600,000TT) to send up the 1974 team to Germany just for nostalgia's sake?

It could be any kind of formal, public acknowledgement not necessarily kick out that kind of money for them. Who said anything about sending them to Germany?
Trini to de bone; Pointman to de bone.

Offline morvant

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2005, 01:41:49 PM »
it is true that to know where youre going you have to know your history

but let 73,89 just be a reminder and leave it at that

lewwe stop dwelling in de past nah man

please doh cuss meh i young and stupid ;D
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

Offline Pointman

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2005, 02:08:37 PM »
it is true that to know where youre going you have to know your history

but let 73,89 just be a reminder and leave it at that

lewwe stop dwelling in de past nah man

please doh cuss meh i young and stupid ;D

ah doh think de issue is "dweeling" as it is "acknowledging" in a public setting. As you said we have to know our history. A lot of youthmen in Trini doh know these '73 players and for the one who know the '73 story they can put faces to names. Then we would finally be able to put '73 to rest.
Trini to de bone; Pointman to de bone.

Offline morvant

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2005, 02:10:34 PM »
well i say we do somthing right b4 de first practice match on de field and honary dem fellers and them
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

Offline Pointman

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2005, 02:27:34 PM »
well i say we do somthing right b4 de first practice match on de field and honary dem fellers and them

dat would be ah good time. especially if dey playing a big team like Brazil or Argentine(FBD)*, or England.






*Fire Bun Dem
Trini to de bone; Pointman to de bone.

Offline Socapro

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2005, 04:33:02 PM »
well i say we do somthing right b4 de first practice match on de field and honary dem fellers and them

Great idea Morvant, I hope we do that for the BIG warmer game in T&T, the world will be watching so what better time to remind them that we deserved to reach World Cup since 1974 but got cheated!

Someone with some sway please pass this suggestion onto the TTFF!! They NEED to do this to show that we still remember and appreciate our football pioneers!
De higher a monkey climbs is de less his ass is on de line, if he works for FIFA that is! ;-)

Offline morvant

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2005, 04:33:46 PM »
let we kill dem with email starting now ;D
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

Offline Pointman

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2005, 05:46:28 PM »
let we kill dem with email starting now ;D

post dey email address...ah go start dem.
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Offline Disgruntled_Trini

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2005, 09:54:56 PM »
FIFA should ah give we ah bly in 78 jes for that.


Ms que un club.

Offline pioneertrini

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2005, 10:08:33 PM »
yeh all the players should be taken to germany and given 1st class hotel best seats vip treatment for all Trinidads matches. as a gesture by fifa of a bad decision by them if u wanna call it that from the past. i tink that would be a big story too, a team that qualified 32 years ago finally get to germany. its descusting that could ever happen and its a real pitty we still see it today. the one place were money and politics should have no say. is now the place that they dominate. boi they does fix presidential elections, world cup finals (brazil v France 98)  ;D nuttin safe again.

Offline BigToe

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2005, 10:10:23 PM »
I knew that four goals were called back and the referees were banned for life. But, I never actually read or heard the details. What f**kery! FIFA should have intervened.

I was able to see Steve David play in the NASL, and, although, older was still a boss baller.

Offline lizzard1910

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2005, 04:29:47 AM »
lizzard by chance do you have access to a digital copy of the report?

right now: no  :(
but i'll contact the tv station and will check out if there's a chance to get it.

Offline lizzard1910

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2005, 05:56:15 AM »
lizzard by chance do you have access to a digital copy of the report?

right now: no  :(
but i'll contact the tv station and will check out if there's a chance to get it.

There's a video section on their website, but the report is not in it. I asked them to include it...Let's wait and see.

Offline dombasil

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2005, 05:58:18 AM »
This is a little off de point but do any of you remember dr'Little Mikey' Sheppy was talking about. Dat man was used to come to every game in de savannah and give men real talk. Players used to fraid Mikey mouth.

Offline lizzard1910

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2005, 09:44:59 AM »
lizzard by chance do you have access to a digital copy of the report?

I got an answer from the TV sation: They say they cant put it on the website ??? >:( it's possible to buy a tape or a dvd of the whole show for € 40,- :cursing:
If I find the time, I'll put a translation of the written story they've published in the forum...

Offline rastafari

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2005, 10:24:56 AM »
This is a little off de point but do any of you remember dr'Little Mikey' Sheppy was talking about. Dat man was used to come to every game in de savannah and give men real talk. Players used to fraid Mikey mouth.

Yeah I remember him when i use to play football for burrokeets youth team and de sunday league team. Ah use to cuss him nuff times when i was indisciplined  but one thing though, he was the biggest critic and the biggest fan of all time in T&T football for me.
I is ah belmont man so i know all dem, sheppy included.

R.I.P SHORT MIKEY
We finally make it he go be  supporting we still that's for sure.

JAH BLESS RASTAFARI

Offline Behbehman

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2005, 03:38:14 PM »
In German TV there was a report about de Soca Warrioirs. Also about there history. The showed a match between Haiti and TT. TT scored 4 goals all of them were denied. The only mentioned that the referee was banned for lifetime. Anybody knows more about it? Who payed for the referee ans stuff? ???

If yuh doh know...buh it look like Haiti geh cuss from heaven because dey interfere with Jah people...Haiti is still the poorest nation in the Western Hemisphere....God eh sleeping breds.

Offline Peong

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Re: T&T vs Haiti 1974
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2005, 05:31:49 PM »
lizzard by chance do you have access to a digital copy of the report?

I got an answer from the TV sation: They say they cant put it on the website ??? >:( it's possible to buy a tape or a dvd of the whole show for € 40,- :cursing:
If I find the time, I'll put a translation of the written story they've published in the forum...

Thanks for the effort lizzard, but don't bother to spend your money.