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Author Topic: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets  (Read 26863 times)

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Offline Feliziano

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #60 on: December 25, 2005, 10:31:39 PM »
yeah me ent have no point at all  ;D
it was just an observation on my part bout this whole ticket thing lol
btw not to be mean or run people down..but yuh think it right for people wanting to go to Germany and they ent even have a credit card?
i see we might end up in that arguement again like the taking out of loans for Germany again lol
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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #61 on: December 25, 2005, 10:39:49 PM »
yeah me ent have no point at all  ;D
it was just an observation on my part bout this whole ticket thing lol
btw not to be mean or run people down..but yuh think it right for people wanting to go to Germany and they ent even have a credit card?
i see we might end up in that arguement again like the taking out of loans for Germany again lol

I have ah millionaire living right down de road from me and he eh have ah credit card..besides yuh ehs ee dey offer ah bank draft option..ah wonder why?

Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #62 on: December 25, 2005, 11:28:27 PM »
Guys, this has nothing to do with who has a credit card, or who can or cannot afford to purchase the tickets and go to Germany, or who had the opportunity to purchase tickets prior to our actual qualification.

The issue at hand is (granted the accuracy of the article), Jack Warner and his cohorts through the ownership of Simpauls, gained an unfair advantage in the acquisation, packaging, and then re-sale of the tickets.  If the allegations are accurate, it would appear that JW has decided on the pricing of the tickets without the natuaral market of possible buyers playing a part in reaching a fair price/supply equilibrium.  JW took the opportunity away from all possible "credible buyers."

The question remains: What gives JW the right to do this?  Is this legal?  If anyone on this forum is an expert on Trinidad & Tobago jurisprudence, then please come forth with an answer to a simple question.  If all allegations are totally accurate, and there is indeed a direct link between JW and Simpauls, have any laws been breached by the fact that JW received these tickets?  Also, if  T&T is out of jurisdiction as this is a FIFA issue, could T&T still seek action based on fraud?
Bottom-line, which entity has jurisdiction in a case like this?  FIFA in a civil suit of some sort, and/or T&T in a civil or criminal suit? 

Or no one?
« Last Edit: December 26, 2005, 12:03:51 PM by fidel2xl »
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Offline doc

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #63 on: December 25, 2005, 11:49:47 PM »
Another sad thing about the corruption in the TTFF, FIFA, and the entity that is Jack Warner, is that this kind of corruption is also endemic within the Olympic committee, and the United Nations.  When we hear stories of the underhand bribing of the "too-glad-to-accept-bribes" Olympic officials that takes place in order to secure a vote for the particular city to host; or even the Oil for food debacle that took place in Iraq, in which UN officials basically accepted bribes in the form of millions of barrels of oil each, by Saddam Hussein, to look the other way...and the world for the most part stayed silent by-the-way (oh, yeah, they did blamed de US...hmmmmmmm). 

Look, we ourselves have to decide what part are we to play in bringing the arms of justice to grab hold of the guilty parties.  Silence, inaction, and scapegoating will not cut it.  Jack Warner should face the justice system in T&T, and we should not look back with regret when it happens.     

If you haven't read FIFA's code of ethics, I'd suggest you do :devil: :devil:
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Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #64 on: December 26, 2005, 12:01:11 AM »
Another sad thing about the corruption in the TTFF, FIFA, and the entity that is Jack Warner, is that this kind of corruption is also endemic within the Olympic committee, and the United Nations.  When we hear stories of the underhand bribing of the "too-glad-to-accept-bribes" Olympic officials that takes place in order to secure a vote for the particular city to host; or even the Oil for food debacle that took place in Iraq, in which UN officials basically accepted bribes in the form of millions of barrels of oil each, by Saddam Hussein, to look the other way...and the world for the most part stayed silent by-the-way (oh, yeah, they did blamed de US...hmmmmmmm). 

Look, we ourselves have to decide what part are we to play in bringing the arms of justice to grab hold of the guilty parties.  Silence, inaction, and scapegoating will not cut it.  Jack Warner should face the justice system in T&T, and we should not look back with regret when it happens.     

If you haven't read FIFA's code of ethics, I'd suggest you do :devil: :devil:

Why don't you enlighten us, Doc? ;)    I'm quite interested to learn if a member of FIFA's executive body is exempt from questionable practices  leading to obvious conflicts of  interests.   What does the FIFA statutes or their Code of Ethics say about that, Doc?  ;)     
« Last Edit: December 26, 2005, 12:05:06 PM by fidel2xl »
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Offline Feliziano

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #65 on: December 26, 2005, 05:30:14 AM »
Guys, this has nothing to do with who has a credit card, or who can or cannot afford to purchase the tickets and go to Germany, or who had the opportunity to purchase tickets prior to our actual qualification.

The issue at hand is (granted the accuracy of the article), Jack Warner and his cohorts through the ownership of Simpauls, gained an unfair advantage in the acquisation, packaging, and then re-sale of the tickets.  If the allegations are accurate, it would appear that JW has decided on the pricing of the tickets without the natuaral market of possible buyers playing a part in reaching a fair price/supply equilibrium.  JW took the opportunity away from all possible "credible buyers."

The question remains: What gives JW the right to do this?  Is this legal?  If anyone on this forum is an expert on Trinidad & Tobago jurisprudence, then please come forth with an answer to a simple question.  If all allegations are totally accurate, and there is indeed a direct link between JW and Simpauls, has any laws been breached by the fact that JW received these tickets?  Also, if  T&T is out of jurisdiction as this is a FIFA issue, could T&T still seek action based on fraud?
Bottom-line, which entity has jurisdiction in a case like this?  FIFA in a civil suit of some sort, and/or T&T in a civil or criminal suit? 

Or no one?

yes we knew this was a thread bout Jack and his pot of Gold tickets..but i was just making the observation bout if some of us had tickets..we wouldntve cared bout who didnt have access or can afford them...we woulda been calling all ah dem waggonist.
also maybe it have nothing else better going on to bitch bout  ;D ..full day of English football on tv ahead.

but anyway Jack is wrong..whether is good business or not..or that he reaping his rewards from the TTFF.

oh another thing i didnt like was that Jefferz coming on here trying to get tickets for he Trini Posse buddies..if them claim to be so big..they could fend for themselves...ah sure them have the right connections too  ;)
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Offline JDB

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #66 on: December 26, 2005, 06:07:35 AM »

yes we knew this was a thread bout Jack and his pot of Gold tickets..but i was just making the observation bout if some of us had tickets..we wouldntve cared bout who didnt have access or can afford them...we woulda been calling all ah dem waggonist.
also maybe it have nothing else better going on to bitch bout  ;D ..full day of English football on tv ahead.

but anyway Jack is wrong..whether is good business or not..or that he reaping his rewards from the TTFF.

Whether men have tickets or not this is an objectionable situation.

Even though I believe that tickets will go on sale after this package has run its cost they will still be difficult to get.

But most importantly we had an opportunity to go FORWARD with this qualification, to progress. This erodes whatever little public trust the people had in the TTFF. Yes people will forget over time but why should they.

Then they will complain when they can't get 25,000 people in the stadium regularly.

But they are doing nothing to help themselves and help the football. WHICH IS SUPPOSED TO BE THEIR JOB.

At best this whole scene is poor management at worst pure greed and at th eend of the day TnT football is worse off than it would be if we DO THINGS RIGHT.
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Offline fishs

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #67 on: December 26, 2005, 08:07:42 AM »
Maybe most men here is real WAGGONISTS tuh local football.
Ah coulda see dis coming from ah mile away.
But Jack thinking is dat he was almost solely responsible for trini being where we are and his reasoning will always be Jack's reasoning,
Payback time.
No calculation fuh what is ah reasonable profit to make on tickets, to hell with everybody who feel ah is ah tief because is my business making de money, actually allyuh ungratefull, after all we wouldna be having dis shit if wasn't for me Jack Warner.

This thing is normal Jack MO and I going to tell men here we will talk about it for years after like 89' fiasco, but yuh know what ?
It eh changing de price ah macaroni because Jack doing want Jack want and to hell with everybody.

Ah want de woman on de bass

Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #68 on: December 26, 2005, 09:53:35 AM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D
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truetrini

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #69 on: December 26, 2005, 10:03:46 AM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Quote
Hell yeah, Give him de cross oui!!!. Self interest or no self interest he was very instrumental in getting us to the Big Fete!!!


seems like apathy is yuh forte?

Come on man..yuh cyar be serious right?

Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #70 on: December 26, 2005, 10:10:48 AM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Quote
Hell yeah, Give him de cross oui!!!. Self interest or no self interest he was very instrumental in getting us to the Big Fete!!!


seems like apathy is yuh forte?

Come on man..yuh cyar be serious right?

Nah Point Fortin is my forte(get it, Fortin and forte...same pronunciation ;D )

on ah serious note, how should tickets for the games be disbursed to the public? What is the procedure or process for making that possible? Also what are your feelings on the socawarriors paraphanalia issue ie who gets exclusive rights to produce items bearing the socawarriors logo/name etc.
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truetrini

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #71 on: December 26, 2005, 10:20:58 AM »
Simple..add a premium and put dem for sale..first come first serve..or a lottery system..like how dey writing man name in ah copy book.

Offline concerned

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #72 on: December 26, 2005, 10:23:54 AM »
18000 $ profit by 2000 packages is a wopping 36 million profit....with NO refund policy

Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #73 on: December 26, 2005, 11:43:06 AM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   
« Last Edit: December 26, 2005, 11:45:19 AM by fidel2xl »
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Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #74 on: December 26, 2005, 01:17:47 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?
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Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #75 on: December 26, 2005, 02:13:38 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   

« Last Edit: December 26, 2005, 02:31:44 PM by fidel2xl »
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Offline Jefferz

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #76 on: December 26, 2005, 02:28:49 PM »
like truetrini say,

"Jack for Trinity Cross!"
since ah born or at least circa Copa Caribe

Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #77 on: December 26, 2005, 03:10:23 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)
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Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #78 on: December 26, 2005, 03:57:11 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2005, 03:58:53 PM by fidel2xl »
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Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #79 on: December 26, 2005, 04:44:39 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)
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Offline OutsideMan

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #80 on: December 26, 2005, 05:00:25 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)

If you read my earlier posts on this matter from yesterday, you would see that I make it clear that it all depends on the accuracy of the allegations etc.  Anyway, every battle starts from somewhere.  All the other issues, airport scandal, money laundering by politicians of ill gotten gains etc, should also be taken seriously.  But the issue at hand in this dicussion was JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF...period.  We can talk of corruption in the Roman Empire, to the Czars of Russia pre 1917.  But it's neither here nor there in relation to JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF.  Anyway, let's see where this goes.
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Offline Pointman

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #81 on: December 26, 2005, 05:04:21 PM »
Allyuh leh Jack an he family make dey money nah, why all de hating?? Ah wonder if man does have dis kinda passion when monies for ah new airport suddenly is unaccounted for an real people geh catch in slackness.
I say leh Jack make he money...da's Trini ting. ;D

Pointman, you are obviously kidding...at least I would hope so.  For the most part, we are not hating on Jack Warner...we are "hating" on his actions, and the actions of the TTFF who are complicit in this.  If the allegations are accurate, the actions observed by all reasonable clear thinking individuals would come to an obvious conclusion --- that what JW through his direct linkage to Simpauls, having exclusive "rights" to the tickets on the go-ahead by the TTFF, is an Unfair and Unjust business practice.  There was and is NO Accountability, and NO Transparency.  Certainly even a Jack Warner supporter can see that. 

Anyone who supports the actions of JW and his cohorts, in the light of all the evidence, has no right to speak against the crime situation in T&T.  If you accept one crime, and show apathy to one issue, then you should ALSO accept ALL crime...maybe even nominate the hitmen, the kidnappers, and the crimelords, for the Trinity Cross.   

Now, if you would like to discuss the airport situation, we certainly can on another board.  I'm sure you heard that Piarco just decided to construct a new world class hotel w/in a kilometer from the airport...there's more bacahnal to come, my friend...stay tuned.     ;)   

Fidel, what I said should be taken w/ ah grain ah salt. We all know there is nepotism involved in this whole football thing. Along with being CONCACAF presi JW is also ah businessman, he in dis ting to make money. The conflict of interest issue here is one for the auditors to find and prove. Since JW and he boys running tings and transparency scarce proof will be hard to come by.
Also, since when is business fair and just. In the real world of business we do what is in our power to be successful and if we have a monopoly in something even better. I dare say with, all due respect,you'd do the same. too.
Is it fair to equate this situation with the state of violent crime in T&T?

Pointman, with all due respect I understand how business works...I'm in the business field in the business capital of the world --- Wall Street.  In my business, as in most, we have rules and regulations in order to maintain a fair playing field.  Trust me, I understand the way things work.  I fully believe in the ideals of capitalism and the free markets despite my namesake of "Fidel" (which is my actual middle name).  In my business you do what you can to get that competitive advantage, but all within the boundaries of the law.  Ethics comes into play also. 
You made a statement that I would do the same as Jack Warner if I were in his shoes.  Yes, you may be correct or you may be wrong.  However, if I were committing an act such as that, then I would know that it is a calculated risk I am taking.  If i got caught, then i would probably fight tooth and nail, and find the most expensive lawyer to plead my case of "innocence".  But I would know that I am wrong, and deserved to face the arms of justice...but I would probably never admit to that in public, though.  Hey, that's what liars do.  Liars and dishonest people will never admit to wrongdoings --- do you expect anything less? (hahaha).  But any clear thinking sensible person seeing the evidence, and my actions, wouldn't buy my story at half price.
How's that for realness, Pointman?

Listnen, you can committ the crime, but you have to be ready and willing to do the time, if caught.  Ask Michael Milken...once the biggest Junk Bond "monopolist" on the planet (Averaged an income of US $450 million per year). 

PS:  And yes I believe it is fair to equate this "crime" with any other crime in T&T.  It basically boils down to our levels of acceptance of what is right and what is wrong in our country.  It boils down to the standards of behaviour we are willing to accept.  It boils down to our sence of decency and values.  We lower those standards, and we stand the risk of losing a lot more than we bargained for.   




Fidel, since you work on Wall street then you know a thing or two about monopolies and JW clearly has one when it comes to T&T football. He will make money off of it. Also you should know that companies are always looking for ways to push the ethics envelope vis a vis business practices here in the US and elsewhere for that matter. JW will never see the inside of anybody's jail nor suffer any fines etc for his business practices in the T&T business arena. I think it is the exception rather than the norm that businesses conduct themselves in an ethical manner.
Also, people wherever they may be,  have always made destinctions in the type of crimes committed and how they deal with them. I think few people are willing to equate JW and co's actions/business practices with violent crime since the impact on society is quite different.
I'm not a huge JW supporter but I think some of us can be a bit disingenuine when it comes to JW and his actions...maybe it's our collective passion for football. ;)


Again, you miss the point, Pointman.  There's nothing inherently wrong with a monopoly, as long as the rules of the game were followed.  I expect companies or individuals to bend the rules, or find loopholes.  That's what any wise business professional would do.  But then there are the blatant acts of corruption.  CORRUPTION.  That's a different ballgame entirely, my friend.      The situation with JW has nothing to do with having or not having a monopoly.  This has to do with lack of Accountability, and lack of Transparency, and profiting from it.  It has to do with Blatant Corruption.   

You'd be surprised how truly similar the impacts are of white collar crimes are in society vs violent crime.  Everyone feeds off the same system, and when a blind eye is often turned in one arena for a certain class, there's a resentment that resonates within the poorer communities.  There's only so much a society can take. 

Anyway, now it's wait an see.  Make no mistake, this is a test we are facing, and how we handle it will certainly help define who we are as a people.


Fidel, I understand the point, I know we talking about corruption...CORRUPTION ;D, but can it be proven in JW's case. As you say this is a wait and see matter and I suspect like everything else it will go unresolved and at the end of the day JW and co will make out like fat cats.

Personally, this is not a battle I'm willing to fight but if we go after JW for matters like this then lets go after certain politicians who have private accounts outside the country with untold millions and everybody involved in the airport fiasco and all de other bobol tings going on.
You and I both know how this will turn out though. ;)

If you read my earlier posts on this matter from yesterday, you would see that I make it clear that it all depends on the accuracy of the allegations etc.  Anyway, every battle starts from somewhere.  All the other issues, airport scandal, money laundering by politicians of ill gotten gains etc, should also be taken seriously.  But the issue at hand in this dicussion was JW, Simpauls, and the TTFF...period.  We can talk of corruption in the Roman Empire, to the Czars of Russia pre 1917.  But it's neither here nor there in relation to JW, Simapuls, and the TTFF.  Anyway, let's see where this goes.
:rotfl: awright boss yuh make meh laugh
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Offline FATZ

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #82 on: December 26, 2005, 06:50:09 PM »
Well boy, i just came back into the country and was watching through the old papers and saw this damn headline big and bold, i also saw stories about murders, car crashes and other shit but this one topic had to be read first and right now i'm waiting for the 2nd part but to all JACK Warner 'bamsy flies' like potato toti and the others, this is what the man doing to Trinidad again and again and allyuh fools just supporting blindly. This is as bold faced and bold face can be, the biggest criminal in T&T is Jack Warner. >:( >:(
WELCOME TO DINSLEY OUT IN THE STREETZ THEY CALL ME FATZ

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #83 on: December 27, 2005, 11:08:35 AM »
Fellas I spoke to Jack Warner and he said he can understand my anger, which anger is no doubt based on ignorance but by Monday next everything shall be revealed, do have some patience, my friend.

So I (Sam) will wait patiencely before I say anything more on this issue.
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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #84 on: December 27, 2005, 11:16:04 AM »
OK Sam I waiting too.

Jack buying some time to come up with an explaination..so I hope is ah damn good one.

I cyar wait!

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #85 on: December 28, 2005, 09:09:06 AM »
Yea jack does it again.... yuh feel any ah we broke @$$ niggaz go be able tuh afford any tickets now, Jack go make ah killing... Like when he said centre of excellence wouldah be ah skool fuh football,,, skool my left nut him making real money....



Ah alyuh feel it done dey..... he sold the rights to the adidas uniform to He refree buddy so ah normal kit starts at bout $300 yuh go see the price now!!!!


ah set ah bloody tief running de football now but me nah frighten.... as meh mama always used tuh say.....
5 DAYS FUH TIEF ONE DAY FUH POLICE


Offline ricky

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #86 on: December 28, 2005, 10:01:54 AM »
Fellas I spoke to Jack Warner and he said he can understand my anger, which anger is no doubt based on ignorance but by Monday next everything shall be revealed, do have some patience, my friend.

So I (Sam) will wait patiencely before I say anything more on this issue.

Sam thanks for the update from Cactus Jack but i personally think come monday he going to be telling us the tickets all sold out or some other news we do not want to hear.
If he come out Monday and puts Tickets only for sale, the people who bought from simpaul already will be PISSED, so I  think its too late for him to go back from here.....
WE SCREWED

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #87 on: December 28, 2005, 10:17:37 AM »
I just know i goin wit about 20 ah meh freinds we apply for we tickets we screem ah seriously cheap travel  plan and we ROUGHIN IT. At this point i couldnt care less for this short, balding chip mout......

J-J-J-Ja-Jack! Wu-Wu-Wu-Warner!

JUST GIVE MEH, MEH BIG STONE WHEN WE GET INTO DE STADIUM IN DORTMUND AND I WILL TAKE CARE OFF THIS WHOLE, Caribbean dictatorship problem.


Beenhakker for Concacaf President!
since ah born or at least circa Copa Caribe

Offline gothic

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #88 on: December 29, 2005, 02:04:52 AM »
i normally just read the post here but this time JW forced me to post..

this is just blatant man...i have every thing else organize for Germany but it look like i(and 9 friends) will have to hope for tickets from fifa or stand outside de stadiums now cause i ent paying TT30,000 for a package i could organize better for myself just to get jack richer

Offline Jefferz

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Re: Warner's family firm monopolises FIFA World Cup tickets
« Reply #89 on: December 29, 2005, 02:09:37 AM »
same here.
since ah born or at least circa Copa Caribe